Do not commit the 7 Shooter's Sins - Ken Hackathorn & Bill Wilson discuss Gun Culture -Gun Guys Ep56
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- The Gun Guys, Bill Wilson and Ken Hackathorn, have compiled a list of "The Shooter's Seven Sins." Many of them are things that all shooters are guilty of. Some are warnings against current trends. But be careful not to commit any of these 7 shooter's sins.
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ABOUT BILL WILSON Bill Wilson has always been infatuated with guns. Originally trained as a watchmaker, he has been in the firearms industry since 1974, starting out with a retail store called Sportsman's Headquarters in Berryville, Arkansas. Since that humble beginning, he has built Wilson Combat into the largest and most successful custom firearms company in America. Since 1977 Wilson Combat has been the leading innovator in high-performance, custom 1911 handguns, tactical long guns and accessories. A Wilson Combat product’s unmatched level of exceptional reliability and peerless craftsmanship is only equaled by our legendary customer service. Wilson Combat is proud to service all levels of local and State law enforcement including The Department of Homeland Security, US Border Patrol, HQ SOCOM, US Marshal's Service, US Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, Coast Guard, Diplomatic Security Service, Texas Rangers and many more elite law enforcement and military units worldwide. We are also pleased to support the needs of thousands of law-abiding private citizens in the United States and in many other countries abroad.
ABOUT KEN HACKATHORN Ken Hackathorn has served as a US Army Special Forces Small Arms Instructor, Gunsite Instructor, and NRA Police Firearms Instructor. He is currently an FBI Certified Firearms Instructor, and an SRT member and Special Response Team trainer. Ken has trained US Military Special Operations forces, Marine FAST and SOTG units and is a contract small arms trainer to FBI SWAT and HRT. Ken has provided training to Federal, State, and local law enforcement agencies and been active in small arms training for the past 25 years. He has written firearms related material for Guns & Ammo, Combat Handguns, Soldier Of Fortune, and currently American Handgunner and contributed to at least six other gun/shooting journals. Ken was also a founding member of IPSC and IDPA.
0:00 - 7 Shooter's Sins
1:15 - 1. Possibilities vs Probabilities
3:50 - 2. Practicing what you are good at not what you aren't
5:30 - 3. Good Draw Grip and Firm Firing Grip
10:35 - 4. Trying to Buy Skill
13:30 - 5. Speed will Make up for Accuracy
16:45 - 6. Tuning a Gun until it doesn't Work
21:25 - 7. Carrying a gun as a Lucky Charm
24:50 - The Shooter's Seven Deadly Sins
#GunGuys #BillWilson #KenHackathorn 
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Did we miss a shooter's sin that you would like to add to the list?
I thought you were going to leave out the ridiculous quest For speed over accuracy, but you covered it. That would be my biggest gripe. Thanks!
Constantly adjusting adjustable sights?!?
💥😎Thinking you're gonna shoot like "John Wick" because you buy the same guns as him! lol🤣👍🇺🇸
8. Giving unsolicited advice at the range.
@@onpsxmember OMG this is HUGE! And it especially happens to women. My wife is constantly getting unsolicited advice from male shooters on match day (Defensive Pistol) - even though she smokes them in the competition! It's...weird. 🤣
Man, kudos to Bill for absolute selflessness and honesty! A man whose livelihood depends on manufacturing and selling "fancy guns" stressing to buy ammo and practice instead of buying more fancy guns.
100% but I think the biggest point was to stop adjusting a stock gun not that a fine tuned factory gun doesn't have it's place
My out-loud words almost excatly as I was listening 👍🏻👍🏻
I also noted his comment saying pretty much all the guns from good manufacturers now days are good, reliable and enough accuracy for self defense.
Yes but carry cuts look great.
Amen. Now, if my budget allowed me to buy a new Wilson Combat pistol, I would. They are good guns. Meanwhile, I keep shooting my old G19. I did put some good aftermarket night sights on it.
Great Advice! I retired from the Police Dept. of a major city after 35 years. I began my career with a 4-inch S&W revolver. I recall that we were not trained to shoot from the draw. Our first shot was always from the ready position. After I retired, I continued to work armed security as an Independent Contractor. I sold my service revolver and purchased a 9mm sub-compact. After recently giving up working armed security and moving to Florida, I just sold my sub-compact 9mm and purchased a 380 Sig 365 because it seemed to be easily concealed and has less recoil and weight than the Sig 365 9mm. Here in Florida, outer garments are rarely used, so obviously a smaller gun is easier to conceal. Yesterday, I took my new Sig 365 in 380 to the range and I was very disappointed in my shooting, although the gun worked flawlessly. I will take Ken and Bill’s advice and buy more ammunition and train until I master draw, accuracy, and speed. Much appreciated!!! It's been 1 year since I gave this comment, and since then, I went back to the 9MM with the Sig 365.
CLASSIC example of exactly what they spoke about.
Thank you for your service.
