FIRE!! Execute an EMERGENCY descent. Now. - Flight Training VLOG
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- Опубликовано: 5 апр 2018
- Emergency descents are a relatively recent addition to the Private Pilot ACS and an important skill to keep sharp. Fire is a risk we cannot mitigate in a light airplane but we can be prepared for it. In this video I will show you how to execute an emergency descent in a non pressurized light airplane. Fly Your Best!
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The Flight Chops video I reference is here -- • Emergency procedures o...
Another killer educational video. Can’t get enough of these.
Wonderful reminder of why we need to stay current on emergencies. Thanks, Jason!!!
Thank you . I was in A Cessna 206 years ago getting my high performance sign off and we did a lot of airwork including how to do a high speed decent and the information that was first was to do clearing turns before any maneuver and he demonstrated to pull the prop control which increased our airspeed during my 45 degree turns and keeping my eyes outside looking for any traffic. The 206 is heavy on controls so trimmed for pitch and power for my altitude once I rolled out to the altitude we needed to be at before landing.
Great video!!! During my training, my instructor didn't have me put flaps in (Engine fire simulation - Cessna 172M and 172N models). It was mixture out, fuel selector off, master off (vents closed) and pitch for 100 to put out the flames. Then it would be my ABC checklist for engine-out landing. My DPE went right into engine failure/landing as well after a simulated fire on my Private checkride. If you're ever in the Seattle area, lets go flying!
I really enjoy the content. It allows me to imagine what it would be like to fly since I can’t...I take an approved ssri but wouldn’t even try to pass a medical because I know a special issuance is like winning the lottery.
Every video you do is another great reminder to go out with my Instructor to do more Emergencies and Knowledge of the Checklist during a simulation because one day it could happen in a real emergency situation where and when that I'll be ready and prepared to Fly the Aircraft without hesitation and with Patients to get the Aircraft on the Ground to Walk Away safely. Great practice
I like these cuz they are always where I fly
Great stuff, I’m going to add this to my monthly “self” practice!! I think the last time I practiced this was my check ride. No reason to not continue practicing it!!!
I agree Andy, especially this one and simulated engine failures. If you have a good scan for traffic and you're tight on these emergency procedures, you've done a pretty good job of preparing in a light airplane.
Great video, thanks for sharing!
🙌🏻
Hey, I fly at KLVK too!
Seeing Steve's original video a while back got me thinking about the fire extinguisher placement in my half-built RV-8, which is always an issue with that plane. Some guys put it behind the pilot's seat... but if I do that, I have to make certain I can easily retrieve it with one hand, by feel alone.
wow, it's good that you're thinking about it. It's hard to figure out a good placement in some models.
I prefer at least 60 degrees of bank and full spoilers. But then, not a lot of things that can catch fire in a glider :).
You had me for a sec😂
I don't have my license yet and was hella worried when you said that at first.
can you also do wing fire procedure? how do you side slip to keep fire away from tanks?
I believe I understand the thinking here. The goal is to get on ground ASAP. With flaps, the emergency is prolonged. With a flying envelope up to VNO in smooth air, take advantage of it and use a controlled spiral to expedite the descent while controlling a/s with pitch. I suppose if there's time to trim the pitch, you'll time to don a mask, use the extinguisher and hopefully find a suitable landing site. Is this about right?
That's about right! I think with this procedure it's about practice, practice, practice. It takes an almost military level of training to feel confident ... but keep drilling it and after 10 times or so you'll feel prepared, and you'll be ready for it if (god forbid) you ever need it.
I loved doing emergency descents in training, but yeah we did them with flaps extended. My CFI did talk about the possibility of an engine out at the end of the descent but we never drilled one. :-\ Actually, my latest video (just posted today) I was going to go up with the sole purpose of doing practice maneuvers but got totally sideswiped (hehe no pun intended) by the crosswind situation there and just scrubbed the flight. Definitely need to bring my crosswind proficiency back.
I think you'll find that if you do them clean at a higher airspeed you'll get a faster descent
My understanding for preferring the full flaps form of the emergency decent is that the goal is to get in the ground as quickly as possible. With the flaps down you reach the bottom in the landing configuration with considerably lower energy and lots of drag to bleed off the energy you do have. In the clean decent you reach the bottom of the decent with lots of energy to bleed off and considerably less drag to help. You basically have to level off to slow down while with flaps you could roll out on final and set it down right out of the decent.
Thanks for that input. It makes me want to go out and test again! My recollection of doing this with the flaps down at Vfe (85kts in the Cessna) is that I was unable to get the VSI much past 1500 fpm, at least a 500fpm slower than the clean configuration. I want to test it now with a timer to a full stop landing from altitude. Maybe a follow up video?
My CFI and I were able to hit 2000 FPM at 90mph
In the Cessna we were flying Vfe is 85 KIAS. I think part of the reason it's hard to really optimize the vertical rate of descent when doing it flaps down is a fear of exceeding the structural tolerances outside the white arc. As it is, with flaps down, there is no negative G protection ... outside the white arc all bets are off. It's interesting that you two were able to do it ... I think this video needs a follow up! Maybe a side by side comparison of the two techniques.
i think worrying about Vfe is a part of why most people have a hard time getting the most out of a flaps down emergency descent. If you exceed the white arc you're a test pilot and there is no negative G protection with flaps down even inside the white arc. I agree that in complex airplanes the additional drag of gear makes a huge difference and that if you have 40 degrees of flaps it would make a huge difference too. So it's a great point about the different makes and models and these are great points. I really encourage folks to get out there and try both ways for themselves. I am thinking this needs a follow up where we test both ways all the way down to a full stop.
