I Was Rock Climbing and Now My Wrist Hurts (TFCC Injury)
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- For more content like this as well as in-depth blog writeups and links to research articles, go here: www.hoopersbeta.com/
Overview: 00:21
So what exactly is a triangular fibrocartilage complex (TFCC) injury?
What is a TFCC Injury: 00:30 - A TFCC injury is an injury which Involves possible tears of the fibrocartilage articular disc and the tissue that connects the disc to the triquetrum and other carpals. This may involve any of the following:
Ulnocarpal ligaments (ulnolunate, ulnotriquetral), Radioulnar ligaments (palmar radioulnar ligament, dorsal radioulnar ligament, triangular fibrocartilage disc, meniscus
So, basically anything on the ulnar side of the wrist (ulnar side is the pinky side, whereas the radial side is the thumb side of the wrist)
Common Causes: 00:53
The most common cause / mechanism of injury is a fall on an outstretched hand with your palm down (wrist in pronation). There are two main types of injuries as well, a compression injury vs an extension injury (overstretching the ligaments).
How do we suffer a compression injury?
Falls
Mantles
Cross-over moves that close down the space between your wrist and ulna
How do we suffer an extension injury? This will be due to hyper radial deviation with wrist extension. So, basically:
Dynos that cause rapid radial deviation
Far reaching moves to the side
A 3rd type of injury of this is simply overuse. Think about work related tasks. The most common is one that includes twisting of the wrist (going through constant pronation and supination) think of work with a screw-driver, for example. But this can also be the result of any lifting or carrying type issues.
Symptoms: 01:18
So, what kind of symptoms can you expect if you have a TFCC injury?
The symptoms will most likely be on the ulnar side of the wrist (the pinky side). The pain will typically increase with any activity that requires forearm rotation through supination and pronation (turning your palm up and palm down) as well as activities that produce ulnar deviation (your wrist bending towards your pink side). People may find an increase in clicking, snapping, or crepitus in the wrist. They may also have decreased strength and in association increased feelings of instability in the wrist.
Tests: 01:59
If you have those symptoms, how can you test yourself?
First, you can perform a combination of lift tests. With your palm up, apply a little resistance to yourself by applying pressure with the unaffected hand through the palm of the affected hand. Slowly build your pressure. If this hurts, stop. If this does not hurt, attempt the table lift test. As it sounds, you will attempt to lift a table with your palms facing up and the weight being placed through the palms of your hand. Again, slowly build pressure and if this hurts, stop. These two tests will help test for pain or instability of the wrist.
Furthermore, you can do the compression/grind test or the chair press test. With the compression/grind test you will place your wrist into hyper-supination, ulnar deviation, and extension (see the video) and load the wrist through your first with the unaffected hand. Pain indicates a positive on this test, positive for an injury. Finally, the chair lift test is simply using a chair with armrests, placing both hands on this armrest, then attempting to lift yourself out of the chair mainly using your hands. Pain here is again a positive test, meaning you have an injury.
Treatment: 04:14
Treatment and recovery for this type of injury involves a first line of defense of bracing for 4 weeks. I highly recommend a wrist widget (affiliate link: amzn.to/2F1gXoN) for this. You also need to look for irritating factors and try to reduce them, whether that be work related activities or otherwise. If you are consistently irritating the injury, it will take longer to heal and may form more scar tissue along the process.
If you aren’t feeling better in 4 weeks, you need to see a specialist who can design a program for you. You may have developed limited mobility in the wrist from being immobile which may require specific interventions, or you may have lost proprioception and stability in the wrist which would benefit from a strength and stability training program. On the severe end of the injury spectrum, you may have a severe enough instability that would require a surgical consultation. Your specialist should be able to help with this decision as well. Of course, if you believe your injury is serious enough from the onset of injury, do not delay in seeing a specialist, particularly if it is impacting your day to day activities.
Bloopers: 05:49 - your favorite part!
// Products (Amazon affiliate links)
Inexpensive Therabands: amzn.to/2Q1TVUS
Wrist Widget: amzn.to/2F1gXoN
For more info visit RockTherapyPT.com
Instagram: @rocktherapypt
Jason Hooper, PT, DPT, OCS, CAFS
Filming and Editing by Emile Modesitt
www.emilemodesitt.com
Instagram: @emile166 
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It has come to the point that every time I get some injury I just assume that you have a video explaining that exact injury and how to go about fixing it. Thank you!
Haha well I hope we don't let you down! But I also hope you don't need too many videos from us! :)
Honestly the best climbing injury advice out there
Awesome! Thank you for that. Share with your friends ;)
by far
Note from somebody who's been suffering from a TFCC injury for over 6 months now. (Bike accident which resulted in a TFCC cartilage tear) I wish I'd have seen this Video in May, it would have saved me from many trips to many doctors, because a lot of them don't know about this... Luckily I found a doctor in my area who specializes in hands and who was able to actually diagnose this.
Good news is: this will heal by itself.
Bad news is: in my case it can take up to 18 months of healing. So if you have this: be patient.
Also be wary of surgery. My doctor said there is only 1 out of 8 types of TFCC injuries that can be successfully treated by surgery. So really, really make sure it's the last resort.
