Crab Guard / Cross Guard: Boxing, Muay Thai, MMA applications
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- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- The crab guard, cross guard, or “mummy” guard is a defensive boxing posture that is often used to block and parry punches. But does this boxing specific technique have applications in other combat sports? Specifically in Muay Thai and Mixed Martial Arts?
Yes.
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Ramsey Dewey is a retired pro fighter, combat sports coach, referee, and fight commentator… and occasional musician based in Shanghai, China.
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I fought professionally in Mixed Martial arts, Sanda, Muay Thai, K1 and American kickboxing from 2004-2011 when I was forced to retire due to a broken skull and being blinded in one eye. I hold a brown belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, Black belts in multiple traditional martial arts, including Taekwondo and kyokushin karate. I also train in catch wrestling, sambo, taijiquan, judo, and boxing.
I currently coach at the Animal MMA gym, the Extreme Fight Lab, and the Mordor Fight Club, all in Shanghai, China.
The Cross Guard or "Barring the Punches" as it was called way back in the 1700's was part of Bare Knuckle Boxing when it was essentially MMA, as well as Okinawan Karate that also involved grappling for self defense. It's meant specifically for mid and close range including grappling.
It's meant to cover the body and you duck your chin down into the top arm of the guard while the lower arm stays across the body so that your head and body are both protected at the same time.
You can pin their arms or raise their chin with your forearms, it prevents collar ties, you can get underhooks or block the inside of the thigh with the bottom arm, or you can post and frame on the back of your opponent's neck if they try to shoot for your hips.
1700's Bare Knuckle Champion Daniel Mendoza wrote about it in detail in his book about Boxing. As a Southpaw I keep my Right Arm over top because the top arm's elbow and tricep are for deflecting the lead hook over your head and that allows you to keep the other arm lower across your body.
So an orthodox Fighter should have their left arm over top vs Southpaws. Fighters trained it for both sides since most fighters switched stances so frequently back then.
To jab or punch with the top arm crossed, just snap your elbows to the sides of your ribs with your hands shoulder height before jabbing or hooking or whatever punch. It becomes a smooth quick transition and even a feint with practice.
Edit: The Cross Guard I use as a Southpaw is not the same "Dracula" cross guard that Fulmer used. He wrapped the top arm completely around his head with the elbow center in front of his face.
That weakens the entire guard and causes you to absorb more impact to your head through your guard, and he was unable to use a traditional jab.
I use the traditional cross guard with my forearm centered in front of my face and the palm and elbow on either side.
I use the orthodox version as a southpaw with my feet in southpaw as a southpaw with Orthodox opponents because my elbow needs to parry their left hook.
My cross guard is functionally the same as Archie Moore and George Foreman's cross guards, and I can jab as easily from mine unlike Fullmer because of that difference.
Traditionally before gloves all punches, guards were trained in both stances as switch hitting was the norm before specializing in one single stance became popular.
Thank you for this. I have a new rabbit hole to disappear into for a year or so ⬇️🐇💨👀!
I was just about to comment that we have structures like the cross block in karate that I use as a defensive shield and entry.
Yes cross arm Guard it goes back before 1700. Slave fights were known for it which was the beginning of prize fighting fun fact. The technique originated in Africa. It is also a staple of 52 blocks and jail house rock 2 boxing styles used black prize fighter
@byob7728 I don't use the cross guard that Fulmer used. He wrapped the top arm completely around his head with the elbow center in front of his face.
That weakens the entire guard and causes you to absorb more impact to your head through your guard, and he was unable to use a traditional jab.
I use the traditional cross guard with my forearm centered in front of my face and the palm and elbow on either side.
I use the orthodox version as a southpaw with my feet in southpaw as a southpaw with Orthodox opponents because my elbow needs to parry their left hook.
My cross guard is functionally the same as Archie Moore and George Foreman's cross guards, and I can jab as easily from mine unlike Fullmer because of that difference.
Traditionally before gloves all punches, guards were trained in both stances as switch hitting was the norm before specializing in one single stance became popular.
Switch hitting is far superior imo
I am a cross guard Thai boxer and there are very few videos detailing and breaking down it's use amazing vid thank you coach for covering this rare guard IT NEED MORE USE cross guard is life!
