Hey guys make sure you also watch the very end part of the video where I go over what to do when you’re surprised by a SAM site at close range! And if you liked the video please consider supporting us on patreon! www.patreon.com/Spudknocker
Spudknocker I have tested dcs with sa-300 quite a bit and I never saw any evidence of a missile loosing energy DUE to turning. I find it quite discusting actually. No added drag and near instant turns for the missile. Quite simplistic implementation I would say. Can you find the same results?
Spudknocker: good coverage on SAM evasion, enjoyed the total package. You used the words of the acronym for Wild Weasels - YGBSM - which is still a part of the WW shoulder patch today. The originator of that phrase was Jack Donovan (EWO in the initial WW program in F-100F's) and I had the good fortune of working with Jack during my tour in South Korea in the late 1960s. Helluva man, helluva aviator and someone I called a friend. Best wishes. John Achor (Nomad).
@@Margus81с300 использует газодинамические рули, при маневре почти не теряет скорость, на такой высоте полёта как в ролике это труп с 100% вероятностью. Поверьте я имею возможность вживую видеть стрельбу батареи с 300
Spud just casually defeats like 10 missiles while carrying two huge LGBs and gas bags. Good stuff. Will use this when I'm ready to go beyond wobbling around the landing pattern.
Several of those shots were outside of the threat circle and Spud would have had to fly into em. Any maneuver at all on those first two to stay out of the threat circle would defeat those. The ones inside the threat circle good tactics kilt those.
Really glad to see this tutorial man. Defending against SAMs is always a problem area for me, I almost always die. 7 minutes in and I already see where I am going wrong.
It’s not often that i comment on any videos on RUclips, but i just had to tell what i thought of video. I had to smile while i watched, the way you defeated those missiles again and again was brilliant. I can’t count how many times I’ve been shot down by sam-sites by bleeding of all my energy. This video learned me how sam-site works and how to defeat it, thank you. Keep up the good work.
Today I learned that Split S and crash diving to the deck in a direction that makes missiles manuveur in thick air or over calculate their lead forcing them into the ground is sometimes more than I need to do. I might have been over reacting a bit LOL. Thanks Spud. I have been practicing against SA 300. I will try some of what I learned tonight against the SA 6.
Haha thanks! I think it was something that the community could really use and yep its all about killing that missile's energy! And with the FCS controlled jets people are FAR too rough with the stick, zapping their energy and now you're in combat under 200 knots, easy pickings for any SAM or enemy pilot, or even AAA!
Awesome video!! Also turned this video into a wicked drinking game, every time Spudknocker says - therefore - you have to take a sip. But super awesome helpful video :)
Yup, will now STOP yanking on the stick so hard. Beautiful tutorial, Spud. Most of your WW stuff I already did... except the wild pull on the stick. I gotta stop that.
Just what I wanted to see, nice one Spud. Interesting thing I found out a while back - the F-14B's jammer actually works better versus SAM's than the jammers in any other module I own - I did a semi scientific test and it reduces a SAM's engagement range by about 5-7% over the others ( which all had exactly the same performance - go figure ) which is a small but useful advantage. Haven't tested the F-18 and F-16 jammers effectiveness though, didn't have them at the time. It's just a shame that the F-14 can't carry anti radar missiles, or anything with a launch and leave stand off capability
If I may have a request... this video + 4 HARMs killing those SAMs + low level high speed flying! Then... I’ll cancel my Netflix subscription! Amazing video Spud! Aaaaaaaaas always!
Just finished the book "Viper Pilot" by Dan Hampton today and I've been itching to do a Wild Weasel mission in DCS. Great book if you haven't read it. Awesome tutorial Spud!
also a good thing to note is while the A-10c is a much harder aircraft to defeat these AA systems the A-10c is meant to operate in that sweet spot near the ground, and also has a missile launch warning system that will even alert you of MANPADs. so if you think that you have a missile coming your way your best bet is to put that missile at your beam and dive for the deck, dropping chaff/flare every now and then depending on the threat type. i have taken out a few AA sites as an A-10c but its best done by a fighter capable jet, as when i did take out those sa-6/sa-15 sites i had a nice grouping of trees and a hill right at the 6 mile mark on my ingress, so all i had to do was lock my mavs onto a markpoint where i saw the AA threat, fly down right above the deck and pop above the hill, lock the mav, rifle and turn away.
PhantomPh1re ya in real life an A-10 just isn’t going to be assigned a SEAD role especially in contested airspace. The best way to avoid these missiles in an A-10 is to simply stay at farther standoff distances and use terrain as you’re saying... just have to be carefuk cause that’s where you can get in trouble with AAA
I actually had a really fun flight on the Hoggit Georgia At War server a couple nights back. It was my first time flying at dead of night and I tasked myself with eliminating SAM sites and BAI's with the A10C2 module. It was such a steep learning curve, but I'm happy I challenged myself to take out as many as possible before getting shot down.
That's nice. This is updated info for me. My tactics up till now were learned back then in the Jane's F-15, always beaming 90 degrees. Now, learned about denser air and 90+45 technique and split-S. It will help a lot.