Happy to hear that you were able to find a specialist who was able to help you!
Dear @Jan Brinker , could you please update us? How is it going now (I guess it´s been more than a year). I´m at 5-6 months and just took a cortisone shot. I do use wrist widget but my overall recovery seems chronic at this point. Surgeon wisely recommended PT, would love to hear from your experience so far.
@@titiuclaudio Maybe i can speak about my experience. 9 month ago i got a TFCC injury doing climbing. It hurted pretty bad and the strong pain stayed for a long period (it was a strong injury, not just a little elongation of the ligament). I first did some reinforcement of the wrist with weights and some mobility exercices. Now i only feel the pain in some position, but it can be super painfull if i put all my weight in this position, and when i climb leading, i'm not super confident. I'm positive to the first compression test, after 9 month of climbing, and reinforcement... It takes time
What is your situation now, did you find a solution ?
Thank you for doing these! Extremely helpful
Please keep making Videos! They're so incredibly helpful and well made. I finally found out, that i dont have a TFCC Injury. Phew!
Always good news! How is your recovery going?
I love that you release these videos at the same time Iget those injuries hahah (shoulder couple weeks ago and wrist for this week) Always looking forward to your videos 😁
Haha, we try 😉
Sorry to hear of your injuries though!
Sounds like maybe you shouldn’t look forward to his videos lol.
Thanks for this! Injuries can be scary and your videos make them less scary with solid, succinct information and calm demeanor!
Glad to hear it :)
It is scary sir....it will never be heal...
great helpful video! I've now figured out that I have a compression TFCC injury and now I can go on my way towards strengthening and stabilizing my wrist. Thanks a bunch!!!
Sorry to hear about the injury but glad this was helpful!
this channel is pure gold. I just experienced my first "real" injury with TFCC, overtrained and not listening to my body. the stoke is sometimes to high i guess.. this is really helpful to get an idea on how to move forward! thanks!
Thank you for the kind words and sorry for your first injury!
This was so helpful. Thank you so much!!
Great video - on point. I had this injury which turned into FCU tendonitis (can have similar symptoms) which impacted my ability to climb for three years (unfortunately re-injuring while rehabbing). After many hand therapist and PT consults it was actually doing rice bucket exercises (which no one told me about) that really became the turning point for being able to strengthen the wrist again. I never thought I'd be able to boulder again but after a lot more rehab (strengthen extensors and any opposition muscles to using TFCC!) I'm back to sending v5 and training 💪 - make sure you take adequate recovery time and make friends with a rice bucket!
Hey Alex - I know this comment is old but could you share what rice bucket exercises you used?
Hurt my left wrist this month and have been taking a break from climbing :( this vid is helpful!
Hi Hooper!
Thanks a lot for making this video. I think I have a TFCC injury in my right wrist, but the thing is, it doesn't hurt on the ulnar side of my wrist during the table test with outward rotation, but rather on the top of my wrist, going towards my index and middle finger. Is this still a TFCC injury? And if so, would a wrist widget still help, besides stability training? I read that it's mostly for pain on the pinky/ulnar side of the wrist.
Thanks in advance!
Hey thank you so much for your super helpful videos! As a beginner climber I've found so much value and comfort in your content on injuries. Currently dealing with what seems to be an Extension TFCC injury, based on instability felt during the Table-lift test, and I've been getting random pains the past 2 days now including on the inside wrist. Anyways, during the Load and Twist test for Compression TFCC I noticed pain starting up in my elbow instead of my wrist.
Is it possible that the wrist sensitivity could actually be connected to the ulnar nerve which goes through my elbow? I've been suffering the past week with fluctuating elbow pain which I originally thought was climber's elbow but based on your videos seems likely to be Ulnar Nerve Entrapment (since at times the pain could be felt on my inner upper arm area just above the ulnar side of the elbow.
Would be so grateful to hear your thoughts, you are a great help for many! Please continue making videos :)
Great info thanks, i just developed this injury from pulling too hard on dry tooling routes.
Sorry to hear that! Hope you have a quick recovery.
Hey Hoops!
I’ve had wrist pain from what I would think is an extension of the TFCC a number of times, usually being too weak and trying to pull on slopers is my Achilles heal..
This time around the pain is building up from over use and too much training and I’ll step down a bit on intensity and volume. For the sessions that I will have, do you think any kind of method of taping the wrist is useful?
Thanks for some amazing content 🙏💯
Thank you for the great video! The first test was painful for me so it looks like a TFCC injury.
I've read it can take quite a long time to heal, should I completely stop climbing in the meantime or is it ok to keep going, maybe at a slower pace?
I only have two wrists but this is my fourth time coming back to this video 😥
You have an overview video of wrist injuries? I have wrist pain but it doesn’t exactly fit this description. A small summery video that links to your more in depth videos would be super useful
Hey Jason, I don’t know if you still read comments on older videos, but thanks for all the great content. If you have a bit of time it’d be great if you could point me in a general direction regarding a weird kind of pain that starts from the thumb side of the wrist and shoot’s up the arm up towards the elbow. I only have that pain after some weird kind of force onto it (pulling really hard on slopers with a bend arm for example). As soon as I let go of the sloper the pain starts and shoots up the arm. After 5 seconds or so the pain is entirely gone and the wrist feels a bit sore. I’m assuming it’s some kind of overloading as it is a lot better when I don’t climb for a few weeks but it always comes back after a 3-5 sessions.
