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Omen Goku & Gas New Form; Dragon Ball Super Manga Chapter 85 Review

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  • Опубликовано: 19 июн 2022
  • Dragon Ball Super Manga Chapter 85 features Ultra Instinct Omen Goku vs Gas, Gas' New Transformation, the Ultra Ego Vegeta vs Gas Fight and what it means for the franchise going forward. | WORLD OF GEEKDOM: bit.ly/2pSc9gf
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    #DragonBallSuper #DragonBallZ #Vegeta

Комментарии • 1,2 тыс.

  • @avihayzirkiev9814
    @avihayzirkiev9814 2 года назад +219

    I think there is some misunderstanding regarding the mouth blast,
    Mouth blast is related to being animalistic, the Ozaru form uses it because it's an animal,
    Nappa uses it because he's barbaric, and barbarians are sometimes referred to as 'animals'.
    Recoome uses it as well, all for the same reason, being instinctive and animalistic.
    Maybe Goku's mouth blasting right now is an attempt to show that Goku is more in touch with his instincts and emotions, thus making choosing Omen more of a viable option for this fight and his state of mind.

    • @wolfzeru5745
      @wolfzeru5745 2 года назад +19

      Also Broly when he goes berserk

    • @TheWendellpaulo
      @TheWendellpaulo 2 года назад +7

      @@user-dk3kx5wk3u where can I find the colored scans?

    • @caleabveasley2369
      @caleabveasley2369 2 года назад +1

      I said that but I thought in omen he had the defense but his offense was weaker like in top when he basically gather up a kameha but had to get out of it to blast it

    • @cinnamonpancakes54
      @cinnamonpancakes54 2 года назад +6

      @@user-dk3kx5wk3u Omens eyes are silver in the official colored manga .

    • @Hammer_of_moab
      @Hammer_of_moab 2 года назад

      Barbarian has nothing to do with animals if comes from bar bar bar which is old Greece blah blah blah

  • @amirkenan1
    @amirkenan1 2 года назад +53

    Vegeta lost 2 times in UE for the same reason. He really needs to do something about his durability or figure out a way to get strong enough to the point he matches his opponent before succumbing to the damage and losing.
    Otherwise Ultra Ego is flat out ineffective.

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад +8

      He’ll get there eventually
      Just think about how much stronger gas is than granolah
      And how many full power attacks he took head on
      It was obvious that vegeta was gonna seriously damage or kill gas if his power didn’t run out

    • @liamfowell8661
      @liamfowell8661 2 года назад +2

      i guess the argument here is that the power levels at play here are so astronomically high that even the likes of UI and UE may not be enough to contend with them. we're also talking about people that have magically become the most powerful in the universe. there's nothing to say that there were 1 or 2 unknown other out there more powerful that goku and vegeta at the time of these wishes. but i agree, i think there'll be something come out down the line about UE improvements just UI.

    • @steverobinson5048
      @steverobinson5048 2 года назад +1

      Lol y'all do know writers are writing this stuff....you speak as if this is reality..

    • @liamfowell8661
      @liamfowell8661 2 года назад +2

      @@steverobinson5048 and yet people still like to discuss this. it's a bit of escapism from the shite that goes on every day in the real world. there's enough s**t going on surrounding Obi-wan and Lightyear at the moment t make us all sick. dont try and take away people enjoyment of this just because the like it.

    • @steverobinson5048
      @steverobinson5048 2 года назад

      @@liamfowell8661 hmmm ya wtf are you talking about stay in subject...I could care less about obi wan janobley..nor do I care about "oh smeegie service what other people like let them enjoy it" stop being captain save a ho you'll probably get more p****.

  • @Brillz4y
    @Brillz4y 2 года назад +34

    Goku didn’t necessarily leave, he just moved further away from the fight on a higher cliff over the fight. He was in the same place when he stopped gas’s sword from killing vegeta.

    • @solidsolo9258
      @solidsolo9258 2 года назад +9

      Yeah also Vegeta was the one who told Goku to stay back, and Goku saw Vegeta was giving Gas a run for his money, so he trusted him to handle it.

    • @NousagiCaptain
      @NousagiCaptain 2 года назад

      Geekdom nit picks the weirdest shit lol, Vegeta tella goku to back off all the time and Goku lets him get his ass beat to near death and then help.

  • @kylewilliam4230
    @kylewilliam4230 2 года назад +117

    I think the idea of Goku using a mouth blast, when it’s usually done by villains, reflects how remembering Bardock has effected his emotions. It’s the reason he can’t effectively use silver hair UI. his emotions are on fire because he’s feeling things he’s never really felt before in his life,like true Saiyan pride. Goku is connecting with a part of himself he’s never been in tune with because of the fall on his head that effected his memory as a child. This arc does feel kinda stagnant right now tbh, like some exciting things still going on for sure but some of the writing seems lazy potentially. We can’t say for sure yet because the whole arc hasn’t finished; it’s impossible to know the full context of the plot if you haven’t seen the ending yet. We may get better explanations for our questions once this all plays out and this arc ends but as of right now a lot of this doesn’t make much sense. Like just constant retcons and rewrites. I love Dragonball, and I get there’s no, “official canon” but still, come on y’all. Oh and just to add, I think vegeta is fully aware of Gokus scrambled emotions, and I think he knows it’s because Goku remembered Bardock. I think that’s why he specifically told him to go leave and, “figure out his ultra instinct” because he knows Gokus mind, body, and soul are not aligned in a way that would allow him to effectively utilize MUI. Because deep down Vegeta is a fighting genius and understands other peoples techniques and forms and I’m gonna just stand with that no matter how many times he’s beaten by the writers lol. I’m not a die hard vegeta guy necessarily but that dude deserves more than just one little teaser in every arc, his character development throughout Dragonball has been great. And where the hell is GRANOLAH?! YA KNOW?! CUS, GRANOLAH THE SURVIVOR ARC???!!!! Lol

    • @doomthagoon8512
      @doomthagoon8512 2 года назад +4

      @Denzel Amaniampong plz explain

    • @randomfly98
      @randomfly98 2 года назад +7

      @@doomthagoon8512 right i think this writing too lazy

    • @doomthagoon8512
      @doomthagoon8512 2 года назад +1

      @Denzel Amaniampong well?

    • @shawngaines1117
      @shawngaines1117 2 года назад

      @@taecampus he use the super ghost kamikaze which he spit from his mouth lol

    • @doomthagoon8512
      @doomthagoon8512 2 года назад

      @Denzel Amaniampong none of that makes any sense. How do his emotions boost ui omen to being stronger than PUI and why can he use his emotions with it in the first place. Also he been getting hit in ui this whole time like ui lost its main ability. The whole point of the moro arc was for goku to learn to put his emotions aside and let ui do its thing they keep going back and forth

  • @Threelives229
    @Threelives229 2 года назад +92

    I still hold the position that UI probably shouldn't have been perfected during the Moro arc. Goku probably should've kept using sign/omen or even some intermediate step between the sign and perfected UI before he eventually perfected the technique/transformation. That would've made things less confusing. Now it seems like the authors are trying to write themselves out of a corner and their explanations aren't particularly convincing or consistent with what they've previously established. UI is supposed to be the ultimate technique and was exalted as making you unbeatable once perfected. They could've maintained this portrayal if they had just saved Goku perfecting it until the end of Super or something. It's what it is at this point but I definitely think there're better ways they could've handled it.

    • @Mapple-qp6yg
      @Mapple-qp6yg 2 года назад +26

      I think the issue comes from people equating being able to enter UI to mastering it. Despite Whis saying just entering UI freely is only the first step. Geekdom also isn’t considering the fact that rage / emotion boosts are busted in the Dragonball verse. Remember SS2 Vegeta surpassing SS3 Goku in BOG.

    • @pedropierre9594
      @pedropierre9594 2 года назад +13

      @@Mapple-qp6yg ah i disagree, the manga just doesn’t convince me of the continuity of power, its failing to follow its own rules of power its a mess

    • @spiritplanes2453
      @spiritplanes2453 2 года назад +4

      It should’ve been UI,Omen,Pui, then finally later down the line MUI

    • @YHAA-wz8fx
      @YHAA-wz8fx 2 года назад +22

      @@spiritplanes2453 MUI is a damn fan name lol, it’s never been mastered or perfected by Goku. Like dude still can’t land a single blow against Whis so obviously Goku UI isn’t mastered nor perfected, he has a long ways to go before using it efficiently like the angels.

