efrain, if you liked crisis of conscience, Franz's " in Search of Christian Freedom" will blow you away-an exceptionally spiritual book written with love.
@GZS the scriptures are not proof to me . You can quote all day long but it does no good for someone who already knows them & how contradictory the whole thing is. To each his own.
When I left a Voicemail asking, "How Can I Do Research Without Using Apostate Material?" If was from when I was first waking up and terrified. A video like this is exactly what I had in mind.
@GZS Genuine question: How does one determine that the source mentioned (the bible) is reliable? I ask because there are thousands of religions in this world, all of which claim that their own holy book is true and that all others are false. So I want to learn the methodology for determining which of these books is true.
@@daniloleite5251 Thanks. Lloyd has helped me with the indoctrination a whole lot. Plus, when he provides references, I get to look it up on my own. It is something I enjoy doing.
@@daniloleite5251 quite possible, and often the case (re: robot). But I like practicing reaching out with cordial curiosity, and on a few occasions I've had productive dialogs, which is gratifying.
@GZS I'm a believer but it might be a wee bit different but yes I am a believer maybe in the matrix or something I got to read your comment later it's too long I'll get back to you on that.
2:51 1)Wikipedia 13:51 2)The Australian Royal Commission 18:02 3)Documentaries/Series about other cults 26:08 4)Books by Cult Experts 31:45 5)Investigative Journalism Articles 37:02 6)Books on the Bible and Bible archeology 43:42 7)Atheist Literature
I remember the first time I went to your channel. I was literally shaking and terrified. Your the first person to wake me up. Great video to help others Lloyd.
This reminds me of what I read in a preview of a movie about the Rwandan genocide. it reads in part and i quote: "As the country became a slaughterhouse, mosques became places of refuge where Muslims and Christians, Hutus and Tutsis came together to protect each other. KINYARWANDA is based on true accounts from survivors who took refuge at the Grand Mosque of Kigali and the madrassa of Nyanza. It recounts how the Imams opened the doors of the mosques to give refuge to the Tutsi and those Hutu who refused to participate in the killing," end of quote. As a JW at that time, I was taught that ONLY JWS were peaceful and helpful in Rwanda during the Genocide. It was and is still a Lie and dangerous propaganda. Neutral literature indeed helps to diffuse the watchtower propaganda.
Thanks for the plug! The channel was indeed created to be completely neutral, and it will stay that way. I am actually considering updating it in various ways to make the ARC more accessible in the future.
Thank you @Jakke Control, for your great quality footage that has no commentary. I followed along with the transcripts. Your footage has no comparison for quality. Thank you, for making it so easily accessible. 🍻
I am literally writing these down to start trying to really wake up my significant other. Lloyd I can’t thank you enough for all your videos. Much love 💗
Lloyd’s suggestion at 18:18 reminds me of a superb series here on YT, that Lloyd pointed towards in one of his earlier videos. Called ‘My LDS Journey’ by ‘askreality’, it’s a short series that takes a sensitive approach towards a Mormon’s own personal awakening, and though not without reference to witnesses, (as a reverse argument of this comparison) it illustrates significant similarities, and is plausibly a neutral testimony. A JW would embrace the idea of a Mormon ‘waking up’, so may entertain watching. Excellent viewing for anyone.
Thank you for this video, very helpful. I’ve watched this video twice because this topic is very important to me. I have over the last 2 years taken in all the content that I can (RUclips videos, books, and documentaries on exjws, excult members, and cult experts) to deprogram myself and I have taken advantage of a lot of what Lloyd suggests here. I have been able to share a lot with my husband although he is very uninterested in looking at most of it. I will be checking out the remaining suggestions that I haven’t looked into yet!
Than you Lloyd! I'm an ex JW and I want my JW family to wake up but didn't know how to go about that. Thanks again Lloyd for this video this has been helpful.
Thank you, Lloyd I really appreciate your valuable time for research! Oh and yes, I really miss Hitch and his brilliant take on reality..."though not yet beheld"!
May I just add The Naked Archeologist series.. This was amazing in looking into the intimate and detailed aspects of life in ancient Judah, Israel with a touch of good down to earth Jewish humour. Also, the YaleCourses RUclips channel on a series of lectures on the Bible, analysing history and literary styles.
Hi Lloyd, love your work. Having tried to discuss with my mother for many years, I will say that there’s no such thing as independent views with no vested interests. It’s either the “truth” by the Watchtower or it’s anti-witness. They don’t recognise anything else!
Wow thanks so much for this video! I've been trying to find a video like this for so long. This will help me in my research a lot, and hopefully help me wakeup the rest of my family. You have helped me so much to wake-up. I really appreciate you & all your hard work! 🙏🏼
For me what started my looking into things was the Newsweek article on the Russian persecution. People were talking about it during service and commenting about it during meetings. That article alluded to the "worldwide scandal" regarding CSA. I was like "there's no worldwide scandal, I need to get the facts." That led me to Wikipedia, then the ARC, then the videos of the ARC. That led me here.
A brilliant source also is the Encylopedia Britannica which I know Lloyd has mentioned before. It's referenced hundreds of times in Watchtower literature so there isn't really grounds for distrusting it. It is the most prestigious encyclopedia in the world and also quite conservative. And now it's available online, with a free trial option too. One particular superb article is "Biblical literature" which goes through all the books, canonical and non-canonical, giving scientific consensus on authors and dates, canon formation etc. All the stuff that WT literature skews horribly, ignores, or at times plainly lies about. Also singular articles about each book, about history of Palestine etc. related stuff is useful. To me it's been very helpful since elders tried to discredit my findings as non-consensus views.
👋 👋 Howzit going Lloyd. This was an awesome video. You truly care about people, because, your list can be used by other groups of Christians. Although I've never been in a cult, I wouldn't mind reading these books. They are educational, and thought inspiring.
I have been just called out an apostate after arguing with my in laws. Devoted JWs. My wife tells me to not convince others. She is emotionally in but not physically. Her whole family is in. I’ve been out mentally for years and now working on the physical part without ruining my kids relationship with their JW family. It’s like trying to avoid land mines. Going back to being an apostate my in laws won’t accept anything neutral. It’s automatically dismissed.
My kids already know that religions are a means of controlling people. My son asked me why the Bible lies?He mentioned Jonah being swallowed and concluded that it’s scientifically impossible. My son is 10. I’m happy that at that age my children are using critical thinking.
