Just one problem....... most people still can't afford the old and very old 5th generation Landcruiser... a good used one for 2018 to 2021 still runs over $60k to $90k..... most Americans don't even have $500 cash to their bank accounts
$55K for the Land Cruiser? Yeah, right. Saw another video by a guy asking a dealership to get on a wait list for one. Was told there would probably by a $10K dealer mark-up.
It starts at mid $50ks, which implies ~$70k well optioned. 6th gen 4Runner will probably end at mid $50ks. There’s room for both. But I’d also wait and see what 6th gen 4Runner looks like before putting a deposit on the LC.
@@Yul-Uhluyeah but the trd pro is ancient and a rip-off. Trd off-road is more value. Still outdated but at least not a rip-off. LC base is overpriced but at least not outdated and demand will hold value way better for when you want to trade it
@@cmdrls212 I bought an off road premium. Much better value than a TRD Pro and doesn’t actually feel that outdated to me. Have had it six months and love it. No regrets.
The LC wasn’t selling because it was too high priced. They brought it back but made it cheaper to appeal to the USA market. The front sway bar disconnect is merely 1/2 of the KDSS system but electronically controlled, they did this 1/2 only to cut cost. The engine is 4cyl single turbo not the V6 again to cut cost. The 3rd row is gone because the battery pack is in that location, however if you take a close look it still had the 3rd row cup holders on the sides behind the 2nd row. In conclusion, I guess if you want a stripped down LC versus a loaded 4Runner that’s a decision you’ll have to make.
Was at Toyota dealership and was told the final price of the "standard" version of the Land Cruiser will base at $77k! That "1958" at "mid-50s" is a teaser and I doubt many will be built or be available. It's designed to get you into the Toyota dealership showroom. They'll want to have the mid-tier Land Cruiser (not the higher end LC Heritage) as the main seller and put it at the highest production levels. My dealership said they'll put a $2500 dealer markup on that mid-tier LC which, while bad, could be much worse. Some dealerships will hit the buyers with even higher dealer markups, for sure. So, given that you'll probably be buying a LC at $77k base, plus some dealership cash grab markup, but some additional options and delivery cost, etc. and you are looking at an "out the door" price of the LC being around $85k! That is no bargain and at about the same price as the previous generation LCs sold in the US. People are getting way ahead of themselves in discussing the LC as an inexpensive off roader. It is not! Paying $85k for one will be painful for most folks. That is where the 4Runner comes in, as it will likely continue to have TRD Premium type pricing in the $55-60k range. The LC is not about to replace the 4Runner anytime soon.
The original forerunner was two-door and had a removable top like a blazer K5 why don't they go to keeping it smaller and with flexible options to customize it like the Jeep and bronco and leave the Land cruiser to be the solid body SUV that's a little larger kind of like where the Montero left off from Mitsubishi
I hope the 4Runner will still be around. I am digging the new LC though. Am a little surprised by the price. I had a '08 FJ and it reminds me alot of it.
I’m guessing 4Runner won’t be fulltime 4wd like the current one and instead will be like the sequoia. Also I think they will offer it with a third row to differentiate it from the Land Cruiser
With the new Tacoma pricing out this looks like it may be true. Only other possibility is the 4Runner gets smaller otherwise it's going to be about the same price as the LC just with an actual base model.
2 possibilities: a) 4runner would get a refresh while still on the same level as now, prices very similar to what we currently have, but much fewer trims and only the tacoma engine. Or b) as in the video, a scaled down version, using tacoma's complete powertrain, probably built in US/Mexico factories, size and wheelbase comparable to 2000s Isuzu Rodeo, they may reduce metal panels and use some more plastic (maybe a removable roof?). This may allow for a couple extra trims like TRD off road... I love the 4runner and hope they bring a nice streamlined truck based suv even if a bit smaller that the current 5th gen
I don’t like that the only option is the 4 cylinder hybrid. I’m sure that the next gen 4Runner will have the 2.4 but i hope they give you the option of getting the hybrid or not on certain models. But I do like the new Land Cruiser. However… great video as usual.
