4WD MOD LAWS & TRACK CLOSURES - What Australia needs to learn from the USA to SAVE 4WDing!
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- Опубликовано: 20 авг 2024
- Shauno & Jesse LIVE from ARIZONA in the USA! 🦅
This month’s HOT TOPIC 🔥 Has Australia taken their vehicle modification laws too far?
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Shaun & Jesse were confronted by the extent of the modifications that American 4WDs can have in the US compared to here in AUS where you can be defected for having 1cm of tyre poking out! 👉 Let us know your thoughts on Australia’s modification laws in the comments below!
BONUS HOT TOPIC❗Can we learn from the USA when it comes to looking after our tracks & keeping them open?
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It’s not just 4wding, it’s also the shooting, fishing, dirt bike riding, hiking, etc. communities that are being targeted. We need to all work together to advocate for more suitable laws
Absolutely
Open Mt Warning
Nailed on the head mate, everything is hit left, right and centre. But there are people in these groups that make it easy to target the rest of us. We need to clean our backyard to strengthen our position so it will be harder for the "powers to be" to say no
@@simeondeherluin9811 Its open
+Rock Climbing 😢
That's crazy the Queensland outlaws 35" tires, in the USA, we have STOCK rigs that come from the factory with 35s
Haha that must be bloody awesome mate. Yeah the laws are a bit strict here in Queensland
This ☝️
Yup same as Canada 🇨🇦 we love it
Power of the people. You vote or and let the Karens run government then they outlaw 35s. From an expat Aussie.
@@MattPrattWho votes does not matter, its who counts the votes that matters. Ever wonder why they always make you do it in pencil...😅
An example of the ridiculous laws we have. In NSW I wanted to remove the rear seats in my Y62. After a lot of trouble finding out the regulations it turned out to remove 2 seats required a Blue Slip and rego to be update to make the car a 6 seater. To remove one more seat (entire rear row) I would have had to have the car engineered and the car reclassified as it would no long be regarded as a passenger vehicle.
How does the removal of seats that can be folded down and not used require any form of inspection let alone full engineers report.
Thanks for raising the issues we are all experiencing and hopefully some sanity will prevail.
Absolutely ridiculous
It's the same in Queensland.
Ive grown up 4wding and have watched as the scene has changed over the last 30+ years. My grandparents travelled the country from the high country to the cape and the deserts before the time of GPS or even mobile phones. The adventures they had can never be repeated. Their passion continued on through my parents and onto me. I now have my own business in the industry, setting up vehicles suitably to travel this country for individuals wants and needs.
The reality is that we can see a lot of the country with only "mild mods" and this should be fit within the guidelines of 50mm lift and 50mm tyre diameter increase without engineering certification. For anything outside that scope, it shouldn't matter what the tyre size or the track width etc is as long as the vehicle passes engineering. So, the practical side i.e swerve tests and brake tests as well as satisfactory structural inspections etc.
The reason for regulations are to ensure the safety of all road users, so if the vehicle passes the tests/ proves to have sufficient handling abilities, then that should be the bottom line.
As for track management, the culture of 4wders has swung in direction of people who don't necessarily appreciate the bush, and seem to view it as a semi lawless place where you can carry on, be disrespectful of your surroundings and others without consequence. Thats a culture thats got to stop before we loose the right to access the bush.
Id prefer to see tracks stay open rather than see them locked up and inaccessible. Theres a lot of old tracks that were bloody hard that have been closed over the years because they became too hard to maintain or deemed too unsafe. Instead of destroying the track with a dozer, put a sign at either end stating that its of extreme difficulty and proceed at your your own risk. If you've got a vehicle thats built to be able to tackle technical 4wheeling as well as safely drive there then you should be allowed to do so.
Go see Australia, make memories, make the most of what we have on our doorstep and take your rubbish home.
Spot on mate
The right to access the bush… sorry, but we don’t work for the government
So this is definitely the comment that I relate to. We went to Fraser (not playing that game) in 2021, and ended up camped with so much toilet paper on the ground that we were forced to move to a section that was 'clean' for hygiene reasons, but certainly still littered with this same toilet paper. It was everywhere. In regards to the 'culture' of the new 4wd owners, towards the end of our stay, a 79 series came flying up the beach, onto the sand dune (with vegetation) and then proceeded to camp not 50m away from us. Music and all of that going, with the lighting etc, and we just packed up the next day and took off to Brisbane. This really ruined our stay and memories of the place and he had no need to create another path, when there was already enough paths to choose from. It is even to the point where I can winch a guy out who is desperately stuck, and not even get a thank you or 'what do you drink...'
The toilet paper is not new and we lost a spot in FNQ recently and the last time I drove into this area years ago, I spotted this Patrol next to a flowing waterway, he had shit all up and down the waterway, not bothering to dig or even cover his faeces, and this area was closed within 3 months.
I do not know the answer, but 2017 Fraser was cleaner, and in 2021...
Australia is the ultimate nanny state. We do need some laws to stop outright stupidity but we have far too many restrictions in this country. A channel like this can harness our political voice in a way nothing else can. Keep up the good work guys!
Yep punish everyone except the people who offend
So glad they are speaking out, might have a chance 🤞🏻
Did you know... Australia has THE MOST laws of ANY country on Earth?! Australia has OVER 1 MILLION laws!!!!!
Dont look at canada
@@michaelferguson387 yeah cuz they'll still do the wrong thing anyway.
The sad truth is that a certain small but very visible percentage of people leave trash behind. I always come back from the trails with at least one bag full of trash, and many times, I come across mounds of human waste with dirty toilet paper "flags" on top. How hard is it to bury it? They aren't even using biodegradable camping paper. My friends I wheel with do the same. The crazy thing is, we wheel some of these trails every month, and there is always new trash. Then we also have people who graffiti and/or shoot at ruins and historic sites. There are a lot of A-holes out there, and we need to find a way to better educate, enforce, and peer-pressure these types of people.
