Day 1: I am Rogal Dorn, Praetorian of Terra, Primarch of the seventh legion, Imperial Fists. Seventh found son. Defiant and Unyielding Day 109,704 I am....Rogal...Dorn...I think?
I honestly think it was genius the way they show off just how much Horus has lost it via how he thinks he’s gonna rebuild the mornivaul with Big E, Dorn, sangy, and Valdor. Not only is he insane to think that they would just turn around and join him,but the thought of “The Emperor being the avatar of Slenaash” is one that could only run through the mind of a madman. 😂
??? But he hasn't lost it tho (unless u mean the insane amount of god-tier arrogance, literally, lol). He TRICKED the Big E... the most powerful psyker in 30k, including FORESIGHT, by "losing it." But thats cap, he simply compartmentalized 90% of his power/intelligence over time by playing madness, by masking his warp power/tactical genius, obviously with the backing of the gods. Kinda like Alpharius or Corax, pulling back their presence, to the point the can walk right by an astartes. THATS whats so genius about the writing, imho.
The Emperor is the biggest perfectionist in the galaxy from the psychic projection he creates of himself (massive golden warrior) to his creation of the Custodes/primarchs. Where do you think the primarchs got their personality flaws from?
It would be kind of funny if Rogal Dorn was stuck in some forgotten stasis chamber on the Phalax. Poor guy got stuck teleporting back when he "died", and was basically forgotten in a broom closet for 10 000 years. 😂
He went to take a power nap for couple of centuries in stasis and ordered not to be disturbed. But because of the war of the beast all who knew of it and the records were lost. Unfortunately they put “no entry” sign in the door and nobody has even considered entering because the fists follow orders.
My working theory for Perty's ascension is that somehow the chaos gods helped him lose control of the obliterator virus and forced him to embrace warp powers to ensure his own survival. No way he would choose to ascend otherwise
If each of the primarchs get a piece of emperor gear, can they voltron combine into a big e robot? The blood angels are kind of khorne-y at first glance, but remember that sanguinius is constantly fawned over for his beauty, and the legion is also really into art and wine. There’s some slaanesh-y stuff in there.
One of the saddest moment of HH is when Sigismund tell Dorn 'I'm the Emperor's Champ now." Dorn, exhausted and melancholic after tirelessly leading the defense of Terra only to see that he's losing, feels bereft of one last thing he prided himself in, thinking 'I used to hold that title." Very human thing to feel in that moment imo. Right there with Loken starting to weep for Horus only when he's sure he's alone.
Of all the channels I watch. I think this one and the Sand man is the one if I had the choice to just chop it up for an hour or so, he would be the one that I would enjoy talking Lore endlessly with over coffee or drinks.
I have been doing baldurs gate playthroughs as best I can get lore accurate primarchs. My first was as Lorgar and he LOVED the absolute his charisma was off the charts and he'd charm and manipulate people. I've done zomebie raising fungal druid as mortarion scythe included. I'm going to save angron until last i think.
I dont see Peter-Turbo falling for it. If Dorn built it, i'm betting the Iron warriors would fire a single inert torpedo at it, inscribed with: "We arent that stupid."
You consistently have some of the most well researched and informative videos on the WH RUclips space. I think a lot of your theories are well thought out and you take a lot of different evidence together to form the most plausible conclusions which is refreshing. So many ppl let their own biases dominate the discussion that it either becomes comical or idiotic. It’s refreshing to see someone finally be honest that the Lion is obviously the best and that Erebus is a aids infested bish. Love the vids, i would love to see a video about any death watch plots or the Omega vault. Also how come there aren’t more “eyes of the emperor” stories ya think ?
YOUR KILLING IT SANDMAN, these videos have been banger after banger. As a person intimate with the lore I think you have some fantastic opinions about the universe.
as far as i'm concerned the iron cage is a happy feel-good story. it's rare that perturabo/the iron warriors really end up on top. iron within, iron without.
Yeah but it was something of a hollow victory. Dorn and many of the Imperial Fists survived. He won, but not completely. Perterabo had total victory in his grasp and let it slip away due to his emotional need to make Dorn suffer. The fact that he, the great logical thinker and Ironman who constantly berated his brothers for their lack of logic let it slip away due to his emotions probably burns him bad.
My theory is that Dorn knew the fists were too stubborn to accept the codex and that they were probably going to cause a civil war and basically destroy the imperium in the process. He uses the iron cage as a way to either wipe out the legion in an honourable(ish) last stand, or if they survive, as a way to "decimate" his legion and break their will, kind of like how perty does when he first takes over the iron warriors. I think doing something so fucked up to his own sons is what finally breaks him, and afterwards he basically drops all his marbles and spends all his time torturing himself and trying to get himself killed in glorious combat, kind of like a big ass black templar. Either that or the magic pain glove told him to do it.
I'm fairly convinced this was a final hoo rah to him. Without his legion the Imperium would have been doomed, but preserving it at the cost of a civil war will also doom the Imperium. Of all the traitor legions, the only one that got away relatively unscathed was that of Peter Turbo. And so in service to the Imperium, he attempts to destroy it at the cost of his. Rogal isn't a dummy.