Toyota is missing the market. Jeep is the most successful vehicle in the Offroad segment. Wrangler offers solid axles, front and rear lockers, removable top & doors, and great approach & departure angles. Landcruiser and 4runner only offer us a rear locker! Wake up Toyota if you want to sell more offroad vehicles you need to offer more of what the consumer wants. Adding Landcruiser will only divide Toyota's sales in the segment.
I don't think it will be a problem. The 4Runner pricing will be below the LC250/Prado. Also, I don't think a 4Runner TRDPro or TrailHunter buyer would cross-shop a BASE 1958 LC250 with cloth seats and missing many options. The 4Runner does 135k-145k units a year. The LC250 sales are unknown at this point in the USA. The LC200 did 3850 units a year in the USA. This could do better. But nobody knows. The LC250 will take some sales from both 4Runner and Sequoia. The pricing for the new 4Runner will stay where it is I think. Maybe drop the 4Runner Sport with its 20" tires and even the Limited and make the line all about off-road driving. A Trailhunter version will be the top model and like the photo shown it will be ready for adventure.
The engine choice for the base landcruiser will most likely be the 4runner TRD Pro engine? Just don't see what you put in the lower trims to keep the cost down. A non-hybrid 4cyl turbo? That sounds awful lol this in betweeen hybrid era for Toyota is gonna be weird.
I think you hit the nail on the head: main differientator will be tech. Heres what I expect (at the moment): Lame duck 2024 4Runner marketing will be dominated by "special editions" consisting mostly of appearance packages. Actual shipped examples will be mostly high-end, few low optioned. No new mechanical bits: no money in engineering for an outgoing product. 2025 will be sized and styled close to new Tacoma, offering mostly same engine/drivetrain. Ie: slightly smaller than new LC. Gotta preserve the high floor height/ low ceiling tradition of the 4Runner. Pricing will be sent milar as you said: mid 30's to mid 50's. Big questions for me are on the top/low end: Will Toyota offer the 2025 (?) 4Runner with 4x4 and a manual transmission in a low end package, ala the Tacoma SR trim? Ie: no rear locker, automatic/non-switchable traction control, cloth seating, no sunroof, maube even steel wheels? This would make the 80's 4Runner enthusiast in me very interested... but it probably won't happen... AND Will they offer a high end version w/the powertrain goodies? iForce Max, rear locker, swaybar disconnects, terrain select? This would overlap the same price range as the "1958" Land Cruiser trim. I suspect most of the offroad tech could be available in a single top end package, with leather/sunroof/best infotainment... but no iForce option at all.... Just the turbo in the 4Runner from top to bottom.
what makes this more complicated is that the lexus GX, basically a mid range land cruiser, is about 63k. So the new midlevel land cruiser can't be more expensive than that. That squeezes the 4Runner even more.
Well they watered down the LC and lowered the price, who's to say they won't do that with the 4Runner. I have a 2015 LTD with 160k miles. It was priced about 10k lower than it is now. This LC does not inspire me to want to trade it in. For the money I'd rather get a 23 GX knowing that if I wanted to pile 500k miles on it, I could.
And by the way around the world, the land cruiser is more prestigious than the G wagon or range rover. In the middle east, where money doesn’t matter only the best car. The Land Cruiser out sells everything.
If you look at the price of a 2018 new 4runner vs now Toyota is making a ton of money. I don't think the price will go up much on the next version if at all. New 2018 4runner TRD Pro was like 46-47K? LC you are getting standard all wheel drive. The new 4runner won't get that except for maybe the Limited.
Not sure what the confusion is… 4runner tops out at where the LC will start. Folks who have the income will go with the LC, but there are plenty of people who will not be able to afford that and will “settle” for the Runner. Having both will only increase overall sales for Toyota. No cannibalism, as far as I can tell.
4runner TRD Offroad is the comparable model to the Landcruiser 1958. It has a rear locker, no sunroof, and cloth interior. It is priced at $44,000 vs the 1958 at $55,000 ish. I think the Landcruiser is priced right and the 4runner pricing is good all considering inflation and the current vehicle economy.
I like the 4Runner TRD Off Road Premium. Just bought one a few months back. Has a moonroof, Softex seats, power heated seats, and some other niceties. Only $48k.
New 4runner renderings are hideous. If thats what its gonna look like, they shoud wait another year or two and kick around some more ideas. Especially if its gonna be a close design to the LC.
