People forget that Lightfall doesn’t end with its campaign. It still isn’t over. It’s called Destiny 2: Lightfall: Season of Defiance and Destiny 2: Lightfall: Season of the Deep for a reason. People keep forgetting this. Instead of saying Lightfall was ass, say the MAIN CAMPAIGN THAT WE HAVE SO FAR is ass.
The saddest part is how strand in this game may have cost Witch Queen story wise. Allegedly strand's introduction was going to be the reveal that strand is what Savathun used kept the traveler locked in place and that is how she betrayed the witness not just "Oh she didn't tell this cosmic entity that a planet he already passed by had a redditor city on it."
I remember seeing all the trailers for lightfall thinking “this is going to be crazy if these are the things they’re showing! Imagine what they’re not showing!” Well turns out. They just showed everything before the game was released.
@@bannedmann4469 bro witch queen forsaken taken king and rise of iron were all great. Lightfall was such a letdown because it was suppose to be the final shape and lightfall as one. Lightfall was only bad because it was rushed
@Raven those were the best. I play the game for the lore. There were other expansions that were great like beyond like for introducing the darkness power stasis and returning variks. Don’t forget about the 20 seasons which half of them were really good. Lightfall was good too, but not the best
I feel like Elsie/the exo stranger should’ve been part of lightfall’s campaign or at least been the person to be all “we need to go to Neptune!” Instead of Osiris since she has a Pouka, which are found in Neomuna.
Bro I forgot she had the Pouka and this make a lot of sense. They couldve scrapped Nimbus altogether and had Osiris and Elsie go to Neonuma and work with Rohan.
It would have also been good sense it was established in beyond light that she was the foremost expert on using darkness energy (stasis) so it would have been much easier to establish her as an expert on strand
That would've been better, because nimbus and osiris kept pushing the guardian to learn strand to the point where they were harming the guardian, but exo stranger actually seems to know what she is talking about instead of "go use strand again, maybe this time you master it"@@ominousromanpillar238
She really just became Ana's sister after beyond light, she made it seem so dark and grim, guardians vs guardians, we got the yay we saved the day! Who's the next villan?
"how did our character know to go to Neptune?!" Bruh... Last season literally ended with us finding out the veil was on Neptune directly from Rasputin 😅 that would be the obvious place to go once our character starting seeing a bunch of darkness ships zipping off lol
great point, but I guess I'm trying to put it in perspective from a player who only plays the annual release content not the seasonal, my fault on not making that more clear
I got back to playing when lightfall got out after years and i can confidently say that whole story looks like it's written after eating shrooms plus someone lost all the pages regarding what is veil.Witch Queen was masterpiece i loved it and i'm just dissapointed Lightfall wasn't on this level +strand should have been left in witchqueen phhf deepsight rather deepshite -secure the veil -why? -it's important -why -idgaf
I had no idea where we learned it, but I'm just returning this season after not playing for a year. Though I think that talks more of how poorly past info is shared about the story of destiny 2. It's up to watching RUclips videos or cutscenes to know what's going on at all. Even adding a sentence about each season on their timeline would be a huge help
I think with strand they wanted to do a poison “spider/insect” theme but there wasn’t enough identity. So they changed it. Proof of this is not only all the spider themes on strand (they literally wanted the warlock super to turn you into a spider laying eggs) but there was a bug where a triumph required unraveling kills but instead of unravel it was called “infested”.
Not even it was just mainly meant for witch queen, you can tell because the warlock chest piece from throne world literally has the warlock strand subclass symbol, made up of the same worms from parasite(most likely an early concept of threadlings)
The reason they didn't do a poison subclass is because that's what we wanted. So instead they made a completely new subclass that not only broke the game but quite literally took all their attention away from every aspect of the game outside of that subclass.
@@naveenkv7175 if they originally wanted a poison subclass it makes sense to make a poison exotic weapon. Even though poison never happened, osteo striga still made sense because of the existence of thorn and necrotic grips
Honestly the part of the final cutscene where your guardian has a dilemma about killing your ghost to stop the witness is a very interesting idea. If the ghost ever dies in the story it’ll be like super dramatic and cliche, or he’ll just get revived somehow. But man, it seems like a real homerun way to create an extremely compelling storybeat.
See that would’ve worked in that scene if there wasn’t two characters that could both fly. Like Osiris yells “get your ghost!” And everyone just stands around watching him when it would take two seconds to just go up and grab him. Hell the story spends its whole runtime hyping up an ability that lets you grab onto stuff and pull you to it only for us to just stare at the ghost as it fucks off.
@Peniley Majorey I honestly would’ve been fine with losing our light subclasses seeing how powerful we got in the DLC before, this time we would have to get used to strand and stasis. And if you look at it, all light subclasses have 3 styles of play I.e 3 different supers. Whereas the darkness subclasses only has 1 each
I think the best part about this is that Ghost and everyone acts like the Witness didn't just take over our Ghost (seriously not even a single line of dialog I've heard post-campaign has referenced this)... and the fact when Rhulk even just tried speaking to one in the past the Traveler spoke through it saying "lol no" and self destructing that poor ghost. Does this mean the Traveler wanted this to happen or was it just bad writing?
@@mr.dr0bot731 I don't want to sound like an apologist for Bungie and how badly they missed with the story of this expansion but I do feel like the Traveler has had sus intentions at best the majority of the time. Could be a bit of both with the majority being due to bad writing.
I liked seraphs gameplay but the story felt like we did nothing. We did all this work rebuilding Rasputin but at the last second he has to destroy himself and we're back at step one
@@evanf1997 i literally came back to the game because a buddy of mine gifted me the expantions for my birthday and i knew how bad lightfall was so i told him "lets play a game where gonna count how many times they talk about The Veil" and if your curious the radial mast is refered to a total of 13 times in the span of 2 missions that of itself is impressive
Thats not a tree in the vision at 9:00 that's just the back half of the veil still my guy. The veil is shown in 3 different frames. Two of the roots, and one of the top portal looking part
I just wish they'd just make cutscenes for all of the seasons with a voice-over explaining the season in detail so people can follow the story much better especially the new lights!
Bro not even new lights i think everyone does not want to have to play the game every week to find out a small part of the story every week in ever season and then forget what happned the season before
@ryanfraser9283 I can't tell if you're dumb or dumb. Where did I say they should make players get a small part of it weekly? All they have to do is add the cutscenes to the timeline... Learn to read, would you?
The Veil and Nefele Stronghold were mentioned in the lore pre-Lightfall and by Rasputin by during Season of the Seraph. Also "Veil" is said 68 times in the campaign and post game. MyelinGames counted.
Pretty sure the original 'Lightfall' concept is now going to be 'The Final Shape'. I belive what happened was they, as originally announced, planned to go Beyond Light --> Witch Queen --> Lightfall and have Lightfall be the end of the saga, but they realized somewhere along the line they needed more time to do 'Lightfall'.. so they changed its name to Final Shape, and invented a totally new 'side-story' to be in-between, which is the Lightfall we got. My hope is that this means the 'original Lightfall', aka Final Shape, is going to be really good for getting the extra time to cook. Here's hoping.
i think commendations are a fun thing to have, but it shouldnt have been to unlock guardian ranks. I think they tried to make what ffxiv does, after an activity you can commend one pople in your party, those commendations unlock just cosmetics and allows you to be a mentor.
Dialogue in the mission where we have to destroy the radial mast and suppression thingies from ghost specifically goes as follows " It's suppresses our powers all our known powers anyway" which is why strand is what we have to use.
biggest hint of strand being in Witch Queen, is the final fight with Savathun. The Wizards we need to kill are '' Threadweavers'' Bounding the traveler with Green looking strands of webbing.... hmmm where do we see that before..
A perfect explanation of the entire campaign, I agree with almost every point you brought up about the plot and the gameplay format. Hoping for a new start either at final shape or after 🙌🏼
It’s funny how he came up with a better story Ima time crunch then an entire team could in god knows how long. I love destiny, but man sometimes this game is a mess.