    • @joeyhollis1924
      @joeyhollis1924 2 года назад +4

      I think UI omen should have been gokus trump card in the TOP maybe we got a glimpse of MUI but him mastering MUI in the Moro arc would have given way more weight to not only merus’s death but also his transformation scene and that final punch against moro would have been so much more impactful it would have have made merus a more memorable character too

  • @zaidbaig2943
    @zaidbaig2943 2 года назад +53

    I like the fact that they are using all forms improving them instead of giving goku a totally new form

  • @uncertifiedhater5902
    @uncertifiedhater5902 2 года назад +57

    I think people are looking at this in a 1 dimensinal, linear progressional way. UI was a technique that Goku was able to reach because of his subconscious need to push past his limits. This form allows his body to subconsciously move on its own without him having to any unnecessary thoughts weigh him down. MUI enhanced this by completely clearing not only thoughts of battle, but all emotions, making him a stoic, fighting machine.
    The thing is, this mindset goes against the nature of Saiyans whose power come from the thrill of battle, and more so in line with the likes of angels who are natural nonchalant and indifferent entities, which goes in line with them having strict rules about unnecessary involvement in mortal affairs.
    Whis explained in the beginning of the arc to Goku that as of right now, he is simply copying the angels and therefore hinders his usage and growth with the form, so he must find his own variation of ultra instinct. With the fight between gas and Bardock, we were able to see that Bardock won not because of him "clearing his mind" or anything, but because he took advantage of his natural instinct as a Saiyan which is to find thrill in the battle of a strong obstacle in order to grow, which was ultimately what allowed him to find the strength to defeat gas. Goku is now realizing that by adopting the mindset of entities that are completely opposite of his own nature hes essentially hindering or nerfing himself and he's suppressing his true desires for the sake of power which ironically is what is holding him back.
    This is quite genius as it gives the technique "ultra instinct" a whole new meaning, as it's not simply battle instinct, but a technique that is fueled by the true instinct and nature of the user, basically using their natural tendency and desires to boost the user to the peak of their battle potential, hence the name "ultra instinct".
    By having experienced the pinnacle of UI in the way of the angles via his silver-haired form, he was able to determine that such a mindset was in fact not in line with his own nature and subsequently puts him one step closer to obtaining that Whis had alluded to at the beginning of the arc, which is an Ultra instinct that is in line with him as Son Goku and as a Saiyan.

    • @tsebanjo
      @tsebanjo 2 года назад

      How would you describe Vegeta's transformation? He fully committed to the thrill of battle and evolves through the use of Saiyan's zenki ability. Especially after letting go of the idea that he should take on Granola's revenge, he should now be fully enthralled in the fight. Curious as to why Goku attained a new variation of UI, adopting the same ideas as Vegeta. Whereas Vegeta's transformation more or less remained the same

    • @liamfowell8661
      @liamfowell8661 2 года назад +1

      DAMN! I think you f*****g nailed that!
      But wasn't there a comment somewhere saying that there are 10 different levels of UI and Gokus MUI is right at the bottom? perhaps what Goku is doing now is starting to discover the versatility of UI and starting the break through in to some of the new variants.

    • @Jiron127
      @Jiron127 2 года назад +1

      @@tsebanjo goku is using ui omen. I don't think vegeta is correctly using the form, either? He's far too barbaric in the state and takes too much damage

    • @ChrisJordanTV
      @ChrisJordanTV 2 года назад +1

      exactly. somebody with common sense. When I first read the chapter, i got this exact thought immediately. Common sense aint so common.

    • @liamfowell8661
      @liamfowell8661 2 года назад

      @@Jiron127 agreed i think there will be something down the line with UE too. being Egotistical doesn't necessarily mean that you need to be angry and barbaric at the same time. i would say that ego and pride are more or less one in the same.

  • @NeroDante89
    @NeroDante89 2 года назад +129

    To Vegeta's credit against Z Broly: I think the fear he felt had more to do with how awed he was facing against the Legendary Super Saiyan, on top of his knowledge of the infamous legends surrounding the form. Paragus himself, in the original Japanese version, said that Vegeta, "as a true blue-blooded Saiyan, acknowledges on an instinctual level just how terrifying Broly's power is".

    • @krishrama
      @krishrama 2 года назад +24

      that broly transformation still holds up today. just classic. iconic when he finally went into LSSJ...
      and ya i think it was vegeta just being shocked and kind of having a respect for him as well.
      at seeing the true legendary super saiyan. being different from their own and brolys epic ki
      and speed and power in that form. that was what the legends were talking about. also being
      a saiyan and all that. it was psychological mindfuck for him. i aint judgin.

    • @saibamen2597
      @saibamen2597 2 года назад +1

      Nah fuck that, hate that scene for my entire life. It's always you guys who accept every shit that's get written on the show like a cuck.
      There is a reason why Toriyama didn't let Vegeta feel fear in the new one. The one who wrote dbz Broly was a Certified Vegeta hater even the interviewer told him why is Vegeta weaker in the movies.

    • @DethaneGames
      @DethaneGames 2 года назад +10

      To Vegetas credit: it never actually happened and is a half step above fanfiction.

    • @shawngaines1117
      @shawngaines1117 2 года назад +5

      Yeah it was like a cat meeting the lion lol technically of the same species but totally different

    • @IcarusFallz
      @IcarusFallz 2 года назад +4

      No defending him. He was the prince of all bitches vs Broly

  • @awesomediscussions
    @awesomediscussions 2 года назад +73

    The reason why Goku had to leave Vegeta behind is because Ultra Instinct requires the user to clear their thoughts. If Goku is on the battlefield worried about Vegeta, that's the opposite of clearing his thoughts and the point of Vegeta's request to Goku was to figure out how to perfect his Ultra Instinct, so Goku went to a quiet remote place to do that so he can focus.
    Vegeta has always been known to be the punching bag of the 2 so it doesn't surprise me that he is in this chapter as well, it's Vegeta, that's his calling card lol

    • @shadowslayer9988
      @shadowslayer9988 2 года назад

      I thought it had more so to deal with controlling his emotions.

    • @wildin8156
      @wildin8156 2 года назад +10

      It’s what the writers want Vegeta to be*

    • @genorem
      @genorem 2 года назад +2

      @@wildin8156 it's what he always has been.

    • @wildin8156
      @wildin8156 2 года назад +6

      @@genorem it’s what the writers have made him to be, they’re not real people I hope you understand that part.

    • @genorem
      @genorem 2 года назад +6

      @@wildin8156 as a practicing writer, get over yourself.

  • @SocietyKongMedia
    @SocietyKongMedia 2 года назад +10

    People complained for years about form fatigue, shit being the same. They are doing some very original things, and it's an open ended story. That's why dB fans are so mad. They are so used to retreading the same ideas that when a new idea or story choice happens, they get mad. It's just so dumb.

    • @Mapple-qp6yg
      @Mapple-qp6yg 2 года назад +3

      @sk no, emotion boosts have always been broken. See Vegeta SS2 in BOG. And Goku straight up says he can’t calm down to utilize MUI to its full power rn. So Ui Omen amped with a Emotion boost is stronger.

    • @SocietyKongMedia
      @SocietyKongMedia 2 года назад +2

      @sk we are talking about energy meant for fictional dieties. It barely makes sense to them, so to expect a straight forward answer is still nonsensical

  • @chronzic9976
    @chronzic9976 2 года назад +187

    I hope they haven't forgot what Vegeta did against Moro, Spirit Fission. I think it would be awesome if he figured out a way to combine spirit Fission with ultra ego to keep his stamina going while he gains power and slowly drains his opponent until he just destroys them. I know that would go against Vegeta's Pride but I think it would be amazing. Vegeta wants to destroy his opponent when they are at there best..I'm sure he would think of that as some cheap trick.

    • @cheeseburgerfreddy6350
      @cheeseburgerfreddy6350 2 года назад +42

      He cannot drain his opponents with forced spirit fission it's not the same as moros magic

    • @joe2434
      @joe2434 2 года назад +18

      @@cheeseburgerfreddy6350 he literally did that to Moro he can’t do it to gas because it’s his power

    • @YHAA-wz8fx
      @YHAA-wz8fx 2 года назад

      @@cheeseburgerfreddy6350 thank you, I have no idea why fans think spirit fission will work on people that uses their own strength, it only works against fusion and absorption. I’m starting to wonder do these people even read and comprehend.

    • @cheeseburgerfreddy6350
      @cheeseburgerfreddy6350 2 года назад +55

      @@joe2434 He only split his stolen power from him that's all, Some of you believe he can absorb their energy and they made it very clear that he can't do that so idk why people think it's a save and grace for Vegeta he has no save and grace.

    • @chronzic9976
      @chronzic9976 2 года назад +1

      @@cheeseburgerfreddy6350 Good point but still something to think about.

  • @Gzilla313
    @Gzilla313 2 года назад +28

    I hope that as Gas ages he realizes what's happening to him and uses his last bit of energy to turn on Elec for using him.

    • @roxtechs
      @roxtechs 2 года назад +3

      Even tho it’s predictable I like the concept of Gas running out of Gas haha.

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад

      That’d be a nice character moment

    • @giogio5838
      @giogio5838 2 года назад +1

      I can't wait to hear or see what was the main con behind Gas' power-up. In Granolah's case it was decreasing his lifespan to only 3 years. In Gas' case it could've been something else. He could've aged up a little after becoming the strongest warrior in the universe, but I can imagine Elec wishing for Gas to go beyond his limits in exchange for rapid aging.

  • @godlyentertainmentlive9161
    @godlyentertainmentlive9161 2 года назад +29

    Essentially goku confirms 2 things.
    1.The mui transformation is nerfed when goku's emotions are present
    2. The ui omen transformation can use some of the ui properties but this form is NOT nerfed by gokus emotions and is seemingly buffed by them instead. So goku can basically reap the benefits associated with emotions like excitement and rage while in omen

    • @imthatotakuguy8702
      @imthatotakuguy8702 2 года назад

      Since this arc started I said that they nefted MUI and people called me crazy

    • @SonGoku0-r
      @SonGoku0-r 2 года назад +1

      Yeah he can basically use his emotions without nerfing Ui properties of Omen instead gets Stronger.

