It sucks, I'm finally old enough and more into the games to really tackle a battle tower properly just for it to be taken out of the games. I understand nature, IVs, EVs, all that. And now it's no longer in the games. I mean the battle tower in SwSh was okay but I really wish we'd see the return of a whole battle facility like in Emerald and Platinum. And I want the return of trainer card stars too, dammit!
Let me tell ya it is still great to go back and conquer the old games battle towers/facilities with your current wisdom. I had a blast going back and finally beating the emerald battle frontier
The old games being stuck with such crappy breeding mechanics is annoying because not long after they removed frontier they finally improved breeding. Breeding QoL and frontier content have swapped spots. Although the old games have that content youre playing suboptimally without rng manip or pkhex, and that isnt a gamebreaker, but its definitely disappointing. Gen 5 is really to blame for removing frontier and i dont think pwt is a substitute at all but at least for gens 6 and 7 i got to enjoy the maison/tree as well as improved breeding and a complete dex, didnt even bother playing gen 8. But hey you always have pkhex and rng manip but they need external tools so it aint the same.
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Worst part is that it's not just the Battle Tower and Frontier. We've been missing many things like minigames, Game Corner (could've been replacecd with something else), Contests, Secret Bases, battle formats (Triple, Rotation, Royale), battle mechanics (Megas, Z-Crystals, Dynamax), wild battle formats (Hordes, SOS, doubles, Safari), ingame Mythical events and sidequests, customization (not for the player, but for User Interface, PC Boxes, Dialogue boxes and other things), National Pokedex, proper Gyms and Elite 4 with rematches, Battle Recording/Video, and overall overworld exploration (Soaring, Underwater, dungeons/puzzles). All of those features add personality to the player, great challenges and rewards for the single player game, and multiplayer value that make Pokemon more unique and special, and its so sad to see them being removed instead of giving us each generation an even better experience.
See that's why the national dex was so important to me. Like now we don't have the nat dex or a battle facility and no trainer card stars like where is all the post game content going?
Not even just postgame content. Over the last two generations, Pokemon has removed far more features than they've added. The games are hollow husks of what they used to be.
You have no idea how many times I saw that model, and got pissed when we didn't get the battle frontier as DLC or an added update. Hoenn is my absolute favorite region, and the battle frontier being teased to us was probably one of the biggest slaps in the face GF has given us, aside from DLC lol
@droomish1 If DLC 2 ends up being an overglorified final dungeon, I'm building a time machine to stop myself from picking up the pass, and telling myself to wait for if they ever split up into two separate purchases just to only buy the first one. I don't like the trope as is, so that would suck balls if that ends up real.
What i dont like is that there are LITERALLY 4 DOUBLE BATTLES if you dont buy nintendo online also, i thought that the big towers in lavencia were gonna be the battle tower
Something it is often not looked into is that the Battle Tower technically died on SwSh. Yes, it is present physically, but there isn't a concept of losing a streak, you need to just win 50 battles, doesn't matter if it is in a row or not, there is not a reset if you lose. You can watch a movie while mashing A without really paying attention, and if you lose well, just continue on the next battle. They also removed from the 100th and 200th streak rewards the berries they gave, battle tower on swsh was no more than an empty formality which they didn't care about and removed completely on SV.
Technically, SwSh did have a streak focused battle facility in the sparring facility in the Isle of Armour DLC that did actually challenge you get a streak of wins while damage persisted in between rounds.
@@FraserSouris The streaks were monotype teams only and ended after 5 victories I believe, it could have been a decent replacement if they also had an endless mode with heal after every match, or at least every two matches. With only being able to heal twice the entire thing, making streaks isn't manageable
Not sure if it has been mentioned yet but more then likely the reason 4kids changed Lorelei's name in the dub was because her name in Japanese is Kanna which is two syllables. So to match the mouth movements of the characters mouths on screen they changed the name to Prima which again is two syllables.
there are tons of characters in the anime who have more or fewer syllables in their english names than their jp names who weren't affected in this way though. imo 4kids just didn't realise she was from the games and already had an english name and made a mistake, or the jp team forgot to provide them with this information during the localisation process
THE CORRECT OPINION , SV’s post game is literally so boring it’s just ONE like battle competition , nothing else . It’s so boring , another reason I’m sticking with HGSS and not SV
Yeah idk if you noticed but dlc is the new after game story and sword and shields dlc basically fixed the game so. Idk I'm waiting to see the new region they basically introduce in this dlc
My personal favorite facility is the Battle Tree in Alola. It just feels so nice to occasionally see some old faces once you reach a certain point. And that's another problem I have with SV. NO CAMEOS. In fact, as far as I'm concerned, Ingo is the ONLY cameo character to physically appear in gens 8 and 9 combined. Yes, Mohn is *alluded* to, but for Pete's sake no one cares. Not even Looker is in those games, and that just feels wrong. Looker was THE throwback character. It's even more weird that there aren't any Galar trainers in Paldea. Like, would adding Piers or anyone else have really killed GameFreak? The answer is no. I grew up a Unova baby, and seeing so much love for the older titles over so many games all of a sudden be pushed aside... just doesn't sit right with me.
If you think about it, Double Battles are Nintendo Switch Online Exclusive now in the Postgame where you can't rematch the Arena. A Battle Tower would have made the most Sense in Paldea considering there are Multiple Champions. Just make it so you have like the Gym Leaders rematchable in there.
I think the most fulfilling thing I've done in pokemon is getting all the golden emblems in the Emerald battle frontier. That took about 300 hours and, man the accomplishment felt amazing. I'd love to have another shot at something like that in modern games
RIP battle frontier man, I hadn't grown to appreciate it until you started posting about it on YT. Hope that SV gets their own version of it with the DLC or something similar
Seeing them remove the battle tower and all difficult post game content has had a pretty interesting effect on battle item acquisition too. You used to *have* to do the battle tower/frontier in order to get most of the choice items (sometimes one or two will be available outside of it, but only one) or items of similar power, but because it no longer exists, they needed to put them SOMEWHERE. They wound up deciding to put them into the general stores and available based on the number of badges you have required, which sounds great on paper, but it actually trivializes the entire game in a way that Pokemon has never seen before. To be fair, it is by "choice" (TEEHEE), but in a nuzlocke for example you basically have to ban battle items now instead of rationing them out IF you even received them if you want even a hint of a challenge. In other words, while acquiring items for online battling has never been easier, it came at the cost of having to add another rule to challenge runs of the game.
To be honest as a casual player I never bothered with most of the items, as you would need to grind for hours to optain them, so adding them in the main game really gave me the opportunity to experiment and try things out. Sucks that people will have to add more rules to nuzlockes though 😅 I really hope that the dlc adds some kind of battle facility!