Those sub-compact or micro-compact pistols are a bitch to shoot. It took me close to 500 rounds to get comfortable with my LCP haha
I wanted to love the 365 SO badly, but could not shoot it worth a damn like I could a Mustang, so I also went .380 (Lehigh only, as recommended by Massad on this channel) but down a few rounds at 10+1 with Mag-Guts.
Guilty of a few. Relaxing my grip after first shot was a huge problem until realizing that problem and training to fix it. I actually talk to myself through the stages. Tighten that grip!
Im guilty of many, actually.
@@LeandroMoretti So you mustve learned a lot from this video. I hate dryfire but it does help.
@@4America2024 same here
I used to be guilty of at least half of them. Through continual training I learned to keep my gun tuning as close to factory specs as possible and tighten my grip before shooting. After hearing sin #3 I'm realizing that I may be loosening my grip by the second or third shot though.
I've been a shooter since I was a kid in the 1960's, and I never fail to learn new things from Bill, Ken, and Mas. Thanks so much for sharing your vast knowlege and experience!!
I could listen to these gentlemen all night such a wealth of experience, such wisdom freely given. Best of thanks from the Rheintal in North East Switzerland.
Thanks for listening
"Speed is fine but accuracy is final." Wyatt Earp
I can almost hear Doc Holiday observing: "He missed everything - really fast!"
My biggest sin is sometimes relaxing my grip subconsciously when shooting. It's something I need to think about constantly. I think that's a very common problem with many! Thanks for a great video my friends!
It was for me until I realized it and consciously am trying to remember to tighten that grip everytime I shoot.
As a newbie to the pistol world, this was one of the most informative videos I've seen. Kudos to the guys and thanks.
These guys share knowledge that I wish I knew 43 years ago when I first became a cop
Wilson's point is valid. Don't 🚫 buy a new $800 gun then buy a $8 holster. A ccw system or gun requires a belt, magazine holder, holster. You don't need to spend $200, 500.00 but be a informed consumer. Buy good kit, well known brands.
Welcome to the club. Practice, practice. I does help with muscle memory.
The amount of knowledge those two have in the firearms industry is unsurpassed!
I’ve watched everyone of your posts I’ve found, and this is absolutely the best of them all. Excellent advice.
Great to hear!
Agreed.
This is how you learn,by simply listening to someone who has the wisdom,and experience.Outstanding sirs!!!! Ready for more!!!
More to come!
The Wilson Combat Channel is the only source you need on the gun world. Real education from pioneers in the modern gun world. These guys dispel a lot of myths. There’s no substitute for experience.
The first match I entered back in 1987, I shot a perfect score with the second fastest time of the match.Afterwards I got a lot of comments about my tiny groups and that I would have had the fastest time if I had not shot such small groups.I told all of them my accuracy was what mattered to me the most and the speed was secondary and that speed was getting better the more I practiced! I had a 10 meter air pistol range in my bedroom and my business which was a gun store.We use to have matches weekly in my store after closing and later I adapted Daisys infrared cartridge and target system to work with a Pact timer for speed matches.The Daisy infrared targets had a 2 inch diameter target area and required precise hits to get counted.Had to use double action semi,s and wheel guns only but man did we have some wild draw from concealed carry matches!
Excellent video guys and the humility of Mr Wilson is refreshing considering the masterpieces he builds for the rich folks!
Keep up the awesome videos as I always learn something new from everyone of them!
This is the BEST video you two have made together! Hopefully, many people will realize what mistakes they're making.
Hope so!
I live in New England. In December, the sun sets around 3:30. Carrying a light on your gun around here is a reasonable choice. Many deadly force incidents happen at night. The Streamlight tlr7 is small enough that it is reasonable to carry on a daily basis.
“Accuracy with speed” Love it! Along those lines, the one other that bothers me most is “fire power”. For years now the drive has been to carry more rounds. Double stack mags may be fine for some and that’s all well and good, but I fire a single stack 1911 grip far more accurately, consistently. And in an urban setting more lead in the air is not “fire power”. Fire power to me has always focused on accuracy! And less lead in the air reduces the danger to bystanders etc. As you both emphasized, the current drive for speed also lends itself to more lead in the air! Even many of our recent law enforcement involved shootings seem to be expending more and more rounds. There are many variables that we could argue all night about why that is and I think you covered most, if not all of those here pretty well, but just having more doesn’t mean you should expend more. Especially when better accuracy could have eliminated most of it. I think that’s probably covered under your training for ‘probability vs possibility’ rule as well. Another terrific video, Excellent reminders.
As a retired Fed, and a 40+ year Instructor--though not at the levels of either of you, I AGREE whole heartedly with you on the possibility v probability. About a decade ago, before I retired from the Border, ISIS made threats against LE in the SOCAL area. Without talking with each other, six other instructors or people I considered shooters, ALL made the same change. We put our custom 1911s in the gun safe and went back to high-cap 9mms. If you find yourself at a party thrown by ISIS that you didn't want to be invited to, I want as many things that go "bang" as possible! Now that I'm retired and teaching part-time for fun, I've gone back to 1911s without concern. Sure, I carry a Hellcat some days, or a G-19, but I'm not concerned with things that have a one in a million chance of realistically happening. Also, NOBODY can miss fast enough to win anything. KUDOS to you both! Hammer
Well said,.
