C40 GT and ESP X3 are very likely the same oil with different label and green dye / zirconium tracer added to the GT. This is probably because X3 is being phased out by X4, which will have different base oils and an SP compatible additive package like the FS A40 0W-40. German oil club shows identical additive levels and FTIR results for the ESP X3 and C40 GT. The PFF forum also has a thread on it and the suspicion is that X4 will not be compatible with a DLC coating in the MA275s.
Seriously, I call BS on if one of these oils will cause a motor to blow versus the other. Sometimes motors blow for no reason....it does happen. 99% of the time it is because the motor loses oil pressures on the track due to either low oil levels or high lateral g's or usually a combination of both.
Thanks for the video. I am a GT4RS owner from Taiwan. Recently, I received an official letter with a recall code WRA2, informing GT4RS owners that starting from 2024/02/01, we should use C40GT certified oil instead of C40/VW 511 00 certified oil. The letter mentioned that if we are using C40/VW 511 00 certified oil that was purchased before 2024/02/01, it is acceptable to continue using it. However, after 2024/02/01, we must ensure that we switch to using C40GT certified oil. (Lol, it seems like they are waiving their responsibility if C40/VW 511 00 certified oil has any issues with the engine.) Anyways, I think you are correct that we should move to C40GT certified oil as soon as possible.
I have a gt4 rs, i had a letter in march from Porsche where they write me to use only C40 GT oil from that moment. I did a oil change at the dealership in april with the new oil specification but i have told them about the letter and i request the new oil! Car is working fine..
Where are you located? In the USA we have not received any correspondence for Porsche on this change but I have heard from folks in the UK and Germany that did receive letters.
@@ItsTrackTime I live in Romania, they send really fast 3 documents in the letter. They say from that moment to use only the new oil! To be honest with you the car goes the same, nothing you can fell has changed!
my 2022 GT3 just blew up recently, i was using the original oil as specificed. I ve seen the new oil. ive put on about 25 trackdays on my car in the last two years.
@@ItsTrackTime it will be going in this week, and I will find out more information soon! Hopefully more details will be provided after they diagnosis things.
Thanks a lot, that explains why Porsche (FRANCE) has replaced the oil sticker of my GT4 RS 3 weeks ago with other so called "factory changes", but without any explanation ! Indeed, they should have at least telling me why. Not even a word, else than we've changes the sticker...
Interesting so you did not receive any letters or any explanation from Porsche they just quietly changed the sticker so that it now calls for the new oil?
If you go to a Porsche dealer they will use the new gt oil on the modern gt cars, you will also receive a new booklet telling you to only use the new gt oil. It’s a new thing as of 2-3 months ago
In the US? I haven't heard anyone in the US say Porsche told them to only use the new GT oil on the 9K rpm engines. I even asked my service adviser when this was going to be communicated to US customers and he said I don't know.
Probably they improved the blend of additives to make the oil pump live a bit longer. But maybe some components have been improved as well, current engines are more reliable than those built 1-2 years ago. Anyway who tracks one of these cars should not change the oil any later than every 4000-5000km.
Let me know what you find. So far I've had a person in the UK and one in Germany say they mailed them letters explaining the change and telling them to switch oil immediately.
@@ItsTrackTime main point is under warranty yes by all means run the Porsche specd oil. If not many better options like Mobil 1 fsx2 5w50, Supercar 5w50, drive di40 or dt40, even motul 300v 5w40.
I run Motul 300V in my DeMan 4.5 GT4, per the recommendation of Rick DeMan. Handles the higher temp better. But, with frequent track days, you must change it more often. I also added a deep sump for more oil/cooling capacity.
@@ItsTrackTime It's got nothing to do with EPA. C40 / mid SAPS is to protect OPF and EPA does not require OPF. It's not really relevant anymore as C40 oils pass the same tests for wear as A40 oils and you can make a top tier mid-SAPS oil like Motul 300V. The restrictions are Porsche / VW standards for deposit control etc. that many non-approved oils could fail. ESP X3 is a better oil than the A40 oils it replaced btw.
