Integration hell! Finding matching stock for Märklin 3083 (ETAT 231)...
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- In this video, we are going to look at a lovely Märklin 3083, an ETAT 231, that I have had in the collection for many years. We’ll try and place it in historical context, use this information to identify matching stock and hopefully locate and acquire models to assemble a train, so the locomotive finally sees some action. If you’d like you can stay with for a bit as I embark on a rather tumultuous journey.
Enjoy!
Models featured in the video:
- Märklin 3083 Série 231
- REE Modèles - VB-267 and VB-268 Voitures OCEM RA (OCEM RA coaches)
Sous titrage auto-traduit disponible, pour voir comment faire: • Petite astuce - Sous-t...
Automatisch übersetzte Untertitel verfügbar, wie macht man das? Siehe: • Kleiner Tipp - RUclips...
Channel email: the3rdrailchannel@gmail.com
Subscription: / @the3rdrail
Sources and credits:
www.maerklin.de
www.wikipedia.org
SNCF History:
www.sncf.com/fr/groupe/patrim...
Archives SNCF:
www.archives.sncf.com/
openarchives.sncf.com
OCEM RA Overview from a very good site: Train Consultant Clive Lamming
trainconsultant.com/2022/11/1...
Voiture P.O.
trainconsultant.com/2022/11/1...
Docrail:
site: www.docrail.fr
OCEM related galleries:
Rivets apparents: docrail.fr/les-voitures-de-l-... and RA B9: docrail.fr/voitures-ocem-rive...
Panneaux lisses: docrail.fr/les-voitures-c10-o...
CpaRama:
Forum topic: Locomotives et trains de l'Etat
www.cparama.com/forum/viewtop...
search terms to use for material used in this video:
C 11 - Machine n°231-991, type 231 "Pacific", série 231-981 à 231-996 construite entre 1908 et 1918 - Editeur : F.Fleury.
C 97 - Machine n° 3605 Bavaroise, type 231 "Pacific", série 3602 à 3679 construite de 1908 à 1918 - Editeur : F.Fleury.
82 - L'Express Manche-Océan (Hendaye-Saint-Malo) à Saintes (Charente-Inférieure) vers 1933.
Locomotive "Pacific" ex. Etat Bavarois construite par Maffeï entre 1908 et 1918, série 231-981 à 231-996, type 231.
Editeur : H.M.P.
Locomotive à vapeur, type "Pacific", n° 231-982, en tête d'un train du Réseau de l'Etat.
Locomotive à vapeur, type 231 "Pacific", n° 3605 du Réseau de l'Etat.
Locomotive à vapeur, type " Pacific ", n° 231-983 du Réseau des Chemins de fer de l'Etat.
Locomotive à vapeur, type " Pacific ", n° 231-996 du Réseau des Chemins de fer de l'Etat.
Other:
Voiture OCEM Soudée Allégée
reseau3gg.centerblog.net/4562-...
Interesting armistice material:
C 139 - Machine n° 131-901, type 131 "Pacific", construite en 1912 - Editeur : F.Fleury.
C 145 - Machine n°140-928, type "Consolidation" pour trains de marchandise, série 140-908 à 140-955 construite par les Etablissements J.A.Waffée (?) à Munich (Allemagne) entre 1915 et 1919 - Editeur : F.Fleury.
C 173 - Machine-tender n°42-909, type 141T "Mikado", construite en 1917 par la Société Hanomag à Hanovre (Allemagne).
Editeur : F.Fleury.
Slam door/wooden coaches:
2 - Train de Marée Paris-Dieppe - Editeur : ND.
9 - Le train de Paris-Mantes par Poissy - Editeur : ND.
Voiture de 3° classe n° 3681 du Réseau de l'Etat - Carte-photo.
Voiture de 1° classe n° Alz 281 du Réseau de l'Etat - Carte-Photo.
#Märklin #mgleis #analog #wartung #tmrguk #mobaanalog Märklin layout #ETAT #231 #REE Märklin trains #Spielbahn voiture OCEM RA 
Развлечения
Despite all the troubles - it is a beautiful train! Enjoy ;-) Bo
It is growing on me 😉
Thank you for this most informative video. I have had the same problems with REE & Roco rolling stock, that you have so patiently and thoroughly dealt with. I am in your debt, as I did not persevere and put mine away for another day - which if I now follow your example, will allow me to utilise them on my layout as originally anticipated.
Glad this was useful. Roco should be easy I think as they make AC wheelsets for most of their stock. Good luck!
Great video! I appreciate the research you have done to assure that your model consist matches the prototype. As you have discovered, when one mixes locomotives and rolling stock from different manufacturers. you have to deal with "Integration hell". Not fun, but you did a fantastic job and the results more than compensate for the extra work.