@@tonyplaysguitar101 No worries being a casual player! I probably should've emphasized that it's really not that big of a deal in the end cause you can choose not to use them haha. Would absolutely love to see the battle tower as DLC! Or any offline difficult content frankly lol
I used to disregard the Battle Maison until I tried to complete the National Pokédex and doing forced me to play Maison in order to get Porygon Z, Magmotar, and Electivire. Honestly the Maison is pretty overlooked because of the ORAS tease. For a battle facility it's pretty fleshed out with 5 distinct formats and four of who are honestly some of the best battle facility heads in the series, with strong personalities and insane teams each. It's no Battle Frontier, but the Battle Maison isn't necessarily bad as a standalone. Edit: Also ORAS is where the balance between postgame challenges and online was at its best imo.
I’ll never forget the ORAS Battle Frontier tease. I was oh so hopeful we would be getting the sweet Hoenn Battle Frontier in 3D… I remember learning about the “Battle Resort” and nearly pissing myself with happiness.. until I arrived there and saw that bloody tease that never came to be. It pissed me off so much that I skipped Gen 7 entirely.
SV actually looked fun. I skipped gen 8 and thought I was permanently quitting (bought gen 3-7 as they came out) but Legends reinvigorated some hope. With the shift back to 2 versions and THEN having absolutely no postgame facility that was the final straw for me buying the main games again ):
Agreed, taking the battle tower out removing super single/double and battle win streaks likewise with cutting available useable pokemon is just gutting the modern game close to barebone.
Gen 5, while it didn't have a Battle Frontier in name, it debatably had enough facilities to qualify spread across the region. Battle Subway, Battle Insitute, then in BW2 the PWT, Black City and White Forest. It be insane if they don't bother to least bring back one of them.
I didn't play pokemon since Platinum and was really disappointed to find out that there is no endgame battle challenge facility in SV. I had a fun time completing all the side quests, completing the Pokedex and doing raids and shiny hunting, but not having a battle zone like in Emerald and Platinum is sad, even more sad to not even have a battle tower (even tho those were boring anyways). But then again, Emerald and Platinum were special editions, so kind of a predecessor to DLC with a revamped story and extensive endgame. Maybe the SV DLC will bring some more endgame grind again? SwSh had dynamax raids so maybe they will cook something up
once i completed the pokedex in scarlet and violet i haven't played the game much since. the battle tower is something i spent a lot of time playing outside of normal competitive pokemon so it is very disappointing to see no battle tower in the game.
I think part of what makes the battle tower (and by association, ribbons) so fantastic is that it can endless if you want it to be yet still providing tangible rewards. Oh? You got the contest ribbons for this Pokémon? What about the others? You care about them too, right? At least for me, it creates a nonstop loop of me wanting to decorate my partners with everything I can. Heck, in brilliant diamond, I spent quite a time grinding money just for the ribbon syndicate ribbons for my main team and shinies, and as that battle tower basic set looms over me, I remain quite determined to keep playing to conquer it just to give my Pokémon their ribbons. And thats why i love contests and battle towers and those random npcs you visit every day to hear a story, they provide goals formthe experience to guide the journey. I dont really dabble in competitive, dont have the time and dont have the mental capacity, but also, where's my carrot on a stick? Where's my tangible reward? Not everything needs a reward, yes, but I like to chase something more than just a good time, and with ranked comprtitive having a ribbon to earn, but locked behind becoming a Pokémon master of the meta before the rules change again kinda puts that far out of reach for me, so id do casual battles? But theres no ribbon. Heck, I more readily just run laps around paldea to get marks than play the online battles because the satisfaction of that end point is what makes the journey possible for me in the first place. I dont set out on a shiny hunt just to listen to the battle theme, im in there for the journey im led along to that endpoint. Also i hate max raids, Obstagoon can go [game end] for cheating, for the whole bs difficulty and waiting half a century for them to end. when i saw teraraids were realtime and didnt have to wait on allies, they sounded like a fix to everything wrong with max raids, problem: theyre broken and still bs. So after the SV big update and getting my paradoxes, that was all the raids for me, i got what i wanted and no longer had an insentive outside of the sweet HM for mr saguaro, but that isnt motivating me enough to commit to that grueling grind to MAYBE get it after being worn to exhaustion. tl;dr Pokémon game modes need some sorta carrot on a stick to encourage people to actually play them.
I miss how they did ribbons in gen 3-4. I still cant believe how gen 5 had none at all, and beyond that point theyve been really sparse. Theyre an underrated feature imo, it really makes it feel like my mons travelled between gens.
This video got my sub. Me and my best friend have played since OG Red and Blue. It pains me how easy this would be for them to implement and they just choose not to
It's so weird to me that some people (and seemingly Game Freak) think that multiplayer is somehow a replacement for good singleplayer content. In no other RPG would people accept that logic, and they shouldn't accept it here. Singleplayer and multiplayer can co-exist, as they always did in the past, but they can never replace each other. As someone who mainly just cares about singleplayer, it's nuts to me that as they've made breeding/training more convenient, they've gradually eliminated all the actual reasons for doing it.
Totally agree, also I don’t even want to shiny hunt without battle facility….I hate PVP where you can only build a team based on the environment, I can never use my favorite Pokémon. But in battle facility, you can literally use any Pokémon if you can think about a combo
I'm honestly surprised with the trainer cards they never attempted to tie these into the digital events or IRL tournaments, like attending an in game event at a store to get a mystery gift item, they don't have a system in place where you could have a symbol saying "__ won this player cup or attending this regional tournament". The trading card game has been doing this for years, where if you attend IRL large tournaments like Player Cup or regional, you would receive extra player mats or cards with special symbols based on your placement. Like instead of the play mat for entering the tournament, you get a mat that says Day 2 qualifier, Top 64, 8, champion.
They do use the ribbon system, but as far as I can remember you only get 1 ribbon for winning the entire tournament of a regional or nationals, I don't believe that is the best way to do it, as again the TCG has multi level prizing, so you don't have to be the literal best player in the world to earn something tangeable but can get SOMETHING for playing at your skill level.