My 2022 992 GT3 just got serviced and they gave me a new leaflet regarding the oil, and replaced the oil sticker ! There is also the new oil on the invoice!
@@ItsTrackTime not at the dealer but if I remember correctly in the leaflet they say that the formula of the green oil is changing and will not be suitable for GT cars anymore
@@ItsTrackTimethis is it. The new GT oil is the previous X3 ESP. It’s just for convenience as many had a hard time to remember reading the rear side label so now they rebranded it to “GT” up front. And of course to increase their profit margin as the GT oil most certainly will have a Porsche tax on it. I will most definitely use up all my 2x 4L of ESP X3 that I have stocked up.
I've heard that theory as well but given Porsche Motorsports is telling the race teams to switch immediately and the Mobile1 spec sheets show differences I would assume there is a tangible difference between the two blends.
Not necessarily true. You can formulate a C40 to beat an A40 oil. They have the same wear limits in the tests. You can substitute other additives for ZDDP.
GT4s and 4RS motors have been blowing up (most NOT tracked) for a host of reasons, from failed oil pumps to connecting rods. I've not heard of this failure mode. Porsche issued a manual update to correct the incorrect diagram for where to fill oil vs coolant in the 718 cars. I'd expect to see this update in the manual as well. There are other brands of C40 that have been in use. Motul comes to mind. Any indication that warranties will be voided for use of other C40 oils?
The manual only seems to specify C40 when calling out the oil requirement but I'm going to just follow what the dealership says given they are the ones that will communicate with the mothership if my engine blows. They sell both Mobile1 ESP X3 and GT. Both are C40 compliant but it seems only GT is acceptable now.
@@ItsTrackTime Interestingly my 2 year service is due. I just set an appointment and asked about the oil. I'll post back in a few weeks when the service is done.
@@ItsTrackTime my warranty will expire in 5 months. The Panamera GTS manual says Porsche c40 VW 511 00 0W-40/5W-40. So this means I can use it without effecting warranty period right?
This is intresting. Do you think esp x3 switched formulations thus making less sutable for gt cars prompting m1 and porsche to make this other line of oil?
I'm reading ESP was blended for cars with particulate filters in Europe and likely formulated more for EPA like regulations than engine longevity so the 9K motors suffered. From the two Mobile 1 spec sheets you can see there is a difference between these two blends...
This seems to indicate that a pursuit of efficiency won out over ultimate engine protection, and now the mistake has been realized. In an ideal world, the factory oil fill for GT cars would be formulated to maximize engine protection/performance, at whatever slight expense to EPA regulations. Leave the maximizing of efficiency to the engines in the rest of the fleet--standard 911s, Caymans, Cayennes, etc.
Exactly, I don't understand why low production track cars need to pass all of these rigorous EPA regulations. High volume commuter cars should be the target of such regulations.
I would also like to know that. I'll call my service guy on Monday and see what he says now. Last time I asked he confirmed only 4 quarts could be removed during the drain process.
I talked to my service rep, who then radioed the mothership, and came back with the following answers: 1) You can mix ESP and GT oil with no issues 2) Still no way to drain more than 4 quarts from 4RS 3) New oil protects better in extreme environments, ie track driving
Do 3 oil changes back to back. Only change filter on 1st one. So basically an oil change followed by 2 flushes after running the car 180-200F oil temp in between each.
@@ItsTrackTime Yes. 100hr warranty on 992Cup engines and 60hr warranty on the trans. They will take your failed engine or trans in (along with data) and determine "who" is at fault. You will pay for the replacement engine or trans up front and then be reimbursed once they determine you are not at fault. It can take months. It can take weeks. Just this past weekend at UTAH Porsche Sprint Challenge PMNA hand delivered two sequential boxes from Carson. Warrantied.
Good to know, thanks for the info. Given some of these cars are hard to purchase from Porsche Motorsports directly, like the 4RS Clubsport, if you buy one 2nd hand from a race team "new" does Porsche treat you as a 1st class citizen and honor the limited warranty or are you on your own?
@@ItsTrackTime Doesn't matter if you are the original purchaser. The cars are "tracked" by Porsche Motorsports while they are being raced professionally. They go by: 145km = 1Hr.