    • @ashworth770
      @ashworth770 2 года назад +3

      @@imthatotakuguy8702 MUI hasnt even been mastered be a GOD so I understand what DBS is doing. UI is a technique anyway not really a power up so this is why Gohan has supassed it.

    • @SRT_DRE
      @SRT_DRE 2 года назад +1

      Nah. The Manga just ruined the anime. Jiren beat the sht out of Omen. Where was this super power offensive form against Jiren? MUI was supposed to have been the form that he didn’t use emotions or thoughts. They just flipped the Manga upside down:
      I personally need an explanation. Either the anime is no longer canon or the anime is its own continuity. The manga and the anime are vastly different. Even the movies are different from the anime and manga.

    • @YHAA-wz8fx
      @YHAA-wz8fx 2 года назад +4

      @@imthatotakuguy8702 no, the emotions thing always been a part of the silver haired form,, remember Merus told Goku he must stay calm even when there is a jarring shock to his emotions in order to tap into the silver form.

  • @nicholaslewis6182
    @nicholaslewis6182 2 года назад +31

    This is a very Jiren moment imo. Remember during the TOP Jiren wanders off to await the end of the tournament. During that time he meditates and seals himself away in his energy.
    Goku walking away at Vegetas’ request and meditating has the feel of gathering his thoughts, collecting his experience against this fighter and preparing. Jiren had just seen Goku in omen when he does the same.
    Just a thought…🤔

  • @georgecostan3248
    @georgecostan3248 2 года назад +35

    The perfected UI form is about body instincts, so you can't do mind games with the opponent or reason with it. It is only for opponents with whom you have no choice but fight them.
    The Omen UI form is a mix between UI and the warrior's personality. It is better used for opponents with whom you can reason with or can manipulate on the battlefield.

  • @dominikdobrotic8298
    @dominikdobrotic8298 2 года назад +51

    Goku always powered up in the past by his emotions while UI forced him to calm down to use it. He previously used the Omen form while trying to be as calm as possible but he figured out that combining the omen UI form boost together with the emotional boost makes him a lot stronger than mastered ultra instinct.
    In the end the story is about getting to be the strongest in the way that suits you. Vegeta gets it by ultra Ego while Goku needs to find his own true fighting style, instead on copying Whis's UI.

    • @liamfowell8661
      @liamfowell8661 2 года назад +2

      I'm wondering whether they try and combine the traditional super saiyan with UI some how. the speed, agility and stamina of UI combined with the raw emotive power of the super saiyan transformation. i feel like at some point things will come back to the roots if of the show.
      The saiyans have shown that they an amazing capacity to combine they many fighting states, kaioken, super saiyan, god ki, it's almost inevitable that they'll do the same with the new transformations too. how else will they eventually match up to the Grand Angel?! (forgotten his name!)

  • @chaosutopia56
    @chaosutopia56 2 года назад +15

    I feel like in the omen form he’s utilizing not just his emotions but his saiyan instincts

  • @kynshii
    @kynshii 2 года назад +68

    Maybe Goku is utilizing the UI Omen with this Saiya-jin Instinct. Nappa, Broly and Great Apes using the mouth blasts seems like a Saiya-jin technique. Goku has been taking steps to embrace his heritage and Whis even asked him about. It feels like the direction is going that way and I like it

    • @issy785
      @issy785 2 года назад

      what’s a saiya jin

    • @Nikketmzee
      @Nikketmzee 2 года назад +2

      @@issy785 it means saiyan in Japanese and and Spanish

    • @issy785
      @issy785 2 года назад

      @@Nikketmzee oh why he usin the japanese name

    • @Nikketmzee
      @Nikketmzee 2 года назад

      @@issy785 it’s probably his preference, I say Saiyajin as well but that’s because I grew up with the Spanish dub so they’ve always been called Saiyajins to me not saiyans

    • @issy785
      @issy785 2 года назад

      @@Nikketmzee ohhhh that makes sense, that’s a a cool fact i learned about the other languages too, thx

  • @mannnnel
    @mannnnel 2 года назад +31

    When an animal acts on instinct, it acts on emotion. Goku's instinct is emotional since he's not an angel and therefore it's not natural to be devoid of emotion. It kinda makes sense but it's still frustrating, because he was supposed to have been able to surpass his nature as an emotional being...that seemed to be the whole point of UI. But i guess that is only the point if you're an angel, but since he's not, maybe he shouldn't strive to mimic one, even if Whis thought that was the ultimate goal for him.
    Edit: Chapter 68, first of Granolah's arc | -Whis: "Copying me won't get you far, you must develop your own style"

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад +2

      This version shows even more emotional control
      He can express his emotions while maintaining a balance to be able to use the perks of ui.

    • @solidsolo9258
      @solidsolo9258 2 года назад +2

      I also believe that Goku in sign looking like bardock psychologically messed up Gas to doubt himself and fight worse.

    • @8-p335
      @8-p335 2 года назад

      @Solid Solo Goku literally said he was barely stronger than gas when he went omen and said he had to finish to the fight quick

    • @solidsolo9258
      @solidsolo9258 2 года назад +1

      @@8-p335 Well it could be that Perfected Ultra Instinct would be stronger than Gas too if his heart was calm, but since it wasn’t because of all the stuff he is going through, he decided he might as well use sign.

  • @linkmaster253
    @linkmaster253 2 года назад +19

    Vegeta needs to learn that new Instant Transmission. I'd call it 'Forced Transmission'
    Imagine Vegeta being able to teleport his allies or opponents to himself.
    He would definitely be able to save more people/Use it to Hakai without worry. If he felt like helping that is.

  • @youdom5
    @youdom5 2 года назад +13

    Goku using UI Omen while having some control despite his emotions clouding his head, and psyching out Gas by making him reminded of Bardock to let his guard down, I really liked. Still goes back to how martial arts started since DBZ, technique and use of trying to outsmart and psyche out your opponent despite the power gap.

  • @SpammytheHedgehog
    @SpammytheHedgehog 2 года назад +15

    This is no longer the Granolah Arc. This is the Gas Arc.

  • @ty-ray1307
    @ty-ray1307 2 года назад +124

    I think gas is going push himself so much in the next chapter to the point that the life fades from his body an he dies as an old man and in his mind a failure though I’m not sure if he is going to be stronger than Goku or not I’m leaning more towards yes with a similar outcome to mui goku vs Jiren in the anime

    • @cheeseburgerfreddy6350
      @cheeseburgerfreddy6350 2 года назад +10

      Predictable Granola will probably jump in to help Goku as well or something

    • @dallasraisbeck7297
      @dallasraisbeck7297 2 года назад +2

      I said this a few days ago. I agree with you.

    • @jibril2473
      @jibril2473 2 года назад

      UIO is trash

    • @Underworldwarrior1
      @Underworldwarrior1 2 года назад

      He is 99% stronger than Goku now

    • @genorem
      @genorem 2 года назад +8

      I believe his techniques will probably be more refined, but i'm gonna predict he'll tire out quickly because of his growing age.

  • @_WiZ420
    @_WiZ420 2 года назад +112

    I think he's using Omen to figure out how to take Whis's teachings to heart. While it may not be his base form, it's a lot closer than any of his forms with UI stacked on top, and he could still mean to focus on UI in base. That or it's your theory, I like both. Could also be both.

    • @InstincterAshed
      @InstincterAshed 2 года назад +6

      It's mentioned in the chapter, Goku managed to obtain an UI of his own that matches his emotions..

    • @DethaneGames
      @DethaneGames 2 года назад +5

      UI in base is already a thing though. UI as a technique can be used by goku in any of the forms now. Silver hair and Omen are now JUST powerups.

    • @kelvanorolle761
      @kelvanorolle761 2 года назад +6

      @@DethaneGames I mean UI also gets better the more he transforms so it isn't just pure power. The technique gets better aswell. Also MUI (before he starts losing power) has no vital points. Every other form does. The silver haired form supposedly has no "weakness".

    • @samuelvanlane
      @samuelvanlane 2 года назад

      My theory is he's using omen so he can try and combine kaioken or Super Saiyan. The talks about him being able to use emotion in that form lends me to believe itl be super Saiyan Wich would be his "own version of ultra instinct " super Saiyan UI inbound....

    • @_WiZ420
      @_WiZ420 2 года назад

      @@DethaneGames Wrong, they're transformations lol You can argue Omen not being one (I don't recommend arguing against me on this one for your own sanity), but MUI is literally STATED as a transformation.

  • @Thekinguk2j
    @Thekinguk2j 2 года назад +40

    Sometimes going all out isn’t the right way to go. We’ve already been through this before. Remember when ssj grade 2 wasn’t the right transformation for cell? It’s the same thing here. Even in real life people use certain strategies or mindsets to win in fights or anything else. It may not be the strongest or smartest method but it may be the best for a specific situation. Plus goku leaving the battlefield to figure something out isn’t “out of character” for goku. How are you supposed to think clearly when there’s a whole battle going on right next to you?