Trying not to be devil's advocate here, but on the flip side, I don't understand this assumption by "low capacity shooters" (ie mainly revolver and 1911 advocates) that have this belief that if you decide to carry a double-stack handgun that it's almost an obligation that you must want to mag-dump it until it's empty. If the "average" gunfight usually ends with 2-3 rounds expended, then I don't understand why the "low capacity folks" get so wrapped around the axle thinking they'll only fire 2-3 shots while the "high-capacity folks" are automatically going to "spray and pray" their way through, when the reality is they'll more than likely fire a similar number of rounds and the only difference is they'll just have more rounds left in the magazine compared to the revolver and 1911 folks.
@@Verdha603 My comments are not based on any assumptions but rather actual first hand experience. My comments truly only apply to those who are prioritizing more ammo over accuracy and in my experience in law enforcement, the trend, as well as the marketing strategies have been to emphasize higher capacity. There’s obviously a balance thats needed to be achieved individually. My opinion was and is that accuracy should be the priority. In line with the discussion regarding probability vs possibility. There are many factors to consider. The more unnecessary weight you add to a duty belt has some serious long term effects on ones posture and health. If you are someone who is simply following the marketing trend you may want to consider first which weapon your most accurate with and then adjust the number of extra magazines you feel are reasonable depending on where you live and work or on duty vs off duty if your in law enforcement. The video solicited comments. I gave mine. Depending on how you make your choices about which weapon to carry it likely didn’t apply to you at all. If however I have triggered some emotional, knee jerk reaction you may wish to reconsider why that is and reevaluate how you look at these things. Far too often I’ve seen young officers make these decisions based on marketing tactics and peer pressure only to learn the hard way through experience that what they’ve stated here are real considerations to be taken into account. There have been plenty of documented shootings where officers join in a firefight simply because other officers are shooting. A relatively recent one here in my neck of the woods involved over 15 officers shooting at a vehicle when they clearly had no line of sight on the suspect as he was dead out on the sidewalk long before the shooting of the suspects truck had stopped. Obviously not every officer falls into any general statement. But then thats exactly what this video is addressing, general statements about “shooting sins”. Not all apply to everyone. But all are good food for thought!
@@Bodhi1satva While I can’t say my experience is LEO in nature, I am simply pointing out the flip side of the coin. To draw from my military experience, I would say it is equally a problem to have older members that end up so set in their ways as to prove incapable of accepting change or adapting to changes in circumstances, whether that be advances in technology or training. I have seen the prioritization for accuracy reach such an extreme as to listen to the “old timers” preach ad nauseum that they only need “one shot, one kill”, when the data simply doesn’t bear it out. Just like there is a trend for younger soldiers to focus on “firepower” to the point of sacrificing accuracy, so too do the older soldiers focus so much on “accuracy” as to oftentimes treat even the idea that multiple hits may be required on one target as a failure on the competence of the individual shooter. Technological advances meet similar resistance in a way that just boggles my mind at their inability to grasp the fundamental advantages certain technologies can offer (ie eschewing rifle optics for irons out of some misplaced sense that shooters will be more ammunition conscious with irons, or in this case often taking the view that more ammunition in a firearm is primarily, if not solely, a replacement for skill).
As you said, a balance of the two is required and every individual has different priorities to consider, and while I am not saying this out of some sense of knee jerk reaction, I am simply showing the flip side of the coin that often gets ignored of the older crowd refusing to accept new information and continuing to make decisions based on “what worked in my day”, with any criticism of this viewpoint usually being swept aside as “you youngsters just don’t know how to respect your elders, do you?”
"In a gun fight, you need to take your time in a hurry." Wyatt Earp
The “you only train what you are already good at” sin is so true…
Have been doing that since school
True, but maybe he is really good at it because he trains at it - maybe he trains at it because he likes it more. Definitely a chicken or egg question.
I really appreciate you making these videos. They're educational and might save a life someday. I share them with my friends who own guns and carry. And I absolutely practice, practice, practice! Practice dry-firing, re-loading and drawing from various positions because you won't always be standing facing your target when you need to draw and defend yourself.
30 years ago this month I participated in the Orange County Law Enforcement "Top Gun Pistol" Match. Numerous civilian and military law enforcement agencies from Orange County California use to participate in this annual match. It was based on the Mozambique Drill. Each shooter had two B-27 type targets, each string shooting two to the body and one to the head on each target. They added the extra incentive that speed will break a tie in accuracy. The only caveat was that a miss eliminates you from the match. Every string of fire someone was eliminated after a clear miss on a B-27 from 7 yards. Most of the people who missed were usually the fastest shooters in that string. After two-thirds of the shooters were gone, two Marines, a female Captain, and myself, a Master Sergeant, along with five LEOs were left. They moved us back to the 15-yard line and we went through numerous strings, all eliminations due to misses, always in the headshot. It came down to two shooters, the female Marine Captain and myself. They moved us back to the 25-yard line for the final string. The Captain had always beat me in speed, but her shots were never as accurate as mine. The last string went by with the Captain firing her final shot before me. She beat me for time, but when they scored the target, I had clearly won for accuracy. My headshots were right where they should be and hers were not. One of her headshots was below the neckline of the target. Both the Captain and I were shooting our issued M9 Berettas. Speed is good, but accuracy won the day for me.
