The Scarlet Crusade's Rise and Embarrassing Fall in Warcraft
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- Опубликовано: 9 июн 2024
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0:00 Intro
2:19 The Puppet
4:34 The Ashbringer
9:34 Why Join the Crusade?
12:49 Classic
17:32 Wrath
21:33 Cataclysm
22:57 Mists
24:32 Legion
24:49 BFA
26:33 End
#WorldofWarcraft #WoW #WoWLore 
Игры
![The Story of Sally Whitemane (And the Scarlet Crusade) [Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/l7DpW0C84cM/mqdefault.jpg)
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Asmonbald will love this.
Urrrrg!!! Your story telling is second to none! Brilliant... just brilliant
Just grow a beard lads, problem solved.
Platinum wow you forget the Scarlett embesedor in stumwind church ungerdround.
the act fast keeps guy was intense.
the old lore is just so much more interesting than all of this new interplanetary galaxy super villain lore right now...
Urban and simple lores will ever be more interesting than cosmic shit
100 %
Yep. And from this video is super apparent how originality of the lore degraded over the expansions.
I point out the marvel crap movies era ... Everything must be big and flashy and ultraduper powerful
Legit what warhammer did and now Warcraft. Lame
"Yes, my fellow Humans, we have come to save you"
"Hooray it's the scarlet crusade!"
"From yourselves!"
"Oh no it's the scarlet crusade"
Hahaha. Good ol' Hellsing Abridged reference.
Lol yea
Hahaha sooo true!
Shame they got wreaked like Diana
I mean Arthus literally says: "Im so glad I made it to save you all" just before smashing a man over the head with a hammer... So it seems to just be something these humans like to do.
Ah yes, Sally Whitemane. One of the most interesting characters in WoW lore because of her story and her qualities as a human being. Really good character.
That's what makes her being raised as a DK so interesting. What happens when she, Lilian Voss and Calia Menethil eventually sit down and chat? I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall for that =O
@@BrendanAurabolt He's talking about the thighs bro
I came
@@vapingfury4460all praise the scarlet head ass!
I love her qualities.
“Oh by the light he dc’ed” had my straight up cracking as a priest main
There's one thing we forgot! In Shadowlands, you can find Houndmaster Loksey as a ghost in Revendreth where his punishment is to be chased through the woods by dogs.
TBH shadowlands is a wonderful concept for an expansion. Horribly, horribly executed but it has a lot of potential:
Baine, Jaina, and Anduin meeting their fathers again? Thrall meeting his for the first time? Velen getting to make peace with his wife and cleansed son? Genn explaining to his parents that its not just a phase, he really is a furry?
Past villains explaining their redemption or punishment moreso than was already done/in a more interesting or conclusive fashion, like finding out what deathwing is up to? If he was just smoking a giant hookah like in warcraft adventures that would have been amazing.
Souls from other universes and extinct species- they had free reign to create whatever they wanted from that.
Characters getting to talk to reaaaally old dead characters from like the war of the shifting sands and learning lore stuff they were never supposed to know, like meeting Huln Highmountain?
The jailer being defeated by Cairne in a dramatic cutscene when he runs off and locks himself in his room crying after Cairne chastises him for not eating all his vegetables.
It could have been so much more.
@@booradley6832 well said, exactly my thoughts. Where the hell is Arthas? or variann coming back to team up with Anduin, for a father son moment?
@@silentslayergaming8469 at this point, better we don't have Arthas or Varian.
@@booradley6832 As every single expansion. Always a "what a wonderful thing could be" but never comes.
@@silentslayergaming8469 Spoilers below
Anduin's corrupted sword is Arthas, the jailer turned Arthas into a sword, he holds all the abitiies of Lich King Arthas fight and he even summons a shade of the Lich King model to fight alongside him. Still no word on Varian in Shadowlands
You know, it’s a running theme of these videos where they start with “this is a fairly complicated situation where even the villains are understandable” but lead to “they end as some evil loony toon characters for the player to bully”.
A perfect example of modern Blizzard writing. They became hacks well before Shadowlands and the ass-pull that is the Jailer.
More realistic than ud think. Most zealots start small then go nuts
Though highly unlikely, I fear the day they touch the Defias Brotherhood and give them the chance to “shine”
At least Hearthstone is handling them quite well lorewise...
@@whistlerdan7718 To be fair, they actually wrapped the Defias up as part of the Uncrowned (the rogue order hall).
@@aureliodeprimus8018 fantastic ending for the defias. They fit the uncrowned real well
The way Blizzard retconned the hell out of the Scarlet Crusade was always so annoying to me. Originally Scarlet Crusade was founded by several members like Alexandros Mograine, Saidan Dathrohan (the real one), Taelan Fordring, General Abbendis, etc. And they were initially a pretty heroic faction albeit a bit overzealous (which was understandable considering what they went through and their circumstances).
They became the main bastion of the Lordearon's resistance after the fall of Garithoses faction, the "new alliance" in FT. And the Scalet Crusade was doing pretty good initially despite their over zealotry around the vanilla WoW timeline. They were allied with the Stormwind-led Alliance and were almost on the verge of retaking Lordaeron from the forsaken (Alexandros with Ashbringer was a great force multiplier).
And it was at this point that Saidan got killed and replaced by Balnazzar thus eventually leading Balnazzar in the guise of Saidan to manipulate Renault Mograine into assassinating his own father. It is at this point the reshuffling of the scarlet crusade leadership at the tail end of the Vanilla WoW period is where things start to go bad for the Scarlet Crusade. When they became the crazy radical extremists. And it was a great tragedy what became of them despite their noble origins.
