I'm about the same age as you guys. Been shooting since I was 9. I've literally watched thousands of videos on firearms and have never heard of this channel. It's obvious why. Listening to you guys talk is like going to grandpas house. I have around 50 handguns, one of which is the new M&P 5.7. I feel there is a spot for it in my collection. The drug cartels in Mexico are paying up to $5k for 5.7 pistols on the black market because of the massive increase in the use of body armor. These cartel members shoot at each other every day. I value the opinion of those idiots more than the couch grandpas. Enjoy your obscurity.
I love it to and the price on the black market is accurate I’m Mexican American and I travel to Mexico twice a year have 3 57 from different manufacturers and I love it
Sorry but it’s the same argument as the 45 vs 9mm, 9 has less stopping power but Carries more ammo and lighter with less kick, well 5.7 is lighter, kicks a lot less and you get more ammo per mag. So if you say the 5.7 isn’t good enough, then you have to say the 9 isn’t good enough so we need to carry 45 or 10mm.
5.7x28mm doesn't pass the FBI ballistics tests, but 9mm does. The difference in internal ballistics between .45 ACP, .40 S&W and 9mm is negligible, while the difference to 5.7x28mm is rather obvious. 5.7x28mm isn't good enough from a performance standpoint, plain and simple.
@@charliefoxtrot5001 it's a glorified plinker . After all it's been around since 1990. Some 33 years . Gun manufacturer's are running out of new gun ideas . Thee New fad is PDW . Keep in mind all the key board warriors think they are Ethan Hunt . The cool factor sells these days
@@charliefoxtrot5001 This is incorrect. Perhaps you simply weren't aware of newer developments since your wrote his 8 months ago. However, there are types of 5.7 ammo that work just as effectively as 9mm. Even more so because they penetrate armor, go into the gel over 12 inches (per FBI), and tumble significantly. I had to respond because I keep seeing you post this misinformation in other comments. You should read up on it more.
@@TradeDrifter I went through this discussion with others. There are speciality 5.7x28mm rounds (e.g., Dragon Fang and Elite Ammunition) that are either unreliable, discontinued, unavailable, or cost $3/round. They barely achieve what 9mm does and can penetrate certain type of soft body armor from a pistol barrel, but not rifle plates. Factory target or self defense ammo that actually is available (still at steeper prices), functions reliably, and the average 5.7 owner buys does not do that. It is not even remotely comparable with 9mm in terms of internal ballistics. 5.7x28mm is a niche round for fanboys. It doesn't solve any problems. It just creates more. People should spend that money on training, rather than on some magical equipment. PS: Understand that the FBI ballistics tests include more than just a bare gel test or a denim + gel test. There are other barriers being tested. Passing the test means to have sufficient penetration after passing that barrier. There isn't a single service round being offered in 5.7x28mm that passes the FBI ballistics test! Federal, Speer and Hornady do not offer 5.7x28mm service rounds for a reason.
A 5.7 IS VERY ACCURATE. WHEN EVERYTHING IS EVALUATED HD ABOUT GUN AND ACCURACY. STOPPING ATTACKER MAKES GUN BEAUTIFUL AND PERFECT. Hitting target at greater distance is game changer
@DWDAmateur I had a 407A on mine (was free with another package) and it was fine, but my wife does not like red dot's so I took it off and am just running with stock sights and a flashlight +green laser on the lower rail. It's so accurate and fires smoothly with almost no recoil. The PSA 5.7 is just a great piece.
The guy says the few live targets that were shot with 5.7 wasn’t affective. Hmmmm ask the people at fort hood was it affective. 👌👍 the lowest 5.7 has similar ballistics as a +p 9mm. I’ve seen the data and it looks very promising.
The first part of this comment is obviously off, as you could replace 5.7x28 with a 22 LR and still innocent people would have been killed. The second, that a low tier 5.7x28 is as powerful as 9x19 +P is just complete nonsense. On ft-lb you get to standard pressure 9x19 with about 330 ft-lb, but that is out of a 5‘ barrel. Really weak stuff. Top end 9x19s get into the high 400s. The only real life pro this cartridge has over 9x19 is that some special loads penetrate 3a.
@@nikos6220 the problem is people can’t get out of that Rambo mindset that people get into. And honestly your opinion is welcome and I’m not talking shit I don’t get mad over silly things like this but I know what the ballistics show with good ammunition with the 5.7 and it surpasses 9mm. I don’t see anyone willing to get shot by it. It’s just dumb. Nobody wants to be shot period but facts remain you can’t also compare 22lr to 5.7. That’s just unjustifiable nonsense
@@guns4Armageddon 🤦 5.7x28 newspeak 😂. Get yourself Quickload or the really good free GRT and model some 9x19 and 5.7x28. Come back with the highest ft-lb 5.7x28 you were able to create, and we‘ll see. Until then, happy learning.
Terrorist attack in which the shooter had lots of time and shot over 150 rounds vs. self defense scenario when seconds count. This typical Fort Hood argument by 5.7 fanboys is just nonsensical. The mob used to assassinate people with .22 revolvers. That doesn't make a .22 revolver an effective self defense tool. " the lowest 5.7 has similar ballistics as a +p 9mm" -- is absolute and utter nonsense. Many people arguing for 5.7 as an effective pistol round simply do not train. You just hear the same stupid arguments over and over again.
I'm probably average for the age of the 3 of you. The 45GAP is a great round if you believe in the caliber. 45 doesn't have to be fast to do it's job. I have 1 5.7; the PSA. Dudes in Alaska are carrying this round for Grizzly because it has no recoil, is fast, and has 20+ capacity for headshots; otherwise shooting a Grizzly is pointless unless you're using a .338 Y'all have made it to the Fudd Hall of Shame
Interesting...I wondered if there might be some Alaskans that could prefer a very fast follow-up option vs the 10mm muzzle-rise defense. With the right loads, it could serve a person better. If all anyone ever needed was 1 shot to solve their problems and recoil didn't matter then everyone would carrying a .44....but they aren't.
@@ShastaBean yeah. I have a total custom 44 Blackhawk from Gary Reeder for that sort of thing. My Glock 40 (10mm longslide) is MagNaPorted to keep it down a bit. I have a 460 Rowland, but it's a bit much even compared to the 44Mag. And the 44 can be loaded much hotter. But there are dudes betting there lives on 22 rounds of 22/5.7 and proper headshot placement. I'll give that a couple of years.
@@Swampytheroot I think I'd be reluctant to defend against what should be a single-threat in a grizzly with a 5.7. But I do get the inclination given the ability to rattle off a lot of shots, in a hurry, and better chance to be accurate. Personally, I think I'd opt for a 10mm. But if I had to hand something to a 16 yr old daughter to carry through those same woods, I doubt she'd be any sort of effective with a 10mm, or a Desert Eagle. As far as these guys calling it just "fun"...I'd personally consider those "monster pistols" to be more of that. I have a friend that bought a Freedom Arms 454 Casull - he said it hurts his arm. haha...and where I am at, javelinas are one of my biggest threats when out & about...dealing with a squadron of 13 of those...? Yeh, I'll pass on the jumbo-cartridge revolver of 5 rounds for those things! I carry the 10mm AND the Ruger 57. I think I'd actually reach for the 57. I've had them chase me and charge me another time. That's what made me go out and buy the 10mm & 5.7...I envisioned a 9mm JHP just skipping off of their brick-like forehead. Fortunately I didn't have to fire, as they were just running me off (adult pair w/2 juveniles). Bears are a whole different ball game. Mountain lion? I think the 5.7 could be a great choice considering how they move. Wolves? Maybe same thing.
I live in a town home. I CANNOT have any defensive shots go through my connected firewalls and say hello to my neighbors. 5.7 is good enough to stop and intruder, but also looses its punch fast enough to far less danger to my neighbors. That is why I would consider it. 22 magnum is fun but not something I would want to bet my life on. Shot guns that are people stoppers will punch through walls too.
Thinking that low-recoil is just about fun, fun, fun is totally overlooking the concept of follow-up shots & for many (most?) shooters, the ability to effectively & quickly address multiple threats. If you want to compare to .22 mag, and accept that you are getting same velocity from a pistol shooting 5.7 vs a rifle w/.22 wmr (the 'R' stands for RIMFIRE) and somehow equate those? Lost Comparing your honey-badger 10mm to 5.7? yah, no. See how a every day person does with a 10mm against 6 - 14 javelinas that decide to attack, vs having a 5.7. I'll give that nod to the 5.7 to be able to quickly & accurately handle those...or other types of attackers. I carry a 10mm but if I could encounter those things, I also carry the 5.7 and most likely would be reaching for that and not the 10mm. I have been chased once and charge on another occasion, but thankfully not attacked. Follow-up shots with the 10mm could be a nightmare. Look further than the mass-produced stuff and get from Elite, Vanguard, or R&R (when available) or load your own. Notice Paul H added the Ruger 57 & LC to his EOW options recent video to consider when it comes to having something light, effective and be able to use same mags in either/or. On his 1st presentation with the LC and his two-shot drill, his time went from ~25 seconds to ~17 seconds. Meaning a 26% improvement on his very first attempt. Most would argue he's a bit above the 'average Joe" when it comes to being capable. Appreciate the discussion, for sure. I've become interested in the cartridge and unfortunately the brass is the biggest constraint issue and not having sourcing options which are what leads to the lack of available choices. The big producers are for sure nerfing it, sadly. The loading & testing videos I've done are far more promising that the widely commercial stuff. Hopefully that gets solved for, sooner rather than later.