Uh... I do not remember any negative sentiment going into Lightfall, the only unpopular Witch queen season was season of Plunder, though I maintain that Haunted was the worst, and Season of the Seraph was peak Destiny, the sentiment going into the expansion seemed almost universally posative, yes, people were bored of the seasonal model, but BUNGIE had promised the structure would be changing, and the whole overdeliverry scandal didn't happen until season of the deep with the state of the game. Destiny was basically at an all time high until lightfall came out. Also, we knew about Neptune and the Veil before the Witness did, Rasputin told us about it after Spire of the Watcher in season of the Seraph.
I could be wrong 15:13 ish but I don’t think it mentions dark powers specifically, but that it’s resistant to powers they know that we have and they know we have the 3 lights and Stasis but didn’t know about strand.
They did name-drop the Veil in the last part of Season of the Seraph, and Osiris already knew there was something on Neptune involving it, telling our Guardian that too. Doesn't make it any less terribly written, but they at least did SOME foreshadowing in the season before.
@@emilianocastillejos1330 it was revealed right after the final mission and cutscene, I learned about it because I came back for the finale, I quit playing when the season launched lol
This video made me think of something... If Nezarec was resurrected by the Light, does that make him a Guardian? Does that also make The Traveler his Ghost? Kind of an awkward relationship if that's true 😂
The Veil was mentioned by Rasputin in his final message to us, and was told to Osiris as well. That’s how Osiris knew they were after The Witness and Calus were after the Veil
Somethings about the story that bugged me that could be been improved from a writing perspective: -This was the first time we’ve met REAL daddy Calus. When we were on the Glykon, Katabasis said Calus looked like “Slop” or “Sludge”. We don’t see that in any sort of Calus flashback or cutscene” but it would’ve helped us understand why he sided with the witness. To get his body back and his desire to no longer rule from the shadows(Daddy Calus Bots) but on the forefront. -Calus and Kaital having a clash of ideals and mettle has been a hinted to us since the Glykon and the season of the Haunted AND Duality. The fact we don’t see more of them together was a missed Opportunity. Having a cutscene of Father and Daughter having an actual fight. Have him beat her, only because of his Darkness powers and not because of his strength. Have him show remorse she can’t follow him and her desperately trying to appeal to her father who she hates, but still cares for. -Nimbus’ issue is a lack of proper tone yes, but a cool way to have made more sense of it is having Rohan die in the final mission (saves our ghost and dies as a result) then have that change Nimbus(sy) from a wise cracking teen to a more somber, character who makes occasional jokes and wisecracks but is more cynical and saddened as a result and their jokes reflect that(self burns and sarcastic negativity). -Osiris was annoying during the campaign. He would’ve been much more enjoyable if rather than being insufferable with him acting as the ‘only smart guy in the room’ he could’ve been in an everpresent state of mourning over Sigira. Have him sad and remorseful throughout the campaign as he sees us interact with our ghost. Then when Rohan dies, Osiris becomes the mentor to Nimbus who is also dealing with loss, and realizes he needs to use his boundless experience in order to mentor the younger generation and others(somehow Moth Mommy Savathun was a better mentor to crow than Osiris had been in general lmaoo) -Have the loss of the guardians at the intro and Amanda impact the characters more. Have Zavala go to try and Thunder Crash the witness, while Ikora tries no Nova bomb him and the queen harbinger his ass and Crow ‘Golden His Gun’ only for him to shoo them away, not killing them but messing them up. Have the stranger terrified because she’s never seen anything like this happen but knows it’s worse than her Dark Timelines. -Strand is a power of memory right? Osiris says as much when he’s theorizing .Have our guardian experience memories in the form of hostile negative memories(old vaulted boss battles) and the only way to master it is to also remember the good stuff as well. Have it be something that makes our guardian DEAL with his/her trauma and move on to be stronger over all as a character -Nezerec is one of my favorite characters in D2 but I think him just giving nightmares to the people of Neomona is outside his scope. He was brought back to life by the traveler. And is being regrown like a Chia Pet in the Witness’ Pyramid. Have his influence of nightmares extend to the last city, the dreaming city(remember that place?), Caital’s Cabal forces as well as Neomona. Rather then jumping onto the pyramid ship and messing cabal up, have the Cabal be locked in a battle against maybe the Lucent Hive since they’re on the tear to kill Neserec because they know Moth Mommy Savathun would want him dead and they also are getting nightmares. Then have a cool mechanic where we in some capacity team up with a lucent raid team to complete an encounter(like have a lucent Hive knight be the send out a buff to us that highlights which planet is dark and which one is light or something like that). Then when we fight our homie Nezerec, have a cutscene of Nezerec getting his golden armor back(like on his statues). And maybe include a mechanic where he throws curated nightmares at us, manifest copies of himself, jumpscare us etc. have him play into being a FINAL GOD OF PAIN. I’m a writer, working on a few novels at the moment but I’m not trying to say “oh me story better, git gud bungo!” but I feel that few more emotional moments in this story, as well as cutscenes to establish characters and their relationships would go a LONG way. The witness/claus cutsesne was great and I wish we had more like it tbh
I love all these ideas, except for the thing about Strand being a way for our Guardian to deal with their own trauma, only because that was kinda the plot of Shadowkeep already. But I wish they'd saved that for mastering Strand instead, like you are suggesting.
Us randomly joining a Lucent Hive Team is silly and fanfictiony. If you really knew Destiny lore, you would know that Savathun will gladly wipe us out, and had her Lucent Hive kill a good dozen Guardians. She says in the Throne World Ship "Our powers may be similar, but our paths are separate." She isnt going to ally with us for the same reason the Warlords did not ally with us.
Osiris knew that "the veil" was on neptune due to Rasputin naming it and the coordinates(of neptune) at the end of season of seraph. Nimbus is also an "angsty late teen/twenty something" that was ahead of their class as far as lore. Im still enjoying destiny and have more positive things to say than negative but we all have different experiences and limited perspective. Either way, be kind an respect each others opinions. I don't agree with half of what Ive seen, but this is still a great video so far Evan, if nothing else, people can take away how you see the game. Keep killin' it dude and stay safe out there and be kind
Well he's got a perspective that is of someone who's does the immediate drop of content, and not the annual pass seasons that go away. It's something I deeply understand perspectively speaking. Fomo is not Evan's thing
tbf they explained why strand is exhausting us -- we're approaching it like stasis, abusing it for maximum power, whereas the idea was to go full bruce lee -- we're not a river, letting it flow through us, we're coercing it to our needs initially
Strand was supposed to release with Witch Queen. Resonance, the 3rd Darkness power, was supposed to release with Lightfall. We never got Resonance before the Witness was defeated now, so IDK how the fuck we'll get it, if ever.
The only problem with having the stories revolve around using the darkness subclasses is that you’d need to buy the previous expansions to have access to them
This is the hard thing for me. using the Lost and GoT reference... I probably knew 3 years ago that there would be no true ending to Destiny. We'll probably kill the witness, or it'll leave, or it'll stay and we leave, or we all die... but no matter what, I always knew I was not going to be happy with any possible ending that the Bungie writers come in with. Expectations vs Reality. The bar is already so high (even after all the misses this season) that when we get to the end it'll fall flat. But, and there is always a but.... the game has made itself such a part of my life, that i'm still going to push on to see the end.
@@bofa722 To be fair, we haven't even explored most of Earth after the Collapse. In lore we know there's other areas that other Guardians have been to, but we ourselves have no real visual explanation of places like the Chicago Exclusion Zone, the Sahara Contested Zone, the Radioactive Exclusion Zone (which I think is another part of Old Russia), and SO much more.