It is worth mentioning that as a general rule that articles on topics that are high traffic will always be reviewed by more experts and thus such articles can be very reliable.
When I was in college, the school policy on Wikipedia was we couldn't cite Wikipedia as a source, but we could use sources listed in the Wikipedia article. That's where the real information is.
Back when I was more indoctrinated I did some research on when the Roman Empire started and what they were before. I did some research on Julius Caesar on Wikipedia. When I saw that he had threatened his captors that he would crucify them when he becomes emperor I just thought that they didn't understand the history of the torture stake. I just didn't understand actual history.
My interest for neutral conversations: Take back your life & The bible unearthed. Yes, using WTs own sales tactics: "Wouldn't you like to know how the mind of a cult member works to bring them into the truth; I found this book interesting in helping me to learn more about the origin of the bible". Good suggestions indeed. Thx.
THE BIBLE UNEARTHED!!! Love that book. There is a companion documentary aired on Nova on PBS here in the USA which I found on You Tube one day and it was probably the single thing that most tipped me towards waking up. I cant recommend it enough!
You felt the same I felt, last week my first time, ever…and, I’ve been ranting about my issues ever since on these type of videos…some though, are just turn offs with nothing but spewing out stuff one may shout when jw are ringing their doorbell., and this is rare to hear a channel with a mad ex or maybe he wasn’t even an ex, but , any who, I am really glad I got brave enough and open minded enough after all these years, finally, at 63yrs old I understand sooo much about what’s been causing my guilty thinking about what I’ve observed that I can’t even express my feelings without being considered to be treading dangerously…there’s no one to talk to about what you REALLY want to ask so you are rather lost, confused, angry, disgusted, when sitting in a meeting hearing things that strike you as…seriously? Why would tell people something like that, especially new folks that are studying…or just visiting and you’re telling the audience without any consideration for those who don’t know about the religion, that if they are not one of Jehovah’s faithful who has gone through baptism to become one of the Jehovah’s people, you WILL NOT, WILL NOT, make it into the new order, of everlasting life on a paradise earth…that’s what I was told constantly in meetings that I was scared and got baptized at thirteen…as a disfellowshipped person I always had a pet peeve about that issue, and they use the scripture that says to remove the wicked one from among you, I’ve been disfellowshipped four times, I’ve been told, I say three, but, they say they have my file…I never knew they went that far, and why would I be surprised?..they go as far as to ask me very detailed questions about how many times did I have oral sex, do I masturbate because it’s wrong, and, wasn’t I over fifty, thus why am I still interested in sex, because woman aren’t suppose to want sex after fifty…I told the elder I felt sorry for his wife, AND, as to how many times…why?, isn’t once bad enough to cause an issue? Also, I asked, you mean to tell me, you believe that these men who aren’t married, not committing a wrong act with anyone, aren’t jacking off!?, come on now…by the way, I told the elders, everytime I take a shower, you know, those shower heads are something else and just when did you start mentioning masturbation in these meetings, that’s a first, I told them…I’m sorry to write so much, I hope it’s understood…I’ve just haven’t been able to tell anyone who’s understand it’s wrong, and, the things everyone here says, it’s all the same, so, I’m not crazy… Appalling Your advice to talk to another witness in the way you suggested , is really a good idea. They will be so eager to argue the point to prove the other religion wrong and wicked…I also came to realize that the things constantly criticized and ways about, the “ways of the world”, being in the world, but not part of the world, is an utter impossibility.
Another banger Lloyd! Thank you! This will be helpful for me. Watching this, I was getting more ideas about how to direct my own activism on tiktok and RUclips
Not many people are sincere enough to wake up it’s amazing the amount of people are in it for reasons other than a sincere desire for the truth therefore proving it’s a cult or not true doesn’t make a difference.
Using a JWs own compulsion to evangelize and debunk rival religions is an ingenious strategy. Studying other religions was what woke me up. "Mankind's Search for God" was published back in the 90s by the WTBTS to give JWs at least a superficial knowledge of other religions, but it neglects to address some of the largest NRMs like Scientology, as well as unorthodox forms of Christianity like Mormonism and Christian Science. In the atheism department, might I recommend John Gray's 'Seven Types of Atheism'? It's a short book that takes a broad survey of atheist thought from its earliest beginnings in ancient Greece down to modern times. Gray's book avoids the common error of confounding atheism proper (disbelief in God/gods) with philosophies like Scientism and Marxism.
One of the reasons l was never truly convinced as a child was because in the old pink songbook we would sing a song with Satan's name l used to always think that was apostaty right there. When the sing to Jehovah version came out l thought great they will have not put Satan in it but they did it again .l never sang any song with that word in it because l would feel bad but whole congregation happily sang his name. I don't have either songbook but would be interested to know how many times the name Satan was in them
Funny. I kinda like singing "satan" in kingdom songs. Anyway, consider that leviathan is named in poetry, possibly song lyrics, in psalms 74:14; 104:26, whereas revelation 12:3,9 seem to identify satan with leviathan. Also, there are some who see the names of canaanite gods in lyrics in the song of moses in deuteronomy 32:24, the dirge of habakkuk in habakkuk 3:5, and especially in psalm 91:5-6.
THESE ARE GREAT!! i just have a side note about idea of "non biased government websites and documentaries about other cults"...i know how i would have responded and i know how my mother responds to these things- Government cant be trusted bc its in satan's hand. comparing to other cults is "satan trying to mimic gods one true org and failing to do so"....i know now how blind these ideas are but i also know exactly how JW respond...the same goes for any books about cults. thanks for all you do loyd. you helped wake me and my wife up as well as many in my old congregation including our COBE!
I found subtle comments help a lot but no there is no magic words to wake them. I’m noticing with time someone close to me kind of waking on her own . Time will tell
This really pisses people off. But snapping your fingers at them and say ing to wake up count five four three two one snap click your fingers snap your fingers in their face and say wake up it's fun but I don't know if I should do it or not. 😵😜😤
I was this close to getting her watching the Scientology series when my PIMI wife saw the ad for the JW special and had nothing to do with Lea Remini after that :(
My husband didn't. :( He asked: Do you have a problem with disfellowshipping???? Also, a PIMI friend watched it, would be shocked and appalled by it; she did not see the similarities. Unbelievable.