"Fast is fine, but accurate is final" - attributed to Wyatt Earp. You proved it!
Slower is smoother and smoother is faster
Kenneth pretty cool!!
This is some next level dumbass boomer logic. In the real world she could've sent 5 headshots in the time your slow ass sent one. Even if all 5 were slightly low or some low/some high, she had a greater effect on target. Balance of speed and accuracy. It doesn't matter if you can shoot .25 MOA if it takes you 3.5 days to make that shot.
Very true! Sort of. You cant be poky either.
It is so refreshing to watch an entire video without ads, not to mention the excellent content. Many Thanks,
I remember seeing a quote from no less than Wyatt Earp some years ago in a book. Earp was being interview by someone, and they asked him at one point how he had survived so many gunfights. His answer was something I remember to this day, and it would still be good advice. What he said was "Shoot slow. In a hurry." That would be good advice for anyone in a life or death scenario. Accuracy has always been more important than speed.
Very well said, "prepare for probability and don't chase possibilities!"
Muzzle discipline. When at a shooting range keep that muzzle pointed down range at all times.
I always look forward to new videos from you two and this one as usual did not disappoint.
The NUMBER one shooter sin. A newbie purchasing a firearm and thinking they're good to go with ZERO instruction, training and practice. I've been an avid shooter since 2004 when I purchased my first pistol. Since then, I currently STILL take firearms lessons from people who are way more advanced than I'll probably ever be. There's always more to learn. My takeaway from this video is that I didn't learn anything new.....which is a good thing!
The best advice I ever received was from a lifetime shooter. From shooting rabbits as a kid, Vietnam, the AMU to the presidents 100. Jamie, you can’t miss fast enough to win. Miss you Mr Don C. Thanks for the years on the range.
These two gentlemen are a national treasure. As a fellow crusty old dude, I appreciate their candor and perspective.
I followed along, writing the list, and finding 8 or 9 things I need to practice on during range trips. I need more ammo! Thank you both for sharing the life time of knowledge you carry with you every day!
Love this series. I really like your input. I tend to carry a revolver. I carried 1911 and Glocks for a long time. As I have progressed I got more interested in wheel guns and found I can carry and shoot them pretty good. I know capacity is the big issue but it’s one I’m willing to accept. I feel very well armed with my SW 66-3 and a speed loader.
You better hit. Because I count shots.. then advance. (Yes I've dont it.)
@@hawghawg381 Wow. It sounds like you’ve been in a gun fight or two. Where I live it’s not quite that bad.
@@Graydog-sx6le Iraq (1 time) and Afghanistan (twice)
@@hawghawg381 , Thanks for what you did. Hope all is going good now.
@@hawghawg381 And what if they top off a mag after chambering a round? What if they’re quicker with reloads than you’re giving them credit for? What if they’re firing full-auto (which can make counting a bit more difficult)? What if there are two shooters or one shooter with two guns? There are too many likely scenarios there for me to count my life on counting rounds fired. The fact that you’re here commenting means it worked well enough for you. How often was that a thing? I just can’t imagine too often.
Bill, you hit the nail on the head train with the tool you carry. Have enough ammo on hand for training at a minimum twice a month, I'm on the range weekly 250-500 peas
Great to see 2 greats in this craft still pushing. Been a fan for over 20 years.
Outstanding! I advise people to use this formula when choosing life saving equipment and training methods: Evidence Based Practices + Historical Precedent = Probability / Emotion has no place here...
One that I would add for certain guns, train with your defensive ammo. Nothing wrong with range ammo for a good bit of your time on trigger, but at some point you need to spend some serious time shooting with defensive ammo. You may find that your gun behaves differently when the gun is running HSTs instead of Winchester white box FMJ. This is especially true in the little pocket pistols.
As a newbie, I'd wondered about that. Guess I'll have to try it! Thanks :-)
THIS.
Wow! Interesting in case I carry one as a backup.
I carry Inceptor ARX 9mm+P and they make a cheaper round nose that is the exact same bullet weight and load as the self defense round. It's really helpful for training with your carry ammo.
Great video. These are something we all need to hear and take to heart.
Absolutely!
Awesome as always. Thank you. You guys continue to cover all the good subjects.
Great video guys. You were spot on. Most of these pearls of wisdom can apply to both self defense and competition shooting alike. Thanks for sharing.
Keep getting well Mr. Wilson! Your hosts are great, I value these clips . . . they really help.
Great orators and so much knowlege.
Thank you…cheap wisdom versus expensive add ons for your gun! I’ll practice and buy ammo!
Love the advice and gorgeous landscape!