I am an average shooter, and at 75 feet, I can keep 3 inch groups with the M&P 5.7. I think its a great home defense and close quarters round. I would trust it over a 22 lr, especially since you can carry 22 rounds in a mag. its a light weight round that has a lot of power to it. its expensive to shoot, but in general, so is gun ownership. Also, its shot placement that counts. If you are good with the bigger calibers, keep to them.
5.7 yaws like a rifle rou ds does. Doesn't always fragment(I'm sure the green tips do that better) but still reliable penetration and goes through doors without fragmentating too much. Good caliber to me. Expensive but so easy to shoot you don't need as much practice if you're used to 9mm or 40.
It's basically a mini Rifle round that you can fire from a Handgun that holds 22 rounds. Its like a gun nuts wet dream. The design of the M&P is also really innovative and has really low recoil. I don't understand some of this negativity. The only downside is the price of the ammo but if more people adopt it instead of dogging it the price will drop.
woah! 10:36 - why is 12-14" of penetration from .380 different than 9mm?? It's not - if we choose to ignore the concept of expansion and energy ft-lbs (most people probably shouldn't do that).
This is a weird video and somewhat insulting. There must be a lot of "gun weirdos" out there or companies like Ruger, PSA and Smith and Wesson wouldn't be producing them. If it was that bad, then the FN would have ceased production long ago. If you are just trying to be practical, then the average gun guy should have one revolver, one semiauto pistol, one AR, one bolt gun and one shotgun. Many of us enjoy shooting as a hobbie and we buy different guns, because we can and not because they are practical or useful. Tone it down guys!
To old to know any better. “It not all that and a slice of bread”. Says a lot. And, “ I’m not an expert”. Pretty much sums it up. Stick to your 38 revolver. Just to let you know, something old timers. Listening to U2 sold me I’m buying a 5.7. There’s a reason the military stepped away from 45s. Body armor soak them up.
Indeed. Gulf War Marine and current Navy Officer here. I’m not sure why the idea of someone like me, a pretty good shot, with 22 rounds of personal defense 5.7 against “Stainless Steel Steve” with his pristine Rick Grimes Colt Python is so “weird.” I can lay down 4-5 cycles of 4-6 rounds with high accuracy and virtually no recoil, as opposed to Colt Python dude’s 2-3 cycles of 2-3 rounds with questionable (for most with a double action revolver) accuracy and high recoil. It’s a no brainer to me. And all the kvetching over ammo costs…most people spend more on a case of beer than the difference between 9mm and 5.7….
Frankly, it may be just me, but the talk of shooting someone in the pelvic region didn't do it for me. It's like purposely shooting someone in the groin; the Israelis do that.
The round isn't magic but it is very viable. I've never understood the haters. What other round fired from a pistol can defeat IIIA? In a pistol format it's a rifle in a holster. You can pack rounds with much less weight. The Ruger 57 and LC Carbine are my "bugout" set up for the urban environment I live in. Also home defense. Why all the fuss?
You can kill a Brown Bear with a 22LR. It's been done. So yes, I agree. People are making a big fuss about pistol rounds when what you really should be showing up to the fight with is a rifle round. That being said, I carry a small NAA Pug in 22Mag at times. At 10 feet, I could shoot a tooth out of a perps mouth.
Counter factual: I’m buying a S&W 5.7 within the month for concealed carry. I like the high velocity, low recoil, accuracy (will be running it with a red dot), and magazine capacity. (Some of my friends tell me the Smith trigger on the 5.7 is great as well). As for your comment about weird people, I guess that could be true. I’m a Gulf War Marine, current Naval Officer and own a variety of guns ranging from colts, rugers, kimbers, a CZ-75, a Mossberg 12-gauge, and a Sig. Does that make me weird? 🤷🏼♂️ What is weird to me, however, while we’re on the topic, is how in the weeds many people get with ballistics when their personal chances of getting in a firefight are so mind-bogglingly low (I’m talking those who aren’t LEO’s or security folks) that the chances of 1” of penetration or some bizarre cavity tumble rate making more of a difference than just hitting the damn target, whoever it may be, is on par with their chances of winning the powerball. I’m a pretty good shot, and I’ve been in a war and close to a few others since. I’m not sure why someone would think me with a S&W 5.7 with 22 personal defense rounds would fare worse than your average range dude with his 6 rounds of .357 fired from his pristine Walking Dead (talk about fads!) Colt Python. It’s much easier for me to emerge from cover and lay down 4-6 very accurate rounds with close to no recoil than it is for “Stainless steel Steve” to get off two accurate rounds at me with a double action revolver. The best part is I get 4-5 cycles of 4-6 to his 2-3 cycles of 2-3 round bursts. (For the record I love revolvers for what they offer…)
Having got interested in the 5.7 from the release of the S&W M&P I want to see more info and testing on the ammunition. A green tip armor piercing round and full metal jacket are not defense rounds. Hollow point and frangible rounds will do much better against soft targets. Or perhaps with 22 rounds you can mix them up for the best of both worlds.
So far its been out 33 years, and more models keep coming out lately, and more companies load ammo for it now. NATO finally adopted it 2 yrs ago.. after being designed specifically for them , at thier request in 1990.
While I respect (And usually enjoy) debates about the effectiveness of things 2A related, I've been on this spinning rock long enough to know it's how effective something is USED that often matters, more. We drop 1,000lb steers all day long with the .22mag. Yes, we're at point blank range, angling the shot appropriately, and with one cartridge that bovine is instantly sent to bovine heaven. It's effective. I replaced my trusty-dusty Ruger P85 (9mm) which I EDC'd for DECADES, for the Ruger 57. All of my friends/cohorts tried giving me grief over this, until we took our various platforms out to the range, and put the various calibers through all the paces (Speed, penetration, damage) using varied targets. They're not laughing/mocking anymore! Is it a 'Niche' cartridge? Sure, why not? Are there many other calibers that hit harder? Of course there are. For what the 5.7x28 can do, coupled with it's capacity/ease of shooting/instant target acquisition as you're shooting it? That it is reloadable and has a wide array of options for projectile? It and the LC Carbine I've teamed it up with suit my expected needs perfectly! Now, if/when the Zombie Apocalypse happens? Nuke 'em from orbit! ('s the only way to be sure!) ;-)
Funny you should bring up the zombie apocalyptic. Rick Grimes is a folk hero. But would it be more realistic in his fictional scenario to carry a Python or a .22 pistol with high magazine capacity? lol.
@@DeshCanter You're making a good point, and you're also underscoring mine-own. Ricks 'Choice' of pistol certainly has merit, and you won't find me dissing either the .357 or .44 magnum calibers. Another very valid point is, those calibers are VERY popular, and so, reloading/finding more is easier than other, lesser-used ones. However, in this 'Zombie Apocalypse' setting, where it demands a head shot to put one down, I'm still choosing my 5.7x28, with twenty round magazines, over my wheelguns (I own both .357/.44mag), due to sheer volume of fire before reloading, and damned quick reloading (Mags). I also have to admit, while the 5.7x28 is gaining popularity, and finding them to buy easier, if the industrial engine shut down, that would soon become a problem. My .02 on this is, I'll bear/use it during the beginning (More zombies), and when the cartridges run scarce, THEN turn to any of my other platforms to carry on the fight. Fun stuff to think about (If a bit dire)! thx for reading an' replying! :-)
Many here defend the 5.7 but you have to ask yourselves why hasn't it caught on after 20+ years with NATO and Europe, or rather until the full potential of the cartridge wasn't realized until recently with special AP rounds only available to military and police? Because without steel or Tungsten cores, there really isn't any improvement over 124 gr 9mm. Essentially as civilians you are getting a round with a little more energy at double the price of 9 mm. I hate to say it, but civilian 5.7 is for suckers.