EV will have much higher Mpg, a lot more torque and much faster 0-60 and cost maybe a tad more. Just not many options for off road besides Rivian at this point.
The 6th 4runner will be so cheap in its interior finish it wont be funny. It shares the same frame as the new landcruiser 1958 and that looked cheap in the cabin at mid 50s pricing. They are really going to have to downgrade something in the 4 runner to get the price right. Cheap interior materials? Cheap suspension components? Perhaps it will go back to being a tacoma without a bed? The new tundra was given a landcruiser 300 frame,10 speed transmission and a lexus engine and that must of put a strain on the price point So the price went up and some of the finish quality seemed to go down.
For me it’s a fail. I want something the size of the 200 or bigger. I don’t want smaller. The 4runner is to small. I had a 3rd gen 4runner and a 100 series. I won’t pay for the new sequoia. I’m not paying more than 50k for a car.
If they come up with a 4runner designed like the rendition you showed , I think it'll be a home run. This "Retro" kick that Toyota is on is nonsense. We want a truck looking tough ...not a bug eye sprite.
The 200 series was the last real Land Cruiser in the United States. This is a Prado plain and simple. It will be fantastic no doubt, but it’s not the same vehicle as they sell with the 300 or even the 200 around the world. Meaning if you’re in Afghanistan, Columbia, or the Australian outback. You’re not gonna Buy a small four-cylinder. You’re gonna buy the 300 series. Even at $100,000 that is the real Land Cruiser.
The new land cruiser mid level model is marketed to mall crawler soccer moms and will sell in droves. Toyota doesnt care about what enthusist want. They want a high volume seller. Sadly it will sell enough to justify their abomination. 56k for manual burlap sack covered seats, caster wheels, no FULL KDSS, 15 pay subscriptions for the electronic interfaces. Let's not forget the delicious 4 banger. No tailgate And and and...smh Toyota, Oh what a feeling...sad😢
@AllTerrainNation Toyota must have something up their sleeves. I keep seeing rumors of a manual as well but they are attached to posts I don't 100% believe as they are renders. And I see the posts of " My friend at toyota told me this " Which also have a hard time believing 🤣
5th gen will be an absolute classic. Buy while you can.
Just one problem....... most people still can't afford the old and very old 5th generation Landcruiser... a good used one for 2018 to 2021 still runs over $60k to $90k..... most Americans don't even have $500 cash to their bank accounts
@@Aikynbreusov 5th gen 4runner
Yeah
5th gen 4runner is more landcruiser than the new landcruiser.
That 4L V6 is used in the 70 series landcruiser in certain markets
Just bought a fifth gen. 🎉
@@Elon_Musket congrats!!!
$55K for the Land Cruiser? Yeah, right. Saw another video by a guy asking a dealership to get on a wait list for one. Was told there would probably by a $10K dealer mark-up.
I hear of huge markups for 4runners, even Rav4s. People think they can get LC for $55 yup.
It starts at mid $50ks, which implies ~$70k well optioned. 6th gen 4Runner will probably end at mid $50ks. There’s room for both. But I’d also wait and see what 6th gen 4Runner looks like before putting a deposit on the LC.
Glad I bought a 2023 4Runner
Ditto
A fully loaded 2023 Trd Pro 4Runner cost the same as a base fully stripped landcruiser. 56k...
An easy choice to make.
@@Yul-Uhluyeah but the trd pro is ancient and a rip-off. Trd off-road is more value. Still outdated but at least not a rip-off. LC base is overpriced but at least not outdated and demand will hold value way better for when you want to trade it
@@cmdrls212 I bought an off road premium. Much better value than a TRD Pro and doesn’t actually feel that outdated to me. Have had it six months and love it. No regrets.
Not sold on turbos on big SUVs
The LC wasn’t selling because it was too high priced. They brought it back but made it cheaper to appeal to the USA market. The front sway bar disconnect is merely 1/2 of the KDSS system but electronically controlled, they did this 1/2 only to cut cost. The engine is 4cyl single turbo not the V6 again to cut cost. The 3rd row is gone because the battery pack is in that location, however if you take a close look it still had the 3rd row cup holders on the sides behind the 2nd row. In conclusion, I guess if you want a stripped down LC versus a loaded 4Runner that’s a decision you’ll have to make.
