Is Porn Dangerous?
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2010
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WHY IS THIS SO CORRECT!?
You guys are so insanely level headed it's awesome.
Fight those practices? They WILLINGLY engage in these acts! No one is FORCING these ADULTS to do anything! My god, have we gone so insane with anger that logic becomes the first victim?
I never used to be a big fan of yours, but I've discovered that how much I agree with you guys is really hit and miss. And lately, there's been a lot more hits. Kudos, keep doing a good show.
Good debate, good points....finally, a good show. Happy new Year!
Well said!
4:14
What an awesome point by Cenk! It's great to hear him finally not cater to women whining about the consequences of their own personal choices.
Love Cenk's reaction at 3:05
well said!
LOL at the censored subtitles. "The dark side of point?"
Hmm I like how these guys on this show always have really good unbiased logical opinions which they can articulate well
I like how they zoom in on Cenks reaction @ 2:48 LOL!
While banning may or may not take her position out of scope since she was saying "hijacking," I think the areas of mutuality and fairness are things to consider in porn. Despite a few comments I heard on this thread/discussion, I argue that consent is not enough since porn actresses may not know the serious risks involved and equal information, their rights, or be coerced. There are many contracts in many industries that have illegal provisions and unfair agreements, and ,for me, I can image porn being darker about this sort of things. Porn owners should be held accountable for certain health areas and the welfare of their workers.
YES. I think it is good there is awareness to the negatives sides of pornography and yes I encourage that the best support structure is put in place.
Just like with any industry that involves risk and hazards to a persons health education, awareness and regulations are needed including assistance, support and of course choice.
It will of course cost money for those involved but it is good that you want to invest it in your actors(acting has gotten better) and support staff.
If a majority of the audience is put off by seeing malnourished, bleeding and infected actors or hearing horrific things happening behind the scenes then it's not good for the industry as a whole.
It is an Adult industry for adults so we must be adult about it.
@nickrd182 Or the enjoyment that comes from realizing "I am not in pain", "I actually feel pretty good". Or the enjoyment of remembering who you are, where you have been and who your loved ones are. An enjoyable life looms all around you, but you take it for granted and pursue these self-destructive habits which will ultimately take your life away and deprive you of even the simplest pleasures. And this is all my message is; life is here, now and it is good. Enjoy it, you don't need sex or drugs
I remember a simpler time when ATM meant 'at the moment'.
@dxcell1 What research are you talking about? The first study I found was a "study on the relationship between porn and sex crimes concludes that when the availability of pornography increases, the rate of sex crimes either stays static or decreases." So, either you think sex crimes is a good thing or you are incorrect.
@adler2adler Most research in any kind of science is mostly correlational. Self-report surveys aren't the most empirically sound methods for collecting data, however to claim that sociologists "rely" on them is a stretch. They use a wide variety of other data-collecting methods that are more sound, but you'll never find a sociologist or a psychologist that claims a complete cause-and-effect relationship between any two variables.
Yeah! I cought myself several times thinking the same: "she will get an infection" "that's not healthy" never thought that someone else would think about it too XD
Cenk's face @ 2:48 is priceless.
Adult Porn isn't a problem, some people may abuse it or whatever. Thats the case with pretty much everything. Child Pornography is what im worried about, it should be a mandatory death sentence to be in possession of.
"The individual makes a clear effort to define moral values and principles that have validity and application apart from the authority of the groups of persons holding them and apart from the individual's own identification with the group. "
Lawrence Kohlberg
omg its soooo true. i need to read that book
I love how cenk is like " YEEAAA"
I think the issue that this raises is that porn has the power to change sexual appetites and when those appetites are influenced by porn to be more violent, more dominant, more abusive, and very certainly less interested in whether or not the woman is actually getting pleasure out of the encounter, this does have implications for sexual expectations in the real world. Is it surprising to think that someone who consumes a lot of porn showing sexual violence would be more likely to commit acts of sexual violence? And are sexual acts of violence rare enough that that extreme doesn't matter too much to people as a whole? Well when 1/5 of women experience sexual assault, the answer is no. I am not advocating for porn to be banned but I think this is a really important conversation to have, we need to think about what porn does to us.
How many guys watch hardcore porn? All of us !!!! Watching Porn doesn't make you want to sexually assault a woman thats ridiculous. ...and your question about what porn does to us... hmmmmm it gets people off. Now their is some fucked up porn out there but you have to realize the females AGREE they sign papers and know and are FULLY AWARE of what they are doing
Ryan Choate
I keep seeing this "they agree to it" in these comments. Do they? It is true they have contracts but what is in the contract? Has anyone outside the industry seen how these contracts are worded? Do the women read and understand what the contracts mean? at the same time they agree is there also manipulation and worse possible corrosion going on by the porn producers? And what about non contract grey area porn, non Hollywood porn, overseas porn?