    • @genorem
      @genorem 2 года назад +13

      Thank you, completely in character.
      Especially given the circumstance.

    • @9thhokagegoku671
      @9thhokagegoku671 2 года назад +14

      Exactly I think ppl are just looking for a problem. People nerf powers all the time

    • @UnifiedEntity
      @UnifiedEntity 2 года назад +2

      And here's the problem with this mindset though, Omen is already stated as the improper form. It is unstable. Ss grade 2 wasn't the right form because of how wait for it.....unstable it was. Losing speed as a result of power, not only that energy wasted for such a drastic transformation. Goku has already used Mastered Ultra Instinct in various situations where it's life or death but his mind was calm. Suddenly he can't calm his mind and has to regress to Omen? No. That doesn't make any sense. And Vegeta is already in safety which he saw to so this unnecessary. What damn reason does he NOT have to be calm when the guy suppressed so much rage when some literally lose their existence to save him 😑😑😑.

    • @terrakage4462
      @terrakage4462 2 года назад +4

      @@UnifiedEntity I think the answer is that omen allows goku to feel all the emotions he is which allows him mastery of omen that surpass mui. Imo mui is powerful but too rigid because of it requiring goku to be calm. Whis commented on this several times that goku have a calm mind is conflicting of his nature and that he should stop trying to mimic him and find his own version of ultra instinct.
      Mui is still powerful and requires calm, just not as powerful as omen with emotions attached.
      I’m the Moro arc he couldn’t even get back into Mui until Merus sacrificed himself, hinting that goku is much stronger at the peak of his emotion rather than when he is trying to remain calm.
      Remaining calm conflicts with goku’s nature is all.

    • @UnifiedEntity
      @UnifiedEntity 2 года назад +2

      ​@@terrakage4462 But look what I said. When Merus sacrificed himself, Goku was clearly furious, but suppressed it and got into ultra instinct and dominated Moro. Thats the opposite of being emotional or "peak" emotional. A much stronger Moro mind you. Which Omen couldnt even contend long with a weaker version, let alone cause lasting damage.

  • @garycummingsjr.6896
    @garycummingsjr.6896 2 года назад +7

    Sometimes you have to take a step back in order to figure things out. UI and it variations is still new to him and mastering it various levels makes each sequential level stronger. That’s why Whis told them to train in base form because it made each level above that stronger

  • @Andy-cm5ur
    @Andy-cm5ur 2 года назад +3

    I think i like this Approach.
    Keep Blue-UI for long dragged out battles that dont need the absolute strength or UI precision [starting of arcs].
    UI Sign for when Goku isnt calm but needs more power and better precision of UI [like here]
    MUI for when hes calm, and ready to end a fight fast and with absolute power and precision.
    Three different peak power options for Goku for 3 kinds of fights.

  • @michaelrowlett1802
    @michaelrowlett1802 2 года назад +21

    I think it's interesting that Gas is the parallel of Moro. As he gets stronger, he grows older. Where as Moro appeared younger as he grew stronger.

    • @jerrickcole5704
      @jerrickcole5704 2 года назад +7

      Nice assumption.

    • @Jiron127
      @Jiron127 2 года назад +4

      Good point.

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад +3

      Also Moro used others for power
      While Gas is being used as power

    • @michaelrowlett1802
      @michaelrowlett1802 2 года назад +1

      @@leultrainstinct406 I didn't even think of that. But since you mentioned it. Both villains had the dragon balls used on them. Moro willing did so where as Gas was reluctant. Pride and underhanded tactics was never really an issue with Moro. Again, I thought the comparison between the two was interesting.

  • @truefeelke
    @truefeelke 2 года назад +19

    The changes to UI are not unnecessary. It is character development, and I think they for once did a good job here by not giving Goku yet another transformation, but showing how much he has grown his UI abilities by now allowing him to use UI alongside his emotions to power up. This is actual good writing.
    Also, Vegeta did wear Gas down. You could say the latter was running out of gas (pun totally intended) when Goku started his fight with him.

    • @cybergogeta0433
      @cybergogeta0433 2 года назад +3

      Running out of gas lol good one😂😂😂

    • @coolraul510
      @coolraul510 2 года назад

      too many transformations since super started and now they wanna change what they do 🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️ perhaps what is being done with ui (figuring out multi-uses) shouldve been done with ssgod before we even got to blue

    • @truefeelke
      @truefeelke 2 года назад +1

      @Stg please rewrite that piece... It is full with spelling errors. Thank you.

    • @lorcejay2596
      @lorcejay2596 2 года назад +2

      @Stg Character development doesn't only suggest growth in a character's personality, it can also refer to the changes in a character's emotions whether they've now become a raging person or a calm one comapred to how they were before, it can also refer to the changes in a person's body or abilities or fighting style especially in action stories. Character development is not one dimensional, it is a spectrum.
      As for your UI argument, the rules surrounding UI have never once been stated to be one way in the story, or concrete. For instance, Whiz as an Angel is always in the state of Ultra Instinct which means he's always in a state of calmness, yet we've seen him lose his composure (emotions) the time when Beerus was destroying planets randomly and Whiz had to hit him from behind to stop him from attacking.
      And in the instance of Goku, there's never been someone like him who uses UI so some rules that apply to Angels may not apply to him, just like the rule where UI changes Goku's hair color but doesn't change the Angels, or the fact that Angels are always in UI but Goku has to tap into it. So since Omen is a small version of UI it can allow Goku to tap into his emotions unlike if he was using the full version of UI. That makes sense to me and it's not even a contradiction, if Goku was using the full version of UI and was still fighting like a Saiyan, then that would've been horrible.
      - Also there are plenty of reasons to explain Goku beating Gas, which one of them is that Gas was constantly having a PTSD of bardock which was breaking his concentration and reaffirming his fears of his loss against him. Also the fact that Gas has been fighting constantly without a break which would make him significantly weaker than he was before, Vegeta also made sure of that. Nothing so far suggests that Goku is stronger than his MUI.
      Some things in the story require a bit of thinking rather than jumping to conclusions. I think there's more than one way to look at the situation.

    • @fg009letyrds8
      @fg009letyrds8 2 года назад

      @@coolraul510 Yeah pushing out Blue immediately after SSG was a GRAVE mistake on Toriyama's part.

  • @yrjkeenwa6584
    @yrjkeenwa6584 2 года назад +12

    I wish Ultra ego had some kind of healing factor that also helped him when he got stronger. It just doesn’t make sense to take damage if it’s still as lethal 😭

    • @JohnnyMacs19
      @JohnnyMacs19 2 года назад +1

      Look at UI and all the changes its gone through already. I'm sure Vegeta is going to make improvements with UE.

    • @yrjkeenwa6584
      @yrjkeenwa6584 2 года назад

      @@JohnnyMacs19 most definitely, gonna have to see how they decide to evolve it from here

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад

      @@yrjkeenwa6584 because taking damage is what fuels him
      So it wouldn’t make sense to heal

    • @yrjkeenwa6584
      @yrjkeenwa6584 2 года назад +1

      @@leultrainstinct406 bc taking damage is still as lethal tho 😂😅

    • @decepticonxhunter4850
      @decepticonxhunter4850 2 года назад

      Vegeta just needs to be smarter about how he uses UE. He thinks that he can allow himself to take a nonstop barrage of crit hits just because he gets stronger from taking damage. He also needs to stop telling his opponents that he's getting stronger from the hits because he made the same mistake with Granolah.

  • @doloepicmusic
    @doloepicmusic 2 года назад +47

    I think the ui rules make sense. Mui is an Angel technique, angels don’t have emotions and if he’s wound up about Bardock he won’t be able to control that form. But if omen can provide enough of a power boost and not be affected by the users mental state than it’s a more viable form for goku

    • @Ramona122003
      @Ramona122003 2 года назад

      Angels have emotions. We clearly saw this with Merus. And why would Goku be more wound up over Bardock then he was seeing Merus, his latest mentor, die in front of him because he failed to mastered UI.

    • @tyjones9864
      @tyjones9864 2 года назад +3

      @@Ramona122003 Huh? What kind of question is that? He had already started to accept his Saiyan lineage. Now he's just finding out his father was good-hearted and selflessly fought for others, as well as remembering his parents saving his life.
      I'm not saying it's set in stone, but you can't seriously sit here and act like it would make no sense.

    • @basedimperialism
      @basedimperialism 2 года назад +2

      @@Ramona122003 Uuuhh maybe because Bardock is his father, and Goku loves his family? He just found out his father, who was a member of a vicious warrior race was kind-hearted and fought to protect the same people Goku is protecting right now? You really think that's going to be less emotionally charged than someone dying who Goku has basically no connections to?

    • @Ramona122003
      @Ramona122003 2 года назад

      @@tyjones9864 Goku accepted his 'Saiyan lineage' back on Namek and then again in Broly. This isn't some new ground.
      Bardock did a few good things, but he's hardly 'good-hearted' since he still did genocide. As Piccolo pointed out to Vegeta, a few selfish acts don't make up for a lifetime of evil.
      Goku is the same person who kept his head together after he learned he murdered his own grandfather as a Great Ape.