Cool video! I disagree slightly with disregarding missiles that are moving in your vision. For a couple of reasons. First, DCS has very primitive guidance laws for all missiles, which means they always take perfect lead pursuit. If DCS gets more realistic missile guidance implemented, you will see missiles moving relative to your vision in their pre-terminal phase. This means that a moving missile can still be tracking you. Second, I believe I've been re-engaged by SARH missiles fired by a Moscow. And I know that IR missiles can re-engage in DCS. So while the missile/radar may not _currently_ be tracking you, it's not necessarily defeated.
Do we know how many of the SAMs are active, semi-active and passive? I think I seen on Covert Cabal that some forces use ECM to jam the radio link between the missile and the ground station, suggesting some are semi-active/passive. It really becomes important when you are trying to beam the missile when you should be beaming the track radar.
Good video and explanation, espeacially for energy management. But the first 2 turns weren't "beam" headings. The beam is always nearly 90 degres from your threat, in SEAD and air-to-air.
Spud. Great film. I've dipped in and out of your instructionals over the years. Always planned, calm, clear and skillful. Good job, man. May your 88's always hit their marks.
Great video. I'm sort of confused though at around @8:30 you correctly say we need to beam the missile, and that means turning perpendicular to it's flight path at you, but then draw a line that is anything but perpendicular. Missiles heading right after launch is 267 but the line you originally drew was definitely less than 90 degrees to the missiles path. The 45 degree addition seems to be more in line with perpendicular. I know I'm picking nits but did I miss something?
i have to keep some this in mind next time i run iron hand with my harrier, generally im at 50ft jinking left and right to get within kill range with sidearms and zuni/guns. works well against Sa-10's but Sa-15's and 19 are a challenge.
v_seraphim_v the Harrier really isn’t suited to that mission type, an AV-8 in real life would never be assigned a SEAD mission. The Harrier really isn’t fast enough to deal with these threats same as the A-10 and the harrier is particularly vulnerable to manpads and IR guided sams due to its heat source being right in the middle of the fuselage
@@Spudknocker see i find that interesting in DCS i much prefer to face IR threats in the harrier as opposed to radar ones, i have a much better survival rate against IR due to the harriers large flare count, and what i like to use like a panic button the flare salvo button which allows me to deploy 10-20 flares in 1-1.5 seconds. what you say makes sense in regards to the central heat source , i just find that its generally the other way around in DCS. even when it comes to air engagements, i can evade R-73's much more consistently , as opposed to the R-77 or R-27/R-27ER. but like i said i am generally scrapping the trees so im sure that helps. anyway nice video.
v_seraphim_v yep but if it actually hits you your survival chance drops to zero in the carrier due to the placement of the heat source this is why the Harrier carries so many countermeasures. This was a big issue that contributed to the harriers high loss rate in Desert Storm/Shield
From my experiences of playing DCS, I learned something the hard way. Never EVER fly close to a Strela. unless you are in a mirage then that way go ahead
All the SAM evasion knowledge I had prior to DCS was mostly Vietnam era. What I loosely remember the "Duke" saying was you wait, wait and wait and at the last second turn hard because that missile traveling at mach 4 won't make the corner. I'm certain we watched the same hard to find back then documentaries. I think I might have had something even you didn't have, an autographed copy of his book Fox 2.
Well done, great video and skill! May I ask: How do you enable the pilot on the F-16? I think that there is no such option... Also, how do you enable the Lethal Range Ring on the HSD? I cannot figure this out! Thank you!
Hey spud! Could you do a video on accurate comms? Things like fox codes (which most people know) but mostly things like brevity for ARMs and Mavs, bombs, target destroyed, and things like that. I am at a point now where “my bomb hit the target” doesnt feel correct. There are a lot of videos covering fox codes but thats it. Thanks, and nice video!
Hi lemon, not to take away from spud making another video, but GS, Ralfi, grim reapers and several others do have videos on it. Search for dcs brevity codes
Jon L. Thank you, but there are still a lot of topics in that area that haven’t been covered. Fox codes were just an example, but there arent any explanations for things really morenon depth than that :)
Not sure which topics you're referring to, but if you specify, it might help everyone either point you in the right direction or help make a video that addresses something that hasnt been covered before. This one from GS might be a good start, but please feel free to note anything that might be missing (i might be missing it myself 🙂) ruclips.net/video/ct-Dl2fW8cA/видео.html
spud I have a question. Setup for chaff and flares in your plane is setted to? 2/1? 2/2 other? and sequence repeat? And f18 works pnly in manual mode doesn't it? I remember in Jane's f18 that it worked in auto mode too and had a sort of theatered countermeasure with a long wire to avoid sam on my tail. Is it real or it was just a fiction?At last 90 degrees, push hard no lose energy going down where air is nmost dense and then 180 degree to give no chance to missile… than repeat. Correct? And this tactic works for a/a missiles also?
but that sam site effectively kept you outside its threat ring, it did its job, what if you need to get past that ring to strike something and you have no HARMs left? how do you fly "towards" it as much as possible and strike while being able to defeat it, if at all possible
Christopher Williams when a missile is tracking you it appears stationary on the canopy if you see any movement side to side you know it’s no longer tracking you properly and you’re in the clear
@@Spudknocker My first thought was about how the SAM doesn't fly straight at you, it flies to a point out in front where you are going to be, so shouldn't it appear to move towards the tip of your plane (ie. moving to the right when you are looking out the left side). But then I think I straightened it out... Since your plane is also moving towards that point, it's always going to be at the same angle from you, but at the same time, it's actually pointed at the meeting point out in front of you both?