However, Blizzard later changed the timeline and story/lore for the Scarlet Crusade by making it so that Scarlet Crusade was only ever formed after the death/murder of Alexandros by Saidan (Balnazzar). Essentially erasing their noble origins/history and utterly retconning them so that they were a bunch of radical extremist xenophobic nutjobs from the very beginning. They essentially erased all the nuance from an interesting and well-developed grey faction. And made the Scarlet Crusade just another doomsday cult in a world utterly full of them.
Scarlet Crusade had such great potential for an interesting morally grey story but Blizzard utterly wasted them.
Might be heavily connected to how dreadlords got retconned too.
Blizzard has screwed up A LOT of the lore through stupid and unnecessary retcons. The Scarlet Crusade was just one of many. I always appreciated the Crusade's efforts to save human civilians(before they started the whole Dreadlord nonsense) and HATED killing the farmers in Tirisfal.
just nublizz messing up the amazing groundwork laid out by the original team yet again
Personally wouldn't have called the OG Scarlet Crusade 'morally grey', but rather a 'necessary evil'.
I can definitely feel that frustration, because of how much Blizzard got accolades for long term story telling, but I'm also past that.. I much prefer something like One Piece in terms of long term story telling.
I think that some things changed very radically during vanilla and tbc, a thing that was finalized in wotlk, which is that, wow transitioned into extremely simplistic story telling with the veneer of some grand mysteries in places, as well as a ton more references and gags taking center stage.
The scarlet crusade and Lordaeron was the best worldbuilding Warcraft ever had. Every single town that appeared in the game had lore, Andorhal, Caster Darrow, Tyr’s hand, Hearthglen. You knew everybody’s name, Sally, Darion, Tirion. You saw the changes and effects on the plague on each of these places. Pity we don’t have that anymore
Darion only showed up just before Wrath.
@@JoshSweetvale and? Obeseling.
I don’t even play WoW anymore but I’ll always watch this man’s content
Yeah me to
same
Same. So much.
Right? Dude needs to go pro.
Same, but I am still a huge fan of the WoW lore.
The lore around the Scarlet Crusade was one of the best in WoW from vanilla until DK's starting zone and to some extent in Dragonblight and Icecrown but Blizzard couldn't keep it up and trashed them right after and changed them into your typical punching ball villains that we encounter and faceroll again and again
Punching ball?
@@Kfo221 well yes, we just go and beat them again and again like the naga or murlocs
Oh, dont' forget, and ressed lady whitemane, because she had a playerbase who really liked her, not taking into account any lore before she was raised as a deathknight. Purely for the fan-service.
@@liva9994 fanservice aside wasnt sally whitemane truly a powerful wielder of the light... canonically isnt she one of the few who IS able to bring back the dead? (i assume recently deceased and not long dead)... could have sworn there were other tidbits about her that highlighted how gifted she was. she is definitely the sir zeliek
@@MyidolGwen I don't know if she has been, I imagine she has after the death knight quest where they make her the last horseman. But I think canonical wise, only Aegwynn has been powerful enough to bring a person back to life (her son medivh), and that's only because she had the power of several strong mages in her.
But in the game, I would imagine Demetria the scarlet Oracle would be far stronger than Sally then, as the quest text states that she can bring any of the people back to life, not only 1, but several. Also since she holds the title Oracle and is the end of a long chain quest. But then again, she is walking around in a shadow form.
3:30 ah yes, the Jailers plan. So cunning.
Players when it's some nebulous force in charge: This is great story writing!
Players when that nebulous force is revealed: This is bad story writing!
@@drudle wow dev?
Ooh shoot Fernando comics , I enjoy watching those DC and Marvel feats on your channel 😅
@@joe77andino thank bro! I appreciate it man, see you on the channel !
Arthas: wants to purge a city that's infected.
People: This guy is mad!
Scarlet Crusade: wants to purge towns out of fear of them being infected.
People: Let's join them!
Meanwhile, Arthas at the top of Icecrown: ... Yep. I'm going to kill them all.
They learned their fucking lesson lmao
Fun fact: in comics Ashbringer we see the possession first hand where Balnazaar first introduces himself as thal'kituun, the "unseen guest" in their tongue. And THIS little of handed piece of lore actually got into the game.
Welp, now I can’t unhear the word “FLYING DEATH FORTRESS” everytime I see a necropolis now, thank you Platinum.
i was just doing something like that for a future D&D campaign and i just said "fuck it, FLYING DEATH FORTRESS is the name now."
@@chadhardt6136 I'm also writing a D&D campaign, and I cannot wait to introduce Naxx in the same voice. lol
Heroes of the Storm: "What is my purpose?"
Blizzard: "You provide funny quotes for content creators."
Heroes of the Storm: "OH MY GOD!"
Hearthstone: I thought that was my job?!
The part where he runs into Strath and it goes to an actually player sweating pulling the pack of mobs, I needed this in my life😂😂 honestly amazing❤️
“Oh by the Light he DC’ed” lmao that scene is probably the funniest scene he has made
I would have loved a Scarlet Crusade raid in WoW+. Hearthglen (10-man raid) and Tyr's Hand (25-man raid) could have been locations for the raid easily.
lol imagine thinking Blizzard would waste resources on classic+
I think if this was ever done I think they should finish up the zone north of the plaguelands and call it "The scarlet northlands". No this isn't just an unfinished quel'thelas. There is lore that supports there being a lordaeron northlands along with greenwood pass connecting to quel'thelas. Have the entire zone controlled by the scarlet crusade. Introduce a new dungeon "The scarlet bastion" and a new raid "The scarlet citadel".
The vanilla + private server, Turtle WoW, is doing just that. Their next content patch will be introducing the Scarlet Citadel raid. Won't be for a while, considering they just released a content update in late December, but it will happen eventually.