Would the exercises in your wrist stability video help?
Emil Abrahamsson stated in his latest video that the heavy roller from lattice training helped with wrist pain that he had when climbing on slopers - however, he did not specify it more in the video.
Hope you can point me in a direction :)
Thanks for reading and again for your videos, they definitely helped me a lot already!
Great video. One question I still have is how to know when it's ok to climb, and if there are specific climbing adaptations to make while recovering this type of injury? Also, should you wear the wrist widget while climbing? Is taping recommended?
I tried a wrist widget & thought it was pretty worthless so returned it. It never stayed in place, even if I tried making it more uncomfortably tight. I've TFCC instability pain in both wrists now, right started over summer, left just this past month. Unfortunately I do use my wrists constantly while working, I was able to stop doing surgeries for a while though. PT work did help the right wrist & I got back to climbing in december, but after a month of slacking on PT then trying to climb again now both hurt. I guess need to do wrist PT for life now! Infrequent climbing & lack of gym this past year sapped all my wrist strength... hoping once can get back to regular gym time it'll be easier to keep it up... Thanks for posting all of the wrist videos (I watched the other ones too).
Yeah they definitely don't work for everyone. It's a light recommendation. Meaning if it helps reduce the symptoms, great, but definitely won't be your long term solution.
Dang! Yeah that's rough but also so true. Many of these injuries have their root cause in strength and the moment you stop doing that training it can go back to it's previous state. Best bet is once they are feeling better again, try to incorporate the training / rehab into your weekly routine to help maintain and even continue to build strength so the injury doesn't return. Good luck! Hope it all heals up quickly :)
Your videos are so beneficial for injury prevention. Thanks for all you do! Currently taking the summer off for a TFCC tear.
Dang! Sorry to hear that (but thank you for the kind words!) I hope you heel up nicely and have a good fall / winter :)
Thanks for this video. I fell off a v3 onto a straight hand ten years ago!!!! Although my wrist has healed, the clicking , some instability and weakness has remained since. I haven’t dedicated a lot of time to strengthening it directly but will do now. I’m just really pleased to finally have a name and understand what happened! Thanks!
How long did it take for your wrist to heal?
@@yahirlecaros7036 it’s been so long that I can’t remember exactly. However the effects of it last to this day, which is global weakness and instability. I have been strengthening it quite rigorously for 6 months, regularly climbing too. It’s way better than it was but definitely still weak. I continue !
@@KungFoo1 that great to hear! Do you still feel pain?
@@yahirlecaros7036 not really pain, but stiffness and sometimes it feels a little unstable when gripping at funny angles… I’m convinced strengthening will help
I'm standing while watching. :) Thanks for the vid.
Thanks for watching!
@@HoopersBeta Thanks to you for the helpful infos. I just injured my right wrist lightly, during bouldering, most likely it is TFCC. Not too severe, it only hurts on slopers or when I force-rotate my wrist, but I decided to take a 2-3 weeks break from climbing. I started bouldering only 6 months ago and am already over 40 so I think it's best to take it seriously. We don't have wrist widgets here where I live (Aliexpress can deliver but takes ages) do you think a traditional wrist support can also help? And sport cremes? Can I still do push-ups amd/or pull-ups while recovering (I can feel the pinky side a little while doing it). Thanks so much.
Is wrist widget appropriate for an Extension TFCC injury? Or just for a compression TFCC injury? Their test seem to be geared toward compression injuries. Thoughts?
I had a tfcc injury with all these symptoms mentioned in the video. Came from bouldering too much on a Boulder with a move where one had to Push off with one Hand again and again. Healed After 3 months
Yeah, that's the double edged sword of climbing. The problem becomes addicting and we sometimes have to repeat challenging moves over and over. Glad to hear you've healed up though!
@@HoopersBeta thx! Great videos btw. Incredibly helpful and really well made
I have a similiar problem as you . During those 3 months, did you quit completely bouldering\any kind of heavy lifting?
First day of climbing inside again and I immediately get this injury :) should've realized I've barely climbed slopers the past few months.
I am getting a pain not all the time. I lifted a tripod and I’m sure the awkward position I lifted it many times gave me this pain. Then I rested for a week and the regular pain was gone. Now here and there O get the pain. I am gonna try your exercises thanks Doc.❤
Thanks for another great and helpful video! One question: when discussing the symptoms you speak a lot about feeling pain on the outside of the wrist. But the picture in 0:43 appeares to show another ligament (connecting radius and ulnar i guess?) in the "middle" of the wrist. Is it possible that a TFCC tear results in pain there instead of the outside of the wrist? Many thanks!
thanks so much for the video! great content as always.
BUT:
what if all those test are negative... or kinda almost negative? recently I started feeling a pain in that area on the pinky side of the wrist - especially when doing mantles and such.
so, when I started reading about TFCC, I was sooo sure that these test will be positive. but nope.... they're kinda.... not.
