I saw Pete play many times, first at Crosley Field and then later, at Riverfront Stadium. One time though, was the most special of all. It was the first time I ever saw him play in September, 1963 at Crosley Field. I was eight years old and my Dad took me to see the Reds play the Cardinals. Pete was the Red's rookie second baseman and he was known as Peter Rose at the time. Pete was having a very impressive rookie season but the thing that I remember the most about this particular game was that it was Stan Musial's final game at Crosley Field. I remember that they had a pre-game ceremony for Stan "the man" and that he hit several balls over the outfield fence in batting practice. Then, during the game, he got the final hit of his career 3,630 hits which was the all time National League record, at the time. It was a grounder into right field, just out of the reach of the outstretched glove of the Red's rookie second baseman who would eventually go on to eclipse Musial and then Cobb as baseball's all time hit king.
@@stevencramsie9172Are you sure? Gambling has completely taken over sports and has been legitimized. DraftKings actually has a two story annex attached to Wrigley Field. There is too much money involved. It’s a matter of time before a player, manager or ump helps influence an outcome, if it hasn’t already happened.
I was born and raised in Cincinnati in the 1970’s and I loved the Big Red Machine and Pete Rose. Every kid did. Rest in peace Pete. Thanks for the memories.
@@s.henrlllpoklookout5069 No. Pete Rose was a HALL of FAME player as a PLAYER. He gambled post playing days as a Manager. If Pete Rose did PED's, Steroids, etc. I would say he does NOT deserve to be in HOF.
Dan, 73, born and raised in Cincy and have forever loved the game. Rose was my hero between the lines, I wanted to play the way he did but I have always said "he was not a boy scout off". He never cheated the game, his team, his hometown. RIP14
Didn’t care for Pete when he played, I was a Pirate fan. But damn, looking back I realize what a baseball player! He played it like we were all taught back then: to hustle, run an infield grounder out, put in an all out effort. I couldn’t be happier to have grown up in the 70s and early 80s when baseball was BASEBALL! RIP!
This is ridiculous. You have journalists, most of who have never played the game professionally voting on HOF candidacy. What a joke. People who have never played the game vote for who gets into the HOF. And then some lone jackass journalist does not vote for Derrick Jetter as a first-ballot hall of famer. You have to be kidding me. How about banning that lone jackass journalist from ever writing another article. Pete Rose deserves to be in the baseball HOF.
At this point it does more for Rose's 'legacy,' the good and bad if he stays out of the HoF. It's like the Galarraga's perfect game that wasn't. Change the history and it's just another perfect game. But it's bigger than most perfect games on the book as it is, and similarly Rose's exclusion will continue the debate around him as a player and a person.
Well, they never put Shoeless Joe Jackson in the HOF, so stands to reason Rose isn't making it either. Now, if they want to induct BOTH of them, so be it.
He threw a world series by purposely playing to lose. If he had just bet on the White Sox to win he never would have been investigated. Not what Rose did.
13:25 thanks for sharing about Pete Rose, DP! But, you’re saying this about Mutombo, so where is the 15min clip about him? You did what the rest of media did…
In the BB HOF or out of the BB HOF Pete Rose was NL Rookie of the year, NL MVP, a three time NL Batting Champion, a three time World Series winner, a World Series MVP, a .303 lifetime hitter, the ALL TIME BASE HITS leader. So wether he’s inside the brick building or outside the brick building, It doesn’t matter for the next statement: he’s one of the best ever to step up to the plate in a MLB game for an official at bat.
Wow Dan i had no idea you're from Cincinnati! Been watching you since the espn days no wonder you've been my favorite sports analyst it the Cincy vibe👍
It also was hypocritical to put Ron Santo in posthumously. I understand Pete's situation is WAY different, but they can AND should put Pete in (as well as Shoeless Joe). Let's end this chapter of baseball.
Accountability and integrity. Right. Cap Anson and his 3,000 hits, along with his racism and refusal to play with black players that helped the color ban come to life and exist - for decades. Commissioner Landis, another paragon of virtue, who kept MLB lily white until his death @ 1946. Just 2 wonderful examples of Accountability and integrity.
@@retiredusvet4396 Ricky Henderson , who showed the other team up by attempting to steal bases when the Oakland A's were 9 runs ahead or 9 runs behind just to set stolen base records had no integrity . That isn't baseball . Hank Aaron would not approve of showing someone up . Ricky wouldn't last a month plying in the NL in the 1960s . Hof pitchers Bob Gibson , Don Drysdale , Juan Marichal , Jim Bunning , Ferguson Jenkins , Jim Maloney and other pitchers would constantly , and rightfully knock him down every time he came to the plate . No integrity on Ricky's part . Reggie Jackson , who started the stupid showboat act of looking at the home runs that he hit would also be knocked down by Gibson , Drysdale , etc . when it was a game . Barry Bonds , Roger Clemens and Dave Winfield also had no integrity .
@@frank5503 All he had to do is say " I was wrong and put in some community service work as the " cautionary tale " of what could happen without getting help for gambling addiction. America loves a redemption story but he refused to admit to the problem.
@@Padraig1974 He doubled down even after the investigation. He even went so far as to be coy on whether or not he apologized in the book he was peddling. Sorry to little too late .
I honestly don't care. His play on the field is all that matters. Short of rape or murder, I don't care how much of a low life a player was (and Rose WAS a low life) as long as his play on the field earns him a spot.
One argument ill make for keeping the ban is what it will say to future players. If we reinstate all the people that were banned, then players might think its not real or serious enough. You open that door, you can't close it. I think Pete should have been put in already, but I get the other side of the argument. The whole thing is sad. He certainly won't be in the hall for anything off that field that's for sure. Been pretty well documented he wasn't exactly the best guy off the field. But as a player which all that matters, he should be in. He waited to little to late on being honest. Plus on some level what does it matter if we and him all know he's a hall a fame talent? If he wasn't nobody would care. Its just a formal technically he didnt get. Having said that, R.I.P. charlie hustle.