Something that upsets me about sv lacking a battle tower is that it's the game that feels most set up for one. There's a school system in the game for pokemon. Surely you can just reuse the courtyard there as a battle tower area, make wins/losses reward LP that's already built into the game, and just expand the LP shop. Heck, there was a reddit comment I saw when the game first released "I want a battle tower that is just Nemona with 50 different teams"
I bought my copy of emerald from a garage sale 17 years ago. I never restarted the save file that was on it and still to this day am playing that exact same cartridge on the save file I never even started. The elite four had already been defeated. I spent my entire time playing emerald in the post game. That’s how much longevity it has. Shout out to DAN whose save file has been living on for nearing 20 years and who doesn’t even know I exist or that his legacy lives on haha
In emerald, i was too young to understand evs/ivs and what pokemon were good (id just go for the ones with highest stat totals). Now i that i understnad, and it is significatly easier to optimise these things, there is no battle frontier. Online is not a replacement.
@@unofficialmeme5972 That's fine. But the beauty of Pokemon endgames is that only those who enjoy it can play it if they want. If you want to stop after the credits and beating the champion, you can. The lack of an endgame is an issue because the people who don't like the endgame don't gain anything by its absence. Wheras the people who do like it, lose a lot.
I like when there is post-game "stuff" to do, not the battle tower i'm not really interested in that, but more legendaries to catch, storylines and what not Maybe as a kid if i understood pokemon better i would've liked the battle towers, but now i don't enjoy the games that much that i'd want to get so good at them. I have other stuff to do.
I actually don’t really mind the loss of the battle facilities. The increased accessibility to competitive Pokemon has made competitive more accessible, but it has also made a nonsense of the battle facilities. As it turns out, a lot of the challenge of the battle facilities goes away when you can make a competitively viable team in fifteen minutes. While some people may prefer the grinding to get the exact nature and IV spread necessary, I think the fun part is the battling, and competitive is infinitely more challenging than battle facilities once there are no limits on your ability to team build. There is zero reason to invest in a battle facility post game when most people who play post game are either building for competitive or shiny hunting.
4:02 "There is no finish line, and so the grind, fittingly, will never stop. So alternatively, a game with clearly outlined goals is great." Me personally, I lament the loss of the Battle Tower for the complete opposite reason: so that the game has endless replayability. Even when away from the game, sometimes some wild idea for a strategy strikes me, and I want to try building it in the game to see how reliable it is in the endless stream of battles against equal levelled opponents. Absent this challenge, I feel a lack of motivation or incentive to innovate, hence why the severely watered down battle tower of SwSh had me put down the game almost instantly after I deemed that I had seen all there is to see. Same with SV. I still boot up USM on Citra occasionally just to mindlessly bash in some AI opponents while watching documentary or commentary videos. The sheer variety of the national dex, Z-Moves, and Mega Evolutions, and the endless combination they bring makes it so satisfying to play.
I would ignore the battle frontier as a kid as I found it too difficult. But going back to it now I realize how fun the shakeup on the gameplay is and how much I’ve improved as a pokemon trainer over the years. Defeating a frontier brain now gives a good feeling similar to that of defeating the elite 4 when I was a kid. The fact that a battle frontier was only in two pokemon generations is a crime.
Finishing the game and maybe the pokédex has been always the main goals of the games. Battle Tower/Frontier, with the beginning of Crystal, has always been "oh wouldn't it be cool if we did this?" kind of "throw ideas on a wall and see what sticks" idea. It was pretty cool for what it was intended to be in JP Crystal. The rest of the entries were just bastardization of that idea into coin-cruncher arcade games with stupid hard difficulties due to no online capability. It was good in a sense that they posed a real challenge, but ultimately, later battle facilities only served as an additional means to pass the time, give additional options to customize your team (item vendors, tutors etc) FOR PVP. All and all, it was just a gimmick, albeit a popular gimmick. So I'm not suprised that they moved away from it in time. What I would've liked is them making an additional, seperate game purely focused on battling like Stadium 1 & 2. Those games were popular for a REASON after all. That being them serving as the "final challenge" of their respective generations. They required the team from your gameboy titles, they posed a HUGE challenge, and they rewarded you with VERY cool stuff (Surf Pikachu, Earthquake Gligar etc). I think a game like that would REALLY spice up the things and scratch the itch fans have had. I mean imagine this: You get a frontier game, it reads your save file from main titles, lets you register your team from all the pokémon you have, offers challenges, sets very powerful prizes like pokémon with strong IV's, hidden natures, unlearnable moves that would shake up the meta, give rare berries, give special ribbons or trainer card medals for clearing certain challenges, or give costume pieces/room decorations (remember those?) for all to see! IMAGINE HAVING SECRET BASES AGAIN! Imagine making a very cool base with rare stuff, with you sitting in front, that people you've traded with can see, imagine them being able to challenge you there. Just like Gen3! But all that wouldn't be bringing gamefreak profits. so no.
I actually just finished the game yesterday and was sad to see that there is no real postgame. I’m not really into the online or competitive stuff or even filling the Pokédex. Only really finished the game to get to the postgame.
I'll never forget you Muk you did what no others could in the battle factory fkn hit the evasion noob ai all times with muk were good times the days without him are sad.
The battle frontier in emerald is what made everything come together for me. Maybe it's because I'm too competitive for being a casual player, but I think Megaman battle network 3 and pokemon emerald showcase postgame done right. So much cool stuff and ways to test your might. But some people just want a victory lap and nothing more, I get it.
sword and shield actually does have trainer card stars. it is a lot easier to get all of them, but it definately still represents completing everything that there is to do in swsh.
Just another video that proves my point how Yo-Kai Watch games are better in every way over Pokemon. YKW3 is filled with tons of challenging postgame bosses where you cannot overlevel AND has a postgame battle facility which serves to help test your competitive teambuilds. Not to mention the game is full of a ton of ingame accolades and achivements so even if you collect every monster and beat every boss, you are STILL not done with it.
Midway through, I was about to comment "Why not have both Battle Frontier & improvements for the social aspect", but good thing you said that by the end. Don't comment unless you've watched the whole video.
excellent video. I did the Ribbon Master challenge in 2019 during the leadup to SWSH release, requiring play on games ranging from Gens 3 to 7. playing so many games in succession like that made it abundantly clear how much less the newer games have for players to actually DO outside of finishing the story. and clearing the Battle Towers in gens 3 and 4 felt like such a massive achievement, it really disappoints me to see how much worse they got over the years. like, did you know in gen 7's standard format you actually CAN use Pokemon at a higher level than your opponents'? I couldn't believe my eyes when I first saw that. me and a buddy used to play Multi Battles in the Maison on XY for hours while hanging out watching movies, trying to come up with combinations and strategies to win the 50 streak. you say that Pokemon has placed more emphasis on the social aspects, but I think the removal of multiplayer content like contests and battle towers is still a huge loss towards making the games feel like a social activity.
