Grim Reapers vs Human Olympus-Controlled Layered IADS SAM Network | DCS
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 11 июл 2024
- Today we try the Olympus DCS Mod for a second time. This time a human controls a Syrian layered SAM network, and we we have to fight against it in 4th generation SEAD aircraft.
PATREON: / grimreapers
0:00 Overview
1:40 Scenario Details
3:43 Olympus Controls
5:50 Battle Planning
7:56 Take Off
USEFUL LINKS
GRIM REAPERS (RUclips): / @grimreapers
GRIM REAPERS 2 (RUclips): / @grimreapers2
GR PODCASTS: anchor.fm/grim-reapers
DCS TUTORIALS: / @grimreapers
DCS BUYERS GUIDES: • DCS World Module Quick...
DONATE/SUPPORT GRIM REAPERS
MERCHANDISE: www.redbubble.com/people/grme...
PATREON monthly donations: / grimreapers
PAYPAL one-off donations: www.paypal.me/GrimReapersDona...
SOCIAL MEDIA
WEBSITE: grimreapers.net/
STREAM(Cap): / grimreaperscap
FACEBOOK: / grimreapersgroup
TWITTER: / grimreapers_
DISCORD: / discord
THANK YOU TO: Mission Makers, Admin, Staff, Helpers, Donators & Viewers(without which, this could not happen) xx
#GRMission #DCSMission #GR #Olympus #DCSWorld #DCS #Aviation #AviationGaming #FlightSimulators #Military 
Игры
Hey cap can you do the battle of kasham
ruclips.net/video/XQ6L35rdywQ/видео.html
I gotta say, Olympus has me hooked, these missions are dynamic!! Great job by Poosh on the air defense, and I really appreciated his takeaways in the debrief!! Also, damn fine wild weasel work by Fly, and an excellent job by Firedad of finding that space to make the close in shots so there was no chance to turn off the radar!! I think valuable lessons were learned on both sides, and I sincerely look forward to more of these flights!! Great flying as always Grim Reapers!!
Part of the reason the US started using the AGM-88 HARM over the AGM-45 Shrike is because the HARM has a position memory, so even if the radar is shut off they can track in on it's position.
There is some misconception about the HARM's "target position memory".
In theory the HARM was capable of that.
But in practice this didn't work too well with the missiles used in '80 and '90s (I mean AGM-88A/B/C). It didn't work in a way everybody thinks and this capability was not meant to ensure hitting radars that stopped emiting.
AGM-88 HARMs in '80s and '90s used an INS (inertial navigation system) to know it's position in flight, so if the F-4G or EA-6B (or F-16CG) uploaded the actual position and the target coordinates to the missile before launch, then theoretically the missile could navigate to target position even if radar stopped emiting.
( But wait - if it really worked well, then why the expensive and sophisticated passive radar seeker would be needed at all? )
So if the attacked radar stopped emiting while the missile was in the air - the HARM could continue to fly toward it's position (the one uploaded by launching aircraft). If the radar started emiting again - the homing was resumed. If it didn't - there was a good chance that HARM would hit somewhere in vicinity of the target.
But the accuracy was rather poor. The INS system used in HARM missiles was not as precise as today's GPS, and the position error increased with time of flight.
If the attacked radar shut itself down after HARM launch, lethal hit was unlikely.
The main reason for using INS in the missile and uploading target coordinates before launch was not to be able to target non-emiting radars, but for using the missile in Range-known (pre-briefed and TOO) modes where the missile fly an energy efficient parabolic trajectory to known position of enemy radar. Such trajectory allowed much better range than if using straight, direct path.
For this to work, the missile has to know at least approximation of it's own position in flight.
In 1991 HARMs were used mainly to suppress Iraqi sam, because after initial surprise, Iraquis quickly learned to shut down radars after detecting HARM launch, and later even after hearing the word "MAGNUM" over rafio - and they had very high chances to survive then. This is said openly by former F-4G pilots - that HARM was rather an effective SAM suppression tool than effective SAM killing tool.
Only if the radar emitted untill the missile hit, kill ratio was good. If it stopped emiting - not so. Maybe few percent. Usually the attacked radar come back on air later that day or the next day.