And there is one more entry in the www.modelrailroadcollector.wiki too now 😉 Glad you enjoyed the video, thanks for the visit!
Félicitations pour avoir réussi à trouver un train adapté à la locomotive bavaroise 231, un exploit qui nous assaille tous depuis les débuts de ce modèle Märklin. Nous vous sommes grandement redevables, vous qui êtes de langue maternelle française et qui comprenez l'organisation des publications sources. En revanche, le mieux que j’ai fait pour correspondre à ce modèle est de tirer parti des probables mélanges de wagons lors de la mise en place du système ferroviaire national. Ainsi, à la suite de la locomotive, viennent un fourgon postal à claire-voie en provenance de Lima, un wagon-lits et un wagon-restaurant dans lesquels fut signé l'Armistice de 1918, quelques voitures de 3e classe Paris, Orléans et du Midi, et une voiture-bar SNCF naissante disponible chez Jouef. . Les choses qu'il faut faire en l'absence d'information !
Ce qui compte, c'est de tirer du plaisir de nos trésors, quelle que soit la composition. Content de lire que la vidéo vous ait été utile. Ce doit étre un aspect de ce loisir qui m'intéresse le plus. Chercher, trouver le premier fil, et le suivre pour voir le sujet s'éclaircir un peu plus, lien après lien. Il ne me reste qu'à trouver des voitures OCEM ETAT de seconde classe maintenant 🤔... Mais je laisse cela pour plus tard, lorsque j'aurais fini de ne pouvoir manger que des pommes de terre 😉😉 Les sources d'information sont listées en description. Like, share and subscrbe comme ils disent en anglais... 🙏
Excellent video as normal. I understand fully of what you went through there. Having bought myself a REE coach set. Again a very nice set, but kept derailing on track track. I have filmed them on my own RUclips channel. But I simply gave up and sold them for Marklin coaches. These days I tend to buy shorter Marklin coaches of era 3 to run around my 36 radius curves. Era 3 being older than I usually want. As all my engines are era 4. Still I enjoy watching my trains as well. Keep up the good work. 👍
We got there in the end... Thanks for the visit. 🙏
@MrBrenren : looks like the answer for K-track is a NO. 😉
Merci pour cette superbe et passionnante vidéo. Et en plus même avec mon faible niveau en anglais j’ai tout compris car vous parlez avec un bon rythme et tout est bien prononcé ❤
Mission accomplie! 😉 Merci d'avoir passé un peu de votre temps précieux ici aujourd'hui. 🙏
@@The3rdRail oh oui mission accomplie ! 😉. Est-ce que vous pouvez me dire le site que vous parcourez au début de la vidéo à 00:40 ?
@Spe666 www.modelrailroadcollector.wiki. Il y a aussi une de mes vidéos sur ce sujet: ruclips.net/video/vvO2jiLFCgo/видео.html
@@The3rdRail Merci beaucoup !
These times of transition are very interesting to model. In the USA when Penn Central went bankrupt, the government organized Amtrak and Conrail. There was lots of mismatched rolling stock.
I love messy trains and transitions 👍 Do you know of a good site where I could find high level information on US railways?
No, I really don't. There are good websites with photos. I have been concentrating on the history of electric locomotives in my area, which includes the Swedish Rc4 that was tested here (and the French CC 21000). Sorry, I'll have to buy you a beer or coffee sometime!
I think you have already... 😉
This is exactly why I started collecting the old tinplate stuff. A valiant effort on your part!
Felt a bit like torture at times but we got there in the end... Thanks for the visit!
Thanks!
Very kind of you good Sir! Thanks!
Thanks for the video. I always appreciate seeing you try out new things and working your way through the problems.
Thanks for watching!
I actually love the "kit bashing". Great job & great review! Watching from the US. I bought a Märklin dealer display layout from a charity auction. It is what got me involved in Märklin trains. Previously I was collecting two rail HO. Keep up the great, informative videos!
Glad you enjoyed it. Have fun with your trains...
A very attractive train, even the colour seems a good match with the loco. Well worth the money - who wants a Märklin Flying Scotsman anyway? You would only have more "integration hell" with one of those.
Yep colours are nice. Thanks for the visit!
Would Hogwarts Express fit to Flying Scotsman?
Well, yes and no. FS was an LNER engine, while the Hogwarts express is a fictional train, based a GWR prototype - in the movies, anyway. Even after nationalisation, the engine classes pretty much remained in the regions they came from. The FS Märklin made is the current museum livery, which means it could go with just about any British outline coaches. Märklin themselves suggest the Orient Express set, which is a continental prototype, which would never have been hauled by the Flying Scotsman.