While this is certainly a compelling story, I just can't imagine any imperial fists disobeying the will of their Primarch, much less going to war against him over this (or anything short of outright betrayl) also they still had The Last Wall protocol in place so that was sorta cheating the codex from the get-go.
You described Dorn and I do love him from The Heresy. And it sounded like you described Batman. There Clicked something: We all call Conny K. The Batman of the Bunch but as always: That’s not Totally the Truth. The Hyper-prepared and trusted by Gods aspekt of the Dark Knight, and then again the Stoic “We do it my way or you can take a hike” stuff… totally Batman as well… Really fun, how much archetype these characters are. Love it 🥰
52:00 i reailize i'm not watching live but i do love the idea of Rogl running around the golden throne in penance... perhaps in a stubby centurion armor... BRUVA ALFABUSA 5 EVER!!!1
What Dorn could get: I would love him to get a special Refractor field or something. An Armour that is not visible. Or: He shows up with Constantine Valdor. Not a Real Armour or Fortress but a loyal Brother - they earned each others respect. And the Death of his Fortress and finally his Legion - by his own hands… I would see him return as much as grown up as the Lion. And where Roboute had to Harden, he could soften up. And he would return and maybe he could find his inner Monk, his faith. And follow his Sons wisdom… trusting not in the Build, but the Brother. Trusting not in Arkana but in Faith. And where Roboute is the Logistician, and the Avenging son. And The Lion is the Hunter… The Praetorian could well become the one guarding the Starchild, wearing black armour instead of Gold. And be the Nullmaiden to Magnus’ Super Psyker. Just the line in the red sand he drew back then. Just the one to stubborn to die or give in or admit defeat. But now tempered, humbled and fortifying not walls, but the hearts of Men. The Sword, the Shield, the Faith. You know… Truth, Justice and the Imperial Way… ;)
I think that from all the plans Dorn draws up on the wall, he wrote out his own demise in the iron cage. Pert just came upon the plans Dorn wrote out and uses them against him.
Late to the video but in regards to a piece of armour/weaponry for Dawn, I was thinking it could be the eagle standard that adorns Big E's power pack. It could stand in place of the one Dorn already had and offer defensive buffs to Dorn and surrounding troops in game which ties in with his fortress building ability.
Man. I think your right on the money about JK returning next. GW has a guaranteed hit with a redone SW line so they’re not gonna do that quite yet. Then CC, they already dropped some with the scouts KT to test the water. Plus they also can battle Drukhari…
(Okay, I paused the video to write this before I lose the thought, so forgive me if something like this is discussed later in the video.) I know many people dislike Dorn's part in this book, and I understand their point-of-view. In a vacuum, his storyline feels inconsequential. But, I think it's truly BRILLIANT when you consider it in combination with what we know of his FATE. A.) There is a lot of evidence (IRL) that suggests long-term isolation (like solitary confinement in prisons) has an overwhelmingly negative & permanent effect on mental stability. Stated simply: isolation breaks people, and renders them susceptible to engaging in violent outbursts, diminishes reason, etc. B.) Dorn, after the Heresy, orders Guilliman to NOT ASSIST HIM on a dangerous mission (when going-after Pertie.) Then, Dorn willingly walks into a trap, a trap set-by Pertie, one of the most talented engineers in the galaxy. Brilliant. C.) Consequently, this long-term isolation in the desert neatly explains WHY Dorn goes "berserker mode" after the Heresy. Yes, Dorn is always shown to be brimming with anger, but he is also practical, rational, and caring about the lives of his sons.
The cloak of the emperor hides you from even the gods of chaos. Best way to give the cloak to corvis corax and can lead to him trying to assassinate one of the four chaos gods
Couldn't the Imperial Fists just have laid cyclonic exterminatus on Sebastius IV upon arriving in orbit uncontested? I am pretty new to the 40k setting, so my knowledge about the lore still has some weak points. I don't really understand the process of commiting Exterminatus, so If someone could help me out?
RE - Terminator Plate - So remember the Terminator Plate isn't made from any part of Big E's armour. The Crux Terminatus on the shoulder, however, is. That could be a single molecule, so there could be loads left or they could just retcon the CT to give a different benefit and make it rarer.
Are they EVER gonna tie up all the loose ends? Whatever happened to that rogue AI on mars that was fighting the traitors and chaos? What happened to the mechanicus adept who is the steward of the ctan shard? Has the chaos forces found her?
I always like to think that Omegon (Now back to his original name Alpharius, after the real Omegon died to Dorn) hunted Dorn after the Heresy ended, and cut his hand as a callback to how Dorn cuts off his twin's hands, having now the primarch somewhere as his prisoner. Of course, it won't be like that, but it would have been interesting.
32:19 isn't it that after that whole 'almost getting sacrificed for fulgrims ascension' incident, Perty started to slowly die? because then him becoming a daemon primarch is just a desperation for keep living
Doombreed and Nkari were stated as being on-board the Vengeful Spirit so maybe Dorn fights one of them. I think Doombreed is more likely since he's a daemon Prince of khorne and Dorn has just rejected khorne.