@@nutcrackit7396 I am running the Scarlet Citadel in DnD 5e, although it has nothing to do with WoW, it is great!
I'm still upset they shit the bed that hard. We could've also had illidans prison, and a cheeky dota battleground.
this channel is more of treasure now that WoW's Lore and Storyline is very uninteresting
it makes you realize how much potential this universe has if it was in the hands of competent people
Turtle wow is the place for you. Free private server that is vanilla but retold by people who are mega fans of pre wow warcraft lore. They're getting a scarlet bastion raid next patch.
When good game developers find success, they gradually turn from storytellers to marketing people for their bread and butter; corrupted by the Dreadlords.
@@lucamckenn5932 I heard about Turtle and Ascension a lot, I have to try them out.
@@Ar1AnX1x ascension is seemingly a beginner unfriendly place. Situations like not having a guild or people to group with and getting ganked by level 255 whales that do. Seems fubar.
@@lucamckenn5932 whales in a free game? that's nuts, then I'll try Turtle first, I feel like I'll end up just playing BC, WOTLK and Vanilla on Private Servers but if Turtle is as good as they say it'll be awesome since they update it regularly.
"Flying Death Fortress"
That sound like Death Star lol.
The flying death fortress at 19:20 got me good
Ah yes my favorite Alexandros Mograine quote:
"This is just like Finding Nemo!"
One of my favorite factions both astheticly and lore wise
This faction has been one of my favorites ever since I started playing Vanilla. Scarlet Mon is the reason 2 of my Horde characters even existed in the first place!
-(RP) UD Priest who fell in love with Whitemane the first time she did the instance and devoted a good portion of her 1-60 journey to take her Chapeau and get clothing to look like her in some sort of version of her. This was long before they had Transmog options in WoW so I ran this place MANY times over and over to get the SM Tabard and Whitemane's Chapeau and the various garments and armors to look like the NPCs. Even led MANY a lowbie through for my guild for quests.
-UD Warrior had a time in here just because I wanted Herod's Axe and I did the same multi-run scenario to get it.
SM then became a farming zone for my BE Paladin when they were introduced TBC Expansion and I got her to 60 and realized that the expansion allowed a 60 to solo this place with ease. Many a stack of Silk and Arcane Dusts were sold on AH after slaughtering this place. Made a LOT of money off this place in mid-TBC.
All that aside: I loved this instance and storyline. The lore and characters made you really understand the level of desperation they were feeling and in their hubris, madness and corruption that they really were little better than the Scourge themselves. When WOTLK dropped and we were sent back here again for minor questlines, esp when I discovered that the Ashbringer questline existed...I HAD TO HAVE IT. I tried SO hard to get my hands on an Ashbringer but none of the items ever dropped.
Alongside that the SM was technically the entry into the Plaguelands and how mysterious the area was as it was tethered to a low level zone just served to make me more and more curious. And when I learned of the Argent Dawn and what lay afterwards with Scholo, Strat etc...I was hooked. SM was a stepping stone to a much larger lore drug. Never forgot it.
When they 'rebranded' the place with updates...I was so disappointed. Sure, 4 zones for the instance was a bit much yes but...it was so diluted when they changed the NPCs and made the place sound so cheap. But I always remember the earliest SM-the place was a hotbed for players and I met 3 lifelong friends in those instances that I still speak to today. Long live the Scarlet Crusade.
11:10 FLYING DEATH FORTRESSES
17:55 you did it again 😂
What's confusing about the statues of elves and dwarves in the Monastery? They're from 2004. The Scarlet Crusade being hostile to non-humans from the get-go isn't retconned into the lore until 2009, with the release of the Ashbringer comic. The dwarf's plaque has misspelled his name ever since it was added too. His name is given as Stoenbrow, which isn't a word. But there are several dwarves named Stonebrows in the game.
This needs to be pinned.
Is "Stoenbrow" a typo, or is it actually spelled that way in the game?
@@salzisaufmtisch5891 Well, RUclips deleted my comment. It's actually spelled Stoenbrow in game on the statue.
@@DominionSorcerer you see, the dwarf was german
I wouldn't say it was retconned, by the time we see the Crusade in game they do seem to be hostile to non-humans. Take for instance the fact that there is not a single non-human NPC in the Crusade. The Argent Dawn on the other hand has many, including Horde races. Part of the point of the hall of champions is to show that the Crusade wasn't always as bad as it is by the time we see it, and many Dawn characters agree having once been members of the Crusade themselves.
They didn't retcon the Crusade being hostile to non-humans, they just made it more explicit.
Love the use of the Heroes of the Storm quotes.
They made Sally a Simpsons/Futurama referencing lady of sass and attitude (which may or may not have made her hotter), but hell if they also didn't give her character some personality that WoW just... didn't.
Non-canon spin-off game or not, I have no reason to deny that Whitemane as canon.
_"We Whitemanes have never approved of the Greymanes' rule. They're too neutral. With Blackmanes, you know where they stand. But with Greymanes, who knows? It sickens me!"_
One of the things I would have liked to have seen during BFA would have been the Alliance and the Horde reaching out to the less desirable factions due to their desperate circumstances. It would have been a good way to reintroduce the Scarlet Crusade and do something with them.
Agreed but you have to remember lorewise, they were prettymuch wiped out by the end of Cata. Plus Sally Whitemane was raised as a DK during Legion. Can't remember which NPC but the Ebon Blade states they wiped out what was left of the Scarlet Crusade years ago.
My guess is the Scarlet Brotherhood are the few survivors who've gone into hiding.
Acherus will always be my favorite
FLYING DEATH
FORTRESS
The Scarlet Crusade will always be one of my favourite lore factions in WoW.
I always hoped that one day they would rejoin the Alliance and be the much-needed aggressive/offensive faction in the power dynamic of the Alliance.