Isn't that 2.4 liter hybrid system the same one in the Toyota Sienna minivan, Lexus NX and RX without the i-Max turbo??????
Was at Toyota dealership and was told the final price of the "standard" version of the Land Cruiser will base at $77k! That "1958" at "mid-50s" is a teaser and I doubt many will be built or be available. It's designed to get you into the Toyota dealership showroom. They'll want to have the mid-tier Land Cruiser (not the higher end LC Heritage) as the main seller and put it at the highest production levels. My dealership said they'll put a $2500 dealer markup on that mid-tier LC which, while bad, could be much worse. Some dealerships will hit the buyers with even higher dealer markups, for sure. So, given that you'll probably be buying a LC at $77k base, plus some dealership cash grab markup, but some additional options and delivery cost, etc. and you are looking at an "out the door" price of the LC being around $85k! That is no bargain and at about the same price as the previous generation LCs sold in the US. People are getting way ahead of themselves in discussing the LC as an inexpensive off roader. It is not! Paying $85k for one will be painful for most folks. That is where the 4Runner comes in, as it will likely continue to have TRD Premium type pricing in the $55-60k range. The LC is not about to replace the 4Runner anytime soon.
Pricing it out on Toyotas website. 1958 is 55k Land Cruiser is 61k and 1st edition is in the 70s. Toyota is only releasing 1st editions at launch
The original forerunner was two-door and had a removable top like a blazer K5 why don't they go to keeping it smaller and with flexible options to customize it like the Jeep and bronco and leave the Land cruiser to be the solid body SUV that's a little larger kind of like where the Montero left off from Mitsubishi
Too much logic haha
I hope the 4Runner will still be around. I am digging the new LC though. Am a little surprised by the price. I had a '08 FJ and it reminds me alot of it.
I have a big smile when I drive my 2013 sr5 4 runner trail anywhere...
I’m guessing 4Runner won’t be fulltime 4wd like the current one and instead will be like the sequoia. Also I think they will offer it with a third row to differentiate it from the Land Cruiser
only Limited 4Runner get full time 4WD. Every other trims are part time 4WD.
@@Baebon6259 - Are 4runners full time 4WD like Lexus 460. I don't think do, maybe I am wrong.
@@bobby350zonly the Limited trim is, every other one is part-time 4WD.
A 4 cyl turbo that “feels” like a v8 doesn’t make it a v8.
Guys do you think the 6th gen 4Runner will be made in Japan alongside the land cruiser or made in Mexico with the Tacoma ?
Great question.. I remember a rumor a few years ago saying they may move it to Mexico but I haven’t read anything since
@@AllTerrainNation man we hope not
Kentucky
With the new Tacoma pricing out this looks like it may be true. Only other possibility is the 4Runner gets smaller otherwise it's going to be about the same price as the LC just with an actual base model.
2 possibilities: a) 4runner would get a refresh while still on the same level as now, prices very similar to what we currently have, but much fewer trims and only the tacoma engine. Or b) as in the video, a scaled down version, using tacoma's complete powertrain, probably built in US/Mexico factories, size and wheelbase comparable to 2000s Isuzu Rodeo, they may reduce metal panels and use some more plastic (maybe a removable roof?). This may allow for a couple extra trims like TRD off road... I love the 4runner and hope they bring a nice streamlined truck based suv even if a bit smaller that the current 5th gen
I think pricing will start at $44Kish and top off at $58,500. The Land Cruiser will bump up to start at $60Kish and top off at $72Kish
I don’t like that the only option is the 4 cylinder hybrid. I’m sure that the next gen 4Runner will have the 2.4 but i hope they give you the option of getting the hybrid or not on certain models. But I do like the new Land Cruiser. However… great video as usual.
I guess Toyota expects people to cross shop the new GX if they want a TT V6
Pricing makes perfect sense to me. The Base Land Cruiser (1958) starts out at the top of the 4Runner range.
Toyota is missing the market. Jeep is the most successful vehicle in the Offroad segment. Wrangler offers solid axles, front and rear lockers, removable top & doors, and great approach & departure angles. Landcruiser and 4runner only offer us a rear locker! Wake up Toyota if you want to sell more offroad vehicles you need to offer more of what the consumer wants. Adding Landcruiser will only divide Toyota's sales in the segment.
