No Crank, new starter, how to troubleshoot, any car! (2011 Ford Taurus)
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- Опубликовано: 10 ноя 2024
- As with my other no crank videos, the starting system tests shown in this video can be applied to any car! Knowing how to do voltage drop testing is the key.
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For more information on this topic, I have written a “field manual” called Engine Performance Diagnostics which is available at www.scannerdanner.com as an eBook or paper book.
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On ScannerDanner Premium I will bring you right into my classroom at Rosedale Technical College. You will find page for page lectures taken right from my book as well as exclusive classroom type case studies. What is so special about these classroom case studies? I pull live problem vehicles directly into my classroom and we troubleshoot them in real time, using and applying the theory and testing procedures we learn during the classroom lectures. There is no better on-line training of how to troubleshoot automotive electrical and electronics systems anywhere!
Disclaimer:
Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. ScannerDanner LLC assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. ScannerDanner LLC recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not ScannerDanner LLC.
I graduated from Scotty Kilmer, to Chris fix, to Eric the car guy, and now with Scanner. Man, this guy is hardcore!
welcome and thank you! glad you found your way here.
Indeed!
Scottie kilmer is.more hilarious and showy, and Toyota again and again
I agree with you Scanner danner is the best
7777uyyhbyyhby6ynbhhy
I worked on many intermittents in electronic equipment but the process is similar. And as you say if it aint broke it is hard to fix. So, one day i was looking up reviews for a local auto repair shop that I thought I might use. There was a negative review by a customer that said they took their car to this shop who had it for a day or so and told the customer the problem was intermittent and they couldn't make it malfunction so they gave him back his car with no charge. So they couldn't fix his problem but they didn't charge him either. Having worked on intermittents I understood the problem, and I said that is an honest shop, and started using that shop. I haven't been disappointed.
This guys knows his stuff and know how to explain in detail the work he’s doing. I just recently the engine swap to 2004 Scion XB, engine turn one on the 1st try. Unfortunately the engine I purchased came with a bad cylinders head gasket and I had to tear-it-down once to replace the head gasket. Engine was installed for the 2nd time, the engine cranks but it won’t starts. This video has giving excellent guidance where I need to troubleshoot the electrical issue . Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Great video Voltage drop testing is a powerful skill, learn how to it and it will save you a hours of time and money wasted on parts. Nothing but the best on SD Premium
I agree
Outstanding video Paul. It was a great example of the importance for a "loaded circuit" voltage drop. The visual inspection was also a huge clue as to direction. Always a pleasure to learn from your videos.
I have the most respect for the way you’re explaining your craft. Very honest and a great educator and I wish I went to your school to learn. God bless my brother and thank you.
Thanks so much!
HALLELUJAH!!! You have helped me find the problem on my 95 Roadmaster! It's been driving me crazy, but now we're gonna be OK!!! Thank you Scanner Danner!!!
Great job! I was always taught "test it where it lives, make it work hard" goes to show how important loading circuits and voltage drops are.
Absolutely!
Great video! A hidden lesson in this is getting all the information you can from the customer before starting, it can save you a lot of time diagnosing the real cause of the complaint.
Man isn't that the truth! I almost didn't post this because of my own misdirection
@@ScannerDanner You need to have Pete use a cheat sheet.
A go or no go style chart.
In case he isn't there when you start your work.
Saves you time and makes you more money. :)
@ScannerDanner please continue to post the good the bad or different direction lol its not a mistake its a lesson.
After finishing the video, c it is much more simple. The Escape 3.0 was crazy. I told the guy to expect the worse. It would not crank though. Yours started and there was no noise from bad AC bearing. That serpentine belt will hold the engine back. And the wrap around the AC pulley is such that it won’t slip. Cool voltage drop tests. All the Premium videos r so helpful on learning the Vantage. The Vantage Pro and the Verus
Great lesson for voltage drop testing Paul. Yes that connector does look like an electrical part for wiring in a house, I am sure you can find that in Lowes or Home Depot. Thanks for the video!