Dorns (current canon) actions during the Iron Cage Incident might not be in line with Dorn, but it sure is in line with *Khorne* - not leaving the battlefield, demanding honourable combat - they could easily stick close to the extisting lore whilst embellishing around the edges. I do like the idea of only his hand being left behind after being pulled through a portal, do we currently have any Primarchs taking direct action against Khorne? I dont know enough to make any grounded statements so im struggling to make the next mental step, as someone who is an adept at fortifying it seems unlikely that Dorn would take the fight to Khorne directly, especially as Khornes whole thing is fighting, but he could be building something around him, or a trap for him in some way.
Fists and Dorn himself likewise are masters of siege warfare in general, they just have a particular propensity towards defending. Fortification isn't his only shtick lol
Hey bro. I love your work! You think there is any chance to get SuperAnchors to voice Dorn in the future? His name is Admiral Burke, or Superanchors (now) and he is literally mine (and most 40k fans) head Canon dorn voice. He's the voice from TTS, and I'm sure he would do it...if asked. He said he never gets asked for appearances on remliez podcast. Please please let dorn shine, reading your amazing work and literally embodying Dorn
i do wonder if its not so much a case of Perturabo "Ascending" to daemonhood as much as he simply resembles his brother daemon princes in terms of raw power that he is mistaken as such? Last i remember, Perturabo was interred in a primarch sized dreadnaught from the wound dealt to him by Fulgrim. It would make sense for him to imbue warp power into a suit of armor to keep himself alive while he uses it as a mobile life support system/fuck everything in that direction button. He may even have a deal with Vashtorr to supply the technology or resources needed for such a suit. another cool idea would be for two primarchs to make their return together, one chaos and one loyal. For example, if perturabo is primarily dying from poison/chaos corruption then he'd have reason to seek out Nurgle and use the Eldar goddess he captured to heal himself, at the same time it could reintroduce the MIA Leman Russ, who is persumable searching for the same goddess to fix the emperor. it would sufficiently shake up the setting while also giving a win by Leman failing to free the goddess but Perturabo still being healed, and thus returning to combat. it also brings an interesting internal conflict as we know Fulgrim is on the top of the Peter Turbo shitlist
I think that Black Library authors need to flesh out more of the rivalry between Dorn and Perturabo. I don't think we've seen enough to warrant quite the level of enmity we're seeing, particularly from Perturabo, personally, towards Dorn. We know it was glory and praise for Dorn and ignominy for Perturabo; but what really went on *between* them as men to warrant the Iron Cage? Why is this quite so personal? I don't think we have the answer yet.
In the original lore rhogal dorne dies after boarding a chaos ship full of khorne demons and after lots of killing basically just got to to depressed gave in and let himself be killed..
47:00 the Fists are all about their gun lines and enfilading bolter salvos. I'd bet real cash monies that Dorn gets Daddy's bolter. That may be a bit underwhelming, but I feel it in my bones. Plus, old lore (so obviously prone to redaction) is every Crux Terminatus crest has a small sliver of the Emperors ruined plate, thus further bolstering the armors protection. I'd doubt there's too much of the armor left to hand out. Of course to me that begs the question of what Vulkan or the Khan get when they show up.
Plot armor: The Primarch. the "i fortify bases" primarch just happens to not be inside any of his fortifications, the entire thing he's good at. and beat the im 3 steps ahead of everyone else primarch in a fight inside his own ship surrounded by his own men. Makes zero sense
Also on the cancer comment. Most cancer is fatal to the host if not checked. Very rare is the cancer that leaves the body of the host and survives in infect other things. There is a case of this happening is dogs however
I haven't read the book, but the idea that all he has to do is say the words "blood for the blood god" will make him fall to chaos is ridiculous. being trapped in a desert wouldn't turn him into a bloodthirsty maniac, it wouldn't change his morals and ideals. to turn a guy like Dorn to chaos you'd need to convince him that it's the right thing to do somehow. no amount of torture would work.
Complete isolation breaks people IRL in hours, so Rogal lasting centuries in complete isolation is quite a feat. Only once Rogal was boken could Khorne begin to reshape him to eventually accept chaos as the only way to be released, but Rogal never broke.
Think of it like the final verbal component to a spell. He's been placed in a place that would break his psyche, that's step one. He's then in a place full of warp energy and has Khorne directly staring at him, that's step 2. If he says it he's doing Khorne's bidding, and so it's the final step to breaking his defenses. If cockblade got Fulgrim this works too, frankly.
" being trapped in a desert wouldn't turn him into a bloodthirsty maniac, it wouldn't change his morals and ideals" -Guy who does not understand how solitary confinement and white torture works
Rogal should have been a better brother to perturabo, I understand that perturabo was hard to like and all but beating him every time? That's how resentment between siblings develop.
I think that Dorn might get a powerfist? I'm not aware of the emperor having a powerfirst but we know GW isn't scared of bringing up new weapons that the emperor supposedly had.
I think Dorn's end was just bad writing. Such a well-written character throughout all the novels, to be disgraced with this authors decision to write him as a moron
If you think about it Dorn is a defense breaker so he would actually be deadly in melee combat given time he should be able to beat all his brothers, and he is a master of defense so he should also have that time during the fight just saying if written right Dorn is deadly, and I am a Vulcan fan saying this!!!$$$+++
Any primarch can beat any other primarch. They are at such a level that our comprehension of fighting cant fathom. There are three primarchs that were a cut above, and ferrus, horus and sanguinius are long dead.
ferrus?realy? wtf ferrus was the worst primarch (thanks to the writing tbh)...he good fooled by a minor xenos-human allianz, got beaten twice by fulgrim, he was an idiot and unlike angron he had no butchernails in his head.