Visit Terrible Tim Witherspoon's channel. 2X heavyweight boxing world titlist, former sparring partner of Muhammad Ali, vocal proponent of both the Philly shell and the cross guard.
Agreed
I mean it works but it's mostly for boxers that don't care about their midsection being kicked.
I believe that one limit themselves, by thinking of one's self as a standard guard fighter or a cross guard fighter. By all means specialized in the cross guard, your abilities will be greatly improved by learning the other guard, if for no other reason than understanding your opponents game. With all due respect.
How do you protect your body? Would love some tips
I’ve always been fascinated by the cross guard and love watching boxers who use it will (Moore, Frazier, Norton, Foreman ect.) but have never really had much success with it. There are so few videos on how to use it properly. So glad you made this Coach
Sylvie Von Duuglas Ittu specialises in this guard in Muay Thai - I made a lot of use of it myself so I'm glad to see you covering it!
Sylvie is an absolute treasure.
I saw those videos too, very helpfull
I literally was just looking up stuff about this guard and now you upload this. Wow perfect timing!
Cool!
Great lesson. One thing a few of us discovered, is the opportunities a spearing straight elbow to either their guard, or open midsection while in the transition to jacketless grappling leaves. Muay Thai is of almost equal importance in mma as is generic submission grappling
I love your training partner. He is funny. I like seeing him
Jourdan is the best!
Knife-wielding maniac and a great dancer
Another possible technique that Archie Moore used (he taught the cross guard to George Foreman) is to rotate your hips and torso in the same way as when throwing a straight but with the cross guard up for parryng punches with the elbow of the right arm and launch a left hook counter punch
This is the best explanation of the cross guard ever ever
This looks similar to how Dustin Poirier blocks punches in his fights
He uses 52 blocks which comes from prison fighting
So glad you finally gave yout thoughts on my favorite guard. I had lost hope on this but you keep impressing us ; well done !
Also, it is a bit unfortunate you haven't evoked Archie Moore nor the '"Mormon Mauler" AKA "the Cyclon" AKA Gene Fullmer, especially since the latter had a very good cross guard (he beat Robinson twice...). This version isn't only more appropriate in close combat, but it can prevent the opponent from grappling with you, or give you some whizzers etc.
I encountered something like this with Lyte Burly of 52 Blocks/Jailhouse Rock when I lived in NY, called Skull and Bones. It also dovetailed into my empty-hands Arnis training to "defang the snake" in elbowing a fist as it comes it. Great to see another analysis/perspective on it from the Coach! Thank you!
With skull n bones the arms are more together and center towards the chest also u use ur hand to catch punches
I box like this in southpaw it’s a good way to set up counter power shots
This is an excellent guard to use when fighting opposite stance from your opponent!
I usually use the high guard, and I use the crossbones guard, along with the dracula shell for backup
The beard looks awesome Ramsey. Protect it well with this guard.
Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Archie Moore, Ken Norton and Gene Fulmer popularized this kind of guard in Boxing.. i used it a lot in sparring and it's very effective to block straight punches
Just about the only channel that discusses the cross guard in the context of MMA!
Terrible Tim Witherspoon has done several videos on the cross guard in the last year. All very instructive.
Tim Witherspoon is the MAN!
@@RamseyDewey did you see that he took his time to help if you ask and send him a sparing ?
@@RamseyDewey ruclips.net/user/live_8-MGVipA7w?si=TUezfNjjeAcWGhc-
Cross guard is great when shooting double legs to protect against knees.
This was great timing I happen to be coaching a class on this fairly soon and have been eating up all the info on it that I can. I must say, I'm starting to like it myself
Awesome video, and I must say that pokemon suit is badass
It’s the Cross Arm Guard and it’s apart of 52 blocks and jail house rock These we’re arts used by Black prize fighters during slavery. Frazier and Foreman used it and so did Holyfield
Works best of your opponent is taller or squat low when moving in.
Finally! Now I know the name of this damn thing!