I got the best karma the other week.
I was 3 hours from where I currently, live in my home town, decided to go for a drive out to my favourite spot on earth. Some grub had thrown a camp chair into the bushes.
If I hadn’t of stopped to spend the time to pick up that chair I would have missed one of my favourite 4x4 channels showing up (aussiearvos) which were in QLD from VIC. The chances of our paths crossing were altered just because I picked up a bit of rubbish!!!
It only takes one person to wreck everything for the rest of us
Peer pressure is huge, if you see someone doing the wrong thing call them out, used to have to call out my group all the time, now they get it
"we need to find a way to better educate, enforce, and peer-pressure these types of people"
A cricket bat works well.... Just sayin.
This is bigger than trash mate
The point Jessie made about clubs looking after tracks, Mixed with your point of keeping them open for everyone is great that’s 100% what we need to see in Australia.
They do it at Fraser.
Also do it in vic, but shut some tracks and your only allowed up if your in the club, total bull, need to be managed by the club but open to public
@@terrybailey4039 we need it everywhere though, not just Fraser.
Torn totally agree
I feel like the guidelines should be made by a 4wder and not someone who thinks the mods are dangerous and shouldn't be allowed.
It would definitely help if the guidelines were created in kahoots with someone who knows 4WDing & 4WDs!
People who know are busy living.
The people who want to change rules are busy sooking
In America you can have a vehicle that is rusted to nothing and still be within the law
There are two sides to every story
I wonder which side the statistics agree with
What if you're a 4WDer who thinks mods are dangerous
A lot of 4wders wouldn't know a safe mod if it smacked them in the face.
There needs to be a regulatory body representing 4wders (or car people in general) that collaborate with engineers and the government.
That way there should be a happy medium.
Oh, and a national set of rules, instead of state would be fantastic.
U.S. fan here, been following you all for about 6 years now. Appreciate the content fellas, and glad to see you visiting!
Time for a convoy to Canberra I reckon. Organize it during school holidays, get families involved, get kids on the news saying they're sad dads car got defected, sad camping is too expensive, sad dad no longer takes them out on weekends.... Submit a list of demands regarding mods, closures, forestry closing tracks on power trips, and councils charging money for entry to our own crown land along with a petition with thousands of signatures
using your kids ? to parrot what you want them to say ? gross.... failure of a parent
I run 37 inch tires, 5.13 chromoly gears, 6 inch long arm lift on my two Door Rubicon. Runs great on the road and drove all the way across the USA. I'm bumping up to 42 inch tires next.
the bigger the tyre the less talented the wheeler ...
@@markhowells13 we just have bigger rocks here in the USA.
Fkn seppos …
Just tell them your 40s identify as 33s
Good idea mate 😂
😂
Haha yeah mate
Even better - my 4.5l twin turbo diesel identifies as electric
🤣
I've been a cop in Colorado for 15 years. I've never had or have heard of a modified rig causing an accident due to the mods. My only concern would be rocks, debris, water that the tires kick up causing broken windshields and visibility problems for other drivers. This can be solved with flaps that can be removed for when the rig is off road.
shauno out here complaining about getting done for flares/mudguards that dont cover the poke of the wheels. Doing exactly what you describe
I'd have to disagree with you. I work a trade so I'm constantly on the road. Twice have I seen a lifted truck lose a KFC chicken bucket wheel on the road and said wheel smash into other vehicles on the road. Not to mention the idiots who blind everyone on the road who install HID headlights and not adjust the beam. They have caused accidents. You might want to have your captain put you on highway patrol.
@@abeliiibecerra5281 I also work a trade and I see Utes going side ways on wet roundabouts every time it rains. tradie Utes, dads in Utes, even my bosses BOG STANDARD BT50 with all the modern safety features slides out on wet roundabouts regularly. its got nothing to do with being lifted and HID headlights are no brighter than the stock headlights that come on nearly every modern car these days.
4WD 24-7 read my mind. Fantastic to see you guy's putting your influence in the right places. You guy's are the best!
Expat of 17 years in the US: all my family is still in Australia. Every time I go back the nanny state feeling is worse. Australia feels like a bunch of judgy Karens about everything.
In the US I have an LS swapped toyota on 40" tires with home built suspension. Most people are stoked on it.
In the US they don't require a bunch of engineering BS for vehicle mods. Let insurance sort it out.
No one wants to hurt anyone in their modified vehicle. In Australia Karen down the street sees your truck with 40s and with her expert engineering knowledge (feels) calls the cops on you. Lobbies for legislation for the things she doesn't care for.
In the USA there is more "love and let live". Less power in the Karens. Karen has less reaction to your 40s or thinks "freedom hell yeah" and the cops are definitely "freedom hell yeah". "Who are you actually hurting by driving this modified vehicle, maybe I should solve some actual crime".
I'm seriously thinking of moving because of this! I got my ute taken off the road for 35"tyres and a having a after market turbo. Was wild as. As I just spent 2k on overhauling the whole break system. And I'm a deisle mechanic but they wouldn't have a bar of it. It's definitely the nanny country
@backwoodslogging8443 Yeah Covid lockdowns were crazy in Australia.
I hate to brake it to you but it's not about your vehicles or any other "thing", it's about targeting people that are self reliant and forcing them to be reliant on the government. The biggest obstacle to complete government control is large numbers of self reliant, self sufficient citizens. In other words, if you rely on yourselves than your not reliant on the government and that means they can't control you.
I agree, well said!
Exactly.