Most jehovah's witnesses will ignore anything negative about the watchtower society. Their history won't matter to them. All that matters to them is that they go from door to door. The Australian Royal Commission won't matter to them. The jehovah witness will just ask you, well who goes from door to door? What other denomination does that? So see, it has to be Jehovah's organization. No one else does that. Only us. They will ignore any documentation. It won't matter to them anyway. They will refuse to believe it. What is so obvious to anyone else is so invisible to them. But, that's what they have chosen.
The best option in my opinion is the Australian Royal commision because it is undeniably from the mouth of an accepted governing body member under oath... admitting the things they effectively deny in their utterings to their own members
great live stream today. Watch and wait- some subjects of this livestream will end up decried on dub tv by one or more of the gov boobs. it’s so obvious now that they’re watching. hey lett, et al, GFYS.
I guess I'm going to go practice riding my motorcycle in the parking lot while I wait. That's a good way to stay sharp on emergency maneuvers and pass some time until he starts.
@GZS calm down. Try reading something other than the bible. Do some real research. Maybe someday you'll have real understanding. We are all pulling for you. Have a great day :)
The books by bart ehrmam. "Who wrote the bible?" by richard eliot friedman. The yale lectures by christine hayes and dale martin. The lecture on plagiarism in the bible by cynthia chapman. The lecture on the dead sea scrolls and the bible canon by sidnie white crawford. Various documentaries on the dead sea scrolls, by the bbc, timeline, pbs nova, and others. The bbc "in our time" podcast series, especially the episode on the apocalypse. The video on leviathan by "trey the explainer". The new annotated study bible, the jewish annotated new testament, and the footnotes of the "net" on biblegateway. Perhaps some articles of the jewish encyclopedia, such as on the book of revelation. Perhaps some articles from thetorah. Perhaps some of the podcast episodes and lectures by michael heiser, such as on yahweh from sinai, and enoch themes. I've been wanting to get my hands on books on yahweh by john day and by mark smith, but haven't yet. Edit: the article on editorial fatigue in the gospels by mark goodacre.
Nothing on money and investment? For example, I remember questioning when I was ‘in’ about the organisation owning shares in Boeing. I pointed out to an elder that Boeing make some of the most advance military hardware in the world and maybe someone needs to tell them, believing that they were just unaware…. Hmmm
Brand new to your channel so maybe you've already addressed this, but how did you go from being a Jehovah's witness to being an atheist? Just because this particular religion got it wrong does that mean the bible is false and God doesn't exist? I've heard of JW's leaving the organization but they still believe in God.
If you’ve been raised or indoctrinated as a Jehovah’s Witness then you will already be convinced that all other religions are wrong. When you realise the JWs are wrong, then you really have nowhere else to go religion-wise.
Also, generally atheists do not claim “God doesn’t exist”. They just don’t believe a God does exist. Until good enough evidence is provided then most of them remain unconvinced
I recommend jw escape to see the truth is Jesus also jw reasoning mark martin i am the way the truth and the life no one come s to the father except through me also note romans 10-13 lord to be saved not jehovah. Name Jehovah not found in New testament
If I'm disfellowship, am I allowed to still attend the meetings? There's no feeling at all at my hall. And if I see any of them in the street they running the other direction. Or turn their nose up to me. So I already feel like I'm being shunned. So why not make it official. Everybody loved me, I was the next best thing to apple pie. Until I got baptized. Strangest thing
What a coincidence. Just this morning I started re reading The Bible According to Spike Milligan. I'd like to think Spikes version is more believable than the original. It's certainly more enjoyable
I also found some other books helpful in terms of wider philosophy/sociology questions, such as "The Better Angels of our Nature" by Steven Pinker about the decline in violence in human history, or "What It Means to Be Moral: Why Religion Is Not Necessary for Living an Ethical Life" by Phil Zuckerman about morality. These books really challenge some core tenets of the JW belief system (that the world is becoming more and more terrible; that people cannot be moral without the right religion) without talking about JW dogma or even any religion in particular.
once when i was in an argument with my elder father, i asked him if he had every tried to look at his beliefs objectively, and he said no, only other people’s…
I would accept and in return, offer, a Bible study, I think ex. J dubs need to be better at spot-passaging... it's a lot easier to play chess, with an opponent who is just moving the pieces they're being told to move.
The Westboro Baptists and the JWs run on parallel tracks. The big difference being the Westboro Baptists are more honest up front about their beliefs and practices.
I've given you the names of each of the shows in the series. I'm not aware of there being any "link" that will work for everyone, as access will be dependent on which country you're in.
The truth is not jw organizations the truth is Jesus do not follow man follow the Bible only and he will see the truth. Jesus is the way the truth and the life no one comes to the father but through him not an organization. If he reads the Bible without publications of jw the truth which is Jesus the Bible alone will remove the lies of jw
Oh, I forgot…BROTHER FRANZ?, is this THEE, Brother Franz that everyone is so enthralled with and considered one of the first that I’ve seen everyone running up to at the convention, like some do with the special speakers from School Of Gilead, or, the circuit overseers, or Bethel…? Oh, but we aren’t suppose to be like those religions that put others higher than the congregation…my father was an elder, but, he wasn’t like any elder I’ve seen, except the ones in south city congregation, my father was transferred there, and it was a blessing to be some where and not have elders jealous of you because you were absolutely outspoken real sarcastic put you in your place and smile and joke past you while doing it, I’m not being partial either, the congregation just didn’t seem to like our family, boy, when one of us fell away, got pregnant, wore our hair in a Egyptian style, it was talked about to my father that my sister was wearing a phallic symbol, I don’t know if I’m right about that word, but my mom had taken HOURS to do my sister hair, it was down here back and my mom braided it and wrapped it, etc, beautiful…my brother wore a pink striped suit and they had a fit, it wasn’t loud pink it was sharp but it wasn’t black or everyday suit for church…but it was sharp, my hair came out when I was a teen from a perm and I had to wear a wig, they had something to say about that, but, where we went, we fit right in, I had never been to a all white congregation before, and my father was a jokester and all the other elders were too, they were very real, loving and fun, and we all took care of each other in not just a spiritual way, it was like a family of close friends and well, family, and if I had been pregnant in the last congregation, you can be sure I would have been disfellowshipped, which makes me wonder why if they are always going by scriptures regarding laws, why does the group of elders handles things differently and since when does the Bible need to be literally taken from its original text and verses changed to help those who aren’t witnesses, understand it clearly, and the regular scripture from that changed verse, put at the bottom of page like a footnote, we aren’t suppose to change the words in the Bible, right? That’s only what the other religions do…that was totally a time for wonderment and pure disgust as I saw it, and, the excuse was bull, that’s is NOT suppose to be done…
I would check to make sure there are not any Spanish language translations out there. Documentaries could be viewed with Spanish subtitles. Just some food for thought. Good luck!