Pete the player and Pete the manager are two different people and get inducted under separate circumstances. So Pete the player should have been inducted.
pete rose said he only bet on his team to win. okay pete also said he NEVER bet on the game for 15 years. so he was lying at that time. then suddenly was telling the truth?
@@LibertarianUSA1982 Yet baseball is worthy enough for you to click on a video and then make a comment on that video. You know, when I find something boring and not mattering, I just scroll right over that video. Not you!
It technically would not be hypocritical. He had a lifetime ban. He is no longer banned. It would be rude to his memory. The hall of fame probably screwed this up. The hall of fame has less meaning for keeping pete rose and in my opinion, some of the steroid era heroes out. It is now the hall of fame for baseball players approved of by commissioners caught up in politics.
You can’t tell me that other players didn’t bet on games also. They take drugs beat their wife’s and girlfriend’s but, one of the greatest baseball players of all time can’t be put in the HOF. The hell with all of you…
I am glad they kept him out. Yes great player but he messed with the integrity of the game and thats inexcusable. Might be the unpopular opinion but it is what I feel.
I respect the heck out of Pete Rose and his 4,256 hits. Back in the 70's I hated him and the big red machine because they were better than my Dodgers. When my son played little league, I always told him how I saw Rose play and that he had all those hits. I also told my son that there are rules, and consequences for breaking them. RIP Pete. I will not deny anyone what I know of the all time hits leader and the way he played the game of baseball, whether he makes the hall or not.
I wonder how none of his fans talk of how bad he was as a player his last four years? No team would have had him as a player except the Reds. How many more wins do you think the ultimate winner would have had if he didn’t keep writing his own name in the line up while slogging it out for the record? Cobb hit .323 his last year. Rose .219.
Pete Rose kept Pete Rose out of the HOF. There is no reason for that to ever change. MLB embracing sponsorship from betting apps is irrelevant to Pete's actions. He broke the rules. He got caught. He lied. He signed the ban. He continued to lie about it for years and was never genuinely remorseful about anything outside of getting caught. Pete got exactly what he asked for. No need to take that away from him now.
OK in the 1920s Alex Pompez ran a numbers operation in Harlem. He was owner of Negro League New York Cubans. In 1932 Dutch Schultz took over Pompez's numbers racket. In 2006 MLB posthumously inducted Pompez into the HOF. Running a Dutchworthy numbers game is a bigger deal then betting on a few games. Let Rose in
If you put Pete Rose in the Hall of Fame then put Shoeless Joe Jackson in as well. They both gambled. There is virtually no one alive that saw Joe Jackson play.
Watch them put him in there and subtract his numbers while he was player/manager and it removes him as the all-time hit leader. Nothing would shock me with the MLB.
I agree. They did not induct him into the Hall of Fame when he was alive. So they should not do so now. As the saying goes, 'send me the roses while I can still smell them.'
Here's the thing. Rose broke a long standing rule that's been posted in every major and minor league clubhouse since the 1920's. He chose to ignore it. The rule states that you can't bet on baseball period. Betting on baseball gets you a 1 year ban. Betting on your own team gets you a lifetime ban. Rose bet on the Reds as manager and he accepted the lifetime ban. Now, 2 things kept him from reinstatement. # was the death of A. Bart Giamatti. Some say the Rose ordeal is what led to his heart attack. #2, and this is more egregious, is that Rose chose not to be humble. Had he come out and admitted what he had done and admitted he had a gambling problem and that he was seeking help, not only would he have been forgiven, he would have garnered a bit of sympathy and he probably would have been reinstated after a season or 2. But no. He chose to be indignant and denied any wrongdoing for decades to the point that after a while he tried to make himself out to be the victim. Pete Rose ended up where he was because of Pete Rose and no one else. As I said, great ball player, horrible person.
There are PED users enshrined in Cooperstown. This tells you that MLB doesn't really care about it's own rules that they themselves created. And since they don't care about there own rules, some of us think keeping Rose out was just being petty.
@@Soxruleyanksdrool these jackoffs put in David Ortiz first ballot when he was juiced out of his mind but won't put in Bonds Arod or Clemens who were all way better players than Ortiz. It's a joke.
@@austinlindsay7854 plenty of rich people have been fleeced by people they trusted for tons of money. I really doubt the feds care about saving Ohtanis imagine
"What can I do to give back to baseball"??? The guy signed more autographs than anyone. Did tons of interviews, card shows, was on FOX being as positive as ever. When Pete said he was the biggest ambassador of baseball he was a right to say that. "Oh he never said he's sorry" everyone knows what he did and he said he was sorry 1000 times you're not kidding us
Pete made a big mistake because he said he only bet on the reds to win ....as the manager. Who literally dictates who plays for how long. So your basically saying you knew you had no chance of winning on the days you didnt bet. That sounds far worse than just being like, yea i bet on us to win the world series in February
One of the biggest tragedies of Pete's gambling was the fact that it ended his managing career. I think Pete could have been one of the great managers of all time.
Yeah, he "made his bed" by getting more hits than anyone else who's ever played the game. Can't tell the story of baseball without him -- and yes, it's a museum. It's not about "tears," loser (except maybe of your regret for making such an ignorant comment!).
@@rodrigodiaz1321 Indeed, Pete was ever so. If he had had an ounce of humility, he'd be in the Hall. Like I said, Pete has no one to blame for his fate but himself.
@@rodrigodiaz1321 Like I said, the controversy has been all up to Pete. (And certainly not about me.). I say, let him rest in peace. He's lived his life his way, the rest of us be damned.