It’s explained why he does the iron cage in the black templars codex from 4th/5th. He knew his sons would never accept to be broken down into chapters, so after using the pain glove he attacks the iron warriors. Then the surviving sons have no choice but to accept the codex
I'm currently going through the horus heresy, i haven't read these books yet, going through the read order, ATM in on garo and they just found locan. However going based off khorne wanting him.... would the red angel (not angron i mean the blood angel rage angel) make more sense, i may have forgotten or just not know but to my knowledge we don't know what happens to it after it shows up at horus after sangy told him to go.... until an inquisitior finds him in 40k
I also don't ever want them to make the lion younger again I think the age shows how he's gotten wiser not that he's slower or weaker angron learned that the hard way
No, he didn’t approve of Sigmanson’s (sp) Big E faith and essentially banished the zealots to he Eternal Crusade. Washed his hands and let the berserkers do their thing. Papa sooo proud but can’t admit it out of pride. What a adorn thing to do.🙏😎
I think Vulkan should get something from the Emperor that's more abstract. Because he can already craft powerful artefacts that may one day exceed the capacity of even his Father's mastery and knowledge, and moreover inheirted the Emperor's aveternal nature; his status as a true perpetual rather than simply being genecrafted to live a long time. In Captain Planet, there's a punch of different rings that represent elements and then there's one guy who's power is "heart." I think that's what Vulkan should get; he should get a revelation from the Numen; the Emperor's divine agape, that empowers him in some way that parralells the physical artefacts He left behind. It would fit his personality as the Salamander primarch.
![FNAF vs TF2 - Episode 2 [SFM]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/z5b3V2-VLb0/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for having me on brother! Means the world!
Thanks for voicing the Praetorian!
literally just heard your voice and was like ''is that actually....'' only to scroll down and see this comment. collabs for the win
Rogal Dorn lecturing the blood God on seige warfare and ethics feels like the most Rogal Dorn thing I've ever read.
So I tied a melta bomb to my belt, which was the style at the time....
Day 1:
I am Rogal Dorn, Praetorian of Terra, Primarch of the seventh legion, Imperial Fists. Seventh found son. Defiant and Unyielding
Day 109,704
I am....Rogal...Dorn...I think?
I honestly think it was genius the way they show off just how much Horus has lost it via how he thinks he’s gonna rebuild the mornivaul with Big E, Dorn, sangy, and Valdor. Not only is he insane to think that they would just turn around and join him,but the thought of “The Emperor being the avatar of Slenaash” is one that could only run through the mind of a madman. 😂
Woah woah woah! Check your privileges please! Big E is entitled to love space poppers and dark age of technology dildos if he so chooses!
Well in his mind was get a vacation for life and finally enjoy yourself for yourself and stop being a creature who live only for mankind.
??? But he hasn't lost it tho (unless u mean the insane amount of god-tier arrogance, literally, lol). He TRICKED the Big E... the most powerful psyker in 30k, including FORESIGHT, by "losing it." But thats cap, he simply compartmentalized 90% of his power/intelligence over time by playing madness, by masking his warp power/tactical genius, obviously with the backing of the gods. Kinda like Alpharius or Corax, pulling back their presence, to the point the can walk right by an astartes. THATS whats so genius about the writing, imho.
The Emperor is the biggest perfectionist in the galaxy from the psychic projection he creates of himself (massive golden warrior) to his creation of the Custodes/primarchs.
Where do you think the primarchs got their personality flaws from?
"And then daddy will marry the hot lady I saw across the Warp. And then me, daddy, Dornie, Sangie, and uncle Valdie will have fun together forever..."
Dorn has built a fort that is so good, even he cannot get out. The front door has two keys that need to be turned at the same time.
Inb4 the 2 key part was added in by Alpharius and Omegon. 😨
@@Humster that would be peak Alphie. I actually want this to be true, otherwise he died like a fool.
It would be kind of funny if Rogal Dorn was stuck in some forgotten stasis chamber on the Phalax. Poor guy got stuck teleporting back when he "died", and was basically forgotten in a broom closet for 10 000 years. 😂
That’d be utterly terrible and I’m all for it
He went to take a power nap for couple of centuries in stasis and ordered not to be disturbed. But because of the war of the beast all who knew of it and the records were lost. Unfortunately they put “no entry” sign in the door and nobody has even considered entering because the fists follow orders.
"I was dead. IN PRETEND"
😮 10:17 12:41
My working theory for Perty's ascension is that somehow the chaos gods helped him lose control of the obliterator virus and forced him to embrace warp powers to ensure his own survival. No way he would choose to ascend otherwise
Khorne: Blood for the who?
Skulls for the what?
Dorn: MILK FOR THE KHORNE FLAKES!!!!
Kind of neat that Rogal's fists get bloody when he punches down the wall. It's almost as if he gets 'Crimson Fists'
The end of the Imperial dream broke Rogal Dorn more than anything else.
"Nothing but net." really enjoyed this phraseology about Dorn in the heresy
If each of the primarchs get a piece of emperor gear, can they voltron combine into a big e robot?