We weren’t going to Neptune on purpose, us and Osiris were following the ships that were leaving the battle, and boarded them. All we knew was we needed to stop whatever the hell Calus was doing
It's almost as if the story we got was never actually planned and the actual content they had planned had to be delayed so they tried to make another dlc before the end without actually knowing what was going to happen or even the theme🤪
The Guardian should've shot Ghost. Rasputin, the chad he was, actually sacrificed himself and virgin Guardian can't even aim steadily at their own Ghost. As we learned during Forsaken, you can't kill Ghosts with regular weapons, so the kinetic energy would likely just have blown Ghost away. Ghost would be alive because of previously explained plot armor, but it seems Bungie forgot about this fact. Lightflaw moment
One of the things that drove me away from Destiny was the constant feeling of losing progress due to the seasonal light model. It never felt like my account was truly growing...
Destiny fans: “Lightfall looks so grey I can’t wait to fight evil in a new darker tone with a serious main villain.” Bungie: NEON LIGHT SPIDER-MAN WITH 9 FT TALL GENDERLESS CLOWN
You had a misunderstanding, they explain in the story that the radial mast is built to suppress all stuff we have avaible, strand works on it because the witness and Calus didn’t know about it
Also, the whole thing with the Ishtar collective is pretty straightforward. The entirety of the dungeon spire of the watcher is all about how neomuna came to be or at least part of that story and how the Ishtar collective is involved. The lore is really good. You should read it and season of seraph with the nafele stronghold also explains this
"You guys are great at making the game part, save the story for the show not the game" and they were great at making the story part too, there's nothing wrong having both.
People keep saying “they think” strand was for witch queen. Well it was it’s a known fact Bungie literally said it was and it was pushed out for another light 3.0 rework.
The 33% rating is hilarious because Eris Morn made a reference to hermeticism in the first sever mission from Season of the Haunted. I’m the only one I’ve seen so far to have caught that since “As above, so below” is sussy mystic occult lingo to which most people would never be privy otherwise, but for whoever wrote that line, I’m sure it spun like poetry. It seems like they’ve been waiting until recently to start inserting their renditions of ancient symbols in occlusion, but there are probably way more that we all overlooked in everything up to now. The problem they’re facing is how to make it significant enough to help people understand the story better, and that entirely comes down to the fact that the writing needs improvement. The Witness making the ☀️ shape with the Traveler, for example, is very on the nose, but to make people think twice about that, it needs to be illustrated more, because there’s a symbolic reason that we draw 8 triangles around a circle to represent the Sun or an octagram to represent Venus/Ishtar/“The Morning Star” that could easily be tied into the story, having more relevance than in name alone, with just a little more effort. Another one I noticed: in the first cutscene the Witness uses its left hand to wipe out the Guardians and find the Veil, but in the last cutscene it uses its right hand to triangulate the Traveler, all while the leitmotif “The Path (Luna)” from the Music of the Spheres plays over what sounds like the Traveler screaming. It’s space magick. If the visuals, music, and dialogue aren’t doing more than just some obscure reference to explain its significance to the story, then it should be further elaborated upon with less contrived, more intuitive writing.
I’ve always hated the seasonal model and I’m hating it even more now. The game is crumbling. I’ve gotten kicked from the game around 75 times since lightfall. Sometimes it even crashes my console. I don’t even get error codes. They need to start making sure stuff works before just jamming it into the game
9:28 Rasputin actually told us about Neptune, Neomuna, and the Veil at the end of Season of the Seraph, and Osiris had been having visions about Neomuna ever since he returned to us at the end of Season of Plunder
I like almost everything in your rewrite except for the bosses. I believe Xivu, Nezarec, and even Calus deserve their own bigger spotlight than just 1st, 2nd or 3rd encounter of a raid.
according to leaks calus wasnt even meant to make it past witch queen. he was supposed to die in haunted, but they needed a villain for lightfall after they split it in two.
I beat the story n asking myself did they just chopped the expansion into pieces of smaller expansion and..... again? Good thing i wait for the discount to 75 buck in PSN to get just a month later
I started playing D2 last month, and I've played through the Witch Queen campaign, the Lightfall campaign, and just in the last couple of days, the Beyond Light campaign. I'm super new to the universe, and I'm just along for the ride at this point as a newbie. I don't have the last 8 or 9 years that some have, and I don't expect myself to be on the same level as my friend, who's been with Destiny since the beginning. The poor man has scraped my pixels off the ground more times than we can count, but the environments and the new challenges have been fun for me. In any case, I appreciate your review as an experienced player in the Destiny universe. Your points make sense and I get the frustration of gameplay vs story (I played WoW for a decade, I get it 😅). I can only hope that the writing pulls through from here on in and that find a cohesive conclusion leading into the Final Shape.
Im pretty sure that the original idea of Lightfall was scrapped, leading the devs to rush creating the current story. Thats why it felt so unfinished. Because it is unfinished.
This may be an unpopular opinion. But Season of the Haunted had more content than Season of the Defiance and they really could have given us more stuff. The Castellum got boring after a bit, but the story missions felt like a story mission. Not a back and forth fetch quest.
Question now is whether anyone here cares for the story or just wants big explosions and epic battles. Not to mention how, bland Evan's rewrite for witch queen feels (finch being a double agent just isn't as interesting as someone who's realized that they fucked up and is trying to fix what they've done in whatever way possible)
The design of Neomuna is completely nonsensical. Nobody would ever design and live in a city like that. For one, the roads are narrow planks suspended above bottomless pits of death with speed bumps to knock you off the road to your death.
Bro it's a little weird how many little (but very obvious) details you miss or get wrong about not only this DLC but Destiny as a whole. Given how long you've played this game and how long the DLC has been out for now, I really don't get it.
Lightfall itself was decent. It wasn't amazing but it wasn't bad. The writing and plot was kinda mediocre and the raid is a meh... but everything else that came with it has been amazing. Strand feels incredible, except titan because we got shafted on that super, I know its strong but its the super for the 4th or 5th time. The QoL changes are great. The neomuna weapons are good, the armor is good. The destination itself is amazing. The Vex partition missions are some of the best missions ever. The "secret" exotic quest is super fun. The new strike is good. Its just insane to me that people took the writing, the only bad part, and rated the whole expansion just off that and they didn't look at anything else. Also I prefer to judge based on seasonal content meshing with the expansion more than just the expansion. Like Witch Queen should be S or A tier but the seasonal content dropped it down to like a C or D for me. We had 1 good season with WQ and that was the shortest season with season 19. So far season 20 has been pretty good. A little short story wise but still good. Root of Nightmares is a decent raid... Its nice to have a very simple raid to take new players through. Granted DSC, KF, and VoG are also easy for new players but RoN is very beginner friendly. But like half the raid is spent traversing from one encounter to the next. It really feels like they took a dungeon and stretched it out, literally. The explicator encounter is really cool though but I wish we got the leaked boss instead of the cabal guy. But the loot from RoN is just not that great. If you compare it to Vow, Vow is amazing. Vow doesn't have a single bad weapon. Its actually kinda crazy that the vow raid exotic might be the worst weapon from that raid. The glaive and deliverance could be argued to be bad but when the raid came out the raid exotic was by far the worst weapon. Now its good, but I hate that you basically have to buy an ornament to use it. Anyways back to Lightfall itself, yes the expansion should not have cost $100. $70-80 would be more fair. But the player rating or whatever is just because people jumped on the hate bandwagon instead of forming their own opinions. I get that lots of people dont like it but I think most people have come around to saying its like a C tier. And thats where I would put it for now. Like I said earlier if the seasonal content is as good as Beyond Lights seasonal content was then Lightfall will become a B or maybe even an A tier.
