This 3.7L Hartech Rebuilt 996 is a Perfect Porsche 911. But at What Cost?
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
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Today, I experience the car I tell everyone to buy - a 996 generation 911, rebuilt by Hartech after an engine failure and kept fresh with almost exclusively OEM or OEM-spec parts - is it good, and what is the cost of such a car?
#Porsche #991 #911
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Whether it makes financial sense or not: I deeply admire people who set out to do things right, cost be more or less damned. I tip my hat at this man.
Would you do it.....or just trade it before rebuild & buy a nice 996 Turbo....
@@1950bobster I can’t tell you if I’d spend a boatload on a 996 Porsche, because I haven’t driven one. But: For a fun car I strongly prefer a N/A, so yes.. I would rather spend whatever money I have making a N/A car better, than buying a turbo car. Without a doubt.
Same here. Got it spot on.
Amen to that.
That's why we love our cars. ❤
What I love about the older 911's is the size of them. The new ones are too wide for British B roads. They might be quick around the Nurburgring but that's not the real world. 😮
Any 911 after the 997 generation is a really big car. When the 991 came out I saw one side by side with a 997 and the increase in size was really shocking.
I agree, I have a 997 4s and that’s about as wide as want to go with them.
People like to say how much bigger the 992 is over the 996 but it's only 4" longer and 3" wider than a narrow body 996, or only 2" wider than a C4S. So bigger, true, but not even close to a C8 vette which is ~10" longer and ~7" wider, and a wopping 14" longer wheelbase (vs 996). Porsche had to go bigger to stay competitive, but only a little.
@@DSC800I think those width differences are significant, if you live in a country where tight and narrow country roads are commonplace, once you leave the nearest motorway & begin exploring. If you drive mostly on modern roads, then I expect the width difference might disappear as an issue, or at least, bother the driver.
Luke, owner and manager of Friends Green Porsche, whose company did the work outside the engine rebuild (that’s Hartech’s domain) has said in video more than once that there’s a noticeable difference in width, once you’re on the move. FGP HQ is gloriously rural and the roads, off the local main roads, are in not too bad condition, but narrow. Narrow enough that you can’t so easily & safely hustle a 991 generation 911 along than you can a 996/997.
I bought my own 911 from Friends Green Porsche, recommended.
@@GT380man Yeah, I've driven a rented Fiat 500 in and around Lisbon. A fun little car and wouldn't want anything bigger. I'm in San Diego with modern but not so well kept roads.
I don't think the differences are significant other than modern cars have also pushed the wheels out further with tighter clearances between the tire and fender. So a 3" width increase might be more like 5" at the tire wall. I run 10mm spacers on my 996 and could probably go with 15mm. Modern cars run a slightly stretched tire that tucks under the fender with only mm clearance. The sightline of the body of the car and center-caps are pretty much the same. So, with all this, the car feels bigger.
Of course when it comes to rear overhang not much can be done with the Carrera engine in back.
Day 1 of asking jay for garage tour/ fleet update
I second that!
He will update us when there is something to update
@@LawrenceTimmeHopefully it's a Porsche. 😅
Love some Hartech!! I did something similar, hunted for a C4S with a blown engine. Rebuilt to a 4.0 and swapped the tiptronic out for a manual. I timed the market right and could still sell it and get all of money back, plus some. Side note, I did the build myself over 2 years, using a Nickies 4.0 block and stage 1 Hoffman heads. Fully documented on the Rennlist 996 forum.
While I may be biased since I have a 996, but I really like the 996 headlights. The clear versions are like the GT1 Strassenversion which is a cool feature all while being different from the other 911s. Of course the classic 911 headlights are iconic, but the car still retains the classic 911 shape all while being a great car.
The early headlights are the best feature of the car!
I have the clear versions as well, and have even toyed with the idea of getting a set of ambers.
Total copy of the lights on the GT1 race-car, so all the beardies can wind their necks in.
The original headlights look even better on cars with the aero kit👌
It's always been beautiful.
Dgaf about hivemind goofs
Glad you enjoyed the work we did on the engine
Amazing car. Amazing video. Well done on the choices, perfection!
I also own a 1999 C2 manual 996, and it just ruins everything else I drive when it comes to feel. It also confirms to me that 300bhp and 1320kgs is all you really need on British roads. I firmly believe that in time the values of the early cable throttle manual 3.4's will catch and maybe surpass the C4S.
A 3.4 with regular oil changes is a very reliable engine- I agree that prices will only go up.
I bought my 1999 C2 for 21,500 USD. Opened the glove box and found a surprise: paperwork and photos of an engine rebuild from one year before for 17K! I pretend this means I spent 4,500 for it.
Bruh. That’s amazing luck
1999 doesn't have a glovebox. Do you mean under the armrest?
I have the exact same car and bought it from its first owner in 2002. It’s been sitting in the garage too much, but I really enjoy driving it. This inspired me to get it back on the road again
I have done something similar(ly stupid). Bought healthy & running 996 and let independent specialist renew the engine and accessories, suspension and brakes. Never had any, not even the most minor, issue with it during my entire ownership of three years. I think the car deserves to be in shape and has plenty to offer to offset the initial cost. My bill was about 14k Euros for the job, plus purchase price which here on the continent is slightly elevated now (25 to 30k Eur). As a bonus, it's vintage enough to feel unique and different in every aspect if you are young and used only to new cars like I was. Second bonus, its ridiculously easy to obtain any parts you need.
Why is that stupid? Honestly seems like the best way to own a 911.