If a HARM was launched without target coordinates (like in self-defense mode) and just homed on active radar, it probably also had some very basic kind of "target memory" but rather in form of "direction to target" - if target emitter shut down, HARM probably just navigated to continue on course. But it could be effective only of radar was shut down just seconds before hit....
ONLY after introducing GPS navigation in more modern versions of HARM (and that would be the AGM-88D block 6 and later AARGMs), those missiles were able to accurately (up to few meters) hit the target coordinates that were uploaded by launching aircraft. So capable to reliably hit close to radars that stopped emiting. How close - it depended also on how precise were those coordinates that were uploaded. For example older F-4G were able to geo-locate enemy emmiters much more precisely than later F-16CG with HTS.
The AARGM incorporated also an additional MMW active seeker (similar to one in radar version of Hellfire missile) so it has a good chance to locate and directly hit enemy radar or SAM even if target coordinates were not very precise or if a mobile SAM vehicle is trying to relocate after shutting-down.
The original AGM-88A HARM was developed mainly to have an advanced, smart, universal seeker (unlike the Shrike), to be fast (High-Speed ARM), and with INS so it could be used in "Range-known" modes, and not be fooled by short pause in radar emission - because the HARM would continue to fly to the target using INS and stored target coordinates, so if targeted radar came back on air, HARM would resume homing on it. This way the enemy could not safely turn radar back on untill it heard HARM went "boom" in vicinity - and even then there still could be another HARM in the air, launched later at known emitter coordinates.
As long as there were any HARMs in the air (or enemy thinked so) he could not turn on it's air defence radars.
So AGM-88A/B/C as an effective suppression tool - yes. Enemy could avoid losing SAMs by turning radars off, but at the same time he could not defend targets that were being bombed....
But it was not very effective as a killing weapon. Against smart opponents that used emission control HARM's Pk was very low.
Iraqi radars were shut down once they detected a missile launch. Not because they heard 'Magnum' over the radio I'm pretty sure. I wasn't there for very long,, but I remember hearing that. I was part of the SCUD hunting teams amd we were finding everything but SCUDS. The Iraqis weren't capable of listening into our radios. Especially after it ws rumored that the Russiams had sold Iraq a missile that was capable of shooting down a jet because they could home In on radio transmissions. This turned out to be not true, but we didn't know that. That's why communications were kept to a minimum and also there was so much use of jammers and Prowlers were up looking for radio emission homing signals because the US had originally developed a missile that could home in on radio transmissions. We never deployed it, but I remember the tests done for it. We also stopped using HARMS and started using Smart Pigs aka the JSOW. This is what the A-10's were doing by using the TV system from their Mavericks I believe and then using that to launch a JSOW or a bomb since they lacked targeting pods. That gave the idea to F-16 and EA6's to use a HARM to home in on a target, but actually launch a cluser bomb,or a VT bomb for air burst above.
I think with modern technology we (NATO) can do better. My idea is the ALARM (Advanced Loitering Anti-Radiation Missile). Even if it was a decoy body with GPS lock, and submunitions.
@@timbaskett6299that’s alr a feature on the most modern MALD variants
@@amizaur3marcinostrowski186 I want to point out that those accounts are from the very earliest HARM missiles; at a time where missile guidance tech wasn't that great across the board.
Later variants of AGM-88 is a much better missile than the variants you are describing.
This is especially true for F-16's fitted with an HTS pod and the latest variant of AGM-88.
One of the things we always talk about in these videos is the human element. The specs of these SAMs (and other assets) dont mean much when consider the SAM operator might be out taking a piss, the guys are watching RUclips videos, or the system is simply broken.
This really brings us a step closer to reality. It would be cool to do a 6hr mission or the like to really see what its like to catch the opposition sleeping at the wheel
This was fun to watch having the human controlled SAM's.
dudes name Sam: wow
@@voidwalker9223 Related to the Sham-Wow?
That was a fun video, very good idea. I'm just learning my first DCS module right now, but I've been watching GR for a while. Thanks for sharing the passion :)
If the human is Kortana then my money is on the human.
Cap.should ask her if she'd be willing to be the air defense next time she is able to play. I wonder if Simba would be any good at it as well.
