National champion coach teaches you the OPTIMAL first serve toss
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- Опубликовано: 11 июн 2024
- If you want to hit fast, consistent first serves, you need a consistent and optimal toss.
The most efficient first serve toss is...
1. Slightly out in front of you. This helps you get your bodyweight behind the ball and allows you to make contact at the fastest part of your swing.
2. Slightly higher than you can fully extend. This allows you to keep a continuous motion and be more consistent with your toss location. It's also easier to time the toss so you can make cleaner contact.
3. Slightly out to your hitting side. You swing your fastest out to the hitting side, not directly above your head. 
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"Toss to your swing" pretty much sums it up. My shoulder will thank me (and you).
All great info. What worked for me was that i tossed the ball as slow as possible. I used to rush the toss and the ball was all over the place. Slow tossing arm made me toss to the same spot every time. Also when tossing, i made sure my tossing shoulder lightly taps my chin. It gave me full extension to maximize the whipping motion of my serving arm. These 2 changes made a huge difference in my serve in terms of consistency and confidence.
Rod Laver told me,” You can’t have a good serve without a good toss.” Great tips!
Hi Jonathan, I've been a USPTA technical coach for 37 years. Totally agree with all these concepts and teach them the same way. I share certain RUclips instructional videos with students and this will definitely be one of them. The only suggestion I would have is that your imaginary contact point, demonstrated at 1:23, is too far in front of your head, and a different arm-to-racket position/ contact point than you are actually in when you (or any pro) contacts the serve. (The "Feel versus Real" phenomenon...). But LOVE the video and thanks very much for producing it! PS if you think you are stiff at 40 years old, wait till you hit 70! 😅😅
I learned to play by reading Vic Braden's Tennis for the Future book in the 1970. He advocated a low toss, continuous swing, placing the ball in front and to the right. I think this is a great video.
I came across your videos yesterday. I like your presentation, no waffle every sentence contributes to the leaning. Thanks from Scotland.
1:00 is what worked for me comfortably as well.
Awesome video and excellent podcast. Many people say the second serve is the most important shot in tennis so can’t wait to see some content directed towards the second! Thanks!
I actually made a video on the second serve with my favorite drill yesterday
My first time here on your site, noyce! I like your delivery, it’s very “no nonsense” you’re a good communicator. The meat of your lesson is quality as well. Noyce!
Agreed 100%. The only valid reason for a high toss is if it's off you can adjust your stroke and still hit in. But that always comes at a cost of power and placement. On a first serve there is absolutely no reason why you should impede the natural ballistic movement.
I have committed to a lower toss after seeing this video and can say it definitely works. I’m getting more spin due to continuous arm motion, the toss is more consistently in a good spot. And a surprising benefit is that the start of my service motion is more calm. Like, if you are only trying to toss a bit over your reach, the tossing arm moves slower which means the whole serve motion prior to tossing is slowed down. Which leads to better balance and better composure under pressure
Go low!!
Love it!
Loved it!!! Very Simply explained. My biggest takeaway is 'toss to your swing '
Interesting timing of this video as it's been a topic I've been working/struggling with for the past 2 months as I'm reworking my serve. A coach has recommended me to switch to pinpoint and while overall I find more consistency and comfort in this movement, my brain can't compute a low toss, I just can't get everything organized in time. I've lowered it over the years but I feel like there's a threshold for myself where I'm late if it's too low. But there could be a few reasons as to why. Also just in studying my toss in comparison to the pros, I was thinking my toss is too far out to the right and I've been trying to correct it, but it naturally wants to hang out more to the right (even though a little more 12 oclock feels more effortless when I make contact). Interesting that your suggestion is to keep it out there, maybe I'll stop trying to over work myself on that aspect.
Excellent video, very well explained. Not too glib, not overly complicated either. Perfect balance of instructions.
Thank you!
I learn so much from you Stokke. Keep up the work for us mortals who never had coaches!
I'm your coach from afar!
Hello coach Jon. Simple basic tips for beginners and pros. The toss is the key to an effective serve. Its also the key to winning. I like the terms you use: height, depth and width positions as ive been using words: height, back to front and side to side (L to R) positions. I'll be using your terms from now on. Hope to see more of your videos.
excellent video instruction, much appreciated!
Great instructions! Thanks a lot
Great lesson coach!