@@Ferraridude13 Purely from financial standpoint it's not wise. I would recover next to nothing of that cost if I tried to sell it. I keep it longterm so I don't mind, but it is a downside that needs to be mentioned.
Can I ask what company you used for the engine rebuild? I’m EU based (Portugal) and looking for reliable indie EU options. Local shops are brutally expensive (taxes).
Its just a lot of preventative maintenance that you would have done anyway, more enjoyable way of doing it
@@MathewLewit idk I think a full engine rebuild presents value to the discerning buyer. Depends on initial purchase price as well I guess.
Awesome. I’m biased, I own a 1998 996 3.4 in manual with 18” rims and I simply love it. I spent ages trying to find a pristine example here in Australia and have kept it completely standard. I replaced the suspension, dampers and bushes with OEM parts and have never regretted it - what a car. It might have “only” 300bhp but it absolutely flies across country. I’ve got a good friend who owns a new 992 Carrera S with PDK and we regularly go driving through the national forest back roads in convoy with him - and the 996 has never let me down. Not only does it keep up - and even sometimes pull away, if I take a brave pill (although I’m undoubtedly busier behind the wheel), it always astonishes me (and my friend) at just what cross country pace it has in the dry. Porsche knocked it out of the park with this car - you just need to find a good one, which is getting harder and harder these days.
The 996 is a better looking car than the 997, there I’ve said it!
Agreed. It is just so jewel-like in its lines. The 997 is beetle-y at the front, and generally the lines are just duller and more fussy. Both are nice-looking cars, but the 996 hit the sweet spot for me.
@@MorningNapalm agreed, the 997 is a great 911, but I can’t help but seeing Volkswagen Beetle when I look at the front end and those headlights! The 996 has aged so well and is really coming of age.
@@zencoaching1932 The less bulbous rear end, the headlights no longer offend and have a retro modern classic look. Mechanically, they are of an age now that most major issues have been dealt with and have been replaced with superior parts! Don’t get me wrong the 997 is a great 911, but I believe the 996 no longer deserves to be looked down upon by a small Ignorant section of the Porsche community!
I am not sure I agree with everything said here. You mentioned IMS, RMS and bore score. Both IMS and bore score were a much bigger issue on the 996.2 facelift car, and RMS is a minor issue, just an oil weep, easily fixed. In fact, the IMS issue on the 996.1 was so rare that this car wasn't even covered by the US lawsuit, just the facelift. You then claimed that you were sure that there were many other issues too, but that really isn't the case. It is a very good and reliable engine with one or two potential issues. You finally said that you couldn't do any preventative maintenance to avoid them, but you absolutely could. The IMS bearing could be refreshed any time, and clutch replacement was a good time to do it. There are several better options from third parties, but originally only the Porsche item would have been available. Part of the problem was that Porsche had spec'ed the bearing as being sealed and that it should last a lifetime, but the way they used it, the sealed-in grease would eventually leak out, and this was when the problems would arise. If you switch it every 80000 km or so, you would likely never see the issue. Bore scoring was tied to over revving, among other things, so since there is a rev limiter, you only really had to worry about not exceeding redline on downshifts. If you treated the engine properly, bore scoring would likely not happen either. Overall, it was a massive step up in drive quality over the air-cooled cars, and a fantastically fun and dynamic car. You can argue about the headlights, and people do, but honestly, I quite like them. The 996 was by far the most-selling 911 up to that point, so apparently lots of people agreed. Apart from a couple of bills to get the car back into shape after a mildly neglected previous ownership, the running costs of mine have been less than 2000 Euro per year, often closer to 1000, and I have never driven a more fun car. The way it flings out of corners is just so deeply satisfying.
In my opinion, the 996 is a more satisfying 911 to drive than both the 993 and all 911s which came after. The 997 was relatively boring, and its main advantages were round headlights, which again you could argue about, and a slightly better interior. The 992 and 991 are just too large for a 911, in my opinion. They are wider than a Jaguar XJ! I still love the earlier 911s, apart from the 993, which was really Porsche's attempt to make a 996 without changing very much, and in my opinion, the design was a failure, as it looked neither classic nor modern, just a sort of awkward in-between. The customers echoed my opinion, as it sold very poorly.
THIS 👍😎
Some of what you have said is total nonsense, if you have an original IMS you want the seal to be worn so it allows oil to flow through it. Aftermarket IMS bearings are even more of a risk, as they will fail, and you won't know when.
@@VS-qd5qw LOL WHAT??? You have no idea, go talk to an engineer, over and out.
@@MorningNapalm over and out is what your car will do with the ceramic bearing - good luck! Lol
@@MorningNapalm congratulations for paying for a time bomb to be installed in your car
Biased 996.1 owner here. Yes, its the best 911 money can buy. Its far better than any earlier iterations, and compared to the newer 991 and 992 versions, its smaller in any aspect, lighter and its a liveable car you dont have to morgage the wife and kids or be so afraid to use. All the hate on the 996 is due to incompetence and by ignorant people. Mine is a september 1997 one of the first, it has its second gearbox, fourth engine and clocked 220.000km. It has a Numeric shifter and cables, center console delete, mechanical LSD (from factory), MO30 sports suspension (from factory), the 996 GT3 carbon bucket seats and a RUF-Raid steering wheel. With the new Micheline PS5 rubber its a dream to drive.
As fellow 996 owner, I am wondering how did you managed to go through 4 engines? Are you tracking it?