Thanks for todays video, I loved how the methods and concerns discussed in the video were heavily influenced by the fact that you have a human opponent & human induced spontaneity & weapons conservation. It really makes a world of difference in terms of strategy realism. Even if controlling individual missiles is not possible, would really love some additional human controlled opponent content. If controlling missile launches is somehow possible, would love to see human vs human naval missile combat & human driven saturation attack.
AGM-88 HARM has a position tracker, turning off the radar doesn't help. Once it knows where the radar is, it can hit it.
The GPS equipped variant of the HARM can, but the older variants only have INS, so is rather inaccurate at hitting shutdown radars (very low chance depending on distance to target when radar stops emitting)-----earlier version was more more of a radar suppression tool than a killing one...
But it may be imprecise, due to the small radiation sample it took, and land a few meters away from the radar.
So, it does help.
Oh, and as a former MANPADS stinger, DCS definitely Nerfs them.
modern MANPADS with image infrared seekers are pretty damn effective. Countermeasures are basically useless against them and has made it suicidal to use helicopters offensively now.
Fun video, and good flying GR!
This was the coolest mission in a while. Thanks guys
GOOOOO FLY!!!!
Weaseling his way to a win!!
#FlyFan
This was great to watch, i like the human controlled SAM network vs the boys! Def wouldnt mind more of these 👍🏼
Cap, I had a strange image when you said 'Big Bird' radar. The image was of that big yellow bird from Sesamee street operating a missile site.
That works for me.
really enjoyed this one Cap. Thankyou :)
Pooshes POV would have been really awsome to see at the same time or give clips of moments from his POV: that would make this really fun
Since everyone involved seemed to like this format with the Olympus mod, i hope to see more and different scenarios. It becomes so much more interesting with the pvp element. 10/10 vid!
Imagine DCS having the capability to be used as a turn based RTS, a bit like the Total War series, move your units then when it comes to fighting, take control of a unit.
dcs needs HQ kinda of add on, where you control divisions, regiments, platoons, .. and obviously also SAM systems, .. in real world most of spotting is done with highly mobile EW stations, and AWACS, and other kind of off range platforms, SAMs launch only when plane is within kill zone and assured destruction..so you see and hear no beep beep unless you going to eat it for sure.
HARM is far from miracle weapon, in skilled hands SAMs will be impossible to overcome without losses.. simple as that
command modern operations
@@keepwalking6041We are seeing real life right now in Ukraine, Russia and the Middle East, advanced systems are being naturalised by shop bought hobbyist toys.
@@superflyguy4488 anyway, Integrated air defense is a totally different beast and simply cannot be easily walked through, you need more resources, more expense to over come ergo u lost, as in war, in real war its about cost, if u can make enemy bleed more either human casualties or economic -preferably both- then you win. and from 1960 to today i think we have seen enough to conclude USSR-Russia air defense works, and works insanely good. only in hollywood or in overwhelming poor countries can air power work as ppl believe it works.
Very fun video to watch!
I would like to see a version of this with the most modern Russian or Chinese sams being used. Also use more modern US tech such as maybe F35 with AARGM or AARGM-ER. Also small diameter bombs SDBs.
Make sure the HARMs and AARGMs cannot be beaten by simply turning off the radars. They do in fact have a “memory mode” which allows them to remember where the emissions were from and continue to them even if the SAM stops emitting in flight.
Definitely more interesting to watch than the usual suppression of AI. Hope to see more of this, and see the Olympus tactics improve.
COOL! Nice usage of Olympus
This was really interesting, and I think worth attempting again.
I love the JSOW, but recently I've found DCS is doing weird things with them if fired at long range (which is kinda the point).
Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't be more "realistic" scenario to not have pre-existing threat rings? I think it would make for a more interesting hunt from both sides. and then on opposite side, let the defender expect act from 360 grid. potentially they can set up their own assets around the map.
I didn't hear a plug about going onto the Stone burner server if you want to learn how to dodge life diving SAMs better. Great video as always. One day I'll be able to join in on one of these midis now that I'm your side of the world.
Well, you just plugged it!
Only just "discovered" this game omg...
Used to play alot of flight sims but that was a very long time ago: Falcon 4.0; DID eurofighter and TAW, manuals a thick as my erm..big toe. So im exited getting into this world. Just bought my first module, look for a plane falling uncontrollable out of the skies and its probably me :-)
God Speed sir. This is a sim...and it will let you know. 😂
Good hunting buddy. Get a grip of the basics and squadron up... Then the real learning begins!
