You all are killing it with the in-depth and comprehensive Oath coverage! I appreciate you all putting in so much time with the game and then even more time sharing and recording your thoughts!
Yea we said about that in the video - I think the issue is it's a fan modification, for playing with 2, not an official rule (which it should be, but it's too late now!)
Do you think the CWP would be better in games with more bodies? Almost a psydo co-op against an over powered monster ai? One thing I have noticed from playing leader games like root is they tend to be more fun with large groups
I think the issue is you wouldn't want to include it in a game with more players, because then you'd just have the numbers to already have a good game and running the CWP is effort. I guess it would also dilute the effects of the CWP because you'd have more players it'd go for, so perhaps it wouldn't be so OP.
Oath, at its heart, is a multi-player political game and this cannot be recreated in a one or two player version. However we enjoy the 2 player with the bot experience and also the 3 player with the bot. The caveat is that you need to understand fully the rules of Oath and also the rules for the Clockwork Prince / Prince in Exile. Of course the warbands at sites / board came up in playtesting and I would suggest you try both ways to see which you prefer. We certainly prefer the round robin approach of equal warbands on sites and board.
@@BoardOfItReviews I agree with Stephen as well, especially his point about understanding how the Clockwork Prince operates. I've played six games solo on the TTS official mod and I've beaten the Prince four out of the six times. The most important thing about playing it is to not let it get the upper hand. It means you spend more turns campaigning against it, using relics and denizen cards to beef you up, so you can minimize the size of its force as much as possible. If that tactic doesn't work, then try working behind it's back so it doesn't get triggered (hint: empty the favor banks of it's friends). This tactic works against the robot much better than it does against human players, since the Clockwork Prince can't really observe what you're doing and block you or attack you like human players would, since they can see with their eyes how many war bands you have, what advisers you have face up, what relics you have, etc that the Clockwork Prince doesn't always take into account when it's doing its step by step process. It comes down to this being almost like two completely different games - One of them playing against scheming, conniving humans full of political intrigue, and the other being trying to outwit a robot, either with the help of other humans or all on your own. Either way, both of them are enjoyable in their own way. Thanks for the great video you guys, I look forward to watching more in your library!
It's a shame the Clockwork Prince doesn't seem as fully tested at the rest of the game. Fingers crossed for something like the better bot project in Root!
Yeah, it seems like it was an afterthought when it came to development. I do appreciate it being included in the base game though, unlike Root. Hopefully they release a clockwork expansion later on that functions a lot better. I personally have three friends to play with, so I don’t really need to deal with the clockwork prince.
Absolutely, very appreciative for it being in the box and I'm no less enthusiastic to try the CP out 😊 Oath seems to have a good number of knowledgeable fans already, so I'm hopeful any shortcomings in the bot will have fan support to iterate on as the physical copies start arriving. I'm very envious of your 3p option - it'll be 2 + CP for the foreseeable future on my end!
Yes definitely - I’m sure we’ll get around to trying the fan variant we talked about in the video and look forward to seeing what others might come through as more people get their copies, like you say! 😊
Yeah, this game is really a 4-6 player game. Two and three are still playable and can be fun, but you aren’t getting the full experience. I do appreciate that the clockwork prince is there as an option, but it doesn’t seem well developed imo. Hopefully they release a fully optimized and streamlined bot expansion later on like they did with Root.
@@WideMouth I wish the game just had 2p mode, not a bot that i need to parcel a part of my brain to it. other games section off parts of the board or remove components to make it work at 2p (ex. brass b, lacerda games). I really don't want to have a bot that I need to control (with a flowchart in this case) to simulate a third player (not yet apparently here). i really love pax pamir 2e but I hate additional rules overhead to play with wakhan because 2p does not work. at this rate, i probably will never play another cole werhle game since he clearly doesn't make games for 2p
@@lemilfy You still can play a fun game of Oath with two players (even without the bot), but it’s just not as good. Oath is a political game where players are all competing with different victory conditions - it wasn’t really designed to be optimized for less than four people. The same could be said for Root, where the focus is on competing factions with different functions. In fact, I’d say that almost all of the most popular tabletop games are made for more than two people. It’s not really anything new. That being said, there are still games that are made for two players, like Star Wars Rebellion and The War of the Ring. Also the game isn’t $120. That’s only if you pre-order Kickstarter copies from third parties. The game was $90 on Kickstarter, and I assume the retail version will be about the same when it releases.