Happy New Year
Basics. Always go back to the basics. I had a no start on my wife's van and found out I had power going to the starter and ordered a starter but when I went to put the starter in found the other side of the circuit was loose. Actually was lucky and saw the ground wire bolt going into the trans was not tight. Tightened up the ground wire and it starts imagine that.
So yeah test both sides of the circuit. Another great vid PD.
I've watched many of ScannerDanner videos this guy is a genius 👍
good as always. i was taught a little differently. i see you check voltage across the battery as a baseline then at the terminal etc and subtract the voltage to get your drop. which is fine. i was taught to put the meter in parallel with the circuit under test. the meter with the unloaded circuit may have a reading but dont worry about it. the high input impedence of the meter wont activate most automotive circuits. then load the circuit with its normal load and while the circuit is loaded you read the direct drop reading on the meter. the theory is what shows on the meter is the amount that cant make it through the conductor. thus the drop. this also accounts for small variations the battery drops as it is loaded. served me well for the last 40 years. also easier when you are doing say the starter stud to the ring terminal as both leads are right there together. both ways work and do what they should as i have done it both ways on everything from cars to nuclear densitometers.
Ya I was wondering about those connections as well. From where he hooked up I believe you would be seeing the voltage drop of the starter itself. Hence the math you were talking about. Normally you would hook up from the battery positive post to the starter stud. This measures the voltage drop in between. That extra resistance is like a series circuit with two bulbs. If the bulbs are the same resistance you would see 6 volts dropped across each bulb totaling 12 volts. Voltage drop of the cable should ideally be 0 but you will loose a little should be less then a volt. In school I think .5v what acceptable. I've seen a cable drop a few volts before....3 or 5 volts I forget. Car only started while boosting because it needed that extra "pressure" to start the engine.
But theirs more then one way to skin a cat so after writing this I think I understand the method he was using.
Love these videos Danner!
I realize probably most of this video was done for instructional purposes, but my numero uno rule for diag, is "follow the sh*t stains". That melty battery cable is where I would have immediately started at. I love your videos, and have definitely subscribed. Keep it up. I'll probably head over and get on the premium content as well.
Holy Cow, that battery cable splice "repair" brought back memories! 30 something years back, my first car was a hand-me-down POS '77 Subarooo sedan. The positive cable clamp and the first inch of cable had disintegrated thanks to a severe case of the Western NY green crusties. My local Allegheny NY K-mart carried those cable splice things, the dealer was too expensive for a real cable, and I was a broke kid. :D I put the splice in place and soldered the daylights out of the connections. It was definitely a hack job, but it held for a couple of years until the car rusted apart and had to be junked. I got lucky with the splice repair, probably thanks to the solder job and because early Subarooo engines weren't much more than lawnmower engines. I still have an extra cable splice kit hanging on the wall of my garage. I don't plan to use it. LOL BTW, I enjoyed your video and have subscribed. Thanks!
I not a mechanic dumb dump as far as auto electric but i pronounce the problem as an ignition switch which has been a common problem in ford cars for 60 years at least in ford cars and vans 15 years or older. My boss at a junk yard told me that tip me off to that fact back in the 1990s
Great video Mr Danner as always the effort you take to set up camera angles and video editing is brilliant and the best on RUclips. I've bought you book and watched your video's and increased my electrical knowledge dramatically as a apprentice tech. Happy new year, all the best. Harry
U.K
Thanks so much Harry!
Great video Paul. Only ScannerDanner could make a 30 minute video on a bad battery cable!
Love it. I'd guess the Bendix may have been stuck on that starter out of the box and once it went through one cycle it decided to unstick.
Not sure to be honest. Sounds like the most likely scenario though, thanks!
FrugalPrepper
I'm assuming your refering to the Starter solenoid when you say "Bendix".....Bendix is a corporation not a part of the starter.
zeke112964 the bendix is the drive gear and return spring subcomponent for the starter that gets thrown outwards to engage the flywheel.
I worked in parts retail in conjunction with a shop. Tons of these Chinese rebuilds have this stuck on/first time problem. We used to deal with a local multigeneration rebuilder who was in business since the 1920's. He laid off most of his work force because of the influx of Chinese parts. He now only does custom/industrial repair. His looming problem is sourcing decent field coils for starters. I have tons of Internationals that use MT-10 Delcos and half of them Chinese starters out of the box fail a megger test on the coils. He said he could get me some coils if I would go halfers on a SeaLand van from China... But then again, we're back to the same problem.
