My great thoughts... You need Aron Szilagyi to demonstrate the secondary 1 and 2 parries. I totally agree, it's hard to remember any other high level fencer in any weapon who the prime. Nice to see you added some wheelchair fencing to your videos. Last action, at 5:15, I saw that covered in another video (yours?) where the discussion turned to where she got that. Someone mentioned that it comes from an old, old fencing book, like before the sport sabre was invented old. What, no sabre 6 parry? For those of you who've never heard of it. On a right hander, take a 5, then turn your hand so the knuckles face your opponent and bring the hand over to the left side. One of my first coaches told me not to bother trying to use it in bouts, as it is mostly a "coaches" parry.
Yeah, I agree... 😢 But let the others show their highlights as well, right? Appity, Ibragimov, Dershwitz... The greatest set of sabre-fencers altogether of all the times, I think. I wonder, what will come after this generation gets finished...
The WTF parry at the end looks to be high octave - I've been reading Capt. Alfred Hutton's book on military sabre and that's a parry he advocated in his manual.
I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask for advice, but I started fencing recently and I really want to get better quickly!! Any suggestions on what to do?
Learn the distance. That is the most important and at the same time the most basic thing that you should learn. All those fancy actions, that amazing attack, it doesn't matter if you fall short at the very end. How to learn distance? On attack: Try to never fall short when attacking but also to never receice a counterattack. If you fall short while attacking, you missed the moment of your lunge or the lunge was not executed correctly. If you get counterattacked, you were too close to begin with! At that distance, you should have lunged few steps ago! Don't bother if you get parried at the start, just don't fall short! As soon as you master the distance, adding a false attack will be a piece of cake and you will rarely get parried. On defence: Stop trying to do fancy parries. Try to provoke your opponent and make him fall short by retreating (in en garde and with steps, no cross running!). No parries. A lot of people stop and try to take parry. You can't do that. You have to retreat at an appropriate distance or you will very rarely make a parry. So stop worrying about parrying and start worrying about distance. If you run away, you won't need to parry, so always try to retreat first, parry later. Now, while you are learning. When you master the distance, we can talk about parries and second intentions. In all of that. Stay in en garde. Your back leg is like a spring in that position. It will propell you forward on the lunge. You will get tired, but stay in en garde. Take a break if you want, then come back but stay in en garde. Judging the distance correctly is one thing, being able to control your body to keep the distance is another. So you need to learn to move very well. Short steps, longer steps, slower steps, faster steps. Do a lot of footwork. 30 minutes every day. Just slow correct steps. Different kinds and combinations. Gradually add speed. If you master the distance, you will have a much better chance when trying to learn more advanced tactics. If you try to parry at the wrong distance, you will most likely not succeed, yet with the right distance and correct set up, unless your opponent notices the trap, success is guaranteed. The same is true for the attack. It doesn't matter how fancy your attack if you always fall short at the end. This is what I try to teach normally. There are a lot of other small stuff, but by far, this is the most impactful thing one should focus on in my opinion.
@@archardor3392 Thanks! Do you think it's important to have a long lunge? Like Oh Sang-uk? I apologize if I am asking too many questions I am still quite new to this.
Oh wow, I didn’t realize anyone still used prime. I was taught that from my first coach who I learned later had taught me a fair number of classical techniques without me realizing it. Once I started rethinking everything I learned, I always assumed that parry riposte was one of them
Prime is great - but seldom against an attack with no set up.Try this: offer point in in line, when your opponent beats, drop your tip and look for quinte, prime or seconde. Because the hand has v.short distance to move the high line parties are much easier.
The same here. We were not even taught to use it, it was considered to belong to the realms of epeé mostly. However we were taught the "sixth" (sextieme?), which is a very beautiful parry, and effective as well: just imagine the "fifth" but with reversed hand. Very useful to change into from a faked "second" (seconde). Well, these were the 1970'ies...
Exactly, I actually said 'wtf dude' out loud when I saw that (I've seen plenty of foilists and epeeists do the behind-the-back shot, but not in sabre). Only way it would be legal was if it was a retreating counter attack, but he took a half-step back at most (even that is pretty doubtful)
Great video but as some said Reshetnikov needs to be here. Also needed are Homer and what about circular 3 parries or the almost universal sweep parry that we can sometimes see some Korean fencers doing?
The fencer on the right used what Le Marchant referred to as "sword arm protect". Alfred Hutton called it high octave and claimed it was the only defence for a cut #2 riposte over the sword. Apparently the young lady on the right has read Hutton's book "Cold Steel".