Hello and thanks for the video! What would you recommend if you are positive to both tests? In the first test, the pain is on the pinky side but on the second test, the pain in on the thumb side though. For instance I can't go in push up position without pain (wrist extended and loaded).
i know this is old but as someone who developed these injuries while climbing and started doing your wrist strengthening workout, first, thank you, and second-
if you're experiencing this pain but when you try these tests you don't feel any pain, don't automatically assume you're in the clear! I find that my wrist pain is sporadic and if I haven't been climbing hard it's not as likely to bother me, but every now and then something completely random like lifting up a tea kettle or opening a jar will kill. if you're not getting a solid positive DEFINITELY go do the hooper's beta wrist stability workouts! its almost verbatim what my PT told me to do for my instability
You're welcome! And thank you for the kind words of support and the excellent share! 🙏
Thank you for this super nice video! very clear and well made :)
If I may ask a question:
My symptoms went (kinda) positive towards the 1st point of the 'Compression Injury'; I immediately felt the pain as soon as I deviated the wrist. However, I did not feel pain for the 'chair push off test'. So, hopefully its not too bad. I already do have a wrist widget and planning to wear it especially while bouldering. Taking full time rest from climbing is emotionally quite challenging. So, would you recommend some particular style of climbing to avoid? Thanks a lot :)
Yeah you are correct. The layoff from climbing can be so emotionally challenging as it can become such a positive factor in our lives! I would recommend avoiding cross over or dynamic moves. Perform one's that place your wrist in safer positions and that you can load comfortably, that way if it does start to produce any discomfort you can stop. Also, the pain feedback is not always immediate so pay attention to what type of climbing you are doing and if you notice pain later, you'll need to make adjustments.
@@HoopersBeta Thank you so much for such informative feedback and supportive comment! I will keep an eye and make adjustments accordingly.
by the way: I think your content is really great and of high quality. You definitely deserve more views and subscribers (if that dictates a 'greater success' of youtube channels). I will definitely share these contents with my friends and climbing community. If there are other means of support, I think its worth sharing. I am sure many of us will be willing to contribute. Thanks a lot again :))
I was looking for the comment that would describe my situation and yours fits perfectly. So, a year later - do you have any feedback, how long did it take you to fully recover. What to avoid, can you boulder, ect.? I was happy to realize I'm able to lead climb if I bandage my wrist and avoid loading onto my hand and twisting it. A vertical mouse is also nice and I wear a splint during a day.
@@matos4df Thanks for sharing your experience :)
My TFCC injury was not to a great extent (luckily) and after a month of careful climbing (so no weird pushing off moves, especially with slopers) I felt quite good. However, I do have a very flexible (== unstable, in this case) wrist, which can be injury prone. I followed the exercises from Jason to stabilise the wrist. Definitely recommended!
Thank you for the videos really helped me get some more information on my problem. I am not an experienced climber but I noticed pain on my wrist after every session and when I tried fingerboard for the first time I noticed something like a pop and completely lose of balance on my wrist( not to mention that I'm not able to keep my self up on the board for any amount of time even if I have the strength, my wrist/fingers keep me back). I haven't found anyone with similar problem like me on my gym and also a professional told me that it's probably nothing but I get that pain every time and also I get positive tests like yours. Do you have any recommendations on how to improve both finger/wrist strength(because my fingers grip is pretty weak too) without wrist pain?
Thank you for your channel and help!
I kinda started feeling a little pain during certain moves when climbing/bouldering. 2 days ago it hurt more during the session and after it (during sleep when making certain movements). I had problems with tendonitis before and dont wanna get a chronic injury again. I thought about strenghening my wrist with a gyroscopic ball (because I can work out at work). sometimes it feels like I am pulling my hand out of my wrist because my wrist is not strong enough (can't describe it any better), I feel like I am physically at my limit sometimes (and I am not climbing very difficult stuff, just getting into 6bs bouldering). when doing your tests (table lift) I did not feel any pain directly but my right wrist felt more unstable than the left. my right arm is also the stronger one so maybe the problem is that I am relying too much on my right arm? thanks for the vid, great advice! you should have more views!
Yeah it definitely sounds like you could use some additional wrist stability training. If you haven't already, check out our wrist stability training videos and see if some of those work for you! Thanks for commenting.
How often should you wear the wrist widget? As much as possible (sleep + idle time), or only during activity? Is it possible to wear it too much?
Hey Hooper, I’ve been dealing what I thought was a TFCC injury on both wrists, but an MRI showed that my TFCC and all other soft tissue is intact. I’m a bit ulnar positive, and according to the MRI my main/only issue is bruising on the bone and some edemas from ulnar abutment. I find that closed crimps, weird pinches, some TFCC rehab exercises, and falling on my wrists (duh) make the pain worse, so I’ve only had a handful of climbing sessions in the last few months, and started wearing wrist widgets consistently last week. I’m planning to rest completely while I recover from ankle surgery, but in the past couple months I have seen very little progress with my wrists. How long should I expect this injury to take to heal? Will it just come back when I start climbing again, since I’ll still be ulnar positive? Is there anything I can do to help it? Thank you!!