The real punishment was inflicted upon baseball fans and the sport overall. Pete was destined for all-time greatness as a manager. He was the greatest baseball mind who ever lived, depriving the players of what he would have passed is a crime! Just look what has become of the sport... Kids aren’t playing, the league sucks and it’s becoming less relevant each year. It baffles me to this day the lack of compassion people have on the situation given that gambling is considered a disease and he made those bets on the Reds because he was a coping with life, post playing. No one argues that gambling was the wrong thing to do. The rule itself states you can’t gamble “… on the game where the better has a duty to perform…” and that these rules exist to protect the integrity of the game. Pete may have broke the rule as the manager (duty to perform) but his wagers were always on the Reds to win outright. The distinction matters because he didn’t affect the outcome of the field. If anything, one could argue he was more incentivize to try his best or at least we know he never threw a game. Can we say that about other managers? There have been claims/reports that teams have lost on purpose so they received a better draft selection. This is all to say that Pete may have broken a rule but he never betrayed the game itself or the fans. Can we say the same about the players using PED’s, foreign substances or getting the pitch from a signaler in the stands? Nobody has been banned from the sport. Spin rates are still being ignored and how many players/organizations got away without punishment at all? How much money did the players and clubs earn due to increased performances? Pete lost a career managing and the MILLIONS he stood to gain. If distinction doesn’t matter then every jaywalker should be ticketed. To think in 2024 we’re still having the debate whether he should be in the HOF makes me sick. The man should have been fully reinstated to manage after 5-10 years (maximum). Nope.. we were robbed and hits will never end. It’s the only lifetime punishment I know of that doesn’t end when the person dies. Anyone ok with this is not ok with me.
Open-ended punishments are typically framed in accordance with how they apply to the punished (ie 'life in prison', 'death penalty'). Ergo, a permanent employment ban is a lifetime ban because it's rightfully assumed employment potential ends when life ends. Pete has passed on, if the HOF doesn't want him inducted, IMO, it's not the ban keeping him out.
its just weird to have a shrine to baseball and not have guys like Rose and Bonds showcased in some way. put them in a special asterisk wing if you want. you cant tell the story of baseball history without these guys
Pete Rose memorabilia is in the Hall Of Fame . As well as him being the all time hits leader is acknowledged in the Hall of Fame . He does not have a plaque with his likeness on it in the Hall of Fame .
Death does not exonerate a man for his crimes against the sport. There’s no betting in baseball. Period. Everyone who plays the game or works in any professional capacity with the game knows that rule. Pete Rose willfully and without remorse violated that rule over, and over, and over again. Just because his lifetime has ended doesn’t mean the ban should be lifted. I’m disgusted by all the apologists just because he died. We’re all gonna die someday. Death is not an accomplishment to be rewarded.
DP kinda implied a good compromise. Why can't the Hall have a more or less permanent display of the career and downfall of Pete Rose? He's not an elected member, but he could be a prominent and beloved part of the story that the museum preserves about the sport of baseball.
@@panamaslim595 he didn’t get in because he gambled on baseball and lied but he was out there this weekend signing autographs without being in the hall so he did not need the hall question what 2 players are not in the hall of fame because of gambling I bet🤣🤣you know both names and I can’t tell you who went last year
No, Pete thought he was bigger than the game of baseball, bigger than the hall of fame. He wasn’t. His arrogance and his stubborn refusal to acknowledge publicly that he bet on baseball is why he is not in the HOF. If Pete had just come clean and admited that he bet on baseball back in 1989 when he was originally suspended then he would have been in the HOF a long time ago.
Pete violated the rules and America is a forgiving country but he acted like a jerk, lied about it for a long time, and became a felon. Also admitted to sleeping with a 14 year old when he was in his 30s. I'm happy he never got in. Didn't really have any effect on my life but his whining about it was so pathetic, there's more to life than having your plaque on a wall in upstate New York. He got to earn a living playing a kids game and went around crying like he was some sort of victim.
@@rossw5576 I don't really care but I would argue more, "OJ shouldn't be in the HOF because Pete Rose isn't" rather than "Pete Rose should be in the HOF because OJ is."
Pete the player earned his way into cooper's town. I could care less about the other stuff, so many purple like you who probably have made a ton of mistakes in life happy for the downfall of someone who gave his all for his sport. You don't get the nickname CHARLIE HUSTLE for nothing.
@@raularellanes4101 good for you you couldn't care less! I don't take particular pleasure in it, my whole point really is that it's just a plaque on the wall, and I don't really care nor feel sorry for him, there's more to life to worry about ithis. It is true, I have made mistakes but not to the level of being a tax cheat or statutory rape.
He should of been banned from Baseball but not the Hall of Fame. They should of let the writers vote on it. He should be in the Hall better later than never.
Lifetime ban is over. He never beat the system. He went to his grave thinking he would never enter. The hall of fame is about Baseball and the accomplishments of players. It’s a game of statistics and if you can’t have the guy in the Hall with the most hits then what legitimacy does the HOF really have? That’s my honest opinion.
People and players would be furious if they put Pete in now after hes gone. If they put him in now it just means they couldve put him in anytime they wanted and they just didnt wanna do it because the hof didnt like him and that would anger a lot of people.
I say in. The four players caught doing the same crime this year only got 1 year suspensions. They can come back, and are still HOF eligible (well, if they get good). Why not Charlie Hustle?
MLB Rule 21: "Any player, umpire, or club or league official or employee, who shall bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in connection with which the bettor has a duty to perform, shall be declared permanently ineligible." Think this is pretty clear.
Except when he was banned (as he should have been from coaching or managing) there was no rule in place about that disqualifying you from the HOF. They added that rule after.
@@tommyfu9271 It is simple. The HOF is not run by MLB. There are many players who "belong in the HOF" if we take only their numbers, but are not for violating provisions of rule 21. All they did was formalize what was an unwritten provision of admittance. Further, there is no distinction in rule 21 for coach or manager. Heck, even an owner of a team has been banned from baseball for violating rule 21.
@@MetroCSN oh it's simple alright. the voters are a bunch of self righteous sanctimonious hypocritical pricks. sure ban the owner from being involved in mlb. that's fine.But Rose belongs in the HOF and should have been there before he died.
Idc what he did, the HOF isn't a boy scout club. There's guy's in the dang thing that gambled(Shoeless Joe Jackson/1919 Black Sox scandal). Keeping Charlie Hustle out is ridiculous, but if I'm his family I would refuse to attend or participate (edited the date bcuz I had 1921 at 1st)
They won't let Pete in I had heard he already wrote the speech it was given to I think his grandson to be read at the ceremony maybe it's all good but the man is gone now so he does not have to omit anything I'd like to know what was written if true
Ultimately, and obviously, Pete caused these problems. BUT... I also have to say that people like Johnny Bench and Dan Patrick (and others, but these are the most relevant here), who had the ear of commissioners along the way, could've put in a stronger word for him instead of secretly shit-talking him or setting their own self-aggrandizing conditions on reinstatement. They know they helped keep him out and now that he's dead, they'll have to live with that, too. It's all pretty messed up.