Great work, great chaņnel! Yes, I'm looking forward to the tactics of screaming and gesticulation being promised - my adored Basadze and Curatoli will be great stars in that compilaton, I guess! 🙂
There no exist 5 parries... There it´s traditional 8 parries of sabre. You have differents schools. But there always more than 5. But now in sabre olympic fencing it´s litle probable to do it all.
you mean with foil or epee as you don't need all 8 parries in sabre...actually i thought you only needed 3 (i was only taught and used well 3 parries... tierce, quarter and quite)
@@ryanschultz9037 Parry 6 (using modern hungarian/italian numbering) is also known as the master's 5 in some places. It's mostly used after your opponent parries 4 and ripostes to head but it can be usedin other cicumstances. (see the bronze medal match from Atlanta 96.) Imagine you're a righty and you take a a lefty's five with your left hand holding the saber but standing on guard as righty, now give your right hand back the saber without moving the saber from where it's at. This is sixth. There is no 8 in modern saber's numbering system. The last parry in the video (the wtf) is parry 7.
@@esgrimaxativa5175 If I understand correctly, parry 6 then can be described as a supinated parry in an elevated position across the body. It is a high risk parry, but functions to lockout the opponent's blade in a counterparry type of situation.
@@esgrimaxativa5175 the last parry is a form of 8th, because one is defending the outside with the blade downwards. The 7th would be the same, but defending the inside.
What am I seeing wrong, a lot of the seconde parries look like prime to me. If I'm not mistaken, prime goes down and to the "outside" (to the right if right handed) and seconde is down and to the "inside" (to the left if right handed). But a lot of the seconde parries look like they go in the same direction as the blade hand
1 parry - hand held high, past pronation, covering the inside line, like a 4. 2 parry - hand held high (?), past pronation, coving the outside line, like a 3. Note that I put a ? on the part about the hand held high. Traditionally that is correct. But since there are attacks that come from below, looking to get under the guard of a 3 position, you will see fencers bring the hand lower to stop this attack. The scene of Szilagyi taking 2 against Oh's lowline attack shows this.
Question: is there a definitive source for the numbering of parries? Are there different sources for different weapons? As a foilist some of these are familiar -- prime and 4 seem to be basically the same as in foil, for example. But the high outside parry -- which is evidently 3 in sabre -- I learned as parry 6 in foil. Obviously the dynamics of how to execute the parry are different with a cutting vs point weapon, but it's the same general idea. I also learned my low outside parry -- described here as parry 2 -- as parry 8. What accounts for the differences here? The weapon difference? If so, who decided the parries in different weapons would be numbered differently, and when did they decide?
I can only speak for foil and epee (since it's much more easier to understand to non-fencer as myself). from what I've known and read, there are some parries that share the same line. Parry 3 and 6, for example, is done to deflect attack from high outside line. Parry 2 and 8, is for low outside line. The difference between those parry is whether the hand is pronated or supinated (it has something to do whether your palm is facing towards you or towards in front of you/"against" you/opposite of "facing towards you", I often mistaken one for another so you might want to google it). If I remember correctly, parry 3 is when the palm is facing towards "against you" while the parry 6 is when the palm is facing towards you. For low outside parries, 2 is the palm is facing against you while 8 is when facing against you
My great thoughts...
You need Aron Szilagyi to demonstrate the secondary 1 and 2 parries. I totally agree, it's hard to remember any other high level fencer in any weapon who the prime.
Nice to see you added some wheelchair fencing to your videos.
Last action, at 5:15, I saw that covered in another video (yours?) where the discussion turned to where she got that. Someone mentioned that it comes from an old, old fencing book, like before the sport sabre was invented old.
What, no sabre 6 parry? For those of you who've never heard of it. On a right hander, take a 5, then turn your hand so the knuckles face your opponent and bring the hand over to the left side. One of my first coaches told me not to bother trying to use it in bouts, as it is mostly a "coaches" parry.
The 6 parry you describe was used by Montano against Ochiuzzi at the New York World Cup (I can't remember what year) I forgot to put that one in
@@SlicerSabre Check the fencers coached by Kirienko if you want to see 6. And Bashta
This is definitely not just another Szilagyi highlight reel.
Cool
Yeah, I agree... 😢 But let the others show their highlights as well, right? Appity, Ibragimov, Dershwitz... The greatest set of sabre-fencers altogether of all the times, I think. I wonder, what will come after this generation gets finished...
The WTF parry at the end looks to be high octave - I've been reading Capt. Alfred Hutton's book on military sabre and that's a parry he advocated in his manual.