Having the variety of 4Runner / Land Cruiser/ and Gx550 can result in less sales making prices possibly come down also .
I don't think it will be a problem. The 4Runner pricing will be below the LC250/Prado. Also, I don't think a 4Runner TRDPro or TrailHunter buyer would cross-shop a BASE 1958 LC250 with cloth seats and missing many options. The 4Runner does 135k-145k units a year. The LC250 sales are unknown at this point in the USA. The LC200 did 3850 units a year in the USA. This could do better. But nobody knows. The LC250 will take some sales from both 4Runner and Sequoia. The pricing for the new 4Runner will stay where it is I think. Maybe drop the 4Runner Sport with its 20" tires and even the Limited and make the line all about off-road driving. A Trailhunter version will be the top model and like the photo shown it will be ready for adventure.
The Landcruiser was not a good seller at all here in the USA because the price was way tooo high out of reach for the working class....
If Toyota was smart the new 4 runner would have a removable top and doors, rubber floors and can fit 35s and directly compete with bronco and wrangler
I would like that too but Toyota is too conservative.
@Bobby-ho5sy id say so too. But they did make the fj cruiser. That thing was about as weird as it could get.
The engine choice for the base landcruiser will most likely be the 4runner TRD Pro engine? Just don't see what you put in the lower trims to keep the cost down. A non-hybrid 4cyl turbo? That sounds awful lol this in betweeen hybrid era for Toyota is gonna be weird.
it not a mess, i think they want the 4runner more premium. Cars cost are going up due to inflation.
I 100% agree with you. The Toyota dealers will gouge you every chance they have. The are the worst.
I think they vary. I bought a 2023 4Runner recently and had a pretty good experience. No markup either.
I think you hit the nail on the head: main differientator will be tech.
Heres what I expect (at the moment):
Lame duck 2024 4Runner marketing will be dominated by "special editions" consisting mostly of appearance packages. Actual shipped examples will be mostly high-end, few low optioned. No new mechanical bits: no money in engineering for an outgoing product.
2025 will be sized and styled close to new Tacoma, offering mostly same engine/drivetrain. Ie: slightly smaller than new LC. Gotta preserve the high floor height/ low ceiling tradition of the 4Runner. Pricing will be sent milar as you said: mid 30's to mid 50's.
Big questions for me are on the top/low end:
Will Toyota offer the 2025 (?) 4Runner with 4x4 and a manual transmission in a low end package, ala the Tacoma SR trim? Ie: no rear locker, automatic/non-switchable traction control, cloth seating, no sunroof, maube even steel wheels? This would make the 80's 4Runner enthusiast in me very interested... but it probably won't happen...
AND
Will they offer a high end version w/the powertrain goodies? iForce Max, rear locker, swaybar disconnects, terrain select? This would overlap the same price range as the "1958" Land Cruiser trim. I suspect most of the offroad tech could be available in a single top end package, with leather/sunroof/best infotainment... but no iForce option at all.... Just the turbo in the 4Runner from top to bottom.
what makes this more complicated is that the lexus GX, basically a mid range land cruiser, is about 63k. So the new midlevel land cruiser can't be more expensive than that. That squeezes the 4Runner even more.
Great point
I say for the 2025 4Runner TRD Pro; they will charge around $66k MSRP before dealers take it to the moon.
Well they watered down the LC and lowered the price, who's to say they won't do that with the 4Runner. I have a 2015 LTD with 160k miles. It was priced about 10k lower than it is now. This LC does not inspire me to want to trade it in. For the money I'd rather get a 23 GX knowing that if I wanted to pile 500k miles on it, I could.
Love the shirt Dave!
Thanks man! Rogue one is the best SW movie since the purchase
maybe 4RUNNER will be lower priced under $50k stay on the 109" wb and go after wrangler /bronco 2/4dr
I honestly don't think there is a price issue..it's all about what vehicle you want..
Smaller version of 4runner is coming
And by the way around the world, the land cruiser is more prestigious than the G wagon or range rover. In the middle east, where money doesn’t matter only the best car. The Land Cruiser out sells everything.
If you look at the price of a 2018 new 4runner vs now Toyota is making a ton of money. I don't think the price will go up much on the next version if at all. New 2018 4runner TRD Pro was like 46-47K? LC you are getting standard all wheel drive. The new 4runner won't get that except for maybe the Limited.