If I was the person in Pete's family who decided whether to accept induction into the HOF now or not, I would say thanks but no thanks. We all knew that the HOF was morbidly awaiting for Pete to die and was then going to induct him. It was quite the low-life stunt to pull in my opinion. TBH, it was never a HOF without Pete Rose in it. Does it really matter whether he's in the HOF or not? Not really, no. There are dozens of people in the HOF that were put in as players that never ever played a single out of MLB, not even one.
Where dose it say you need to be a saint to get recognized as one of the best players in your sport? The baseball Hall of Fame is already a bunch of hypocrites. Pete Rose is worthy by his playing career. Put him in or close down the Hall of Fame.
Two thoughts to bat down: 1. MLB promoting betting on all sports, including baseball seems to mitigate Rose’s transgressions and his lifetime ban for betting. 2. HoF is, I think, for on the field performance. Not on whether you are a good or bad guy. Lot’s of bad actors, bigots, in HoF. Rose on bb performance deserves to be in.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
Being hypocritical never stopped MLB
Bart Giomatti has a special place in hell
Exctemento
it was a lifetime ban. He's no longer alive so it wouldn't be hypocritical
He has to carry water for the “totally ethical” billion dollar sports industry as they helped him become a millionaire broadcaster.
Pete is kept out because he admitted to having sex with a 15 year old, not the gambling
Hypocritical is having a gambling podcast but then being preachy about people asking you gambling questions.
Right
Goddamn savage😂😂😂😂
Exactly 💯 Thank you
Or getting a scoop about a gambler from your bookie..
. While gambling illegally. Snitch behavior
Boom, roasted.
I saw Pete play many times, first at Crosley Field and then later, at Riverfront Stadium. One time though, was the most special of all. It was the first time I ever saw him play in September, 1963 at Crosley Field. I was eight years old and my Dad took me to see the Reds play the Cardinals. Pete was the Red's rookie second baseman and he was known as Peter Rose at the time. Pete was having a very impressive rookie season but the thing that I remember the most about this particular game was that it was Stan Musial's final game at Crosley Field. I remember that they had a pre-game ceremony for Stan "the man" and that he hit several balls over the outfield fence in batting practice. Then, during the game, he got the final hit of his career 3,630 hits which was the all time National League record, at the time. It was a grounder into right field, just out of the reach of the outstretched glove of the Red's rookie second baseman who would eventually go on to eclipse Musial and then Cobb as baseball's all time hit king.
I remember watching that on tv.
The term "great " is thrown around quite easily to describe players in sports these days but Pete was really that, a Great baseball player.
I'd walk through hell in a gasoline suit to play baseball. - Pete Rose
...but would he do it without wearing a gasoline suit? Now, THAT is real passion.
He'd do anything but stop gambling
@@mikeid3067 It was a addition just like any other addition
Sounds like the grain of guys like Ty Cobb. GOAT. Pete rose was the gold standard in playing baseball..
@@mikeid3067He gambled as a manager, not a player.
But nice try, wise guy.
This segment was sponsored by Fanduel.
People that use Fanduel are not managing or playing for the teams they bet on.
But if you found out fanduel was the manager of the team, would u think differently? Ppl don't remember facts is historical
Fanduel bet on baseball as a player and manager? MLB should ban Fanduel from the HOF for life.
@@stevencramsie9172Are you sure? Gambling has completely taken over sports and has been legitimized. DraftKings actually has a two story annex attached to Wrigley Field. There is too much money involved. It’s a matter of time before a player, manager or ump helps influence an outcome, if it hasn’t already happened.
Exactly.
I was born and raised in Cincinnati in the 1970’s and I loved the Big Red Machine and Pete Rose. Every kid did. Rest in peace Pete. Thanks for the memories.
It's hypocritical that *Bud Selig* is in the Hall of Fame 🙄
Bud Selig was a great player.....Wait a minute - He's a stiff and someone who has the baseball talent comparable to Anthony Fauci
Bud Selig always looked like a less intelligent Stephen Hawking to me.
Bud crook, jerk, money hungry ass
Right? If he's in then Bonds, Clemens, MgGuire & Sosa should be too
@@s.henrlllpoklookout5069 No. Pete Rose was a HALL of FAME player as a PLAYER. He gambled post playing days as a Manager. If Pete Rose did PED's, Steroids, etc. I would say he does NOT deserve to be in HOF.
It ain’t the Hall of Good.
-Charlie Hustle
Brought to you by DraftKings
He served his lifetime ban.
He went to heaven, so he's still alive. Still banned.
Okaaaay ?!? He lived out his days what that that to do with them unfairly not giving him any break he just the one that got caught
Yes let him in.
It’s a permanent ban, not a lifetime ban.
@@George-f8h If only that place weren't make-believe.
I have never seen or heard anyone EVER say they want Pete Rose's haircut. You must be crazy.
Better than the Beatles' sissy haircuts !
Like another poster typed: HE SERVED HIS LIFETIME BAN. So it’s time to put him in the MLB HOF at COOPERSTOWN NY.
Dan, 73, born and raised in Cincy and have forever loved the game. Rose was my hero between the lines, I wanted to play the way he did but I have always said "he was not a boy scout off". He never cheated the game, his team, his hometown. RIP14
Rose placed bets on the team he was managing. He completely cheated the game, his team and his hometown.
@@locustjohn3865 are you from Cincy?
@@gregwagner2163 No, thank God.
Didn’t care for Pete when he played, I was a Pirate fan. But damn, looking back I realize what a baseball player! He played it like we were all taught back then: to hustle, run an infield grounder out, put in an all out effort. I couldn’t be happier to have grown up in the 70s and early 80s when baseball was BASEBALL! RIP!