I hear people complaining that the battle items not being locked behind bp, but, counterpoint: i always struggled with the battle facilities with a combination of not being versed in the meta to be good and NOT HAVING GOOD COMPETITIVE ITEMS.I love the idea of getting to use the big kid held items in the main game, and the disposable ones actually being reusable! Gone are the days of me accidentally deleting my focus sash because I left it on Kartana when i challenged the elite four to grind levels, gone are the days of having good items in my bag in swsh but refusing to use them lest they be gone forever! I welcome the disposal of that with open arms, BUT I completely agree that a battle tower is a keystone of the Pokémon formula. It's the reason we NEEDED stadium 1&2 because they wrre effecfively the gen 1&2 battle towers! So much of my playtime in sun and moon was on the battle tree, why? Because I couldnt be arsed to finish my Pokédex, but also because it gave me a nebulous goal of not getting screwed over by colress's minimizing Muk on battle 40 or other such gems as I earn that fancy ribbon for my Pokémon. (I am very driven by earnable marks and ribbons) So even if the reward was just money or league points with a ribbon at battles 50 and 100, i'd be happy, I'd play it until my final projects are due! The open world aspect is nice, but just being able to explore a world where youve already scoured every inch of it isnt as exciting as the initial journey to chart these lands.
To be fair, the Scarlet and Violet DLC offered more challenges and fitting boss battles and the second half was pretty much an entire giant battle facility with different minigames and activities integrated into it while still remaining completely separate from the Battle Tournaments themselves. There were multiple different competitions to be had aside from battles but there was still an emphasis on a single player story mode boss battle structure. And it seemed pretty great whole providing new story content, characters, lore, and certainly more challenging gameplay thrn in the bas game by itself.
The closest and most recent we got was the battle tree(?) In gen 7 in since they had a sort of mark and we got some post game characters Not as fun as the frontier but close and fun (kinda)
The most hated games Pokemon-Brilliant-Diamond-Shining-Pearl might actually have one of the best battle towers ever like literally facing a Zapdos on your first Master Class run ever was so unforgettable for me. Also getting tonthat point. It abuses on RNG or NRG or whatever that Is called but that was also the challenge of the battle tower, beat ing the game at its best.
Pokemon GO ruined the main series by making these ridiculous raids the new post game grind. Oh well, I'm enjoying finally trying to complete Gen 4 battle frontier (f you battle factory I hate you) while Scarlet is collecting dust till the DLC. Wouldn't be terribly salty about the changes, but my friends who did play pokemon stopped after Gen 7, so I only play by myself (random players online wouldn't be an issue if you could just communicate with them)
I've been doing a lot of Battle Tower stuff thanks to a Ribbon quest I'm doing and after awhile, I now see the complete appeal of them. It's a shame that it no longer exist...
Training for firereds battle tower now. Please, show gamefreak you care by not purchasing new games and creating conversation about the older generations. Maybe even pick up a few old cartridges and talk about it online. Gamefreak and Nintendo will continue to lose faithful, hardcore consumers.
My issue with the gen 3 battle frontier is that it expects you to use competitive Pokémon, yet gen 3 is easily the worst gen to raise competitive Pokémon. It is more complex than gen 1 and 2 in that it revamped a lot of systems, yet it offers very little control and helps unlike gen 4+. EV training is extremely tedious in Hoenn, breeding for a good nature + IVs is pretty much near impossible. Like gen 1-2, most Pokémon still have garbage movepools. And TMs are still single use and most of the good ones are unique acquisitions.
Not complete without the battle tower. I completely agree. Just one of the reasons why I never collected or played (Scarlet & Violet) I just hope they bring back something that does lockout leveling up. Forcing all monsters during battle to be at Lv.50. I hope they do it in (Legends Z-A.)
Honestly I think the Battle Tower and battle facilities as a whole could be brought back if they were made a lot more newcomer friendly. Just make each of them a doubled Elite Four, you face eight trainers before fighting a notable strong trainer at the end, and you’re done. But if you want, you can keep your battle streak going and get rewards for reaching certain thresholds, allowing for endless replayability for those who want to challenge themselves, all the while lowering the point of entry and keeping that skill ceiling.
When I found out there's no post game battle facility in SV I was devastated, but I've kinda gotten over it because I've been having a lot fun with ranked battles in gen 9, I even have gotten to master rank in ranked I believe 3 to 4 times now, but it would still be nice to have a post game battle facility, I find them really fun, like there's a reason I play mostly the battle tower in my copy of HG to this day, it's a lot of fun to me
6:29 Pokémon Crystal at the second generation also lacked treiner card stars but had a Battle Tower. That was the first inception of the concept in the series, in fact.
I have a feeling that hope is not lost, it seems like the second half of the DLC is going to be some kind of battle school. Which hopefully will be a return to a battle tower. And I know people will complain that something like that is behind DLC, and yeah it sucks. However, with the scope of the pokémon games ever growing and the difficulties that Scarlett and Violet have had I feel that them getting extra time and money to possibly make this really really bad ass battle tower alongside a cool new story and new pokémon is going to be worth the wait and frankly worth the DLC. I know people have mixed feelings on this and it's valid to want the game to just come out finished. But the cycle that these games are made on is just not attainable for that to happen, especially with how divergent this game is from the entire rest of the franchise and the sheer amount of content that's within it. Game freak has about 169 employees, and this game was made in about 3 years being worked on at the same time as Legends Arceus so that team was already split. People think because pokémon makes an assload of money game freak also makesan absurd amount of money, but in reality most of that pokémon money is coming from and going back into merchandising. Game freak is a small company with an absolutely ridiculously popular IP with which they must continue to match demand with. In conclusion, it's okay to be upset about the current state of the video game industry. It's not just pokémon, most video games will launch kind of broken and need a day one patch. Frankly outside of some visual glitches for me Scarlet Violet has been pretty much glitch free the entirety of my 200 plus hours in that game. And I have a really good feeling that the second half of the DLC is going to be exactly what we want, I could be wrong and that would suck. However I genuinely think it's going to be worth the wait
If it's in the dlc then that's nice but too little too late. The battle frontier should be in the base game. It being in a dlc is better than nothing - but still bad.
Pokemon games started to be very underwhelming when the games became 3d, but the switch era was when the games became garbage, there are good developers and with good ideas in GF but they are very few people and they get no time to make a multimillionaire dollar franchise game, now they even sell the postgame in a dlc couse they didnt even finish making the game...
btw the reason lorelei is called prima in the 4kids dub of the anime is cuz her japanese name, kanna, is 2 syllables so the lip flaps wouldnt match saying "lorelei", and while they couldve edited the flaps to support 3 syllables, that would take too much time, effort, and money for something like 4kids, who are trying to cut costs to make as much money as possible by bringing over popular shows from japan. her other 2 appearances in pokemon animated material (pokemon generations and origins) both never verbally mention her name, so if they ever bring her back then we just kinda dont know what they would do, but i assume they would edit the lip flaps to fit 3 syllables
Perhaps fans should petition for a more mild version of the Battle Frontier. Maybe Game Freak can do something like Orre Colosseum in XD: Gale of Darkness. There is not massive amount of trainers to fight; however, it does offer a good endgame challenge to players while being relatively easy for developers to create.