Also it always felt weird that the Alliance didn't have a Paladin order in stormwind for years... I don't think the church and the Paladin trainers count.
In the stormwind Church underground there is a scarlet embesedor, platium Wow forget about him.
Well they do have the NElves for that agressive faction since Teldrassil happened
I second this.
@@riatorex8722 "since teldrassil happened" yes that's the problem, they should have been wild and aggressive (or rather, more defensive of their lands) since vanilla considering their WC3 campaigns, but they were made into eyecandy hippies instead, people forget that in the sentinel campaign you kill some paladins. On the other hand, the undead in vanilla were similar to their WC3 counterpart, starting with neutral rep with the other horde races and being in the horde for their own gains.
nope the scarlet crusade its the reason why Arthas its dead and shadowlands happend
The thing that makes the Scarlet Crusade such a beloved group of villains is that their story and motives have a background each and everyone will understand and if anyone had the choice of either joining the Scarlet Crusade or the Argent Dawn, many would pick the first option.
It's sad that despite the entire world having so much lore, there is nothing like this group of people that defy death on multiple occasions and even win in their ultimate goal but are rather an annoyance than a help to the cause.
What other "villainous" factions in Warcraft could have gotten a greater role?
I would agree with many chosing the SC over the Argent Dawn because many forget the Forsaken were also a threat in Lordaeron as well. They were not nice to the living but act likely they drew the short straw. So Forsaken in the Argent Dawn would have been a big 'No' from many of their people.
@Rose's Zen Garden The bloodsail are a pirate group mostly active in the southern parts of Azeroth. And I think they'd be foolish to be active when there's a war between the biggest factions on the planet... but then again... they want treasure soooo
They could/should be the main villains when Undermine finally becomes our main focus
@Rose's Zen Garden its not even much of a naval war considering the ineptitude of the horde and zandalari, I never bothered stabbing the god or whatevs so in my characters Canon, he is aware that, yes skeleton t-rex is a thing, yes old gods are a thing, oh and hell exists and im now working middle management for some idiotic angles that lack wings!
Seriously what the fuck happened? 14 years ago I was excited to discover darkshire!
@@Elenrai the writers happened that made us too damn powerful and introduced more and more powerful things too quickly that we didn't feel like weak.
(Killing Deathwing/Lich King -> Boars next expansion)
@@Gebirges oh its so much worse, imagine not playing since WOTLK, and you make your nice little lvl 1 orc, you roam around the starting zone, slowly making your way to orgimmar, so far we are only aware of some sorta natural catastrophe..but then you hit level 10, and the introduction of Zandalar occurs...15 minutes ago I was killing boars and doing search and rescue, and now I am suddenly summoned by the hordes leadership, and that total tonal whiplash is insane!
Kind of funny coming back to this with the Scarlet Crusade suddenly showing up in Gilneas in seeds of renewal
Forgot to mention they were also responsible in creating a second Ashbringer that eventually appears in game as the disc priest artifact weapon Light's Wrath in Legion. However, in keeping with their bad luck, those involved in purifying it died because Balnazzar disrupted the cleansing ritual needed to create it for fear of it unmasking his identity. Although the ritual was the ultimately successful, the resultant weapon was unstable, having a tendency to immolate it's wielders and those around them if they were weak of mind or let their stronger emotions get the better of them. Balnazzar never destroyed the staff and chose to let the crusade keep it, because he looked forward to the carnage it would later go on to unleash on friend and foe alike.
SM has always been my fav set of dungeons. The lore, the loot, the characters, all great.
It was mine until they got "revamped," same with Scholomance.
@@lhfirex Agreed. sigh.
@@lhfirex The revamp wasn't that bad when it was released. It was cool, specially with the Lillian voss addition to their story in tirisfal glades
The Scarlet Monastery was my favorite dungeon in Vanilla. The Scarlet Crusade was/is some of my favorite lore to come out of WoW. Wish they were still side antagonists, sad they never really became main antagonists.
I anticipate binging so many of your videos, so informative and entertaining, thank you kindly :> ALSO thank you for placing non-adsense promo at start or end of video, rather than interrupting midway ^^;;;
I have watched this video probably 10 times over the past year and only now did I notice the “FLYING DEATH FORTRESS” that’s slipped in at the introduction of the onslaught harbor 😂
This to me just kind of sums up why I found wow so much more interesting when it was all in a smaller scale.
I mean I would 100% find a major story around a 'villain' like them based in the lands we know who have an actual history in the world, and somewhat complex and interesting motivations so much more engaging than "universe destroying mega evil we have never heard of number 34"
The part about the scarlett crusade getting their shit together compared to the argent dawn actually killed me
Not sure if anyone has mentioned this, you also can see a young Sally Whitemane, Renault, and Vishas playing together as children in the Caverns of Time dungeon Escape from Durnholde Keep. They are playing behind the inn in Southshore. Herod is also there as a huge kid. Inside the Southshore Inn you will find Mograine and tons of important members of the Scarlet Crusade. I think Tirion is also in there and they are talking about how they are going to fight the Scourge. It's a really awesome to see these kinds of easter eggs put in.
They really need to start telling stories like this, just normal human conflicts rather than going to other planets to fight space aliens.
Imagine if there was a huge questline that told a story like this with you being one of many paladins and priests.
But then the time comes where you can choose a side, so you could go with the scarlet crusade if you wanted and you could be part of a temporary faction until you finish the questline and eventually leave it.
They did tell stories like this. This entire video is about stories like this being told. But they also tell stories of space aliens. They had space aliens in WoW since Warcraft 1, so they expanded upon that. There's room for both stories in the game.