So a couple of bits to add to this. If you are maintaining good SA and see that you are outside of the threat circle of the SAM when it fires at you just doing the maneuvering alone is good enough for a kinetic kill on the missile. It just can't reach you regardless. Inside of the circle yes you use all the tricks. Also I have to disagree with a base rule of no more than 10k altitude. This seriously limits the range at which you can score kills with the HARM. Not a super big issue against the SA-6/11/Hawk but a world of difference when going up against the big boy Patriot or SA-10 systems. Those I like to come in at 32k and if I can get close enough for a shot prior to being engaged then I can magnum then turn my life insurance altitude into airspeed and turning ability to use against the incoming missiles. The lesson here is correct though that the lower the altitude the more the missile has to work. It is just using the old fighter saying. Speed is life. Altitude is life insurance. You can quickly build up a ton of smash while losing altitude and make life suck for that incoming SAM. Now if in your situation with LGBs or CBUs or some such then yes staying lower is better. Another bit which I'm surprised didn't get a mention is using wingman tactics to take out a SAM like this by coming in at different angles. Too dangerous with overfly weapons like LGB or CBU but can work wonders with Mavs. If both of you have Mavs whomever gets shot at does the rope a dope against the missiles while the other sneaks in close enough for a shot and get out of dodge. Obviously this is also SAM dependent as Patriot and SA-10 will have no issues dealing with that and you just have to run them out of missiles even for a HARM shot a lot of the times.
20:05 I think the white trails of a SAM launching at you are beautiful, cool and scary as fuck at the same time. Especially with SAMs that launch missiles with different flight paths (high/low) or if there's a lot of them at once. Like in this Falcon 4 BMS video: ruclips.net/video/deqz_Hs1mQE/видео.html I have to say, the BMS SAM AI is a lot more nasty than the one in DCS (which tends to just fire at max range). In this case, the launching SA-2s do a saturating attack, forcing the pilot to be on the defensive so long that he's out of energy; probably because they know their PK is pretty low. The pilot does in fact do the exact manouvre of turning into SA-2s Spudknocker talked about in the beginning!
I agree that the DCS SAM AI is pretty basic, in fact every AI in DCS. You can improve it by alot as a mission designer. With 1 simple trigger you can create a SAM Site that will only activate and attack you at kill range or, with some of the scripts out there, will do that on their own. You dont even need triggers or scripts for AI planes. You can set up how they react to threats, what distance to fire, how to defend and so on. A lot of Multiplayer Missions while using a lot of scripts to give the Mission life, fail at the basic tools the mission editor gives you.
justin devine I have an Ultra-wide G-Sync monitor, I think G-sync is literally the best thing out there when it comes to making games look and feel fantastic
Hey, I'm watching this on my cellphone so I can't tell if You're using labels like you mentioned for those missiles, When You switch to missile view I see no labels being displayed so I wonder what label mod do You use?
Very cool stuff and helpful as well. Some of your thoughts are already in my mind about beaming and bleeding the missiles energy. There's is only one thing that I have to slitghly disagree with you. If enemy radars don't appear in your RWR, they could be in RWR's blindspot. But what happens if a IR-SAM supprises you? I guess things could be a bit more nasty even if you're flying low. Do you have any advices for that situation, especialy in terms of energy managment?
Raven Raven keep your eyes peeled, that last bit of the tutorial that you’re referencing is mostly about if you get caught off guard by a SAM site at close range, at low alt during a bombing or strafing run in an area with known manpad/IR guided sams I would preemptively release flares
Hey Spud, I watched your vid last night and can now do wild weasel finally : ) . But the in close missiles are another matter, I keep getting hit. What range do you try to shoot for to do your break? Also my speed is over 450 kias, I noticed yours down around 360, should I aim for a slower speed when breaking in close? I can avoid the first sometimes but always hit by the second. These are SA6's. I know, its just a matter of practice. Its a nice change of pace Thanks again
I know you say it somewhere in your video (or another one 😂) but what countermeassure profiles do you set? Do you have some standard ones or do you set it seperately for each mission?