For recreation tennis this is indeed better a little more to the right because they don’t have that much shoulder over shoulder which changes the angle to hit . Good video for those who haven’t seen 500 others yet
Can't you still have shoulder over shoulder with the toss to the right? Federer has a shoulder over shoulder action but he also rotates his chest from very closed with his back to the net to partially facing the net.
@@CJZM7777 yes ofcourse but the more to the right the less youll have that ( which is easier for recreation tennis )
This is a great lesson! Thank you.
Hope it helps!
Golden tip coach. Thanks
You're pretty good. I like how easy you make it look. Thanks
Thanks!
Excellent breakdown. Thank you.
Very helpful. Thank you.
this is excellent, so simple i feel like i could run out to the court now and hit a nice serve. That won't happen, but in time it will if i keep the tips in mind. great video, excellent presentation!
Go try and let me know how it goes!
Excellent point about “tossing to the swing” 😊🎾
Nice simple advise, thank you!
Hope it helps!
Excellent advice
Glad you found it useful!
Better drill for power (without hurting your knees) is to hit the back fence on the fly. Encourages a throwing motion. Instead of “tossing to your swing” (whatever that means)
Makes sense, glad I found you subscribed. Great job!
Amazing thank you!
Funny thing is, I've never been coached on my toss and I have the exact toss that you have precisely because it feels the most natural in that place.
Thanks for the vid. Liked the two serve locations of your slice serve. I tend to only hit it wide but I Should practice in the body. BTW, would love to see your toss ideas for second serves. I do tend to place it higher and wait a little b/c I don't want to miss...
Two words, just two words: Roscoe Tanner.
As always great info
Thanks Mark!
Absolutely brilliant!!!I totally agree
Cheers from France
Just wanted to add that it is pettinent all the way.I find there is such a misinderstanding with the toss height.I am not a coach nor a brilliant player but most of the tennis players I see when walking by a tennis court don't seem to understand the thing with the toss.Most of the time it is way too high which actually prevents from having the proper timing.
I do think that the tennis serve isn't well explained over here in France and the important points in the sequence are missed. It seems like the mechanics and bio mechanics is not well understood.The consequences are that the tennis serve becomes something way too complicated.And the main issue are the injuries!!I am not saying that working around 3 axis is easy.Well enough babbling.
You nailed it so well and precisely.Your video is a must!!!Take care and keep up the great work
Vic Braden would love this lesson!
Yea, I learned tennis by reading Vic's books and this lesson is very consistent with what he taught.
One of two tennis channels where I immediately hit the like button before I watch the video
Love to hear that!!
i could not agree more. I'm 6'5", but I'm also nearing 74 (yoa), and I just started playing tennis a bit more than three years ago. I watch people toss anywhere from below head level to two-and-a-half times their height. It's crazy! I also agree with the idea of people reading your serve--not only were the points you made right on the mark, the average club player doesn't even consciously try to read a serve. Thanks for the confirmation... 40? Really? Young buck... PS ~don't forget those doubles tips... Thanks again!
I like hearing from older people...makes me feel young! Still working on some doubles videos
Hey Jonathan, just came across your channel. Thanks for posting and sharing. Could you add more demonstration on the first serve and the depth - how far into the court you toss. I find that as important as the toss height.
As you pointed out, most (old school) coaches try to convince to toss higher. I always found that hard for my serve. So I go with your technique. Would be nice if you could elaborate a bit further with views from side and back for us to get an even better understanding how exactly it works out for you.
'You are 40' ... come on - nowadays not anything you got to point out. ;-) why do people feel the need to mention their age.
You're one of few guys /channels that you know there's gonna be and expect something good useful info in their content .
💪👍 The width was interesting for me as approach as I'm kinda short 1,7m and I usually naturally toss pretty much to my right and I was kinda struggling and trying to bring it more to my 12. I feel like I'm popping some great serves closer to my 12 since I can reach higher . Still a bit undecided bout it.😁
You need to do what works best for you!
Pros tend to have more lateral tilt than rec players resulting in a toss closer to 12:00.
Great tips, I agree with wich one of them.
And sorry if I wrote something wrong, I’m from Brazil.😉
Excellent tip . What's the weight of your Percept and did you customize it ?