Well said
Convid and jabs mandates, went down hill fast from there
North shore (Noosa) is a great example of a track being loved to death. Being a 4wder myself (but also a greeny in my own right), even I think it should be closed if something isn't done. It's straight up getting ruined from lack of simple solutions. We need a group to stand up and put simple amenities (composting drop toilets for example) and more rubbish bins, limit permit numbers etc. If it had a group taking care of it and enforcing rules, it would be so much nicer of a place. The police can only do so much and only tend to target on long weekends, holidays etc anyways. People need to start standing up and taking control themselves. This is a great video guys. Keep up the work for raising awareness.
half the people getting angry here will be the ones leaving a pile of bundy cans next to the river alongside a half smouldering fire while they drive home half pissed and doing tik toks for their mates about how they opened a can at 6 am *facepalm*
They are being targeted because a good modified 4x4 means you have freedom to go most places on and offroad, this is what govt doesn't want us to have,FREEDOM!!
Cheers Jesse and Shauno!
Agreed!!
agreed! you's stay in your homes. you'l go nowhere. you'l own nothing. and you'l be happy about it. the WEF is in all countries now
It’s not just 4x4’s being targeted. You often seen police set up ready to defect cars leaving car meets or near an event of some kind.
I agree that a code of practice based on science could work. But we also need to annual road worthy checks for registration purposes. Some of the least road worthy cars aren’t modified.
I couldn’t agree more when you say police are picking on modified cars
My friend had his plates confiscated because he had a wheel flair fall off so the one wheel had poke.. and a dead brake light.
That is definitely not worth number plate confiscation..
Driven Wild 4x4 have an event next weekend specifically to clean up the Glass House mountains tracks!
We spoke to Jesse and Graham about it at the Brissy 4x4 show and they were super keen to get behind it!🙌🏼
What we need is a
4WD24/7 parlament party in office and Shauno for priminister 🤘🏼👌🏼
I like your thinking 🤔
Bloody oath mate! A joint board with 4x4 24-7 crew, Adam Greentree, fly Joe Rogan and RFK Jr over 😉 and we would become the most thriving country the world has seen!
@@lavishcorrectionscoatings6681
I thought you were serious until you mentioned RFK jr
@@Ktmfan450 😂 leave him out then 🤷🏽♂️ I only care about the wheeling and hunting 😉…. And keeping WEF out of Australia
@@lavishcorrectionscoatings6681 There already plenty Billionaires with influence in Australia
No wonder yall came here and were blown away after you see how we modify our rigs in the states. I pray Aussie loosen up and allows a little more freedom to modify your vehicle in any way you’d like and enjoy the outdoors, which is ultimately the number one reason I (and most of us) are in this hobby.
Gday, i am in BC Canada. So many tracks here are being closed because of the amount of trash left behind and people driving through sensitive area with out any care about the environment. I belong to the BC4X4 Association, which is a not profit group and this group does regular cleanup and maintenance of off grid camping sites etc and it is well represented at RV shows, Outdoor shows etc. As more modified vehicles there are many restrictions here as well. I think education is the key to keeping off road tracks open
I’d love to understand the frequency rate, or stats of the like where by the modifications on a heavily modified offroad vehicle are the contributing factor in comparison to standard vehicle rate. Standardisation Nationally could also have its benefits!! Keep it up team!!!
BHP Biliton did a study in 2012 comparing vehicles with accessories fitted
They pretty much found out that you were better off being in a standard vehicle than if it had a bullbar and roll bar fitted in a crash
I am in the Toyota landcruiser club western australia. We have adopted the Holland Track. There are a few clubs in the west that have adopted other tracks.
I immigrated to Australia 22 years ago from Belgium. I've been into 4WDing in Belgium. Australia is a nanny state. In Belgium or Europe for that matter, its a lot worse. You can't change nothing on your 4wd over there. In comparison Australia in my eyes is a lot better. But having lived here now for 22 years, I wished I'd immigrated to the US instead. I've been to the US in 1995, 7 years before I came to Australia. If only I'd known then what I know now.
Thanks for all the kind words about our back country guys, we love seeing you here in the states. Im sure im not alone when I say we appreciate the exposure to parts of Australia that us here in the USA may never get the chance to see person 👍
This is just a reoccuring issue over and over about tracks closing and more restictions put in place. Nothing is going to change if the 4wd community in aus doesn't clean up their act and stop being a bunch of bogans. It's extremely rare for me to see a track that hasn't been torn to shreads outside of the marked track, rubbish everywhere etc. Tele track, absolute prime example.
@@kiwismurf4536 Yep. Nailed the problem.
@@kiwismurf4536mate tracks a meant to be driven, what are you supposed to do pull up and have a tea party when it rains, you probably drive a stock triton
Not exactly true... I was reamed and threatened by a ranger in Eurimbula NP in QLD for... moving a fallen tree OFF the main track. People had made a fresh new track around the fallen tree instead of just moving it out of the way. The new track was butchered and a right fkn mess so I moved the tree to block the new track and reopen the original one. Another important factor is, the original track IS A GAZETTED ROAD which is on maps! So... I did the right thing and blocked a bypass track that was destroying bushland, reopened the original ROAD/track and I was threatened with a $10,000 fine for doing so! It has NOTHING to do with the state of the tracks, it's all about control and restricting us from doing anything. It's purely government overreach and Gestapo control!
@@user-lu2vt8cv3m yes I agree. But why are chainsaws banned in parks? I agree it's stupid, but unfortunately there's that 1 percent of morons who'll bring their chainsaw into a park and cut down green trees etc etc. I've seen it plenty of times.
@@user-lu2vt8cv3m bunch of idiots,yeah just clear the track is almost always the way to go, no point creating a bloke if you don’t have to, as for everyone carrying on about big tyres, what about big rock steps, deep mud, and other hard obstacles, can understand having an a and b line, for cruisers and tritons, not gonna kill any more frogs than 1 track, or the chemicals that they put in the water turning them
Gay
Can't get behind this enough. Down with bureaucratic Idiocracy, viva la revolution.
I’m from america and moved over here 10 years ago and used to offroad a hilux/tacoma 2wd that was lifted with prerunner accessories but could go anywhere, especially on sand. The laws here especially with lifts and fender flares is ridiculous, when it comes to off roading how much clearance you have makes a huge difference as well as tires. In arizona and the uk you can have a side by side on the road, those would be perfect on places like fraser, etc. The ford raptor would be a beast if they would put a 4-6” lift with bigger tires like they do in the states.