When you got less recoil and more accuracy, what's deadlier a crazy hollow point that's gonna snap more or a 5.7 that's hardly recoiling with better follow up shot chances and accuracy to the chest and head. I like 9mm, but if I can have something that's doing just about the same damage but more accurate and less recoil...I'll take that chance. Just gotta stock up on more expensive ammo
@@SirAsylus89 It's a glorified .22 Magnum. No, is doesn't "just about the same damage". It doesn't even pass the FBI ballistics tests. Federal, Speer and Hornady do not offer a service round in 5.7 for a reason.
This video must be satire. 7 months before they posted this video, they posted another video entitled "The case for .22 Magnum ( ruclips.net/video/C74xk5OZfYw/видео.html ). When you watch these videos back to back it is one giant contradiction. 5.7 and 22 magnum have similar ballistics. These "experts" talk about how 22 magnum is handy, you can use it for self defense, and how 22 magnum is just so useful. They then claim the opposite for 5.7, which is ironic because 5.7 is more versatile, is set up for much higher capacity semi auto handguns, produces significantly higher ft/lbs of energy, and has been shown repeatedly to be able to punch through body armor. The only possible advantage that 22 magnum has is that it is a cheaper round. Even that is changing though, as the price for 5.7x28 is dropping as its popularity rises. As previous comments have stated. Enjoy being one of many gun channels that no one has heard of.
Remember the carnage at Fort Hood in 2009? The 5.57 was used to kill many of those people and wound many others. 3 of those people charged the terrorist..they all died. Maybe you should read up on the incident
You don't need stopping power if you have armor piercing ammo lmfao just a completely nonsensical argument. Also it's shot placement that matters. And for people who can't shoot the 9mm accurately its the perfect round. If I can get a head shot or a heart shot with it but can't with a 9mm, guess what!? The 5x7 will always be better!!! 🤣🤣🤣 literally a completely nonsensical video with no reap argument against the 5x7 at all.
It may not be a 45AARP that'll directly transport someone's soul to hell, but when you have 20-23 rounds in a magazine of something with no recoil that has the energy to get through bone, I'm pretty sure it'll work if it goes into someone's brain can. And it's not exactly difficult to put rounds where you want with it.
Can’t really disagree with your comments about the 5.7, but I acquired my S&W because I saw a huge potential as a field pistol, for game shooting, varmints, and also personal protection while hiking and hunting. One huge deal for hikers and backbackers is the weight of the ammunition, about 12.5 oz for 50 5.7 as opposed to 21 oz for 9mm. The TCM is a good round too, but gun choice is extremely limited, and I’ve never seen TCM ammo on the shelf, anywhere. I’ve acquired the gear for reloading for my Smith, and nice folks at the ranges I frequent leave a good bit of brass for me to scrounge. Good video.
the information about the stoppages at fort hood is incorrect here. The torso shots stopped people, some were only shot once and died. AND keep in mind he wasn't using a top 5 ammo choice either. THAT's important.
I would advise you try Vanguard Outfitters and Elite Ammunition for the 5.7 rounds that do what the original "military" FN rounds do. You have your choice of ammo that is intended to pierce armor, higher mass rounds that fragment more and rather questionable subsonic (other than range use).
I think the Armscor .22 TCM is an under rated alternative to the 5.7x28 and not quite as expensive. The downfall is that it's a proprietary round with a limited selection of firearms. Yes, I have one of RIA's pistols in .22 TCM and it is a fun firearm. Is also have one of RIA's 1911 in .22 WMR, which is an interesting firearm. Comparing the two over a chrono, they are fairly close in ballistics. My .22 TCM was running 1900 fps over my Chrony with factory ammo. Side note: I want some of that 10 mm Honeybadger! I'd like to try that in my TNW carbine. Thanks for the enjoyable conversation, cranks!
when I was a child hunting varmints, I noticed that they run if you miss first shot. With a co2 bb gun in semi auto, I had the most luck with fast follow up shots.
Given, what it was designed for, as a weapon that was in between a full-sized rifle and a pistol for rear echelon soldiers. It was designed (with the military rounds) to puh holes in most soft body armor. The FN "rifle" was designed to be used by those troops who didn't need a full-sized gun yet might need to put holes into some bad guys who got where they weren't supposed to be. Is it a be all end all round not hardly but until you can get the terminal effects of a .50BMG into a handgun or rifle that even a 140lb person can effectively use I don't believe there is such an animal. Also ROy that M1 looks like it is about to slide off the corner of your wall behind you.
If, pelvic girdle shots really are as effective as was stated in this video, then caliber choice is not really that important. Same is true IF the Mozambique tactic in gun fights is an effective means for body armor. If both these theories hold true in real life application, then it makes the most sense to carry a round that one is most accurate with under stress.
Great Channel! You are doing a Great Job ! A long time ago an old Scotsman (ex SAS I think) taught to shoot into the "pelvic girdle' AKA NUTS then work your way up with further shots as needed. The only thing wrong with this is when someone is shot in the Nether region they really do not need a second shot as they are writhing around on the ground , not able to move and bleeding like a stuck hog.............. and none around wants to kiss it and make it well...................
These guns are all fun, & there’s more and more of them coming out. I’m sure like the 9mm the ammunition will catch up. I am picking up the Ruger LC Carbine this week from my FFL. I guarantee that no matter what, I will have fun shooting this. As for costs, that too is coming down. I found them for $37 a box which is half what it’s been. I’ll let you know what I think Gene Eldon Mo 🤠
The Ruger LC is dangerous is that it feels like a plinker gun and is fun to shoot.. which is dangerous for the cost of the round (currently). Hopefully the round, as more options becomes available, will get back down around what it was pre-covid price. I miss the days when I could get a box of the AE FMJ for $13.
I like 5.7 and while I do not own a Steyr GB I do have a Steyr M40 and L9A2. Also like .357sig and dillon 9x25. I guess now that you mention it I guess I am a little weird.
I'm the weird guy that had 7.62 x 25 before 5.7 was cool. Yeah it's kind of an evolution of the old KGB round, so it's not really new. What it's good for, pistol engagements at 50 yards plus, which can be interesting with optics. You can also make those shots with 9mm now but it's flatter. In which case my grandfather would've said wtf are you doing? You should've brought a rifle. Also, true if you need more than 6 bring a rifle. So for the size why aren't you just carrying a 1911? Quit being weird. People talking about looking for pocket knives to go jousting with. Getting sold, we already have 22 mag and it's not advisable to bring a pocket knife jousting.
Regarding the "pelvic girdle" shot rather than the so-called "Mozambique Technique" I remember reading in a US Army Field Manual on pistol craft dating back to the '80 that as a failure to stop drill was to fire into the target's pelvis, in order to "break the body's support structure". Interesting to see that people seem to be figure it out again. Seems to be a case of "everything old is new again." As for the 5.7x28, I own a Ruger 57, and a CZ-52 as well. Why? Because I have a soft-spot for bottle-necked pistol cartridges. While I've carried my Ruger on some occasions -- and am sure I could handle pretty much any threat with a total of 60 rounds at my disposal -- I would not carry my CZ-52 except in an emergency. Both of them can deal with any likely threat, but being left-handed trying to use the CZ-52 . . . well, the lack of ergonomics might get me killed.
Roy mentioned my favorite caliber , the 38 Super. I for the life of me can't understand why it isn't more popular. As far as the 5.7 goes , I'll pass. I have 4 S&W M&Ps in 9MM , 40S&W , 45ACP and just bought the new 10MM. I don't plan on buying the 5.7.
@@youtubewatcher4792 I agree there brotha. I got 2 boxes coming in the mail. I need something I can actually shoot accurately. I can't shoot pistols for crap man. I have shot long guns my whole life and am a great shot. But when it comes to pistols it's a whole different ball game, and with the injuries I have now and a wife and a 4 year old nephew with me all the time and 34 years old I don't know if I can take 5 people like I use too. So i need something I can put on point where I want it. I can't shoot a 9mm for the life of me. This at least I'm on paper lol Note: it's not like I didn't train with multiple 9mms either. I can shoot the 2000 dollar 9mms easy, but I'm not carrying a 2000 dollar gun and losing it in a court case for 10 years. I went through at least 500 dollars worth of ammo bare minimum with multiple 9mms. So I have practiced lol
The Smith & Wesson 57 is a hell of a gun fogies always talking shit about innovation. I’m 52 and I love the 57 took it out to the range and hit a target from 75 yards four times out of 10 I’m rocking with it.
If the ammo stays the price it is, it's a fad for me lol. I'm not burning money like that. Same with the 22 mag, I was going to get one to save on shooting and they're frickin overpriced so just got a TX22 competition which is alot of fun. Anyone interested in a shield plus performance center ported barrel with the red dot? Has about 400 rounds on it so far, I need to buy ammo and parts for my full size
Your 22 magnum won’t penetrate body armor! These bullets have a nasty tendency to turn backwards! They have great ballistics considerations as well as velocity! I was at Ft. Hood for that incident believe me nobody wants to be shot at with a 5.7 !! Magazine capacity is also great! I wouldn’t want to be shot with a 22 magnum either! I believe in precision accuracy for self defense and this round is great for accuracy at close range!