Check this out. ruclips.net/video/9qwLNCQm6bg/видео.html , could be a split tear which isn't visible in an MRI.
I have dealt with wrist pain now for 5 months. After a few doctors, I finally have an answer from an orthopedic doctor- possible tfcc/ecu tear/tendonitis... Finally made it to the MRI stage after doing conservative treatment already and it not working. I am looking forward to seeing what the results are so I can start healing correctly with the right diagnosis in 2 weeks!
Happy to hear things are moving in the right direction!
Just want to say a *huge* thanks for this video, Jason. I didn't know what injury I had in my wrist (I'd never heard of TFCC injuries), but having worn the wrist widget for a bit over a month and doing wrist stability exercises, my wrist is feeling a lot better and I'm back to climbing at a decent level again (while avoiding too much strenuous climbing, and anything that involves pushing with my wrist). I wear the widget all of the time, but do it up quite tight when climbing or anything else that puts a lot of load on my wrist.
Do you have any recommendations for how long to wear the wrist widget for? Are there any risks with wearing it all of the time for a long time?
Have you seen an improvement since you posted this comment? Thanks!
@@erenbilen92 Yes! My wrist is fully recovered and I've been climbing the hardest I've climbed. I have had other small wrist and finger overuse injuries since so I've now dialed back my training but the TFCC injury doesn't bother me now. Wrist widget and wrist strength exercises are what did it for me :)
@@DemolitionTurtleThanks a lot! Very glad to hear. I have just started wearing wrist widget and doing wrist exercises. Wish me luck!!
I'm pretty sure I have this and I can't climb or go to gym because of it. These things are my escapism and it's having a massive toll on my mental health. I didn't have any swelling or bruising and mostly full range of motion by the third day so thought it may only be a week or two. It's been 18 days and I still get a sharp pain in the area if any excessive flexion is used. A push up is impossible as are most other pressing exercises. I managed to hold a 100kg barbell with no pain and do some shoulder presses on a machine pretty soon after the injury but have since just been resting it. Do you think with this information the future could be bright expecting recovery soon?
Adding collagen to my intra and post workout drinks seemed to help me greatly. Highly recommend trying to potentially speed up the healing process!
I'm not sure if you're still responding but if you get the chance I'd love a response since I'm sort of at a loss. My wrist seems to sort of pop on the pinky side, but not painfully. It may seem a bit unstable but barely noticeable if at all. Is popping normal? Btw love all your videos they're such a fantastic resource and so well done. Your channel is a gold mine!
Popping can be normal, as wrists do have quite a bit of mobility and a handful of tendons that cross over that joint. So, it can be the joint itself being a bit too mobile, or it could be the tendons sliding (popping) as you move. On the pinky side, the ECU (extensor carpi ulnaris) is typically the culprit that causes clicking if it is tendon. If it is the joint mobility, though, you just want to monitor for discomfort because it can be causing irritation at the TFCC. If you feel that you are quite mobile / unstable then doing some stability training would be recommended.
Thanks for subbing and for sharing your positive thoughts as well!
@@HoopersBeta awesome thank you so much! I went ahead and have ordered a widget just in case it gets worse and continue with strength training that area. I'm sadly not a stranger to wrist injuries as I have injured my schaphoid on the other side before too :( super duper appreciate your comment you have no idea!! Keep up the videos they're brilliant and SO helpful!!
Happy to help! Good call on the widget and continuing with strength and stability training :)
I have been dealing with an injury on the radial or thumb side and I believe that it is medial interosseous nerve syndrome. I can't make the okay sign👌. The last digit in my thumb and index finger do not flex. I have been to see several doctors, surgeons and Chiropractors but have not made any progress. Any advice you can give would be greatly appreciated.
Hey Hoop! Have you got any videos for rehabilitating shoulder tendinopathy?
I have an injury in my left wrist which tracks with what you described as the 'extension tfcc' injury. X-ray and ultrasound showed nothing, while MRI showed a ligament sprain. It's been a frustrating injury to diagnose and treat. I injured it 8 months ago, and two GPs, a hand therapist, and a physio couldn't tell me what was wrong. Finally, after begging for an MRI for months, I have some answer. It's stopped me from climbing as hard as I want for a long time.
What u think. How to deal with it. Surgery???
I'm experiencing both extension and compression injury.....so what exactly can I do ?
can you do a video on thumb side wrist pain?
Can you do a video on a Scapholunate ligament injury in the wrist?
Can you do a video on TFCC or ECU repair surgery recovery for climbers? I'm looking at it for both wrists!
In my opinion, surgical repairs should follow the surgeons post op protocol and treated in person by rehab / hand therapists before transitioning to sports. Each surgeon may have a slightly different protocol and there may be some variations for you depending on what they do in the surgery.
So if I'm more positive for the extension injury test, then what?
A question...We probably shouldn't tape and try to do exercises at the same time? I have already had pain for a month now and I am not sure what to do. Thanks in advance.
This video is super informative!