@@drudle The problem is the stories feel a bit too "grandiose" to be relatable at all. The story of the Scarlet Crusade feels real, relatable, and if you view it from the SC's perspective, understandable. Personally I can't relate to space aliens, but to each their own.
@@jakewolfe7397 Absolutely agreed. Scarlet Crusade, Defias, etc all are very relatable factions where you can see how things went the way they did and relate in some way.
But we've also had big, magic trees being humped by a giant demon who was being bombed by elf spirits. Warcraft lore tends to do a bit of both extremes.
Honestly, I think there's a place for both. I don't think every expansion needs to end on the note of cosmic horror (which it usually doesn't) but having some bigger picture is always nice (for me, at least).
I'd love if they introduced some newer conflicts into EK/Kalimdor but unless they plan to revamp zones, I don't see it happening. However, even in Shadowlands, I would say we got to see some more relatable factions; evil elites who abuse workers for their own gain, the drama of needing to lose some in order to win most, etc. Like, I could relate some emotion to some of that, including in Dragonflight with the whole idea of lineage and home and family. I'm surprised you can't relate to, or at least understand, orcs and their struggles.
@@drudle This is why I get confused when some vets say that the eredar/draenei and legion/other cosmic shit = bad/not true wow.. we always had space or cosmic horror/tech stuff.
@@sommerblume9671 I can understand how in your face it is now, but .. yeah. It's always existed. People just didn't like to think about it.
I always loved the scarlet crusade and their aesthetic. I always wished for some kind of allignement with the alliance. Its really sadge that they always lose.. :(
I love your profil picture.
D: Clap
Unfortunately that is the way with all interesting villains. Because players are the heroes, the villains must always lose. Or if they win, I'm not sure if I have ever seen the villains defeating the player legitimately, without it resulting in just a game over and a re-try.
That's one of the things that annoy me in FF14 at the moment. The big villains that you square up against, but are not supposed to defeat because the story says so, either cannot be damaged by you or have a one-hit KO attack they use when their health falls to a certain level. And then they have the temerity to go "Pathetic." even if you were kicking their ass until the writers had to deus ex machina the villain beating you.
I also like whitemanes aesth- I mean yeah the crusades aesthetic.
6:51 - 7:17 - honestly my favorite part lol. Had me rolllling.
Every time I watch these I am just overwhelmed by the amount of talent and skill that shines through in them. Not just your animation and machinima skills (though those alone are probably the best I’ve ever seen) but also your instinct for how to produce a good video, how to portray personality through a simple gesture or animation, how to communicate through a visual image instead of words (like showing how Saidan was now possessed by momentarily showing the dreadlord’s wings behind him), and your attention to detail. Your comic ability is also great; there were moments I chuckled out loud. Someone needs to hire you because you absolutely have a talent.
Make Lordaeron Great Again
The Scarlet Crusade always were and always will be my favourite "villians" in wow history
Man i gotta say, Platinum is a fucking legend. The amount of detail you put into these videos is absolutely nuts, every single one so far has been a gem. I laughed my ass off at the fairbanks disconnect moment xD
Speaking of details: Do the character models in game look like this nowadays? Not been playing any WoW since Legion and there only for a short term sentimental comeback.
@@nervsouly i dont think they changed the character models since Legion. Only some less important npcs are now of a different skin color or something stupid like that after they added new customization options
i didnt plan on watching this whole video, but did. more interesting than anything in retail. classic+ WHEN???
The Scarlet Crusade will always be an amazing faction for their purpose alone. Forget Sylvanas's "morally gray" Garbage.
The Scarlet Crusade were founded on completely believable motives, and relatable fears we can witness for ourselves just journeying through Azeroth. We see what the Scourge has done and how isolated the Crusade is in their fight to reclaim their home. Even as outside forces manipualte them; their goal is honor if only their xenophobia wasn't. There were bits where the Alliance can try and help the Crusade in Desolace which should've been expanded on.
Blizzard has a problem of creating amazing ideas, but failing to treat them right over long term. The Crusade should've been the wary enemy we make allies with against the Scourge. They could've been the "enemy of my enemy is my friend" deal but never to truly trust. Far better that these light fanatics been on our side, rather than just another mob type to bully.
Yeah surely this . They could expand their lore and make them grindable faction and i think they thought doing this at some point of the development but for some reason they just didn't go on that direction .
I know ya wanted to get it all out but ya had in one line.. "Blizzard has a problem of creating amazing ideas"
In Vanilla I was totally stoked by the Scarlet Crusade. Finally, a faction that had the right ideas but poor choices in implementation. They were a true force to be reckoned with and i was quite saddened by the (typical) 'just make 'em goons" turn they were given. Just one example of how Blizz story developers showed little interest in previous canon as the writing team(s) changed over the years.
Also, why the hell were we given the chance to kill Fairbanks again? I mean, I know Blizz figures that we're all just murder hobos anyway but he WAS a good guy!
Is that the reason why later on, they removed the option to kill him (or even interact in that hidden room) because someone at Blizz actually read a previous script and said "um, I think this guy was on the good team, maybe we shouldn't have the PCs defile his (un)dead corpse?" Sigh...