I'm not some anti-porn christian by any standard but there are legitimate questions that need to be asked I've only listed a few. I don't believe we should run some rough shod crusade against the porn industry but we need to be open minded consideration towards porn workers. their agreement shouldn't be a stand alone position of tough shit you agreed so we don't care about you.
@Euvari good point.
@Rybot9000 The universe is not an absolute numerical one, as opposed to two universes. The term universe actually refers to a singularity, a uni-fied tra-verse. It is simultaneously singular and plural. Plurality is manifest in the physical appearances, as presented to our senses, the singularity is maintained by the necessity of logic, of contiguity. For one object to interact with another, there must be some mode of operation which effectively binds the two objects together into one system
1:19 YEAHH! lmfao
Sometimes cheating causes you to get caught and ruins your relationship, should we ban cheating?
Ermmmm we kind of do... It's called Marriage.. If you cheat while Married that is a reason for Divorce which may result in leaving the wife with half your stuff...
johnboy96 That also sort of doesn't matter either since divorce can be no-fault now therefore divorce doesn't need reason.
Nolan Hutain I don't know the full terms of marriage because i'm not married and it doesn't interest me..
The only reason i'd get married is if a girl made me lol....
But it's embarrassing with all your family there and all that... all attention on you... I don't why people bother... especially when they're not religious.... We know we love each other why do we need to get married...
You get me?
Marriage obligations have no teeth in it anymore. Marriage overall is in decline on a national level. I made the comment to point-out there is no accountability in marriage which encouraged people away from it. Divorce court is a money maker and an economy of its own, which should tell people something about the institution of marriage.
It goes to show that what is legal may not be moral
Love Cenks facial expressions through this video.. classic.
@adavidpirtle It has to be a serious injury (tramautizing (sp?) or a threat to your life... a bad back qualifies as neither of those). (will post more as soon as I get the words in the correct order in my head... I have a longer reply but suck at wording stuff)
The problem with the porn industry is that viewers associate as observers, not participants, so they do not feel responsible for the actions taking place.Perhaps regulating prostitution could diminish some of the ill effects of porn. Participants would be responsible for their own health, workers could establish their own terms, and if workers decided to retire they could. Whereas in porn, "stars" are never free of evidence, the health of the workers is unknown and fetishes become mainstream.
@nickrd182 I may sound like an old man trying to talk sense into a teenager, but the fact is I'm only 29 and already feeling these effects. I don't know how old you are, but don't think you ever escape the consequences, you may only postpone them. In addition to all of the stomach related problems, STD and the like, I am suffering a decline of memory from the consumption of pot. I've also developed a mild form of visual psychosis known as "visual snow" which can lead to other forms of psychosis
Also another major side-effect of binge drinking is Korsakoff's Syndrome which consists of anterograde and retrograde amnesia. Makes your life a living hell.
@Solareffects ROFL!!! thats a good one! haha
1 thing she forgets to mention is that in many countries like the UK the porn that she goes on about is banned and you can get 2 years in prison for possessing it on ur pc.
You never go ATM!!!!!!!!!
"Goody Two-pants" is now a meme.
How did this become an interview?
@Rybot9000 Let's put it this way; When pavlov rang a bell for his dog before feeding him, the cells that represented the ringing of the bell activated in contiguity with the cells that activate with the appearance of food, such that, the cells representing the bell and the cells representing the food became metabolically linked and whenever one of the cells fired the other would fire such that the dog would anticipate food upon hearing the bell. This is how the brain is configured.
'yeahhh!!' *shrug*
@waaagghh I agree about the lack of casual relationship. Even the researchers themselves admit it, however I would not discard their research completely.
I myself believe that biological predisposition to aggression is much more important factor, however I'm not an expert on the subject and I can't claim anything with the 100% certainty. I just threw this in as an addendum to my original point since the guy to whose comment I responded mentioned it.
its true , with a degree of tongue in cheek thrown in. there are times when porn
may seem a more desireable pasttime than actual human contact. but studies
also indicate too much internet connectiveness can lead to loneliness and
depression. people learn that too much is --too much. and they stop.
@Rybot9000 Its the same thing that causes heart-attacks in heroin addicts and alchoholics, if you understand the processes. It is closely related to operand and classical conditioning, and Pavlov's Dog. But on a more concrete biological level, the cells actually undergo a "metabolic change that increases the potential for co-activation." The metabolic process is known as Long-Term Potentiation. And sorry Cenk, its not just some people, we all have brains, well, most of us.