Ha! I love and own the FN and Smith and Wesson 5.7 and I drive a Hummer H2… also have Glock 20 in 10mm and Glock 33 in 357 sig among many other weapons. I’m not weird.. don’t generalize😂
of people can look further than the mass-produced stuff and get from Elite, Vanguard, or R&R (when available). Most people wouldn't do a lot of volume shooting with tho$e...but defense? You bet. Defeat (much) armor? You bet (cite Buffman). It's much more than just fun, fun, fun...when a person considers follow-up shots, accuracy and any smaller-frame shooters ability to wield it effectively. Or if crafty enough, people can load their own. Comparing 5.7 to whatever 10mm was being tossed about is about as apples vs. oranges as you can get. Being able to quickly/effectively engage 3 or 4 attackers with one vs the other is not the same as being able to stop a grizzly with one vs the other.
Ft Hood, 13 fatalities, 13 one shot stops, 11 COM, 1 head shot, 1 stomach shot, every other shot was arm leg or shoulder, 3 one stop shots on 3 men charging the shooter, it took 5 9mm rounds to stop Nidal and it didn't even kill him, you can also buy custom 5.7 ammo that has 400 to 600 fps faster than any neutered commercial FN rounds, look at Ellifritz study on stopping power, 5.7 stopping power is closer to rifle rounds than straight wall pistol cartridges
Terrorist attack in which the shooter had lots of time and shot over 150 rounds vs. self defense scenario when seconds count. This typical Fort Hood argument by 5.7 fanboys is just nonsensical. The mob used to assassinate people with .22 revolvers. That doesn't make a .22 revolver an effective self defense tool. 5.7 out of a pistol performs less than 9mm. That's a fact. There is also no 5.7 pistol round that passes the FBI ballistics protocol. That's another fact. Yes, there are custom rounds that cost $3-$10/round. They are primarily geared toward offering a civilian variant of SS190. A 20-round magazine filled with those rounds would cost you $60-$200 and you are supposed to carry a backup magazine. You would be carrying $120-$400 of ammo. Oh, and you certainly would need to make sure that the ammo cycles reliably by shooting 100-200 rounds, i.e., spending another $300-$2,000. I have not met a single 5.7 owner that does any of that. In fact, I have not seen a single 5.7 in a training class, as you can easily shoot 300-500 rounds per day. And, no, it's still not serious rifle ballistics out of a pistol. S4 Elite Ammunition is 2,500 fps, but only 28 grain, for $2.88/round + shipping.
@@charliefoxtrot5001 I carry vanguard black fang, taking in to account the drastic difference in recoil and ability to get on target faster, the ability to have more rounds in a similar sized gun that weighs less, and the ability to go through alot of types of soft armor while producing hydrostatic shock like a rifle and a larger wound cavity than almost all 9mm rounds Im super comfortable carrying my 57 half the time and my glock 20sf the other half when im feeling brave. Its not for everyone but it is definitely not a cartridge to dismiss so quick
@@ryankelly6652 The Vanguard Outfitters Black Dragon Fang looks certainly interesting, but there is just one problem. It is my understanding that Vanguard Outfitters got sued by Elite Ammunition 8 years ago and stopped producing ammo. Got any more info on that? In any case, it's no different than the Elite Ammunition I already pointed out with the same ridiculous cost implications. And, no, it's not serious rifle-type terminal ballistics, despite marketing claims. A 28 grain bullet flying at 2,500 fps with 389 ft-lbf is just not a 55 grain bullet flying at 3,000 fps with 1099 ft-lbf. There is a 1.2x speed, a 2x weight and a 2.8x energy difference. And that's just 5.56. By the way, body armor is defeated with training, not with gear! I carry my Glock 20 Gen 4 when I think I need to.
I'm a year late to the party but these guys make Tim Walz look manly. How's a dude with a Wilford Brimley mustache and suspenders consider anyone else weird?
Hmm your 22 mag doesn’t stack up my man with the 5.7. I find it funny these guys state carrying a 5.7 is “ weird “ it’s simply because they know very little about the caliber and seem afraid of anything that’s isn’t a 9 mil or 45acp. Cmon guys go out and fire it before you talk sh*t about something you don’t know
He even brought up the Ft Hood shooting, he COM 11, 1 head shot, 1 stomach shot, the rest were arm leg and shoulder shots, if he had used a 9mm the fatalities would've been far less
Have the Palmetto State Armory Rock 5.7 all tough fun to shoot the down size are the price of ammunition and the lack of availability to choose from. If you want the best 5.7x28 ammunition you're going to pay around $300 a box. The ammo I've shot FNH 40 grain blue tip and Federal Eagle 40 grain, am not impressed. Is the 5.7x28 a fad? Only time will tell. A 40 grain bullet traveling at 1800-2000 fps definitely has the ability to kill someone.
Love the show as always. Agree with everything. BUT, in defense of us weirdos who like weird guns…. That is where advances come. The first Double Action revolvers were not all that. Neither were the first Single Actions for that matter. The first 9mm hardball ammo wasn’t up there with REAL guns like the 45. But. Those weirdos started something. (Personally tho. I’ll stick with my Ruger Birdshead in .45 with the companion acp cylinder)
You're right David. Like race cars, that technology often makes it into "regular" cars. But you have to admit some of the weird guns are ... well .... weird. Roy
![Is 5.7x28mm Just Overpriced .22 Magnum? [Part 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/oMdaQVCEOYw/mqdefault.jpg)
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I have a SW 5.7 . its a fun easy to shoot gun. I don't care what anyone else owns or shoots.
I'm about the same age as you guys. Been shooting since I was 9. I've literally watched thousands of videos on firearms and have never heard of this channel. It's obvious why. Listening to you guys talk is like going to grandpas house. I have around 50 handguns, one of which is the new M&P 5.7. I feel there is a spot for it in my collection. The drug cartels in Mexico are paying up to $5k for 5.7 pistols on the black market because of the massive increase in the use of body armor. These cartel members shoot at each other every day. I value the opinion of those idiots more than the couch grandpas. Enjoy your obscurity.
Love this comment
I love it to and the price on the black market is accurate I’m Mexican American and I travel to Mexico twice a year have 3 57 from different manufacturers and I love it
The old crows are still using single shot 20ga shotguns, GTFOWTBS you guys a saying. Don't support these OLDFOOLS😂
Ha 😂 great comment
They are literally old coach potato's that can't even do a push up. Giving advice on a bullet that kills on a daily basis lmao.
Sorry but it’s the same argument as the 45 vs 9mm, 9 has less stopping power but Carries more ammo and lighter with less kick, well 5.7 is lighter, kicks a lot less and you get more ammo per mag. So if you say the 5.7 isn’t good enough, then you have to say the 9 isn’t good enough so we need to carry 45 or 10mm.
5.7x28mm doesn't pass the FBI ballistics tests, but 9mm does. The difference in internal ballistics between .45 ACP, .40 S&W and 9mm is negligible, while the difference to 5.7x28mm is rather obvious. 5.7x28mm isn't good enough from a performance standpoint, plain and simple.
@@charliefoxtrot5001 it's a glorified plinker . After all it's been around since 1990. Some 33 years . Gun manufacturer's are running out of new gun ideas . Thee New fad is PDW . Keep in mind all the key board warriors think they are Ethan Hunt . The cool factor sells these days
@@charliefoxtrot5001 This is incorrect. Perhaps you simply weren't aware of newer developments since your wrote his 8 months ago. However, there are types of 5.7 ammo that work just as effectively as 9mm. Even more so because they penetrate armor, go into the gel over 12 inches (per FBI), and tumble significantly. I had to respond because I keep seeing you post this misinformation in other comments. You should read up on it more.
@@TradeDrifter I went through this discussion with others. There are speciality 5.7x28mm rounds (e.g., Dragon Fang and Elite Ammunition) that are either unreliable, discontinued, unavailable, or cost $3/round. They barely achieve what 9mm does and can penetrate certain type of soft body armor from a pistol barrel, but not rifle plates.
Factory target or self defense ammo that actually is available (still at steeper prices), functions reliably, and the average 5.7 owner buys does not do that. It is not even remotely comparable with 9mm in terms of internal ballistics.
5.7x28mm is a niche round for fanboys. It doesn't solve any problems. It just creates more. People should spend that money on training, rather than on some magical equipment.
PS: Understand that the FBI ballistics tests include more than just a bare gel test or a denim + gel test. There are other barriers being tested. Passing the test means to have sufficient penetration after passing that barrier. There isn't a single service round being offered in 5.7x28mm that passes the FBI ballistics test! Federal, Speer and Hornady do not offer 5.7x28mm service rounds for a reason.