In Vanilla/Classic there's a scarlet crusade liaison officer in the Cathedral of Light within Stormwind City. They hide him in the basement, but the church of light and the alliance were still maintaining diplomatic ties o the crusade
I honestly despised the Ashbringer comic. It retconned so many interesting things about the Scarlets, and is part of the reason why it seems so odd to see dwarves and elves among the honored champions represented with statues in Herod's room. Believe it or not, the original story was that Saidan Dathrohan AND Alexandros Mograine formed the Scarlet Crusade together after the Silver Hand disbanded, before Balnazzar even managed to get his grubby mitts on Dathrohan. The Scarlet Crusade at its formation was still somewhat as you see it in-game, same iconography/color scheme/bases of operation, but minus the fanaticism and extreme xenophobia that is commonly associated with it now. It was meant to be a force of retribution against the evil that rended its way through their once-idyllic homeland, a united effort by all the remaining living citizens of Lordaeron, be they human or otherwise, to take back their kingdom from the undead monsters that infested it. Balnazzar came in later and said "Y'know, these guys would make for excellent meat puppets to throw at that traitorous Ner'zhul and his new human plaything Arthas." and possessed Dathrohan. Then after convincing Renault to do the deed against his father, he kicked out a lot of the people who weren't really jiving with his new 'reforms' to the order to ensure better 'security', and those people who were booted out then went on to form the Argent Dawn. So really, the Argent Dawn was the knockoff and the Scarlets were the OG successors to the Silver Hand and Lordaeron as a nation. Honestly makes much more sense to me, because the Argent Dawn has rarely ever demonstrated any kind of care for Lordaeron and its legacy in any capacity, given the fact they actually let Forsaken into their order, thus tacitly recognizing the Forsaken claim to Lordaeron City and Tirisfal despite there still being living citizens of the kingdom roaming around.
Are you saying the Forsaken are not rightful residents of Lordaeron city? Even tho they were themselves former living residents?
@@victorzhu Yes, because they are no longer living.
The "Why Join the Crusade?" segment, is literally why I Roleplayed a Scarlet Crusader since Vanilla until I quit playing sometime around Legion. Except with one major difference, I have never once seen the Scarlet Crusade as villains.
Same here dude, although I tended to RP my character as a former Silver Hand paladin / Scarlet crusader who saw through the corruption in the order, but still saw the Scarlet Crusade as an idea as a very useful tool in reclaiming Lordaeron from the undead. Went through quite a few attempts to create a 'reformed' Scarlet Crusade that was just a tad bit less fanatic, but obviously still had a human bias because, after all, Lordaeron was a human kingdom.
Yes
It still pisses me off that the Forsaken still hold the capital city and the Alliance aren't pulling their weight in cleansing Lordaeron from the undead.
I died at the 2005 WoW recreation of Mograine storming Stratholme, and then I revived to "Oh By the Light He DC'D!"
Gotta say, I just recently started watching your videos and I absolutely love them! I'm a big fan of lore videos and the hikarious plotholes Blizz got into. It showed how you have grown as a content producer as I binge watched many of your newer and older videos. I salute you for it!
Also, the Ashbringer Gameplay bit in Stratholme was seriously the best, you outdid yourself! Stay Awesome~
I believe most of those Whitemane lines and interactions are taken from Heroes of the Storm. Good stuff!
Loved the old school Scarlet Crusade, they made a really cool enemy. My only problem is how Blizzard just can't bring themselves to tell a morally questionable story like that without eventually just falling back on "but wait, they were actually being tricked by a demon the whole time!" Grow some balls, Blizz, people are capable of great evil sometimes, it doesn't always have to be some demon behind the scenes making them act that way.
Anyway, awesome vid!
The Defias questline is pretty morally grey too and no demons involved :)
@@Konuvis Eh, the defias was basically created and puppeted by Onyxia though. Like they only came about because Onyxia was manipulating the noble class to underpay the workers, and then she was basically telling them what to do after that to fuck over Stormwind.
@@sweptay I don't agree. Onyxia for sure manipulated the nobles to not pay the workers but Van Cleef wasn't manipulated into seeking revenge and creating the Defias.
The Scarlet Crusade was just the lore reason to establish why Undead/Forsaken are paranoid about joining their fellow, still living Humans. :)
For flavour as to why the Forsaken stay hostile. Which was balanced out by the many Argentum branches. Horde races being members as well, benevolent lightmagic users and even Forsaken are among their ranks. The insistence of Blizzard that there is no cross-faction play for pretty much *all races* by now, might have truly been a mistake.
“Fairbanks where are you? I need heals!”
He says with full health
It blows my mind how people can make content like this. This is some serious dedication and impressive editing talent on display.
The Scarlet Crusade, the Ebon Blade, the Silver Hand... kinda wish we had some green/yellow/blue factions to fill out the rest of the Paladin Power Rangers. And yeah, I know the Ebon Blade are DKs, but they're the "looks like a bad guy but fights with the good guys" thing.
Well the original death knights were warlocks souls put into the bodies of knights /paladins, so in a sense they are dark paladins
@@alihorda Knights. Paladins didn't exist when the first generation Death Knights were created. (paladins were a direct result of how badly the Church of the Light faired during the First War when their priests proved unsuited to the rigors of extended military campaigns). These were essentially just pure spell-casters (and most of the surviving ones ended up becoming Liches once the Scourge was formed, aside for the ones who stay behind on Draenor with Gorefiend and became the Riders of Karabor). They had immense magical and necromantic powers but were still quite fragile despite inhabiting the bodies of armored knights and were unsuited (and generally avoided) direct combat.
the 2nd gen Death Knights were martially capable soldiers that the scourge empowered to serve as commanders or elite field troops, or a handful of paladins who lost faith or were turned after death. Their magical expertise role was supplanted by the Liches, so most of them were simply warriors who gain power via rune-magic, which could pull a lot of the same tricks as the first gen Death Knights, but not to the same scale of power, as their powers were entirely limited the energies of their runeblades.
You do have a few outliers though, Marduk Blackpool's runeblade was ridiculously powerful (responsible to both of the chasms in the plaguelands from where it's fragments fell, as well as being capable of twisting and corrupting the minds of others almost instantly no matter how strong their will, if he could focus his powers on them), though lost most of it's energies after it was shattered.