@j0hnwi11iams Such that, both aspects of a duality, say black and white, up and down, left and right, inside and outside, etc... all of these things are polar opposites in a duality which is integrated into something which is non-dual. Or, using negative dialectic we can arrive at the synthesis too. The same applies to mind versus matter. There is no separation between the two, they are dual faces of the same non-dualistic substance. Sometimes this position is given as neutral monism.
lmfao cenk's face at 2:40 2:50
@ 2:53 Ana said "ass-to-mouth". lol
1:22 I'm not sure I agree with that.
1:50 The ineffectiveness of banning it, and the ethics of banning it are seperate. The question if "if we knew a way to ban it more effectively, should we?" remains.
3:00 I agree that standards need to improve within the porn industry to help reduce exploitation and adverse health effects, but I don't see that as grounds for "porn is bad, stop watching porn" arguments.
@adavidpirtle I never said anything about murdered. The cultural relativism is about WHEN does a child become an adult. In some countries it's 18, some 16, parts of Africa are 13. They are legally adults in their country but minors here. Should we allow a sex tape of 2 or more 13 yr old Africans (in Africa) to be legal in the US because, by their countries definition, they are legally an adult (and thus can willingly consent to anything (basicially what you have said :) ))?
Education is important. For instance, if you do ATM, there is a 1% chance you will get a bacterial infection (made up number). Proliferate that information. But every actor has his/her "no" lists of things they won't do. Some women are comfortable with being choked, but they won't do ATM. And, of course, they make more money doing ATM. Those that choose to do it should be allowed without new government regulations.
The slippery slope argument rarely works and not surprisingly, it fails here.
@Rybot9000 "Principles of higher ethics" seems like an illusory paradigm, but its all really based on one objective fact; contiguity. Though the term may be disputed in some forms, it remains a unifying quality of the physical world, enough so that scientists have written books about it. Contiguity simply means in temporal and spatial proximity, such that the appearance of one predicts the appearance of another. Under this unifying law, all things, including humans are bound into one universe.
I loled @ title.
"Desensitization" is nonsense. The only reason porn is supposedly more hardcore on average than it used to be is because the people who are into hardcore stuff have always existed and now that segment of the market is being tapped into.
This is the same as the idea that playing violent video games desensitizes people to violence. It simply doesn't mesh with reality.
@Hardtongue FUCK, that was hilarious man
Oh jesus christ. o__o; That was one crazy-ass list.
@nickrd182 Actually, when you consume alcohol the brain compensates for it by the downregulation of neurchemicals which the alcohol serves the role of. The brain learns to compensate for the alcohol through this down-regulation requiring greater quantities to attain the same high. This effect applies to everything and is a solid formal neuroscientific theory. Then again, you can just deny that for the hell of it, and because it justifies your desires and behavior.
@CyborgNinja7 And why can't I use it for my arguments? Do you own it or something? Or you think you have a license on its use and i don't? Or because i interpret it differently?
It is actually the Bible which says the Lord God is One. And the word "One" is translated from Hebrew "Echad" which means unified-integrated whole, just as I was saying. I guess you think the scripture was written in English and has never been translated or modified to suit English. Also check out; Gamalah and Almah.
I think the criticism in the book is not that violent or gross porn is a new thing, or that we should ban it entirely, it's that it's so prevalent in our society that it's causing problems. Kids (boys and girls) see it from a young age and they think that's how sex is supposed to be. And after seeing all this extreme stuff, actual sex with a regular human seems boring.
This type of porn develops in men an appetite for sex acts that most women find distasteful. That is not a recipe for successful long-term relationships.
I think the point of Dines's book, Pornland, is more to do with the adverse consequences on relationships of those who consume it, be it directly or indirectly.
@NoJamOnYourBread I wish I could still get off to horses. It's so hard to find vore scat videos with eels.
Cenk is a genius. I love his analogies and views.
If porn is dangerous, my computer is a nuclear bomb.
"Goodie Two-Pants" rules!
The subtitles are hilariously wrong.
first of all: OF COURSEEE!
My favorite part.
I like Cenk's closing point. I'd like to add that I think it's rather absurd that when forms of entertainment go stale the tendency is to go straight for shock factors. We saw it with other film and television genres, of course it would happen with pornography. It's lack of imagination that causes the decrease in quality NOT porn itself.
@MajorCroom
I agree. However, if someone chooses to do it then it's their bad luck if they get sick from it.
@keggerous very true said!
Note the news network name is dangerously close to " T I T "
Cenk brings up a good point. This wouldn't even be an issue if it wasn't for the fact that something bad was happening to a woman. Last time I checked, nearly every job in the history of the world caused you to have to sacrifice your body in order to be worth a damn. it's sad, but true.
@adavidpirtle I still don't see where you said that (sry). Can you point that out in case I missed it (lots of posts on here from us). Either way this side tangent on here wasn't really part of the main argument and it diverged from 1.) a misunderstanding and 2.) a bad phrasing of words for both of us. There was no defeat here for either of us as we had the same point to begin w/ and conceded to agree to agree (after making ourselves clear).