    • @Ramona122003
      @Ramona122003 2 года назад

      @@basedimperialism "Bardock is his father"
      Father by blood. He still doesn't know the guy.
      "Goku loves his family?"
      He doesn't even know his Saiyan family, he just barely remembers them.
      "He just found out his father, who was a member of a vicious warrior race was kind-hearted and fought to protect the same people Goku is protecting right now?"
      He was still a mass-murderer who was on the planet to commit a genocide. Him doing a few good deeds doesn't suddenly changed that.
      "You really think that's going to be less emotionally charged than someone dying who Goku has basically no connections to"
      He spent six months with Merus while he could barely remembers his dad.

  • @SocietyKongMedia
    @SocietyKongMedia 2 года назад +15

    People really want transformations to be simple and straightforward. Stop. Not everything has to be so simple all the time. These concepts are very philosophical. So getting annoyed because there's no straight answer, it's immature. This community needs to grow tf up.

  • @1hundred1
    @1hundred1 2 года назад +4

    Dragon ball fans really can’t read. Geekdom complains about anything lol, obviously this arc has been making it a huge point that Goku tapping into his original nature will make him stronger than he is now. Toyotaro is hammering this shit into the readers head EVERY SINGLE CHAPTER. How do you still get confused by that? That’s why he fights in Omen now because he can optimize the form to the point where he doesn’t have to force himself to think about nothing, he can be himself in that form. It’s not that difficult to understand

    • @christopherlake9667
      @christopherlake9667 2 года назад +1

      I agree with you shisui but db fan after all , they keep on complaining for next 30yrs 😂😂😂😂lol

  • @Starman_Dx
    @Starman_Dx 2 года назад +12

    Eyup, that's what I thought and said too.
    Goku knows about Bardock, knows the fight, Gas even mentions it. They've taken alot to time to reference that fight and what happened, and Goku is using that knowledge, hence Omen over MUI.

  • @press8704
    @press8704 2 года назад +4

    The forced teleporting, barriers, and telekinesis were the highlights of the chapter for me

  • @Panamaniax507
    @Panamaniax507 2 года назад +6

    They did the same thing in Z…. Goku knew his super form from the cell saga was stronger than super saiyan but he decided to master his regular super saiyan form

  • @ushhushhp3308
    @ushhushhp3308 2 года назад +11

    I like how Gas levelled up instant transmission with his ability to teleport Vegeta.
    When Goku went UI omen at the TOP he also had that sayian roar..what if when hes in this state, hes using UI to tap into his true sayian pride?
    Coz that ki blast from his mouth was like a great ape?

  • @pairo9163
    @pairo9163 2 года назад +25

    As far as I know, it was the community that called UI mastered when all Goku did was complete it. I think goku has realized that the complete UI is essentially him trying to be an angel( who have great control over their emotions or maybe no emotions) which puts a limit on how much Goku could improve UI after he completed it. UI omen is an incomplete technique but it gives more room to diverge from the path an angel takes in order to take your own. Whis has simply been explaining how angels maximize their potential but he understood that saiyan and angels are different. Whis likely told Goku to figure out his path of UI because he knew He would hit a roadblock if he was only copying the innate nature of a different species(angels). I think the main goal of Whis is trying to teach is for Goku to embrace his own instincts as a state of being. That’s why Goku was able to do better in this chapter. Once he tried to do he own thing, the limitations of being something you are not disappeared and now there is more room for growth.

    • @noone4902
      @noone4902 2 года назад +1

      We called it mastered because the title of dbs episode 129 where the form debuts is called "Limits super surpassed! Ultra Instinct Mastered!"

    • @urnarafiel2806
      @urnarafiel2806 2 года назад +3

      Glad i never call that silver UI as MUI, just UI...

    • @pairo9163
      @pairo9163 2 года назад +1

      @@noone4902 That’s fair. But the anime and manga have done quite a few things differently . Either way, I guess that title put the idea into the community first.

    • @Jiron127
      @Jiron127 2 года назад +2

      Agreed!!! I'd also like to reference that while whis is much more experienced than merus. Merus can teach goku better on the fundamentals of the form.
      While whis is able to pick apart the usage, of the form. He has issues translating that to goku. Not to discredit whis in the least. I just think merus can instruct goku a bit more because the power gap isn't as pronounced.

    • @JohnnyMacs19
      @JohnnyMacs19 2 года назад +2

      I honestly like what they are doing with UI if you think about it makes sense. Goku was taught by angels how they use UI and how they mastered it. So they took a step back and he seems to have different branching UI's. Omen is the "base" where it can splinter off into other things being the best way into tapping into the beings natural instinct.

  • @ultrainstinctgoku1926
    @ultrainstinctgoku1926 2 года назад +22

    Gas resolve is gonna be his downfall. He fights for his brother rather than his own pride, yet his brother doesn’t value Gas’ life, only his own means to an end. It’s tragic

  • @austinb9732
    @austinb9732 2 года назад +14

    I hope that when he does the mouth blast we get that double voice type effect from the TOP I personally loved that

    • @jerrickcole5704
      @jerrickcole5704 2 года назад +1

      I do believe Goku either learn the mouth blast with Brody or learn it on his own.

  • @grimdaggz
    @grimdaggz 2 года назад +8

    Silver has power, utilized during the TOP to do as much damage under a time limit. Omen focuses on dodging, while running the clock. Seems like he's gonna tire Gas out.

    • @decepticonxhunter4850
      @decepticonxhunter4850 2 года назад

      CUI has optimal dodging abilities as well, as was evidenced in the Moro Arc where Goku was dodging everything UI Moro was throwing at him. Goku just used Omen instead of CUI because the latter form would've burned through his stamina faster than Omen would have.

  • @Act10nJacks0n88
    @Act10nJacks0n88 2 года назад +24

    i personally like what they're doing with UI and making it so you have to be in the right headspace for different variations. Fits right in my opinion to make it much more difficult to master. Also loved the mouth blast and thought the writing on this was very fun. but hope they implement granola since it's his arc

    • @steverobinson5048
      @steverobinson5048 2 года назад

      The problem with what your saying is that leaves no cap for the form...aka leaving them all the space they need to not write themselves into a wall..you can't go from the Moro arc where Goku literally creates a giant spirit god form in ui mastered to having to revert to using omen form because he can't get mastered u.i right...even though we've already seen what it's capable of and he isn't even using some of those moves here. It's sloppy

    • @steverobinson5048
      @steverobinson5048 2 года назад

      @Shoreside Vale there literally is no explanation to what your explaining dude lol..it's just bad writing......

    • @steverobinson5048
      @steverobinson5048 2 года назад

      @Shoreside Vale It...makes...no...sense...

  • @teamlavender2011
    @teamlavender2011 2 года назад +22

    When it comes to finding the right techniques, I think Dragonball has been infamous for that. Omen makes sense if he can’t use Mastered UI correctly especially learning about his dad, Bardock. Instead of having that distract him he uses it as a part of his instinct as a force to be reckoned with.

    • @UnifiedEntity
      @UnifiedEntity 2 года назад +3

      This just sounds like something that would benefit the nature of the Saiyan's potential, and that's super Saiyan.

  • @danyahlaarayah7016
    @danyahlaarayah7016 2 года назад +6

    I find it funny how Vegeta is telling Goku about figuring out UI when he don't use UE properly and I notice how in the manga and superhero Vegeta's knowledge of battle and forms is growing and they are making him looking like he's surpassed Goku in that manner.

  • @mikecassidy9185
    @mikecassidy9185 2 года назад +3

    I think it makes sense that Goku left Vegeta behind. I would assume it takes a tremendous amount of peace and focus to do what he's trying to accomplish. That's probably hard to do while there's explosions and your buddy getting absolutely bodied in front of you.
    He needed zero distractions.

  • @fogtim
    @fogtim 2 года назад +5

    The only thing that confuses me, is how during the ToP when jiren tried killing u7, it filled goku with rage which gave him a power boost

    • @JohnnyMacs19
      @JohnnyMacs19 2 года назад +3

      Well immediately after that is when Goku fell out of UI. So maybe it has something to do with that

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад

      He was still in control tho. It wasn’t like he was out of control/berserk

    • @shido_rimru_
      @shido_rimru_ 2 года назад +2

      @@leultrainstinct406 stop making excuses

  • @williamgolston5399
    @williamgolston5399 2 года назад +33

    But I really believe "perfecting" UI means he has to get better at each level. He's perfecting Omen I assume......I LOVE that he's using new techniques like a mouth blast (in human form) because I'm SICK of the limited ki attacks from him (Kamehameha).

    • @SonGoku0-r
      @SonGoku0-r 2 года назад

      Yeah i guess

    • @crazyc1cken969
      @crazyc1cken969 2 года назад +3

      I kind of look at it like this I can't remember who said it whis or meerus but goku was told not to rely on ui as a transformation but instead it should be a normal state of mind

    • @roxtechs
      @roxtechs 2 года назад +1

      I hate that UI is treated just like any other transformation. Like Toriyama and Toyotaro had no true endgame for Goku Mastered UI.