The blood angels are kind of khorne-y at first glance, but remember that sanguinius is constantly fawned over for his beauty, and the legion is also really into art and wine. There’s some slaanesh-y stuff in there.
One of the saddest moment of HH is when Sigismund tell Dorn 'I'm the Emperor's Champ now." Dorn, exhausted and melancholic after tirelessly leading the defense of Terra only to see that he's losing, feels bereft of one last thing he prided himself in, thinking 'I used to hold that title." Very human thing to feel in that moment imo. Right there with Loken starting to weep for Horus only when he's sure he's alone.
Of all the channels I watch. I think this one and the Sand man is the one if I had the choice to just chop it up for an hour or so, he would be the one that I would enjoy talking Lore endlessly with over coffee or drinks.
Haha! If there's one thing I love to do, it's talk Warhammer lore!
I have been doing baldurs gate playthroughs as best I can get lore accurate primarchs. My first was as Lorgar and he LOVED the absolute his charisma was off the charts and he'd charm and manipulate people. I've done zomebie raising fungal druid as mortarion scythe included. I'm going to save angron until last i think.
I'd love to see an angry bitter Dorn making his own version of the iron cage as a grudge match against Perturabo
I dont see Peter-Turbo falling for it.
If Dorn built it, i'm betting the Iron warriors would fire a single inert torpedo at it, inscribed with:
"We arent that stupid."
I'm not convinced he intended to make it out alive.
He was never smart enough nor Perturabo dumb enough.
You consistently have some of the most well researched and informative videos on the WH RUclips space. I think a lot of your theories are well thought out and you take a lot of different evidence together to form the most plausible conclusions which is refreshing. So many ppl let their own biases dominate the discussion that it either becomes comical or idiotic. It’s refreshing to see someone finally be honest that the Lion is obviously the best and that Erebus is a aids infested bish. Love the vids, i would love to see a video about any death watch plots or the Omega vault. Also how come there aren’t more “eyes of the emperor” stories ya think ?
Rogal Dorn is actually Polish. He changed his name from Rógał Dornowiecki.
Would explain why he and his sons are unable to smile
Khorne wants Dorn because he's a rapper at heart😂
YOUR KILLING IT SANDMAN, these videos have been banger after banger. As a person intimate with the lore I think you have some fantastic opinions about the universe.
Thanks man! Means the world to get that kind of comment
🔥🎸🔥
I love Rogal Dorn. My home-brew chapter is an Imperial Fist successor chapter because of that character.
How is a home brew chapter an Imperial fist. Imperial Fists are an official chapter, not a home brew. Do you mean they are IF gene seed?
@@nickr0425 Does it make sense now jackass?
@@nickr0425 A successor chapter of the Imperial Fists legion.
Dorn is proof that autism is the best weapon against chaos.
I felt pretty stupid when I realized why this video was streamed on Thanksgiving 😂 thanks for the lore
as far as i'm concerned the iron cage is a happy feel-good story. it's rare that perturabo/the iron warriors really end up on top. iron within, iron without.
That's what it was written as originally wasn't it? Iron Warrior lore where they legit win
They won a bunch of important battles during the Heresy
Yeah but it was something of a hollow victory. Dorn and many of the Imperial Fists survived. He won, but not completely. Perterabo had total victory in his grasp and let it slip away due to his emotional need to make Dorn suffer. The fact that he, the great logical thinker and Ironman who constantly berated his brothers for their lack of logic let it slip away due to his emotions probably burns him bad.
Perty going Demon Prince makes sense, if you consider that Fulgrim stabbed him with THAT sodding blade. It's a means of survival.
Red: Who's the blood for?
Dorn: shall I repeat my Ethics of war PowerPoint?
When Dorn comes back, he's going to get the emperor's socks as his bit of daddy's gear. Heard it here first!
Hopefully a tissue
My theory is that Dorn knew the fists were too stubborn to accept the codex and that they were probably going to cause a civil war and basically destroy the imperium in the process.
He uses the iron cage as a way to either wipe out the legion in an honourable(ish) last stand, or if they survive, as a way to "decimate" his legion and break their will, kind of like how perty does when he first takes over the iron warriors.
I think doing something so fucked up to his own sons is what finally breaks him, and afterwards he basically drops all his marbles and spends all his time torturing himself and trying to get himself killed in glorious combat, kind of like a big ass black templar.
Either that or the magic pain glove told him to do it.
I'm fairly convinced this was a final hoo rah to him. Without his legion the Imperium would have been doomed, but preserving it at the cost of a civil war will also doom the Imperium. Of all the traitor legions, the only one that got away relatively unscathed was that of Peter Turbo. And so in service to the Imperium, he attempts to destroy it at the cost of his. Rogal isn't a dummy.
While this is certainly a compelling story, I just can't imagine any imperial fists disobeying the will of their Primarch, much less going to war against him over this (or anything short of outright betrayl) also they still had The Last Wall protocol in place so that was sorta cheating the codex from the get-go.