They are not requiring it but it should provided better protection for all of their engines. The surprising one that is missing from the "required" list is the 4.0L 8K rpm GT4 engine. I have one of those as well and will be moving it to GT oil once I deplete my stash of ESP.
@@ItsTrackTime That is why you should not be giving advice when it's only based on your belief. Mobile 1 specifically warns against use of the C40GT oil in non-RS cars. I have a 718 Spyder and it takes the regular C40 and not the C40GT.
C40 GT and ESP X3 are very likely the same oil with different label and green dye / zirconium tracer added to the GT. This is probably because X3 is being phased out by X4, which will have different base oils and an SP compatible additive package like the FS A40 0W-40. German oil club shows identical additive levels and FTIR results for the ESP X3 and C40 GT. The PFF forum also has a thread on it and the suspicion is that X4 will not be compatible with a DLC coating in the MA275s.
Seriously, I call BS on if one of these oils will cause a motor to blow versus the other. Sometimes motors blow for no reason....it does happen. 99% of the time it is because the motor loses oil pressures on the track due to either low oil levels or high lateral g's or usually a combination of both.
Thanks for the video.
I am a GT4RS owner from Taiwan. Recently, I received an official letter with a recall code WRA2, informing GT4RS owners that starting from 2024/02/01, we should use C40GT certified oil instead of C40/VW 511 00 certified oil.
The letter mentioned that if we are using C40/VW 511 00 certified oil that was purchased before 2024/02/01, it is acceptable to continue using it. However, after 2024/02/01, we must ensure that we switch to using C40GT certified oil.
(Lol, it seems like they are waiving their responsibility if C40/VW 511 00 certified oil has any issues with the engine.)
Anyways, I think you are correct that we should move to C40GT certified oil as soon as possible.
Thanks for the report!
Still no letters in the USA.
Very strange they are silently switching to the new oil but not announcing it to customers.
Ur comment in brackets probably makes the most sense
I have a gt4 rs, i had a letter in march from Porsche where they write me to use only C40 GT oil from that moment. I did a oil change at the dealership in april with the new oil specification but i have told them about the letter and i request the new oil! Car is working fine..
Where are you located?
In the USA we have not received any correspondence for Porsche on this change but I have heard from folks in the UK and Germany that did receive letters.
@@ItsTrackTime I live in Romania, they send really fast 3 documents in the letter. They say from that moment to use only the new oil! To be honest with you the car goes the same, nothing you can fell has changed!
Thanks for the info!
my 2022 GT3 just blew up recently, i was using the original oil as specificed. I ve seen the new oil. ive put on about 25 trackdays on my car in the last two years.
I assume they gave you a new engine?
Did they tell you to use C40 GT in the new engine?
@@ItsTrackTime it will be going in this week, and I will find out more information soon! Hopefully more details will be provided after they diagnosis things.
@@ap-op1wyyou don’t have gt3
@@The_North0 yes i m just dreaming and making stuff up 😂
It sounds unbelievable that a change in oil would make a motor blow.
Thanks a lot, that explains why Porsche (FRANCE) has replaced the oil sticker of my GT4 RS 3 weeks ago with other so called "factory changes", but without any explanation ! Indeed, they should have at least telling me why. Not even a word, else than we've changes the sticker...
Interesting so you did not receive any letters or any explanation from Porsche they just quietly changed the sticker so that it now calls for the new oil?
If you go to a Porsche dealer they will use the new gt oil on the modern gt cars, you will also receive a new booklet telling you to only use the new gt oil. It’s a new thing as of 2-3 months ago
In the US?
I haven't heard anyone in the US say Porsche told them to only use the new GT oil on the 9K rpm engines. I even asked my service adviser when this was going to be communicated to US customers and he said I don't know.
Probably they improved the blend of additives to make the oil pump live a bit longer. But maybe some components have been improved as well, current engines are more reliable than those built 1-2 years ago. Anyway who tracks one of these cars should not change the oil any later than every 4000-5000km.
That's why the .2s are always a good bet.
Thanks for the info - will investigate
Let me know what you find.