@@zeke112964, the "bendix" is the starter drive that kicks out into the ring gear. Yes there is a company named "Bendix" but entirely different.
This is great knowledge here. I have 2001 honda accord dx with no park light, dash lights, interior lights and radio don't work. Replaced all fuses and nothing works. Blinkers and head lights works perfect
I watched one of your videos yesterday. Very easy to understand instructions. I was also able to follow the details of each part of the no crank situation. Thank you, this is help me a great deal, I will be following more of your instructional help videos.
Thank you and welcome to the channel!
Happy New Year to you too.
I hate intermittent problems.
Awesome video, Brother these case studies should get you your own tv show!
really becoming a fan of yours SD! your videos will help me alot to maintain my car in a better condition i got it after i bought it :-)
Probably the best carmech/diagnoser I've ever seen on youtube! *big thumbs up*
Thank you Gwen!
Hi Paul, I've never seen a repair like that before, never even seen anything like that joint before, we on the other side of the pond, call that a numpty joint, because you would have to be a right numpty to fix something like that, lol, I enjoyed the video but I always start at the output side of the starter solenoid for my first voltage drop test and work back, but your the man Paul, and I wouldn't dream of trying to showing you how to suck eggs, Basically its your fault I bought a scope, keep up the good work, Cheers
The customer fired the parts cannon ! LOL ! They're going to hate themselves when they find out the pro's made the right call and could have saved the the customer a starter if the old one may have still been good . Lesson learned , don't tell the mechanic their business ! A cheap code reader dosen't make you a tech no matter what the advertisement says . As always , great diagnose and repair ! Happy New Year !
Heh, this remainded me of one time that i used H4 pulp to test a wires to starter.
First was starter command wire. H4 was brith, on ignition on starting. Next was B+ that lithed that light birth as well and i was sure on that point, that it needed a new starter.
Then i turn my head and start LOLing ;D
The the birth H4 light showd me a box on the firewall. The damn B+ cabel had a bridge box in firewall and it was so full of green stuff that it did come out of that plastic box.
So the secend i hit the ignition to start, the H4 55w lamp whent out.
Well i did learn my lesson on that just "a load" dont do any good you allso need to know the correct load of the part (and for future, to know when some parts do use too much dosent hurt eather).
Cheers! and happy New Year to you too!
Happy new year, thank you for your video. That splice union looks like one that I use for underground cable repair. One of the the things to watch when installing is clean both wires and torque those screws as per specs or it will make a bad connection and increase resistance especially if it is an aluminum splice connector, they expand more than cooper, I usually avoid it like the plague and use a cooper fitting. That is one of reasons I like to use a crimp barrel and epoxy isolation. Also using the barrel makes you use the same diameter wire, the screw type gives you the wrong expectation that everything will be fine.... until you have that dreaded feeling looking at smoke coming out and knowing that you just have used the last can of smoke in your toolbox....Thank you Paul for the video.
Great job o...... We needed to be involved.
Good to see you Danner in the new year......... I loved being in your class at Rosedale tech
Happy new year Paul. You may recall answering some questions for me on SDP basic electrics only yesterday? This video release has come just at the relevant time for me, great to see how the circuit "must" be loaded to see a drop even on a cable that size, awesome! Thanks for sharing
Sweet! Thanks David. Keep it up man.
The crank when the starter was replaced was most likely the eyelet for the s terminal has a small tab that is bent in a 90 degree angle that indexes into the factory starter solenoid .on the aftermarket starters I've seen this tab touch the solder joint on the solenoid causing the crank I've seen that many times usually I'll cut it off have a great new year
Best explanation so far
Oh yeah, that's the adapter plug that usually corrodes on the end of the cable and not the stud on the starter that you can't get off without destroying the adapter. It also says on a big sticker on the starter that the warranty is void if you do not use the new adapter...I have 3 in my toolbox for Ford starters...
you are the best automotive technician
You Sir, are an amazing teacher. N°1 on youtube. Happy new year.