@@TradeDrifter You 5.7 boys always claim there is this "mystical" ammo that we haven't seen yet. 🤣
A 5.7 IS VERY ACCURATE.
WHEN EVERYTHING IS EVALUATED HD ABOUT GUN AND ACCURACY. STOPPING ATTACKER MAKES GUN BEAUTIFUL AND PERFECT. Hitting target at greater distance is game changer
My PSA Rock 5.7 is fantastic. If they don't meet your standards, more 5.7's for the rest of us! You can keep your 9's.
Do you run an optic? Considering the Bushnell RXC-200 COMPACT REFLEX SIGHT over the Holosun 507K for mine, but looking for opinions.
@DWDAmateur I had a 407A on mine (was free with another package) and it was fine, but my wife does not like red dot's so I took it off and am just running with stock sights and a flashlight +green laser on the lower rail. It's so accurate and fires smoothly with almost no recoil. The PSA 5.7 is just a great piece.
The guy says the few live targets that were shot with 5.7 wasn’t affective. Hmmmm ask the people at fort hood was it affective. 👌👍 the lowest 5.7 has similar ballistics as a +p 9mm. I’ve seen the data and it looks very promising.
The first part of this comment is obviously off, as you could replace 5.7x28 with a 22 LR and still innocent people would have been killed.
The second, that a low tier 5.7x28 is as powerful as 9x19 +P is just complete nonsense. On ft-lb you get to standard pressure 9x19 with about 330 ft-lb, but that is out of a 5‘ barrel. Really weak stuff. Top end 9x19s get into the high 400s.
The only real life pro this cartridge has over 9x19 is that some special loads penetrate 3a.
@@nikos6220 the problem is people can’t get out of that Rambo mindset that people get into. And honestly your opinion is welcome and I’m not talking shit I don’t get mad over silly things like this but I know what the ballistics show with good ammunition with the 5.7 and it surpasses 9mm. I don’t see anyone willing to get shot by it. It’s just dumb. Nobody wants to be shot period but facts remain you can’t also compare 22lr to 5.7. That’s just unjustifiable nonsense
@@guns4Armageddon 🤦 5.7x28 newspeak 😂. Get yourself Quickload or the really good free GRT and model some 9x19 and 5.7x28. Come back with the highest ft-lb 5.7x28 you were able to create, and we‘ll see. Until then, happy learning.
Terrorist attack in which the shooter had lots of time and shot over 150 rounds vs. self defense scenario when seconds count. This typical Fort Hood argument by 5.7 fanboys is just nonsensical. The mob used to assassinate people with .22 revolvers. That doesn't make a .22 revolver an effective self defense tool.
" the lowest 5.7 has similar ballistics as a +p 9mm" -- is absolute and utter nonsense.
Many people arguing for 5.7 as an effective pistol round simply do not train. You just hear the same stupid arguments over and over again.
@@nikos6220 half the weight with same round count.
I'm probably average for the age of the 3 of you.
The 45GAP is a great round if you believe in the caliber. 45 doesn't have to be fast to do it's job.
I have 1 5.7; the PSA. Dudes in Alaska are carrying this round for Grizzly because it has no recoil, is fast, and has 20+ capacity for headshots; otherwise shooting a Grizzly is pointless unless you're using a .338
Y'all have made it to the Fudd Hall of Shame
Interesting...I wondered if there might be some Alaskans that could prefer a very fast follow-up option vs the 10mm muzzle-rise defense. With the right loads, it could serve a person better. If all anyone ever needed was 1 shot to solve their problems and recoil didn't matter then everyone would carrying a .44....but they aren't.
@@ShastaBean yeah. I have a total custom 44 Blackhawk from Gary Reeder for that sort of thing. My Glock 40 (10mm longslide) is MagNaPorted to keep it down a bit. I have a 460 Rowland, but it's a bit much even compared to the 44Mag. And the 44 can be loaded much hotter.
But there are dudes betting there lives on 22 rounds of 22/5.7 and proper headshot placement. I'll give that a couple of years.
@@Swampytheroot I think I'd be reluctant to defend against what should be a single-threat in a grizzly with a 5.7. But I do get the inclination given the ability to rattle off a lot of shots, in a hurry, and better chance to be accurate. Personally, I think I'd opt for a 10mm. But if I had to hand something to a 16 yr old daughter to carry through those same woods, I doubt she'd be any sort of effective with a 10mm, or a Desert Eagle. As far as these guys calling it just "fun"...I'd personally consider those "monster pistols" to be more of that. I have a friend that bought a Freedom Arms 454 Casull - he said it hurts his arm. haha...and where I am at, javelinas are one of my biggest threats when out & about...dealing with a squadron of 13 of those...? Yeh, I'll pass on the jumbo-cartridge revolver of 5 rounds for those things! I carry the 10mm AND the Ruger 57. I think I'd actually reach for the 57. I've had them chase me and charge me another time. That's what made me go out and buy the 10mm & 5.7...I envisioned a 9mm JHP just skipping off of their brick-like forehead. Fortunately I didn't have to fire, as they were just running me off (adult pair w/2 juveniles). Bears are a whole different ball game. Mountain lion? I think the 5.7 could be a great choice considering how they move. Wolves? Maybe same thing.
New cartridges have no intention of getting off your lawn.
Beavis and Butthead and OtherBeavis.
I live in a town home. I CANNOT have any defensive shots go through my connected firewalls and say hello to my neighbors. 5.7 is good enough to stop and intruder, but also looses its punch fast enough to far less danger to my neighbors. That is why I would consider it. 22 magnum is fun but not something I would want to bet my life on. Shot guns that are people stoppers will punch through walls too.
Secret service knows the greatness of it .
Thinking that low-recoil is just about fun, fun, fun is totally overlooking the concept of follow-up shots & for many (most?) shooters, the ability to effectively & quickly address multiple threats.
If you want to compare to .22 mag, and accept that you are getting same velocity from a pistol shooting 5.7 vs a rifle w/.22 wmr (the 'R' stands for RIMFIRE) and somehow equate those? Lost
Comparing your honey-badger 10mm to 5.7? yah, no. See how a every day person does with a 10mm against 6 - 14 javelinas that decide to attack, vs having a 5.7. I'll give that nod to the 5.7 to be able to quickly & accurately handle those...or other types of attackers. I carry a 10mm but if I could encounter those things, I also carry the 5.7 and most likely would be reaching for that and not the 10mm. I have been chased once and charge on another occasion, but thankfully not attacked. Follow-up shots with the 10mm could be a nightmare.
Look further than the mass-produced stuff and get from Elite, Vanguard, or R&R (when available) or load your own.
Notice Paul H added the Ruger 57 & LC to his EOW options recent video to consider when it comes to having something light, effective and be able to use same mags in either/or. On his 1st presentation with the LC and his two-shot drill, his time went from ~25 seconds to ~17 seconds. Meaning a 26% improvement on his very first attempt. Most would argue he's a bit above the 'average Joe" when it comes to being capable.
Appreciate the discussion, for sure. I've become interested in the cartridge and unfortunately the brass is the biggest constraint issue and not having sourcing options which are what leads to the lack of available choices. The big producers are for sure nerfing it, sadly. The loading & testing videos I've done are far more promising that the widely commercial stuff. Hopefully that gets solved for, sooner rather than later.
I am an average shooter, and at 75 feet, I can keep 3 inch groups with the M&P 5.7. I think its a great home defense and close quarters round. I would trust it over a 22 lr, especially since you can carry 22 rounds in a mag. its a light weight round that has a lot of power to it. its expensive to shoot, but in general, so is gun ownership. Also, its shot placement that counts. If you are good with the bigger calibers, keep to them.
If it'll put a hole in you, it'll kill you... the capacity and flat shooting alone is worth it
5.7 yaws like a rifle rou ds does. Doesn't always fragment(I'm sure the green tips do that better) but still reliable penetration and goes through doors without fragmentating too much. Good caliber to me. Expensive but so easy to shoot you don't need as much practice if you're used to 9mm or 40.
It's basically a mini Rifle round that you can fire from a Handgun that holds 22 rounds. Its like a gun nuts wet dream. The design of the M&P is also really innovative and has really low recoil. I don't understand some of this negativity. The only downside is the price of the ammo but if more people adopt it instead of dogging it the price will drop.
woah! 10:36 - why is 12-14" of penetration from .380 different than 9mm??
It's not - if we choose to ignore the concept of expansion and energy ft-lbs (most people probably shouldn't do that).