Actually we're not supposed to read anything having to do with Evolution either. If I tried to point a fellow JW to a page about Evolution, I would be shunned pretty quickly
What we need is a specific refutation of the watchtower, 2011, october and november, about 607. Like what carl olof jonsson did, but from a reputable, respected, non-exjw source.
My mom was going to watch a documentary about scientology once and then she thought what if they made one about jehovahs witnesses and I didn't like it that would upset me so she didn't watch it and then they made one about witnesses and she saw that as proof the devil was tempting her with the first documentary about scientology
If you're 11 years old you can have a lot of fun with this idea if you figure out certain things about high manipulate your parents if they're in the truth so-called truth. You can become a real little demon if you wanted to haha because I had step Brothers when I was a kid and they weren't raising the truth like me false truth that is. They raise hell I wish I knew how to back then in hindsight 🤣
@@AAAAAAAUUUGGGGHHHHH I get the real idea now I got it. I had fun writing my last comment though that you're correcting. Good luck sounds great keep up the good work. Be careful. Force be with you. 😲
Let me ask you why jesus never even one time said jehovah is his father in the bible instead told us to pray our father in heaven not jehovah in heaven…………
Those channels are awesome for facts and logic. But when a person is seeking emotional consolation for their deconversion / a virtual pat on the shoulder, then I recommend Talk Heathan, Street Epistomology, Cordial Curiosity, and Seth Andrews.
@@SR-ry6hs They are businessmen, they have a tobacco company "Phillipe Morris tobacco company, the Coca Cola Company with its Santa Claus, pharmaceutical companies, they also finance a weapon company, they also have a real estate business
Hi Lloyd. You have done exactly what you have say that Jehovah's Witnesses are doing "Misrepresenting the others". Around 7th minute 26 sec time of the video you said "thiests who believe that everything sprung from thin air from the garden of eden" which is a fauls statement and misrepresentation of the biblical belief. Please rectify
That’s not really what he’s saying here. He’s including those particular types of theists under the umbrella of the people who are against evolution, not all theists.
After watching the Australian Royal Commission, I gave myself permission to read Crisis of Conscience.
Me too
efrain, if you liked crisis of conscience, Franz's " in Search of Christian Freedom" will blow you away-an exceptionally spiritual book written with love.
Good for you!
I have just.ordered the book.
It’s funny how cults think other cults or religions have crazy beliefs 😂
Good point !
Our cult is better than your cult .Or your cult is more cult like that is why we are not in a cult. Lol !
It's crazy 🤦🏿♂️
@Alex's Modern Life Blue Oyster Cult ! Yes!
@GZS the scriptures are not proof to me . You can quote all day long but it does no good for someone who already knows them & how contradictory the whole thing is.
To each his own.
When I left a Voicemail asking, "How Can I Do Research Without Using Apostate Material?"
If was from when I was first waking up and terrified. A video like this is exactly what I had in mind.
@GZS
Genuine question:
How does one determine that the source mentioned (the bible) is reliable?
I ask because there are thousands of religions in this world, all of which claim that their own holy book is true and that all others are false.
So I want to learn the methodology for determining which of these books is true.
@@PBAmygdala2021 i think he is kind of a robot. just paste the comment and get out
I'm happy you found the content you need. Lloyd and many other people are helping us so much.
Hoping the best for you
@@daniloleite5251 Thanks. Lloyd has helped me with the indoctrination a whole lot. Plus, when he provides references, I get to look it up on my own. It is something I enjoy doing.
@@daniloleite5251 quite possible, and often the case (re: robot).
But I like practicing reaching out with cordial curiosity, and on a few occasions I've had productive dialogs, which is gratifying.
Watching this, while my JW mum in law is watching her Sunday meeting in the other room…
I do the same thing all the time with my 80 year old mother. 😭
@GZS I'm a believer but it might be a wee bit different but yes I am a believer maybe in the matrix or something I got to read your comment later it's too long I'll get back to you on that.
@GZS
Quoting the bible is no more proof of God, than quoting a Harry Potter book is proof of Voldemort.
I watch his videos while I’m at my meeting during the watchtower study…🤣
@@jackhoff3398 right on way to go 🤣
2:51 1)Wikipedia
13:51 2)The Australian Royal Commission
18:02 3)Documentaries/Series about other cults
26:08 4)Books by Cult Experts
31:45 5)Investigative Journalism Articles
37:02 6)Books on the Bible and Bible archeology
43:42 7)Atheist Literature
Thank youuuu
Thanks so much Susan, I'll use this for the description. This saves me some time, thank you! 😊
@@LloydEvans By all means use it for your description. Happy to help. Your videos have been so helpful. Thank you.
Sometimes, Wikipedia is less trustworthy than even Watchtower!
I remember the first time I went to your channel. I was literally shaking and terrified.
Your the first person to wake me up. Great video to help others Lloyd.
This reminds me of what I read in a preview of a movie about the Rwandan genocide. it reads in part and i quote: "As the country became a slaughterhouse, mosques became places of refuge where Muslims and Christians, Hutus and Tutsis came together to protect each other. KINYARWANDA is based on true accounts from survivors who took refuge at the Grand Mosque of Kigali and the madrassa of Nyanza. It recounts how the Imams opened the doors of the mosques to give refuge to the Tutsi and those Hutu who refused to participate in the killing," end of quote. As a JW at that time, I was taught that ONLY JWS were peaceful and helpful in Rwanda during the Genocide. It was and is still a Lie and dangerous propaganda. Neutral literature indeed helps to diffuse the watchtower propaganda.
❤❤❤
Well done!!! David splane declared war and you strike like a champ... Proud of you
@GZS lol, i just asked you the hour, bro.
@GZS sir, this is an Arby’s.
Splane: I am going bring out the heavy artilary for the apostates
Lloyd: I'm going to drop a bomb on JW propaganda
As a former Elder with some PIMO friends, this can't be more timely. Eargerly waiting!