Maybe using a sam that lunchs with a normal jet engine to transonic speed, and goes pasive on you like in TWS then at 5 miles it separates from the jet engine and turn on the normal rocket engine, going mach 3 in a few seconds a very close, also without leaving any contrails until the very last moment
Notching sa10s seems OP still. I shouldnt be able to skirt the edge of an sa10 site in notch nd turn in to smack 6s and 15s before reentering the notch
22:35 - but you didn't explain why it is so obvious that the second missile is not a threat anymore, I'm DCS for years but I didn't dealth with SAMs much yet so it's not obvious to me, I know if I seen it up close in-ga,e but not in this view that is shown.
Some 737/Comercial pilots that fly on unfriendly skies need learn this or even some BFM and wildly maneuver away to evade from being accidentally shot down by a stray missile out of unfriendly high alerted SAM near Strait of Hormuz Disclaimer : Not an offense to the victims of real life accident and high respect for the one lost their life, just a random idea pop up in my head while watching this
Even my opinion said that comercial passenger aircraft need RWR to alerted the pilots and IFF to say : "hey! I'm a comercial jets flying civillians, do not kill me or a whole world will be mad at you!"
Paul Campbell this is a RUclips issue that popped up when I made an edit in the video, it’s only noticeable when you watch it on an ultrawide screen for some reason
Well, one thing that would have been nice is to go a bit deeper in explaining sam systems. I suggest you read: www.falcon-lounge.com/falcon-bms-essentials/threats-guide/surface-to-air-missile-sa-6/ And also, those tactics are restricted to DCS as in another sims, SAM AI needs a loooot of improvement knowing there are no sam tactics modeled... Cheers
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Hey guys make sure you also watch the very end part of the video where I go over what to do when you’re surprised by a SAM site at close range! And if you liked the video please consider supporting us on patreon! www.patreon.com/Spudknocker
Spudknocker I have tested dcs with sa-300 quite a bit and I never saw any evidence of a missile loosing energy DUE to turning. I find it quite discusting actually. No added drag and near instant turns for the missile. Quite simplistic implementation I would say. Can you find the same results?
Spudknocker: good coverage on SAM evasion, enjoyed the total package. You used the words of the acronym for Wild Weasels - YGBSM - which is still a part of the WW shoulder patch today. The originator of that phrase was Jack Donovan (EWO in the initial WW program in F-100F's) and I had the good fortune of working with Jack during my tour in South Korea in the late 1960s. Helluva man, helluva aviator and someone I called a friend. Best wishes. John Achor (Nomad).
@@Margus81с300 использует газодинамические рули, при маневре почти не теряет скорость, на такой высоте полёта как в ролике это труп с 100% вероятностью. Поверьте я имею возможность вживую видеть стрельбу батареи с 300
Spud just casually defeats like 10 missiles while carrying two huge LGBs and gas bags. Good stuff. Will use this when I'm ready to go beyond wobbling around the landing pattern.
Whimpers2 all in a good days work! Good thing about a sim versed real life is you can work on anything you want!
Several of those shots were outside of the threat circle and Spud would have had to fly into em. Any maneuver at all on those first two to stay out of the threat circle would defeat those. The ones inside the threat circle good tactics kilt those.
Really glad to see this tutorial man. Defending against SAMs is always a problem area for me, I almost always die. 7 minutes in and I already see where I am going wrong.
Triv make sure to watch the ending part as well cause that goes over what to do when you are surprised by a SAM site at close range!
@@Spudknocker will do man
It’s not often that i comment on any videos on RUclips, but i just had to tell what i thought of video. I had to smile while i watched, the way you defeated those missiles again and again was brilliant. I can’t count how many times I’ve been shot down by sam-sites by bleeding of all my energy. This video learned me how sam-site works and how to defeat it, thank you. Keep up the good work.
How to evade:
1) Quick turn
2) Total black out
3) Be casual
theonefrancis 4) smash into ground in GLOC haha
@@Spudknocker GCAS not modeled?
@@utley Not in our model of Viper
Today I learned that Split S and crash diving to the deck in a direction that makes missiles manuveur in thick air or over calculate their lead forcing them into the ground is sometimes more than I need to do. I might have been over reacting a bit LOL. Thanks Spud. I have been practicing against SA 300. I will try some of what I learned tonight against the SA 6.
Remember to also be gentle on the stick so you don't dumb all your energy in a first turn
The SA-6 is easy. If you get below 100ft. the missile can't track you and it will lose lock.
@@Aeronaut1975 Agreed my problem is getting down quick enough sometimes. I've Gotten much better at now.
What an intro!!! :D
Popcorn dropped to the floor together with my jaw.
Simple edit but what an effect.
Technical quality content, overall 10/10
Excellent video man. Specially the energy equation tips and being gentle on the joystick. Liked the pause and explanations. 👍
Haha thanks! I think it was something that the community could really use and yep its all about killing that missile's energy! And with the FCS controlled jets people are FAR too rough with the stick, zapping their energy and now you're in combat under 200 knots, easy pickings for any SAM or enemy pilot, or even AAA!
Awesome video!! Also turned this video into a wicked drinking game, every time Spudknocker says - therefore - you have to take a sip. But super awesome helpful video :)
Yup, will now STOP yanking on the stick so hard. Beautiful tutorial, Spud. Most of your WW stuff I already did... except the wild pull on the stick. I gotta stop that.