    • @roshanranjan8701
      @roshanranjan8701 2 года назад

      Thats just out of character. He's using broly moves.

    • @tistakere5055
      @tistakere5055 2 года назад +5

      @@roshanranjan8701 broly is not the first one using a mouth blast

  • @mr.saucemanxbackupaccount8969
    @mr.saucemanxbackupaccount8969 2 года назад +19

    I think Gas becoming old is because that’s his power operates through his resolve to fight for Elec. It’s different from Granolah, who will probably age rapidly once his three years in near completion

  • @meshachbrown662
    @meshachbrown662 2 года назад +13

    Btw that makes no sense how he can use emotions in ui omen because when he fought against Moro and used ui omen he had the speed boost till he started using ui improperly hence using his emotions and brutee strength and force and then got stomped out by Moro. Which is literally the reason he unlocked mui after because he had no emotions so. I dunno how now he can all of a sudden use his emotions when it’s been shown to us beforehand that he shouldn’t use ui like that stated by meerus

    • @Leviathan_Art
      @Leviathan_Art 2 года назад

      Wasn't moro like 6 months ago in DBS time?
      If anything he learned it off screen ( page). Like your bring up Moro as if Goku fought him last chapter ( or yesterday in DBS time).
      When it's probably been like 6-8 months since then. Hell wtf was the last time we seen this m.f. use healing (from a few chapters ago) and telekinesis?

    • @Klato-sx5eq
      @Klato-sx5eq 2 года назад +6

      Meerus was teaching him how an angel does it, Goku had issues with his stamina and not his ability to stay calm

    • @jaylingraves8800
      @jaylingraves8800 2 года назад +2

      Omen can used when his heart is calm. Silver is activated when both his heart AND mind are at peace.

    • @cheeseburgerfreddy6350
      @cheeseburgerfreddy6350 2 года назад +5

      It's just shitty writing they retconned UI and Goku's history for no reason, He'll probably have trouble with UI again in the next arc for whatever reason.

    • @Mapple-qp6yg
      @Mapple-qp6yg 2 года назад +2

      Perfected Ui with zero emotions >>>>>>> Ui Omen with emotion boost >>>>>> Inperfect Ui with emotions. Basically after Meerus death and in the TOP Goku used a perfect zero emotion Ui. But that state of mind is not something Goku can replicate freely even if he enters silver Ui. Right now using his emotions with the UI Omen technique is stronger than him trying to utilize silver Ui with his state of mind.

  • @gonzalex87
    @gonzalex87 2 года назад +10

    I really like the idea of Goku going back to black hair. When they first introduced UI it look cooler on that black blueish style than silver white, in my opinion

  • @Nidas3Hunnid
    @Nidas3Hunnid 2 года назад +2

    Vegeta also ran from Frieza second form back in the Namek Saga. He truly has grown a lot.

  • @PoohKalonji_97
    @PoohKalonji_97 2 года назад +2

    I just took it as Goku said “ My heart isn’t come right now “ just in this moment he can’t really get a control of his emotions during this fight dude just remember his parents and is feeling Saiyan pride ! He’s riled up !!

  • @soulawakens8305
    @soulawakens8305 2 года назад +11

    I think 73 is going to come out of nowhere and use his copy ability on Gas if he dies from aging. I'm calling it....

    • @kylewilliam4230
      @kylewilliam4230 2 года назад

      Decent prediction here id say, especially considering they literally haven’t even mentioned him since like the 4th chapter of the arc

    • @emojimr4427
      @emojimr4427 2 года назад +3

      That's not a bad twist of events

    • @nickhardt2486
      @nickhardt2486 2 года назад +4

      73 might just disappear forever, part of me thinks everyone thinks he's coming back, but toriyama forgot he existed

  • @BuckFoeJiden
    @BuckFoeJiden 2 года назад +5

    I think dropping back to omen is a trope go goku "getting back to his roots."
    It shows with his initial dialog, too. "Thats just how I am" excited for battle, carefree and fighting with emotion, which is classic goku. I believe his "MUI" as it is isn't a true mastered ultra instinct. I see him re-mastering ultra instinct much the same way he tapped into it against Jiren. By letting everything but the fight ahead fade away, and embracing his Saiyan roots. The love of battle, and nothing else will finally allow him to unlock UI, and with both his Saiyan lineage and his personality, this will all tie together, and I see it igniting a fire in Vegeta that let's them finally, truly, fight together without fusing.
    Vegeta is more if a hardened battering ram, and goku more of an elusive striker.
    Everyone's talked so much crap on this arc, but I think we're going to see some serious character development for the two as a duo that we haven't seen since the Buu saga.

  • @GameOverJesse
    @GameOverJesse 2 года назад +19

    Thanks for covering all of these

  • @elilennon6834
    @elilennon6834 2 года назад +3

    So with MUI and UI whis at the beginning of this arc told goku to learn how to use UI with his other forms and to save the silver haired version for when he needs to surpass his limits well obviously Gas is an opponent that would make sense for Goku to surpass his limits against but do to Goku mental and emotional state he cant use the Mastered version to its fullest so I guess in a way its not really that Goku is regressing with MUI its that he has no real emotional or mental control thus hes weakening himself

  • @nyxayde
    @nyxayde 2 года назад +3

    I don't get what's so hard to understand as to why he's using Omen over MUI.
    MUI requires him to free his mind and heart of emotion to be fully utilized and used at max potential and power. However goku isn't in a calm, pure state mentally or emotionally, therefore he is bringing down the effectiveness of MUI making it basically weaker than normal.
    However due to his amped mental and emotion state, he can utilize the power speed etc of Omen more effectively and in combination with his emotions.
    Let's say (again not factual numbers just an example) that MUI is 50x stronger than Omen when ultized to its max ability and potential. (Clearing the mind, devoid of emotions). Because of gokus mental and emotional state he can't bring out that full potential therefore cutting MUI effectiveness and power in half, making it as strong as Omen. No matter what the differnece in power is between the states, Goku isn't able to fully utilize MUI.
    However since Omen still gives a massive boost to Goku in strength, speed, etc etc and can be used in conjunction with his emotions (since we know saiyans can get a rage/anger boost) he can essentially make Omen stronger than MUI when his emotions are out of wack.
    So yes while MUI is always naturally stronger faster etc when goku cant clear his mind and emotions, MUI can become as weak as Omen when he is out of sorts with his emotions. But he can make Omen just as strong or stronger because he can use its power in conjuction with his emotions..
    MUI: Strongest state of power when goku is devoid of emotions and calm mentally but weakened when out of sorts.
    OMEN: Naturally weaker than MUI but can be used in conjunction with his Emotions and mental state. In which given the certain scenario, can be stronger that than MUI

  • @Pentaclown84
    @Pentaclown84 2 года назад +4

    i get the feeling ellec wished for something like getting gas' power after his life runs out so he himself doesn't need to give up his life

  • @NightEye0509
    @NightEye0509 2 года назад +4

    I don't know man, Ultra Ego seems pretty useless. So, Vegeta gets stronger as he gets damaged but then ends up being useless because he took too much damage? Doesn't this just make him a punching bag? Still waiting for Vegeta greatness....

  • @jaylingraves8800
    @jaylingraves8800 2 года назад +16

    I'm not sure why you would have a problem with Goku leaving to figure out UI if Vegeta TOLD him to do so. We saw that Goku was ready to jump in and help Vegeta at any point. I'm not sure why you would have a problem with this part in particular 🤔

  • @SpammytheHedgehog
    @SpammytheHedgehog 2 года назад +7

    This would make sense if this Arc took place during the Dragon Ball Super Hero movie.

    • @DestroAzureDx
      @DestroAzureDx 2 года назад

      Minor Spoiler warning:
      While I agree it would've and it's what they shouldve done it appears it doesnt...

  • @blaketindle4703
    @blaketindle4703 2 года назад +3

    Drag-On Ball has never been more accurate.

  • @andrewpickett722
    @andrewpickett722 2 года назад +7

    Am I wrong, or did piccolo use a mouth blast or two at some point within Z?
    I'm sure it's obvious he CAN since the Demon King did it and piccolo is basically his doppelganger at this point but we've also seen goku use a small ki blast through his feet (VS Kale, T.O.P) it's not much different given the amount of KI control the guys have, and goku can clearly and effortlessly control balls of ki (also T.O.P against the saiyan females)

    • @djtwister6997
      @djtwister6997 2 года назад

      Yes I forgot when but he did

    • @krishrama
      @krishrama 2 года назад +1

      ya saving gohan from a saibamen back in saiyan saga dbz.
      it was epic. but then he never used it much after that...
      i like that move tho.

    • @andrewpickett722
      @andrewpickett722 2 года назад +1

      @@krishrama that's right!! That's the moment I was remembering. Where he throws the Saibamen up into the air and blasts it right?