So far I've had a person in the UK and one in Germany say they mailed them letters explaining the change and telling them to switch oil immediately.
What if I told you both those oils are not ideal for track durability. Remember Porsche race teams rebuild their engines every 60 to 100 hrs….
I would be very unhappy given I don’t plan to replace my motor in 100 hours = 25 track weekends.
@@ItsTrackTime main point is under warranty yes by all means run the Porsche specd oil. If not many better options like Mobil 1 fsx2 5w50, Supercar 5w50, drive di40 or dt40, even motul 300v 5w40.
Once I get out of warranty then, as you say, more options are available but for now I'll run Mobile1 GT and cross my fingers.
If an oil shears in just a track day or two, it is worthless and shouldn’t even be an oil they recommend. The problem is likely much deeper than oil.
I run Motul 300V in my DeMan 4.5 GT4, per the recommendation of Rick DeMan. Handles the higher temp better. But, with frequent track days, you must change it more often. I also added a deep sump for more oil/cooling capacity.
I wonder if Redline or HPL would be a more attainable alternative - that might even wear better too.
I sure once we get out of warranty there will be better alternatives available that don't have to pass the EPA regulations.
@@ItsTrackTime It's got nothing to do with EPA. C40 / mid SAPS is to protect OPF and EPA does not require OPF. It's not really relevant anymore as C40 oils pass the same tests for wear as A40 oils and you can make a top tier mid-SAPS oil like Motul 300V. The restrictions are Porsche / VW standards for deposit control etc. that many non-approved oils could fail. ESP X3 is a better oil than the A40 oils it replaced btw.
My 2022 992 GT3 just got serviced and they gave me a new leaflet regarding the oil, and replaced the oil sticker !
There is also the new oil on the invoice!
OK so that's good news.
Did they explain why they were changing the required oil?
@@ItsTrackTime not at the dealer but if I remember correctly in the leaflet they say that the formula of the green oil is changing and will not be suitable for GT cars anymore
I've read that the X3 ESP was reblended and would be called X4 ESP so maybe that is the path forward and X3 ESP will die off.
@@ItsTrackTimethis is it. The new GT oil is the previous X3 ESP. It’s just for convenience as many had a hard time to remember reading the rear side label so now they rebranded it to “GT” up front. And of course to increase their profit margin as the GT oil most certainly will have a Porsche tax on it. I will most definitely use up all my 2x 4L of ESP X3 that I have stocked up.
I've heard that theory as well but given Porsche Motorsports is telling the race teams to switch immediately and the Mobile1 spec sheets show differences I would assume there is a tangible difference between the two blends.
A40 spec oil is still superior. Would only use A40 if out of warranty and no OPFs
Not necessarily true. You can formulate a C40 to beat an A40 oil. They have the same wear limits in the tests. You can substitute other additives for ZDDP.
Great video, thanks for making. Is there a cost difference in the oils?
Thanks!
Yes, Mobile1 GT is 50% more expensive from what I can see right not.
GT4s and 4RS motors have been blowing up (most NOT tracked) for a host of reasons, from failed oil pumps to connecting rods. I've not heard of this failure mode. Porsche issued a manual update to correct the incorrect diagram for where to fill oil vs coolant in the 718 cars. I'd expect to see this update in the manual as well. There are other brands of C40 that have been in use. Motul comes to mind. Any indication that warranties will be voided for use of other C40 oils?
The manual only seems to specify C40 when calling out the oil requirement but I'm going to just follow what the dealership says given they are the ones that will communicate with the mothership if my engine blows. They sell both Mobile1 ESP X3 and GT. Both are C40 compliant but it seems only GT is acceptable now.
Those kinds of failures are a shocker for the sticker u pay
Thanks 🙏
You’re welcome 😊
Can I use this in my GTS 4.0? I would think so.
They aren't recommending it.
So far it's only required for the 9K rpm engines.
@@ItsTrackTime Interestingly my 2 year service is due. I just set an appointment and asked about the oil. I'll post back in a few weeks when the service is done.
Thanks, I know some other GTS owners that would like to hear the answer.
Can I use this Porsche c40 GT oil for my 2nd gen Panamera GTS?
