20 Year Old Trane Won’t Start Second Compressor!
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- Опубликовано: 29 апр 2024
- In this video I do my best to get this old Trane to start!
#hvac #hvacguy #hvaclife #hvactechnician #hvactrainingvideos #hvactroubleshooting #airconditioner #furnace #compressor #trane #skilledtrades #bluecollarpride
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This is among three channels I watch that have me convinced that Trane makes HVAC more complicated than it needs to be.
Raised my anxiety level about 20 points.
Yeah, he had me going too. To hell with the way it was wired, I wire it my way. He knows his stuff.
Nothin beats single speed. I dont care what you try to convince me, the less parts the better IMO
less parts to fail makes sense
They do have schematics . Have a great day.
Wiring diagrams are usually on the inside of the cover he took off.
I have a similar layout in my Trane XL1800, 1999 model year 2.5 / 5 ton unit. In my case the breaker was tripping when the 5 ton tried to start. Turned out to be the Hard Start Cap was bad. Note: From looking at the diagrams, the hard start appears to be used for both the smaller and larger compressors and a single run cap is also used for both compressors. Only one compressor runs at a time. The fan has it's own cap and I believe it's either a variable speed or maybe a 2 or 3 speed fan. I don't recall off the top of my head. If you need a wiring diagram for one of these, I have one that you can use to verify your wiring. You might even find one in an envelope somewhere inside the unit behind one of the panels. Also, be sure to test both the Small compressor and then the Large compressor to make sure they are both starting and running independently of each other. The small compressor should run when the thermostat demand is 1 to 2 degrees demand from room temp. I think 3+ degrees demand from the thermostat will force the smaller compressor to shut dow, then pause for a minute, then the large compressor starts and runs until the room cools back to within 2 degrees of the thermostat set point. It will run until the thermostat is satisified OR if its still hot and getting hotter in the home, the thermostat will sense that we're losing ground as the delta rises in the house and it will trigger the larger compressor to kick in after stopping the smaller one. These units work pretty well and I'm going on my 26th summer with mine. Knock on wood!! LOL I believe the hard start kit is used to start each of the compressors, not just the larger one. Only ONE compressor should ever run at a time. I think you kind of started to get youself confused when you began swapping out the relay. Unless someone else was in there an messed up the wiring before you got there, there was really no reason to mess with any of the wiring on the contactors, etc. I know it looks like a rats nest and can be very confusing because they use two triple pole, double throw relays, so it takes a bit to get your head around exactly what is happening when. LOL Anyway, if you have not verified both the low speed/ small compressor and then the high speed / larger compressor independently, you may want to go back and do that just to be sure that both compressors will start when the temp demands cause them to trigger for more or less capacity. If you need a wiring diagram, just respont here with your email address and I'll be happy to send it to you. From what I have found the mechanics of how they are wiring these are all pretty similar regardless of the size. As long as you have 2 compressors that run independent of each other, the diagram should work. Thanks for sharing!!
Same design as they had on the American Standard 2T/4T HP.
If you don't use the factory potential relay, you'll be going back. They are different ones too. You have to get the one for that particular compressor. Been there done that
That is correct sir. Been there done that myself.
I hope he takes your advice
What is different about it?
Yeah same here is it because of the tonnage?
Yes the Trane recips in general did not like aftermarket after a year or two. I think it has something to do with the back EMF or the potential relays not being sized right
This is where a HA1 would come in handy to analyze the compressor to verify compressor will start before messing with the hard start kit
I was waiting for the hard start to PoP ! When it’s wired the wrong way and relay doesn’t dis engage it Pops like a shotgun
😂
Bless your heart! I have only had one Trane in an apartment I lived in was a 2 ton box and that thing would run until the cows came home so long as it was clean and a full charge!
I am sure this is something you know and have come across. When it comes to train units, always go back to the OEM start kits. The generic ones work intermittently at best on train units I believe it is the relay and how they are wired differently. Unless they did not have a start kit to begin with. I think you would be fine just replacing the start cap and keeping the old relay unless the relay is bad but that is why I always change both. But for a temp fix to test if it will work, just replacing the bad cap should get you going until you can get the OEM kit in. I have seen the relay stick closed and cause issues so that is something you have to check after replacing the start cap. Usually causes very high amps while running if the relay sticks closed and of course the compressor overheats. But if you have a call back for this one that is where I would start. Hopefully it wont be an issue.
You can’t stop a Goodman .
Except for snakes
My American Standard 2 stage HP had a 4 Ton compressor and a 2 Ton compressor. reciprocating type. Rated a 16 and 14 SEER.
The package for the hard start kit has directions on. Order a Copeland electrical handbook.
Release the magic smoke; nice chattering relay.
Almost
Great job Curtis a real head scratcher glad you got it figured out to get the costumer some cool air thanks for the video
I did apartment maintenance and got certified and trained on the AC Work as well. My boss would send me out to some smaller independent apartment complexes to do the heat and air and AC work on them at times. One unit I ran across had heat strips. Who ever had been in there working on on it in the past, whether the same guy or different guys, had totally screwed the wiring up in there. From things being miswired to having multiple relays and sequencers that weren't needed, and I couldn't understand what they were doing, although I think that's the problem is that they didn't know what they were doing. I ended up yanking everything out of there, even the heat
strips because they were burnt. So I put in new heat strips new relay, new sequencers and redid all the wiring from scratch and it worked fine. They actually had different guages of wire feeding the power to the heat strips spliced together, what a mess.
You can not use 2 wire start kit to directly replace a 3 wire start kit. If the start kit is bad you should of just removed the 3 wire set up and put the 2 wire directly to the run capacitor. All that wire switches got you confused.
I had to try for myself. Knew when I started it might not work. But, had to try it at least once.