Clearing turns on a emergency decent? Who would have thought...😅
Great video! Paul's thumb is kinda freakin me out though
I love the videos and podcast. I'm prepping for my PP checkrides. My instructors are adamant flaps need to be used in an emergency descent.
Does manuevering speed come into play for this manuever?
Also, any chance you can add the podcast to Google play?
Thanks for everything!
Eric
Hi Eric, thanks for listening! What is their logic on flaps down? It's really a balance of risks. If you were truly on fire you need to get down as fast as possible which would be at Vno. If the air is smooth (and you don't yank on the controls) this speed should be safe. However, if it's turbulent you'd want to be a bit slower (and not have any flaps down because you lose protection in the negative G direction). Interesting conversation, however. I am releasing a podcast next week that revisits Va, I will try to mention more there. You should be able to find the podcast on Play as of last week, have you tried recently?
Thanks Jason, I just subscribed on Google Play. I'll be looking for next week's podcast.
I'll ask about their logic and report back. My main instructor is a stickler about Va, which I'm assuming is why he instructs full flaps and 90mph. The other instructor said he tried several different configurations and full flaps and just shy of Vfe in our clubs 172M resulted in the fastest descent.
I've been learning a ton from your podcast. I've internalized a lot of the your teachings. Anticipate Recognize Act! Swinging from landing spot to landing spot...and several more.
Keep up the good work!
Eric
Roger, glad you found it! I'm surprised to hear that about full flaps but thanks for the report. I encourage you to go up with them and try both ways (make sure you get 45 degrees of bank and hit Vno if you're doing the clean version). Also, keep in mind you have no protection from negative g loads with the flaps down (for the stickler about Va). One argument I've heard for doing it with flaps is that you'll turn the electrical system off in the descent and (in a Cessna) flaps are electric. So if you're going to use them for the forced landing you'll want them out before you turn off the electrical, I think that's a fair thought. I appreciate you listening and your comments! thx
Jason, I discussed this with my CFI last night. He wants flaps down for the forced landing as I’d likely be turning the power off on the way down.
Man, my instructor had me try to get the fire extinguisher out too, but we definitely would have burned up. Those fire extinguishers in the 172 are not in any sort of ideal position.
They are even worse in some low wing airplanes. I've seen them up by the pilots left foot 🙄
I could see them maybe being mounted under the yoke, between the legs, but then you'd most likely keep bumping into them all the time.
You are definately one of my favorite CFI's. Want to come to KC Missouri?
Thanks! I love Missouri, would enjoy a trip out there. I grew up in horse country, Missouri feels like home. Can't be there full time though
The Finer Points that’s cool! We may have to work something out for late summer. Whenever I said “can’t” as a kid, my dad always told me “can’t died in the cornfield and couldn’t, wouldn’t bury him” 😁.
@@TheFinerPoints how about Utah?
Dan G Always looking for a reason… it’s beautiful there!
I wonder if you could expedite your descent even more by kicking in opposite rudder (using your whole fuselage as giant speed brake). I think glider pilots call this "California Slip", I've been told if done well, it looks as if the plane was flying backwards).
So, Vno, steep turn (generating as much induced drag as possible), then opposite rudder, like when entering a spin, except with lots of airspeed (generating even more drag with the fuselage)
What do you think?
I wouldn't try that at speeds this high. It is an interesting point and I'd like to test it at slower speeds, perhaps at 85 with the flaps down, but I would NOT push and hold hard rudder in a Cessna at Vno. I am also keenly interested in structural integrity these days. We had a local pilot crash in February due to an inflight breakup ... and now the recent Embry Riddle crash in Daytona due to the same thing. Va (maneuvering speed) is not what many pilot's think it is but it is clear about "guaranteeing" a single control deflection fully and abruptly but only at the appropriate speed. Anyway, there will be bit more on this weeks podcast but it's really turning into a deep dive study project for me. I'd like to be able to explain it simply and fully so that all pilots can easily understand it.
Is that something that should be practiced regularly even after you get certified?
I think so Rocky. I think there are 3 risks in a light airplane you can't wish away, FIRE / FAILURE (structural, engine, systems) / COLLISION. The best we can do for these is be very prepared, no matter how good we are we could always use practice.
Did this recently get added to the PTS? I don’t recall having to do this for my PPL and I certainly have never done that level of decent. Certainly I learned slips, but not holy cow that steep of a decent. Is there a risk of getting into a spin if you are descending that fast/steep and in a turn?
Yes, it got added about 2 years ago maybe? With the last change to PTS before the ACS I believe
Imagine you are at 7500 and need to get down now,... like right now, and you are in a spin rated plane. Could you just stall and spin it down to 3000, and then recover nose down, Vno, and 45 degrees bank and continue in an emergency descent? It would be faster
I was practicing a forward slip at 70 kts in a 172 and decended at 1800 to 2000 ft per min all while heading for my target airfield. Are you decending faster than that?
Gord Rose yes. The VSI is pegged so it’s hard to know exactly how fast. Also, I’d be skeptical of your rate indications in a slip
I rent, and my rental doesnt have a fire extinguisher. Should I buy my own ? I doubt they would buy one just for me
yes, I'd buy a small one and keep it handy in flight. You might never need it. you'll probably never need it. but .... (get a smoke hood while you're at it and you're fully prepared for something you'll probably never need. probably
Just got done with my lesson on doing emergency descents and my god I’m going to be sick 🤢
Is this how skydive pilots descend so fast
Flight chops video - ruclips.net/video/JhUwVn9tNMA/видео.html
Thanks, I will add that link to the description.
Gusty landings