"You're just an idiot standing on the wall" is my favorite line in the entire heresy
You described Dorn and I do love him from The Heresy. And it sounded like you described Batman. There Clicked something: We all call Conny K. The Batman of the Bunch but as always: That’s not Totally the Truth. The Hyper-prepared and trusted by Gods aspekt of the Dark Knight, and then again the Stoic “We do it my way or you can take a hike” stuff… totally Batman as well…
Really fun, how much archetype these characters are. Love it 🥰
No, it's 'We do it the best way or you can take a hike. Which just happens to always be my way.' Big difference.
52:00 i reailize i'm not watching live but i do love the idea of Rogl running around the golden throne in penance... perhaps in a stubby centurion armor... BRUVA ALFABUSA 5 EVER!!!1
What Dorn could get: I would love him to get a special Refractor field or something. An Armour that is not visible.
Or: He shows up with Constantine Valdor. Not a Real Armour or Fortress but a loyal Brother - they earned each others respect. And the Death of his Fortress and finally his Legion - by his own hands… I would see him return as much as grown up as the Lion. And where Roboute had to Harden, he could soften up. And he would return and maybe he could find his inner Monk, his faith. And follow his Sons wisdom… trusting not in the Build, but the Brother. Trusting not in Arkana but in Faith. And where Roboute is the Logistician, and the Avenging son.
And The Lion is the Hunter…
The Praetorian could well become the one guarding the Starchild, wearing black armour instead of Gold. And be the Nullmaiden to Magnus’ Super Psyker.
Just the line in the red sand he drew back then.
Just the one to stubborn to die or give in or admit defeat.
But now tempered, humbled and fortifying not walls, but the hearts of Men.
The Sword, the Shield, the Faith.
You know… Truth, Justice and the Imperial Way… ;)
that,,,sounds pretty damn awesome!👏👍
Dorn is going to come back with an actual Imperial Fist.
I dont get why Perturabo is so disliked in the fandom imo hes the most interesting traitor primarch
"Just say it... Say it... Say who the blood is fo-..."
"CIRCA 300 M1...."
Dear Rogal
Go crazy, I'll always save you.
Roboute
Dorn gets The Emperor's Codpiece!
I think that from all the plans Dorn draws up on the wall, he wrote out his own demise in the iron cage. Pert just came upon the plans Dorn wrote out and uses them against him.
Late to the video but in regards to a piece of armour/weaponry for Dawn, I was thinking it could be the eagle standard that adorns Big E's power pack. It could stand in place of the one Dorn already had and offer defensive buffs to Dorn and surrounding troops in game which ties in with his fortress building ability.
Man. I think your right on the money about JK returning next. GW has a guaranteed hit with a redone SW line so they’re not gonna do that quite yet. Then CC, they already dropped some with the scouts KT to test the water. Plus they also can battle Drukhari…
(Okay, I paused the video to write this before I lose the thought, so forgive me if something like this is discussed later in the video.)
I know many people dislike Dorn's part in this book, and I understand their point-of-view. In a vacuum, his storyline feels inconsequential.
But, I think it's truly BRILLIANT when you consider it in combination with what we know of his FATE.
A.) There is a lot of evidence (IRL) that suggests long-term isolation (like solitary confinement in prisons) has an overwhelmingly negative & permanent effect on mental stability. Stated simply: isolation breaks people, and renders them susceptible to engaging in violent outbursts, diminishes reason, etc.
B.) Dorn, after the Heresy, orders Guilliman to NOT ASSIST HIM on a dangerous mission (when going-after Pertie.) Then, Dorn willingly walks into a trap, a trap set-by Pertie, one of the most talented engineers in the galaxy. Brilliant.
C.) Consequently, this long-term isolation in the desert neatly explains WHY Dorn goes "berserker mode" after the Heresy. Yes, Dorn is always shown to be brimming with anger, but he is also practical, rational, and caring about the lives of his sons.
Just found your channel. Very solid content. Got yourself a new subscriber.
Khornes plan sounds like Peter Griffin trying to get that kid to 'do math'.
Rogal Dorn gets a model of him inside a Dreadnought inside a Rogal Dorn Battle Tank.
The cloak of the emperor hides you from even the gods of chaos. Best way to give the cloak to corvis corax and can lead to him trying to assassinate one of the four chaos gods
Shoutout from the grim frostbitten north of Sweden. Keep it up!
Couldn't the Imperial Fists just have laid cyclonic exterminatus on Sebastius IV upon arriving in orbit uncontested?
I am pretty new to the 40k setting, so my knowledge about the lore still has some weak points. I don't really understand the process of commiting Exterminatus, so If someone could help me out?
RE - Terminator Plate - So remember the Terminator Plate isn't made from any part of Big E's armour. The Crux Terminatus on the shoulder, however, is. That could be a single molecule, so there could be loads left or they could just retcon the CT to give a different benefit and make it rarer.
Rogal Dorn = King in Yellow.
Valdor went with him to build the emperor's new army.
I'm not saying sandman and valrak are the same person... but I've never seen them in the same room together.
This one speaks proper English though, and isn’t extremely irritating, but still well informed 😂😂
Are they EVER gonna tie up all the loose ends? Whatever happened to that rogue AI on mars that was fighting the traitors and chaos? What happened to the mechanicus adept who is the steward of the ctan shard? Has the chaos forces found her?
I always like to think that Omegon (Now back to his original name Alpharius, after the real Omegon died to Dorn) hunted Dorn after the Heresy ended, and cut his hand as a callback to how Dorn cuts off his twin's hands, having now the primarch somewhere as his prisoner. Of course, it won't be like that, but it would have been interesting.