Not sure what the confusion is… 4runner tops out at where the LC will start. Folks who have the income will go with the LC, but there are plenty of people who will not be able to afford that and will “settle” for the Runner. Having both will only increase overall sales for Toyota. No cannibalism, as far as I can tell.
The TRD Pro 4Runner will be around the same price as the LC.
4runner TRD Offroad is the comparable model to the Landcruiser 1958. It has a rear locker, no sunroof, and cloth interior. It is priced at $44,000 vs the 1958 at $55,000 ish. I think the Landcruiser is priced right and the 4runner pricing is good all considering inflation and the current vehicle economy.
I like the 4Runner TRD Off Road Premium. Just bought one a few months back. Has a moonroof, Softex seats, power heated seats, and some other niceties. Only $48k.
New 4runner renderings are hideous. If thats what its gonna look like, they shoud wait another year or two and kick around some more ideas. Especially if its gonna be a close design to the LC.
EV will have much higher Mpg, a lot more torque and much faster 0-60 and cost maybe a tad more. Just not many options for off road besides Rivian at this point.
No markups, Toyota 😢
I will never pay over MSRP.
I think it will go back to its roots and fight the jeep and bronco
The 6th 4runner will be so cheap in its interior finish it wont be funny.
It shares the same frame as the new landcruiser 1958 and that looked cheap in the cabin at mid 50s pricing.
They are really going to have to downgrade something in the 4 runner to get the price right.
Cheap interior materials?
Cheap suspension components?
Perhaps it will go back to being a tacoma without a bed?
The new tundra was given a landcruiser 300 frame,10 speed transmission and a lexus engine and that must of put a strain on the price point
So the price went up and some of the finish quality seemed to go down.
For me it’s a fail. I want something the size of the 200 or bigger. I don’t want smaller. The 4runner is to small. I had a 3rd gen 4runner and a 100 series. I won’t pay for the new sequoia. I’m not paying more than 50k for a car.
If they come up with a 4runner designed like the rendition you showed , I think it'll be a home run. This "Retro" kick that Toyota is on is nonsense. We want a truck looking tough ...not a bug eye sprite.
I like your shirt
🇺🇸NO! The 4RUNNER should be less now. I can live with that. Toyota giving people what they want with decent pricing. Hopefully, QDR is still there!
4Runner too small?!?! Bite your tongue Dave! The modern "midsize" truck is the same size as a 80s and 90s fullsize truck. Make Minitrucks Great Again!
I didnt say it was too small for me lol.. Each generation people makers tend to grow the car or truck
The 200 series was the last real Land Cruiser in the United States. This is a Prado plain and simple. It will be fantastic no doubt, but it’s not the same vehicle as they sell with the 300 or even the 200 around the world. Meaning if you’re in Afghanistan, Columbia, or the Australian outback. You’re not gonna Buy a small four-cylinder. You’re gonna buy the 300 series. Even at $100,000 that is the real Land Cruiser.
The new land cruiser mid level model is marketed to mall crawler soccer moms and will sell in droves.
Toyota doesnt care about what enthusist want. They want a high volume seller. Sadly it will sell enough to justify their abomination. 56k for manual burlap sack covered seats, caster wheels, no FULL KDSS,
15 pay subscriptions for the electronic interfaces. Let's not forget the delicious 4 banger. No tailgate
And and and...smh
Toyota, Oh what a feeling...sad😢
RAV4: 30-40k 4runner: 40-55k. LC: 55-70k. Relax..all is well with the world
I think its a stretch to say all is well with the world
No way I'll buy a hybrid Landcruiser
Why do people buy Toyota? Dependability 1st. Cool factor 2nd. 3rd Built Right the 1st time. Toyota isn’t perfect but they perfect what they build.
i don’t think there will be a 4runner
Cheaper 4Runner
They need the 4 runner to go up against the bronco and wrangler...removable tops!!
A throw back hard top would be cool
@AllTerrainNation Toyota must have something up their sleeves. I keep seeing rumors of a manual as well but they are attached to posts I don't 100% believe as they are renders. And I see the posts of " My friend at toyota told me this " Which also have a hard time believing 🤣