So what if I have pain for the table lift test but not when I left from mid-palm but instead I lift (with straight fingers and palm) from my fingers? The closer to the tips I load from (still straight fingers) the more pain I get. I get pain with end range flexion and ulnar deviation. I am a route setter so it's not ideal .. please send help. Should I still try the widget ?
Hi Misha, great question!
I don't have a definitive answer for this, but I can offer possible ideas / solutions. It is possible when you are lifting from the palm you are creating more stability by activating the flexor carpi radialis and ulnaris more versus when you are lifting from the fingers you are activating the FDP/FDS more and perhaps not creating the stability at the wrist with the FCR/U (as mentioned). It is also possibly that it is simply leverage. The further away you are creating force the more likely you are generate the instability at the wrist because of the length of the lever arm.
OR.... complete opposite, you may have a strain of one of those muscles :)
Ultimately, use the additional tests as well to see if you can confirm, support, or even bring into question, your findings. I always say that 1 test is not definitive, but multiple tests that are all positive provide much greater, more concrete evidence, to help guide your conclusions.
@@HoopersBeta Hey, thank you for taking the time to give me such an in-depth and thoughtful response! I had my wrist checked out by a physio and he said it's most likely that due to the hyper mobility of my wrists (they're the bendiest ones he's seen) and the imbalance (weakness haha) of the extensor muscles in my forearms compared to the strength of the flexor muscles; the instability has caused either my TFCC or the ligaments around the small bones in my hand to become quite inflamed. I tested negative for all of the TFCC tests. I'm working on recovering from the inflammation and strengthening the extensors in my forearms and the pain is going away!
Actually found out I had injured TFCC by studying the hand/wrist anatomy, but its nice to have it confirmed :D
Thank you very much for the videos! I'm in the last steps of recovering from golfer's elbow on my left hand and just started to fill wrist pain in the same hand. I think that the pain may be developed because of the pronation/supination exercises(?). After doing some research online I can't really understand if it's a TFCC or an ECU tendonitis. I fill the pain when pronation, and deviation to both sides. Don't fill any pain when supination or extension.
Thank you for watching! When you look at the ECU, one way to test it is so simply look at it's function. So it will perform extension and ulnar deviation, and will be particularly active with the elbow straight. So you can always test this by straightening you elbow, performing wrist extension and ulnar deviation, and applying light resistance. If this doesn't hurt, either 1) it's not the cause or 2) your tissue is not currently highly reactive. It may not be a perfect answer but it's a stepping stone. Do you have pain with deviation to both sides while in pronation? Or are you saying you have pain with pronation, radial deviation, and ulnar deviation?
@@HoopersBeta Thank you very much for the detailed answer! About the pain, It's the second option that you described. I performed the wrist extension and ulnar deviation with light resistance and didn't really felt any pain. It seems like the pain isn't always there but when he's there, deviation for both sides is pretty painful.
Yeah that definitely sounds more TFCC then. Be sure to look into activity modification, and maybe avoid high range pronation supination exercises. If it keeps bothering you, it's definitely worth a check in with a specialist. Don't want to let those kind of issues go untreated if you can avoid it!
@@HoopersBeta Again, Thank you very much for the help! I ordered the WristWidget after reading some recommendations. I'll probably go next week to check it with a specialist. So the exercises on the last video you uploaded are good for TFCC treatment as long as I don't feel any pain while doing them? Can't wait for the next video!
What about pain in the thumb side? Would love to have a video on that :)
Good idea! The thumb is a tricky one. So many structures :)
Hi Sofia! I also have pain on my thumb side. Can you elaborate a bit more on your symptoms and recovery pls?
80% sure I just got this TFCC Injury by doing a Volume Mantle then putting 65% of my Bodyweight on that one wrist. I did not feel any pain for each of the tests, but thanks for the tips anyways!
In terms of treatment, reducing factors i.e., no climbing or etc. could 2 weeks be fine or it depends on the acute inflammatory phase?
Thanks for the video. I have pain on the pinky side of the wrist and it hurts when I rotate it outwards. However I didn't feel any pain in any of those tests. What could this mean? Thank you!
Have you done any resistance testing? It could be an ECU injury (extensor carpi ulnaris). Would need more info to help further!
I have no clicking or popping or such, but I have pain when overhead pressing et cetera. And pain if I climb too often, is this likely TFCC? I dont remember how I managed to get the injury, I think it was just gradually. I climbed very often, but there was no sudden "oh crap, I just injured myself"
So should I STOP climbing all together? Or modify like you said? I've been resting for a couple of weeks - pain is now 2 to 3/10 when compressed.
Hard to say, I don't generally give hard stops without performing a full evaluation.
I have pain in one nerve doing first two excercise u told in my wrist and shoulder? Is that tfcc? Hot to cure it?
I have wrist pain, but not related to the pinky side. Instead, it's the thumb side that hurts a lot. If I have my arms at 90 degrees in front of me, palms facing inwards and my hand in a fist, I can pivot my hand/wrist with no pain. But when I extend all my fingers (most importantly my thumb), I can barely pivot 10 degrees without pain.
It's the first time that this happens to me after so many years of climbing :(.. I feel like I'm only at 60% of my strength when on a pinch or sloper, because I can't force all my fingers to their full strength, because the second that my thumb is engaged, it hurts.