@@MathewLewit previous owner did club racing, many trips to Nurburgring, Spa, Alpe passes, etc. I did the gearbox change two years ago, and current engine was a warranty on a engine rebuild Porsche did that ended up with intermix. So the car has 220.000km, but the gearbox and engine has only 7.000km.
Wow some serious money has been spent on this. 220k on one engine would've been impressive but 4 engines less than impressive😅
But it's not my money and you obviously love this car enough to lavish it!!
@@markwalton8644 first and second engine was abused on track, third engine was not built right and onky lasted for ca 10.000km. Fourth engine is all-new from Porsche (new block and heads (longblock) and this engine has ca 7.000km from new built. This was a warranty delivery from Porsche free of charge. The first gearbox was rebuilt some years back around 2017 (new second and third gear), I replaced this with a new gearbox at 205.000km in 2021.
I can never get bored of that flat 6 sound
With a sporty exhaust definitely sounds nice. I am an American V8 guy all day but there are more than a few wicked sounding engines from the Europeans. I love a big inch V8 with a lumpy cam but an engine capable of 10k rpm is glorious.
Poppopbangbang might dispute the "best 996" moniker
I have a 986 Boxster and love it, think it has aged gracefully and the orange headlights are just cool now. Hopefully soon I can upgrade to one of these…
Having just bought a restored 996 with a broken engine I really enjoyed this and feel vindicated in my choice.
996 is on many points in a difficult stage in its life. Here in Belgium you pay around €2300 of taxes every year to keep them on the road + MOT, that is without insurance and fuel. So that is already a hefty bit. Once they're 30 years they can get the oldtimer status and les expensive road taxes. Also if they just gotten the bare necessities of maintenance, they will need a certain amount of work.
Despite these costs and only driving mine around 5-6000km every year I'm still more than happy with my purchase of what was last year I think the cheapest 996 of the country. It was been parked for 3 years with the previous owner due to ilness.
Now almost 1 year later I've put in around €5500 in parts and maintenance (almost a complete suspension overhaul in the right way) and for some preventative maintenance.
Car is now at 219500km and engine is still pullling strong (second engine though), ims, rms, aos, clutch have been replaced by the previous owner so I'm pretty safe.
But I thing between now and 5-6 years I think my engine will be rebuilt. Luckily I do almost as much as possible myself. :)
Good story with this car. The 996's deserve these treatments for the fun and nimble sportscars they are.
The 996.1 c2's are also the closest to the older aircooled cars because of the cable throttle.
So, sounds like Belgium is a place run by left wing criminals. Crappy euro country taxing their people very highly.
996.1 owner here. I had mine for 12 years. Great cars
I can see the logic here. Don’t know what he paid for the car, but I’m guessing that all in he has spent considerably less (maybe half) in inflation adjusted money than the car cost new. For that he has a car that is better than new in every way that matters.
I own 911 997 C4S , factory full aero kit with the multi spoke rims tan leathers over midnight blue , it’s had a full HARTECH REBUILD I love it so much 😊
11:41 I hate to break it to you... M030 does not make the suspension any harsher. It makes it lower (20mm lower for RoW, 10mm for US). The springs are the same stiffness (spring rate) as the non-sport package springs, and the shocks are the exact same part (Bilstein B4). The only other difference is the sway bars, which have no impact on harshness, you should only really feel them in the form of a slight body roll reduction.
Also, you completely neglected to mention the fact that the early 3.4 cars (MY99 and earlier M96/01, M960/01S) essentially don't suffer from bore score, dechunk, or IMS failures. The IMS is dual row on those cars (failure rates in the fractions of a percent range compared to about 5 percent for the single-row cars, per the class-action suit filed against Porsche over the matter), and none of the 3.4s have had a substantial issue with bore scoring or dechunking, as that was a flaw of the cylinder cooling jackets on the 3.6s and later 997 3.8s (M96/03 and onwards).
Also, the gearbox is not what wears. Slop in the gearchange is the result of... plastic bushings in the linkage under the lever. You can either swap them for bearings, or replace the linkage box outright with one from a 997.1 GT3 which has metal components and bearings from the factory (albeit that shortens the throw), and that solves the issue. The G96 box is actuated by 2 cables, and is widely regarded to be one of the most bombproof transmissions Porsche ever installed. Keep up on the fluid change intervals and it should be more than happy. Only real failing has been prematurely worn 2nd gear synchros on some early examples.
EDIT: 15:32 "Upgraded to the 2006 style IMS bearing." Thats a downgrade. The 2006+ (M97) IMS bearing was a single-row bearing of increased diameter... its loading characteristics were identical to the early dual-row bearings. The downside? The way it fits into the casting of the M97 means it can no longer be removed from the outside of the engine behind the clutch, and now requires you to split the crankcase. So if this car really was an early example (296 horse), it had an M96/01... which didn't have the issue to begin with. And in the process likely irreversibly modified the crankcase to fit the larger diameter bearing, potentially in a way that requires removing and splitting the engine to replace it. What an upgrade.
All of this has not addressed the only genuine design flaw the early M96 ever had... oiling issues between the "Integrated Dry Sump" and the subpar oiling of certain valvetrain components on Bank #2. Both of which can be pretty easily and cheaply rectified between X51 parts and modern aftermarket offerings. X51 baffle, Porsche Motorsport AOS, and the extra oil feed line for the Bank 2 head, throw in an X51 oil pump while you're at it, and you've addressed the only real Achilles heel of the M96/01. Can't find those X51 parts? LN Engineering's UAOS is new but very highly regarded thus far on the Rennlist 996 boards.