Thank you!
Just started watching your channel last week love your content and man I'm hour away from Pittsburgh might take a class .
Welcome aboard!
Somewhere out there is a guy in a reflective jacket saying all you needed was a load pro 😂. Great video as always brother
Lol would you believe someone just sent me one of those as a gift. It was a nice gesture and obviously the guy didn't know anything about the owner calling me out. It was just ironic.
Thanks Keith! Happy New Year
tools help, but it seems lack of using brain and eyes was the main issue on that vehicle. lol
Keith DeFazio -- That's the best laugh I had all day! Thanks!
Happy New Year Paul!! Lovin all the videos..gonna join Premium shortly. Keep doing all that wonderful ‘magic’ you do. 👍👍 😊☺️ ✌️☮️🌻
Paul your brother has not posted any video's for quite some time now.
Is he alright?
Nice video but be carefull with the high amperage charging some modern batteries don't like that.
I'm sure you know but mayebe not all of your viewers🙈.
Happy new year to you and your familie and of course to Pete and his family.
HEY SCANNER DANNER I ABSOLUTELY LOVE YOUR VIDEO MAN IV BEEN LOOKING FOR THIS INFORMATION EVERY ONE KEEPS ACTING LIKE THEY DONT KNOW WHERE IT IS IM LIKING SHARING AND SUBSCRIBING THANKS BUDDY REALLY HELPED ME TODAY BEST NEWS THANK YOU
Great job Paul. Your extra efforts never cease to impress me. Imagine how many starters would not have been replaced if everyone did voltage drop testing.
Happy New Year Brother
Joe Mikos you are right but the cardone guys have to make a living too
Marian Luc Ahh, you are right about that. Everybody has to eat. LOL
Excellent video. All parts were great. Wish to one day make videos like this
great to see you are a pens fan as well. Sid Crosby is from Cole Harbour Nova Scotia where I live. All the best Paul!
nice! Go Pens!!
That aluminum colored connector is a typical welding cable connector. They are fine..IF you wrap the stranded ends in thin copper, then insert and tighten. If you insert just the strands, they will invariably become loose, and give the symptoms as shown. The copper usually comes with the connector as a kit.
Great video!! You have an insane amount of knowledge and insight when it comes to anything automotive. I came across this video while to research for my boyfriend, what was causing his 99' ranger xlt 4.0 4x4 truck not to crank or start. He replaced the starter and now everytime he tries to start The truck, it blows the 50Amp ignition fuse in the box under the hood. You can turn the KOEO and the fuse stays intact, dash lights radio everything has power like normal, but as soon as you put it in the crank position it pops. I have no experience with Ford, (I own a VW which is another electrical nightmare of its own.) I was hoping you may have some insight on this. He switched the relay for the starter and the heater blower motor (which are identical)and the same thing happened. Those 50Amp fuses aren't cheap and I think he has already bought all of them that the whole TWO parts stores in our little bitty town had in stock. Any advice you could give me to point me in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. I'm about to go crazy bc he's in such a bad mood bc he can't figure it out and get it fixed. He has already missed there days of work waiting on the starter to come and now this. Also I hooked my obd2 scanner to the truck it has no codes permanent or pending, but I did notice that the intake air temp was -40° while viewing the limited live data function(of course the engine wasn't running bc it wont start). Im not sure if The IAT is relavent to the problem, just trying to provide all the info that I can. The engine coolant temp was at 60°. I thank you in advance for any assistance you may be able to provide.
Second time I've read this and wanted to answer but I can't without a diagram. If I run across this comment again when I'm on my PC I can help you further
@@ScannerDanner
We figured it out. Took the S line off the starter and then tried to start it and it didn't blow the fuse so that made me lean towards it being a bad starter. Never assume just bc parts are new that they are good. We took it back to AutoZone and they replaced it no hassle at all. Thank you for replying and letting me know you did see the comment. Most people wouldn't have taken the time to do that.
Happy new year paul ... Nice to see the Pro learn something about his verus after all this time :)
Have you tried the Pico Scope battery test? It can help to explain a lot of low voltage and loss of communication codes.