I want to point out we don’t know we have to go to Neptune. Osiris does thanks to Season of the Seraph. we also don’t “just bump into Osiris on his own mission” the opening cutscene and opening missions dialogue we go to help/protect him
To be clear, the radial mast is better explained than you give it credit for, no it does not suppress light, that is the little boxes shown off in the second mission. The radial mast is a connector that uses both light and dark and was supposed to link up with the veil, but since we destroyed it, the witness just used our ghost instead. His primary plan was to link it, and then destroy the veil therefore blocking himself in with no way of coming after him. But he also got us to see his transmission just in case so he could play both us and calus by having us duke it out pointlessly for his gain. You also have neglected to realize something crucial about stasis, its tied to a dlc. The problem with this is that not everyone has stasis. Say for a moment that someone jumps into destiny and this version of witchy lightfall is what you present. Stasis is shown very clearly but then, as a new light with only three subclass options working on getting strand you go “wait why don’t I have access to that?” Suddenly you’ll be actually fairly pissed because they are acting like you have something you don’t. Also, stasis doesn’t TOTALLY need to be mentioned anyways, in the campaign as it is now, Osiris simply says these suppression thingies are tuned around the abilties that calus knows you have, which can include stasis btw.
The stuff about the radial mast isn’t hinted at or explained except for the function. I didn’t know it was meant to lock the door behind him. However I will say this video doesn’t really explore the issues with Lightfall and neglects other details
Can someone please explain why people don’t understand what they did with the veil. To me it makes total sense. From our character and everyone else we know nothing about the veil. Why do people think that bam we know everything all go a sudden. No we don’t know the veil. And bungie did say we would be a pawn. And the witness played us hard to get us into the veil. Since if the witness left the traveler the traveler would have escaped. So the next best pawn was us. And we lost. I see no issues in the story plot wise. Characters were meh tho. Please tell me I’m wrong. I’m waiting
I really hope that if we end up getting a new subclass at all in the final shape, i hope its not just another darkness subclass. I'm hoping for like a brand new light subclass thats like a crazy mix of all of our current ones. Or a mix of light and dark to make us masters of everything we've faced before
@@NitroNinja324 not really. In the end the guardians embody light. It is what we're made of and it's what we command to hold back our enemies. I feel like it would be a cool story point and just a nice thing to have our final added subclass be a powerful light subclass to stop the witness. I don't really care about having even amounts of both light and dark.
I don’t understand why people keep saying this like we don’t already know strand was for witch queen. Bungie literally said it was and it was pushed out for a light 3.0 rework instead.
The whole part about light and dark doesn't work given not everyone owns witch queen and beyond light. Guardian ranks don't work for the same reason. I'm stuck at level 7 because I didn't spend £20 on the witch queen dungeon key. The bring back sunsetting thing also feels a bit excessive.
Honestly this video is so poorly researched and filled with personal bias presented as community consensus that it honestly feels like it was only made to capitalize on the disappointment and frustration that the community has towards Bungie. The game isn’t in a good state and it hasn’t been for a while, but if you’re going to criticize something at least make sure you know what you’re talking about.
I think they should have killed Nimbus, instead of Rohan. They gave us the young idealist who needs to step up and be ready for the future. I think the grizzled old veteran sad that the young idealist died, would have been a much more compelling story.
Firstly, we learned about Neptune from the data Rasputin found on Nefeele Stronghold that he left to Osiris as a 'dying' gift. Secondly, I'm pretty sure it's mentioned that Rohan and co intercepted a transmission about the cabal moving something called the Radial Mast and that's how we learn about its existence, ghost latter reacts strangely when it can sense light from deep in Calus' ship. Thirdly, the generators are the objects that protect a field to suppress our abilities, not just our Light but all of our abilities that the Witness knows of, hence why only Strand works as we're the first to discover and wield it, Stasis is blocked due to the Witness knowing we have it as it gifted us with the ability to wield it. While I'm in no way trying to defend the absolute ball-drop that was Lightfall's campaign, I just feel fair judgement is a must. Your rewrite, I do thoroughly enjoy the idea of us systematically dismantling the Witness' army and Disciplines one by one gaining power as we do so, so yeah.. nicely done.
The only mention of the veil before Lightfall was on a text screen from the end of the previous season. It was literally just a wall of text that most people skipped or at most skimmed to get the quest done. It was a post mortem message from Rasputin, with no indication it was going to be THE McGuffin from next DLC.
I forgot to give the dlc a number rating.. 5/10 I will let the video elaborate for me haha much love everyone
I want the final subclass being taken bassed
9:20 the reason why we know about the veil on neptune is because rasputin told us about it.
honestly, id give it a 4.5
without the game changes that launched with it and just rating the DLC itself, it would drop even lower to a 3~
People forget that Lightfall doesn’t end with its campaign. It still isn’t over. It’s called Destiny 2: Lightfall: Season of Defiance and Destiny 2: Lightfall: Season of the Deep for a reason. People keep forgetting this. Instead of saying Lightfall was ass, say the MAIN CAMPAIGN THAT WE HAVE SO FAR is ass.
@@neekumikuvt328 you mean the seasonal content that will be removed when Final Shape drops? LMAO
The saddest part is how strand in this game may have cost Witch Queen story wise. Allegedly strand's introduction was going to be the reveal that strand is what Savathun used kept the traveler locked in place and that is how she betrayed the witness not just "Oh she didn't tell this cosmic entity that a planet he already passed by had a redditor city on it."
Sounds better than us finding strand on the streets. Really, us being the first to find strand was a stupid idea.
"Redditor city" lmao
Savathun captures the Traveler towards the very end of story.
@@cehaem2 yeah? That's already established
@@BotFisherman yes, so it could hardly have introduced strand...
The worst part about Lightfall was that the Witness never went “This is your Destiny 2 Lightfall.” I will never forgive Bungie for this.
honestly, the witness shouldve said that and lightfalled all over and then we fought them and said "this is our second destiny"
can't believe he didn't say "it's witnessing time" and didn't witness anyone
What are we, some kinda Destiny 2 Lightfall?
can’t believe he didn’t say “Some content shown requires Season Pass or other additional purchase. Content subject to change.”
These comments are fucking great haha
I remember seeing all the trailers for lightfall thinking “this is going to be crazy if these are the things they’re showing! Imagine what they’re not showing!” Well turns out. They just showed everything before the game was released.
The soy $50 Lightfall DLC revealing everything in the trailer vs the Chad "there is a secret dungeon and entire new destination" $40 Forsaken
@@bofa722I miss when bungie kept hitting us with surprises :(
lightfall had such a huge potential, lets hope final shapes potential is made real
Considering it's basically confirmed that the original lightfall became final shape, I think it'll pay off in the end
Seeing as bungie has one more dlc and hasn’t gotten it right. Shows that they won’t.
You guys never learn your lesson...
@@bannedmann4469 bro witch queen forsaken taken king and rise of iron were all great. Lightfall was such a letdown because it was suppose to be the final shape and lightfall as one. Lightfall was only bad because it was rushed
@Raven those were the best. I play the game for the lore. There were other expansions that were great like beyond like for introducing the darkness power stasis and returning variks. Don’t forget about the 20 seasons which half of them were really good. Lightfall was good too, but not the best
I feel like Elsie/the exo stranger should’ve been part of lightfall’s campaign or at least been the person to be all “we need to go to Neptune!” Instead of Osiris since she has a Pouka, which are found in Neomuna.
Actually surprised he didn't bring this up lol
Bro I forgot she had the Pouka and this make a lot of sense. They couldve scrapped Nimbus altogether and had Osiris and Elsie go to Neonuma and work with Rohan.
It would have also been good sense it was established in beyond light that she was the foremost expert on using darkness energy (stasis) so it would have been much easier to establish her as an expert on strand
That would've been better, because nimbus and osiris kept pushing the guardian to learn strand to the point where they were harming the guardian, but exo stranger actually seems to know what she is talking about instead of "go use strand again, maybe this time you master it"@@ominousromanpillar238
She really just became Ana's sister after beyond light, she made it seem so dark and grim, guardians vs guardians, we got the yay we saved the day! Who's the next villan?
"how did our character know to go to Neptune?!"