Very nice. 996 is a great car. I’ve had a 3.4 and C4S and currently a turbo. For reliability turbo wins but 3.4 the best drive.
I have a silver 997 (06) with a Hartech engine. Enjoyed video and love the car. Traded in a Boxster (987 base) for it and in lots of ways miss it, especially during the summer. Enjoyed the video and thanks for being so driver focused when so many are not.
An early 997 with an engine upgrade would be a great thing to have. Probably will be the first non-GT water-cooled model to hit collector status. I may yet swap my 2010 Boxster S for one.
i own a 996 with a rebuilt 3.9 hartech engine. Yes it was super expensive but it was worth it and it's a forever keeper.
40-50K for a basically new car, better that as it left the factor vs a DB9, 360, A8 etc all of which are in very used condition, and will undoubtedly, need lots of fixing. I think he made the right choice.
If I was faced with spending that much on my 996 I couldn't do it. I'd sell as a roller or part it out and move on. So far so good though.
What a great car and journey - well done Lee - just don’t EVER sell it !
I just prefer shitboxes. I'd
Have a 350z over a 911.
Mainly because I can't afford
to run this kinda hardware. Lol
really needs a better exhaust and set of tubular headers, the sound doesnt do it justice. also your comment re the 3.6 M96 not being a revver which you've repeatedly mentioned , is totally false. the 3.6 M96 has variocam +, with more advanced capability of variable valve timing and lift, which the 3.4 doesn't have. Also the 3.6 makes max power right the red line, and there is a big surge first at 4500 rpm, then 5200 RPM till the redline if everything is working correctly.
Another excellent video Jay. Loved your comments on the suspension; original is best. Buy the best you can. Anything under £15k is going to be an expensive project. I bought of FGP, who you mentioned, and have never looked back. My 996.2 has cost me nothing but a minor service in 2 1/2 years. I drive it at least once a week and never lose the enjoyment that driving it gives me. These cars are awesome.
Very timely video, just got my 4.3 litre ‘m97 engined’ C4S back and in everyday driving, it’s quicker than my 991.2 GT3.
Yes, if you rev the GT3 to the redline, it is faster, but the R43 is shockingly quick, with serious grunt from below 3k rpm.
Flat 6 Innovations did the rebuild/upgrade and after working with them for a year, they are to m97 engines, what Ruf is to 911’s - legendary.
Jake and company build awesome engines!
What did that cost you? I've been looking at going for a 4.0-4.2 build motor on my c4s someday.
@@MichaelMeyer93 cost me as much as the car did, but was well worth it!
That’s a lot of commitment and spend in a category of 911 often left to die. In that respect, kudos to Lee. On the other hand, I’m still amazed at the mark up on marked up service that Porsche Indies give. That bill is ridiculous. I appreciate some of the additional labour and service like head skimming etc but really even if you rebuilt four fiesta engines it still wouldn’t add up to that much. Their isn’t any particularly special materials or precious parts used. A lot of non Porsche engine builders (and mechanics) could do the work for a lot less.
In respect to the suspension, interesting they went Bilstein B4 for the dampers. Not an OE part. It must be very supple. I’ve B8/H&R/19” on mine and that’s not particularly harsh.
It’s interesting how all cars seem to do the cycle of being desirable when “tweeked” and improved and then even more desirable when stock fresh. Nostalgia and romanticism? Either way, it’s great to see another 996 kept alive and kicking……still have a 993 over it though. 😊
What was the total investment? Purchasing the car and all the upgrades?
Same as my 1998 996 it also has the Hartech 3.7 build. It’s a great car and a fun engine to drive unfortunately mine suffered a problem just under 20k miles the crank bearing went snd I had to throw £4K at it so maybe not as bomb proof as people are led to believe although it now has a stringer crank bearing in
That being said they’re a good company to deal with and I was just unlucky
A rebuilt engine with new parts had a bearing die? That's strange.
@@nizm0man yep
Not the first time I've heard this.
Jayemm, you may want to drive my 996.1 GT3 CS - it may re-configure your perception of driving a raw, analogue car made by Porsche. Happy for you to have a go - I don’t think you have ever had the original GT3 on your channel…
a 996 carrera for 20k with some new suspension is just my dream
First, the difference between standard and sport (M030) suspension is very small
Standard....wheelrate ....... corner frequency ... measured roll stiffness per wheel (ARB incl.)
.........Fr ..... 30 N/mm ...........................1.91 Hz ......................73 N/mm
.........rear .. 41N/mm............................ 1.71 Hz...................... 71 N/mm
M030....wheelrate ....... corner frequency ... measured roll stiffness per wheel (ARB incl.)
....Fr ..... 33 N/mm ...........................2.02 Hz ......................80 N/mm
....rear .. 50 N/mm........................... 1,88 Hz ..................... 87 N/mm
GT3... wheelrate (996.1 GT3)
Fr ..... 35 N/mm
rear .. 65 N/mm
So there is no that much difference between the std and the M030. Also the damping curves f=f(v) are very close. IMO Porsche makes fr AR-bars too stiff which not only increases roll stiffness but also increases warp stiffness and the latter is not good on bad B-roads. Anti-geo usually also produces harshness. The front suspension has modest 11% anti-dive but the rear has 64% which is quite a lot. Consequently the rear anti-squat is 67%. the anti-geo at rear is definitely one reason to the rear tyre noise as load paths go more via links rather than springs.