My game's Victory Road is gonna be a tower. In a sense. And I'm probably gonna have some battle facility in the form of a Champion's Hall or something.
Switch post games: What's post game??? 3ds post game: we know what post game is Ds post game: we are still at our peak in post games Gba post game: we reached our peak in post game Gbc post game: were still young
The Battle Tower itself fucking sucks. I hate it. BUT, the other facilities with different rules? I love them. It's more than just throw hands with a cheating AI.
I'm guessing most, like me, never bothered much, so that's probably why. I tend to just go as far as i can in post game see and do everything but i found battle tower more luckbased and annoying except for blazing emerald hack, that was good if bullshit somewhat often. Most players i've seen just thinks 'oh i beat the e4 and became champion im done' and anything post that feels like grinding on even if there is story or anything there, until they grind to a stop.
I dunno I kinda despise that it didn't have evasion clause cause I always to because they double team spam but on the other hand I see where are people coming from
BDSP not having Battle Frontier was criminal. Even from the beginning, being a Pokémon master was more than a singular goal. Gen 1 wanted you to be the champion AND catch em all. The franchise becoming more social with humans has reduced the social interaction between the player and Pokémon.
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It sucks, I'm finally old enough and more into the games to really tackle a battle tower properly just for it to be taken out of the games. I understand nature, IVs, EVs, all that. And now it's no longer in the games. I mean the battle tower in SwSh was okay but I really wish we'd see the return of a whole battle facility like in Emerald and Platinum. And I want the return of trainer card stars too, dammit!
it really nails the being born at the wrong time feel
Let me tell ya it is still great to go back and conquer the old games battle towers/facilities with your current wisdom. I had a blast going back and finally beating the emerald battle frontier
Fuck modern gamefreak
It’s the highlight of BDSP imo.
The old games being stuck with such crappy breeding mechanics is annoying because not long after they removed frontier they finally improved breeding. Breeding QoL and frontier content have swapped spots. Although the old games have that content youre playing suboptimally without rng manip or pkhex, and that isnt a gamebreaker, but its definitely disappointing. Gen 5 is really to blame for removing frontier and i dont think pwt is a substitute at all but at least for gens 6 and 7 i got to enjoy the maison/tree as well as improved breeding and a complete dex, didnt even bother playing gen 8. But hey you always have pkhex and rng manip but they need external tools so it aint the same.
Worst part is that it's not just the Battle Tower and Frontier. We've been missing many things like minigames, Game Corner (could've been replacecd with something else), Contests, Secret Bases, battle formats (Triple, Rotation, Royale), battle mechanics (Megas, Z-Crystals, Dynamax), wild battle formats (Hordes, SOS, doubles, Safari), ingame Mythical events and sidequests, customization (not for the player, but for User Interface, PC Boxes, Dialogue boxes and other things), National Pokedex, proper Gyms and Elite 4 with rematches, Battle Recording/Video, and overall overworld exploration (Soaring, Underwater, dungeons/puzzles).
All of those features add personality to the player, great challenges and rewards for the single player game, and multiplayer value that make Pokemon more unique and special, and its so sad to see them being removed instead of giving us each generation an even better experience.
See that's why the national dex was so important to me. Like now we don't have the nat dex or a battle facility and no trainer card stars like where is all the post game content going?
Not even just postgame content. Over the last two generations, Pokemon has removed far more features than they've added. The games are hollow husks of what they used to be.
A Pokemon with no Battle Tower is like RUclips with no Droomish1. That would not be a life I would want to live.
yall I'm starting to think they might not finish the battle frontier project in ORAS
it's too late now because of the eshop :(
You have no idea how many times I saw that model, and got pissed when we didn't get the battle frontier as DLC or an added update. Hoenn is my absolute favorite region, and the battle frontier being teased to us was probably one of the biggest slaps in the face GF has given us, aside from DLC lol
CAHSR moment
I think that gen 8 introducing dlc makes people huff copium that we will get cut staples back as dlcs so it’s fine
the indigo disk area has a "major emphasis on battling" 😭😭😭 get your wallets out folks
@droomish1 If DLC 2 ends up being an overglorified final dungeon, I'm building a time machine to stop myself from picking up the pass, and telling myself to wait for if they ever split up into two separate purchases just to only buy the first one. I don't like the trope as is, so that would suck balls if that ends up real.
What i dont like is that there are LITERALLY 4 DOUBLE BATTLES if you dont buy nintendo online
also, i thought that the big towers in lavencia were gonna be the battle tower
Something it is often not looked into is that the Battle Tower technically died on SwSh.
Yes, it is present physically, but there isn't a concept of losing a streak, you need to just win 50 battles, doesn't matter if it is in a row or not, there is not a reset if you lose.
You can watch a movie while mashing A without really paying attention, and if you lose well, just continue on the next battle.
They also removed from the 100th and 200th streak rewards the berries they gave, battle tower on swsh was no more than an empty formality which they didn't care about and removed completely on SV.
Technically, SwSh did have a streak focused battle facility in the sparring facility in the Isle of Armour DLC that did actually challenge you get a streak of wins while damage persisted in between rounds.
@@FraserSouris The streaks were monotype teams only and ended after 5 victories I believe, it could have been a decent replacement if they also had an endless mode with heal after every match, or at least every two matches.
With only being able to heal twice the entire thing, making streaks isn't manageable
every game since Crystal has had a battle tower, and now that's no longer the case, that's crazy
Not sure if it has been mentioned yet but more then likely the reason 4kids changed Lorelei's name in the dub was because her name in Japanese is Kanna which is two syllables. So to match the mouth movements of the characters mouths on screen they changed the name to Prima which again is two syllables.
there are tons of characters in the anime who have more or fewer syllables in their english names than their jp names who weren't affected in this way though. imo 4kids just didn't realise she was from the games and already had an english name and made a mistake, or the jp team forgot to provide them with this information during the localisation process
I thought it was because Lorelei is the name of a german folkloric seductress.