This is a weird video and somewhat insulting. There must be a lot of "gun weirdos" out there or companies like Ruger, PSA and Smith and Wesson wouldn't be producing them. If it was that bad, then the FN would have ceased production long ago. If you are just trying to be practical, then the average gun guy should have one revolver, one semiauto pistol, one AR, one bolt gun and one shotgun. Many of us enjoy shooting as a hobbie and we buy different guns, because we can and not because they are practical or useful. Tone it down guys!
Oh no people with 1k subscribers tell me my pistol caliber is bad 😢
To old to know any better. “It not all that and a slice of bread”. Says a lot. And, “ I’m not an expert”. Pretty much sums it up. Stick to your 38 revolver. Just to let you know, something old timers. Listening to U2 sold me I’m buying a 5.7. There’s a reason the military stepped away from 45s. Body armor soak them up.
Indeed. Gulf War Marine and current Navy Officer here.
I’m not sure why the idea of someone like me, a pretty good shot, with 22 rounds of personal defense 5.7 against “Stainless Steel Steve” with his pristine Rick Grimes Colt Python is so “weird.” I can lay down 4-5 cycles of 4-6 rounds with high accuracy and virtually no recoil, as opposed to Colt Python dude’s 2-3 cycles of 2-3 rounds with questionable (for most with a double action revolver) accuracy and high recoil. It’s a no brainer to me.
And all the kvetching over ammo costs…most people spend more on a case of beer than the difference between 9mm and 5.7….
If shot placement is the key, then the 5.7 is supreme.
Frankly, it may be just me, but the talk of shooting someone in the pelvic region didn't do it for me. It's like purposely shooting someone in the groin; the Israelis do that.
The round isn't magic but it is very viable. I've never understood the haters. What other round fired from a pistol can defeat IIIA? In a pistol format it's a rifle in a holster. You can pack rounds with much less weight. The Ruger 57 and LC Carbine are my "bugout" set up for the urban environment I live in. Also home defense. Why all the fuss?
Dude, it's not a rifle in a holster. And 9mm xtreme defenders defeat 3A too.
@@chapllc722 Keep on believing that little buddy
You can kill a Brown Bear with a 22LR. It's been done. So yes, I agree. People are making a big fuss about pistol rounds when what you really should be showing up to the fight with is a rifle round. That being said, I carry a small NAA Pug in 22Mag at times. At 10 feet, I could shoot a tooth out of a perps mouth.
Counter factual:
I’m buying a S&W 5.7 within the month for concealed carry. I like the high velocity, low recoil, accuracy (will be running it with a red dot), and magazine capacity. (Some of my friends tell me the Smith trigger on the 5.7 is great as well).
As for your comment about weird people, I guess that could be true. I’m a Gulf War Marine, current Naval Officer and own a variety of guns ranging from colts, rugers, kimbers, a CZ-75, a Mossberg 12-gauge, and a Sig. Does that make me weird? 🤷🏼♂️
What is weird to me, however, while we’re on the topic, is how in the weeds many people get with ballistics when their personal chances of getting in a firefight are so mind-bogglingly low (I’m talking those who aren’t LEO’s or security folks) that the chances of 1” of penetration or some bizarre cavity tumble rate making more of a difference than just hitting the damn target, whoever it may be, is on par with their chances of winning the powerball.
I’m a pretty good shot, and I’ve been in a war and close to a few others since. I’m not sure why someone would think me with a S&W 5.7 with 22 personal defense rounds would fare worse than your average range dude with his 6 rounds of .357 fired from his pristine Walking Dead (talk about fads!) Colt Python. It’s much easier for me to emerge from cover and lay down 4-6 very accurate rounds with close to no recoil than it is for “Stainless steel Steve” to get off two accurate rounds at me with a double action revolver. The best part is I get 4-5 cycles of 4-6 to his 2-3 cycles of 2-3 round bursts.
(For the record I love revolvers for what they offer…)
Having got interested in the 5.7 from the release of the S&W M&P I want to see more info and testing on the ammunition. A green tip armor piercing round and full metal jacket are not defense rounds. Hollow point and frangible rounds will do much better against soft targets. Or perhaps with 22 rounds you can mix them up for the best of both worlds.
james reeves over at TFB TV has tons of content on it
Great gun
The complete Fort Hood report, damage done, ability of wounded to return fire, etc., the report says it all.
So far its been out 33 years, and more models keep coming out lately, and more companies load ammo for it now. NATO finally adopted it 2 yrs ago.. after being designed specifically for them , at thier request in 1990.
While I respect (And usually enjoy) debates about the effectiveness of things 2A related, I've been on this spinning rock long enough to know it's how effective something is USED that often matters, more.
We drop 1,000lb steers all day long with the .22mag. Yes, we're at point blank range, angling the shot appropriately, and with one cartridge that bovine is instantly sent to bovine heaven. It's effective.
I replaced my trusty-dusty Ruger P85 (9mm) which I EDC'd for DECADES, for the Ruger 57. All of my friends/cohorts tried giving me grief over this, until we took our various platforms out to the range, and put the various calibers through all the paces (Speed, penetration, damage) using varied targets.
They're not laughing/mocking anymore!
Is it a 'Niche' cartridge? Sure, why not? Are there many other calibers that hit harder? Of course there are.
For what the 5.7x28 can do, coupled with it's capacity/ease of shooting/instant target acquisition as you're shooting it? That it is reloadable and has a wide array of options for projectile?
It and the LC Carbine I've teamed it up with suit my expected needs perfectly!
Now, if/when the Zombie Apocalypse happens? Nuke 'em from orbit! ('s the only way to be sure!)
;-)
Funny you should bring up the zombie apocalyptic.
Rick Grimes is a folk hero. But would it be more realistic in his fictional scenario to carry a Python or a .22 pistol with high magazine capacity? lol.
@@DeshCanter
You're making a good point, and you're also underscoring mine-own.
Ricks 'Choice' of pistol certainly has merit, and you won't find me dissing either the .357 or .44 magnum calibers. Another very valid point is, those calibers are VERY popular, and so, reloading/finding more is easier than other, lesser-used ones.
However, in this 'Zombie Apocalypse' setting, where it demands a head shot to put one down, I'm still choosing my 5.7x28, with twenty round magazines, over my wheelguns (I own both .357/.44mag), due to sheer volume of fire before reloading, and damned quick reloading (Mags).
I also have to admit, while the 5.7x28 is gaining popularity, and finding them to buy easier, if the industrial engine shut down, that would soon become a problem. My .02 on this is, I'll bear/use it during the beginning (More zombies), and when the cartridges run scarce, THEN turn to any of my other platforms to carry on the fight.
Fun stuff to think about (If a bit dire)!
thx for reading an' replying!
:-)
Many here defend the 5.7 but you have to ask yourselves why hasn't it caught on after 20+ years with NATO and Europe, or rather until the full potential of the cartridge wasn't realized until recently with special AP rounds only available to military and police? Because without steel or Tungsten cores, there really isn't any improvement over 124 gr 9mm. Essentially as civilians you are getting a round with a little more energy at double the price of 9 mm. I hate to say it, but civilian 5.7 is for suckers.
When you got less recoil and more accuracy, what's deadlier a crazy hollow point that's gonna snap more or a 5.7 that's hardly recoiling with better follow up shot chances and accuracy to the chest and head. I like 9mm, but if I can have something that's doing just about the same damage but more accurate and less recoil...I'll take that chance. Just gotta stock up on more expensive ammo
@@SirAsylus89 It's a glorified .22 Magnum. No, is doesn't "just about the same damage". It doesn't even pass the FBI ballistics tests. Federal, Speer and Hornady do not offer a service round in 5.7 for a reason.
This video must be satire. 7 months before they posted this video, they posted another video entitled "The case for .22 Magnum ( ruclips.net/video/C74xk5OZfYw/видео.html ). When you watch these videos back to back it is one giant contradiction. 5.7 and 22 magnum have similar ballistics. These "experts" talk about how 22 magnum is handy, you can use it for self defense, and how 22 magnum is just so useful. They then claim the opposite for 5.7, which is ironic because 5.7 is more versatile, is set up for much higher capacity semi auto handguns, produces significantly higher ft/lbs of energy, and has been shown repeatedly to be able to punch through body armor. The only possible advantage that 22 magnum has is that it is a cheaper round. Even that is changing though, as the price for 5.7x28 is dropping as its popularity rises. As previous comments have stated. Enjoy being one of many gun channels that no one has heard of.
As a FiveseveN & PS90 6yr owner,
I agree, I am very weird... and deadly.
Paper targets fear my name.
Secret Service used P90'$.
And that says a lot.
Not just secret service but military and agencies around the world, the ww2 grandpa's just stuck on the 45.
MeThinks thinks this is my Favorite Blooper Reel Y’all have done to date!