My 996.1 C2 has the Bilstein B16 and the wheelrates are fr 44 N/mm and rear 77 N/mm which is quite close to the 996.2 GT3 figures. I think my car is a tad too stiff for B-roads and Im after a softer fr AR-B. In the winter in the rare, carefully chosen night drives I do I disconnect the front drop link and raise the car by about 10mm. But honestly the difference between the std and B16 is not that big. And remember that 911PW ex-editor Steve Bennett was disappointed switching from M030 to softer (std ?). He felt it still harsh. He ended up having ... Öhlins (?). The 996 is a bit harsh from two things: front AR-B and rear anti-dive/anti-squat. GT3 has even slightly more anti-geo at rear. The geo has not changed significantly in later models but the links have become longer (always a good thing). Obviously later models have the PASM-options and there is the 4wheel steering too as option.
Numbers are numbers but IMO 996 is one of the most Fahrspass 911s to drive for the reason JayEmm also mentions: It is still small and narrow enough for B-roads. It is also reasonably priced so you can really drive and not just worry. IMO it also has the best steering feel of all 911s - although I have not driven the early fans nor 992. The 996 has the driving characteristics of the modern cars combined with a smaller size. I just had a go in Cayman GTS (the turbo version). Wonderful car to drive but the steering is not up to 996. It is too light, too fast and a bit bouncy like a balloon cmprd to 996 steering. 997 is practically the same as 996 but PASM makes if more comfortable. Overall I would say the GTS handled a bit closer to perfection - difference between very very good and excellent. Especially there is noticeably less dynamic pitching motion due to mass being concentrated between wheelbase. Turn is more precise with the GTS, mid corner pretty similar and exit perhaps in 996 even better (more forgiving and determined). Obviously the GTS is more powerfull and especially feels to have quite a bit more torque once the turbo spools to a threashold. Torqque tends to make driving easier but also sometimes robs a bit fun. The 996.1 you got to drive a bit with revs - which is kinda fun.
I have done all the usual IMSB, RMS, thermostat, water pump, AOS, starter, all in the suspension, probably by now 4 sets of tyres, three sets of wheels ... and I have not spent even 15 000 euros extra on these. I do the work myself. The 996 is a great car for someone who can do the maintenance by himself. It's great if you have the chance to do engine out of the car maintenance because everything becomes so easy then. And once it is out, do many things at once to save time and money.
But really, my experience tells you can take any 911 and fall passionately in love with her. One problem I see with many 996 coilover solutions is that they drop the car too much. Mine is about 20 mm lower than std. The problem is really a) with MacPherson when you drop 10 mm roll centers tend to drop 27 mm. And also the camber gain is 0.25 deg/cm which means that 40 mm drop changes camber a whole degree and the adjustment falls short - and then the rear tyres wear from inside corners and the rear start the sideways jumping on an uneven patched straight road.
A 996 is a lot of car for the money. Note that you can get 10 996s with the price of a 991 GT3 RS. Is the 991 ten times better? On a B-road? No. I'd say most of the time 996 is the more suitable car. Ok, not exactly same function cars but makes a point. Even IMSB and bore scoring considered it is still the most economical 911, most smile/miles/cost.
Fried eggs agged well...
Shouldn’t that be egged well? (as a fried egg owner!)
Beautifull car done just right....the owner is to be commended. Great Review getting to the heart of the matter. Thx from NZ
Great video, also seen the owners own video diary on RUclips. Having had standard and changed to M030 suspension on my 996.1 C4, I'd have to disagree about the suspension comment. M030 is only 10-15mm or so lower and not a great deal stiffer. It does have a stiffer rear with stiffer ARB. This makes it a touch sharper but I wouldn't say its noticeably more crashy. Horses for courses I suppose. I would love a Hsrtech 3.7 conversion. 😪
Lovely, understated quality.
I spent $10,000 on a 2003 996 in Southern California for the IMS, clutch and “while you are there” parts. I just got a 2001 911 and will do just the IMS if I can get away with it. My mechanic thinks they are really reliable cars so don’t need all the extra extra.
This car as it is, is for that one owner that does not have any social media app
Where is the best place to buy a 996 with a blown engine?
996 Turbo :D
I’ve wondered this and always think best way is to ring Hartech and see if they’ve had anyone get a quote but not have the balls to get the work done.
@@seshelbow336 Genius. You should suggest that to them and they'd probs make loads on brokering deals on dead cars.
Didn’t do a good job today?????? RUBBISH!!!!
This car is nearly identical in spec to my 2002 C2 (without the engine upgrades). A brilliant car that I've put over 10,000 miles on in my first year and a half of ownership. In the US, you can have one of these, or you can buy a 10 year old muscle car that's been hooned. Seemed like a no brainer to get the Porsche and it's been very kind to me in the time I've had it.
I think the Citroen C2 has entirely different characteristics imo.
@@carlosandleon I can't tell if you're serious, but it was funny nonetheless. Lol C2 is a 911 Carrera 2.
I used to have a delightful 997.1 Carrera S as a daily and sold it last year for a 718 Cayman S. It had an epic Bose sound system- which is far better than the Bose in a 718 (for god sake go for the Burmester if you’re speccing one). Harmon Kardon on my previous M2 sat somewhere in between them. As for driving, that 911 was epic- a lovely blend of analogue and digital, and felt very connected to the road and had a lively engine which screamed at full chat.
Lee is my kind of owner. He spent his money on what he loves and clearly doesn't give a damn what other people think.
Jay, you are spot on about the M030 suspension. I owned two '99 996s, one with the M030 and the other with the M029 setup. I always felt the M030 was too stiff for daily driving duties. That car had the 014 package with the 993 hollow spoke twists and all the desirable 996 specs. I sold the car with the M030 suspension and kept my other '99 with the M029 setup.