@@ZanathKariashi yeah but my point was that originally death knights were warlocks placed in the bodies of knights /paladins
The Azure spear offensive, The Verde Aegis and golden eyes expedition?
@@alihorda Knights. Specifically, knights. Stormwind didn't have any paladins (nor did anyone else in the Eastern Kingdoms at the time Gul'dan made the Death Knights) to put warlock souls into, and all the 1st gen Death Knights were made from the slain Knights of Stormwind.
it's an important distinction as mentioned above, paladins didn't exist yet, and their creation and introduction to the 2nd war proved to be one of several turning points as they finished their training and took the field at a time when humanity sorely needed SOMETHING to renew their spirits and give them hope, as it had been nothing but disaster after disaster up to that point with their only "victories" being stalemates.
Especially as the Horde had just unleashed it's artificially created Ogre Magi and the first of the Death Knights began to arrive from the south and started raising the recent dead as undead servants to bolster their forces while using their powers to scour whole towns and armies from the field.
I just feel sorry for that random gnome that got killed while just having a nice stroll in the forest. :((( RIP Gnomo.
dude, u are really amazing your work your all work is amazing I am playing this wow universe for half of my life like 16 years and a few years with warcraft frozen throne warcraft 1, and somehow this become my life and when I saw your videos when I see and understand a new story I am just missed and more loved for this lovely amazing warcraft. u just remind me of my old-time and somehow after watching this video just say a loud haaaaaaaaaaaah and missed the old time in this crusader dungeon questline and all things :(
thank for all your hard work
22:48 - wow Blizzard really has a dialogue ingame which perfectly reflects on themselves...
What I recall of the scarlet crusaders was their dungeon where you found not one but two undead bosses to kill, I liked the detail of that one inside the church right in a hidden room
The undead boss in the cathedral is Fairbanks, go back to around the 8:30 mark on the video. They throw him in the room to die
8:40 mark*
Your video quality was always above average and charming, but goddamn you are exceeding all expectations considering you seem to do most of this yourself!! Always very creative, and well detailed! I also appreciate the add at the start and not randomly in the middle, even though to also nail the ads 🥺
Alexandros wasn't a founding member of the Silver Hand. Those were Gavinrad, Tirion, Turalyon, Uther, and Saidan. I think it was in the book Tides of War
I hope they come back in a big way. A lot can be done with this group, especially after a large time-lapse while we were in the Shadowlands.
I hope not, keep WoWs current team of terrible writers like Dansur away from them. They can't do nuance at all and a relatable Villian faction is far beyond them.
@@nofun594, now that Metzen is back, is there a hope?
you mentioned that the guy they killed got thrown in a secret room, but not that he's undead now.
A simple and interesting way of illustrating the lore. Subbed...
I devoured every one of your videos and I'm so desperate for more!!! You deserve millions of subs! Your content is just absolutely awesome! Please keep it up!!!
I actually have a good lore question I need help solving. Its true that the Argent Dawn wants to establish peace and destroy the scourge. Well after the events of WoTLK and the events that happen in Cataclysm why did the Argent Dawn do nothing to stop sylvanas/horde when they attacked Gilneas? If they wanted to keep the peace why didn't they intervene? Especially when Sylvanas started using the plague. The only decent counter argument I can come up with is that the Argent Dawn has forsaken and horde followers in their ranks, but this hardly stands when Sylvanas starts acting like the scourge.
Argent dawn is just the UN of the WoW universe.
Any and all plot holes can usually be explained with, "well than x or y wouldn't have happened at all". It's a writing trope; characters being momentarily out of character so that other characters can do something to escalate the plot along. Great writers don't do this, but that doesn't necessarily make for a good story in and of itself.
It's because Sylvanas became the writers' waifu, and people simped for her. How else do you explain her getting away with... well, *everything* she and her Forsaken did? She should have been executed twenty times over for all the crimes she kept committing.
Every time she's told to stop using the plague, she's like "k pinkie promise :)" and instantly goes "kekeke we use the plague now" the second nobody is stopping her from using it for everything from dealing with garden pests, to cleaning the kitchen and trying to destroy every living and un-living being in existence. Forsaken and Sylvanas were better pre-WotLK.
Because the WarCraft writers are kinda shit.
The Forsaken are a member faction of the Horde, so intervening in the War in Gilneas on any side would essentially be picking sides for the Argent Dawn, which defeats their whole narrative of being a neutral faction based upon keeping the undead dead.
"I get it, your edgy. Congratulations! Can we move this along?"
Laughed pretty hard there. Totally legit. Thanks again for the content!
hell yeah! thank you for making wow lore so cinematic and digestible. love your work
And now sadly we have the reclamation of gilneas, were the city is run by the scarlet crusade and we just kill them because we needed a common enemy for the Gilnean and the Forsaken to join forces
It’s a really great idea to go through the old lore like this, with all the spectacular visuals and quirky storytelling.
Almost feels like the cutscenes we would’ve wanted back in vanilla and tbc, but never got due to whatever reason. You could easily go through all the old factions, zones, raids and characters like this. Loads of potential for content and I’m sure all of your viewers would love it.
I would have loved to join a human only Fraction in Classic WoW, being able to declare War on every other fraction in the game.
Crazy to think you only have 200k subs. One of, if not the most creative, entertaining, and informative wow channels out there. Keep up the great work, Platinum.
FLYING. DEATH. FORTRESS
That cracked me up each and every time
Whitemane... If only human women were real...
So the Jailer was behind all of this too. Cant believe the dreadlords have been wokring for Zovaal the whole time and anyone that has anything to do with dreadlords has actually been manipulated by him the entire time.
It was all part of their super sekrit plan, you know. It was so sekrit not even the writers knew what they were doing. Truly a masterful plan.