Don't be a hypocrite.you like Barry bonds.
@@jameslouis5356you lost me?
This is ridiculous. You have journalists, most of who have never played the game professionally voting on HOF candidacy. What a joke. People who have never played the game vote for who gets into the HOF. And then some lone jackass journalist does not vote for Derrick Jetter as a first-ballot hall of famer. You have to be kidding me. How about banning that lone jackass journalist from ever writing another article. Pete Rose deserves to be in the baseball HOF.
Rest in Peace Pete. Love from fans in Philadelphia.
dikembe was a really good player. he was a great person.
At this point it does more for Rose's 'legacy,' the good and bad if he stays out of the HoF. It's like the Galarraga's perfect game that wasn't. Change the history and it's just another perfect game. But it's bigger than most perfect games on the book as it is, and similarly Rose's exclusion will continue the debate around him as a player and a person.
He doesn't need to be in tune HoF. He has more hits than anyone, *by far.* Being the best > being in the HoF
I thought baseball banned Pete for life-not eternity?!?
Well, they never put Shoeless Joe Jackson in the HOF, so stands to reason Rose isn't making it either. Now, if they want to induct BOTH of them, so be it.
No.
Keeping them out, the both of them, is the deterrent to other players, making them respect the game...
not just MLB but the Game!
He threw a world series by purposely playing to lose. If he had just bet on the White Sox to win he never would have been investigated. Not what Rose did.
@@CEOBrien you realize players have been caught this year betting on baseball and they got a slap on the wrist right?
@@btay6260fr like shohei
But u can cheat like the Astros and do coke like Darryl strawberry and still be in baseball. Morality at its finest
He was banned from baseball for life, not in death. So put him in.
The hall of fame is a joke anyway.
Seems like it as time moves on. Harold Baines, Lee Smith and Goose Gossage are in but not Pete Rose. How silly is that?
13:25 thanks for sharing about Pete Rose, DP! But, you’re saying this about Mutombo, so where is the 15min clip about him? You did what the rest of media did…
In the BB HOF or out of the BB HOF Pete Rose was NL Rookie of the year, NL MVP, a three time NL Batting Champion, a three time World Series winner, a World Series MVP, a .303 lifetime hitter, the ALL TIME BASE HITS leader. So wether he’s inside the brick building or outside the brick building, It doesn’t matter for the next statement: he’s one of the best ever to step up to the plate in a MLB game for an official at bat.
Wow Dan i had no idea you're from Cincinnati! Been watching you since the espn days no wonder you've been my favorite sports analyst it the Cincy vibe👍
Grew up and went to Mason HS in the 70's. His older brother was an outstanding athlete for the Comets.
It also was hypocritical to put Ron Santo in posthumously.
I understand Pete's situation is WAY different, but they can AND should put Pete in (as well as Shoeless Joe). Let's end this chapter of baseball.
That was just a travesty. His family would have been perfectly justified to tell the HOF to stick it.
Shoeless Joe Jackson is still banned from Hall of Fame and it's been over a century. I don't think Pete is getting in sadly.
Johnny was the guy's teammate and friend and he said it - rule 21.
It's called accountability and integrity.
Which MLB has none of !
MLB turned a blind eye to steroids because it sold tickets. Don't come here spouting off about honesty and integrity
That was a joke right, dude? This is planet earth. Both don't exist here.
Accountability and integrity. Right. Cap Anson and his 3,000 hits, along with his racism and refusal to play with black players that helped the color ban come to life and exist - for decades.
Commissioner Landis, another paragon of virtue, who kept MLB lily white until his death @ 1946.
Just 2 wonderful examples of Accountability and integrity.
@@retiredusvet4396 Ricky Henderson , who showed the other team up by attempting to steal bases when the Oakland A's were 9 runs ahead or 9 runs behind just to set stolen base records had no integrity .
That isn't baseball .
Hank Aaron would not approve of showing someone up .
Ricky wouldn't last a month plying in the NL in the 1960s .
Hof pitchers Bob Gibson , Don Drysdale , Juan Marichal , Jim Bunning , Ferguson Jenkins , Jim Maloney and other pitchers would constantly , and rightfully knock him down every time he came to the plate .
No integrity on Ricky's part .
Reggie Jackson , who started the stupid showboat act of looking at the home runs that he hit would also be knocked down by Gibson , Drysdale , etc . when it was a game .
Barry Bonds , Roger Clemens and Dave Winfield also had no integrity .
He never took responsibility even after he was thoroughly investigated, he even played around it so he could sell a book .
Who in this world has taken responsibility?
@@frank5503 All he had to do is say " I was wrong and put in some community service work as the " cautionary tale " of what could happen without getting help for gambling addiction. America loves a redemption story but he refused to admit to the problem.
@@str8shot216he has said he was wrong. Many times.
@@Padraig1974 He doubled down even after the investigation. He even went so far as to be coy on whether or not he apologized in the book he was peddling. Sorry to little too late .
I honestly don't care. His play on the field is all that matters. Short of rape or murder, I don't care how much of a low life a player was (and Rose WAS a low life) as long as his play on the field earns him a spot.
One argument ill make for keeping the ban is what it will say to future players. If we reinstate all the people that were banned, then players might think its not real or serious enough. You open that door, you can't close it. I think Pete should have been put in already, but I get the other side of the argument. The whole thing is sad. He certainly won't be in the hall for anything off that field that's for sure. Been pretty well documented he wasn't exactly the best guy off the field. But as a player which all that matters, he should be in. He waited to little to late on being honest. Plus on some level what does it matter if we and him all know he's a hall a fame talent? If he wasn't nobody would care. Its just a formal technically he didnt get. Having said that, R.I.P. charlie hustle.
Pete the player and Pete the manager are two different people and get inducted under separate circumstances. So Pete the player should have been inducted.
Nobody's gonna think anything.
pete rose said he only bet on his team to win. okay
pete also said he NEVER bet on the game for 15 years. so he was lying at that time. then suddenly was telling the truth?
Yet betting is now legal on all pro sports. What's your point?