I just started your series of the Gun Guys on you tube as a way to better understand the 1911 model hand guns. I have enjoyed viewing listening to both Bill and Ken. The experience and wisdom of these two gentlemen is amazing. I have gained some much knowledge on the functions and characteristics of the 1911. But most of all how to become a better shooter. I have owned a few 1911 and over the years and I kept the three I enjoy shooting the most. Thanks,and look forward viewing your next video. Ed😊
Excellent discussion. Practice with the gun/guns you carry and buy ammo. Love it.
As we age some folks lose some of their grip strength. I'm 70 yrars young and suffer from this. Are there any tips to perhaps adjust the grip to compensate for the loss of strength?
For Bill, I just got out of the hospital due to the china flu, take care of yourself!
Best to ya',,,,!
Love this stuff!! Fantastic series and I watch every second of the gun guys.
Knowledge is wisdom. You both have a lot of that. Thanks for sharing and keeping it real.
Thanks for watching!
Such a great video guys, thank you for all of this information, we can all benefit from all of the points you discussed.
One of the best “Gun Guys” episodes!
Great advice and useful content. I was having this conversation with a buddy yesterday and several other days about this topic. I was fortunate to grow up in the 70s and followed a lot of the careers of pioneer shooters. I got into law enforcement in the early 80s and got sage wisdom from old heads. Good training and range habits. As a husband/ dad/ and FTO I've stressed much of what you two covered in this video. Thank you and get well soon Mr Wilson 🙏
Awesome reminders to things We all should know, do and practice! Thank You Guy’s
Drawing from concealment is a big problem for most of us and practice is the only way to get better. Important to practice with your actual carry gun, holster and belt.
The speed over accuracy discussion is so true. I grew up in Columbia MO and was trained a bunch by Ray Chapman. I think Chapman count is the perfect mix for accuracy over speed. IPSC targets are scored 10/8/5. SUBTRACT the time from the score. Whoever shoots the most accurately, the fastest, wins. That's what it should have been from the beginning. Good video gents.
Thank you. As a newer, older shooter I learned so much information from you and am taking it to the range.
Keep up with the great work.
Really appreciate your time and insight. Practice, practice, practice!
Great honest video, it is so important, this should be viewed by everyone who uses a pistol. One big take way you mention throughout is PRACTICE. Thank for this educational video.
Excellent video, gentlemen. I was about to have a gripe with the last point until Ken mentioned comfort of carry. In my opinion, I’d rather have a LCP in my pocket (figure of speech) that I know I would bring everywhere over a G40 that I won’t bring anywhere. The tool is useless if you don’t have it on you. Keep up the quality content!
Thanks for sharing
Love the content. Thank you for all your videos.
Love your videos. Always great information!
I’ve been carrying a bone stock J Frame S&W for over 50 years. I’m not an engineer so I don’t change anything except the grip to accommodate my XLG hands. I can’t carry anything larger or heavier b/c of back & hip issues but I do practice as often as possible. I have to chuckle when I see people buy a bunch of expensive stuff to hang on the gun in hopes of improving their skill level.
Spending most of the money on ammunition is easy these days.
No kidding. It’s gotten so bad that at this point, there are viable carry pistols that cost less than a decent range day. Not to mention how much worse it gets if you want to practice with actual good carry ammo. I just loaded up a single standard AR mag with varmint ammo for home defense and dropped over $50 in the process.
Awesome segment! I have realized most of this overtime, on my own but the affirmation is so encouraging.
Thank you for sharing your extremely valuable insights.
Great discussion. Thank you both for imparting some of your wisdom.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great advice from experienced shooters! Speed comes with experience but should never be at the cost of accuracy!
Great information guys. I always look forward to you getting together and speaking candidly about our chosen discipline.
Thanks for watching!
100%
GRIP! GRIP! GRIP!
This was a great review!
That was some high level concepts intended for the experienced shooter. We need that. Practice is for advancement and muscle memory, which only lasts 72 hours. Shooting, particuarly pistol and shotgun, is much like playing a musical instrument or learning a language. It needs to be done every day. The criteria for buying a gun should generally be is it fun to shoot at the range or hunting, outside of collecting and historic arms. The smallest pistol for me that fits that criteria is the Kahr P380, and the largest is the S&W 4006. In between are the SA35, 1911s, Model 686, things like that. I love shooting steel targets with my gun club friends every Saturday. This week is revolvers. Every day I shoot on my home range or go to the club when in town for errands. What do I carry? Ratshot in a revolver for snakes. My carry environment is not filled with people. Here on the Mexcian border, self defense is way more serious requiring rifles and shotguns. The illegals are armed and all managed by the Mexican drug cartels. There are more LEs than citizens in my county because of the border. More like 3-gun competition than IDPA.
Howdy from Wyoming! Great video. Gratitude and Respect for these 2 giants of gun/self defense world!
Get better fast Mr Wilson. 🙏👍🏼
Much respect. Honesty and integrity.
Thanks to you both for sharing your knowledge and experience
💪🏼🇺🇸
God bless
Great video, we agree to buy more ammo and train. We know that 99% of firearms owners don't train consistently.
You guys make a lot of sense. Thank you!
Wisdom at its finest. All of the RUclips gun experts are just so full of it. Ken and Bill are the G.O.A.T people.