THE CORRECT OPINION , SV’s post game is literally so boring it’s just ONE like battle competition , nothing else . It’s so boring , another reason I’m sticking with HGSS and not SV
Yeah idk if you noticed but dlc is the new after game story and sword and shields dlc basically fixed the game so. Idk I'm waiting to see the new region they basically introduce in this dlc
@@angelloakira true but a good post game shouldn’t just be paid dlc , that should be in the base game
@@WahooYahoo agree. It's odd. It's like they adopted every other big games deal.
My personal favorite facility is the Battle Tree in Alola. It just feels so nice to occasionally see some old faces once you reach a certain point.
And that's another problem I have with SV.
NO CAMEOS.
In fact, as far as I'm concerned, Ingo is the ONLY cameo character to physically appear in gens 8 and 9 combined. Yes, Mohn is *alluded* to, but for Pete's sake no one cares.
Not even Looker is in those games, and that just feels wrong. Looker was THE throwback character.
It's even more weird that there aren't any Galar trainers in Paldea. Like, would adding Piers or anyone else have really killed GameFreak?
The answer is no.
I grew up a Unova baby, and seeing so much love for the older titles over so many games all of a sudden be pushed aside... just doesn't sit right with me.
I mean sv are just better games than hgss
If you think about it, Double Battles are Nintendo Switch Online Exclusive now in the Postgame where you can't rematch the Arena.
A Battle Tower would have made the most Sense in Paldea considering there are Multiple Champions. Just make it so you have like the Gym Leaders rematchable in there.
I think the most fulfilling thing I've done in pokemon is getting all the golden emblems in the Emerald battle frontier. That took about 300 hours and, man the accomplishment felt amazing. I'd love to have another shot at something like that in modern games
RIP battle frontier man, I hadn't grown to appreciate it until you started posting about it on YT. Hope that SV gets their own version of it with the DLC or something similar
the advent of the 90 dollar pokemon game is getting me
pokemon has been isolating its old fans for a long time now
Seeing them remove the battle tower and all difficult post game content has had a pretty interesting effect on battle item acquisition too. You used to *have* to do the battle tower/frontier in order to get most of the choice items (sometimes one or two will be available outside of it, but only one) or items of similar power, but because it no longer exists, they needed to put them SOMEWHERE.
They wound up deciding to put them into the general stores and available based on the number of badges you have required, which sounds great on paper, but it actually trivializes the entire game in a way that Pokemon has never seen before. To be fair, it is by "choice" (TEEHEE), but in a nuzlocke for example you basically have to ban battle items now instead of rationing them out IF you even received them if you want even a hint of a challenge.
In other words, while acquiring items for online battling has never been easier, it came at the cost of having to add another rule to challenge runs of the game.
To be honest as a casual player I never bothered with most of the items, as you would need to grind for hours to optain them, so adding them in the main game really gave me the opportunity to experiment and try things out. Sucks that people will have to add more rules to nuzlockes though 😅
I really hope that the dlc adds some kind of battle facility!
@@tonyplaysguitar101 No worries being a casual player! I probably should've emphasized that it's really not that big of a deal in the end cause you can choose not to use them haha.
Would absolutely love to see the battle tower as DLC! Or any offline difficult content frankly lol
I used to disregard the Battle Maison until I tried to complete the National Pokédex and doing forced me to play Maison in order to get Porygon Z, Magmotar, and Electivire. Honestly the Maison is pretty overlooked because of the ORAS tease. For a battle facility it's pretty fleshed out with 5 distinct formats and four of who are honestly some of the best battle facility heads in the series, with strong personalities and insane teams each. It's no Battle Frontier, but the Battle Maison isn't necessarily bad as a standalone.
Edit: Also ORAS is where the balance between postgame challenges and online was at its best imo.
Not to mention there's no lvl cap in any way in game so it defeats the purpose of items intierly
The Battle Tower has been spamming Double Team ever since Gen IV 😢
Black 2 and white 2 had somewhat of a battle tower in black tower and white forest
loved that dungeon sm
B2W2 also had the basic Battle Tower in the form of the Battle Subway, plus the PWT for some variety.
@@7x9000 the Battle Subway was poggers.
They had the Battle Subway, too. That's one more reason that BW is amazing xD (not even looking to the PWT lol)
I’ll never forget the ORAS Battle Frontier tease. I was oh so hopeful we would be getting the sweet Hoenn Battle Frontier in 3D… I remember learning about the “Battle Resort” and nearly pissing myself with happiness.. until I arrived there and saw that bloody tease that never came to be. It pissed me off so much that I skipped Gen 7 entirely.
I pretended the secret bases were part of a battle tower. The bases I found seemed to be designed like player designed pokemon gyms.
I miss the battle tower because I would play through it for fun and seeing the computers teams help me think of ideas for my competitive teams
I liked the "tower" in UM/US with battles against Blue, Red and others. That was fun.
SV actually looked fun. I skipped gen 8 and thought I was permanently quitting (bought gen 3-7 as they came out) but Legends reinvigorated some hope. With the shift back to 2 versions and THEN having absolutely no postgame facility that was the final straw for me buying the main games again ):
I loved having the different rulesets for battles in Emerald/Platinum's Battle Frontiers, especially the roguelike areas like the Pike and Pyramid.
Agreed, taking the battle tower out removing super single/double and battle win streaks likewise with cutting available useable pokemon is just gutting the modern game close to barebone.
Can't wait for the Gen 5 downgrade remasters to remove the Train Station Battles because Ingo has disappeared.
Gen 5, while it didn't have a Battle Frontier in name, it debatably had enough facilities to qualify spread across the region. Battle Subway, Battle Insitute, then in BW2 the PWT, Black City and White Forest. It be insane if they don't bother to least bring back one of them.
Totally agree, I love older Pokemon games because of the post game. I played Scarlet and Violet for 5 days and got bored of it..
I didn't play pokemon since Platinum and was really disappointed to find out that there is no endgame battle challenge facility in SV. I had a fun time completing all the side quests, completing the Pokedex and doing raids and shiny hunting, but not having a battle zone like in Emerald and Platinum is sad, even more sad to not even have a battle tower (even tho those were boring anyways).
But then again, Emerald and Platinum were special editions, so kind of a predecessor to DLC with a revamped story and extensive endgame. Maybe the SV DLC will bring some more endgame grind again? SwSh had dynamax raids so maybe they will cook something up
it's true dynamax adventures brought a smile to my face so I can try and remain hopeful
once i completed the pokedex in scarlet and violet i haven't played the game much since. the battle tower is something i spent a lot of time playing outside of normal competitive pokemon so it is very disappointing to see no battle tower in the game.
Pokemon without a Battle Tower is a "no-deal" for me.
The national dex was a near- unforgivable sin, but the Battle Tower...