I'll be doing a similar rebuild to my 911's engine when the time comes. These cars are gems and have gotten a bad rap for way too long. Luckily for me and guys like Lee, we picked up our cars for cheap while they were still disliked.
My first 911, a 996 40th Anniversary Edition, comes with MO30 suspension as standard.
I’ve nothing to compare it to, but first impressions after 125 miles are that on our crumbling roads, it’s overly harsh. However, on half decent rural A roads, all the downsides disappear. I cannot pretend that i understand why it feels so lovely but, through sweeping bends, I’ve never felt anything like as fantastic. There’s no body roll and the silly expression, “the steering is so good that you need only to think about your lines & “the car steers as if by telepathy”!
JayEmm is right about how a modest hike in power & torque is noticeable.
The 996 40AE has the Power Pack engine, 345bhp, and it feels at least as fast as my Stage 1 Audi S3, which churned out the same numbers as the first gen RS3.
The
As a minimum wage guy who keeps buying scratch cards with a 500k prize I always have my eye on the 996 (the rest will go to my wife).
Putting myself in Lee’s, to get peace of mind and know I’ve made a sound decision and got a reliable car I’d look at doing something similar.
I always loved 911’s but the turning point was 03 for me.
Outside the Mcarther Glenn outlet at York with my beautiful ex. We we’re in my £440 82 Mini.
There were a couple of 996’s in the car park and that particular day they ticked all the boxes for 27 year old me. Classy, not too flashy, pretty and I guess status. I dreamed of one day owning one and being at the level in life where I could maintain one. I wanted everything that went with the 911.
I see kids today watching the videos on RUclips where everyone has a Lambo feeling the same. I think it’s a thing people with little money often do.
I still dream of having a 996, hopefully one like this.
the only reason the 996 has gone up in price is because every other 911 has also increased in price, as the total industry seems to have done as well
love these 996s now starting to offer classic fun
Great video. I have owned multiple 997 and 996 Porsches, and without a doubt 996 is the more engaging and fun car to drive. 997 has it beat on looks, power and interior quality, but suspension and steering are noticeably more direct in the 996. The 997 has variable steering and most have PASM dampers which suck. As do 19” wheels. 996s are also significantly lighter. Plus the IMSB is a serviceable part in all 996s. The only 997.1 with a serviceable IMSB are 2005 and and early production 2006s. 996>997
Does the 997 really have it beaten on looks? as every year goes by I really start to question that!
Yes it does for looks. and I am a 99 996.1 manual owner
@@computerhelpcc I personally prefer the 996.1 looks. I find that the round front edge of the 997 frunk makes it look odd, more like a VW beetle, and the round headlights, while round, are too small in proportion to the fairly wide car.
Can’t knock a man who loves his car. Financially unwise but I can only imagine how good it makes him feel
The only thing I would add, and the purists disapprove, is the PCM with the CarPlay unit now available from Porsche themselves
Yep. I did that in my 996 I have just bought. Bang up to date media. 😎
Thought about that, it is a good thing but I will fit a Blaupunkt Frankfurt instead which will look period correct and give all the modern features.
What`s the deal with those purists? I have wondered about that for many, many years... It`s not like watercooling ruining the engine sound or anything.
It's not watercooling that's the problem. It's the generally poor workmanship of the car. The older cars like the 993 are frankly bulletproof. They weren't built to a price. I've owned a 993 since 1997 and it's never broken - not once. I expect it to outlive me and probably my daughter who will get it when I'm shown the way out.
@@joemarch2863 I know Porsche had a bit of money issue back in the 90`s so 996 might have been affected by that. Boxter headlights and IMS issues. 996 look good in my opinion.
Great review. Thank you. It's a beautiful car. Time will show its better looking than its given credit for.
What an awesome Q 911! 👏 well done to the owner… I’ll always have a soft spot for the 996 as it was the first 911 I ever went out in 🥰
Cheers Dude, love your videos. One of the reasons I bought this was because it has a large boot in the front and kids fit in the back so it's surprisingly practical for such a small car. Give me a shout if you fancy a go in it.
@@leeeverndenawesome! 🙌
Excellent video, and nice to see some footage of a tastefully modified car
I chose the C4S. The speed difference in the NA models is not very noticeable, might as well get the best looking one. Turbos don't have the iconic engine sound and I don't like the power delivery on twisty roads. 997s I didn't like the drive as much, a little softer. Good 993s were too expensive. I love all of these cars, these are small preferences.
Me too! I have had my 996 C4s for less than a month and I absolutely love it. These things drive soooo well. 😎
@@steverogers7473 I wasn't really a 911 guy until I drove one. I think every car guy needs to drive one once. The steering is just unreal, and I especially like our 996 era, its a pretty hard aggressive drive. Enjoy man! I'm happy for you!
@@WobblePizza yes, I didn't know what to expect, then drove it. Amazing! 👍👌
Just got my 997 C4S back from Hartech after rebuild and 4.1 conversion. Have to say very impressive. 😅
Seriously considering a Hartech 3.7l upgrade to my 3.2l 986 Boxster S when the time comes to rebuild the engine (currently it's on 148k miles. I upgraded to a ceramic IMS bearing at 118k and had the suspension rebuilt with Koni SAs and Eibach ARBs at 124k by Centre Gravity. I have also upgraded my shifter with a FunctionFirst Shift-Right kit and I'm running on Michelin PS5s). The previous owner had an IPD plenum, 74mm thrirtle body and conical airfilter installed, with the engine apparently mapped to 252 hp, presumably at the wheels. It flies once past 5k rpm, but I'm not convinced the previous improvements did the mid-range torque any favours. I do wonder though, what's the DVLA situation with a Hartech engine conversion? Will road tax remain the same, or are new CO2 emmissions per km registered for the modified car? And would I lose my Euro 4 ULEZ compliance? Love the 996.1 Carrera 2 manual by the way, I think it's the best looking 911 since 1973 (the 996.2 is the worst, especially with the turbo front bumper) and this one's in my dream specification, except for the sunroof.