Point is, Märklin made it because of its centenary last year, that's it. I really don't think it was a wise investment in design and tooling, because it is of no interest to a British outline modeller. First of all, nobody would have 3-rail AC 00 scale layout for it to run on, and if they did, then the scale would be wrong. 00 is 1:76, H0 is 1:87, both on the same gauge. The Trix version might have a better chance, but then, the scale is still wrong. So, you cannot just get any British cooaches, which are all 1:76 scale either. For a collector of Märklin steam locomotives, with a good credit rating, it's a must-have, but it would be an expensive oddball just about anywhere else. That's my two cents on that!
@@jochenkraus7016
Thanks for all the research and history! The result is beautiful. I will have to rewatch this!
Glad you enjoyed it! You are too kind!
Wow, what a gorgeous consist, and very didactic once again. Well, that must have been quite the adventure if not a tad frustrating there perhaps. Wheels was our first thought but bon chance finding replacements for M-rails combined with the contemporary fine scale coaches as they are... Quite the feat that you actually succeeded! We really don't understand why diameters of rolling parts aren't specified as such to customers... A step the industry really should have taken already as a standard we would think. 10s of mm can make a vital difference. Brawa is expensive but we'll keep that in mind. Great telling about the French railways btw. Something new learnt there as well. Excellent, and thank you again for this superb upload and all your patience for sharing.
Thanks Linda!
This is a really beautiful train!
Thanks you very much, it is growing on me.
Much of the new stock is not backward compatible. The increasing demand for prototype fidelity and closer to finescale standards demand a tighter tolerance track that is very well laid to suit it. The only reason you don't hear more complaints is that so few people actually run the trains they buy. Many of these high fidelity sets live in boxes waiting for a someday layout...or gasp....an estate sale (where I buy most of my highly detailed items to play with). I'd also observe that even new marklin equipment is intolerant of track variations such as vertical curve transitions that older marklin equipment would not notice. There are several german language youtubes with these complaints.
Yep, times have changed 😉
@@The3rdRailI'm biased but I think you've chosen the best decade to collect...
Thank you for another video.
It was obviously a trying task, and cost more than you’d have wanted, but it does look absolutely great. You could have spent a lot of money, and effort, on something that ended up being a bit disappointing. That’s certainly not the case on this.
Fortunately this is a one off type of exercise, thanks for stopping by today.
Excellent and informative video as always. Looks like you found a really nice set of coaches, no doubt the quality today is what you are paying for. It is a pity though that the newer models do not always run well on older track systems. Enjoy your new addition to the collection
Many thanks! Nice of you to pop by today.
A bit expensive, yes, but it's a heck of a nice train. Not exactly my epoch but if I were a millionaire... would consider getting these as well.
Thanks for making me feel like a millionaire 😉
I can't help but wonder how those coaches would have coped with K-Track or C-Track out of the box. I have several non Marklin wagons that are fine on those formats but a nightmare on M-Track...
no idea... for obvious reasons 😉
Actually the ETAT slam door coaches were not exactly too old for these locos as railways keep rolling stock running long after it's obsolete, which is how a few sets of these have ended up in museums. the DR used compartment coaches from the 1900s until the 50's!
you have skipped over that bit 😉 or you have not seen it yet 😀
If you Sir, are "only an idiot user" (33:55) that would make many of the rest of us infantile in the extreme - I've spent many hours trying to copy your wiring system (backed by zero ability or manuals) and still can't reliably get a block system to work !
In all seriousness, I've learned a lot from you - particularly in the servicing department - critical since all my units are 1960s-1989 in the main. Please continue to upload as I daresay there are many of us who oneway strive to be classed as "idiot users"
🤣
Start simple (ie. oval, 2 blocks), then add complication 😉Glad the channel content is helpful 🙏
Impressive experiment! i run lilliput ex DR carriages in po midi and alsace lorraine livery with this loco! Is it bad?
😀 they are your trains, you do what you want with them...
Thanks a lot for this great video. Since R37 are gorgeous, could they be used on C Track without changing the axles? Have you tried?
No worries, I havent tried any R37 stuff, so would not be able to tell.There is a user called xarklin on youtube who seems to be using some of their stuff as well as REE. He might be able to tell you what he had to do. I think he is also a member of the forum 3 rails in France.
@@The3rdRail Thanks a lot I will ask him
Hello The 3rd Rail ! Great super Excellent video !
OH no you're not the only one... I have the märklin Märklin 3317 BR 231 SNCF
now just a WAGON FOURGON LA POSTE PTT JOUEF PLEASE help me to find Passenger Cars that will fit so that you will like it =)
i hope for SNCF it is easyer to find?