@Rybot9000
not totally true.... there's a limit for me.... then if I get bored of porn or get too busy then I stop for a week or 2 ... then im sensitized again
When you make porn legal and transparent - sex workers in porn get to have full rights, where they can object to anything and choose what they want to do on camera. If you drive it underground - then there will be abuses, no STI checks, etc.
@adavidpirtle 2.) There are things that are to violent to be legally allowed (i.e. hangings, firing squads, waterboarding (when on US territory but not in US) etc.).
I don't think of it as cheapening the word when that honestly is what is happening. Nobody should be insulted if I use rape in the meaning of what they were talking about in the video (as the rape victims most likely never had repercusions (sp?) as bad as THOSE.) It's agreeing to sex, then being raped - for all intensent purposes.
@Grindermetalhead And there are studies which confirm that violent video games negatively affect the level of aggressiveness in children.
2:54 Ana: "Because you have something called ass to mouith"
*Facepalm* lol
@nina090991 Oh please, that's the worst excuse ever.
"If you dont want to be shot, dont provide abortions"
"If you don't want to be verbally harassed dont work at mcdonalds"
Alcohol is legal because the tax revenues are huge. The fact is - and this is well documented - that alcohol and tobacco are legal and they cause more harm financially, emotionally, and physically than ALL ILLEGAL DRUGS combined.
In contrast, they will not legalize pot because hemp (which has no drug value) can replace trees, for cotton, and building materials, as well as replace petroleum to make plastic products and thousands of other products. I don't use pot by the way.
Ive been saying this all along and as a person thats been promiscuous, I can honestly say that the number of male partners Ive had that assume because they saw it on porn, it's totally safe/ok is astounding. Does this mean porn should be censored? No. This means that people who watch porn need to educate themselves about sex.... beyond porn. If they watch too much porn, yes, they can become desensitized and yes, it can and does put unrealistic standards on real women in real sexual situations.
Clearly things like murder, theft, assault, cocaine, Rape, are bad things that harm a society as a whole. But even though those things are illegal, the people who really want to do them continue to find ways to do it. So should porn be illegal and left to the black market? Clearly. It has no positives from a universal point of view.
You guys should of put a disclaimer up at 2:40. I was eating x_x
2:40 .... best part ever
@Rybot9000 But my point was that my desire for MORE alcohol has not changed in the past 5 years, I always know when to stop and binging more and more does not in any way shape or form increase my desire to binge even MORE often. It is an absurd idea. My desire to binge remains the same every day. But this is coming from someone who is not an exception, and just has an altogether addictive personality.
Thanks for feeding the beast, TheGiantRobot. I hope you find solace in spreading stereotypes and blatantly false information.
People who become "desensitized" to porn are people who have a pre-existing emotional problem. They could have had the same result with gambling, for instance. Porn just happened to be their "addiction."
@Rybot9000 A bullet with 1000 less times the amount of gunpowder to the head would be in moderation and would be essentially harmless. I'll extend the hypothetical situation as far as you ask for. My statement still stands, everything in moderation is essentially harmless.
I hit myself in the eye when I was younger
"goody two pants" lol
These women know what they're getting into when they do it. I hate people trying to control people. If an NFL player gets paralyzed while playing, you can't blame the sport of football for it people know what they're getting into.
@Redbloodedsky Uh, are you confusing "publically-provided" for "legal"? Legal means you are allowed to do it, which is how it already is in California and many European countries. It's really the most mild thing to ask for.
sometimes in the heat of the moment its forgivable to go ass to mouth.
I think if an actress gets injured or sick on a porn shoot the company should pay for it
porn is disturbing in that it perpetuates the cultural idea that sex and violence are somehow linked, and what's more, that that is right and good.
the word 'fuck' is really amazing because it's all of patriarchy condensed to four letters. it's really, really twisted that the same word that means 'make love to' also means 'do great violence to.'
dude: "look no one is in favor of gonorrhea in the eye"
girl: "that stuff's so awful"
guess who used to have gonorrhea in the eye?
@Rybot9000 I hope I'm explaining this well enough because it is tricky and I've tried explaining it here before. Not surprisingly the human mind overlooks that which it doesn't want to see. A better explanation may be obtained from the classic book "The Organization of Behavior" by Donald Hebb, or by a study of neuropsychology. None of this stuff is new, but probably about 100 years old. The truth dates before Plato in philosophy. But physical scientific theories are about 100 years old.
I know we're never going to take this away. But I do believe after hearing this that we need to at least have something down for the protection or safety of the women.
From 2:40 to 3:04 I thought I was watching "The Aristocrats."
There's a clear limit in porn, and I think that we should go with what Cenk said. Inspect the actors for diseases and make sure that they're not hurting themselves to an extent were it's severe.