Good on you boys! Stick with this! We should do a respectful 4WD convoy on parliament to show our support
Maybe include some of the 4wd clubs in your trips to help show great work they do and promote joining 4wd clubs.
Agreeable but you shouldn't have to join a 4x4 club to explore our backyard.
I’m from Darwin and I had a jeep TJ wrangler with a 4 link and long arms on 4 inch lift with 35’s and it would pass the engineering test but was also told there is no point engineering it in Darwin because it won’t matter if I went interstate cause they’ll defect me anyway. Travelled Australia and was lucky enough to not get done for any mods. But Australian rules are a joke for people doing the right thing and making 4wd safe!
Keep up the good topics and epic vids lads
In QLD, I was defected for having DRL's on my GQ Patrol, because it didn't come with them from factory, it was deemed ILLEGAL. They were small DRL's in my bullbar, from a Nissan Navara.
You lads are spot on the money. Engineering here in Australia is also over governed. We allow our engineers to do their jobs properly then the actual upgrades on some of our 4bies are very minor.
Well done lads and keep pushing 😎🤙🏾
Seano for Prime Minister. Your chat about making national policy for car mods was spot on and the most that anyone has made sense in a long time. 👏👏👏
In most states, vehicle modification follows pretty much the same rules, except for Queensland-they've got their own thing going on. They all go by the same Vehicle Modification Bulletins (VSB).
I do agree the laws are incredibly restrictive. The second issue on top of the restrictive laws, is the difficulty in getting a modified car engineered if you want to do it legally. For example, if you were to make significant suspension modifications to a car equipped with ESC, it requires an ESC stability test...which is $20000.
The result of this is people who want to modify their vehicle, often drive illegal defectable vehicles because of the cost in getting the certifications and doing it properly. The second nasty result of that is illegally modified vehicles often have their insurance voided in an accident.
No limits 4x4 are doing a clean up of the telly track in october
Good luck with the efforts down under! Glad to see you enjoying the adventure here.
We should all get together on these issues with laws track being closed exc. If we all stand up for the future it will be a lot harder for the people in power to ignore us.
Keep trails clean
Keep trails open
I have personally sat in a meeting where Nat Parks guys were talking about a place where " Up to 5 4x4's drove through a creek causing irreparable damage". I have a property that is 20km away from the the area in question and pointed out that the "damage" will last until the next rain. I had a tree of 450mm diameter and 15meters in length travel down stream 700 meters in the last rain, that would damage more landscape than 50 4x4's. All this BS is based on emotion not reality. In OZ we have a small amount of delusional zealots dictating to the entire population. But the reality is we support it with the 2 party duopoly and resistance to vote for minor party's that support our cause. We have a 2 party take it in turns dictatorship in reality and it is entrenched, Lib Lab Blue Maroon, media entrenched 2 choice mind set. We need to think and react outside the established media.
USA also has a 2 party system but we don't have these problems in Republican States 😂😂😂
Don’t forget WA.
This is the absolute last bastion for touring in your 4WD and rarely touched country. Happy to jump on this push to keep our access open. With respect to First Nations and tracks of course 💪
WA is absolutely brilliant in many ways and has not suffered the same extent of track closures as other states. It is however frustrating the amount of tracks that are being blocked off by mines, whilst in the land surrounding those mines is incredibly over regulated. Can't camp in Lancelin dunes anymore but sand mining is fine, being a prime example.
Extensive ARB bar work, a custom snorkel, a 4-inch lift and those great Dirtylife DT2 17x9in wheels . Coil Conversion GVM Upgrade 4495 Kg 6X6 .
You need to bring all the 4WD after market accessorie supplies, 4WD vehicle supplies, offroad caravan and offroad trailer supplies Australia wide together to support national 4WD standards and keeping tracks open.
Because if we can't modify our 4x4 safely and take our 4WD,, offroad caravans and trailers Offroad and on our favourite tracks. People will stop buying their products.
Also all 4WD clubs including Hunters and fishers and generally all 4WDers Australia wide to participate in a combined organised partition to the relevant authorities. United as one
Australia can do this 👍
Just about every aspect of Australian life is over regulated.
Quite a few other countries too, like South Africa, Canada, New Zealand etc. I wonder if there is a common thing that ties them all together...
Oh you poor bastard.
What a strange conversation when I literally rented a jeep Rubicon from budget Rent-A-Car in Boston Massachusetts that came with 35s from the factory
The thing with Americans, is that they have a greater sense of responsibility for their community and their passions, because they dont have such an overbearing state looking over their shoulders.
This is a very endearing quality about Americans which i wish we had more of here in Europe.
A national code is a good start.
Engineering is the key here, the backyard mods is the issue and always has been. Car enthusiast is the issue because we see so many "builds" that are 1/2 done or 3/4 done without realising that hey if I modify this then I have to also modify that..... that's the issue so should all mods be engineered? The argument also comes down to insurances or insurability so you say a slightly illegal mod being let go is just a poor statement and needs a rethink, because if that vehicle is in an accident no. 1 your insurance is gone, No.2 your totally liable for the accident and if there is injury or death well your in a world of hurt.
1. National Code.
2. Clear guidelines on simple mods that can be done unengieneered.
3. Clear guidelines on Engineering.
I agree that there should be a size limit on Tyers however for the simple reason of ruts..... the bigger the tyer the deeper the ruts that get cut which then limits the amount of vehicles that can access those tracks. Until we get a national track maintenance crews big tyres are just going to suck for everyone.
Either that or learn how not to abuse tracks buy not trying to get bogged and digging trenches........
As an a group we are our own worst enemies and that's just a sad fact.
We have all those things.