@@frank5503it's legal for non players. Leagues have different rules as to what/when/if the players can bet.
@@frank5503 His point is Rose is a lying scumbag.
Who cares. Baseball is boring and doesn't matter. Football is the only sport worthy of watching
@@LibertarianUSA1982 Yet baseball is worthy enough for you to click on a video and then make a comment on that video. You know, when I find something boring and not mattering, I just scroll right over that video. Not you!
It technically would not be hypocritical. He had a lifetime ban. He is no longer banned.
It would be rude to his memory. The hall of fame probably screwed this up. The hall of fame has less meaning for keeping pete rose and in my opinion, some of the steroid era heroes out.
It is now the hall of fame for baseball players approved of by commissioners caught up in politics.
You can’t tell me that other players didn’t bet on games also. They take drugs beat their wife’s and girlfriend’s but, one of the greatest baseball players of all time can’t be put in the HOF. The hell with all of you…
I am glad they kept him out. Yes great player but he messed with the integrity of the game and thats inexcusable. Might be the unpopular opinion but it is what I feel.
I agree wholeheartedly!
Exactly. Everyone isn't Gehrig and Clemente as a person.
@@tommyfu9271 he’s a degenerate gambler!
I respect the heck out of Pete Rose and his 4,256 hits. Back in the 70's I hated him and the big red machine because they were better than my Dodgers. When my son played little league, I always told him how I saw Rose play and that he had all those hits. I also told my son that there are rules, and consequences for breaking them. RIP Pete. I will not deny anyone what I know of the all time hits leader and the way he played the game of baseball, whether he makes the hall or not.
He bet as a player too. For all the bright pennies out there saying he shouldn’t be kept from HOF as a player for what he did as a manager.
I wonder how none of his fans talk of how bad he was as a player his last four years? No team would have had him as a player except the Reds. How many more wins do you think the ultimate winner would have had if he didn’t keep writing his own name in the line up while slogging it out for the record? Cobb hit .323 his last year. Rose .219.
Oh and selling fake memorabilia to all you cincy die hards.
Pete Rose is a Hall of Famer! Period.
Mark Mcgwire, Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa, and Roger Clemens in the Hall of Fame.
Pete Rose kept Pete Rose out of the HOF. There is no reason for that to ever change. MLB embracing sponsorship from betting apps is irrelevant to Pete's actions. He broke the rules. He got caught. He lied. He signed the ban. He continued to lie about it for years and was never genuinely remorseful about anything outside of getting caught.
Pete got exactly what he asked for. No need to take that away from him now.
They have a jersey of his up there in the Hall Of Fame. Not fair to Pete if they won't put him in there.
Pretty sure the jersey is in the museum....very different from the HoF. Pretty sure there's something about the Black Sox in the museum, too.
From what I've heard, Pete didn't want to go in posthumously.
Dan showed that clip in this video, if you watched it.
OK in the 1920s Alex Pompez ran a numbers operation in Harlem. He was owner of Negro League New York Cubans. In 1932 Dutch Schultz took over Pompez's numbers racket. In 2006 MLB posthumously inducted Pompez into the HOF. Running a Dutchworthy numbers game is a bigger deal then betting on a few games. Let Rose in
If you put Pete Rose in the Hall of Fame then put Shoeless Joe Jackson in as well. They both gambled. There is virtually no one alive that saw Joe Jackson play.
Did Pete Rose gamble as a PLAYER? After his career he did as a Manager. 4256 Hits defines the HOF -- Right this Wrong
Joe Briben saw the Black Sox. He drove the equipment jet and played pepper with Ricky Henderson in 1917.
Watch them put him in there and subtract his numbers while he was player/manager and it removes him as the all-time hit leader. Nothing would shock me with the MLB.
The man is a legend. American Hero. But he bet on the game. Sucks. RIP
American Hero lol
@@beg4mercy890exactly....
I agree. They did not induct him into the Hall of Fame when he was alive. So they should not do so now. As the saying goes, 'send me the roses while I can still smell them.'
Here's the thing. Rose broke a long standing rule that's been posted in every major and minor league clubhouse since the 1920's. He chose to ignore it. The rule states that you can't bet on baseball period. Betting on baseball gets you a 1 year ban. Betting on your own team gets you a lifetime ban. Rose bet on the Reds as manager and he accepted the lifetime ban. Now, 2 things kept him from reinstatement. # was the death of
A. Bart Giamatti. Some say the Rose ordeal is what led to his heart attack. #2, and this is more egregious, is that Rose chose not to be humble.
Had he come out and admitted what he had done and admitted he had a gambling problem and that he was seeking help, not only would he have been forgiven, he would have garnered a bit of sympathy and he probably would have been reinstated after a season or 2. But no. He chose to be indignant and denied any wrongdoing for decades to the point that after a while he tried to make himself out to be the victim. Pete Rose ended up where he was because of Pete Rose and no one else. As I said, great ball player, horrible person.
But the rule didn't say you'd be banned from the HOF. They added that AFTER Rose was banned from MLB.
There are PED users enshrined in Cooperstown. This tells you that MLB doesn't really care about it's own rules that they themselves created. And since they don't care about there own rules, some of us think keeping Rose out was just being petty.
@@Soxruleyanksdrool these jackoffs put in David Ortiz first ballot when he was juiced out of his mind but won't put in Bonds Arod or Clemens who were all way better players than Ortiz. It's a joke.
Shohei Ohtani did it and he is still allowed to play. Either that or Ohtani is the most oblivious dummy out there.
@@austinlindsay7854 plenty of rich people have been fleeced by people they trusted for tons of money.
I really doubt the feds care about saving Ohtanis imagine
Put John Dowd in the Hall of Fame.
"What can I do to give back to baseball"??? The guy signed more autographs than anyone. Did tons of interviews, card shows, was on FOX being as positive as ever. When Pete said he was the biggest ambassador of baseball he was a right to say that. "Oh he never said he's sorry" everyone knows what he did and he said he was sorry 1000 times you're not kidding us
Pete made a big mistake because he said he only bet on the reds to win ....as the manager. Who literally dictates who plays for how long. So your basically saying you knew you had no chance of winning on the days you didnt bet. That sounds far worse than just being like, yea i bet on us to win the world series in February
Exactly!