I think part of what makes the battle tower (and by association, ribbons) so fantastic is that it can endless if you want it to be yet still providing tangible rewards. Oh? You got the contest ribbons for this Pokémon? What about the others? You care about them too, right? At least for me, it creates a nonstop loop of me wanting to decorate my partners with everything I can. Heck, in brilliant diamond, I spent quite a time grinding money just for the ribbon syndicate ribbons for my main team and shinies, and as that battle tower basic set looms over me, I remain quite determined to keep playing to conquer it just to give my Pokémon their ribbons. And thats why i love contests and battle towers and those random npcs you visit every day to hear a story, they provide goals formthe experience to guide the journey. I dont really dabble in competitive, dont have the time and dont have the mental capacity, but also, where's my carrot on a stick? Where's my tangible reward? Not everything needs a reward, yes, but I like to chase something more than just a good time, and with ranked comprtitive having a ribbon to earn, but locked behind becoming a Pokémon master of the meta before the rules change again kinda puts that far out of reach for me, so id do casual battles? But theres no ribbon. Heck, I more readily just run laps around paldea to get marks than play the online battles because the satisfaction of that end point is what makes the journey possible for me in the first place. I dont set out on a shiny hunt just to listen to the battle theme, im in there for the journey im led along to that endpoint.
Also i hate max raids, Obstagoon can go [game end] for cheating, for the whole bs difficulty and waiting half a century for them to end. when i saw teraraids were realtime and didnt have to wait on allies, they sounded like a fix to everything wrong with max raids, problem: theyre broken and still bs. So after the SV big update and getting my paradoxes, that was all the raids for me, i got what i wanted and no longer had an insentive outside of the sweet HM for mr saguaro, but that isnt motivating me enough to commit to that grueling grind to MAYBE get it after being worn to exhaustion.
tl;dr Pokémon game modes need some sorta carrot on a stick to encourage people to actually play them.
I miss how they did ribbons in gen 3-4. I still cant believe how gen 5 had none at all, and beyond that point theyve been really sparse. Theyre an underrated feature imo, it really makes it feel like my mons travelled between gens.
Even a tower isnt enough, we need the battle frontier. I beat Emerald's battle frontier when i was 12, kids need to be given more credit.
This video got my sub. Me and my best friend have played since OG Red and Blue. It pains me how easy this would be for them to implement and they just choose not to
In ORAS, why would they suggest they are working on the battle frontier and then never add it or anything at all
It's so weird to me that some people (and seemingly Game Freak) think that multiplayer is somehow a replacement for good singleplayer content. In no other RPG would people accept that logic, and they shouldn't accept it here. Singleplayer and multiplayer can co-exist, as they always did in the past, but they can never replace each other. As someone who mainly just cares about singleplayer, it's nuts to me that as they've made breeding/training more convenient, they've gradually eliminated all the actual reasons for doing it.
Totally agree, also I don’t even want to shiny hunt without battle facility….I hate PVP where you can only build a team based on the environment, I can never use my favorite Pokémon. But in battle facility, you can literally use any Pokémon if you can think about a combo
kids these days won't get to experience losing their battle streak to +6 double team/confuse ray :(
I'm honestly surprised with the trainer cards they never attempted to tie these into the digital events or IRL tournaments, like attending an in game event at a store to get a mystery gift item, they don't have a system in place where you could have a symbol saying "__ won this player cup or attending this regional tournament". The trading card game has been doing this for years, where if you attend IRL large tournaments like Player Cup or regional, you would receive extra player mats or cards with special symbols based on your placement. Like instead of the play mat for entering the tournament, you get a mat that says Day 2 qualifier, Top 64, 8, champion.
They do use the ribbon system, but as far as I can remember you only get 1 ribbon for winning the entire tournament of a regional or nationals, I don't believe that is the best way to do it, as again the TCG has multi level prizing, so you don't have to be the literal best player in the world to earn something tangeable but can get SOMETHING for playing at your skill level.
this just screws over people without switch online
The new games just aren’t as polished as they were during the 2D era
we are in the dark timeline of pokemon
YOU DON'T MISS WITH THESE
agreed. and its a good way for casuals to learn what they'd need to breed a competitive team. also its fun
Fr sv doesn't even lvl cap like sw and sh did
I actually want to replay Emerald (maybe a ROM hack) just because of the frontier.
Something that upsets me about sv lacking a battle tower is that it's the game that feels most set up for one. There's a school system in the game for pokemon. Surely you can just reuse the courtyard there as a battle tower area, make wins/losses reward LP that's already built into the game, and just expand the LP shop.
Heck, there was a reddit comment I saw when the game first released "I want a battle tower that is just Nemona with 50 different teams"
I bought my copy of emerald from a garage sale 17 years ago. I never restarted the save file that was on it and still to this day am playing that exact same cartridge on the save file I never even started.
The elite four had already been defeated. I spent my entire time playing emerald in the post game. That’s how much longevity it has.
Shout out to DAN whose save file has been living on for nearing 20 years and who doesn’t even know I exist or that his legacy lives on haha
In emerald, i was too young to understand evs/ivs and what pokemon were good (id just go for the ones with highest stat totals). Now i that i understnad, and it is significatly easier to optimise these things, there is no battle frontier. Online is not a replacement.
Basically what game freak is telling us is that the real post-game is
*the friends we made along the way*
Better than grinding your life away at a building honestly. I get more enjoyment out of the journey itself rather than the overhyped endgame.
@@unofficialmeme5972the endgame can be quite fun as you take your battling skills to the max
@@FraserSouris I'm sorry, but I never found the endgames in Pokemon to be fun at all, regardless of the generation.
@@unofficialmeme5972 That's fine. But the beauty of Pokemon endgames is that only those who enjoy it can play it if they want. If you want to stop after the credits and beating the champion, you can.
The lack of an endgame is an issue because the people who don't like the endgame don't gain anything by its absence. Wheras the people who do like it, lose a lot.
I like when there is post-game "stuff" to do, not the battle tower i'm not really interested in that, but more legendaries to catch, storylines and what not Maybe as a kid if i understood pokemon better i would've liked the battle towers, but now i don't enjoy the games that much that i'd want to get so good at them. I have other stuff to do.
I actually don’t really mind the loss of the battle facilities.
The increased accessibility to competitive Pokemon has made competitive more accessible, but it has also made a nonsense of the battle facilities. As it turns out, a lot of the challenge of the battle facilities goes away when you can make a competitively viable team in fifteen minutes.
While some people may prefer the grinding to get the exact nature and IV spread necessary, I think the fun part is the battling, and competitive is infinitely more challenging than battle facilities once there are no limits on your ability to team build.