1. National Code. (ADRs)
2. Clear guidelines on simple mods that can be done unengieneered. (State based rules apply here, each state publishes these rules online)
3. Clear guidelines on Engineering.(Must still comply with ADRs and can sometimes exceed state based limits, see the likes of DMW doing secondary manufacturing to comply with these rules. State based rules generally dictate what falls into this category.)
What seems to be most disagreed on, is what mods fit into each category. Most if not all seem to bemoan what is allowed under point 2.
This is not a new issue, it's just that 4wds are now a larger group and are now more of a visible target.
Instead of whinging maybe 4wd27 need to educate viewers on how to do it properly, or why they think the 'proper' way is wrong, or inappropriate.
I don't want to be that guy but only one of the examples that the boys used in this video was tracks actually being closed
The rest were about tracks being closed for upgrade to make them more accessible which is what we should want any way
Totally agree mate if you can't get up a track with 33's or 35's use a winch see far to many old 4x4's with tyre that are to big for the shit brakes that won't stop over the top lifts that won't go around corners usually ripping bog holes to bits. Talking at 100 mph doesn't make you right.
@@longway1 Maybe if people stopped filming themselves and posting it online calling themselves influencers the law wouldn't be so tough on average Joe
Yes mate one has to wonder if it's the amount of money some or most of these so call influencers are lining there pockets with is the motivating factor. I haven't and won't watch all of this show as l don't want to support this kind of channel.
Saying Hello From, Boston, Massachusetts!!! As, Eagle Scout (Highest Level In Boy Scouts), The Scouts Motto is “Leave No Trace”!!! We Carry Out, and Properly Dispose Of Whatever Trash, That We Bring to a Campsite!!! We Also, Do a Trash Pick Up Line, To Pick Up Every Little Bit of Trash!!! I am 27 Years Old, and My Truck/UTE Is a 2016 Ford F-350 Lariat Super Duty 4X4 6.7L PowerStroke Turbo-Diesel!!! I am a Huge Fan of The Channel!!! Keep Up, With The Awesome Content Y’all!!!
Sounds like a beast of a truck!
@@waronwoke It Is A Beast, and I Love It!!! It Has 440 H.P. And 862 Pound-Foot (1169 Newton Meters) Of Torque!!!
Good on ya for picking one of the boys, $100 isn't much for us adults but it's huge for a kid & great way to help keep them interested in 4x4s ❤️
Also though, the bigger the tires, the bigger the ruts for the next guy. There have been a few atv trails get shit down because people were running 40s on SxS and atvs and tear the trails up too much.
Love how they get into the Jeeps in the USA 😜
Edit: would love to see a Jeep in the Aus trip videos
Keep an eye out for a Jeep next week legend...
@@4WD247 ohhhh. Cant wait. Thank you
jeeps are rubbish. unless you get the rubicon, then fix it. plus needs to be 4 door..
We don't need any more Jeeps here mate. They can bugga off those pieces of trash haha
Jeeps are boring. Bolt on everything from a handful of aftermarket companies. JK/JL all look the same. Stuff like the custom builds (dirty 30) are way more interesting
I had no idea you couldn't even run 35s.... That's crazy. We have trucks that come standard with 37s from factory
I do 100% agree with your comments on vehicle modifications, the restrictions, track closures and the focus on the wrong issues, especially as a QLD'r. If we are going to tackle the gov head on with both modifications & track closures the only avenue would be through the National 4wd association.
As you say the voice you have is through being the biggest media outlet at the moment is helpful and if you got other outlets on board to support we might see some changes although if the 4WD association is not supported buy some of the modification suppliers & club funding, unfortunately it takes $$ to make change here now not just common sense, we as the touring and 4wd community would support it.
What I like about Australia is the engineering component. Someone who wants to operate a safe vehicle for myself and others on the road, I appreciate the expert engineering guidance. Nothing like that here in Canada.
One thing about 4WDs that we need to think about is the safety of those outside the vehicle. I’d really hate to be a pedestrian coming face to face with a huge steel bumper and a winch. Not sure how to find the middle ground on that.
The science based approach makes complete sense.
🙄why the f*ck pedestrians on the road . For educated people they know to walk on the side and drive on road so they can't hit by steel bumper or otherwise you are the most idiotic person i have seen in my entire life that is blaming modified 4 wd to hit you with steel bumper on the road ..
Three things that would make a big difference with no change to public interest or in fact increase it.
1. Nationalise modifications not state by state. Modification manufacturers are then assured of an Aust wide market and service and price their offering accordingly. At the moment that is done mod by mod and takes years of lobbying. The national GVM/GCM upgrade rule is a good example.
2. There is no reason SSM or pre-rego modifications cannot be extended to used vehicles. That would encourage manufactures both local and from overseas to invest in making them available and at a lower price point with the additional volume. For instance today outlying over $50K to the one SSM manufacturer that widens the track of a Hilux is crazy.
3. Without the above punters are pushed into adopting mods with varying degrees of safety, don't comply and automatically are not insured. Everyone is at risk under this current arrangement and compliance crackdowns won't change it. It could start with a national code then a grace period for those to get their mods certified or run the risk of eye watering penalties for non compliance.
My three bobs worth.
what,, the fk, is the difference between a new vehicle, & 1 a week old. or 10 yrs.. NONE. maybe go to the u.s. learn.. engineers are starving over there, as they dont get 4k per bs upgrade.. holden commodores, had 26 defects from factory,, but thats o.k. my bro worked there.. worst car on the road.. plus, the gov lets cars in the country, that are rubbish.. so where do you want to start..???.. ITS TAX MONEY, NOTHING ELSE. unless you kill someone in the u.s. no one gives a fk.. anyone, buying a 4x4, to go, 4x4ing, needs to do a 3 month course, in how to not die or kill other people.. be responsible. we went with another club to an excellent property. then some dik in the other club did donuts. banned.. 4x4rs here have the same laws as cars, which is bs, its not a car.. hilux, main & most rolled vehicle in aus.. but thats o.k.. i watched a toyota fj, ifs front, drive slow down a 10'' drop, it rolled.. all ifs sht tie rods & cv,s.. there not meant to go off road.. i have a 1975 f250 highboy. its 26'' to the sill.. std, from factory, sold here to forestry, gov, army.. there the same as the chev cucv, & dodge power wagon.. which we never got.. so if i legaly raise it, it will be 28'' to the sill. hows yours.......they come std with 800 x 16'' wheels.. this,aus, is the only country on earth, where everything is illegal..