Please don’t turn into Keith Olberman.
One of the biggest tragedies of Pete's gambling was the fact that it ended his managing career. I think Pete could have been one of the great managers of all time.
Pete Rose made his bed. No one twisted his arm. No tears were shed by him. No tears are owed him.
Yeah, he "made his bed" by getting more hits than anyone else who's ever played the game.
Can't tell the story of baseball without him -- and yes, it's a museum.
It's not about "tears," loser (except maybe of your regret for making such an ignorant comment!).
So self righteous
@@rodrigodiaz1321 Indeed, Pete was ever so. If he had had an ounce of humility, he'd be in the Hall. Like I said, Pete has no one to blame for his fate but himself.
@@1dash133 I meant you, not Pete. Ppl make mistakes and no one is perfect. He deserves to be in the hall
@@rodrigodiaz1321 Like I said, the controversy has been all up to Pete. (And certainly not about me.). I say, let him rest in peace. He's lived his life his way, the rest of us be damned.
It’s not hypocritical. MLB imposed a lifetime ban on Pete Rose. His lifetime is over.⚰️
So they not going to talk about Dikembe Mutombo?? No love i guess
The real punishment was inflicted upon baseball fans and the sport overall. Pete was destined for all-time greatness as a manager. He was the greatest baseball mind who ever lived, depriving the players of what he would have passed is a crime! Just look what has become of the sport... Kids aren’t playing, the league sucks and it’s becoming less relevant each year. It baffles me to this day the lack of compassion people have on the situation given that gambling is considered a disease and he made those bets on the Reds because he was a coping with life, post playing. No one argues that gambling was the wrong thing to do. The rule itself states you can’t gamble “… on the game where the better has a duty to perform…” and that these rules exist to protect the integrity of the game. Pete may have broke the rule as the manager (duty to perform) but his wagers were always on the Reds to win outright. The distinction matters because he didn’t affect the outcome of the field. If anything, one could argue he was more incentivize to try his best or at least we know he never threw a game. Can we say that about other managers? There have been claims/reports that teams have lost on purpose so they received a better draft selection. This is all to say that Pete may have broken a rule but he never betrayed the game itself or the fans. Can we say the same about the players using PED’s, foreign substances or getting the pitch from a signaler in the stands? Nobody has been banned from the sport. Spin rates are still being ignored and how many players/organizations got away without punishment at all? How much money did the players and clubs earn due to increased performances? Pete lost a career managing and the MILLIONS he stood to gain. If distinction doesn’t matter then every jaywalker should be ticketed. To think in 2024 we’re still having the debate whether he should be in the HOF makes me sick. The man should have been fully reinstated to manage after 5-10 years (maximum). Nope.. we were robbed and hits will never end. It’s the only lifetime punishment I know of that doesn’t end when the person dies. Anyone ok with this is not ok with me.
Open-ended punishments are typically framed in accordance with how they apply to the punished (ie 'life in prison', 'death penalty'). Ergo, a permanent employment ban is a lifetime ban because it's rightfully assumed employment potential ends when life ends. Pete has passed on, if the HOF doesn't want him inducted, IMO, it's not the ban keeping him out.
Mr. Rose ( Charlie Hustle) had a Hall of Fame baseball career. No question.
it was pitiful that you had Johnny Bench trashing Pete just after his passing..
Not hypocritical at all. Rose got the worst punishment he could get: he never got to see himself go into the Hall of Fame.
And we care what a broadcaster who reads from a teleprompter thinks?
Hypocritical now? Just now Dan? MLB has been hypocritical from go.
its just weird to have a shrine to baseball and not have guys like Rose and Bonds showcased in some way. put them in a special asterisk wing if you want. you cant tell the story of baseball history without these guys
Rose/Bonds is a stretch. One used PEDS to get better, and pad stats and the other bet his team would win.
Rose and Shoeless IN, but Cheaters, the Bonds types, with fake stats NEVER.
Bonds was a cheater.
Both Bonds and Rose have artifacts in the Hall, so it’s not completely void of their presence.
Pete Rose memorabilia is in the Hall Of Fame . As well as him being the all time hits leader is acknowledged in the Hall of Fame . He does not have a plaque with his likeness on it in the Hall of Fame .
Death does not exonerate a man for his crimes against the sport. There’s no betting in baseball. Period. Everyone who plays the game or works in any professional capacity with the game knows that rule. Pete Rose willfully and without remorse violated that rule over, and over, and over again. Just because his lifetime has ended doesn’t mean the ban should be lifted. I’m disgusted by all the apologists just because he died. We’re all gonna die someday. Death is not an accomplishment to be rewarded.
Think about what he said, “it won’t help me if I’m dead” I think he looked at being a HOFamer as another way to make money
Putting Pete rose in the HOF posthumously is the funniest thing I’ve ever heard. To finally give in after the fools dead….
DP kinda implied a good compromise. Why can't the Hall have a more or less permanent display of the career and downfall of Pete Rose? He's not an elected member, but he could be a prominent and beloved part of the story that the museum preserves about the sport of baseball.
Without rules what is the point?
Exactly!
RIP Pete Rose
The Hall of Fame only hurt itself, it didn't affect Pete at all.
why would it be hypocritical. it's a lifetime ban. his life is over. he can go in
Pete rose is bigger than the Hall of Fame 😎😎😎😎
🤣
@@MrCaryGrant59 I can’t tell you who went into the hall of fame last year but I know Pete is not in it
Thats exactly why he didnt get in ..he thought he was
@@panamaslim595 he didn’t get in because he gambled on baseball and lied but he was out there this weekend signing autographs without being in the hall so he did not need the hall question what 2 players are not in the hall of fame because of gambling I bet🤣🤣you know both names and I can’t tell you who went last year
No, Pete thought he was bigger than the game of baseball, bigger than the hall of fame. He wasn’t. His arrogance and his stubborn refusal to acknowledge publicly that he bet on baseball is why he is not in the HOF. If Pete had just come clean and admited that he bet on baseball back in 1989 when he was originally suspended then he would have been in the HOF a long time ago.