Wat een maloot! Respect voor de agenten in deze achtervolging! 💪
I think these Wild Weasel missions are up there with my favourites
Good stuff, boys!
I nice change in pace. Would be interesting to add that dynamic into some of the larger campaigns.
This is the good stuff. All humans, or at least AI managed by humans. DCS is DCS but still an order of magnitude better. Hope to see actual Combined Arms™ operations in the future.
Koobs are a former enemy turned friend in the Amslach amd Cole Military Sci-fi book series 'Legionairre'
Fun fact I found out today!
Did you know that although the F-35 has flares, it does not have chaff?
Instead it has 4x ALE-70 active radar towed decoys that can perform various ECM roles such as jamming, spoofing and decoy!
Surprised me anyway!
S-300 Big Bird was missing. Clamshell is for cruise missiles and other low-altitude targets -> S-300 was mostly useless.
I have a vague memory of reading about work being done on a loitering version of HARMs. Fired on the original position, if the system powered off it would note that and circle the general area for a while (no idea of timeframes, so probably 5-10 minutes depending on the munitions capabilities) and wait for the system to power back on and then strike it.
Great concept and video GRs! Something I would love to see would be a comparison of this run to see the difference in difficulties with this run with Gen 5 stealth (F-35) and then run again using Gen 6 NGAD and drones.
Olympus has made DCS quite incredible over the last month
I think now Olympus makes large scale dynamic land battles possible. It would actually give all those land assets CH has made some use.
I really enjoyed this. Kinda would like to see it from the radar operatprs perspective.
Thanks guys.
This was really cool, I'd love to see this being used in wargames in the future :)
We need more human OpFor! Great video
Great stuff! Hopefully Ed is taking notes on implementing integrated sam systems.....this was amazing compared to the silly always emitting Sam's we have now. Might be the most unrealistic aspect of the "simulation"
AMAZING VIDEO GUYSSS!!! If you want to up the difficulty just a tad bit, add SA-8 Osa’s. They loveee shooting down harms!
Don't forget that the U.S. never conducts an airstrike without dedicated jamming support like the Growler and other platforms. In fact NATO countries all request jamming support when conducting strikes. So that means Growlers, Compass Calls, unmanned EW, ect. It's just too dangerous to go in without that stuff. Especially if you don't even want to lose 1 aircraft. That's why stealth is so important. There are only a finite number of expensive jamming aircraft to go around. So if you have a strike composed of B-2s, B-21s, F-22s or F-35s they don't need anywhere near the EW support that non stealth aircraft require to accomplish their mission.
"It's dangerous to go alone! Take this."
In a large engagement vs a human-controlled system, a good tactic might be to launch the decoys in ones and twos, but have your strike package flying with a profile characteristic of decoy spamming. That way the human will be more likely to ignore the real planes until you're much closer than otherwise.
Human - yes, but activated SAM sites would launch at any target - plane, decoy or "decoy" so there is little chance to avoid being shot at by pretending tu be a decoy. Only if the human player didn't activate some SAM at all, believing targets to be decoys - and because if that those planes could fly past those SAMs (or locate and kill them with other weapons while passing by) there could be a gain.
Saw a video of the new 5”mach5 steerable shell for 5” navy cannons. Built to one shot destruction of drones.
The first HARM's went dumb when the SAM's radar was turned off. The new missiles store the last known position in memory and follows the flight path to it.
It would not surprise me that some of the tactics, techniques, and proceedures (TTPs) will be employed in future Red Flag exercises
An EA-18G Growler would come in handy in this mission.
Would be neat to see this from the perspective of whoever was operating the radars.
I like both styles. But . . . Was fun!
Cap and the gang, you guys should look up the RAFs CFS AP3456 in PDF, was released a couple of years back under FOI
Could you please fly Chinese and Russian Planes against Uncle Sam Corridor!(Plus Allies;) MANPADS, Avenger Air Defense System's, C-Ram's, Gepards, IRIS-T's, NASAMS variants, Iron Dome, and couple variants of Patriots Site's! Please use layered defenses, older variants first, and more modern variants of Defense System's further along as it increasingly becomes more difficult! Target is obviously GR Headquarters, located near The Great Pyramids!🙏👍
Please create this in the same way you used to with Russian SAM Corridors back in the day!