It's a better oil so I believe you can but I would follow your warranty.
@@ItsTrackTime my warranty will expire in 5 months. The Panamera GTS manual says Porsche c40 VW 511 00 0W-40/5W-40. So this means I can use it without effecting warranty period right?
The 718 GT4 has an 8000 rpm engine in it and they don't recommend using the C40 GT oil in it. I would consult your Porsche service consultant.
This is intresting. Do you think esp x3 switched formulations thus making less sutable for gt cars prompting m1 and porsche to make this other line of oil?
I'm reading ESP was blended for cars with particulate filters in Europe and likely formulated more for EPA like regulations than engine longevity so the 9K motors suffered.
From the two Mobile 1 spec sheets you can see there is a difference between these two blends...
Yes
We run a few 991 and 992 cup cars and have been trying to buy the C40 GT oil for a few weeks now. Where were you able to buy it?
Suncoast parts and I had to wait a couple weeks for it to ship. I’ve also heard some dealerships have it in stock.
@@ItsTrackTime that's great to know, thanks!
You can’t fully drain the oil out of a cayman?
Just the dry sump 4RS models.
This seems to indicate that a pursuit of efficiency won out over ultimate engine protection, and now the mistake has been realized. In an ideal world, the factory oil fill for GT cars would be formulated to maximize engine protection/performance, at whatever slight expense to EPA regulations. Leave the maximizing of efficiency to the engines in the rest of the fleet--standard 911s, Caymans, Cayennes, etc.
Exactly, I don't understand why low production track cars need to pass all of these rigorous EPA regulations.
High volume commuter cars should be the target of such regulations.
thanks for sharing this! anyone knows a way to remove all 8 qt of oil instead of 4 at a time? I am not sure how I feel about blending oil formulas.
I would also like to know that.
I'll call my service guy on Monday and see what he says now.
Last time I asked he confirmed only 4 quarts could be removed during the drain process.
I talked to my service rep, who then radioed the mothership, and came back with the following answers:
1) You can mix ESP and GT oil with no issues
2) Still no way to drain more than 4 quarts from 4RS
3) New oil protects better in extreme environments, ie track driving
@@ItsTrackTime that's awesome, thank you for the update. Looking to get my oil change in next week so timely info!
@@ItsTrackTime so how are they replacing the oil at service time? Only half?
Do 3 oil changes back to back. Only change filter on 1st one. So basically an oil change followed by 2 flushes after running the car 180-200F oil temp in between each.
Did porsche cover it?
I believe they worked something out that was acceptable to both parties.
Race cars don't really have warranties like street cars.
@@ItsTrackTime Yes. 100hr warranty on 992Cup engines and 60hr warranty on the trans. They will take your failed engine or trans in (along with data) and determine "who" is at fault. You will pay for the replacement engine or trans up front and then be reimbursed once they determine you are not at fault. It can take months. It can take weeks. Just this past weekend at UTAH Porsche Sprint Challenge PMNA hand delivered two sequential boxes from Carson. Warrantied.
Good to know, thanks for the info.
Given some of these cars are hard to purchase from Porsche Motorsports directly, like the 4RS Clubsport, if you buy one 2nd hand from a race team "new" does Porsche treat you as a 1st class citizen and honor the limited warranty or are you on your own?
@@ItsTrackTime Doesn't matter if you are the original purchaser. The cars are "tracked" by Porsche Motorsports while they are being raced professionally. They go by: 145km = 1Hr.
Is this only for GT cars? Any value in using this in non-GT cars on the track (e.g. 981 S, or 992 C2S)?
They are not requiring it but it should provided better protection for all of their engines.
The surprising one that is missing from the "required" list is the 4.0L 8K rpm GT4 engine.
I have one of those as well and will be moving it to GT oil once I deplete my stash of ESP.
@@ItsTrackTimehave you asked if it is okay to use on gt4 8k rpm engines?
@@ItsTrackTime That is why you should not be giving advice when it's only based on your belief. Mobile 1 specifically warns against use of the C40GT oil in non-RS cars. I have a 718 Spyder and it takes the regular C40 and not the C40GT.