Randall MacDonald yes sir! I’m thinking about making a whole video about that, I’m just trying to figure out the best way to do it
Nice! Next time: IR Missiles and undetected Misslie evasion! :)
Just what I wanted to see, nice one Spud.
Interesting thing I found out a while back - the F-14B's jammer actually works better versus SAM's than the jammers in any other module I own - I did a semi scientific test and it reduces a SAM's engagement range by about 5-7% over the others ( which all had exactly the same performance - go figure ) which is a small but useful advantage.
Haven't tested the F-18 and F-16 jammers effectiveness though, didn't have them at the time.
It's just a shame that the F-14 can't carry anti radar missiles, or anything with a launch and leave stand off capability
it does definitely help!
Did you test it against the JF17 jammer?
If I may have a request... this video + 4 HARMs killing those SAMs + low level high speed flying! Then... I’ll cancel my Netflix subscription! Amazing video Spud! Aaaaaaaaas always!
Thank you for this tutorial, I'm particulary bad when it comes to evading SAM.
BTW, that use of meteor F-14 ost is just fantastic
Thank you im glad you like it!
Not only a great tutorial for DCS, but a great practical lecture, useful for any military historian or enthusiast, on how modern SAMs work.
Thanks.
Just finished the book "Viper Pilot" by Dan Hampton today and I've been itching to do a Wild Weasel mission in DCS. Great book if you haven't read it. Awesome tutorial Spud!
FGalletta21 haha we just need some HARMS first!
Phantastic book! Highly recommend !
@@Spudknocker F/A-18 carries em just fine. :)
also a good thing to note is while the A-10c is a much harder aircraft to defeat these AA systems the A-10c is meant to operate in that sweet spot near the ground, and also has a missile launch warning system that will even alert you of MANPADs. so if you think that you have a missile coming your way your best bet is to put that missile at your beam and dive for the deck, dropping chaff/flare every now and then depending on the threat type. i have taken out a few AA sites as an A-10c but its best done by a fighter capable jet, as when i did take out those sa-6/sa-15 sites i had a nice grouping of trees and a hill right at the 6 mile mark on my ingress, so all i had to do was lock my mavs onto a markpoint where i saw the AA threat, fly down right above the deck and pop above the hill, lock the mav, rifle and turn away.
PhantomPh1re ya in real life an A-10 just isn’t going to be assigned a SEAD role especially in contested airspace. The best way to avoid these missiles in an A-10 is to simply stay at farther standoff distances and use terrain as you’re saying... just have to be carefuk cause that’s where you can get in trouble with AAA
I actually had a really fun flight on the Hoggit Georgia At War server a couple nights back. It was my first time flying at dead of night and I tasked myself with eliminating SAM sites and BAI's with the A10C2 module. It was such a steep learning curve, but I'm happy I challenged myself to take out as many as possible before getting shot down.
Love the implementation of the Heatblur soundtrack in this :D
That's nice. This is updated info for me. My tactics up till now were learned back then in the Jane's F-15, always beaming 90 degrees. Now, learned about denser air and 90+45 technique and split-S. It will help a lot.
I'm so glad!
Cool video! I disagree slightly with disregarding missiles that are moving in your vision. For a couple of reasons. First, DCS has very primitive guidance laws for all missiles, which means they always take perfect lead pursuit. If DCS gets more realistic missile guidance implemented, you will see missiles moving relative to your vision in their pre-terminal phase. This means that a moving missile can still be tracking you.
Second, I believe I've been re-engaged by SARH missiles fired by a Moscow. And I know that IR missiles can re-engage in DCS. So while the missile/radar may not _currently_ be tracking you, it's not necessarily defeated.
that intro was amazing
Anthony Whitbread thank you! I thought it was kinda cool too! Haha
Yeah man I watched it like 5 times
That wing flex at the start though o.O
Matteo ya I think it needs some work from ED. It feels a little too robotic if that makes sense and less dynamic
excellent presentation and explanations, and good skills.
and yes i kill my speed all the time.... gotta try to change that. thanks
Do we know how many of the SAMs are active, semi-active and passive? I think I seen on Covert Cabal that some forces use ECM to jam the radio link between the missile and the ground station, suggesting some are semi-active/passive. It really becomes important when you are trying to beam the missile when you should be beaming the track radar.
I’m a bit late to this video but it has really helped me with understanding tactics for briefing. Amazing video!
Good video and explanation, espeacially for energy management. But the first 2 turns weren't "beam" headings. The beam is always nearly 90 degres from your threat, in SEAD and air-to-air.
Spud. Great film. I've dipped in and out of your instructionals over the years. Always planned, calm, clear and skillful. Good job, man. May your 88's always hit their marks.
HI, great video, but I would have really liked to see a tacview of the maneuver to better understand it.