Pete violated the rules and America is a forgiving country but he acted like a jerk, lied about it for a long time, and became a felon. Also admitted to sleeping with a 14 year old when he was in his 30s. I'm happy he never got in. Didn't really have any effect on my life but his whining about it was so pathetic, there's more to life than having your plaque on a wall in upstate New York. He got to earn a living playing a kids game and went around crying like he was some sort of victim.
Agree on everything you said. Rose was a creep.
OJ is in the football hall of fame.
@@rossw5576 I don't really care but I would argue more, "OJ shouldn't be in the HOF because Pete Rose isn't" rather than "Pete Rose should be in the HOF because OJ is."
Pete the player earned his way into cooper's town. I could care less about the other stuff, so many purple like you who probably have made a ton of mistakes in life happy for the downfall of someone who gave his all for his sport. You don't get the nickname CHARLIE HUSTLE for nothing.
@@raularellanes4101 good for you you couldn't care less! I don't take particular pleasure in it, my whole point really is that it's just a plaque on the wall, and I don't really care nor feel sorry for him, there's more to life to worry about ithis. It is true, I have made mistakes but not to the level of being a tax cheat or statutory rape.
He could never say he was sorry. Best ball player I ever saw, but a flawed human being
It’s crazy how long he has been punished for. People commit crimes at do less time.
Time? He never went to prison.
Pete Rose went to prison for tax evasion.
@@stevencramsie9172 he actually did for tax evasion - served 5 months
@@stevencramsie9172 🤦♂️ meh teh for
He should of been banned from Baseball but not the Hall of Fame. They should of let the writers vote on it. He should be in the Hall better later than never.
Lifetime ban is over. He never beat the system. He went to his grave thinking he would never enter. The hall of fame is about Baseball and the accomplishments of players. It’s a game of statistics and if you can’t have the guy in the Hall with the most hits then what legitimacy does the HOF really have? That’s my honest opinion.
People and players would be furious if they put Pete in now after hes gone. If they put him in now it just means they couldve put him in anytime they wanted and they just didnt wanna do it because the hof didnt like him and that would anger a lot of people.
I say in. The four players caught doing the same crime this year only got 1 year suspensions. They can come back, and are still HOF eligible (well, if they get good). Why not Charlie Hustle?
Did he burned a future Hall of Famer Mario Soto for his betting?
Pete’s to big for the HOF
Pete had such a clear head, RIP Charlie Hustle
MLB Rule 21: "Any player, umpire, or club or league official or employee, who shall bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in connection with which the bettor has a duty to perform, shall be declared permanently ineligible." Think this is pretty clear.
Except when he was banned (as he should have been from coaching or managing) there was no rule in place about that disqualifying you from the HOF.
They added that rule after.
@@tommyfu9271 It is simple. The HOF is not run by MLB. There are many players who "belong in the HOF" if we take only their numbers, but are not for violating provisions of rule 21. All they did was formalize what was an unwritten provision of admittance. Further, there is no distinction in rule 21 for coach or manager. Heck, even an owner of a team has been banned from baseball for violating rule 21.
@@MetroCSN oh it's simple alright. the voters are a bunch of self righteous sanctimonious hypocritical pricks.
sure ban the owner from being involved in mlb. that's fine.But Rose belongs in the HOF and should have been there before he died.
Idc what he did, the HOF isn't a boy scout club. There's guy's in the dang thing that gambled(Shoeless Joe Jackson/1919 Black Sox scandal). Keeping Charlie Hustle out is ridiculous, but if I'm his family I would refuse to attend or participate
(edited the date bcuz I had 1921 at 1st)
Shoeless Joe is not in the HoF for the same reason Pete Rose isn't.
The last 30 seconds is an absolute evisceration of Pete Rose as a human being.
They won't let Pete in I had heard he already wrote the speech it was given to I think his grandson to be read at the ceremony maybe it's all good but the man is gone now so he does not have to omit anything I'd like to know what was written if true
He should have been in the HOF a long time ago.... now the HOF doesn't deserve to have him.
Ultimately, and obviously, Pete caused these problems.
BUT...
I also have to say that people like Johnny Bench and Dan Patrick (and others, but these are the most relevant here), who had the ear of commissioners along the way, could've put in a stronger word for him instead of secretly shit-talking him or setting their own self-aggrandizing conditions on reinstatement. They know they helped keep him out and now that he's dead, they'll have to live with that, too. It's all pretty messed up.
If I was the person in Pete's family who decided whether to accept induction into the HOF now or not, I would say thanks but no thanks. We all knew that the HOF was morbidly awaiting for Pete to die and was then going to induct him. It was quite the low-life stunt to pull in my opinion. TBH, it was never a HOF without Pete Rose in it. Does it really matter whether he's in the HOF or not? Not really, no. There are dozens of people in the HOF that were put in as players that never ever played a single out of MLB, not even one.
Where dose it say you need to be a saint to get recognized as one of the best players in your sport? The baseball Hall of Fame is already a bunch of hypocrites. Pete Rose is worthy by his playing career. Put him in or close down the Hall of Fame.
No body respects a rule from a organization that promotes betting on their sport. Charlie Hustle should be in HOF.
If I was Pete Rose or his family I would tell MLB and the HOF that under no circumstance can they use my likeness or name in the HOF.
In the 1970s, the sister of one of the Reds told me that Rose was a notorious bum. Just a crappy guy.
I would take Pete Rose on my team every single day. Period.
If pete rose aint in the hall of Fame then it doesn't count
Two thoughts to bat down:
1. MLB promoting betting on all sports, including baseball seems to mitigate Rose’s transgressions and his lifetime ban for betting.
2. HoF is, I think, for on the field performance. Not on whether you are a good or bad guy. Lot’s of bad actors, bigots, in HoF. Rose on bb performance deserves to be in.
"happy kok" that was our nickname for j.bench. he was always happy & always a kok irl.
Dan would CANCEL half the Hall if he had his way...
Pete for the HOF ✊