It's my favorite weird guard
I am glad to see that you have some mobility. I had assumed that your knee was so bad that you could not punch or be taken down and become one of those teachers that walks around and tells people to try harder, maybe hit them with a stick when they make a mistake. So many teachers talk about how tough they used to be and are unable to demonstrate or explain what they need from their students. Those were always my least favorite classes. I am relieved to see that you are not going down that direction
First session back after a couple weeks off for injury's, I've had a play around with this tonight.
Not sure if or how it fits into my game yet but my initial thoughts are that theres a lot of potential here
Especially since I kinda do some of the things you outlined in your video but I've always thought of it as part of the Philly shell
I did enjoy being able to frame my left forearm on my opponents guard and push them into a corner, something I usually do by clinching up or pushing with a long guard
Tried in a boxing session today so tomorrow I'm going to try it in MMA striking class
Thanks for the video Ramsey i’m gonna incorporate the crab guard since i tend to parry and block more then i use head movement
In capoeira when you go into the base the ginga youre basically switching cross guards.
In every step, because capoeira doesnt have stances, youre holding a cross guard with one of your arms.
This guard is easier for me to get into in mma because its what im used to.
Capoeira has 3 dynamic stances, all at play during the ginga- and they are the same as the three basic wrestling stances and serve the same purpose: power leg forward, power leg back, neutral stance.
@@RamseyDewey yeah you can call them dynamic stances.
We dont stay in them for long so we are not stationary, thats how we are tought. And we also have exaggerated dodges, headbuts, palm strikes, elbows, takedowns, knees, and of course kicks but thats not allowed in the tournaments in Azerbaijan. just the kicks and takedowns and jumping over the opponent to score a point which i dont like.
But i train those other areas with my coach and capoeira DOES have freestyle wrestling moves.
They go well together.
I believe capoeira to be a complete martial art but the rules for the tournaments dont allow it to be a martial art rather it turns into a game.
And lastly jiu jitsu goes well with capoeira also
The front scissor takedown leads to the banana split.
Im sorry this reply is long but thank you for your time and thank you for what youre doing for the martial arts community.
Take care
I love it when you do striking technique videos. Unrelated question: What do you think about fighters doing sit-ups, is it garbage training? The coaches at my gym are thai, so I don't think I'll stop doing them anytime soon, but I want to know your opinion. Thanks for doing the good work coach!
Sit ups don’t make you worse. But have you done Atlas sit ups? Now there is a great exercise for fighters. It’s both a dynamic stretch for the posterior chain, and strengthening exercise with direct athletic cross over for several key fighting techniques. Perhaps I’ll make a tutorial.
Yes
Thank goodness I asked the question
I think Dustin porier uses his own version of this anyone else notice?
Crab/shell/shoulder roll
Love it. I like to work (and block) with elbows and backfists. So this looks like a great guard for me
Gonna try this today. Thanks
Let me know how it goes!
Cool stuff! kind of a Philly shell and Defence Labs combo!
It’s just an old Philly shell variation.
You ever see the Christopher Nolan Batman movies? The style Batman uses in those is Defence Labs... This reminds me of that.
Its weird how i try understand and think of a technique and ramsey makes a video the next day bout the same technique 😅 nice💯🙏🏽
Can you do another cross gaurd video with some more strategies, like best time to use it, offensive combos and defending body shots and kicks?
This could be very nice guard for self defense just imagine hitting than elbow with bare hand.
Great video. Although I would also mention kidney and liver shot. Like you said, if you do it from a close distance or use a wrong timing you will probably eat a good body shot if not a takedown.
Love your content. Thanks for the knowledge.
Got a question
I have a lead straight that hits very hard. Because of it's powe and reach
I over rely on it as a weapon and as a threat to lead them in to other weapons.
I have started mixing it up and purposely firing my straight to early so it is weak manly using it as a feeler.
In early rounds they avoid it.
When they stop respecting it and stand in front of it or even push though. I hold on as long as I can then I find it much easier to finish with a attack he is no longer afraid
of any longer.
So what are some other ways I can trian my opponents to stop worrying and love my bombs.
I love Jordan outfit! ❤❤❤
Thank you for the video Coach! I feel like this is one of the less-talked-about guards in general. Also, sorry if this question might be a little off-topic, but which do you find safer for fighters when it comes to exposure to damage: the 3 minutes 12 rounds maximum duration in Boxing, or the 5 minutes 5 rounds maximum duration in MMA?