@@davidnoelfranks1124 he's probably counting time
@GZS Quit spamming
@GZS blah blah blah
@GZS go Read something!
@GZS Sterile sermonising with lots and lots of nothing!
Thanks for the plug!
The channel was indeed created to be completely neutral, and it will stay that way.
I am actually considering updating it in various ways to make the ARC more accessible in the future.
Excellent news Jakke, and thanks so much for your neutral yet still activism work. Each can make a difference in their own way. More power to you,
Thank you @Jakke Control, for your great quality footage that has no commentary.
I followed along with the transcripts.
Your footage has no comparison for quality.
Thank you, for making it so easily accessible. 🍻
I am literally writing these down to start trying to really wake up my significant other. Lloyd I can’t thank you enough for all your videos. Much love 💗
It's about time Lloyd. I am always thinking about the topics that will wake them up.
@GZS Quit spamming
sasuke would be an apostate 😂
This is my new favorite video, Lloyd!… Brilliant!!! You address all the points I hold dear that continue to help me. Wonderfully articulated!
Haven't seen you anywhere for a while. Great to know you're ok, and still part of the discussion.
Today was a terribly bad day, thank you Lloyd Evans for this video, best part of my day and incredible info❤️thank you for all you do, truly
Thanks Angie! I'm so glad you found it helpful!
Excellent information. I will look at some of these myself as I’m still in the process of healing from my 50+ years in the cult…. Thank you!
Lloyd’s suggestion at 18:18 reminds me of a superb series here on YT, that Lloyd pointed towards in one of his earlier videos.
Called ‘My LDS Journey’ by ‘askreality’, it’s a short series that takes a sensitive approach towards a Mormon’s own personal awakening, and though not without reference to witnesses, (as a reverse argument of this comparison) it illustrates significant similarities, and is plausibly a neutral testimony. A JW would embrace the idea of a Mormon ‘waking up’, so may entertain watching. Excellent viewing for anyone.
If you search ‘Why I left Mormonism - My LDS Journey’ it’ll get you there.
Yes, the videos on the 'askreality' channel are excellent!
Thank you for this video, very helpful. I’ve watched this video twice because this topic is very important to me. I have over the last 2 years taken in all the content that I can (RUclips videos, books, and documentaries on exjws, excult members, and cult experts) to deprogram myself and I have taken advantage of a lot of what Lloyd suggests here. I have been able to share a lot with my husband although he is very uninterested in looking at most of it. I will be checking out the remaining suggestions that I haven’t looked into yet!
Than you Lloyd! I'm an ex JW and I want my JW family to wake up but didn't know how to go about that. Thanks again Lloyd for this video this has been helpful.
Thank you, Lloyd
I really appreciate your valuable time for research!
Oh and yes, I really miss Hitch and his brilliant take on reality..."though not yet beheld"!
May I just add The Naked Archeologist series.. This was amazing in looking into the intimate and detailed aspects of life in ancient Judah, Israel with a touch of good down to earth Jewish humour. Also, the YaleCourses RUclips channel on a series of lectures on the Bible, analysing history and literary styles.
Hi Lloyd, love your work. Having tried to discuss with my mother for many years, I will say that there’s no such thing as independent views with no vested interests. It’s either the “truth” by the Watchtower or it’s anti-witness. They don’t recognise anything else!
Wow thanks so much for this video! I've been trying to find a video like this for so long. This will help me in my research a lot, and hopefully help me wakeup the rest of my family. You have helped me so much to wake-up. I really appreciate you & all your hard work! 🙏🏼
For me what started my looking into things was the Newsweek article on the Russian persecution. People were talking about it during service and commenting about it during meetings. That article alluded to the "worldwide scandal" regarding CSA. I was like "there's no worldwide scandal, I need to get the facts." That led me to Wikipedia, then the ARC, then the videos of the ARC. That led me here.
A brilliant source also is the Encylopedia Britannica which I know Lloyd has mentioned before. It's referenced hundreds of times in Watchtower literature so there isn't really grounds for distrusting it. It is the most prestigious encyclopedia in the world and also quite conservative. And now it's available online, with a free trial option too. One particular superb article is "Biblical literature" which goes through all the books, canonical and non-canonical, giving scientific consensus on authors and dates, canon formation etc. All the stuff that WT literature skews horribly, ignores, or at times plainly lies about. Also singular articles about each book, about history of Palestine etc. related stuff is useful. To me it's been very helpful since elders tried to discredit my findings as non-consensus views.
👋 👋 Howzit going Lloyd.
This was an awesome video. You truly care about people, because, your list can be used by other groups of Christians.
Although I've never been in a cult, I wouldn't mind reading these books. They are educational, and thought inspiring.
I have been just called out an apostate after arguing with my in laws. Devoted JWs. My wife tells me to not convince others. She is emotionally in but not physically. Her whole family is in. I’ve been out mentally for years and now working on the physical part without ruining my kids relationship with their JW family. It’s like trying to avoid land mines. Going back to being an apostate my in laws won’t accept anything neutral. It’s automatically dismissed.
Me personally would do what I have to do for my own piece of mind. JW is already messed up every family they ever got involved with. Sadly
Make sure they don't convert your kids.
My kids already know that religions are a means of controlling people. My son asked me why the Bible lies?He mentioned Jonah being swallowed and concluded that it’s scientifically impossible. My son is 10. I’m happy that at that age my children are using critical thinking.
They don’t do debates nicely... they get cranky 😄
As always... Well presented, enlightening and very useful.... Thank you for the video....
Sorry I missed this live . I was enjoying the sun, nature, family and health, food in this horrible Satanic world we live in.
It is worth mentioning that as a general rule that articles on topics that are high traffic will always be reviewed by more experts and thus such articles can be very reliable.
Thanks again Lloyd
When I was in college, the school policy on Wikipedia was we couldn't cite Wikipedia as a source, but we could use sources listed in the Wikipedia article. That's where the real information is.
Wow Lloyd I can’t wait to see you with a million followers. I see how much your channel has grown and I hope more people find you and leave JW Org
Back when I was more indoctrinated I did some research on when the Roman Empire started and what they were before. I did some research on Julius Caesar on Wikipedia. When I saw that he had threatened his captors that he would crucify them when he becomes emperor I just thought that they didn't understand the history of the torture stake. I just didn't understand actual history.