We’re glad we could help you out on this one and decide that it’s not for you. As you say there are plenty of other games that can be fully enjoyed at 2 players and games that barely change in feel, or don’t change at all, with different player counts so there’s for sure better options out there for you. Don’t know if you’ve watched them already but we have a couple of videos where we discuss our favourites games to play at 2 player that aren’t specifically designed for 2 players and talk about the design and mechanism choices in those games that make them just as enjoyable (if not more enjoyable!) at 2 😊
It is a shame it doesn’t work too well with the official rules but hoping the fan variant we mentioned in the video and more that will probably come out as people get their copies will make the Clockwork Prince more enjoyable!
@@BoardOfItReviews I hope so. In my area, the effects of covid have utterly decimated the once thriving gaming groups. It's to the point that if a game doesn't have a good single or 2 player experience, it doesn't make it to the table.
That is super sad to hear 😢 I hope things can go back to normal very soon for you. We have been very lucky living in Denmark as there’s never been too strict restrictions on how many people you can see in a private home - for most of the year it’s been up to 10 and only since December it’s been up to 5 so it’s still been enough to play most games luckily - hope that will come for everyone soon!
You all are killing it with the in-depth and comprehensive Oath coverage! I appreciate you all putting in so much time with the game and then even more time sharing and recording your thoughts!
Thanks so much for the continued positive feedback and support Michael - it’s very much appreciated!
Maybe someone already said this but you also divide evenly of war bands staying on boards so it dumps half of its war sands when beating one site
Yea we said about that in the video - I think the issue is it's a fan modification, for playing with 2, not an official rule (which it should be, but it's too late now!)
I'm actually expecting to see a fanmade app integration for the clokwork prince. That'd be neat
Agree that could be super cool to see and we’d be really interested in trying out new variants of the CP that may arise!
@@BoardOfItReviews Did a CP App every come out?
@@kevinrivera5554 search for Oath Clockwork Prince Companion
Do you think the CWP would be better in games with more bodies? Almost a psydo co-op against an over powered monster ai?
One thing I have noticed from playing leader games like root is they tend to be more fun with large groups
I think the issue is you wouldn't want to include it in a game with more players, because then you'd just have the numbers to already have a good game and running the CWP is effort. I guess it would also dilute the effects of the CWP because you'd have more players it'd go for, so perhaps it wouldn't be so OP.
Turns out the Clockwork Prince was Professor Snape all along.
Oops. Wrong IP :)
It’s an easy mistake to make 😅
Oath, at its heart, is a multi-player political game and this cannot be recreated in a one or two player version. However we enjoy the 2 player with the bot experience and also the 3 player with the bot. The caveat is that you need to understand fully the rules of Oath and also the rules for the Clockwork Prince / Prince in Exile. Of course the warbands at sites / board came up in playtesting and I would suggest you try both ways to see which you prefer. We certainly prefer the round robin approach of equal warbands on sites and board.
Great point Stephen!
@@BoardOfItReviews I agree with Stephen as well, especially his point about understanding how the Clockwork Prince operates. I've played six games solo on the TTS official mod and I've beaten the Prince four out of the six times. The most important thing about playing it is to not let it get the upper hand. It means you spend more turns campaigning against it, using relics and denizen cards to beef you up, so you can minimize the size of its force as much as possible. If that tactic doesn't work, then try working behind it's back so it doesn't get triggered (hint: empty the favor banks of it's friends). This tactic works against the robot much better than it does against human players, since the Clockwork Prince can't really observe what you're doing and block you or attack you like human players would, since they can see with their eyes how many war bands you have, what advisers you have face up, what relics you have, etc that the Clockwork Prince doesn't always take into account when it's doing its step by step process. It comes down to this being almost like two completely different games - One of them playing against scheming, conniving humans full of political intrigue, and the other being trying to outwit a robot, either with the help of other humans or all on your own. Either way, both of them are enjoyable in their own way. Thanks for the great video you guys, I look forward to watching more in your library!