They’re not really comparable. If it was 3x12 of boxing vs 5x5 of boxing, we could talk about it. Or if it was 3x12 of MMA vs 5x5 of MMA, we could talk.
In MMA rounds, generally speaking, fewer strikes will land than in boxing because a significant amount of the round is spent clinch fighting and grappling. And when strikes do land, they often do different kinds of damage (kicks, knees, elbows, little rock hard gloves)
In boxing, fighters that have been knocked down are given the opportunity to get up and continue the fight in a potentially concussed state, up to 3 times per round! That’s irresponsibly dangerous.
@@RamseyDewey Wow, I hadn't thought about it like that. It does make sense though, since the ruleset is indeed very different.
In this case, I'll specify then: 3x12 of boxing vs 5x5 of boxing: which would be safer for the fighters, in your opinion?
@@luzk1031 there is less risk of potential cumulative damage in a 25 minute fight than a 36 minute fight.
@@RamseyDewey Thank you Coach!
I probably would absorb 1 punch , slide back and front kick .
Joe Fraizer developed the crossguard in such a great way
Sucks for Tony Fryklund to be best known for being on the receiving end of one of the all time great KOs
Can you use the cross armed guard like a modified philly shell for MMA takedown defense by putting the lead hand more downwards with the elbow flared when in clinching range
With my primary background being wrestling, I really don't understand this guard. A static elbow sideways like that is just a free elbow pass? When you showed it at a distance, you did show how crucial it was to be moving to the outside on your elbow side, but if they are trying to circle to that side of your body, it just seems like a huge liability. If I saw someone do this, my first thought is to jab toward the elbow side, then instead of retracting, to follow my jab with the elbow pass/ arm drag. If they are planning on following my jab back, that just makes it easier. At the very least, I should get a very good attacking angle for my double this way? Is there something obvious I'm missing, since the only grapple covered was a leg attack?
Probably should not stay in the crab guard for long
This is very 52 Blocks, Kali, old school Pugilism / Bareknuckle boxing
How exposed is your body? It looks like your ribs are susceptible to a roundhouse or body hook but im not sure how much thatll actually happen in a fight. I've also seen a crossguard where both hands are by your chin. While it covers less of your head, it protects the body a bit more. What are your thoughts?
As long as you know what’s exposed, what isn’t what your opponent can & can’t hit, and from where, you can plan accordingly.
Just like any high guard, you should not simply “keep your hands up” in that position throughout the fight. But rather cover up only to block an incoming strike and set up your own counter attack.
I was using the cross guard until I my kidneys wrote me and desist letter
👍👍
Oh, this was my natural style of guarding
nice toony rushguard
Reminds me of the coaches that yell "Use your 52s" 🙂
I can’t say I’ve heard that before. What does that mean?
Nice Wolverine representation 😅
Ey, did you have considered blending this with unarmed heaven six? It may give you the chance of delivering a barrage of sneaky and very nasty punches/elbows. I'd love to see some testing. You know, by others than myself too.
Isn’t Heaven Six a Kali/Arnis/Escrima stixkfighting technique? What does the unarmed version look like?
@@RamseyDewey Yes! It is! Cool thing about fma stuff is that switchting tools anything works more or less the same. In this particular case you perhaps will see some straigths being blended with hammerfists and elbows since is actually panantukan related. Strikes are chained, and alternating sides. There is trapping possibility and seem to work really nicely with such model of closed high guard that you are presenting. There is a small channel here named Wmpyr (Or something like that) which have been running like 10+ yrs showcasing kali. There i'm sure you will find an example in video of unarmed heaven six or fragments of it. There are some things that are difficult to explain by words but may be easily exemplified visually.
Wmpyr? He used to do podcasts with Kwonkicker. I didn’t know he did kali. Cool.
Unrelated but "Heaven Six" sounds like an awesome name for an anime attack!
Is there any increased risk of rotator cuff injury due to the constant internal rotation of in the case of an orthodox stance the left shoulder joint?
I've seen this in Creed 3
cross guard for blocking headkicks???? How well does this work?