Excellent content.
Biggest and warmest thanks. I’m sending this to all of my clients! I see these sins popping up on their attitudes all the time at my courses. Peace Be The Journey!
There needs to be a part 2! Great info
Get Better Soon Mr. Wilson, and may I say to both of you, fantastic information as always keep these videos coming. P.S. I would Love To See The Training Classes Start again at Wilson Combat.
Great video guy's, love the northwest. I'm from hot humid Alabama, and gone out there a couple of times, I'm jealous. I teach and compete too, one mistake I see kind of goes with the buying skill, "the hottest thing" people discount a old gun. For example I shot a couple of weeks ago in in a conceal carry match, you could only have six rounds in you mag, but no magazine limit. I was shooting my old stock model 39-2 Smith and Wesson and finished 10th out of 39 and up against a lot of tricked out guns glocks and CZ's with Cajun gun works triggers. I'm not saying I am a hotshot ringer, I'm far from that but #8 don't discount or underestimate a old classic. Great stuff and love my CQB ELITE 9MM.
Thanks gentlemen for another great video! Point 5…speed vs accuracy, what a nemesis! This philosophy did more to disillusion me with competitive shooting than any other single thing. I still chose to compete but with a lot less fervor because it was no longer intellectually realistic. So, what if anything is ever going to change this? I lost a match, in cowboy action to a shooter who dropped 8 points more than I, but he was faster! How practical is that? I left that sport there after to pursue IDPA…but the same thing applies there to this day as well.
>> I lost a match, in cowboy action to a shooter who dropped 8 points more than I, but he was faster
Please explain. SASS is scored hit/miss, not with points. Do you mean missed 8 more targets than you? That would be 40 seconds added in penalties and still had a faster adjusted time.
@@FUNshoot Yes sir, 8 misses!
If your competitive instincts will let you, you can still shoot matches but care more for accuracy, solid fundamentals, & good info-processing. It's still very good for your pistolcraft. Who cares if you are climbing the ladder toward GM? If you don't care, the competition world offers lots of good practice opportunity. Most fellow competitors I've met are supportive and not heckling, nudging, or condescending. It doesn't seem to matter if another shooter is super-fast and likely to win the match, or a brand new shooter who makes many stumbles on his first stage. So it's a great opportunity to hone your skills. But I'll admit for sure, the "beep" instinctively makes me want to put my foot to the floor. I try to rein that in and work on what I said above.
@@seanoneil277 Absolutely agree, you have to decide what your personal goals are and pursue those. At my age, 73, it’s honing and improving my skills with accuracy being the primary objective and speed secondary. As an NRA Instructor and Security Team Coach these are my principle goals, but I still intent to do my best and remain a strong competitor. Winning would just be icing on the cake!
Thank you both!
Any time!
Very good video. Many should take heed because all of these are important. Thanks guys for another valuable episode.
I realized awhile back, after making holster adjustments and body placement, that I could carry just about any handgun that I own. I got caught up in the pocket rocket propaganda which felt more comfortable to carry but accuracy was depleted. Like you said, it doesn’t matter how many rounds you can carry or how fast you shoot, if you can’t hit the target, game over. Great video!! 👏
I think the above goes for a lot of people. Most of the time, it's not the gun that is making concealment and carry difficult. It's more often a poorly designed holster, an insufficient gun belt, poor body positioning, or neglect/improper use of concealment wings and wedges. Good thing about all that is, it's generally far cheaper to fix those elements of one's concealment setup than it is to buy a whole new gun.
Dave-- roger that!!
I'm sure that over the years, people have used pocket carry and even "made it work" when called upon -- but in my relatively new (1.5 yrs) pistol experience, a pocket carry seems way more like the "lucky charm" that Bill & Ken talked about. My mindset about everything -- not just pistols -- is to do it with serious attention, not with any static in the equation like what everyone says is the hot stuff, or what some folk hero allegedly did, or the worst one, getting tempted toward any sort of "lucky charm" perspective toward the tool I'm using. Learn to use the tool or don't use it at all. What happens when you try serious production carpentry by using a hammer with a swing from the wrist, or a swing from the wrist + elbow combined? How many nails do you miss, or bend?
Commander size 1911s, HK compacts, and compact/full size Beretta PX4s are examples of pistols that are concealable, comfortable to carry and handle, and shoot accurately. Most of the sub-compact/micro pistol lines are being up-sized in an attempt to offset the short comings of tiny handguns. As you say, many gun owners are realizing comfort and ease of concealment do not justify sacrificing accuracy and reliability.