It’s septime (7th) in mainland systems. Slight differences, namely a better hold on the weapon, but similar usage.
wheelchair fencing is now my favorite thing
You'll want to follow Beatrice 'Bebe' Vio, her story is very inspirational and she's an absolute beast
I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask for advice, but I started fencing recently and I really want to get better quickly!! Any suggestions on what to do?
Learn the distance. That is the most important and at the same time the most basic thing that you should learn. All those fancy actions, that amazing attack, it doesn't matter if you fall short at the very end.
How to learn distance?
On attack:
Try to never fall short when attacking but also to never receice a counterattack. If you fall short while attacking, you missed the moment of your lunge or the lunge was not executed correctly. If you get counterattacked, you were too close to begin with! At that distance, you should have lunged few steps ago! Don't bother if you get parried at the start, just don't fall short! As soon as you master the distance, adding a false attack will be a piece of cake and you will rarely get parried.
On defence: Stop trying to do fancy parries. Try to provoke your opponent and make him fall short by retreating (in en garde and with steps, no cross running!). No parries. A lot of people stop and try to take parry. You can't do that. You have to retreat at an appropriate distance or you will very rarely make a parry. So stop worrying about parrying and start worrying about distance. If you run away, you won't need to parry, so always try to retreat first, parry later. Now, while you are learning. When you master the distance, we can talk about parries and second intentions.
In all of that. Stay in en garde. Your back leg is like a spring in that position. It will propell you forward on the lunge. You will get tired, but stay in en garde. Take a break if you want, then come back but stay in en garde.
Judging the distance correctly is one thing, being able to control your body to keep the distance is another. So you need to learn to move very well. Short steps, longer steps, slower steps, faster steps. Do a lot of footwork. 30 minutes every day. Just slow correct steps. Different kinds and combinations. Gradually add speed.
If you master the distance, you will have a much better chance when trying to learn more advanced tactics. If you try to parry at the wrong distance, you will most likely not succeed, yet with the right distance and correct set up, unless your opponent notices the trap, success is guaranteed. The same is true for the attack. It doesn't matter how fancy your attack if you always fall short at the end.
This is what I try to teach normally. There are a lot of other small stuff, but by far, this is the most impactful thing one should focus on in my opinion.
@@archardor3392 Thanks! Do you think it's important to have a long lunge? Like Oh Sang-uk? I apologize if I am asking too many questions I am still quite new to this.
@Archardor
Thank you for this advice! I just started fencing myself.
The way Szilagyi performs his parry’s than walks away is just so clean.
Oh wow, I didn’t realize anyone still used prime. I was taught that from my first coach who I learned later had taught me a fair number of classical techniques without me realizing it. Once I started rethinking everything I learned, I always assumed that parry riposte was one of them
Prime is great - but seldom against an attack with no set up.Try this: offer point in in line, when your opponent beats, drop your tip and look for quinte, prime or seconde. Because the hand has v.short distance to move the high line parties are much easier.
The same here. We were not even taught to use it, it was considered to belong to the realms of epeé mostly. However we were taught the "sixth" (sextieme?), which is a very beautiful parry, and effective as well: just imagine the "fifth" but with reversed hand. Very useful to change into from a faked "second" (seconde). Well, these were the 1970'ies...
1:42 was this legal? I mean he crossed the legs, didn't he?
Exactly, I actually said 'wtf dude' out loud when I saw that (I've seen plenty of foilists and epeeists do the behind-the-back shot, but not in sabre). Only way it would be legal was if it was a retreating counter attack, but he took a half-step back at most (even that is pretty doubtful)
2:46 Takes a brave man to draw attack on prep against Oh.
Great video but as some said Reshetnikov needs to be here. Also needed are Homer and what about circular 3 parries or the almost universal sweep parry that we can sometimes see some Korean fencers doing?
true, this misses circular and semicircular parries
You have very great eyes! ;) It’s far too fast for me to see! XD
The fencer on the right used what Le Marchant referred to as "sword arm protect". Alfred Hutton called it high octave and claimed it was the only defence for a cut #2 riposte over the sword. Apparently the young lady on the right has read Hutton's book "Cold Steel".
the last one is an old technique parade, conveniently coming from the bend shape of sabre.
Quinte?
@@matthewpham9525 Sixte? Sexte? Sexty?
Great work, great chaņnel! Yes, I'm looking forward to the tactics of screaming and gesticulation being promised - my adored Basadze and Curatoli will be great stars in that compilaton, I guess! 🙂
There no exist 5 parries... There it´s traditional 8 parries of sabre. You have differents schools. But there always more than 5.
But now in sabre olympic fencing it´s litle probable to do it all.
Quinte without Homer and Tierce without Reshetnikov? ;) Great video again.