I have a powerful lead straight thati over use. As a weapon and a tool to bring opponents to my othe power shots.
Lately I have been firing it early to make it weaker until they don't respect it. And they stand right in front of it.
How else can i train my opponents to stop worrying and love my bombs.
Nobody good will stand right in front of your straight punches. Getting off the centerline and flanking your opponent from the side is core to pugilism. That’s more important any amount of power, speed, or any other athletic attribute.
Hello Ramsey i have another question i have no trouble with blocking and parrying punches but when it comes to my head it’s like a basketball hoop i have trouble moving it
You shouldn’t be moving your head independently of your body. “Head movement” starts with footwork- specifically moving off the centerline. This looks like a job for another video!
I'm thinking, full body Pokemon tattoos, why not
Say, Jordan, that's -er, quite the outfit you've got on there.....
How many powerful punches can absorb that guard before the damage passes through, going KO?
Exactly 7.8 punches 🤪 No. No, of course not. There are so many variables in that equation. Not all punches are equal. Not all fighters are equal, and the ever changing dynamic positions of a fight are never the same twice. If you are getting hit on your guard at all, you need to start fighting back. We went over this.
Where's the Mr. Krabs outfit?
Total missed opportunity!
I feel seen
Very informative. Thank you both.
A question, if I may: I saw Icy Mike use a similar guard in a video while sparring with another martial arts youtuber (I don't remember who it was). The difference was the leading arm, which was like the crab guard but at the waist level. Not a Philly shell, since he had a squared stance and the right arm was exactly like yours.
Any idea if it is a specific guard or just something random he came up with during sparring? Could it be that the arm is there to protect against a takedown?
Thank you.
The names don’t matter they just describe generalized positions from which certain defenses and offenses are made easier/more difficult based on their body mechanics. Both hands up can be bladed, cross guard can be squared, everything is relative and situational.
Low lead arm could also be used to get free underhooks in a clinch possibly
Jordan looks like he's wearing a green screen suit and someone's editing in pokemon screensavers onto his body!
Shhhhhhhh!!! Don’t let everyone know that Jourdan is a CGI creation!
Where'd that bloke get his Rash guard?
All the rashgaurds in this video are from xmartial.com
Use my code RAMSEY10 for 10% off everything on the website.
Turn that palm up. The foreman bone is stronger in that position
There are 2 bones in the forearm. Which one are you talking about? The radius or the ulna?
now i know the name of this hand position i thought i discovered😅😂😂😂😂😂
George Foreman and Archie Moore have also used it
Its not crab Gard ... its 52 Blockss cmon man they have to know ! Its a beautifull art
52 blocks is a single high guard technique? EI: the crab guard/cross guard/mummy guard? That’s surprising.
Also surprising you seem to think that a style dating back to 1970 borrowing techniques from boxing, a martial art dating back thousands of years, should take precedence when it comes to naming techniques.
@@RamseyDewey i d9nt think we understand each other on that but its ok. We all love to have new knowledge so thx for yours.
mine is not good enough for internet and I dont have ego to get crazy on internet like our friend Jordan.
Its was a comment of love for martial art.
Not à I know more then anyone.
But its internet.
@@RamseyDewey fun part is with open mind, am the only one to have learn somthing here.
@@RamseyDewey here a super live with Tim and 52 blocks ....ruclips.net/user/live_8-MGVipA7w?si=TUezfNjjeAcWGhc-
52... Anyone?!
I’m 45.
Shame on you for not mentioning the late Ken Norton who was the *GREATEST* to ever use this guard! He would bob and weave with it and use his positioning to throw crisp hooks and uppercuts directly from the guard!
But I taught Kenny Boy
I thought it was Archie Moore ?
just get your squat to 500lb NOBODY will mess with a 500lb squatter.....
Is that why all combat sports champions have never trained martial arts and 'just squat'?
Everything that makes you a better athlete makes you a better fighter. My max low back squat is 175 kilos (385lbs) but compared to people who don’t squat at all, I’m basically superhuman.
Every serious combat sports athlete should make an effort to be at least an intermediate lifter when it comes to squats and deadlifts, in my opinion.
That elbow attack somehow reminds me of the Bajiquan elbow attack.