Great video. I'm sort of confused though at around @8:30 you correctly say we need to beam the missile, and that means turning perpendicular to it's flight path at you, but then draw a line that is anything but perpendicular. Missiles heading right after launch is 267 but the line you originally drew was definitely less than 90 degrees to the missiles path. The 45 degree addition seems to be more in line with perpendicular. I know I'm picking nits but did I miss something?
Maybe a better way to say this would be you want to turn to a point that is no longer closing distance between you and the SAM site.
Thanks for putting all the work into this. Been wanting this for a long time!
i have to keep some this in mind next time i run iron hand with my harrier, generally im at 50ft jinking left and right to get within kill range with sidearms and zuni/guns. works well against Sa-10's but Sa-15's and 19 are a challenge.
v_seraphim_v the Harrier really isn’t suited to that mission type, an AV-8 in real life would never be assigned a SEAD mission. The Harrier really isn’t fast enough to deal with these threats same as the A-10 and the harrier is particularly vulnerable to manpads and IR guided sams due to its heat source being right in the middle of the fuselage
@@Spudknocker see i find that interesting in DCS i much prefer to face IR threats in the harrier as opposed to radar ones, i have a much better survival rate against IR due to the harriers large flare count, and what i like to use like a panic button the flare salvo button which allows me to deploy 10-20 flares in 1-1.5 seconds. what you say makes sense in regards to the central heat source , i just find that its generally the other way around in DCS. even when it comes to air engagements, i can evade R-73's much more consistently
, as opposed to the R-77 or R-27/R-27ER.
but like i said i am generally scrapping the trees so im sure that helps.
anyway nice video.
v_seraphim_v yep but if it actually hits you your survival chance drops to zero in the carrier due to the placement of the heat source this is why the Harrier carries so many countermeasures. This was a big issue that contributed to the harriers high loss rate in Desert Storm/Shield
That sound when the missile is passing by your plane
It was a little scary!
You mean the detonation over your canopy....? 😆
From my experiences of playing DCS, I learned something the hard way.
Never EVER fly close to a Strela.
unless you are in a mirage then that way go ahead
Great tutorial Spud! 🚀🦡
Thank you!
Awesome video! Love your channel! What song is the intro music? Thanks!
All the SAM evasion knowledge I had prior to DCS was mostly Vietnam era. What I loosely remember the "Duke" saying was you wait, wait and wait and at the last second turn hard because that missile traveling at mach 4 won't make the corner. I'm certain we watched the same hard to find back then documentaries. I think I might have had something even you didn't have, an autographed copy of his book Fox 2.
Awesome Video, as always!
Well done, great video and skill! May I ask: How do you enable the pilot on the F-16? I think that there is no such option... Also, how do you enable the Lethal Range Ring on the HSD? I cannot figure this out! Thank you!
Hey spud! Could you do a video on accurate comms? Things like fox codes (which most people know) but mostly things like brevity for ARMs and Mavs, bombs, target destroyed, and things like that. I am at a point now where “my bomb hit the target” doesnt feel correct. There are a lot of videos covering fox codes but thats it. Thanks, and nice video!
Hi lemon, not to take away from spud making another video, but GS, Ralfi, grim reapers and several others do have videos on it. Search for dcs brevity codes
Jon L. Thank you, but there are still a lot of topics in that area that haven’t been covered. Fox codes were just an example, but there arent any explanations for things really morenon depth than that :)
Not sure which topics you're referring to, but if you specify, it might help everyone either point you in the right direction or help make a video that addresses something that hasnt been covered before.
This one from GS might be a good start, but please feel free to note anything that might be missing (i might be missing it myself 🙂)
ruclips.net/video/ct-Dl2fW8cA/видео.html
Dr. Lemonseed I will look into that for you! Just FYI bomb hit target is “Shack!”
Spudknocker Thanks man! Yeah, just looking for a video that runs through comms in your average mission :)
spud I have a question. Setup for chaff and flares in your plane is setted to? 2/1? 2/2 other? and sequence repeat? And f18 works pnly in manual mode doesn't it? I remember in Jane's f18 that it worked in auto mode too and had a sort of theatered countermeasure with a long wire to avoid sam on my tail. Is it real or it was just a fiction?At last 90 degrees, push hard no lose energy going down where air is nmost dense and then 180 degree to give no chance to missile… than repeat. Correct? And this tactic works for a/a missiles also?
What sound pack is that Missile warning sound from?
but that sam site effectively kept you outside its threat ring, it did its job, what if you need to get past that ring to strike something and you have no HARMs left? how do you fly "towards" it as much as possible and strike while being able to defeat it, if at all possible
What about the SAM 6 having ramjet engine and being powered all way?
I don't understand what you mean by horizontal movement at around 16 and 24 minutes?
Christopher Williams when a missile is tracking you it appears stationary on the canopy if you see any movement side to side you know it’s no longer tracking you properly and you’re in the clear
@@Spudknocker My first thought was about how the SAM doesn't fly straight at you, it flies to a point out in front where you are going to be, so shouldn't it appear to move towards the tip of your plane (ie. moving to the right when you are looking out the left side). But then I think I straightened it out... Since your plane is also moving towards that point, it's always going to be at the same angle from you, but at the same time, it's actually pointed at the meeting point out in front of you both?