Or a flying seconde from Homer for that matter
you read my mind
What is the meaning of parries, i didn't translate this word
The last wtf parry was a septime. A very natural parry to use against a lefty.
Bring back Errol Flynn, somebody !
Wait wait....you use a jump parry 2, AND IT ISN'T ONE BY DARYL HOMER?? Come on...that's his thing!
Bazadze's 3 was a thing of beauty.
Somebody mention the thumbnail
Can you do the 8 foil parries aswell?
you mean with foil or epee as you don't need all 8 parries in sabre...actually i thought you only needed 3 (i was only taught and used well 3 parries... tierce, quarter and quite)
good reference for my fanfiction lmao
ok I'm not a superstitious type but i was just researching 1 and 2 yesterday. 👍
What did you find? I think for 1, you need to be faster than your opponent. For 2, you need to be taller.
Is parry 'WTF' considered Parry 6 in saber?
I don't think it corresponds to the foil quadrants, so maybew parry 'WTF' is the correct name.
Parry WTF is actually septime and it is a valid parry.
@@tamasszavo642 ok, then what are parry 6 or 8 in saber? Maybe they don't exist or are not reasonable?
@@ryanschultz9037 Parry 6 (using modern hungarian/italian numbering) is also known as the master's 5 in some places. It's mostly used after your opponent parries 4 and ripostes to head but it can be usedin other cicumstances. (see the bronze medal match from Atlanta 96.) Imagine you're a righty and you take a a lefty's five with your left hand holding the saber but standing on guard as righty, now give your right hand back the saber without moving the saber from where it's at. This is sixth. There is no 8 in modern saber's numbering system. The last parry in the video (the wtf) is parry 7.
@@esgrimaxativa5175 If I understand correctly, parry 6 then can be described as a supinated parry in an elevated position across the body. It is a high risk parry, but functions to lockout the opponent's blade in a counterparry type of situation.
@@esgrimaxativa5175 the last parry is a form of 8th, because one is defending the outside with the blade downwards. The 7th would be the same, but defending the inside.
What am I seeing wrong, a lot of the seconde parries look like prime to me. If I'm not mistaken, prime goes down and to the "outside" (to the right if right handed) and seconde is down and to the "inside" (to the left if right handed). But a lot of the seconde parries look like they go in the same direction as the blade hand
Seconde goes down to the outside, prime is more of a circular parry going from down to up covering your inside torso. That's how I see it at least
@@vidanmilenkovic1666 Ahhhh I see now. In that case what I originally said should be flipped. Seconde is to the outside and prime is to the inside
1 parry - hand held high, past pronation, covering the inside line, like a 4.
2 parry - hand held high (?), past pronation, coving the outside line, like a 3. Note that I put a ? on the part about the hand held high. Traditionally that is correct. But since there are attacks that come from below, looking to get under the guard of a 3 position, you will see fencers bring the hand lower to stop this attack. The scene of Szilagyi taking 2 against Oh's lowline attack shows this.
2:30 she is bhavani devi
Montano really brained on Curatoli with that jump, delay-5, damn.
Can u do this video except with the foil
I've done this 5:09 giving fecing lessons xd
Disappointing lack of reshetnikov, do better slicer smh
Maybe Venya will get his own video. His parry 3 is very unique
4,373rd
u forgot neuvième
Question: is there a definitive source for the numbering of parries? Are there different sources for different weapons?
As a foilist some of these are familiar -- prime and 4 seem to be basically the same as in foil, for example.
But the high outside parry -- which is evidently 3 in sabre -- I learned as parry 6 in foil. Obviously the dynamics of how to execute the parry are different with a cutting vs point weapon, but it's the same general idea.
I also learned my low outside parry -- described here as parry 2 -- as parry 8.
What accounts for the differences here? The weapon difference? If so, who decided the parries in different weapons would be numbered differently, and when did they decide?
I can only speak for foil and epee (since it's much more easier to understand to non-fencer as myself).
from what I've known and read, there are some parries that share the same line. Parry 3 and 6, for example, is done to deflect attack from high outside line. Parry 2 and 8, is for low outside line. The difference between those parry is whether the hand is pronated or supinated (it has something to do whether your palm is facing towards you or towards in front of you/"against" you/opposite of "facing towards you", I often mistaken one for another so you might want to google it). If I remember correctly, parry 3 is when the palm is facing towards "against you" while the parry 6 is when the palm is facing towards you. For low outside parries, 2 is the palm is facing against you while 8 is when facing against you
you've learned the parries in the french system, the italian system is more common in sabre apparently
sabreists lol, imagine only using five parries smh