Welcome to what Street Machines have been copping for years.
Vehicle modifications is a multi million dollar enterprise and needs a proper voice.
Its a shame what happened to all the tracks at Alkimos beach, i grew up offroading there with my dad was young & i always remember there being a massive sign saying “trespassers subject to prosecution” due to wildlife and habitat reasons written below and how offroading was damaging the ecosystem and all that, but only a few years ago they started building houses on top of all this habitat that 4wdrivers were such a threat to. Seems pretty hypocritical of the WA Gov.
the Alkimos tracks were closed a year before i could get my license while i was still in the process of building my setup for my 4wd and i’ve been devo’d that i couldnt revisit that place with all the mates i grew up with
Awesome video as always Shaun and Jesse. Y’all’s adventures in the USA 🇺🇸 have been some epic times. Can’t wait to see y’all’s next adventures here in the USA 🇺🇸 and in Australia 🇦🇺.
They're targeting 4WD's and old cars PURELY to get them off the road. They want EVERYBODY in an EV that can be controlled by third parties remotely, there's NOTHING more to it... Prove me wrong.
USA guy here. Be careful wishing for bigger tires. Like Blunty said, 37s are the new 35s. I've had trails that used to be fine and passable with a little bit of 4x4 skill. You could do them stock or with 33s. Then 35s came. couldn't do them anymore on 33s. So you bump up. Then the 37 guys went up to 40s. Made the trail harder for 35s. Then 42s....
If you can protect the trails and keep them from degrading good on ya. But bigger tires, side by sides, mixed use, etc all deteriorate.
The tough part for open for everyone is, then you have people who don't want nature hurt. You should see the camp site I had in Moab. That trail to get there is closing due to complaints that it impacts where sheep lamb their babies. So it's a balance, you can protect nature by restricting vehicle access, but then not everyone would be able to get out and see it.
Well said
Spot on with everything there. My answer to the question 'why' is that it's easier for legislators to simply say a blanket no to something they don't understand. Takes work for them to understand and that's all just too hard....Super frustrating
I'm.apart of a 4wd club and a few of the members would agree with you boys and the laws being to strict I agree that the government needs to have a look at it and have another think about it
Have to disagree, one national standard would just mean that the beaurecrats would combine all the most harsh aspects of every state engineering code and combine them into one.
QLD is the most lax state for engineering in the country, at least as it stands currently you could get your car regoed in QLD, get it engineered fairly easily and cheap (no emissions testing for example) and then take it back to your home state (which I have done before)
you're right. It's the states part of the United States that keeps freedom alive.
Only issue I see with 40s is ruts, so already we have complaints from drivers on 31s, even 33s that diff out, we have tracks already getting multiple lines and ruts so deep even 35s struggle, so do we need this! 35s is enough for real drivers, over that its comp and closed course only, however we should be able to modify our vehicles even with better than factory bolt on's, even engineering is overkill for these, all we need here is a std that is met by the manufacture of said product, eg a tough dog Panhard or Superior Panhard for example, they are way better than factory, but the tire size I am not convinced its needed for majority of what we do, going bigger increases risk of damage to tracks and we need to promote responsibility, accountability so our tracks dont get closed down! As for Gvt they are just targeting us because they can gather revenue, they don't target crims or unsafe vehicles, they have no money unless its drug money, its like all laws its tax revenue, not education or prosecution for crims and unlawful behaviors, we see that every day in parliament! Agree with the rules at the end, btw I had modded my 80s, full engine mods, Superior under chassis, still got more to do, but I'm not going above 35s they are more than enough for an 80s, otherwise steering box's, axles CVs bushings all get a hammering and more problems than they solve! Correct mods, correct lift and well thought out rather than throwing money at big wheels, if ya want that go comp truck and compete in closed course competition and go at it properly!
Completely agree, but 35s are the new 33s and 37s are the new 35s, so many tracks in the vic high have been dozed and are like highways, great for the bloke in his mux, we can’t doze everything, keep the fire trails dozed and that’s it
So great to see you guys back in the U.S, what a great channel!! Cant wait for the next episode in the States. Thanks guys take care and stay safe and always remember "Miles And Miles Of Smiles"😊😊😊
Funny that you use the term “Free for all” in the US as if it is a bad thing. Free. For. All.
Love you guys.
You need to get Pauline Hanson in this she can represent us at the table
💯👏
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
If there's a buck in it for her you'll see her there
You are funny, she can't even represent herself.
What a disaster she'd create.
Even 35s destroy many tracks here let alone 40". Should limit to 32 or 33 at worst. Many of us "4wd'er" are just looking for campsites and sceneries. Not to mention firetrucks etc. which need to use the tracks for work.
Not to mention the health hazard lugging a 90KG is if you get a flat tyre
I've been off roading for a friggin lotta years and old enough to remember when 31" tyres were considered large.
It was a time when trails were open, one could venture far & deep into shrub.
Now days, tracks that are open get so cut up by people simply doing the wrong thing, then wonder why the tracks get closed.
In the good old times of 31", everyone was in the same category as each other, if you'd repair damage to the track for one, you repaired it for everyone.
Now days, I come along on my 32", some clown has chopped the crap out of the terrain on large tyres, I have to rock fill, shovel dirt over to fill and retain rocks securely (as we used to, fixing it for all) knowing full well I've wasted my time as some other clown will come thru & rip it all up again.