    • @krishrama
      @krishrama 2 года назад

      @@andrewpickett722

  • @LorTrust
    @LorTrust 2 года назад +7

    it’s a godly form, probably more in depth than giving credit for

  • @datmarshy
    @datmarshy 2 года назад +6

    I might agree that it’s uncharacteristic of goku normally… however it’s very similar to the buu incident on the Kai planet. Where he was taking a bulk of pain while goku needed time to get a stronger way of fighting (spirit bomb)

  • @mrD66M
    @mrD66M 2 года назад +3

    UI was never meant to be mastered too quickly, I like that there are a lot of layers to it. I get why some ppl don't like it though

  • @byBlazing
    @byBlazing 2 года назад +1

    Calling it now Elec has a safety measure in place with his wish to make gas the strongest. When gas is fatigued and out of commission the power will transfer to him

  • @qlasalle
    @qlasalle 2 года назад +5

    I think your gripe with UI is odd its not changed at all. You had a whole video about UI not being a transformation but a technique.
    To mix UI with sayain emotional power ups still makes sense.
    Silver haired UI may have limitations when you get power boosts through emotions.

  • @KeysofIDproductions
    @KeysofIDproductions 2 года назад +24

    My thoughts regarding these Ultra forms of Goku and Vegeta is that there are many depths to these techniques/transformations that both are discovering as they fight. It might explain why Goku must figure out his emotional state related to self-movement, whereas Vegeta only just began using Ultra Ego and is punishing his body to understand more and figure out what flaws he needs to work on to make UE more efficient and durable. By the time the main storyline reaches GT's timeline, we'll have fine-tuned versions of these techniques that works for them.

    • @IGiveHonestReviews
      @IGiveHonestReviews 2 года назад

      GT isnt apart of the timeline.....atl universe

    • @leultrainstinct406
      @leultrainstinct406 2 года назад

      Exactly
      Idk why all these vegeta fans are crying when he literally just got the form lol

    • @KeysofIDproductions
      @KeysofIDproductions 2 года назад

      @@IGiveHonestReviews at the moment, Super Hero takes place roughly year 783 of Dragonball's calendar, about a year before the end of Z where Goku meets Uub. GT is set during year 789-790. While no longer canon, the main official storyline is nearing that year. What we've seen in the manga and in SDB:SH would set forth Dragonball into a whole new direction.

    • @IGiveHonestReviews
      @IGiveHonestReviews 2 года назад

      @@KeysofIDproductions do you know when this new movie takes place? Like specifically manga wise?

    • @KeysofIDproductions
      @KeysofIDproductions 2 года назад

      @@IGiveHonestReviews the movie was written before DBS Broly was pitched so they're not really basing the plot off the manga. The main story is the manga story so its still set in age 781, possibly close to age 782 in the timeline. There's no way to know for sure what the next manga arc will be about so whether it wraps up both ends (manga to DBS: Super Hero) is up to Toyotaro/Toei/Toriyama.

  • @uhhhwhat6581
    @uhhhwhat6581 2 года назад +5

    I think it’s similar to what Vegeta did against zamasu where he would switch between blue and god for speed and strength, think of silver hair ui as a constant stream of power, where in his calmness, goku has max martial arts performance, but he can’t really raise or lower the output too much because of that same calmness, with omen, he can use his emotions and excitement to up his power at any moment, as we see he can be more brutal and creative even if he risks being hit more, and I honestly like it when I think of it that way

    • @hassanhazara
      @hassanhazara 2 года назад +1

      This is nonsense, MUI Goku raged and got a power boost at the end of the TOP when jiren sent a blast towards the bench. They really don't know what they are doing, they kept themselves in the corner by completing the UI at the TOP now they don't know what to do with this form lol.

    • @uhhhwhat6581
      @uhhhwhat6581 2 года назад +2

      @@hassanhazara wasn’t ui rage in top anime only ?

    • @noone4902
      @noone4902 2 года назад +1

      @@hassanhazara That only happened in the anime. The manga is handling UI differently. Goku never raged while in MUI in the manga

    • @fg009letyrds8
      @fg009letyrds8 2 года назад

      @@hassanhazara Non-canon anime only. Also Goku being enraged in White Hair is literally a plot hole. If he got enraged in UI sign instead then it would fit.

  • @theleechqueen
    @theleechqueen 2 года назад +2

    Considering how disposable Elec is treating Gas, I'm guessing he has a plan B.
    Very high chance he did something involving 73.

  • @Bannedconfidential
    @Bannedconfidential 2 года назад +8

    Vegeta’s Ultra Ego is one of the most worthless forms as of now. He gets his ass whooped, lands a couple blows then claims “I’m only getting stronger”, then proceeds to get his ass whooped to the point that he gets knocked out smh. This is the most long winded Dragon Ball arc of all time.

    • @yermo-2820
      @yermo-2820 2 года назад

      Facts. This UE is first stage of something bigger GoD power or is a trash transformation.

    • @Majorblack
      @Majorblack 2 года назад

      @@yermo-2820 cope, He will never get pay off ever

  • @SouthPlaya
    @SouthPlaya 2 года назад +15

    I’m starting to get more curious to how strong Elec is him self. I feel like after Gas, Elec is gonna be the new villain but I’m thinking he’s stronger but right now he just wants Gas to do most of the hard work before he steps in

    • @DarkZ0l
      @DarkZ0l 2 года назад +5

      I think he's not physically strong. He's after knowledge. Probably doing something like Aizen did with Hogyoku (idk how to spell it)

    • @Jiron127
      @Jiron127 2 года назад

      I agree. Elec craves knowledge, but not without maximizing his potential first.

    • @basedimperialism
      @basedimperialism 2 года назад +1

      He literally couldn't be stronger than Gas. Gas was wished to be the strongest fighting in the Universe. Elec would literally need to make another wish on the Dragon Balls to become stronger than Gas.

    • @SouthPlaya
      @SouthPlaya 2 года назад

      @@basedimperialism we never saw every wish that was made

  • @dreethebeach
    @dreethebeach 2 года назад +3

    We’ll think about it. It’s a godly technique and he is a mortal so technically he shouldn’t even be using this. So since he’s a mortal this technique is very complex and and nearly impossible to master. But since goku is goku. He will find a way to override any tradition towards techniques. He’s defying gods and using they’re techniques the saiyan way and I think that’s what they are trying to show. They say ultra instinct can’t be used this way but goku says otherwise. He will find a way

  • @undone14
    @undone14 2 года назад +1

    Goku is off meditating but still tuned into the fight. That is how he knew vegeta was about to get stabbed by Gas.

  • @DethaneGames
    @DethaneGames 2 года назад +2

    Goku doesn't need to be on the battle field to see the battle. He can sense every movement from all the way across the planet and maybe even farther. It's been that way for a long time.

  • @xaviercordell9
    @xaviercordell9 2 года назад +3

    I really likes this chapter cuz it shows no matter how much strength u got if u can't stay focused ur bound to lose gas might be strongest from the wish but he has lil experience unlike goku who is a lil bit more experienced it's mental warfare going on that's y gas is losing

  • @brycecox9802
    @brycecox9802 2 года назад +8

    I think the transformation makes perfect sense. As you said, goku needs to have a clear mind and allow his body to take control. My theory is that if you cannot meet these conditions, the MUI form is probably not as powerful or to be utilized fully. By stepping it down hes probably able to utilize it better. The end goal is to be in a constant state of ui like whis, This is actually a great example to show the difference in mastery and power. Just my theory

    • @tedypolano1503
      @tedypolano1503 2 года назад +2

      I personally believe that goku will have to incorporate his emotions into his silver haired version, for him to grow stronger he needs to be able to utilize his strongest form to its max, currently he’s experimenting with an easier version where he can put this theory at work, in the future he’s probably going to be able to incorporate his emotions into mui and that will probably be his strongest transformation

  • @ShanMichaelEscasio
    @ShanMichaelEscasio 2 года назад

    Toyotaro here pulled a Frieza: "This planet will explode in 5 minutes!"
    The 5 minutes:

  • @yammo7013
    @yammo7013 2 года назад +1

    Remember to take into consideration what we have already learned..
    Whis wants goku to learn his own version of ui
    Goku basically has to fight to destroy his opponents and not like he’s been doing
    When goku did that mouth blast that was to show that he’s not fighting like usual. Vegeta even commented on it.

  • @kylewilliam4230
    @kylewilliam4230 2 года назад +3

    I have a potential prediction for what I think I could happen. So I think Goku will fight with Gas until Gas actually becomes too much for him again. Sometime in between that, I think Monaito will see the struggle getting worse for Goku and Vegeta, and decide to sacrifice himself by giving up all the rest of his life energy to fully heal Granolah. Granolah will rejoin the fight, giving him, Vegeta and Goku a fighting chance. But I don’t think it’ll last very long, I think Gas will fade away and die and honestly if they do this part of the arc right it could actually be really sad and yield some real tears for me. Like just the anguish Gas might feel knowing that he died for a man who called him a brother, but treated him like a slave, not family. The broken soul of a little boy who just wanted to prove himself to his older brother, only to be totally betrayed by him, and worse, with a smile on his face. Elec is truly evil and I hope he gets annihilated by someone in this arc, preferably Granolah.

  • @buildaggedonarmanaziie4462
    @buildaggedonarmanaziie4462 2 года назад +3

    Well we have an answer to how Bardock defeated Gas, we have an answer to what the wish for Gas was, as well as some of the conditions for that wish, and so the other things to know are what was Elec's "Other business" that he had to do ? And what are all of the questions that The Hetters, Oil and Maki, asked Zuno ?