Agree. Yet a point to consider is how 1911 compacts face an additional issue in achieving high reliability that most other purpose-built compacts don't. The 1911 was based upon the 5" barrel design's feeding geometry which afforded a shallow cartridge feed angle, and hence it rarely suffers failure to go into battery during chambering. Sadly, this is not the case with the shorter barrel 1911s, the 4 1/2" Commander being the least worrisome. However, today there are 3" barrel 1911 Officer models. Shortening the barrel length increases the feed angle of the cartridge. And that means the fresh cartridge rim is scrubbing along the soot-laden breech face, and the projectile is scrubbing against the soot-laden feed ramp as it also then scrubs against the soot-laden upper rear breech area of the barrel... all of this adds troublesome friction to the chambering process. This design phenomenon means compact & sub compact 1911s are more prone to suffer malfunctions with the cartridge failing to chamber and where it can bobble going nose high, and that at an increasing higher rate as the gun gets dirtier after a few dozen rounds are fired. It's important then to keep the frame rails oiled, and to regularly field-clean the internal surfaces mentioned, using a small cloth. Also using a heavier recoil spring, plus firing projectiles with an ogive as close to that of the original 230 gr. ball projectile as possible makes a difference.
I don't know how anyone shoots all these crappy micro striker pistols that fill half the space in gun stores these days. The answer is probably that they don't and it just sits in a drawer or closet.
The gun industry is like every other company we have seen over the years. They used to make useful, high quality "buy it for life" tools, where now it's all about selling vibes and cheap, high profit margin crap that they plan to make obsolete every few years.
Great insight, and information for everyone.
Always appreciate your incite. Thank you both
Thanks for watching!
I'm guilty of #7. It's like you go out to the mailbox and think "ah, I'll just carry the pocket gun", but then start taking that mentality to the park, then the grocery store, then work, and then you just do it all the time.
but, if you practice with it every time you go to any range, you'll shoot it well enough to carry it all the time
When I shoot a 7 yd Bill Drill, I don't even count it unless I get down zero, or all A-zone hits. I'm also disappointed if it takes me more than 2.5 seconds to accomplish that from AIWB concealment.
Most serious shooters do not sacrifice an acceptable level of accuracy for speed. However, many people use an acceptable level of accuracy as an excuse to remain slow.
No you can't miss fast enough to win a gunfight... But you can also hit slow enough to lose one. Anyone who gets serious about training starts to understand the importance of a harmonious balance of speed and accuracy.
I think what they're getting at is that it is possible to to shoot good then learn to shoot good and fast, but nearly impossible to shoot fast then learn to shoot fast and good. Don't ignore fundamentals and reinforce bad habits
I really appreciated this!! Two on target, third shot off, different guns, different set-ups, same results.. Gonna watch the grip closely, slow down, and practice, practice, practice!.
Thanks guys
Excellent list for which I am certainly guilty of several! I would humbly submit dry firing on a regular basis as #8, another one I need to do more of!
Gentlemen, THANK YOU, this was an outstanding video, which encapsulates a LOT of wisdom and experience.
Okay, I’m certainly no Ken Hackathorn or Bill Wilson, but I am 76, I’ve been shooting for over 60 years, I was thoroughly taught the fundamentals by my father (an FBI Special Agent and firearms instruction), and to some degree I’ve “been around the block” several times (two decades of military service will do that). Therefore, I want to combine a few of the sins you’ve highlighted, which seem to me to exacerbate each other substantially.
Focusing on the possible but not the probable, constantly seeking the “magic / latest-and-greatest” hardware, and foolishly concentrating on shooting speed instead of accuracy, ALL combine (imho) to create a potentially horrible situation for defensive shooters. For many (perhaps nearly all) of us, the realistic threats we may be compelled to lawfully defeat are the 0300 intruder who initially breaks the glass in one’s back window, or the unhinged ex-boyfriend/ex-husband who won’t leave one’s daughter alone, or the sociopath who decides to shoot-up a church service or teach a guy (who he feels is driving too slowly) a lesson, or the junkie who want to assault and rob you at the ATM (and so forth). It’s not an armed mob of dozens of anarchists - who, in his right mind, would be within miles of such mayhem? - or a major drug dealer who wants to murder you and your family, or a band of foreign terrorists trying to escape the police, or any other apocalyptic scenario. No, instead it’s the ordinary, frequently dumb, commonplace, thuggish felon.
What does this have to do with the three aforecited Hackathorn/Wilson “sins?” I’d respectfully suggest it has a LOT to do with them. Some shooters may carry extremely high-capacity, every “bell and whistle, tricked-out autoloaders. In reality, however, a five or six shot Smith (K, L or N Frame) or Ruger (GP-100 or SP-101) revolver (or a 1911A1, traditional DA/SA semiautomatic, BHP, or more-modern polymer frame, striker-fired DA pistol, etc.) will almost unquestionably suffice, IF THE SHOOTER DOES HIS JOB WELL. It’s the “Indian, not the bow and arrow” that leads to victory.
Here’s some solid proof, I fear the many younger and/or less experienced members of our community may not appreciate. Jim Cirillo was a highly acclaimed detective on the NYPD’s stakeout squad, a couple decades ago. He was revered for defeating (and for terminating) many extremely serious - and very dangerous - armed felons. The stakeout squad’s fundamental job was to get these truly predatory serial criminals off New York City’s streets, one way or another. Cirillo used a K Frame S&W revolver, loaded with six .38 Special +P lead wadcutters, to take these especially bad criminals down. Nothing fancy or sophisticated - in fact, many contemporary shooter would find this suite of equipment laughable - but nevertheless extremely effective . . . BECAUSE HE FIRED DELIBERATELY AND WITH GREAT ACCURACY. He didn’t need high capacity, or red dot optics, or bonded JHPs, or tuned handguns, or dazzling firing speed, or even an autoloader; rather, he accurately hit his point-of-aim and near instantaneously defeated the threat.