My interest for neutral conversations: Take back your life & The bible unearthed. Yes, using WTs own sales tactics: "Wouldn't you like to know how the mind of a cult member works to bring them into the truth; I found this book interesting in helping me to learn more about the origin of the bible". Good suggestions indeed. Thx.
THE BIBLE UNEARTHED!!! Love that book. There is a companion documentary aired on Nova on PBS here in the USA which I found on You Tube one day and it was probably the single thing that most tipped me towards waking up. I cant recommend it enough!
Waiting forward! I need to wake my brother up.
I have a son on the liaison committee that needs to wake up🙋♀️
I’m so excited to watch this right now.
Yes!!! Thank you, patrons!!
Not a day goes by that I don’t hope I can somehow wake my mom up.
You felt the same I felt, last week my first time, ever…and, I’ve been ranting about my issues ever since on these type of videos…some though, are just turn offs with nothing but spewing out stuff one may shout when jw are ringing their doorbell., and this is rare to hear a channel with a mad ex or maybe he wasn’t even an ex, but , any who, I am really glad I got brave enough and open minded enough after all these years, finally, at 63yrs old I understand sooo much about what’s been causing my guilty thinking about what I’ve observed that I can’t even express my feelings without being considered to be treading dangerously…there’s no one to talk to about what you REALLY want to ask so you are rather lost, confused, angry, disgusted, when sitting in a meeting hearing things that strike you as…seriously? Why would tell people something like that, especially new folks that are studying…or just visiting and you’re telling the audience without any consideration for those who don’t know about the religion, that if they are not one of Jehovah’s faithful who has gone through baptism to become one of the Jehovah’s people, you WILL NOT, WILL NOT, make it into the new order, of everlasting life on a paradise earth…that’s what I was told constantly in meetings that I was scared and got baptized at thirteen…as a disfellowshipped person I always had a pet peeve about that issue, and they use the scripture that says to remove the wicked one from among you, I’ve been disfellowshipped four times, I’ve been told, I say three, but, they say they have my file…I never knew they went that far, and why would I be surprised?..they go as far as to ask me very detailed questions about how many times did I have oral sex, do I masturbate because it’s wrong, and, wasn’t I over fifty, thus why am I still interested in sex, because woman aren’t suppose to want sex after fifty…I told the elder I felt sorry for his wife, AND, as to how many times…why?, isn’t once bad enough to cause an issue? Also, I asked, you mean to tell me, you believe that these men who aren’t married, not committing a wrong act with anyone, aren’t jacking off!?, come on now…by the way, I told the elders, everytime I take a shower, you know, those shower heads are something else and just when did you start mentioning masturbation in these meetings, that’s a first, I told them…I’m sorry to write so much, I hope it’s understood…I’ve just haven’t been able to tell anyone who’s understand it’s wrong, and, the things everyone here says, it’s all the same, so, I’m not crazy…
Appalling
Your advice to talk to another witness in the way you suggested , is really a good idea. They will be so eager to argue the point to prove the other religion wrong and wicked…I also came to realize that the things constantly criticized and ways about, the “ways of the world”, being in the world, but not part of the world, is an utter impossibility.
Another banger Lloyd! Thank you! This will be helpful for me. Watching this, I was getting more ideas about how to direct my own activism on tiktok and RUclips
Not many people are sincere enough to wake up it’s amazing the amount of people are in it for reasons other than a sincere desire for the truth therefore proving it’s a cult or not true doesn’t make a difference.
It's a social club for some...
@@jgraham1301 yes and a power trip for others
Using a JWs own compulsion to evangelize and debunk rival religions is an ingenious strategy. Studying other religions was what woke me up. "Mankind's Search for God" was published back in the 90s by the WTBTS to give JWs at least a superficial knowledge of other religions, but it neglects to address some of the largest NRMs like Scientology, as well as unorthodox forms of Christianity like Mormonism and Christian Science.
In the atheism department, might I recommend John Gray's 'Seven Types of Atheism'? It's a short book that takes a broad survey of atheist thought from its earliest beginnings in ancient Greece down to modern times. Gray's book avoids the common error of confounding atheism proper (disbelief in God/gods) with philosophies like Scientism and Marxism.
One of the reasons l was never truly convinced as a child was because in the old pink songbook we would sing a song with Satan's name l used to always think that was apostaty right there. When the sing to Jehovah version came out l thought great they will have not put Satan in it but they did it again .l never sang any song with that word in it because l would feel bad but whole congregation happily sang his name. I don't have either songbook but would be interested to know how many times the name Satan was in them
Funny. I kinda like singing "satan" in kingdom songs. Anyway, consider that leviathan is named in poetry, possibly song lyrics, in psalms 74:14; 104:26, whereas revelation 12:3,9 seem to identify satan with leviathan. Also, there are some who see the names of canaanite gods in lyrics in the song of moses in deuteronomy 32:24, the dirge of habakkuk in habakkuk 3:5, and especially in psalm 91:5-6.
Ohhh noooo I missed a premier!
You were missed! :)
I started with Wikipedia, and I was shaking while doing so. After that, I went to Fifth's RUclips Channel because he only did interviews.
THESE ARE GREAT!!
i just have a side note about idea of "non biased government websites and documentaries about other cults"...i know how i would have responded and i know how my mother responds to these things- Government cant be trusted bc its in satan's hand. comparing to other cults is "satan trying to mimic gods one true org and failing to do so"....i know now how blind these ideas are but i also know exactly how JW respond...the same goes for any books about cults.
thanks for all you do loyd. you helped wake me and my wife up as well as many in my old congregation including our COBE!
I'm looking forward to this.
I found subtle comments help a lot but no there is no magic words to wake them. I’m noticing with time someone close to me kind of waking on her own . Time will tell
This really pisses people off. But snapping your fingers at them and say ing to wake up count five four three two one snap click your fingers snap your fingers in their face and say wake up it's fun but I don't know if I should do it or not. 😵😜😤
Thanku very much
Logic is only as good as the paradigm in which the facts exist.
My wife benefited by watching Scientology: The Aftermath.
I was this close to getting her watching the Scientology series when my PIMI wife saw the ad for the JW special and had nothing to do with Lea Remini after that :(
@@motorway2roswell - It's sad that people see only what they want to see. Like the ghosts from 'The Sixth Sense.'