Bruh... Last season literally ended with us finding out the veil was on Neptune directly from Rasputin 😅 that would be the obvious place to go once our character starting seeing a bunch of darkness ships zipping off lol
great point, but I guess I'm trying to put it in perspective from a player who only plays the annual release content not the seasonal, my fault on not making that more clear
Evan is showing his low IQ side
@@evanf1997 you're right, I just misunderstood 👍
I got back to playing when lightfall got out after years and i can confidently say that whole story looks like it's written after eating shrooms plus someone lost all the pages regarding what is veil.Witch Queen was masterpiece i loved it and i'm just dissapointed Lightfall wasn't on this level +strand should have been left in witchqueen phhf deepsight rather deepshite
-secure the veil
-why?
-it's important
-why
-idgaf
I had no idea where we learned it, but I'm just returning this season after not playing for a year. Though I think that talks more of how poorly past info is shared about the story of destiny 2. It's up to watching RUclips videos or cutscenes to know what's going on at all. Even adding a sentence about each season on their timeline would be a huge help
I think with strand they wanted to do a poison “spider/insect” theme but there wasn’t enough identity. So they changed it. Proof of this is not only all the spider themes on strand (they literally wanted the warlock super to turn you into a spider laying eggs) but there was a bug where a triumph required unraveling kills but instead of unravel it was called “infested”.
Uh There are Spiders in one of Neptune moons
Not even it was just mainly meant for witch queen, you can tell because the warlock chest piece from throne world literally has the warlock strand subclass symbol, made up of the same worms from parasite(most likely an early concept of threadlings)
The reason they didn't do a poison subclass is because that's what we wanted. So instead they made a completely new subclass that not only broke the game but quite literally took all their attention away from every aspect of the game outside of that subclass.
@Peniley Majorey Can you explain how?
@@naveenkv7175 if they originally wanted a poison subclass it makes sense to make a poison exotic weapon. Even though poison never happened, osteo striga still made sense because of the existence of thorn and necrotic grips
Honestly the part of the final cutscene where your guardian has a dilemma about killing your ghost to stop the witness is a very interesting idea. If the ghost ever dies in the story it’ll be like super dramatic and cliche, or he’ll just get revived somehow. But man, it seems like a real homerun way to create an extremely compelling storybeat.
Reminds me of the time Sakura couldn’t take out madaras rinnegan and doomed everyone
See that would’ve worked in that scene if there wasn’t two characters that could both fly. Like Osiris yells “get your ghost!” And everyone just stands around watching him when it would take two seconds to just go up and grab him.
Hell the story spends its whole runtime hyping up an ability that lets you grab onto stuff and pull you to it only for us to just stare at the ghost as it fucks off.
cayde has yet to be brought back btw.
@Peniley Majorey I honestly would’ve been fine with losing our light subclasses seeing how powerful we got in the DLC before, this time we would have to get used to strand and stasis. And if you look at it, all light subclasses have 3 styles of play I.e 3 different supers. Whereas the darkness subclasses only has 1 each
But your guardian can't kill the ghost without approaching and breaking it with their hands
I think the best part about this is that Ghost and everyone acts like the Witness didn't just take over our Ghost (seriously not even a single line of dialog I've heard post-campaign has referenced this)... and the fact when Rhulk even just tried speaking to one in the past the Traveler spoke through it saying "lol no" and self destructing that poor ghost. Does this mean the Traveler wanted this to happen or was it just bad writing?
It was definitely just bad writing.
@@mr.dr0bot731 I don't want to sound like an apologist for Bungie and how badly they missed with the story of this expansion but I do feel like the Traveler has had sus intentions at best the majority of the time. Could be a bit of both with the majority being due to bad writing.
Definitely just bungo's bad writing
@@exxy9931the traveler is sus as hell don't get me wrong but if that's what Bungie indented I feel like they needed a lot more to lay it out
I loved Witch Queen both story- and gameplaywise. And out of the 4 Seasons, Haunted and Seraph were both pretty good
I liked seraphs gameplay but the story felt like we did nothing. We did all this work rebuilding Rasputin but at the last second he has to destroy himself and we're back at step one
We have repeatedly been shown that the witness and the dark can control our ghost and can talk through the ghost for years.
Yeah but for what tho? Does it matter? No.
@@mr.dr0bot731 Didn't the Witness litterally use our ghost to connect to the Veil ?
And the characters don't think that's a bad thing lol
Why didn't the Guardian use strand to grab their Ghost and pull it away from the Veil? 😒
Veil is mentioned a total of 23 times in the campaign to answer your question
pedro coming in clutch
It's only mention so few times because we already know what it is and don't need to have a conversation about it.
@@evanf1997 i literally came back to the game because a buddy of mine gifted me the expantions for my birthday and i knew how bad lightfall was so i told him "lets play a game where gonna count how many times they talk about The Veil" and if your curious the radial mast is refered to a total of 13 times in the span of 2 missions that of itself is impressive
Thats not a tree in the vision at 9:00 that's just the back half of the veil still my guy. The veil is shown in 3 different frames. Two of the roots, and one of the top portal looking part
I just wish they'd just make cutscenes for all of the seasons with a voice-over explaining the season in detail so people can follow the story much better especially the new lights!
Bro not even new lights i think everyone does not want to have to play the game every week to find out a small part of the story every week in ever season and then forget what happned the season before
@ryanfraser9283 I can't tell if you're dumb or dumb. Where did I say they should make players get a small part of it weekly? All they have to do is add the cutscenes to the timeline... Learn to read, would you?
The Veil and Nefele Stronghold were mentioned in the lore pre-Lightfall and by Rasputin by during Season of the Seraph. Also "Veil" is said 68 times in the campaign and post game. MyelinGames counted.
I could have sworn something relevant to neomuna (the name nefele stronghold? Idk) was mentioned by Rasputin in d1.
Pretty sure the original 'Lightfall' concept is now going to be 'The Final Shape'. I belive what happened was they, as originally announced, planned to go Beyond Light --> Witch Queen --> Lightfall and have Lightfall be the end of the saga, but they realized somewhere along the line they needed more time to do 'Lightfall'.. so they changed its name to Final Shape, and invented a totally new 'side-story' to be in-between, which is the Lightfall we got.
My hope is that this means the 'original Lightfall', aka Final Shape, is going to be really good for getting the extra time to cook. Here's hoping.
Neomuna really feels like a seasonal story IMO.
copium
@@Vilkiy That's what 'here's hoping' means, dude. Chill.
"Paracausal" in Destiny is like "quantum" in every other sci-fi show or movie (looking at you MCU)
i think commendations are a fun thing to have, but it shouldnt have been to unlock guardian ranks.
I think they tried to make what ffxiv does, after an activity you can commend one pople in your party, those commendations unlock just cosmetics and allows you to be a mentor.
Dialogue in the mission where we have to destroy the radial mast and suppression thingies from ghost specifically goes as follows " It's suppresses our powers all our known powers anyway" which is why strand is what we have to use.
Do the travellers shaker
biggest hint of strand being in Witch Queen, is the final fight with Savathun. The Wizards we need to kill are '' Threadweavers'' Bounding the traveler with Green looking strands of webbing.... hmmm where do we see that before..
A perfect explanation of the entire campaign, I agree with almost every point you brought up about the plot and the gameplay format. Hoping for a new start either at final shape or after 🙌🏼
“Meesa called Jar Jar Nimbus, meesa your humble servant, brah”
I've been waiting for someone to talk about what was likely the original timeline. Great video Evan!
Yooo, found a wild toad comment
It’s funny how he came up with a better story Ima time crunch then an entire team could in god knows how long. I love destiny, but man sometimes this game is a mess.
Love ya toad!
Ps. Still wouldnt be savathuns worm on Fundament cause Mara has it, it was The Osmium Kings deaf worm that whispered to Sathona 🤙
Was just running witch queen again and realized you get a buff called thread cutter In the final fight with savathun
Uh... I do not remember any negative sentiment going into Lightfall, the only unpopular Witch queen season was season of Plunder, though I maintain that Haunted was the worst, and Season of the Seraph was peak Destiny, the sentiment going into the expansion seemed almost universally posative, yes, people were bored of the seasonal model, but BUNGIE had promised the structure would be changing, and the whole overdeliverry scandal didn't happen until season of the deep with the state of the game. Destiny was basically at an all time high until lightfall came out.