So a couple of bits to add to this. If you are maintaining good SA and see that you are outside of the threat circle of the SAM when it fires at you just doing the maneuvering alone is good enough for a kinetic kill on the missile. It just can't reach you regardless. Inside of the circle yes you use all the tricks. Also I have to disagree with a base rule of no more than 10k altitude. This seriously limits the range at which you can score kills with the HARM. Not a super big issue against the SA-6/11/Hawk but a world of difference when going up against the big boy Patriot or SA-10 systems. Those I like to come in at 32k and if I can get close enough for a shot prior to being engaged then I can magnum then turn my life insurance altitude into airspeed and turning ability to use against the incoming missiles. The lesson here is correct though that the lower the altitude the more the missile has to work. It is just using the old fighter saying. Speed is life. Altitude is life insurance. You can quickly build up a ton of smash while losing altitude and make life suck for that incoming SAM. Now if in your situation with LGBs or CBUs or some such then yes staying lower is better.
Another bit which I'm surprised didn't get a mention is using wingman tactics to take out a SAM like this by coming in at different angles. Too dangerous with overfly weapons like LGB or CBU but can work wonders with Mavs. If both of you have Mavs whomever gets shot at does the rope a dope against the missiles while the other sneaks in close enough for a shot and get out of dodge. Obviously this is also SAM dependent as Patriot and SA-10 will have no issues dealing with that and you just have to run them out of missiles even for a HARM shot a lot of the times.
You already know the F4 is blowin this up more than it already has
20:05 I think the white trails of a SAM launching at you are beautiful, cool and scary as fuck at the same time. Especially with SAMs that launch missiles with different flight paths (high/low) or if there's a lot of them at once.
Like in this Falcon 4 BMS video: ruclips.net/video/deqz_Hs1mQE/видео.html I have to say, the BMS SAM AI is a lot more nasty than the one in DCS (which tends to just fire at max range). In this case, the launching SA-2s do a saturating attack, forcing the pilot to be on the defensive so long that he's out of energy; probably because they know their PK is pretty low. The pilot does in fact do the exact manouvre of turning into SA-2s Spudknocker talked about in the beginning!
I agree that the DCS SAM AI is pretty basic, in fact every AI in DCS.
You can improve it by alot as a mission designer.
With 1 simple trigger you can create a SAM Site that will only activate and attack you at kill range or, with some of the scripts out there, will do that on their own.
You dont even need triggers or scripts for AI planes.
You can set up how they react to threats, what distance to fire, how to defend and so on.
A lot of Multiplayer Missions while using a lot of scripts to give the Mission life, fail at the basic tools the mission editor gives you.
They really need to give the F-16 HARMs soon. It will be so fun to do SEAD with it.
AnAmericanDodo 100%
HARMs and Mavs and the F-16 will start to come into it's own. /nod
Nice one Spud!
Sick intro!
Why arent there any multi-stage SAM's with an air breathing second stage?
Hey Spud love the vids, out of curiosity what tv/monitor setup are you using?
justin devine I have an Ultra-wide G-Sync monitor, I think G-sync is literally the best thing out there when it comes to making games look and feel fantastic
@@Spudknocker Thanks for the reply Spud!
Hey, I'm watching this on my cellphone so I can't tell if You're using labels like you mentioned for those missiles, When You switch to missile view I see no labels being displayed so I wonder what label mod do You use?
Amazing tutorial! Definitely going to be putting this to the test tonight on PVE servers! :D
Question, where can I start my training and setup with a hotas in a F16. do they have a profile or list for a hotas and a server for beginners
Was the RWR launch warning different a year ago? In this video it's a "didididididididi" and now it's a "beep beep beep beep beep beep repeating"
Very cool stuff and helpful as well. Some of your thoughts are already in my mind about beaming and bleeding the missiles energy. There's is only one thing that I have to slitghly disagree with you. If enemy radars don't appear in your RWR, they could be in RWR's blindspot. But what happens if a IR-SAM supprises you? I guess things could be a bit more nasty even if you're flying low. Do you have any advices for that situation, especialy in terms of energy managment?
Raven Raven keep your eyes peeled, that last bit of the tutorial that you’re referencing is mostly about if you get caught off guard by a SAM site at close range, at low alt during a bombing or strafing run in an area with known manpad/IR guided sams I would preemptively release flares
Hey Spud, I watched your vid last night and can now do wild weasel finally : ) . But the in close missiles are another matter, I keep getting hit. What range do you try to shoot for to do your break? Also my speed is over 450 kias, I noticed yours down around 360, should I aim for a slower speed when breaking in close?
I can avoid the first sometimes but always hit by the second. These are SA6's. I know, its just a matter of practice. Its a nice change of pace
Thanks again
very good video as always 👍
13:14 dont think you mean't to leave that in LUL @SpudKnocker
Connor Mattless fuck I thought I got rid of that
:D
Haha, thought the same ;)
Tepnox I fixed it haha
Connor Mattless I fixed it haha
Track IR or VR?