My husband didn't. :( He asked: Do you have a problem with disfellowshipping????
Also, a PIMI friend watched it, would be shocked and appalled by it; she did not see the similarities. Unbelievable.
Most jehovah's witnesses will ignore anything negative about the watchtower society. Their history won't matter to them. All that matters to them is that they go from door to door. The Australian Royal Commission won't matter to them. The jehovah witness will just ask you, well who goes from door to door? What other denomination does that? So see, it has to be Jehovah's organization. No one else does that. Only us. They will ignore any documentation. It won't matter to them anyway. They will refuse to believe it. What is so obvious to anyone else is so invisible to them. But, that's what they have chosen.
@@jimbobaggans1564 - Very true. Yet, some of us will watch and wake up.
The best option in my opinion is the Australian Royal commision because it is undeniably from the mouth of an accepted governing body member under oath... admitting the things they effectively deny in their utterings to their own members
Excellent video thank you Lloyd
Hello there!!!!!!!!
General kenobi
Lloyd, ident-ing all the fallacies the gb and helpers use would be subject for a good vid. there are so many to talk about.
I plan to read “ The end of Faith” ! Looks interesting
It is a good read! Hitchens God is Not Great was also a really good read. Audiobook versions are nice because I think both are read by the authors.
Commenting to help Lloyd.
great live stream today. Watch and wait- some subjects of this livestream will end up decried on dub tv by one or more of the gov boobs. it’s so obvious now that they’re watching. hey lett, et al, GFYS.
Very useful to have, when they come round to call .. except that they never do, these days!
I guess I'm going to go practice riding my motorcycle in the parking lot while I wait. That's a good way to stay sharp on emergency maneuvers and pass some time until he starts.
Holy Christ! I'm doing the same thing!
How long have you been riding?
excellant, thankyou
My husband is so indoctrinated… there’s is no way in hell he’d watch anything I recommend.
Trying to get my family to wake up
@GZS calm down. Try reading something other than the bible. Do some real research. Maybe someday you'll have real understanding. We are all pulling for you. Have a great day :)
Well done Lloyd!!
The books by bart ehrmam. "Who wrote the bible?" by richard eliot friedman. The yale lectures by christine hayes and dale martin. The lecture on plagiarism in the bible by cynthia chapman. The lecture on the dead sea scrolls and the bible canon by sidnie white crawford. Various documentaries on the dead sea scrolls, by the bbc, timeline, pbs nova, and others. The bbc "in our time" podcast series, especially the episode on the apocalypse. The video on leviathan by "trey the explainer". The new annotated study bible, the jewish annotated new testament, and the footnotes of the "net" on biblegateway. Perhaps some articles of the jewish encyclopedia, such as on the book of revelation. Perhaps some articles from thetorah. Perhaps some of the podcast episodes and lectures by michael heiser, such as on yahweh from sinai, and enoch themes. I've been wanting to get my hands on books on yahweh by john day and by mark smith, but haven't yet.
Edit: the article on editorial fatigue in the gospels by mark goodacre.
Nothing on money and investment? For example, I remember questioning when I was ‘in’ about the organisation owning shares in Boeing. I pointed out to an elder that Boeing make some of the most advance military hardware in the world and maybe someone needs to tell them, believing that they were just unaware…. Hmmm
Brand new to your channel so maybe you've already addressed this, but how did you go from being a Jehovah's witness to being an atheist? Just because this particular religion got it wrong does that mean the bible is false and God doesn't exist? I've heard of JW's leaving the organization but they still believe in God.
I found DarkMatter2525 youtube channel to be very helpful, and fun. It takes time.
If you’ve been raised or indoctrinated as a Jehovah’s Witness then you will already be convinced that all other religions are wrong. When you realise the JWs are wrong, then you really have nowhere else to go religion-wise.
Also, generally atheists do not claim “God doesn’t exist”. They just don’t believe a God does exist. Until good enough evidence is provided then most of them remain unconvinced
@@SR-ry6hs I agree.
Also, watch RUclips channels NonStampCollector, Talk Heathen, Seth Andrews, Street Epitomology, Cordial Curiosity, and The Atheist Experience.
Happy learning!
I recommend jw escape to see the truth is Jesus also jw reasoning mark martin i am the way the truth and the life no one come s to the father except through me also note romans 10-13 lord to be saved not jehovah. Name Jehovah not found in New testament
If I'm disfellowship, am I allowed to still attend the meetings? There's no feeling at all at my hall. And if I see any of them in the street they running the other direction. Or turn their nose up to me. So I already feel like I'm being shunned. So why not make it official. Everybody loved me, I was the next best thing to apple pie. Until I got baptized. Strangest thing
If they strongly discourage research… how do they do research for their articles? 🤔 are they immune to apostate venom?
What a coincidence. Just this morning I started re reading The Bible According to Spike Milligan. I'd like to think Spikes version is more believable than the original. It's certainly more enjoyable
I also found some other books helpful in terms of wider philosophy/sociology questions, such as "The Better Angels of our Nature" by Steven Pinker about the decline in violence in human history, or "What It Means to Be Moral: Why Religion Is Not Necessary for Living an Ethical Life" by Phil Zuckerman about morality. These books really challenge some core tenets of the JW belief system (that the world is becoming more and more terrible; that people cannot be moral without the right religion) without talking about JW dogma or even any religion in particular.
once when i was in an argument with my elder father, i asked him if he had every tried to look at his beliefs objectively, and he said no, only other people’s…
I would accept and in return, offer, a Bible study, I think ex. J dubs need to be better at spot-passaging... it's a lot easier to play chess, with an opponent who is just moving the pieces they're being told to move.
@GZS Quit spamming
Is there any options to download crisis of conscience
I watch all Louie Theroux documentaries too.... he is great.... The tv show Big Love has similarities too( other than bigamy)is a show about Mormans
The Westboro Baptists and the JWs run on parallel tracks. The big difference being the Westboro Baptists are more honest up front about their beliefs and practices.
Please can you provide a link to the baptist Church series?
I've given you the names of each of the shows in the series. I'm not aware of there being any "link" that will work for everyone, as access will be dependent on which country you're in.