Also, we knew about Neptune and the Veil before the Witness did, Rasputin told us about it after Spire of the Watcher in season of the Seraph.
I could be wrong 15:13 ish but I don’t think it mentions dark powers specifically, but that it’s resistant to powers they know that we have and they know we have the 3 lights and Stasis but didn’t know about strand.
Yall gotta realize that the writers that wrote Halo are no longer at Bungie. They all left after the D1 rewrites before Vanilla D1 even released
They did name-drop the Veil in the last part of Season of the Seraph, and Osiris already knew there was something on Neptune involving it, telling our Guardian that too. Doesn't make it any less terribly written, but they at least did SOME foreshadowing in the season before.
Alot of the intro part evan got wrong, showing really small amounts of research were made.
damn bro wtf LMAO
Tbf who even played Season of the Seraph, pretty much my entire clan and all my friends stopped playing
@@emilianocastillejos1330 it was revealed right after the final mission and cutscene, I learned about it because I came back for the finale, I quit playing when the season launched lol
@Peniley Majorey amen to that, I got burned out like 3 weeks into Plunder and felt no reason to play Seraph until the finale dropped
This video made me think of something... If Nezarec was resurrected by the Light, does that make him a Guardian? Does that also make The Traveler his Ghost?
Kind of an awkward relationship if that's true 😂
The Veil was mentioned by Rasputin in his final message to us, and was told to Osiris as well. That’s how Osiris knew they were after The Witness and Calus were after the Veil
Ohh that makes so much sense why Osiris were rushing us to reach to The Veil
Somethings about the story that bugged me that could be been improved from a writing perspective:
-This was the first time we’ve met REAL daddy Calus. When we were on the Glykon, Katabasis said Calus looked like “Slop” or “Sludge”. We don’t see that in any sort of Calus flashback or cutscene” but it would’ve helped us understand why he sided with the witness. To get his body back and his desire to no longer rule from the shadows(Daddy Calus Bots) but on the forefront.
-Calus and Kaital having a clash of ideals and mettle has been a hinted to us since the Glykon and the season of the Haunted AND Duality. The fact we don’t see more of them together was a missed Opportunity. Having a cutscene of Father and Daughter having an actual fight. Have him beat her, only because of his Darkness powers and not because of his strength. Have him show remorse she can’t follow him and her desperately trying to appeal to her father who she hates, but still cares for.
-Nimbus’ issue is a lack of proper tone yes, but a cool way to have made more sense of it is having Rohan die in the final mission (saves our ghost and dies as a result) then have that change Nimbus(sy) from a wise cracking teen to a more somber, character who makes occasional jokes and wisecracks but is more cynical and saddened as a result and their jokes reflect that(self burns and sarcastic negativity).
-Osiris was annoying during the campaign. He would’ve been much more enjoyable if rather than being insufferable with him acting as the ‘only smart guy in the room’ he could’ve been in an everpresent state of mourning over Sigira. Have him sad and remorseful throughout the campaign as he sees us interact with our ghost. Then when Rohan dies, Osiris becomes the mentor to Nimbus who is also dealing with loss, and realizes he needs to use his boundless experience in order to mentor the younger generation and others(somehow Moth Mommy Savathun was a better mentor to crow than Osiris had been in general lmaoo)
-Have the loss of the guardians at the intro and Amanda impact the characters more. Have Zavala go to try and Thunder Crash the witness, while Ikora tries no Nova bomb him and the queen harbinger his ass and Crow ‘Golden His Gun’ only for him to shoo them away, not killing them but messing them up. Have the stranger terrified because she’s never seen anything like this happen but knows it’s worse than her Dark Timelines.
-Strand is a power of memory right? Osiris says as much when he’s theorizing .Have our guardian experience memories in the form of hostile negative memories(old vaulted boss battles) and the only way to master it is to also remember the good stuff as well. Have it be something that makes our guardian DEAL with his/her trauma and move on to be stronger over all as a character
-Nezerec is one of my favorite characters in D2 but I think him just giving nightmares to the people of Neomona is outside his scope. He was brought back to life by the traveler. And is being regrown like a Chia Pet in the Witness’ Pyramid. Have his influence of nightmares extend to the last city, the dreaming city(remember that place?), Caital’s Cabal forces as well as Neomona. Rather then jumping onto the pyramid ship and messing cabal up, have the Cabal be locked in a battle against maybe the Lucent Hive since they’re on the tear to kill Neserec because they know Moth Mommy Savathun would want him dead and they also are getting nightmares. Then have a cool mechanic where we in some capacity team up with a lucent raid team to complete an encounter(like have a lucent Hive knight be the send out a buff to us that highlights which planet is dark and which one is light or something like that). Then when we fight our homie Nezerec, have a cutscene of Nezerec getting his golden armor back(like on his statues). And maybe include a mechanic where he throws curated nightmares at us, manifest copies of himself, jumpscare us etc. have him play into being a FINAL GOD OF PAIN.
I’m a writer, working on a few novels at the moment but I’m not trying to say “oh me story better, git gud bungo!” but I feel that few more emotional moments in this story, as well as cutscenes to establish characters and their relationships would go a LONG way. The witness/claus cutsesne was great and I wish we had more like it tbh
This is the best lightfall rewrite I've heard so far. You arent changing, just making it deeper and really just raising the quality.
I love all these ideas, except for the thing about Strand being a way for our Guardian to deal with their own trauma, only because that was kinda the plot of Shadowkeep already. But I wish they'd saved that for mastering Strand instead, like you are suggesting.
yo i think bungie is hiring ppl. Plz apply
Us randomly joining a Lucent Hive Team is silly and fanfictiony. If you really knew Destiny lore, you would know that Savathun will gladly wipe us out, and had her Lucent Hive kill a good dozen Guardians. She says in the Throne World Ship "Our powers may be similar, but our paths are separate." She isnt going to ally with us for the same reason the Warlords did not ally with us.
@@3ndlessL00p I mean, wasn't shadow keep about dealing with collective trauma that scarred everyone who lived through them?
Osiris knew that "the veil" was on neptune due to Rasputin naming it and the coordinates(of neptune) at the end of season of seraph.
Nimbus is also an "angsty late teen/twenty something" that was ahead of their class as far as lore.
Im still enjoying destiny and have more positive things to say than negative but we all have different experiences and limited perspective.
Either way, be kind an respect each others opinions. I don't agree with half of what Ive seen, but this is still a great video so far Evan, if nothing else, people can take away how you see the game.
Keep killin' it dude and stay safe out there and be kind
Well he's got a perspective that is of someone who's does the immediate drop of content, and not the annual pass seasons that go away. It's something I deeply understand perspectively speaking. Fomo is not Evan's thing
@@jesseritchie9282 agreed👍
@@jesseritchie9282 He also made it his job to play/cover the game. He doesn’t experience it like most people because the game is his “9-5”.
Great reply.
tbf they explained why strand is exhausting us -- we're approaching it like stasis, abusing it for maximum power, whereas the idea was to go full bruce lee -- we're not a river, letting it flow through us, we're coercing it to our needs initially
I just got home from a week in the woods. Perfect timing to catch the Evan drop
The Veil + Neptune stuff were talked about earlier in Seraph
Strand was supposed to release with Witch Queen. Resonance, the 3rd Darkness power, was supposed to release with Lightfall. We never got Resonance before the Witness was defeated now, so IDK how the fuck we'll get it, if ever.
You end up on Neomuna because you follow Osiris onto Calus' ship when it starts to depart after the Witness sends him.
Its a shame they went more comic book action as opposed to a grittier take.