No changes to your road tax band or ULEZ. This is all based on manufacturer data.
Oh the days of £35k GT3’s 🎉
The Father in Law bought a slightly damaged 996 GT3 for 19k at that time. Repaired kept for 8 yrs and then made a killing on it😮
Cheers for the feature again. If my 3.4 ever goes pop, it's going straight to Hartech for a 3.9. I keep looking at other cars around the 30k mark but the idea of maintaining a V8 Vantage or an R8 just isn't reasonable in my mind. A Hartech build would give me such peace of mind.
Hartech are likely to offer you 3.7 only unless you source a 996.2 3.6 crankshaft, and crank carrier. They are likely to tell you the 3.4 heads don't flow enough. I'm sure the heads can be ported, but your costs keep going up.
I love my 996.2. On my second motor at 135k, but it's been worth it. I do all work myself, so I save a ton. It's got a few parts on it and is a great driver's car. Glad to see you review another 996 Jay. Nice work.
There is something satisfying about doing the work yourself. My Silverado is my daily and my project vehicle. I've done intake, exhaust, lift suspension, brakes, and a wheel bearing (at 60k miles which seems like an early failure) all myself. Not sure I actually saved much since I added some new tools (2 Milwaukee impacts, full impact socket set, higher capacity torque wrench ratcheting sets metric and SAE, pry bars) to the box but I'm good with that.
Excellent review of a superb car! Shame about the clear indicators, but at least he kept the four spoke steering wheel - Only mod I would like to see is the 'center consul delete' - a mere £450 for the kit from your friendly local OPC!
The clear indicators are factory. UK spec came with those after the first year of production. I love the 993 throwback 4 spoke steering wheel 🙂
The 996 will always stand out and it definitely has a lot to offer😊
As much as i love Porsche that spend is just ridiculous.
Sorry!
I think of smiles per £ & it’s then really cheap. I’ve no idea if it’s economically sensible or not. I’m about to buy an overpriced 996, but it’s mileage might be the lowest around & it’s in perfect aesthetic condition. The worst outcome is I throw money at any time dependent worn or failed items, probably returning it to new stock condition (as here) plus a 997 GT3 gear change lever and pivots.
It’ll still be cheap compared with what I could easily spend on a 992, which I’ve tried and decided it’s too much everything for me. Too wide, too heavy, too powerful, too fast. I like the narrow body 996. I can push it without it being silly.
Forgot to mention that I really don’t need a car. I want one. I’m buying thoughtfully and I’m indulging myself. It needn’t be rational. After all, in the past, I spent almost £10K restoring a 1970s Japanese two stroke triple motorcycle. The best examples sell for no more than £6-7K. The example is my own bike that I bought aged 18 in 1978. I bought what might have been the last new, old stock chromed exhausts in the world & there is no aftermarket equivalent. I didn’t mention to my wife what each pipe cost. I was trembling when I unwrapped each pipe, purchased from four separate sellers. It’s not rational, but 18 years later, I get a grin just thinking about it or taking its cover off and taking it out for a 50 mile thrash through rural East Kent. A case of “you cannot buy this feeling” about it.
Something like that is my aspiration with a particular 996 I have had my eye on for a while. I’ve mentally already committed the funds, if needed.
@ 12.30 'Coil over sounds so much sexier than bushes' :)
I noted that & disagreed!
You definitely have a soft spot for everything porsche I've just bought a 2013 NC on the back of one of your videos the BBR 200 and glad I did
3.4 engine never lacked the top end fire works!😂
Guys got a top sports car now that he can take out, thrash all day and not worry about bills for the next ten years plus. 👍
Had both a 996 Targa 3.6 and C4 3.4. No IMS issues with either and both felt quick. Sold the Targa for 17k with 60k miles a few years back. Not sure I would want to spend over 30k on a 1998 C2, he won't be getting that money back. Had the M030 suspension on the C4, which greatly improved handling without being overly harsh, though I don't live in a town).
The lustre of that paint - Lovely! Great close ups. Cheers James
Very interesting and informative video. While, I admire the dedication, it's still just a bargain basement 996....and nothing to get excited about.
For the same money, I'll take the Ferrari 360 as you mentioned. It's driving experience is just going to be better.
IF i had the means this would be the first exotic car i would buy with no hesitation!
This is how a car SHOULD be restored. It will provide him with twenty years plus of pleasurable driving. Well done. Excellent review again James
Great car, and great build, but that's a shit load of money in a 996! I've grown to like the headlights, but I still can't accept that interior... it's just so cheap.
The full leather option goes a long way towards making it nicer.