Help how can I stop my son joining JW cult please tell me
Try xjw critical thinker utube videos so you can ask your son some hard questions that jw can't answer it is with lady cee and jt
The truth is not jw organizations the truth is Jesus do not follow man follow the Bible only and he will see the truth. Jesus is the way the truth and the life no one comes to the father but through him not an organization. If he reads the Bible without publications of jw the truth which is Jesus the Bible alone will remove the lies of jw
Oh, I forgot…BROTHER FRANZ?, is this THEE, Brother Franz that everyone is so enthralled with and considered one of the first that I’ve seen everyone running up to at the convention, like some do with the special speakers from School Of Gilead, or, the circuit overseers, or Bethel…?
Oh, but we aren’t suppose to be like those religions that put others higher than the congregation…my father was an elder, but, he wasn’t like any elder I’ve seen, except the ones in south city congregation, my father was transferred there, and it was a blessing to be some where and not have elders jealous of you because you were absolutely outspoken real sarcastic put you in your place and smile and joke past you while doing it, I’m not being partial either, the congregation just didn’t seem to like our family, boy, when one of us fell away, got pregnant, wore our hair in a Egyptian style, it was talked about to my father that my sister was wearing a phallic symbol, I don’t know if I’m right about that word, but my mom had taken HOURS to do my sister hair, it was down here back and my mom braided it and wrapped it, etc, beautiful…my brother wore a pink striped suit and they had a fit, it wasn’t loud pink it was sharp but it wasn’t black or everyday suit for church…but it was sharp, my hair came out when I was a teen from a perm and I had to wear a wig, they had something to say about that, but, where we went, we fit right in, I had never been to a all white congregation before, and my father was a jokester and all the other elders were too, they were very real, loving and fun, and we all took care of each other in not just a spiritual way, it was like a family of close friends and well, family, and if I had been pregnant in the last congregation, you can be sure I would have been disfellowshipped, which makes me wonder why if they are always going by scriptures regarding laws, why does the group of elders handles things differently and since when does the Bible need to be literally taken from its original text and verses changed to help those who aren’t witnesses, understand it clearly, and the regular scripture from that changed verse, put at the bottom of page like a footnote, we aren’t suppose to change the words in the Bible, right? That’s only what the other religions do…that was totally a time for wonderment and pure disgust as I saw it, and, the excuse was bull, that’s is NOT suppose to be done…
Ah yes, a list of sources that I can't use because my parents only speak Spanish.
I would check to make sure there are not any Spanish language translations out there. Documentaries could be viewed with Spanish subtitles. Just some food for thought. Good luck!
Well, time to ask a Spanish speaking RUclipsr, like chit chat with Caro.
@GZS Advice: Don't OD before posting.
Geoffrey Jackson's 4 hours, should knock 500,000 hours of the worldwide hours total, as it wss such a powerful negative witness.
Actually we're not supposed to read anything having to do with Evolution either. If I tried to point a fellow JW to a page about Evolution, I would be shunned pretty quickly
anyone interested in defending the trinity should check out the wikipedia page on said subject.
Hey Lloyd what do you believe in?
What we need is a specific refutation of the watchtower, 2011, october and november, about 607. Like what carl olof jonsson did, but from a reputable, respected, non-exjw source.
Me looking at this my jw mom next to me lmaoo she don't speak English 😂🤦♂️
What is your hope? Do you have one? What is your final destination?
Life of Brian 'all I said was, this halibut is good enough for Jehovah' !
My mom was going to watch a documentary about scientology once and then she thought what if they made one about jehovahs witnesses and I didn't like it that would upset me so she didn't watch it and then they made one about witnesses and she saw that as proof the devil was tempting her with the first documentary about scientology
Oh my god. I'm waking up an 11 year old at the moment. She.sneaks insta and smallstuff like that
love to hear it!!!
If you're 11 years old you can have a lot of fun with this idea if you figure out certain things about high manipulate your parents if they're in the truth so-called truth. You can become a real little demon if you wanted to haha because I had step Brothers when I was a kid and they weren't raising the truth like me false truth that is. They raise hell I wish I knew how to back then in hindsight 🤣
@David Carey Ohh I'm not 11- I meant I'm waking up an 11 year old in my congregation 😂😂
@David Carey I can put it to mind tho as I'm 13 😂
@@AAAAAAAUUUGGGGHHHHH I get the real idea now I got it. I had fun writing my last comment though that you're correcting.
Good luck sounds great keep up the good work. Be careful. Force be with you. 😲
You x-JWs should go knock on the door of current JWs and preach one of those other similar cults you mentioned to them.
Cultey.. cultie.. culty.. no idea how to spell it, but what a superb word 👍😂
Let me ask you why jesus never even one time said jehovah is his father in the bible instead told us to pray our father in heaven not jehovah in heaven…………
Just show them NonStampCollector.
Definitely. Lloyd showed me the way out of JW but NonStampCollector made me an atheist.
Yes, and DarkMatter2525
Those channels are awesome for facts and logic.
But when a person is seeking emotional consolation for their deconversion / a virtual pat on the shoulder, then I recommend Talk Heathan, Street Epistomology, Cordial Curiosity, and Seth Andrews.
@@PBAmygdala2021 yes, Anthony Magnabosco and Being Reasonable are great channels!
Stay alive till 75!
Schöne Grüße aus luckenwalde
Immediately quit, leave this sect, this sect is from Lucifer, this sect is not from God
It's actually from 8 men in New York, just more people who want to feel important. Lucifer is made up by religion as a fear tactic.
@@SR-ry6hs They are businessmen, they have a tobacco company "Phillipe Morris tobacco company, the Coca Cola Company with its Santa Claus, pharmaceutical companies, they also finance a weapon company, they also have a real estate business
@@SR-ry6hs This sect is also a member of the UN
Hi Lloyd. You have done exactly what you have say that Jehovah's Witnesses are doing "Misrepresenting the others".
Around 7th minute 26 sec time of the video you said "thiests who believe that everything sprung from thin air from the garden of eden" which is a fauls statement and misrepresentation of the biblical belief. Please rectify
That’s not really what he’s saying here. He’s including those particular types of theists under the umbrella of the people who are against evolution, not all theists.
it sounds like you went from the frying pan to the fire if in fact your now an evoluitionist.
We're nearing the time of the End. So all these rants about the org will be moot & under the bridge by then.
🌿🌹 PRAISE THE LORD JESUS CHRIST. HE IS AWESOME AND THE JOY OF THE LORD IS MY STRENGTH !!!