  • @Funkotronimus
    @Funkotronimus 2 года назад +2

    Perhaps the franchise is saving the mastered form for something related to Goku’s evolution as the series continues, possibly suggesting a much bigger threat than Gas.

  • @mrblang12
    @mrblang12 2 года назад +2

    3:08
    The distance goku leaves to meditate wasn’t that far. It’s comparable to how far he watched Vegeta get his ass handed to by kid buu while goku charged ss3. He was able to intervene if needed and he did.

  • @BlueLionsTVNiiNiiFC
    @BlueLionsTVNiiNiiFC 2 года назад +4

    feel like this series is falling off now, no steaks, no creativity, cheap form after cheap form and redundancies with transformations. Feeling like its time to leave it now, its not as good as it used to be, its just a product to be profited from at this point. All the things they could have done when Super returned, personally felt like they rushed things too much with the introduction to the gods and god forms. You don't even feel the power difference anymore in them, i dunno man. Accepting its a series for the new generation now which is fine and happy for them. Feel like my time with DB is over now. Good things come to an end eventually

    • @schemar17
      @schemar17 2 года назад +2

      They should have stopped with battle of God's

    • @BlueLionsTVNiiNiiFC
      @BlueLionsTVNiiNiiFC 2 года назад +3

      @@schemar17 for sure, even the way they introduced that god form was pretty mid and inconsequential

    • @fg009letyrds8
      @fg009letyrds8 2 года назад

      Yeah, where is my steak?

  • @Andy-cm5ur
    @Andy-cm5ur 2 года назад +10

    Basically they are improving all of goku's forms in this arc that's why we see blue doing so much better against gas and now ui sign stomping gas, goku has not been able to fully utilise completed ui in this arc as according to him his mind is not at peace in this arc and he will do that in the final fight, so his true ultra instinct in the final fight will be extremely op.

    • @Mapple-qp6yg
      @Mapple-qp6yg 2 года назад +4

      Exactly he was only calm last arc because of calming down in the face of Meerus’s death. He still hasn’t gained the ability to stay completely calm.

    • @Andy-cm5ur
      @Andy-cm5ur 2 года назад

      @@Mapple-qp6yg so do you think that someone has to die again in this arc for goku to have a calm and peaceful mind in the face of jarring shock for pui?

  • @AristophMarloque
    @AristophMarloque 2 года назад +1

    I kind of feel like Goku going back to Omen is almost a call-back to the old Super Saiyan days and discovering the "beefed up" version that, in the end, was stronger but less effective. Whis kept telling Goku that he needed to discover his own version of Ultra Instinct in order to fully unlock its potential. The silver-haired MUI is possibly a dead-end for Goku as it's basically attempting to emulate the Angels, something which he physiologically will simply never be able to truly accomplish. Maybe he's realized that instead of removing all emotions, which is required for MUI like the Angels, he's a Saiyan so he needs to embrace them. So he's gone back to Omen in order to regain the use of his emotions and is attempting to create his own brand new branch of Ultra Instinct from there.

    • @fg009letyrds8
      @fg009letyrds8 2 года назад

      Oh yeah the android arc where we see different grades of Super Saiyan. Like where Vegeta knows SS Grade 3 was useless and stayed at Grade 2 form.

  • @KaoticReach1999
    @KaoticReach1999 2 года назад +2

    It's weird how there keeps being moments throughout the Super Manga it feels like Toro is just making up things on the spot without putting much thought into it, and the way its paced it feels like it should be weekly, but it being monthly it sets up disappointment
    Goku doing a mouth blast is probably gonna look goofy in the anime too but will see how they do it

  • @titanmasterrace4000
    @titanmasterrace4000 2 года назад +4

    It took two arcs for goku to finally figure it out when in the tournament of power he was easily swapping hands with UI Omen but then again the anime an manga are different.

    • @DarkZ0l
      @DarkZ0l 2 года назад

      the manga version of TOP didn't do it any better

  • @Venom.02
    @Venom.02 2 года назад +3

    I think people are missing..
    On why goku went back to Ui. Omen
    I can see why and I can tell you why geekdom it’s a dragon theory but please hear me out
    As you explain the silver hair you have to be a state of peace and move by instinct.
    And the black is same thing but slightly different as you said he wants to use the omen for emotional damage.
    It suits goku more.
    Here I can clarify in reality in marshal art you can stick to a fighting style for so long till someone kick your butt right.
    So how can someone step it up or beat an enemy or opponent?
    You have to or your forced to change your style or add something new adopt or adept an other “form” or style or marshal art, in order to win

    • @yokingstream1005
      @yokingstream1005 2 года назад

      That’s an interesting take, I hope they explain it further tho, but otherwise I thought the chapter was good

  • @Redwolfxx
    @Redwolfxx 2 года назад +1

    I have feeling Gas will win, but before he lands final blow he runs out of gas, life age/energy dries up

  • @10-5playz
    @10-5playz 2 года назад +1

    I like how Goku and Vegeta are using this as like a training exercise.

  • @quelolol
    @quelolol 2 года назад +8

    I disagree with you so hard. Him being able to switch back and forth between silver hair and omen is great for the story and doesn’t make it complicated at all. Seeing perfected UI Goku get smashed to the ground feels so weird. Now that he “perfected” it he knows he can tap in when he clears his mind completely but in moments like this he WANTS the pride the emotions and it’ll fuel him even more.

  • @Ben-qv7zj
    @Ben-qv7zj 2 года назад +3

    With regard to their being wishy washy on ultra instinct, I feel like you may need to meet them half way on this. The "power boosting" techniques are a dead end for the series and they know it. Ultra Instinct and Ultra Ego can't just become Super Saiyan Silver and Super Saiyan Purple. Toyotaru is even making fun of that as the characters speculate what hair color Goku is going to use next. They're trying to make ultra instinct and ultra ego something more. They're not forms so much as they are "styles."
    To me, ultra instinct seems to require a bodhisattva level of mental discipline that Goku is not ready for. There's a reason the angels are the teachers and not the fighters. They're beyond conflict. It makes sense that Goku, having become emotionally conflicted from remembering his family, hearing Granola's story, witnessing Gas's exploitation, etc is now not able to fully utilize Ultra Instinct. He's become too emotionally invested and so the effort of maintaining a clear mind is taking away from his ability to fight. Omen allows him to fight from a more honest place right now.
    I don't think that Toyotarou is really all that interested in carving out more species-based forms for people to argue stats on. I think he's using the forms to externalize the character's personalities and emotions which is closer to what made the original super saiyan transformation work on a story level. It was about externalizing Goku's rage, it wasn't about a x50 multiplier or whatever.

  • @josephross9388
    @josephross9388 2 года назад +2

    This chapter made was quite something personally I really really liked it and also Goku's re powered up omen form was awesome it felt like dbz

  • @versefourtymusic
    @versefourtymusic 2 года назад

    That goku combo with the Boulder transitioning to the mid section hit would be so 🔥 animated

  • @jordanjones7686
    @jordanjones7686 2 года назад +5

    My wishes for the rest of this arc:
    - Gas defeats Goku (not Silver hair)
    - Granola returns and battle Gas
    - Granola due to having more knowledge on Elec’s wish chooses to fight Gas only
    - Granola decides to follow in Gas footsteps and sacrifice his lifespan for more power due to it possibly being the only way to win
    - Granola and Gas fight to death where neither one is the decisive favorite
    - Before his death, Granola decides to forgive Goku and Vegeta for the sins of the Saiyans (make his death have a real impact, not another Merus situation)
    - Elec and the Heeters escape and try to scheme up so new plan to kill Frieza though Maki and Oil plot to leave Elec after seeing what he did Gas
    - Goku and Vegeta both learn important lessons not only about UI & UE but also about how their actions can have a future impact on their children and grandchild (in Goku’s case)
    - Goku warns everybody (even Frieza) about the dangers of asking to be the strongest in the universe from the Dragonballs (he thinks the same consequences can come from Shenron)
    - Goku begins training Broly and the Super Hero movie is talked about.

    • @yermo-2820
      @yermo-2820 2 года назад +2

      I would add to your story Elec escaping and looking for OG73, discovering Baby is actually inside and staring his revenge against Goku and Freezer alongside him or Tsufurians.

    • @calebgunner
      @calebgunner 2 года назад

      Yow both of your ideas are awesome... Hopefully the end result is similar...
      Making Elec an overarching villain is a dope idea... Greta way to connect the arcs

  • @SpammytheHedgehog
    @SpammytheHedgehog 2 года назад +3

    Granolah's just on hiatus.

    • @CertainlyCynical
      @CertainlyCynical 2 года назад

      Yea no big deal it’s not like this is his arc or anything…

  • @RuiLuz
    @RuiLuz 2 года назад +1

    While using it Goku is no longer in a "zombified" state, he is more him now.

  • @lj3525
    @lj3525 2 года назад +2

    I feel like he’s aging so fast because granola had a average life span of 300 years that got cut down to 3 and the heaters probably have a shorter life span causing gas to age more rapidly. That’s I think until they explain it if they do