A sort but sweet case study to start the new year with! Thanks!
Happy new year Top Cat. Were back in class as soon as the school bell rings.
Would this issue cause a main 120 amp fusible link to blow on the positive battery terminal? Or just lose the connection? I really want to get a good look at the cables on mine but all the dang cables from every which way are bundled together and then those huge bundles are wrapped together in that split loom stuff. It looks so nice, I don't wanna ruin it haha
Nice seeing you SD
Happy new year.
Great video
Happy new Paul
Love those voltage drop tests.
Thank you from New Zealand. Great video presentation.
Nicely done and Happy New Year!
thanks for sharing these videos! I learn a lot from them. regards!
Going to be touring the college on the 13th, can't wait!
Awesome! Stop in and say hello and mention this post.
yes hes back in 2018! love to see you again.
I laughed my heart out when the car started during the voltage drop test 😂
Loaded Circuit...
Loaded Circuit...
Loaded Circuit...
Loaded Wallet!!
😎👊🏼💵💰💴💸
Once again, thanks! Excellent run down. Great video!
Good job Paul. Thank you. Bless You brother. Happy New Year
Very KNOWLEDGEABLE
Thank you
Sir ScannerDanner
From Nick Ayivor from London England UK 🇬🇧
I have seen a low-voltage condition that caused the starter to stay engaged after a low-voltage hi-amperage cranking draw essentially welding the Contacts together at the solenoid temporarily. Then after hooking up a fully charged battery, with the Contacts still welded together and the starter still engaged, The starter cranks and continues to crank without any input from the ignition. So in a panic your main job was to stop the starter from staying engaged and cranking without ignition input. I unhook the cable, Then hooking it back up and the starter disengaged and the problem went away. This may have happened to you!
Definite cable fault. Nice diagnostic job.
First New Year resolution. Become a premium member. Checked ✔.
Great video. I have a 2010 mustang with an aftermarket remote starter, and anytime I disconnect the battery, upon reconnection the car immediately starts cranking. I wonder if that car has a remote starter.
HA! That looks like a 120v AC lug connector for line to house wiring on the battery cable there. Wouldn't be shocked if you find some wire nuts making connections in that vehicle too. :D
We got over a foot of snow - drifts over 3 feet, and still coming down here in western central MA. I'll start the cleanup chores tomorrow i guess.
Great video - another perfect demo on the importance of voltage drop testing. HAPPY NEW YEAR brother!
No doubt that it is, I have plenty lol
Thanks so much Scanner Danner!
Wow...I always call u Paul the great
Thank you so much sir for the great info
You just introduced something new to me in the whole mix..
“Computer controlled starting system”
How to deal with that system ?
And how to disable it ??
for example if I wanted to do a single cylinder compression gauge test??
How to crank the engine manually ??
And happy new year Paul :)
Hi scanner danner
I enjoy your program very much and i find it very helpful. In one of your videos you explained the differences between cranking and starting. The video that you showed us was about no-cranking where you located the problem which was a corroded unit.
You made it easier by making a sound with your mouth which indicated a no-starting issue.
My question is this. Is the process that you did on no-cranking the same as the no-starting to locate the problem.
Thank you for a lovely program and keep up the good work.
FJS
Love the diagnostics
Love the hat (canada makes the best beers)
The official beer of the Pittsburgh penguins :-)
Can we just say....
Someone Micky moused that battery connection setup 😮😮
Did he just say RAD hose lol? Just picking brother. Great video
That is a nice Cantu and if I was able to afford a scan tool I would do all kinds of jobs and fix maybe in kind of car like that with no scan tool I could fix almost any car
Super video, same problem with a Ford Fiesta i Copenhagen, batteri voltage is low, try a new batteri to morrov, PATS is ON. :)
uhh, multiple issues going on, not counting the previous herp-derps working on it :))
Hey Danner, might be time to pick up a Fluke 233 Meter. It has a really nice wireless display with a pretty decent refresh.
I use it all the time for parasitic testing and when I'm working by myself.