32:19 isn't it that after that whole 'almost getting sacrificed for fulgrims ascension' incident, Perty started to slowly die?
because then him becoming a daemon primarch is just a desperation for keep living
peterturbo was tricked by Fulgrim into basically having his soul ripped out.
@24:30 - isn’t that a lamenters helmet? Don’t worry though… we get that a lot… ;D (lamenters collector here XD)
Royal Dorn is the King in Yellow😂😂
>"Dorn might be in the throne room"
>TFW TTS called it
Doombreed and Nkari were stated as being on-board the Vengeful Spirit so maybe Dorn fights one of them. I think Doombreed is more likely since he's a daemon Prince of khorne and Dorn has just rejected khorne.
Dorns (current canon) actions during the Iron Cage Incident might not be in line with Dorn, but it sure is in line with *Khorne* - not leaving the battlefield, demanding honourable combat - they could easily stick close to the extisting lore whilst embellishing around the edges.
I do like the idea of only his hand being left behind after being pulled through a portal, do we currently have any Primarchs taking direct action against Khorne? I dont know enough to make any grounded statements so im struggling to make the next mental step, as someone who is an adept at fortifying it seems unlikely that Dorn would take the fight to Khorne directly, especially as Khornes whole thing is fighting, but he could be building something around him, or a trap for him in some way.
Fists and Dorn himself likewise are masters of siege warfare in general, they just have a particular propensity towards defending. Fortification isn't his only shtick lol
But I do love the Khorne portal theory, neat idea
Such a wholesome chap
I hope we find out that Perturabo's ascension went wrong and he now is patient zero of the Obliterator virus.
Give Russ’s spear to Rogal dorn who defends Terra and let him take charge of the custody and would look so cool. Give Russ the claw
Hey bro. I love your work! You think there is any chance to get SuperAnchors to voice Dorn in the future? His name is Admiral Burke, or Superanchors (now) and he is literally mine (and most 40k fans) head Canon dorn voice. He's the voice from TTS, and I'm sure he would do it...if asked. He said he never gets asked for appearances on remliez podcast. Please please let dorn shine, reading your amazing work and literally embodying Dorn
Perturabo bring a giant Iron Circle Darmon Engine + Helldrake/trad dragon... maybe a throwback to old Dragon Centaurs? 😂
So basically when the emperor returns he is going to come back as Scrooge McDuck huh
Imagine if dorn isn't dead but when he was overwhelmed by the chaos marines he finally gave in
If there's one Primarch i love to hear about and relate to, it's Poor Rogal
Yeah, he goes from Rogal Dorn to Rogal Dumas
It's pretty obvious, he's perfect in defense, a Goomba in assaults
you have a fantastic voice - have thought of doing fan readings of novels? Brilliant channel good sir
Thanks man! I will look into it
i do wonder if its not so much a case of Perturabo "Ascending" to daemonhood as much as he simply resembles his brother daemon princes in terms of raw power that he is mistaken as such? Last i remember, Perturabo was interred in a primarch sized dreadnaught from the wound dealt to him by Fulgrim. It would make sense for him to imbue warp power into a suit of armor to keep himself alive while he uses it as a mobile life support system/fuck everything in that direction button.
He may even have a deal with Vashtorr to supply the technology or resources needed for such a suit. another cool idea would be for two primarchs to make their return together, one chaos and one loyal. For example, if perturabo is primarily dying from poison/chaos corruption then he'd have reason to seek out Nurgle and use the Eldar goddess he captured to heal himself, at the same time it could reintroduce the MIA Leman Russ, who is persumable searching for the same goddess to fix the emperor.
it would sufficiently shake up the setting while also giving a win by Leman failing to free the goddess but Perturabo still being healed, and thus returning to combat. it also brings an interesting internal conflict as we know Fulgrim is on the top of the Peter Turbo shitlist
With you on Corvus getting the claw. I do not think the claw fits Dorn. I could see him getting like a gauntlet of the emp or somethinf.
I think that Black Library authors need to flesh out more of the rivalry between Dorn and Perturabo. I don't think we've seen enough to warrant quite the level of enmity we're seeing, particularly from Perturabo, personally, towards Dorn. We know it was glory and praise for Dorn and ignominy for Perturabo; but what really went on *between* them as men to warrant the Iron Cage? Why is this quite so personal? I don't think we have the answer yet.
Would be great to get more details. I definitely think we will get more in the scouring though
In the original lore rhogal dorne dies after boarding a chaos ship full of khorne demons and after lots of killing basically just got to to depressed gave in and let himself be killed..
Accidentally asending "no no no no no no no no wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait..."
- The Punisher
47:00 the Fists are all about their gun lines and enfilading bolter salvos. I'd bet real cash monies that Dorn gets Daddy's bolter. That may be a bit underwhelming, but I feel it in my bones. Plus, old lore (so obviously prone to redaction) is every Crux Terminatus crest has a small sliver of the Emperors ruined plate, thus further bolstering the armors protection. I'd doubt there's too much of the armor left to hand out.
Of course to me that begs the question of what Vulkan or the Khan get when they show up.