Like.. I understand you.. but technically, why not?
If we are to accept that he was behind the entire scourge, why wouldn't he behind infiltration of scourge's enemies?
@Rose's Zen Garden Full circle.
You should expect nothing less from discount Thanos.
Man, I'd kill for a Scarlet uprising expac or major patch. Just imagine it, something that isn't just an wobbly, jelly Old God or some super-skull death evil guy...how about a bunch of zealots. Make it set in the Eastern Kingdoms like how Cata was mostly in Kalimdor. It could be tucked behind a separate time-shard or something so as not to screw up the old zones for new players. Something really enticing about humble humans doing crazy shit, instead of the otherworldly stuff.
“It’s unlikely that the scarlet crusade will ever return” … annnnd then the forsaken heritage quest happens with an entirely newly raised army 😂
But wait, theres more!
....10.2.5 Gilneas reclamation supposedly has the Scarlets occupying Gilneas.😂
Hay, remember when "What-her-name" Narru tried to force Illadin into joining the "Army of Light" and everyone was like: "Wow! The Light might NOT be a force for good"?
Meanwhile, Everyone just FORGOT The Scarlet Crusade, was. a. THING.
that doesn't count I think, since just because bad people force the light for their own good doesn't make the light itself bad. since light helps those who feel they are right and in need of help, or something. similar to shamans who ask the elementals to assist them but some dark shamans forced the elementals and didn't plea to them , does it make shamans as a class evil? then they retconned the light into intergalactical power struggle between the elements.
The soft nostalgic part of me that remembers wow fondly is drawn to these lore dives and I absolutely love them. Thanks PWoW.
Good god these videos are so well made! I can't even imagine the amount of work put into it
"Wow... Fairbanks, did you not see the puppetshow?"
you slay me.
Scarlet Crusade will always be in my heart - by far one of my favorite factions ever, gotta love the corrupted "smite all evil" viewpoint
19:21 - nice touch ...
Really good video. It's funny, self deprecating and yet does a very good job of bringing to the average viewer on the internet, one of the more profound stories ever told in Warcraft.
PS : Also could you please tell me the sound track that plays at 25:44? It is just so fitting for the topic of the end of a group like the Scarlet Crusade.
It’s alliance warfront music from BFA
@@PlatinumWoW Thanks!!
The production quality on these videos are IN-SAAAANE. Keep up!
Man I loved getting to the level to be able to head into the Scarlet Monastery back in the early days of WoW. Felt so immersive in the lore of Azeroth. Felt legit dangerous for my leveling toon. Man, the good old days.
Wait.
Does this mean the jailer is behind the creation of the Scarlet crusade?
NOBODY EXPECTS THE SCARLET INQUISITION
This is such a good and funny video.
I wish this existed when I played classic. I remember reading reading and reading through wikis, forums and novels.
Kudos on the delivery of these videos, loved it
Wait… In Classic, one more thing happened that wasn’t mentioned: Tirion, another Knight is the Silver Hand founder that was exiled from the order after helping out an orc, traveled to Eastern Plaguelands on the Keep of the Scarlet cause he wanted to rescue his son. Ultimately, the Scarlets were bested there too, but his son was also killed, namely, the Inquisitor Isillien.
I’m Cataclysm, it wasn’t the Argent Dawn. Slight difference I know, but it was the Argent Crusade that ultimately gained the higher ground and took over. Heck, that camp in the beginning? It evolved into another Keep. That place where Tirion tried to save his son? His order went there with a few adventures and liberated from the Scarlets and that also became a base. So, they took over two bases that were in the Plaguelands, leaving them with the Scarlet Monastery
Extremely high quality video, nice animations, perfect narration. Old lore is the best.
Great video! The Scarlet Crusade has always been my favorite faction in the Warcraft universe. It seems like Blizzard had originally planned a much more fleshed out story for them. It therefore pains me to see, that it never really amounted to anything other than The Scarlet Crusade being the bad guys. As the video points out; The Scarlet Crusade had not only survived a devastating Scourge invasion, but even maintained strongholds at the doorstep of The Undercity among other places. They furthermore managed to take the fight to the Scourge, while The Argent Dawn sat around in some ruined chapel or lousy camp and sang kumbaya while various adventurers did the dirty work for them.
As someone who was very moved regarding the story of Lordaeron and its destruction as well as the corruption of Arthas, and who has mained a paladin since early 2005, there has always been on burning question in my mind; why can't we (alliance) join them?! If anything, alliance players - humans especially, should join up with the only faction who tried to reclaim Lordaeron. Instead, we can farm reputation for some stupid teddy bears in Felwood, some irrelevant water elementals in Ashzara, or a greedy cartel whose only merit is being able to settle in some shitty places such as Tanaris. Then there is The Argent Dawn which is essentially a discount version of the Scarlet Crusade. Yet we as players can interact with them, and so they ended up being a relevant actor despite being a mere fraction of The Scarlet Crusade. So many missed opportunities here, both in terms of lore and in terns player actions/possibilities.
But hey, at least we got pandas later on...
So good! As always.
I’m surprised you didn’t discuss the Arisen, though!
Great content man, keep it up. You explain the lore so clearly. Could you maybe make a lore video about the Gorian Empire next?
" This is just like... Finding Nemo, except with a lot of zombies"
-Last words of legendary paladin Alexandros Mograin
If we are just lurking into classic and origin era lore videos we still have plenty of Platinum awesome videos with lore of all the rest of expansions ahead. Glad to stay on your channel😻💚💚
again, i just cannot even fully comprehend the amazing power your lore videos contain. With your added philosophycal coments into this masterfully made video, is just PURE KAThARSIS to watch
the animation when he fell from the mind grapple thingymajigum. top notch :D :D