Derek Vermette I have one too. There nice
Bet it doesn't have a way to do screen recordings and overlay it in a video :-)
Not that model, but you could always throw it on the camera view, the display is easy to read :).
Keep up the awesome educational and entertaining videos.
Does the fluke 233 eat batteries in wireless mode? Was looking at one a few years ago but some reviews about battery life put me off. Wonder if they've sorted it now. Nice video as ever Paul.
Happy New Year
Happy new year master scanner danner
Hi . If you watch your clip at time stamp 8.50 + you'll see the module voltage when you turned the key didn't try to drop while cranking surgesting there was low amp flow to the starter as i'd suspect it to drop to 10.5-11.8v with cranking. Guess you missed that one.. It does however have a small drop in voltage but as you know this voltage would of took a nosedive -10v I suspect if the battery was weak as everything would of been pulled down. Good video ..(not judging call on new battery as you were using battery charge /boost pack . Bets are battery is on last legs too.. Just the voltage drop noted helping point towards low amp draw on battery while cranking at time stamp) .
going by diagrams, the alternator is spliced into the cable at or near the starter and before the bad splice, so the battery wouldn't charge right and it appears the wire feeding the whole vehicle/fuses is on other cable direct to battery still
excellent video man VD that's voltage drop
Happy new year man!
Amazing video Paul Happy New Year
Thank you! Happy New Year my friend
My husband said your his hero .he watches your videos everyday.personally,I think your weird because you scan things all day
lol nice. Tell him I said thank you
Smitty is 100% correct. That is a line lug used for the electric service entering your house.
Happy new danner
Good information on starter and battery issues. Do you think the splice with a new upper positive cable end was installed because of corrosion on the original positive cable end at the battery at the time the battery was replaced?? The splice might have worked if someone had tinned the ends of the cut cable real well with solder before installing it.
Bill
Another awesome video, your teaching prowess never ceases to amaze me. Thanks for all you do:)
Would it have been better to carry out a voltage drop test going across the positve battery terminal to the starter positve, to test the cable? if the wire made connection the way this video shows the voltage may show 12V unloaded and loaded.
Carrying a test Positive to Positve would show 0Volts unloaded and the voltage drop would be shown as a positve voltage when the circuit was loaded.
I had a 2003 Windstar that would do weird stuff when the battery was connected. It would usually just flash the headlamps and chirp the horn. But one time it had a dead battery and it when I installed the new one, the engine cranked on it's own for about 2 seconds. It didn't have any aftermarket alarm or remote start either.
That is super weird. Thanks for sharing
ready for this one hang on? possibly bad radio or rear amp/control unit or wire harness to rear bad and back feeding (forgot what year they had/didn't have the rear unit and maybe the wire still runs back there)
possibly the same on the 2011 taurus, the older taurus had it for sure. wire "hot on start" to the rear unit, if it gets corroded/shorted/fails or wiring issue, it could cause engine cranking by back-feeding power to the starter relay! odd case indeed, but seen it twice
I did notice at 17 minutes when it surprised you by cranking the voltage dropped to 10 volts...if it was a crank no start i know that on fords even if it cranks ok if the voltage drops to low it will not start. A good indication is if the dials do a sweep when you put the ignition on you know it has had a low voltage event...so then you have to explain to the customer that although its still cranking you need a new battery..
YOU ARE THE MAN
Would you look at that! I keep coming back for more videos. Im thinking about paying for scanner Danner premium!
Good vídeo bad installition
Cable mickey mouse happy new year sd
Great video. Thank you so much!
Danner is the man
Lol, I'm really not. I just love what I do :-)
what kind of place do we go when we have this problem with car? I'm having this problem with my car right now..
Happy New Year! !!
Great video SD. How about using a big (200A?) 12v dump load instead of keep on cranking?
crossing wires from the starter to the solenoid will give you the start problem?
I had a no crank recently, the starter control wire fuse kept blowing. Turns out the circuit board was shorting to ground inside the fusebox, and it was intermittent, which was weird. I thought the problem in this video was going to be the control wire shorting to the positive 12V, which would explain how it was cranking by itself, since this is how I'm starting my car until get my new fusebox.