I bought that lokomotive to pull my Le Mistral from Marseille to Nice, will that work in your wildest dreams too? (sorry for my english!)
i mean, will there may be only one time that have happend? ...so i can drive it with some 4076 INOX with a smile?
thank you so much for your so well made videos with all that information! i like it, like it YES i doooo... ;)
YOU are a real märklin, no better, a real "how put some trains to gether that make sense" Rock ’n’ Roller hero for me =))
all the best regards
the fernlenker
AND YES! it is so mad from märklin, even if there had been fitting märklin Passenger Cars, they are no more available !!! ??? WHY?
so many NOHAB from DSB and NSB had to pull only Fraightwaggons?
to get for this Lokomotives the märklin Passengercars, the hunt was insane...
so i understand your invest ;)
At the end of the day, they are your trains, you do what you want with them, what matters is that you enjoy them, not what others think.
Wikipedia says the French Bavarian 231s were withdrawn by 1951. From my research, they stayed in the west of France until the end as far as I understand. Mistral was in service on the other side of France and INOX cars were built from 1952 onwards so not a good match if you care about this. My guess would be to use OCEM coaches (RA or PL) with S.N.C.F. markings (no logo, just letters), late ep. II/early ep. III. The manufacturers I mentioned in the video all did these at some point, and I think there are plenty stocked new in shops (at least they were when I did my research for ETAT), so should be much easier to find. I'd look at french stores such as www.jura-modelisme.fr , www.maurienne-trains.com or aupullman.com , you can usually filter by epoch and company on these sites.
Glad you enjoy the channel, thanks for your time today.
@@The3rdRail Hello, YES i enjoy every Second of your Videos !
AND much more that you send me that Answer! i noticed it in my 231 Projekt to not forget
AND only if you have time or know it right now? I think you know every thing about a all fitting Train =)
so what kind of Steamlokomotive was pulling the Le Mistral to Nice?
if no time, thank you for the wiki Tipp!
I like like your trains are look so good !
HOPE i can make a video where you can then tell if you like that train i build up =)
thank you so much for your effort!
greetings
Stefan
@@The3rdRail i like, like you said it is like Flying Scotsman range... BUT your Train is more charming(?) and looks so good!
i understand you so much! the hunt for the Le Mistral Generator Car brought me for the wohle Train in that same direction =)
and waht others think did not matter, but where you are my hero! it matters what you think ;)
where is the Fun, if just have get together what ever lays around or just märklin offers trains?
looking you videos is so inspiring
de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mistral_(Zug) 😉
@@The3rdRail Thank YOU ! =))
As far as I know the French had not been satisfied by the performance of Bavarian class S 3/6 and they tried to sell them back to Germany. But the Germans refused to buy, they had allready better machines.
Interesting, but, somehow, that sounds debatable... The routes they were used on were difficult, and they stayed in service for a very long time, They were even refitted... If they hadn't been up to the job, the French would have disposed of them very quickly... They was a huge amount of armistice stock to chose from... The S3/6 were in production until the early 30s, until that time there wasn't much better for the Reichsbahn to buy...Thanks for the visit and for sharing!
Another great history research project !! This is one of my favorite Class 231 locomotives !!
I have that loco and bought it as motive power for my Jouef "Orient Express" cars: ruclips.net/video/kEOAjhJs8Jo/видео.htmlsi=ENbb4jMZx3TZUEeD and used it as well for the Primex "Orient Express" and INOX cars: ruclips.net/video/fYfQv1V9Ahs/видео.htmlsi=ewvMSpYMlyznbkbD & ruclips.net/video/Ta2HNcUQkl4/видео.htmlsi=78fqqO0Pw9YS5L3f. This may not be historically correct, but looks good to me anyway. The OCEM (by Jouef) cars have been used behind my Jouef 141R: ruclips.net/video/NV3W18mI-DA/видео.htmlsi=X5rUDTB-zonwQcQb.
They are your trains, you do what you want with them 👍 From my research. The French S3/6s stayed in the west of France for the rest of their career at the SNCF. Glad you found the video interesting.
@@The3rdRail Your videos are always very interesting and informative !!! You’ve helped me many times putting together historically correct consists as well gave me inspiration to venture into new areas / themes etc. I’ll try the Jouef OCEM cars with the Märklin ETAT and share the outcome.
Wow, glad your perseverance and tenacity paid off and you were rewarded 😊 As can be seen from the comments, well appreciated for sharing .
Many thanks!
I just run what I have 🙂
you still had to get what you have at some point 😉
@@The3rdRail Yes of course 🙂
He also runs what he has. After he adjusted what he has to what fits the locomotives ;-)