It's a shame the Clockwork Prince doesn't seem as fully tested at the rest of the game. Fingers crossed for something like the better bot project in Root!
Yeah, it seems like it was an afterthought when it came to development. I do appreciate it being included in the base game though, unlike Root. Hopefully they release a clockwork expansion later on that functions a lot better. I personally have three friends to play with, so I don’t really need to deal with the clockwork prince.
Absolutely, very appreciative for it being in the box and I'm no less enthusiastic to try the CP out 😊 Oath seems to have a good number of knowledgeable fans already, so I'm hopeful any shortcomings in the bot will have fan support to iterate on as the physical copies start arriving.
I'm very envious of your 3p option - it'll be 2 + CP for the foreseeable future on my end!
Yes definitely - I’m sure we’ll get around to trying the fan variant we talked about in the video and look forward to seeing what others might come through as more people get their copies, like you say! 😊
I’ve yet to play with the clockwork prince but might get to it today
Let us know how you get on with it when you play!
Flowcharts?!?! Is this a GMT title?? Thank you for saving me $120. I guess its not worth it for 2p
Yeah, this game is really a 4-6 player game. Two and three are still playable and can be fun, but you aren’t getting the full experience. I do appreciate that the clockwork prince is there as an option, but it doesn’t seem well developed imo. Hopefully they release a fully optimized and streamlined bot expansion later on like they did with Root.
@@WideMouth I wish the game just had 2p mode, not a bot that i need to parcel a part of my brain to it. other games section off parts of the board or remove components to make it work at 2p (ex. brass b, lacerda games). I really don't want to have a bot that I need to control (with a flowchart in this case) to simulate a third player (not yet apparently here). i really love pax pamir 2e but I hate additional rules overhead to play with wakhan because 2p does not work. at this rate, i probably will never play another cole werhle game since he clearly doesn't make games for 2p
@@lemilfy You still can play a fun game of Oath with two players (even without the bot), but it’s just not as good. Oath is a political game where players are all competing with different victory conditions - it wasn’t really designed to be optimized for less than four people. The same could be said for Root, where the focus is on competing factions with different functions. In fact, I’d say that almost all of the most popular tabletop games are made for more than two people. It’s not really anything new. That being said, there are still games that are made for two players, like Star Wars Rebellion and The War of the Ring.
Also the game isn’t $120. That’s only if you pre-order Kickstarter copies from third parties. The game was $90 on Kickstarter, and I assume the retail version will be about the same when it releases.
@@WideMouth im in canada so its $120 for me. Im okay with not playing cole werhle games, there are literally thousands of other games to play
We’re glad we could help you out on this one and decide that it’s not for you. As you say there are plenty of other games that can be fully enjoyed at 2 players and games that barely change in feel, or don’t change at all, with different player counts so there’s for sure better options out there for you. Don’t know if you’ve watched them already but we have a couple of videos where we discuss our favourites games to play at 2 player that aren’t specifically designed for 2 players and talk about the design and mechanism choices in those games that make them just as enjoyable (if not more enjoyable!) at 2 😊
Sigh.... Im so disappointed. I really had high hopes
It is a shame it doesn’t work too well with the official rules but hoping the fan variant we mentioned in the video and more that will probably come out as people get their copies will make the Clockwork Prince more enjoyable!
@@BoardOfItReviews I hope so. In my area, the effects of covid have utterly decimated the once thriving gaming groups. It's to the point that if a game doesn't have a good single or 2 player experience, it doesn't make it to the table.
That is super sad to hear 😢 I hope things can go back to normal very soon for you. We have been very lucky living in Denmark as there’s never been too strict restrictions on how many people you can see in a private home - for most of the year it’s been up to 10 and only since December it’s been up to 5 so it’s still been enough to play most games luckily - hope that will come for everyone soon!