Plot armor: The Primarch. the "i fortify bases" primarch just happens to not be inside any of his fortifications, the entire thing he's good at. and beat the im 3 steps ahead of everyone else primarch in a fight inside his own ship surrounded by his own men. Makes zero sense
Good triumphs over evil
Do not let Dorn come back a traitor I will damn him for eternity
Also on the cancer comment. Most cancer is fatal to the host if not checked. Very rare is the cancer that leaves the body of the host and survives in infect other things. There is a case of this happening is dogs however
I haven't read the book, but the idea that all he has to do is say the words "blood for the blood god" will make him fall to chaos is ridiculous. being trapped in a desert wouldn't turn him into a bloodthirsty maniac, it wouldn't change his morals and ideals. to turn a guy like Dorn to chaos you'd need to convince him that it's the right thing to do somehow. no amount of torture would work.
Complete isolation breaks people IRL in hours, so Rogal lasting centuries in complete isolation is quite a feat.
Only once Rogal was boken could Khorne begin to reshape him to eventually accept chaos as the only way to be released, but Rogal never broke.
Think of it like the final verbal component to a spell. He's been placed in a place that would break his psyche, that's step one. He's then in a place full of warp energy and has Khorne directly staring at him, that's step 2. If he says it he's doing Khorne's bidding, and so it's the final step to breaking his defenses. If cockblade got Fulgrim this works too, frankly.
" being trapped in a desert wouldn't turn him into a bloodthirsty maniac, it wouldn't change his morals and ideals"
-Guy who does not understand how solitary confinement and white torture works
Rogal should have been a better brother to perturabo, I understand that perturabo was hard to like and all but beating him every time? That's how resentment between siblings develop.
I think that Dorn might get a powerfist? I'm not aware of the emperor having a powerfirst but we know GW isn't scared of bringing up new weapons that the emperor supposedly had.
dorn should return with a re-grow hand empowered by all the dead chapter masters that died and names are on his skeleton fist.
I think Dorn's end was just bad writing. Such a well-written character throughout all the novels, to be disgraced with this authors decision to write him as a moron
If you think about it Dorn is a defense breaker so he would actually be deadly in melee combat given time he should be able to beat all his brothers, and he is a master of defense so he should also have that time during the fight just saying if written right Dorn is deadly, and I am a Vulcan fan saying this!!!$$$+++
Any primarch can beat any other primarch. They are at such a level that our comprehension of fighting cant fathom.
There are three primarchs that were a cut above, and ferrus, horus and sanguinius are long dead.
ferrus?realy? wtf ferrus was the worst primarch (thanks to the writing tbh)...he good fooled by a minor xenos-human allianz, got beaten twice by fulgrim, he was an idiot and unlike angron he had no butchernails in his head.
This is the battle of the Chosin Reservoir told in 40K fashion. Korean War.
Awesome video. I appreciate you and your work greatly
Thanks for watching
It’s explained why he does the iron cage in the black templars codex from 4th/5th. He knew his sons would never accept to be broken down into chapters, so after using the pain glove he attacks the iron warriors. Then the surviving sons have no choice but to accept the codex
Lol, dorn becomes a wall after being in the warp to long. Or a lifting crane
I'm currently going through the horus heresy, i haven't read these books yet, going through the read order, ATM in on garo and they just found locan.
However going based off khorne wanting him.... would the red angel (not angron i mean the blood angel rage angel) make more sense, i may have forgotten or just not know but to my knowledge we don't know what happens to it after it shows up at horus after sangy told him to go.... until an inquisitior finds him in 40k
What if Dorn saw the bodies of his sons in the Desert.
The dead on the Vengeful Spirit & the bodies of the ones fighting in the Iron Cage.
If Perterabo bsomes a Demon Prince. It will have no imagination in it and he will look like himself only bigger and with horns.
As a dark angels fan I would love to see a model of old man lion with the lion sword along with a redeemed cypher and maybe even a redeemed Luther
If Luther could even be redeemed at this point
I also don't ever want them to make the lion younger again I think the age shows how he's gotten wiser not that he's slower or weaker angron learned that the hard way
Rogal Dorn sounds like one of Derek Zoolander’s looks
The sacrifice of 400 Imperial Fists' geneseed seems kind of cheap for ascension to daemonhood.
I imagine rogal dorn boring the blood god is like rimmer reading his risk campaign book in red dwarf
I just like perti too much, he always fascinates me
Can you imagine Rogal Dorn leading the Black Templars 😮
No, he didn’t approve of Sigmanson’s (sp) Big E faith and essentially banished the zealots to he Eternal Crusade. Washed his hands and let the berserkers do their thing. Papa sooo proud but can’t admit it out of pride. What a adorn thing to do.🙏😎
I think Vulkan should get something from the Emperor that's more abstract. Because he can already craft powerful artefacts that may one day exceed the capacity of even his Father's mastery and knowledge, and moreover inheirted the Emperor's aveternal nature; his status as a true perpetual rather than simply being genecrafted to live a long time.
In Captain Planet, there's a punch of different rings that represent elements and then there's one guy who's power is "heart." I think that's what Vulkan should get; he should get a revelation from the Numen; the Emperor's divine agape, that empowers him in some way that parralells the physical artefacts He left behind. It would fit his personality as the Salamander primarch.