I'm too old for that shit now, it's hard work, so stop destroying the tracks, drive according and if you damage it, fix it, yes for all.
God knows if a park ranger comes along and can drive the track, there's a better chance it'll stay open, but if he can't, it'll be recommended for gating and MVO (Management Vehicle Only) and gees those gates and signs are becoming so consistent.
24/7, you need to lead by example, chew it up, then stop and fix it up. Better still, don't chew it up in the first place.
Many many videos show you taking the hard line when there is a far easier line available, yes the line the camera car took to get ahead in the first place.
Ex, Simpson desert, camera car tyre tracks around dunes, yet you take the hard line chopping the crap out of the dune peaks.
Tasmania, Shauno couldn't get thru, so then takes camera car line to position himself further along the hard track to winch others thru it, for christ sake, why?
Start by setting a better example guys.
35" should be max. but if you wheel with them just drive taking in the advantage offered you, don't rip up the track making it impassable for all, you're destroying it for all.
@ianweal3081 the whole point of the channel is to tackle tough track of course they take the hard line
Don't think about "what should the government allow" think in terms of " why do we let the government tell us how we can modify our own property"
As someone who worked for an environmental agency one of the issues with tracks are the ones who use the public tracks (Forestry for example )as if it’s their own private tracks and just rip them up spinning tyres digging ditches ect. As a rule of thumb to estimate the approximate cost to repair these track is approximately $100/ linear meter so a 1 km track can cost approximately $100,000/ km. With this in mind is one of the reasons for closing tracks. If people were sensible, mindful and respectful of the tracks then the cost of repair will be much less.
"strict regulations in Australia, maybe the strictest in the world"
You guys are sooooo wrong on that one.
Coming from europe (where you basically can't do anything), having been in the united states, Australia already is the happy medium.
You get some room to play, while still keeping it reasonable. Of course doing more is appealing, but there's already so much you can do, and make quite a capable off road vehicle
When it's all you know, of course Australian rules seem super restrictive. But having seen the full spectrum I believe Australia (or at least NSW) is very close to have it right already
HOW DARE you bring a constructive multi aspect calculated moderate view to a channel whos sole purpose is the one extreme...
A great many of the treks and adventures on this channel are fairly unremarkable but cool none the less spots that are there purely for the challenge. Its steep hills, big holes, borderline 4wd rolling tracks with an end goal that isnt a sight or a spot. Its just the end. Thats a large part of what these guys live and die for. You cant just base regulation and laws around that market. We absolutely sit at a happy medium. The VAST majority of adventures most Australians will do are on tracks that have there complex parts. But by and large can be completed with All Terrains, A locker, some mates and a winch. Nothing more, nothing less. Thats the majority you have legistlate for. The extremes are just that.
@@atheosxgaming yeah I know, my apologies for having some common sense 😅
You guys have such a big reach in Aus you should create a petition to bring to parliament for the community that you entertain.
Good to hear that we are doing some things right over here in the USA and that you guys can take some things back to Australia and hopefully apply them into the off-road world to keep tracks open and free from trash. That being said, trust me, we have a fair share of problems still over here in America particularly here in Utah where you guys recently were there are many groups trying to close down more and more local trails, there are a lot of people fighting this and doing all we can to keep our trails open and publicly accessible to everyone. The idea of having a local club adopting a trail to keep it maintained and free from trash helps tremendously. But I absolutely agree that should be open to everyone not just members of that club. It’s going to take a continued effort It sounds like in both countries for like-minded people to come together and keep these areas open. Like you said it’s a God-given right for every Australian to enjoy the land over there and it’s a God-given right for every American to enjoy our public lands over here.
Bureaucracy is Australia’s biggest problem, but where do you start?!? 247 you guys are doing a great job bring awareness to problems that never get enough attention
As an American I agree with what they are saying regarding finding a happy medium. Over here you can take a new Jeep straight from the dealer to the shop and have as much lift and aftermarket parts your bank account will allow for. When done properly with the right parts it can be as safe or safer as a factory vehicle. The danger in my opinion comes from people cutting corners so they can get the look without thinking about how what they are doing can affect the safety of the vehicle. I think the lack of safety laws also extends to the lack of periodic inspections required for vehicles (not just 4wd). The number of severely unmaintained, rusted out and downright dangerous vehicles is astounding and for the most part mechanics are only allowed to decline work on a vehicle but not report it as unsafe. I’ve seen and heard of a lot more accidents as a result of an unmaintained vehicle rather than a vehicle with bigger tires.
The reality of fixing laws in any level of government, anywhere, is to influence legislators. In the US, lobbyists, as corrupt as those practices can get, have the access to the politicians to get issues heard. If your clubs and associations don’t work together and spend the time and dues money to work your political system, then you be fighting a losing battle. You MUST find an advocate with a voice to make it work.
Would absolutely love to get a petition going for all 4wd driver to sign and take to the Government with some changes to modifications rules and get that happening. I would definitely sign. We have 35s on ours and feel very confident that we can get out of many situations that stock cars would not. Let's get that happening
I think this stems from a bigger issue with rural communities and city communities and the lack of understanding between the 2.
As a young guy who works in the Agricultural industry, there’s a gap between the country and the city that’s starting to show itself in my generation and emerging gens. As more and more people are born and grow up in densely populated areas, there is less of an understanding of what goes on in rural communities and farming communities, which is leading to a divide between them.
This applies to the top comment I saw mentioning all the other communities that are being affected by Australia’s laws/legislation/restrictions. It leads to people in power not having an understanding of the different communities and just thinking they’re all bad and damaging.
What needs to be done is all the different communities need to come to these government bodies and show and explain that they’re not bad IF THEY ARE regulated correctly in cohesion with members of those communities and industries.