I know you say it somewhere in your video (or another one 😂) but what countermeassure profiles do you set? Do you have some standard ones or do you set it seperately for each mission?
Great videos I'm gonna start practicing this tonight or tomorrow
Maybe using a sam that lunchs with a normal jet engine to transonic speed, and goes pasive on you like in TWS then at 5 miles it separates from the jet engine and turn on the normal rocket engine, going mach 3 in a few seconds a very close, also without leaving any contrails until the very last moment
Why are you on CAT I ?
Notching sa10s seems OP still. I shouldnt be able to skirt the edge of an sa10 site in notch nd turn in to smack 6s and 15s before reentering the notch
I think it will be more difficult to evade AAM,because of no smoke. Could you do the tutorial of AAM evasion next time? Thx!
I always practice against S-300s as they're much more deadly. Or for close in practice, tunguskas.
very interesting...
Wow, how come you don’t destroy the Sam sites as well after you defeated the magazine?
..how many times did you fly this mission?
Played too much BMS in my life. That chaff flare low from Betty caused some butterflies in my stomach.
Betty gives me a lot of anxiety in my life haha
22:35 - but you didn't explain why it is so obvious that the second missile is not a threat anymore, I'm DCS for years but I didn't dealth with SAMs much yet so it's not obvious to me, I know if I seen it up close in-ga,e but not in this view that is shown.
I would recommend rewatching about 25 seconds prior i stated the the second missile flying at us was trashed with chaff
Some 737/Comercial pilots that fly on unfriendly skies need learn this or even some BFM and wildly maneuver away to evade from being accidentally shot down by a stray missile out of unfriendly high alerted SAM near Strait of Hormuz
Disclaimer : Not an offense to the victims of real life accident and high respect for the one lost their life, just a random idea pop up in my head while watching this
Even my opinion said that comercial passenger aircraft need RWR to alerted the pilots and IFF to say : "hey! I'm a comercial jets flying civillians, do not kill me or a whole world will be mad at you!"
@@firmaneffendi2801 unfortunately I think Iran did that on purpose and don't care if the world is mad.
Do it in a Gazelle, dodging SA10 is so much fun, like a supersonic telephone pole coming at you
Robin Olds?
Great video, but Tomcat soundtrack while flying the Viper feels wrong lol.
Alex Couch LOL I would say at this point it’s the DCS soundtrack at least for me haha
Intro OST?
Therefore i will like and subscribe
Thanks!
Spud, make a video to dodge those pesky SA-10s
Whats the intro
song name?
its the first song on the Heatblur F-14 OST I forgot the title at the moment
12:23 Mr President, theres been a second missile
Hey this is the music the f14b tomcat plays when you turn the tape on lol
Learned a lot here...simply explained....best advice? Get the heck out a there
Or in English
Bugger off sharpish 😊👍
Paul Jepson biggest takeaway is flip that energy equation into your favor! Haha
Fly low and use the terrain, use jammers, plus be ready to hit the sam site hard
13:14 gazuntite
trying to fix that sorry
So good
Tac-veiw ?
Randy Cunningham learned some other lessons the hard way.
Is it weird I'm eating a baked potato while watching a SpudKnocker video?
LOL not weird at all in fact I encourage it!
I wouldn't Knock it.
How many missles does an SA6 site have, they kept coming. I wanted to see you blow it up LOL
3 per launcher
This guy sounds like the same person who narrated the NASA How to Land the Space Shuttle .
Is that good or bad? LOL
is it me or what no sound in this video?
I think its just you!
UR right
I want F-4 Phantoms in DCS Pls
One thing that could be better is that you shouldn't go vertical against missiles, they can climb more easily than your heavy aircraft.
It really depends as I say in the video, the missile is working off of kenetic energy and that is always dropping
The vid lacks a logical ending - you should´ve popped that SAM site in the end;)
LOL logical ending is surviving the entire magazine capacity of a SA-6 site LOL! But I see what you mean haha
You know, I would have been a bit cheeky with them. Fly right overhead, give em a wing waggle and pop a flare just to let them know they'd been duped.
these graphics make me really miss flying with trackir instead of VR...maybe I should switch back.
Annoyingly this is a 21:9 video uploaded as a 16:9, so I have black bars top/bottom and sides :(
Paul Campbell this is a RUclips issue that popped up when I made an edit in the video, it’s only noticeable when you watch it on an ultrawide screen for some reason
Yea it's done it to me too before. I googled it a bit but it wasn't obvious what the solution was. Anyway nice video thanks :)
Well, one thing that would have been nice is to go a bit deeper in explaining sam systems.
I suggest you read:
www.falcon-lounge.com/falcon-bms-essentials/threats-guide/surface-to-air-missile-sa-6/
And also, those tactics are restricted to DCS as in another sims, SAM AI needs a loooot of improvement knowing there are no sam tactics modeled...
Cheers
avoid sam but but not samantha
LOL