Remember the carnage at Fort Hood in 2009? The 5.57 was used to kill many of those people and wound many others. 3 of those people charged the terrorist..they all died. Maybe you should read up on the incident
You don't need stopping power if you have armor piercing ammo lmfao just a completely nonsensical argument.
Also it's shot placement that matters. And for people who can't shoot the 9mm accurately its the perfect round. If I can get a head shot or a heart shot with it but can't with a 9mm, guess what!? The 5x7 will always be better!!! 🤣🤣🤣 literally a completely nonsensical video with no reap argument against the 5x7 at all.
I own the s&w 5.7 love it
But
I'm going for a gun in every caliber 🤷🏾♂️
It may not be a 45AARP that'll directly transport someone's soul to hell, but when you have 20-23 rounds in a magazine of something with no recoil that has the energy to get through bone, I'm pretty sure it'll work if it goes into someone's brain can. And it's not exactly difficult to put rounds where you want with it.
Can’t really disagree with your comments about the 5.7, but I acquired my S&W because I saw a huge potential as a field pistol, for game shooting, varmints, and also personal protection while hiking and hunting. One huge deal for hikers and backbackers is the weight of the ammunition, about 12.5 oz for 50 5.7 as opposed to 21 oz for 9mm. The TCM is a good round too, but gun choice is extremely limited, and I’ve never seen TCM ammo on the shelf, anywhere. I’ve acquired the gear for reloading for my Smith, and nice folks at the ranges I frequent leave a good bit of brass for me to scrounge. Good video.
Which ammo do you carry?
the information about the stoppages at fort hood is incorrect here. The torso shots stopped people, some were only shot once and died. AND keep in mind he wasn't using a top 5 ammo choice either. THAT's important.
At less than $.50 cents a round now, I’ll stick with the 5.7!! Haha 😂👍
Where???? I have it nearby at .80-1.10 depending on what type
I can’t even find them less the 75 on gunbroker you gotta send us where you’re getting it from
Fudds united!
I would advise you try Vanguard Outfitters and Elite Ammunition for the 5.7 rounds that do what the original "military" FN rounds do. You have your choice of ammo that is intended to pierce armor, higher mass rounds that fragment more and rather questionable subsonic (other than range use).
I think the Armscor .22 TCM is an under rated alternative to the 5.7x28 and not quite as expensive. The downfall is that it's a proprietary round with a limited selection of firearms. Yes, I have one of RIA's pistols in .22 TCM and it is a fun firearm. Is also have one of RIA's 1911 in .22 WMR, which is an interesting firearm. Comparing the two over a chrono, they are fairly close in ballistics. My .22 TCM was running 1900 fps over my Chrony with factory ammo. Side note: I want some of that 10 mm Honeybadger! I'd like to try that in my TNW carbine. Thanks for the enjoyable conversation, cranks!
seem like every new round that is introduced gets new hate.
I'm surprised these old farts aren't carrying around flintlocks.
when I was a child hunting varmints, I noticed that they run if you miss first shot. With a co2 bb gun in semi auto, I had the most luck with fast follow up shots.
Given, what it was designed for, as a weapon that was in between a full-sized rifle and a pistol for rear echelon soldiers. It was designed (with the military rounds) to puh holes in most soft body armor. The FN "rifle" was designed to be used by those troops who didn't need a full-sized gun yet might need to put holes into some bad guys who got where they weren't supposed to be. Is it a be all end all round not hardly but until you can get the terminal effects of a .50BMG into a handgun or rifle that even a 140lb person can effectively use I don't believe there is such an animal. Also ROy that M1 looks like it is about to slide off the corner of your wall behind you.
If, pelvic girdle shots really are as effective as was stated in this video, then caliber choice is not really that important. Same is true IF the Mozambique tactic in gun fights is an effective means for body armor. If both these theories hold true in real life application, then it makes the most sense to carry a round that one is most accurate with under stress.
Great Channel! You are doing a Great Job ! A long time ago an old Scotsman (ex SAS I think) taught to shoot into the "pelvic girdle' AKA NUTS then work your way up with further shots as needed. The only thing wrong with this is when someone is shot in the Nether region they really do not need a second shot as they are writhing around on the ground , not able to move and bleeding like a stuck hog.............. and none around wants to kiss it and make it well...................
Enough bad mouthing any guns these days.. let's feel fortunate we can still own them. Arm yourself with a compound bow.
Best comment ever
What are your thoughts on 30 SUPER CARRY?
These guns are all fun, & there’s more and more of them coming out. I’m sure like the 9mm the ammunition will catch up. I am picking up the Ruger LC Carbine this week from my FFL. I guarantee that no matter what, I will have fun shooting this. As for costs, that too is coming down. I found them for $37 a box which is half what it’s been. I’ll let you know what I think
Gene Eldon Mo 🤠
The Ruger LC is dangerous is that it feels like a plinker gun and is fun to shoot.. which is dangerous for the cost of the round (currently). Hopefully the round, as more options becomes available, will get back down around what it was pre-covid price. I miss the days when I could get a box of the AE FMJ for $13.
@@ghostfox8550 that’s my hope also. Especially with all the pistol options now. I hope that drives it down some with normal demand
I see 5.7 as the perfect defensive round for females and old folks.the lethality plus soft recoil is a win-win
the round is meant to kill people not steel targets
Yes sir 100 percent correct and it's efficient at it especially coming out of longer barrels lc carbine love it.
Be nice if your data was up to date and accurate. FN SS197 is over 2000fps and FN SS 198 is 2400 fps and readily available. This out of 5.7 handgun!
SS197 is 1,736 fps and SS198 is 2,142 fps. Source: Testing by LuckyGunner. You are saying?
I like 5.7 and while I do not own a Steyr GB I do have a Steyr M40 and L9A2.
Also like .357sig and dillon 9x25. I guess now that you mention it I guess I am a little weird.
I'm the weird guy that had 7.62 x 25 before 5.7 was cool. Yeah it's kind of an evolution of the old KGB round, so it's not really new. What it's good for, pistol engagements at 50 yards plus, which can be interesting with optics. You can also make those shots with 9mm now but it's flatter. In which case my grandfather would've said wtf are you doing? You should've brought a rifle. Also, true if you need more than 6 bring a rifle. So for the size why aren't you just carrying a 1911? Quit being weird. People talking about looking for pocket knives to go jousting with. Getting sold, we already have 22 mag and it's not advisable to bring a pocket knife jousting.
Regarding the "pelvic girdle" shot rather than the so-called "Mozambique Technique" I remember reading in a US Army Field Manual on pistol craft dating back to the '80 that as a failure to stop drill was to fire into the target's pelvis, in order to "break the body's support structure". Interesting to see that people seem to be figure it out again. Seems to be a case of "everything old is new again."
As for the 5.7x28, I own a Ruger 57, and a CZ-52 as well. Why? Because I have a soft-spot for bottle-necked pistol cartridges. While I've carried my Ruger on some occasions -- and am sure I could handle pretty much any threat with a total of 60 rounds at my disposal -- I would not carry my CZ-52 except in an emergency. Both of them can deal with any likely threat, but being left-handed trying to use the CZ-52 . . . well, the lack of ergonomics might get me killed.
Roy mentioned my favorite caliber , the 38 Super. I for the life of me can't understand why it isn't more popular. As far as the 5.7 goes , I'll pass. I have 4 S&W M&Ps in 9MM , 40S&W , 45ACP and just bought the new 10MM. I don't plan on buying the 5.7.
Thumbs up for the 38 super love.
Just sold the m&p 9 for this. The 5x7 is a much better gun then anything you just named lmfao
Eli Manning - if you plan on going the 5.7 path, vanguard outfitters makes a round called black fang dragon that is worth serious consideration.
@@youtubewatcher4792 I agree there brotha. I got 2 boxes coming in the mail. I need something I can actually shoot accurately. I can't shoot pistols for crap man. I have shot long guns my whole life and am a great shot. But when it comes to pistols it's a whole different ball game, and with the injuries I have now and a wife and a 4 year old nephew with me all the time and 34 years old I don't know if I can take 5 people like I use too. So i need something I can put on point where I want it. I can't shoot a 9mm for the life of me. This at least I'm on paper lol
Note: it's not like I didn't train with multiple 9mms either. I can shoot the 2000 dollar 9mms easy, but I'm not carrying a 2000 dollar gun and losing it in a court case for 10 years. I went through at least 500 dollars worth of ammo bare minimum with multiple 9mms. So I have practiced lol
Could you imagine owning a 5.7. but living in a 10 round restricted magazine state 🤣..omg ..
ouch in californian who owns a 57
Me...
Its getting cheaper to shoot all the time. I agree about the grip being weird feelng
The Smith & Wesson 57 is a hell of a gun fogies always talking shit about innovation. I’m 52 and I love the 57 took it out to the range and hit a target from 75 yards four times out of 10 I’m rocking with it.