Next time: RTFM on the start kit. The time you lost messing about was not worth it. 🤔
I had to try.
My 19 year old two stage Heat Pump outdoor unit gave out at age 19.- 9 years ago. A/H is still ticking!
Can you give us a recap as to why the replacement hard start didn't work without the rewiring? Thanks for the video.
5-2-1
CAN-SHE-RUN
COMMON-START-RUN
Hi Curtis! Glad to see that you kept at it till you got the job done. Not an HVAC tech (just auto tech and have to face many problems too.
Most people would just buy new one but this guy is master tech
On capacitors the run becomes your common…NOT the unit common
Correct, that can become confusing to those that don’t know though.
The sticker said R12 below the motor info
Yeah I saw that wtf
Nice job Curtis, that was a clean A/C unit for 20 yrs old 👍 Au
Only 5 min into the video, I checked one of these this morning 35 cap on low stage. 10 on high stage. 270-350 mfd start cap was out on it. Replaced it and it ran like a Trane 😎
That one hurt my brain
Curtis please explain this scenario
Check amperage on the hard start kit to make sure it's out of the circuit after it starts.
Bom serviço de repara em ac central parabéns do Brasil.🔨🏠🇧🇷🛠️❄️
Thanks. Saludos de United States - Georgia
5 - common - 2 - start (Start on run cap) 1 - run through the start cap to run on run capacitor. Interesting you had to do rewiring. Oh well I'd say back out this year....time for a new unit. Away from 2 speed or 2 compressor residential.
Man you lost me somewhere, I had to watch it again and I think I got it. How was it running before? The main thing is that it is running now and the customer is happy. So both compressors run depending on the relay that is controlled by the board, so it knows which contactor or both to be pulled in. The hard start cap works on both compressors. I need to shut up before I confuse myself again. A 20 year old Trane, that is one of the good ones. I always thought 2 compressors just meant double trouble. Nice job!
Start and big run cap are used by both, the 5 mfd up top is only used when high is on. It’s added to the other start.
@@HVACGUY Got it thanks
Love your videos! My XL20i from 2010 just grenaded itself last week. Lo stage compressor shorted to ground. I was hoping to get a few more years out of it but I did run it hard down here in hot and humid south Florida. These high end Tranes seem to get a lot of gruff from people but I have to say mine work near flawlessly for 14 years. I loved the two compressor setup and the variable speed blower with communicating thermostat. It could easily hold the house at 70 degrees on a 95+ degree day. The only parts it ever needed was one capacitor, and one contactor. I kept it clean though. I replaced it with the new two stage XR16 (used to be the XR17) and TEM6 air handler, but I think I maybe should have gone with the XV20i to replicate or improve on the performance of the XL20i. So far the XR16 doesn't seem to be able to keep the humidity down as well as the XL20i did. The installer needs to comeback and run an extra wire for the two stage functionality. Right now it's running on 2nd stage (high) or not at all. Once it's capable of using both stages, I'm hoping it will be able to get close to how well the XL20i ran. Sorry for the rant but I geek out on HVAC sometimes. Keep up the great work and videos!
Not at all sir..... would the lower stage compressor do better for dehumidifing the home?
@@MichaelSmith4501-jd8pu I think the lower stage will cause the system to run longer, therefore give it more time to dehumidify the air. I experienced that effect with my XL201 which ran on the low stage most of the time.
That 20 year old trane looks better than my 2 year old Goodman lol
I've only on a couple of those. They're confusing.
Sweat, purge, and roll. Got paid!
20 mins in I would have just pulled all the spaghetti out and started from scratch
U said not long ago bro it’s been 20yrs 😭
I SMELL CALL BACK
Maybe R12 represents room 12 since there are two units.
👍👍👍
I love those early high efficiency tranes. They were a challenge at first but now they’re a breeze. Too bad they are going extinct
5 2 1 common, start, run !!!
I’m not going after this guy jobs
One wire goes to herm and the other goes to common. I'm not sure what you did. A 521 has herm, common, and T2. I just realized that the dual run capacitor is powered by only 120v.
Can we just go to the parts house.
can anyone tell me how the board is still flashing after he pulled the power, I have never seen that unless it is being fed from the air handler
low voltage
The low voltage that runs the board comes from the air handler.
If you pulled the power lug, why was the lights on the circuit board still on?
Low voltage comes from the air handler
Do you need to snip the bleed resistor to get an accurate reading on the start cap? If so will it still work with it snipped? Great video
No, you don’t. But, once snipped it’ll still work fine, you’ll just need to discharge it like other capacitors before touching
@@HVACGUY thanks. I was never sure about that.
Gm bro
What about the next man coming behind you .
Hey Curtis, which camera do you use?
Great video, bro! I love your content, emenslie! Keep'em coming. You are the true HVACGUY! I'm trying to find a service guy like of your caliber down here in LA!
(Lower Alabama) brother!
Thanks
I forgot Trane used to put 2 compressors in some of their residential units 😂
Heavy bastards they are!!
R-12 was also printed on the lower portion of the label . . . wonder what that's about?
My HP used R22.-
Back in the day, like 40 years ago or more they did use r12. I remember them saying that they were changing to r22 because it was better for the environment. Sound familiar?
@@jthonn Definitely better for Dupont and other refrigerant makers who keep coming up with more products besides more HVACR products and test equipment. LOL
Compressor sounds like it has rocks in it
It does
I checked them also with the resistor in place…makes no difference for testing purposes
Wow, looks like we are missing about 300+ comments on this video...compared to yesterday... only 68 now?
5-2-1 can she run
😂
No entendí nada
Sometimes the wire schematic will show you how to wire in a start cap & relay. If the wire schematic is available & readable, just go by the wire schematic.
Just bypass the capacitors and say all is good.