In essence, he was an absolute master of the basics . . . and his documented record clearly demonstrated his true superiority in the fundamentals of defensive handgun shooting could not be defeated.
@@Abledoggie42
I generally agree, IF one enters a venue where large scale lawlessness is common or is currently taking place. To illustrate this, I live in a very nice, upscale, suburban neighbor, my wife and I are retried, and my REALISTIC assessment is our life styles are rather low risk (of course, anything is possible - one can be struck by lighting - however, a Browning M2 .50 machine gun won’t ever be my EDC). Consequently, I feel adequate armed when (for example) I go to the local supermarket (during normal hours) with an SP101, a CZ 75B or a 4.25 inch M&P (weather and clothing dependent). HOWEVER, were anarchy to breakout in my community (essentially impossible) or were I required to make an emergency 0230 drive to an all night medical facility in a sketchy area (very unlikely), you can bet I’d substantially adjust my defensive equipment to fit the REALISTIC emergent need.
I don’t doubt that many Americans EDC needs have changed significantly in the last decade, but (as discussed above) mine really have not.
@@roykiefer7713 I just do the same thing I do every day. Pants, pistol, boots then coffee. Carry same as county duty, every day. Yea, I know other platforms and will carry back-up or "church gun". LOL My wife carries same a duty sometimes. Still it's back to your point, "Can you hit?" I used to carry her little wheelgun years and years ago as backup. 😂Getting older, I see docs in various locations, so I always carry a spare mag these days on an ordinary day. 🤔Changeup to my EDC... even backup spare mag.
@@Abledoggie42 Sorta. Comes back can you hit with those extra rounds? Something I've found often among "carriers" is they will not constant carry their heavy ass sidearm with a lot of rounds. Carried a revolver, 5 rnds with a 5 rnd stripper (found out the .38 could chamber .357M SWC so that was in the stripper) for years and years, even went swimming with it many times.
Back to the questions at hand, will you carry it? will you hit with it? 😊If so, carry on! 😎
Unfortunately, the prospect of a rifle armed gunman killing kids in a school while police stand by is now a reality we have to consider when we look at things which are possible and probable. When it comes to facing the threat of a deranged mass killer, I personally want the greatest capability I can get in my sidearm. High capacity? Check. Ability to make accurate and fast repeated shots out to 40 yards? Check. Extra mags, a light mounted to the front of the gun, a spiffed up trigger with a smoother pull? Check check check.
@@theKashConnoisseur "capability " should be your mindset not bells and whistles. You can add on if your capability and mindset is right.
A wonderful presentation. Learned a lot. Thank you.😊🤠
what youve said here is very informative and these kinds of contents are the ones all new gun owners should keep in mind, RESPECT!
Because of my older eyes, I have a laser grip now. I find it to give instance feedback as to my trigger control in dry firing. As I am a DA revolver guy I can get a lot of dry fire practice in a short time period. I do not think the DA revolver is the gun for all,but I think a lot of it's advantages are overlooked. I completely agree about the draw being the most fungible skill. I think it is a sin not to use your pistol in the field. Ranges have their place, but responding to game opportunities is the closest thing to real world practice you can get. One last thing, is only worrying about defensive shooting. Like it or not, probability or possibility, hunting is using the gun for the offense, and has its place in a skill set. It truly teaches WHEN to shoot. No buzzer or range master to get you moving, just your own judgement and timing.
I used the TV for Go/NoGo drills for the longest (till we cut cable). Couple that with airsoft you'll see if you hit right fast enough. Don't know when it happened, never trained for it, I shoot irons both eyes open.
Be careful, a laser will teach you to rely on it and not your sights. Heck, to see a laser, you cannot be looking at the sights as theyll hide it. Youre far better off with a red dot, especially if you're getting old and your eyes arent what they use to be.
Listening to you two is great ! Thank you for sharing your knowledge !
Thanks for listening
Great advice gentlemen, thank you for posting 👍
Our pleasure!
Only hits count - not fast misses!
Fast hits count. Slow is slow, fast is fast
Another one I see a lot is having 3 or 4 different carry guns. Its hard enough to get really good with one especially under extreme distress. I know its possible to get very proficient with several different carry guns but that take a LOT of training. Work on a primary carry for a long time before you even think of carrying a few different ones.
lol I'm an old fart yea some of us have manual of arms out the wazoo. That shouldn't be a goal. As you said about understanding that one on you.
I have two carry guns, a larger and smaller version of essentially the exact same gun. I think if you're going to have multiple carry guns they should share the same manual or arms and if they share mags/ammo even better.
Great info guys. I've always been a big advocate on training with the gun you carry.
Awesome video. Keep up the great work!
This was really helpful. Being new to concealed carry, the tips about gun size was particularly helpful.