Would you have any ideas on what this problem could be? Thank you!! :)
This, unfortunately, is one that may require further examination. Was there any trauma related to the injury? It could be De Quervain's Syndrome or it could be a scaphoid injury. That activation by extending the thumb would make me think more of a tendon injury (such as De Quervain's) but it's important to rule out other possible injuries.
@@HoopersBeta I haven't had any trauma on my wist or forearm. It's been a while now that I've had a slight discomfort while doing push-ups, but never paid much attention to it. Only in the last month it suddenly started to really hurt, to the point that it hurt to tie my hair in a pony-tail, haha..
I've been doing some finger/forearm stretching and it seems to be helping lots. I looked up De Quervain's Tenosynovitis and it seems like it could be that, though I'm not an expert so perhaps I'm wrong.
I believe that my problem was the "breaking of the wrist" while holding on to slopers and pinches. Perhaps it has something to do with that? And work more on forearm antagonists? What do you think? (and thanks for all the help!! :D )
I'm happy that there was no trauma! You may need to look at all the potential behaviors that can cause overuse, even simple things such as if you carry a lot of items with your day to day, or if you cook a lot do you hold heavy pans in a certain way. Seems silly but it all adds up.
When you looked it up were you able to find the test for it? If you can't I can try to link you to something helpful.
Increased work with pinches (and possibly slopers) can definitely cause this if you suddenly start working on a project or just find yourself loving those styles of climbs recently and have been overdoing it without also doing wrist stability work. A lot of people with wrist instability will find slopers to make them feel very uncomfortable at the wrist. If this is also you, you should definitely work wrist stability into your training!
@@HoopersBeta As you mentioned above, I think my injury came from overuse. Recently i've started to do an increase in V5-V7 boulder routes with decently nasty crimps/pinches as well as a Hangboard regimen. I warm up my joints religiously which may have reduced the severity of my injury. While horizontal and reaching and pulling on a series of 2 finger hole holds(middle and ring finger), I felt a minor pop in my wrist that radiated up to my ring finger. I immediately stopped but tested it on easier route holds to see what could be the problem. my hand seemed to be fine if I climbed statically. but felt pain if my hand slipped or if I tried to palm large slopers. I called it an early night and have been icing for the past 3 days. I have read through many forums but this thread seems to be Identical to what I have. If you have any Links that could help a guy out I would be great full kind sir! 🥹
What happens if you feel like you have TFCC but it's on the radio side of your wrist?
Thanks for your video! How wrist widget should be used? 24/24, 7/7 for 4 weeks? While awake? While sleeping?
Thanks!
will depend on the individual but doesn't need to be used at all times, moreso with activities. Especially with activities that cause symptoms. This may mean training, or simply typing on a keyboard. You can take it off while at rest but will change with the individual.
@@HoopersBeta
Thank you very much!
my wrist hurts on the pinky side when i hold my hand out and move it toward the pinky side. It gradually hurt more as i played golf. any suggestions? Thank you!
What if the chair push test and stuff like push ups doesn’t cause acute pain just irritation?
I've had Tfcc for over a year. I didn't know what it was, but I kept doing daily activities and working. Do you think it can still heal if I change my habits now? Or does the year long problem mean I need surgery now.
Hi! I’ve had tfcc for around a 1.5 year. During this time, after like 7 months it healed but then after few months it was reinjured again but the doctor says it can still heal if I brace it and let it rest but it will take time. How’s yours doing now?
Ironically I was doing PT exercises for instabile/weak wrists when I got this injury... pushed myself too far 😅 Any indications on when you can climb again?
Sir i have tfcc injury from last year due to boxing and now mri report came normal but it still hurts 😭😭🙏..plz give me suggestion..how can i recover this fast😭😭
I compressed the ulnar side of my wrist, lifting an IV pump with 4 channels full of drips. It hurts like crazy. 😵
Hey so I’m not experiencing any pain when I do these tests but I do feel a popping in my wrist when I’m putting weight on a sloper. I find if I continue climbing on slopers my arm starts to hurt. I know I have weak wrists but I’m trying to understand what I have to do to work this problem
i cant even rotate my forearm! on a wait list for doc - this sound like tfcc ?
My problem is, that I have pain on the palmar radial side. Switching to the dorsal radial side, when I want to do push ups. Is there a similar treatment? Does anyone have the same problem?
Can i drive motorbike with the injured hand????
I have no pain but when i pronate and supinate my wrist cracks every time please reply i need your help 😭😭
Hey guys, but late to the party… but I seem to have an issue when tackling slopers. My wrist feels like it hyper extends (“pops” out) when doing certain moves on slopers… is this covered by the video?