The only problem with having the stories revolve around using the darkness subclasses is that you’d need to buy the previous expansions to have access to them
This is the hard thing for me. using the Lost and GoT reference... I probably knew 3 years ago that there would be no true ending to Destiny. We'll probably kill the witness, or it'll leave, or it'll stay and we leave, or we all die... but no matter what, I always knew I was not going to be happy with any possible ending that the Bungie writers come in with. Expectations vs Reality. The bar is already so high (even after all the misses this season) that when we get to the end it'll fall flat. But, and there is always a but.... the game has made itself such a part of my life, that i'm still going to push on to see the end.
Osiris knew the veil was on Neptune because of Savathùn. He also saw Calus’ ships start moving towards it.
I'm still surprised we missed an entire fucking destination on a planet in our solar system when we have NLS drives on our ships
@@bofa722 To be fair, we haven't even explored most of Earth after the Collapse. In lore we know there's other areas that other Guardians have been to, but we ourselves have no real visual explanation of places like the Chicago Exclusion Zone, the Sahara Contested Zone, the Radioactive Exclusion Zone (which I think is another part of Old Russia), and SO much more.
We weren’t going to Neptune on purpose, us and Osiris were following the ships that were leaving the battle, and boarded them. All we knew was we needed to stop whatever the hell Calus was doing
It's almost as if the story we got was never actually planned and the actual content they had planned had to be delayed so they tried to make another dlc before the end without actually knowing what was going to happen or even the theme🤪
The Guardian should've shot Ghost. Rasputin, the chad he was, actually sacrificed himself and virgin Guardian can't even aim steadily at their own Ghost. As we learned during Forsaken, you can't kill Ghosts with regular weapons, so the kinetic energy would likely just have blown Ghost away. Ghost would be alive because of previously explained plot armor, but it seems Bungie forgot about this fact. Lightflaw moment
Let's hope that lightfall tripped so final shape could run a marathon
I appreciate your story arc continuing with the forsaken model of characters you have to knock off to get something. Nice touch!
One of the things that drove me away from Destiny was the constant feeling of losing progress due to the seasonal light model. It never felt like my account was truly growing...
Seasons are the biggest issue with destiny in my opinion
what about seasonal events like the lost or dawning
@@iamstupid-lp1tv those are fine as they are almost like a tradition. But the season system is flawed and will never be great
@@scammer9348 seasons ruined gaming in general
@@ciguret they work for brs way better tho
Ghost, looking at the Radial Mast: "Look what they have to do to mimic a fraction of our power."
Congratulations. They need to hire you for a story director. I’m not even joking. Your fan made one feels like an actual cohesive story.
His wage will be $4/hr
Destiny fans: “Lightfall looks so grey I can’t wait to fight evil in a new darker tone with a serious main villain.”
Bungie: NEON LIGHT SPIDER-MAN WITH 9 FT TALL GENDERLESS CLOWN
You had a misunderstanding, they explain in the story that the radial mast is built to suppress all stuff we have avaible, strand works on it because the witness and Calus didn’t know about it
Also, the whole thing with the Ishtar collective is pretty straightforward. The entirety of the dungeon spire of the watcher is all about how neomuna came to be or at least part of that story and how the Ishtar collective is involved. The lore is really good. You should read it and season of seraph with the nafele stronghold also explains this
I just noticed that in the scene where the witness is in his pyramid he passes nezarec
Statue
No people, but it has food production, gyms, bars, arcades, but no people, Neomuna makes no sense.
"You guys are great at making the game part, save the story for the show not the game" and they were great at making the story part too, there's nothing wrong having both.
People keep saying “they think” strand was for witch queen. Well it was it’s a known fact Bungie literally said it was and it was pushed out for another light 3.0 rework.
The 33% rating is hilarious because Eris Morn made a reference to hermeticism in the first sever mission from Season of the Haunted. I’m the only one I’ve seen so far to have caught that since “As above, so below” is sussy mystic occult lingo to which most people would never be privy otherwise, but for whoever wrote that line, I’m sure it spun like poetry. It seems like they’ve been waiting until recently to start inserting their renditions of ancient symbols in occlusion, but there are probably way more that we all overlooked in everything up to now. The problem they’re facing is how to make it significant enough to help people understand the story better, and that entirely comes down to the fact that the writing needs improvement.
The Witness making the ☀️ shape with the Traveler, for example, is very on the nose, but to make people think twice about that, it needs to be illustrated more, because there’s a symbolic reason that we draw 8 triangles around a circle to represent the Sun or an octagram to represent Venus/Ishtar/“The Morning Star” that could easily be tied into the story, having more relevance than in name alone, with just a little more effort.
Another one I noticed: in the first cutscene the Witness uses its left hand to wipe out the Guardians and find the Veil, but in the last cutscene it uses its right hand to triangulate the Traveler, all while the leitmotif “The Path (Luna)” from the Music of the Spheres plays over what sounds like the Traveler screaming. It’s space magick. If the visuals, music, and dialogue aren’t doing more than just some obscure reference to explain its significance to the story, then it should be further elaborated upon with less contrived, more intuitive writing.
I’ve always hated the seasonal model and I’m hating it even more now. The game is crumbling. I’ve gotten kicked from the game around 75 times since lightfall. Sometimes it even crashes my console. I don’t even get error codes. They need to start making sure stuff works before just jamming it into the game
9:28 Rasputin actually told us about Neptune, Neomuna, and the Veil at the end of Season of the Seraph, and Osiris had been having visions about Neomuna ever since he returned to us at the end of Season of Plunder
I'm never this early. Not even for my job😂
Sure someone has already commented this but no the ability surpressing feilds block our known abilitys strand was not known by big man but Staiss was
You gave goosebumps this entire video, awesome video and story format
I like almost everything in your rewrite except for the bosses. I believe Xivu, Nezarec, and even Calus deserve their own bigger spotlight than just 1st, 2nd or 3rd encounter of a raid.
according to leaks calus wasnt even meant to make it past witch queen. he was supposed to die in haunted, but they needed a villain for lightfall after they split it in two.
6:35 Ive never seen something compared so perfectly before
Love the story idea you came up with. It sounds like it would have been amazing
Not gunna lie, that borderlands soundtrack in the background is really fitting for some reason.
I beat the story n asking myself did they just chopped the expansion into pieces of smaller expansion and..... again?
Good thing i wait for the discount to 75 buck in PSN to get just a month later
I started playing D2 last month, and I've played through the Witch Queen campaign, the Lightfall campaign, and just in the last couple of days, the Beyond Light campaign. I'm super new to the universe, and I'm just along for the ride at this point as a newbie. I don't have the last 8 or 9 years that some have, and I don't expect myself to be on the same level as my friend, who's been with Destiny since the beginning. The poor man has scraped my pixels off the ground more times than we can count, but the environments and the new challenges have been fun for me.
In any case, I appreciate your review as an experienced player in the Destiny universe. Your points make sense and I get the frustration of gameplay vs story (I played WoW for a decade, I get it 😅). I can only hope that the writing pulls through from here on in and that find a cohesive conclusion leading into the Final Shape.
Im pretty sure that the original idea of Lightfall was scrapped, leading the devs to rush creating the current story. Thats why it felt so unfinished. Because it is unfinished.
It's not it's for Final Shape
your imagined lightfall/story is so much better then what we got and now i wish this would've been the story
My favorite part of your lightfall story is when the witness says “it’s witnessing time” and witnesses all over the place.
@penileymajorey7174 you seem fun at parties
This may be an unpopular opinion. But Season of the Haunted had more content than Season of the Defiance and they really could have given us more stuff. The Castellum got boring after a bit, but the story missions felt like a story mission. Not a back and forth fetch quest.
your story sounds a million times better than what we got
LF was announced before BL came out, TFS almost a year later. Nothing was "rushed".