Gun snobs at their worst
Having a different opinion hardly makes anyone a 'Snob.'
Slandering others who have a different opinion, does.
Well done.
I mean why not carry frangable 460 xvr...
If the ammo stays the price it is, it's a fad for me lol. I'm not burning money like that. Same with the 22 mag, I was going to get one to save on shooting and they're frickin overpriced so just got a TX22 competition which is alot of fun. Anyone interested in a shield plus performance center ported barrel with the red dot? Has about 400 rounds on it so far, I need to buy ammo and parts for my full size
Out performs a 22 mag all day.
IMHO I'd rather not stake my life on a rimfire cartridge
Your 22 magnum won’t penetrate body armor! These bullets have a nasty tendency to turn backwards! They have great ballistics considerations as well as velocity! I was at Ft. Hood for that incident believe me nobody wants to be shot at with a 5.7 !! Magazine capacity is also great! I wouldn’t want to be shot with a 22 magnum either! I believe in precision accuracy for self defense and this round is great for accuracy at close range!
Ha! I love and own the FN and Smith and Wesson 5.7 and I drive a Hummer H2… also have Glock 20 in 10mm and Glock 33 in 357 sig among many other weapons. I’m not weird.. don’t generalize😂
Some more internet "experts"...
You can find the armor piercing military rounds on gunbroker. I've purchased 200 rounds of the military stuff and plan on buying more.
of people can look further than the mass-produced stuff and get from Elite, Vanguard, or R&R (when available). Most people wouldn't do a lot of volume shooting with tho$e...but defense? You bet. Defeat (much) armor? You bet (cite Buffman). It's much more than just fun, fun, fun...when a person considers follow-up shots, accuracy and any smaller-frame shooters ability to wield it effectively. Or if crafty enough, people can load their own. Comparing 5.7 to whatever 10mm was being tossed about is about as apples vs. oranges as you can get. Being able to quickly/effectively engage 3 or 4 attackers with one vs the other is not the same as being able to stop a grizzly with one vs the other.
These are the you only need 8 round guys.
Ft Hood, 13 fatalities, 13 one shot stops, 11 COM, 1 head shot, 1 stomach shot, every other shot was arm leg or shoulder, 3 one stop shots on 3 men charging the shooter, it took 5 9mm rounds to stop Nidal and it didn't even kill him, you can also buy custom 5.7 ammo that has 400 to 600 fps faster than any neutered commercial FN rounds, look at Ellifritz study on stopping power, 5.7 stopping power is closer to rifle rounds than straight wall pistol cartridges
Terrorist attack in which the shooter had lots of time and shot over 150 rounds vs. self defense scenario when seconds count. This typical Fort Hood argument by 5.7 fanboys is just nonsensical. The mob used to assassinate people with .22 revolvers. That doesn't make a .22 revolver an effective self defense tool.
5.7 out of a pistol performs less than 9mm. That's a fact. There is also no 5.7 pistol round that passes the FBI ballistics protocol. That's another fact.
Yes, there are custom rounds that cost $3-$10/round. They are primarily geared toward offering a civilian variant of SS190. A 20-round magazine filled with those rounds would cost you $60-$200 and you are supposed to carry a backup magazine. You would be carrying $120-$400 of ammo.
Oh, and you certainly would need to make sure that the ammo cycles reliably by shooting 100-200 rounds, i.e., spending another $300-$2,000. I have not met a single 5.7 owner that does any of that. In fact, I have not seen a single 5.7 in a training class, as you can easily shoot 300-500 rounds per day.
And, no, it's still not serious rifle ballistics out of a pistol. S4 Elite Ammunition is 2,500 fps, but only 28 grain, for $2.88/round + shipping.
@@charliefoxtrot5001 I've shot 9mm and 5.7 into ballistic gel, I'll stick with 5.7 you can have your 9mm
@@nicoscarfo4486 Ignorance is bliss! Which 5.7 round do you carry in your pistol?
@@charliefoxtrot5001 I carry vanguard black fang, taking in to account the drastic difference in recoil and ability to get on target faster, the ability to have more rounds in a similar sized gun that weighs less, and the ability to go through alot of types of soft armor while producing hydrostatic shock like a rifle and a larger wound cavity than almost all 9mm rounds Im super comfortable carrying my 57 half the time and my glock 20sf the other half when im feeling brave. Its not for everyone but it is definitely not a cartridge to dismiss so quick
@@ryankelly6652 The Vanguard Outfitters Black Dragon Fang looks certainly interesting, but there is just one problem. It is my understanding that Vanguard Outfitters got sued by Elite Ammunition 8 years ago and stopped producing ammo. Got any more info on that? In any case, it's no different than the Elite Ammunition I already pointed out with the same ridiculous cost implications.
And, no, it's not serious rifle-type terminal ballistics, despite marketing claims. A 28 grain bullet flying at 2,500 fps with 389 ft-lbf is just not a 55 grain bullet flying at 3,000 fps with 1099 ft-lbf. There is a 1.2x speed, a 2x weight and a 2.8x energy difference. And that's just 5.56.
By the way, body armor is defeated with training, not with gear!
I carry my Glock 20 Gen 4 when I think I need to.
You don't have the facts. Look at the analysis. The survivors took extremity hits. When it was on target, lethality was extremely high.
Thats y I don't listen to old timers....you wouldn't know shit from gold if it hits you in the face LMFAO
I'm a year late to the party but these guys make Tim Walz look manly. How's a dude with a Wilford Brimley mustache and suspenders consider anyone else weird?
Why can't someone import a 7.62x25 doublestack gun? Lots of speed and lots of energy. North of 500ft/lbs.
its soo cool and trendy... except it penetrates body armor...
And subsonic is used with a silencer on my range... The crack is gone!👍
Hmm your 22 mag doesn’t stack up my man with the 5.7. I find it funny these guys state carrying a 5.7 is “ weird “ it’s simply because they know very little about the caliber and seem afraid of anything that’s isn’t a 9 mil or 45acp. Cmon guys go out and fire it before you talk sh*t about something you don’t know
He even brought up the Ft Hood shooting, he COM 11, 1 head shot, 1 stomach shot, the rest were arm leg and shoulder shots, if he had used a 9mm the fatalities would've been far less
Stand in front of one and tell us how it goes. 🤷♂️
Sorry my mind drifted for a second... I could have swore I heard Huntington say that wheat wears a girdle or something or a bulletproof girdle 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Damn ... the secret's out .... Roy
@@fmgpubs 😂😂 take care Roy .. I love how you guys could poke fun of each other.. always love watching you guys...
@@glenmones713 But Tom’s so easy to poke fun at, it’s child’s play! Thanks for watching and posting. Roy
I cant believe that big toe just said "not really that effective" lmao
5.7 x 28 - James Reeves has 5.7 reasons its better than 9mm
Those that can’t do, teach or write about it.
The 5.7 is a laser.
Have the Palmetto State Armory Rock 5.7 all tough fun to shoot the down size are the price of ammunition and the lack of availability to choose from. If you want the best 5.7x28 ammunition you're going to pay around $300 a box. The ammo I've shot FNH 40 grain blue tip and Federal Eagle 40 grain, am not impressed. Is the 5.7x28 a fad? Only time will tell. A 40 grain bullet traveling at 1800-2000 fps definitely has the ability to kill someone.
Gun cranks is the perfect name for you guys--cranky old men who are set in their ways
Ok boomer
I sill question the one stop shot capability of the 5.7 but to compare it to a 22 mag is placing your ignorance on display.
5.7. Just don’t appeal to be a fight stopper. Fire power. Pistol ammo is pricey
Yeah until the grouping is tight in the person chest. Less recoil even in a situation is better that missing with medium to high recoil
I dont care what you say it like my 5.7 i have the ruger pistol and carbine and i love it and also im not a weardo
Love the show as always. Agree with everything. BUT, in defense of us weirdos who like weird guns…. That is where advances come. The first Double Action revolvers were not all that. Neither were the first Single Actions for that matter. The first 9mm hardball ammo wasn’t up there with REAL guns like the 45.
But. Those weirdos started something.
(Personally tho. I’ll stick with my Ruger Birdshead in .45 with the companion acp cylinder)
You're right David. Like race cars, that technology often makes it into "regular" cars. But you have to admit some of the weird guns are ... well .... weird. Roy
you guys are AWESOME. PLEASE KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK!!!
Green tips almost hit 2000fps
5.7 is a fun fad
Take 20 rounds in your body then talk about it
Just goes to show….anyone can get on RUclips. Doesn’t mean you know what your talking about……
Good target gun.
45 ACP all the way.
These guys completely miss the point of the round and its intended use. Classic boomer talking points.
What about 10 mil
What about it? Good for the woods, likely too hot for the streets.