I myself toss too high and have quite a lag on my swing, I know that. That's why I sometimes serve better during warm-up, because I'm more relaxed and hit as if I don't care.
I know it sounds stupid, but playing doubles, if during the match I toss lower and swing relaxed I get the feeling I'm looking too casual, and I'm afraid my partner can get upset if I miss, and think I'm not putting enough effort.
On a different note, I also have the problem of how to practice the serve on my own, without a court or a wall. If I try doing it in the courtyard I'll have them going everywhere, including other people's courtyard, which for sure is annoying. Thinking about a rebounder...
Excellent advice it worked a treat I am 65 and serving better than ever 🤙 ps top tip for you is yoga 🧘♀️ it will resolve all of you issues 👏
I’m 56 and I still jump on my serve!!! Though I’m starting to realize I really really shouldn’t.
Do you recommend turning your torso before you toss or after on a pin point stance?
I noticed that your contact makes no sound. Can you make a video on how to break the sound barrier? 🤣 all jokes aside.. thanks for the vid!
It was windy so I had to remove some background noises...just pretend it was a massive concussion
I agree with your toss highness. But of course this works for en ideal toss. But for example if your toss is basically not very consistent and it would be 10 cm to low than you had aimd it will ruin your service. A toss 10 cm higher then you had aimed would not be so dramatic I guess. My personal experience. What du you mean about that?
Is it different for the second serve?
Spot on. Check out his Podcast. Great Stuff!!!
Thank you!!!
Why do you not encourage using more leg action to hammer your serves? Imagine a pitcher not pushing off the rubber. I’m old school when serve and volley was the game vs baseliners of today. Was taught the arms are synchronized on the takeaway and the legs drive up to the ball carrying your body forward into the court. I used to get 8-10” off the ground like Federer/Sampras but now it’s more like 3-5”. Still have a pretty effective kick 2nd serve but the ball toss is not as far forward as the first serve.
I just don’t use my legs when I’m teaching. I do teach my players to time the leg drive with the racket drop
I’m 54. My coach wants me to toss lower and strike faster. He says I have a hitch. My tendency is to throw a higher toss because I feel I’m more consistent. But I’ll keep trying the lower toss. I liked your suggestion to toss to my swing rather than swing to my toss. Any suggestions on removing the hitch?
How about changing the toss timing, like delaying the toss until you reach trophy pose, if you are otherwise rushing the swing to catch up to your toss?
The biggest problem I have is, tracking the ball while my body and head lowers and then jump up, Changing the head position make it difficult for the eyes to track the ball. In your demo your head was still, I bet when you play us open it’s not that way
A still head is important and you need to see the ball. I can make a video on keeping your body up.
why does your racket hitting the ball makes no sound at all ?
It was windy so I took out background noises
Playing for 7 months now and I love this idea, i don't know what i'm doing with my serve but if i can put the ball at the fastest part of my swing...even with no technique I'm thinking I can get my serve up to 120 mph + Gunna try this tomorrow!
Let me know how it goes!
But what about timing the toss to the swing? If don't toss at the right time for my swing, the low toss will cause me to rush the swing to try to catch up to the ball, creating all kinds of problems.
What's your natural swing? How you would throw a ball is VERY close to your natural service rhythm
@@StokkeTennis there's the average throw, and there's the baseball pitcher throw. I'm trying to improve my throw for effortless power and also accuracy, by focusing on the power generation being closer to the center of my body and let the other body parts follow in relaxed timing.
being a complete novice, can’t you get more power by rocking a bit and jumping up on contact? I understand your being taller and shorter comments but if us shorter guys use this technique won’t we hit into the net. I am only 5’7”
Don’t most stronge servers jump up and land into the court after contact?
Regardless, defiantly will try this out and report back.
Bruh wtf does kneeling do aside from look good for pictures?
Bruh, it was used to demonstrate that the same toss works for shorter people. But thanks for telling me it looks good too!
being a complete novice, can’t you get more power by rocking a bit and jumping up on contact? I understand your being taller and shorter comments but if us shorter guys use this technique won’t we hit into the net. I am only 5’7”
Don’t most stronge servers jump up and land into the court after contact?
Regardless, defiantly will try this out and report back.
Yea, you should explode up with your legs. I was just noting I wasn’t doing it since I was warming up and focusing on the toss for instruction. Definitely use your legs!