NOICE!
I turned captions on accidentally. Turns out its extra entertaining. Didn't know JSOWs could be targeted using a teapot.
I wonder what's the resolution of a teapot's sensor 🤔
Only RAF carries them
Where is Cortona? I miss her!
Cannon ball really did a kick flip in an f16 on the ground😂
I thought Harms have a memory function where they remember where a Radar is even if the radar is turned off?
Yes but it only works accurate enough once they are close enough once the radiation stops.
Goes off to buy more HARMs 🚶♂
Btw, Cap, any chance you can get some kind of presenter "halo" around your mouse cursor during briefings? On a phone it's impossible to see your cursor during the "here, here and here" part of the proceedings.
Will investigate.
'Hello fellow Humans'
How well does Olympus work with other mods like CH's stuff? And can you order specific units like ships to attack specific targets?
Would you be able to do a war game with this setup but the human controlled Olympus can scramble a flight on first contact?
I would like to make a request for a future video
In 2018 the USA offered to transfer two oliver perry class frigates to ukraine. Wiki (yes I know) says that the US have six ships "on hold for foreign military sale" and one "on hold for donation". Say Ukraine gets all seven (possible modernized with VLS cells) plus the two Ada class (maybe throw in the Hetman Sahaydachniy or the unfinish slava class cruiser they have for fun) and see what they can do.
Kortana = Olympus. Can you entice Kortana to run a show like this?
yup
i'm not afraid of no koobe
Where's the coboom?
I wonder can you eyeball fire an air to air missles at ground targets
You should assemble a full time RedTeam, the Anti-Reapers.
They only live and fight for _One Reason!!!_ 😡😈😂
Antithesis to the Grim Reapers... Jolly Sowers?
US navy with CG(X) and LCS vs. Is Navy without
Where’s the EC-37’s?
I’d love to see how the ALARM would fair if one is available?
That would be cool.
So are these the old HARMs that don't remember the coordinates 9f the radar after it's been powered off?
It's more complicated. Older HARM models knew target coordinates - if they were uploaded to it's memory by launching aircraft. But - first, those coordinates usually were geolocated by aircraft systems, so not exact. Second - the HARM like used in 1991 had only an inertial guidance unit, not very precise, so the miss distance could be quite big on longer ranges.
In practice, hits on radars that stopped emiting were said to be rare. Usually same radar went on the air later or the next day. Some SAMs were shot at with HARMs several days in a row, only to be timely turned off and came back on air next day. But hits on non-emiting radars were also usually hard to be verified. If the radars stops emiting exactly in a moment the HARM time to target reached zero, or when the HARM explosion was seen in a distance, then it could be safely assumed it was destroyed. If it was turned off earlier - it was hard to tell. There might be some cases of radars / SAMs being damaged by splinter.
Part 2 naval version please
Does DCS have JDAM-ER yet?
We have a version of it in GR.
Watch out the US D.O.D will send The NCIS after you….lol
Do they send Leroy Jefro Gibbs😂
Should redo with patriot.
Next Time Vs S400 S350 Pantsir SM Tor M2 Tor M2 Tenguska with matrix controlling IADS .
Just asking again, mind doing a scenario of the furry fandom against something?
it’s a shame dcs doesn’t have more sam’s that can do self defense against harms . only one is like tor or sa10 everything else waits to be hit
Patriot and s300 do
Soooo... FNAF a la DCS...? :)
How you doing cap anymore news on your spying wink wink 😜😜 don't forget my camera pen ok 😂
what no comments yet?
lol u put more planes than manpads.. u do realize igla manpad is cheaper than f16.. if anything u will have numerous manpads, in the dozens if not more at a specific target area and approaches to it. also where is the Early warning station that is mobile or awacs to support with intelligence to sams?
Why call Hornets "Bogs"? I don't know much about Navy lingo.
It's a long story, but short version was he used to call it a Wagner mobile after wags from Eagle Dynamics. And after some discussion started calling it a bogachev which is shortened to Bog.
It stems from his lack of love for the 18.
Somebody needs to be "Making The Video", maybe get somebody who doesn't fly in DCS?
You realy can't stop cheating 🤣