If you agree with this video, you didn’t pay attention to the story
Question now is whether anyone here cares for the story or just wants big explosions and epic battles. Not to mention how, bland Evan's rewrite for witch queen feels (finch being a double agent just isn't as interesting as someone who's realized that they fucked up and is trying to fix what they've done in whatever way possible)
The design of Neomuna is completely nonsensical. Nobody would ever design and live in a city like that. For one, the roads are narrow planks suspended above bottomless pits of death with speed bumps to knock you off the road to your death.
Bro it's a little weird how many little (but very obvious) details you miss or get wrong about not only this DLC but Destiny as a whole. Given how long you've played this game and how long the DLC has been out for now, I really don't get it.
Lightfall itself was decent. It wasn't amazing but it wasn't bad. The writing and plot was kinda mediocre and the raid is a meh... but everything else that came with it has been amazing. Strand feels incredible, except titan because we got shafted on that super, I know its strong but its the super for the 4th or 5th time. The QoL changes are great. The neomuna weapons are good, the armor is good. The destination itself is amazing. The Vex partition missions are some of the best missions ever. The "secret" exotic quest is super fun. The new strike is good. Its just insane to me that people took the writing, the only bad part, and rated the whole expansion just off that and they didn't look at anything else.
Also I prefer to judge based on seasonal content meshing with the expansion more than just the expansion. Like Witch Queen should be S or A tier but the seasonal content dropped it down to like a C or D for me. We had 1 good season with WQ and that was the shortest season with season 19. So far season 20 has been pretty good. A little short story wise but still good. Root of Nightmares is a decent raid... Its nice to have a very simple raid to take new players through. Granted DSC, KF, and VoG are also easy for new players but RoN is very beginner friendly. But like half the raid is spent traversing from one encounter to the next. It really feels like they took a dungeon and stretched it out, literally. The explicator encounter is really cool though but I wish we got the leaked boss instead of the cabal guy. But the loot from RoN is just not that great. If you compare it to Vow, Vow is amazing. Vow doesn't have a single bad weapon. Its actually kinda crazy that the vow raid exotic might be the worst weapon from that raid. The glaive and deliverance could be argued to be bad but when the raid came out the raid exotic was by far the worst weapon. Now its good, but I hate that you basically have to buy an ornament to use it.
Anyways back to Lightfall itself, yes the expansion should not have cost $100. $70-80 would be more fair. But the player rating or whatever is just because people jumped on the hate bandwagon instead of forming their own opinions. I get that lots of people dont like it but I think most people have come around to saying its like a C tier. And thats where I would put it for now. Like I said earlier if the seasonal content is as good as Beyond Lights seasonal content was then Lightfall will become a B or maybe even an A tier.
It’s crazy how D1 black garden era writing is better than Lightfall
People saying "let's hope The Final Shape gets it right" bruh cmon get off the copium
I want to point out we don’t know we have to go to Neptune. Osiris does thanks to Season of the Seraph. we also don’t “just bump into Osiris on his own mission” the opening cutscene and opening missions dialogue we go to help/protect him
Dude, this is a really good rewrite. Love the storyflow.
I don’t understand how I still play this game. I hated all 4000 hours I put into this game
To be clear, the radial mast is better explained than you give it credit for, no it does not suppress light, that is the little boxes shown off in the second mission.
The radial mast is a connector that uses both light and dark and was supposed to link up with the veil, but since we destroyed it, the witness just used our ghost instead. His primary plan was to link it, and then destroy the veil therefore blocking himself in with no way of coming after him. But he also got us to see his transmission just in case so he could play both us and calus by having us duke it out pointlessly for his gain.
You also have neglected to realize something crucial about stasis, its tied to a dlc. The problem with this is that not everyone has stasis.
Say for a moment that someone jumps into destiny and this version of witchy lightfall is what you present. Stasis is shown very clearly but then, as a new light with only three subclass options working on getting strand you go “wait why don’t I have access to that?” Suddenly you’ll be actually fairly pissed because they are acting like you have something you don’t. Also, stasis doesn’t TOTALLY need to be mentioned anyways, in the campaign as it is now, Osiris simply says these suppression thingies are tuned around the abilties that calus knows you have, which can include stasis btw.
The stuff about the radial mast isn’t hinted at or explained except for the function. I didn’t know it was meant to lock the door behind him. However I will say this video doesn’t really explore the issues with Lightfall and neglects other details
Can someone please explain why people don’t understand what they did with the veil. To me it makes total sense. From our character and everyone else we know nothing about the veil. Why do people think that bam we know everything all go a sudden. No we don’t know the veil. And bungie did say we would be a pawn. And the witness played us hard to get us into the veil. Since if the witness left the traveler the traveler would have escaped. So the next best pawn was us. And we lost. I see no issues in the story plot wise. Characters were meh tho. Please tell me I’m wrong. I’m waiting
I really hope that if we end up getting a new subclass at all in the final shape, i hope its not just another darkness subclass. I'm hoping for like a brand new light subclass thats like a crazy mix of all of our current ones. Or a mix of light and dark to make us masters of everything we've faced before
4 Light, 2 Dark? Cmon, you know that's silly.
@@NitroNinja324 not really. In the end the guardians embody light. It is what we're made of and it's what we command to hold back our enemies. I feel like it would be a cool story point and just a nice thing to have our final added subclass be a powerful light subclass to stop the witness. I don't really care about having even amounts of both light and dark.
@isaiahv9251 I'm so glad you don't work at Bungie because I'd never forgive them if they did that. Give me my 3 and 3 any day of the week.
no, just no.
So you just want the same subclasses we already have? Genius.
"witch queen was bad for destiny"
"people hated Cayde"
"Evan has hair"
i understand lightfall was ass but all his cap to justify it is just wrong
the more you think about strand in witch queen, the more you realize that strand belonged to witch queen
I don’t understand why people keep saying this like we don’t already know strand was for witch queen. Bungie literally said it was and it was pushed out for a light 3.0 rework instead.
The whole part about light and dark doesn't work given not everyone owns witch queen and beyond light.
Guardian ranks don't work for the same reason. I'm stuck at level 7 because I didn't spend £20 on the witch queen dungeon key.
The bring back sunsetting thing also feels a bit excessive.
Honestly this video is so poorly researched and filled with personal bias presented as community consensus that it honestly feels like it was only made to capitalize on the disappointment and frustration that the community has towards Bungie.
The game isn’t in a good state and it hasn’t been for a while, but if you’re going to criticize something at least make sure you know what you’re talking about.
Savathuns throne world looks pretty nature esque as well swinging on what looks like magic vines would make more sense here too
Lightfall was definitely written by the same cw writers who work on the flash
I think they should have killed Nimbus, instead of Rohan. They gave us the young idealist who needs to step up and be ready for the future. I think the grizzled old veteran sad that the young idealist died, would have been a much more compelling story.
the sad part is bungie with all its finacial backing came up with a story that a primary school child could write better
Firstly, we learned about Neptune from the data Rasputin found on Nefeele Stronghold that he left to Osiris as a 'dying' gift. Secondly, I'm pretty sure it's mentioned that Rohan and co intercepted a transmission about the cabal moving something called the Radial Mast and that's how we learn about its existence, ghost latter reacts strangely when it can sense light from deep in Calus' ship. Thirdly, the generators are the objects that protect a field to suppress our abilities, not just our Light but all of our abilities that the Witness knows of, hence why only Strand works as we're the first to discover and wield it, Stasis is blocked due to the Witness knowing we have it as it gifted us with the ability to wield it. While I'm in no way trying to defend the absolute ball-drop that was Lightfall's campaign, I just feel fair judgement is a must. Your rewrite, I do thoroughly enjoy the idea of us systematically dismantling the Witness' army and Disciplines one by one gaining power as we do so, so yeah.. nicely done.
I wish I could go to the timeline where Bungie release the original idea for the dlc
The only mention of the veil before Lightfall was on a text screen from the end of the previous season. It was literally just a wall of text that most people skipped or at most skimmed to get the quest done. It was a post mortem message from Rasputin, with no indication it was going to be THE McGuffin from next DLC.