Without discussions to bridge the gap, the gap will continue to grow until there is complete segregation
Im a member of a National 4x4 Club. We're in association with ARMA who has been lobbying our Government on behalf of 4wders here in Aus. Unlike the toothless tiger thas is the 4WD association, its actually a Nationwide Association that goes into bat for the 4wd community, without charging an arm and a leg!
Being a National Club we needed representation (and insurance) for all our members across the Country, which ARMA does!
The 4WDA requires membership in each state to the relevent 4WDA body in that state, which is cost prohibitive....and some States have disassociated themselves from this so called "peak body" as they're just lining their own pockets.
ARMA is fast becoming THE peak body for 4wd enthusiasts and and are putting their money where their mouth is....they are actively lobbying the Government for Nationalised requirements on vehicle modifications and rules, as well as keeping tracks open and unlocked!
Anyone in a 4wd Club, regardless of which State, should get behind ARMA!
Australian Recreational Motorist Association.
The issues I think we have with tracks and access is;
The govt agency’s that look after areas don’t have enough money to do the basics so if a repair is too expensive they just close it.
People are lazy and don’t take rubbish home.
The same with the toilet situation, we need more long drops at a minimum in these poplar areas so we don’t get tissue everywhere.
The govt should be working with clubs to help maintain areas.
Only need to look in Victoria to see how unmaintained parks Victoria/delwp areas are. I’m sure they do what they can but it’s not enough.
Looking forward to seeing more episodes in the U.S. Great to see you guys enjoying our wilderness as much as we do.
I'm in a Off-Road club in the US. I'm also in a PNW region 2 with all of our local clubs. We meet ounces a month as a group am we talk about what we can do to keep up with the trails with trash clean ups and also trail fixing from trees or filling in mud holes, fixing bridge crossings. We put on fun runs for everyone to join from club members an non club members showing how to keep the trails clean an up to par for everyone else to enjoy also later on.
Maybe you guys can try an make fun runs for everyone in Australia to show your home state to keep all your trails open
You guys seem pretty lucky compared to us in the UK the bobble hat brigade have got most of our lanes closed keep up the good work and love watching your shows
Hey they answered my question! Glad you all read them!
Come in Europe, every single modification is illegal... change tires size ? Illegal , lift ? Illegal , power modification ? Illegal , bar work ? Illégal , upgrade breaking ? Illegal to. Even air deflector are illegal. And 50% of track is closed. So nobody care about laws and try to make invisible or little upgarde.
don't know what part of Europe you're in, but that's not the case In the UK
@@danhopkinson2811 France
I'm from germany and love all your content. It is almost impossible to tune a car unsafe. Very strict rules and expensive crashtests and the police is strict and takes your car.
Who else reckons that the beers in the shed should be on a different day of the week so sometimes we get a beers in the shed and a normal 4wd vid but love the content boys
2 points, on adopt a track there was an example in Sydney where clubs got behind cleaning up an area for access, sadly once it was cleaned up the land administrators then sold it to a property developer and the space was lost for ever. On the modifications issue, many of the public land and off road parks in the USA allow unregistered vehicles including side by sides buggies etc. We need a "off road only registration" that allows a 4x4 or side by side to be towed to the area and used in state and national parks. Little like club rego for hot rods the standards can be greatly loosened within reason but by having a form of rego for this use then keeps it from being a free for all and a level of safe standards can be maintained.
In most of Europe every mod is illegal. I live in Romania where bigger tires (bigger than factory size) are illegal,bar work is illegal,engine swap is illegal….
Can’t believe I miss y’all! Next time you decided to come to the beautiful state of Colorado I’ll try to find you and go on a trail!🤙💪
If you guys put a national code of practice petition together I’ll sign it and if you guys put on a fundraiser I’ll be more than happy to contribute. Thanks for being the voice of the 4wd community guys really appreciate it.
Two things: Great to hear the US might be a regular stop and I cannot believe how green Arizona is this year.
Agreed, I went to Lithgo for a drive. There was a bunch of bike riders all sitting around a fire, made of discarded dirt bike tyres, plastic, and there was rubbish everywhere. I cleaned up the site after they had left. Took me a couple of hours but, while I was picking up crap, a couple in a 4x4 stopped and gave me a hand.
Later in the day I set up for the evening. Along comes Joe blogs and friends. They made a fire, made a lot of noise until 2 am and left a pile of bottles, cans and a few "organic land mines".
With a public toilet not 300 meters away.
All definitely still drunk and seemingly unfazed by the fact they drove off at seven am.
Even though my 4wd is engineered. I don't feel confident driving it in busy areas as cops are still likely to give me a yellow sticker because like you said, our laws are based on emotion and not science
Here in the US we have Jeeps and Broncos that come from the factory with 35's. The new 4runner Trail Hunter is rumored to be coming standard with 35's.
Think of your vision as a badass meal at camp and your social movement as cooking that meal for your mates. What will make it both delicious and nourishing for everyone? The ingredients of this meal will be the resources you will organize and mobilize. How will you do it? You already have a lot going for you, and your show is a great platform. Maybe look at other instances when Aussies stood up and made a positive change. How did they do it? But maybe most importantly, any successful social movement requires sustained effort. You must keep pushing. Just like you're doing a water crossing or climbing a steep track, you must maintain traction and momentum. You must believe in yourself and take this meal all the way. Good luck, and cheers from the US!!!
Thanks for your needed voices please keep doing that for the goodness of freedom in Australia and travelling and four wheel driving
I heard someone mention "St. Georges Syndrome" regarding another hapless battle thats happening but I think it applies to most issues in Australia. St. George slayed the biggest dragons in the land and was hailed a hero. But when there were no more big dragons he was no longer feeling heroic, so he went and slayed all the smaller dragons. Then when he ran out of dragons he went out looking for other battles to pick even fighting pointless battles just to maintain that honour of being a fighter.
This little story applies to SJWs, Identity Politics and also Policing. We have so few REAL dragons in Australia that the people doing the fighting are fighting anything they can to feel relevant and heroic.