@@MorningNapalm It's not the seats; I could live the standard seats, it's the facia, centre console, and switchgear. The 997 is leagues ahead in look and feel, and the 997.2 infinitely better. The 996 is just so [bad] 90s, and barely better to look at that a lot of late 80s cars! My personal opinion of course, and fair play to anyone who loves theirs, but for me, I just can't go there. It would need to be a £5k throwaway car (which they were almost down to before Covid) and then graft a 997.1 interior into it.... obviously then invoking the wrath of fanatical anal Porsche owners across the globe! 🤣🤣🤣
Well, to each his own. I like the simplicity of the 996 fascia and dash, and find the 997 tacky. So, I will keep my 996 and you can buy a 997 :) @@MrMairu555
Way lighter than my mk5 golf wow
Sweet spot, almost? I had a 997 C2S w a man box and X51. It was annoying me with small faults so I moved it on; but she was pretty much perfect
I Concur but for the money he spent he could've had the 996 Turbo Manual. Much better Car!
Kudos to Lee for going down this route because if I can remember, there was nothing wrong with the base car other than an noisy exhaust manifold, so the engine rebuild wasn’t immediately necessary. In my mind £22k for 35 bhp/42 lb ft of torque is some spend - why not source a 40 Jahre or 996 GT3. The 40 Jahre is 345 stock and the GT3.1 is 360 bhp. All that said, for Jayemm to say it’s the best 996 that he’s driven, assuming that includes his own 996 C4s, is some accolade. Good luck with it Lee, and I’m looking forward to the comparisons with other 911’s that you have planned.
Thanks! Yeah more comparison videos on the way, shame the 997 CS2 owners seem a little shy so can't seem to find one willing to be in a video just yet. We must put the costs into context though, the £22k bill was the cost of all works Harlech completed, that was more than just engine work, I asked them for a tonne of stuff extra. Also the cost of the engine rebuild is around £12k all in, if you want the extra 35bhp/42 lbs ft you pay the additional £3k - so that's not a bad deal at all. A 40 Jahre would be a good comparison to do actually, I think the idea behind that car was similar to what I have done(narrow body, 2wd, manual coupe), and the price is similar to my build, but I would guarantee my car is faster than one of those. And you'd have all the issues of the m96 engines still present. The 40 Jahre is also a .2 of course, I prefer the .1s for the analogue feel. GT3 I've never driven, I would like to try one but again I suspect mine would be a more suitable daily driver - which is what I built it for.
I don't think saying that for the money it took to fully sort the 996, you could have gotten an R8 or an Aston Martin. They would have been in similar condition as the 996 was originally and required the same amount or more on top of the purchase price, to bring to the same condition level as the 996 now is.
This car looks exactly like my first 911 (see the phot of me driving down the corkscrew at Laguna). I LOVED that car. But bores got scored and I sold it off to a friend who promptly totaled the car😢
I still miss that thing. And to your point- redoing the car would’ve costed WAY more than it was worth. Ended up in a 718 Spyder and I love that car too, but something about the 99 911’s simplicity is so wonderful when compared to modern metal
can you try find and review 986, 987, 997 hartech rebuilt cars, id be very intrested
Kudos to Lee for taking the perfect daily driver exotic sports car and turning it into……… well, the perfect daily driver exotic sports car with a long and reliable lifespan ahead of it. A combination of the classic Porsche iconic design, genuine patina and 20/20 hindsight from Porsche aftermarket specialists can’t go far wrong 👏👏👏
this video sounds like it should be on the 997 not 996 …as it’s mainly these ones has the bore score and engine problems more so than the first series model 3.4 on the 996.. lost count how many early 997 Ive seen with hartec engine rebuilds due to bore scoring than the over 996 even with the mentioned ims rms
Thanks for all the details and prices on the upgrades and refreshes
Comforting to have confirmed I'm only a couple miles from those who know how to look after a 911 when I eventually* get one 😊
Nice to hear some sage advice and new attention on a 911 bargain? Well done!
Beetle
Great to see this review
A lovely car done right
the mods you cannot see (visually) FTW
Why does it sound like a little buzzsaw 4 cylinder?
interesting content, and a healthy reminder that no, I cannot afford a 911!
Lovely car, totally agree, an excepcional 911, and pretty standard too
Jay, not sure if there is another conduit to express this but for you to stay healthy and continue to make these great videos, you need to start working on getting into shape or you will suffer a heart attack. No offense intended. We like you but you need to "add lightness"! Good luck. Love the car By the way.
That is my concern, and not yours.
Excellent video and a really nice car. I know these are seriously undervalued in 911 terms, but I personally think they are a cracking looking car, especially in the silver over blue leather. Been thinking about buying a sensible daily, ditching my C7 RS6, and having a weekend car like a 996/997. The thing that puts me off is exactly what you’ve mentioned IMS/RMS, bore scoring and the other engine engine gremlins. Perhaps the Hartech route is the best way forward.
One question I’d like to know, is what was the purchase price, ie Lee’s total cost including the car.
Skip the 996 and get the earlier 997.1 then. The IMS is much stronger and you can scope to check for scoring.
Really nice car. Personally I would rather have done that level of work to a 996 c4s myself. I just think the rear of the 996 c4s looks beautiful and easily makes up for the front lights.
The irony for me is while I definitely agree about the C4S rear-end, I prefer the clear fried eggs over the facelift ones! I'd have a real Frankenporker, with a C4S rear, fried eggs, and a shoehorn in a 997 interior... understanding that it would be worthless to anyone else should I ever sell it!! 🤣🤣🤣
@@MrMairu555 I would appreciate the effort gone into that build! If you know you know. I need the 997 seats myself, they are a lot better.
I've got a C4S manual and absolutely agree. Contrary to what he says in the video, they are quicker on fast, twisty roads and on most tracks, as proven by Walter Rorhl.
There is the "40th Anniversary" model which has the same styling but is RWD.