Hey, sorry to hear that! We don’t have a video exactly about that, but we do have multiple videos on wrist strengthening that should do the trick! A quick search for “wrist strengthening” on our channel should bring them up
But how long before I can climb again? 😟
Hi, Greetings. I am experiencing the exact kind of wrist pain since my dog pulled me of when leashed. It's been two months. I have constantly rolling wrist using crepe and splint during night sleep. I feel little bit of pain when i perform these exercises but no pain at rest or in any of the bones. Do u suggest me to continue with exercises or not? Thanks
thx
So, there aren‘t any professionals here that can help really.. all they say is „rest“. I did rest for 6 months and worked on my wrist stability, but honestly, my wrists still feel super unstable and hurt whenever i try to hold a sloper, no matter how hard the boulder is.. all 3 tests for the stability test were positive aswell.. so yeah, i have no idea what to do. Having these issues since i started climbing almost 2 years ago..
Dang! Sorry to hear that. I'm not sure what area you're in otherwise I would try and help make a recommendation. I'm assuming you have "googled" other providers to see if they do rock climbing rehab in your area? If you would like, you can book an e-consult with me through our site.
I am suffering from tfcc for the past two years... I visited specialist that he told me no need of surgery... I used wrist brace and did more physiotherapy exercises.. Now it's ok but if I play piano my wrist hurts and inflammation occours on the pinky side.. Is this completely curable? What to do? I don't have much pain but during activities it started paining but it is tolerable..
There may be a separate issue, especially if it occurs just with playing, which often involves forward/rounded shoulder positions and consistent flexion of the elbows. Could actually be a nerve related issue. Check out our topics on the ulnar nerve and see if that helps otherwise see another specialist.
@@HoopersBeta Thank you so much for your reply.. Is it curable?Actually I played tennis heavily without any stretches two years ago, it might be the reason..I want to know whether it is completely curable or a life time issue..Can I lift weights in the future? Can I do pushups in the future?I don't have elbow pain..
i have wrist pain, i cant supinate my hand. this havent become any better in 1 month now. i dont think i have a tear, what can i do?
You need to see a specialist. Not being able to supinate your hand sounds serious. Please seek out medical advice.
@@HoopersBeta i can supinate but it hurts. long queues in sweden to see a doctor :(
i. just have soreness on the tendon on the pinky side at my wrist. hurts when i press down on it. i think it comes when i climb too much. so guys take it easy.
It may benefit from some cross training as well to strengthen the tendon. Is it your extensor carpi ulnaris tendon?
@@HoopersBeta yes thats the one. im doing wrist extensions and lateral raises as part of my training
I have De Quervain and I am severely depressed
04:30
1. reducing aggravating factors --> you mean no more bouldering for a couple of weeks I guess? Since the wrist widget needs time too...and probably can't recover properly when one continues to boulder...
*extension TFCC positive :/
Aggravating factors may be in your daily activities as well. Some examples are computer work, construction work / your job, a certain workout you do, etc. Not just bouldering. Need to take a global perspective on the contributing/aggravating factors.
@@HoopersBeta True. Thanks for your reply and the heueristic approach!
Im somehow possitive for every test?? what does that even mean
Rehab / time to see a specialist? :)
Watching this with a painful wrist :)
Hope the vid helps!
sir i have tfcc injury for 3 months , can i lift weights
@@liquidjam7521 better not fully healed
yea it clicks, but not weak. i cant lift weights its been 6 months. i had a pop cast for 2 months so it's slowly healing.
@@liquidjam7521 i am not doing any workout
@@liquidjam7521 it hurts when i twist my arm
@@liquidjam7521 it doesn't hurt for me
what if it is Torn?
will it still heal by itself?
Can I still climb with this ?
depends on many factors such as severity, how you injured it, if climbing is exacerbating it, etc.
Is it OK to climb while wearing the wrist widget?
Sure! I wouldn't want to long term because I wouldn't want to build a dependency on it but it can be in a short term phase.
@@HoopersBeta Thanks so much for your answer!
@@HoopersBeta Hey Hooper, the WristWidget really helps, I ordered it, thanks so much for the recommendation. Currently taking a break from climbing cause of pain in the wrist after long sessions of bouldering in the gym. And I am positive to the extension test. Kinda sucks cause it's just a few months I recovered from a SLAP tear injury and went back to climbing hard. But maybe this is what caused my wrist pain as well (which happened on the right wrist while the surgery on the shoulder was on the left). Who knows, maybe I was climbing really hard and because the left side is still weaker from the surgery I really pushed my right hand. My PT also tells me it can also be from very tight forearms and I should work on them with a ball like we do with a ball and foam roller on the back. Also, my wrist mobility is poor so I guess that contributes a lot. Anyway, the break is going good and already I am feeling better and doing the wrist strengthening exercises. Kinda afraid that when I will go back I will get the pain again after the first session. Will see I guess. Can you actually work on your wrists and extend their range of motion or it's a difficult part to do that and you only get what you've been given?
@@joji_okami yeah it could have been due to a weakness in the shoulders leading to more activation in the fingers and wrists. Could have also just ramped back up too quickly. Which would be good to monitor next time. Progress slowly and you'll likely have better results/less discomfort.
Yes you certainly can improve the mobility given time and patience. Glad the wrist widget helped!
@@HoopersBeta Thanks 🙏 Papa bless!
I have fovea positive...what to do? What is it? Please reply
Chinese subtitles?
Kindly provided by one of our subscribers
I can even twist my wrist 😅😩
Hold onto your butts!
You like crumble?? You like Khruangbin??? waaat