There is zero reason to invest in a battle facility post game when most people who play post game are either building for competitive or shiny hunting.
4:02 "There is no finish line, and so the grind, fittingly, will never stop. So alternatively, a game with clearly outlined goals is great."
Me personally, I lament the loss of the Battle Tower for the complete opposite reason: so that the game has endless replayability. Even when away from the game, sometimes some wild idea for a strategy strikes me, and I want to try building it in the game to see how reliable it is in the endless stream of battles against equal levelled opponents. Absent this challenge, I feel a lack of motivation or incentive to innovate, hence why the severely watered down battle tower of SwSh had me put down the game almost instantly after I deemed that I had seen all there is to see. Same with SV.
I still boot up USM on Citra occasionally just to mindlessly bash in some AI opponents while watching documentary or commentary videos. The sheer variety of the national dex, Z-Moves, and Mega Evolutions, and the endless combination they bring makes it so satisfying to play.
I would ignore the battle frontier as a kid as I found it too difficult. But going back to it now I realize how fun the shakeup on the gameplay is and how much I’ve improved as a pokemon trainer over the years. Defeating a frontier brain now gives a good feeling similar to that of defeating the elite 4 when I was a kid. The fact that a battle frontier was only in two pokemon generations is a crime.
Finishing the game and maybe the pokédex has been always the main goals of the games. Battle Tower/Frontier, with the beginning of Crystal, has always been "oh wouldn't it be cool if we did this?" kind of "throw ideas on a wall and see what sticks" idea. It was pretty cool for what it was intended to be in JP Crystal. The rest of the entries were just bastardization of that idea into coin-cruncher arcade games with stupid hard difficulties due to no online capability.
It was good in a sense that they posed a real challenge, but ultimately, later battle facilities only served as an additional means to pass the time, give additional options to customize your team (item vendors, tutors etc) FOR PVP. All and all, it was just a gimmick, albeit a popular gimmick. So I'm not suprised that they moved away from it in time.
What I would've liked is them making an additional, seperate game purely focused on battling like Stadium 1 & 2. Those games were popular for a REASON after all. That being them serving as the "final challenge" of their respective generations. They required the team from your gameboy titles, they posed a HUGE challenge, and they rewarded you with VERY cool stuff (Surf Pikachu, Earthquake Gligar etc). I think a game like that would REALLY spice up the things and scratch the itch fans have had.
I mean imagine this: You get a frontier game, it reads your save file from main titles, lets you register your team from all the pokémon you have, offers challenges, sets very powerful prizes like pokémon with strong IV's, hidden natures, unlearnable moves that would shake up the meta, give rare berries, give special ribbons or trainer card medals for clearing certain challenges, or give costume pieces/room decorations (remember those?) for all to see! IMAGINE HAVING SECRET BASES AGAIN! Imagine making a very cool base with rare stuff, with you sitting in front, that people you've traded with can see, imagine them being able to challenge you there. Just like Gen3!
But all that wouldn't be bringing gamefreak profits. so no.
I actually just finished the game yesterday and was sad to see that there is no real postgame. I’m not really into the online or competitive stuff or even filling the Pokédex. Only really finished the game to get to the postgame.
I'll never forget you Muk
you did what no others could in the battle factory
fkn hit the evasion noob ai
all times with muk were good times
the days without him are sad.
The battle frontier in emerald is what made everything come together for me. Maybe it's because I'm too competitive for being a casual player, but I think Megaman battle network 3 and pokemon emerald showcase postgame done right. So much cool stuff and ways to test your might. But some people just want a victory lap and nothing more, I get it.
sword and shield actually does have trainer card stars. it is a lot easier to get all of them, but it definately still represents completing everything that there is to do in swsh.
I love your content, informative, entertaining and relaxing! Keep it up!
Just another video that proves my point how Yo-Kai Watch games are better in every way over Pokemon. YKW3 is filled with tons of challenging postgame bosses where you cannot overlevel AND has a postgame battle facility which serves to help test your competitive teambuilds. Not to mention the game is full of a ton of ingame accolades and achivements so even if you collect every monster and beat every boss, you are STILL not done with it.
The Pokemon games of the past will always be better unless the Pokemon company makes some major changes on how they do things now.
BW2 still had the best post game with the PWT and Black City/White Forest
Midway through, I was about to comment "Why not have both Battle Frontier & improvements for the social aspect", but good thing you said that by the end. Don't comment unless you've watched the whole video.
excellent video. I did the Ribbon Master challenge in 2019 during the leadup to SWSH release, requiring play on games ranging from Gens 3 to 7. playing so many games in succession like that made it abundantly clear how much less the newer games have for players to actually DO outside of finishing the story. and clearing the Battle Towers in gens 3 and 4 felt like such a massive achievement, it really disappoints me to see how much worse they got over the years. like, did you know in gen 7's standard format you actually CAN use Pokemon at a higher level than your opponents'? I couldn't believe my eyes when I first saw that.
me and a buddy used to play Multi Battles in the Maison on XY for hours while hanging out watching movies, trying to come up with combinations and strategies to win the 50 streak. you say that Pokemon has placed more emphasis on the social aspects, but I think the removal of multiplayer content like contests and battle towers is still a huge loss towards making the games feel like a social activity.
Pokemon games haven't really been the same, it doesn't really have the life and extra content older games once did
Less and less complete single player experiences and more social sim with mons
I hear people complaining that the battle items not being locked behind bp, but, counterpoint: i always struggled with the battle facilities with a combination of not being versed in the meta to be good and NOT HAVING GOOD COMPETITIVE ITEMS.I love the idea of getting to use the big kid held items in the main game, and the disposable ones actually being reusable! Gone are the days of me accidentally deleting my focus sash because I left it on Kartana when i challenged the elite four to grind levels, gone are the days of having good items in my bag in swsh but refusing to use them lest they be gone forever! I welcome the disposal of that with open arms, BUT I completely agree that a battle tower is a keystone of the Pokémon formula. It's the reason we NEEDED stadium 1&2 because they wrre effecfively the gen 1&2 battle towers! So much of my playtime in sun and moon was on the battle tree, why? Because I couldnt be arsed to finish my Pokédex, but also because it gave me a nebulous goal of not getting screwed over by colress's minimizing Muk on battle 40 or other such gems as I earn that fancy ribbon for my Pokémon. (I am very driven by earnable marks and ribbons) So even if the reward was just money or league points with a ribbon at battles 50 and 100, i'd be happy, I'd play it until my final projects are due! The open world aspect is nice, but just being able to explore a world where youve already scoured every inch of it isnt as exciting as the initial journey to chart these lands.
To be fair, the Scarlet and Violet DLC offered more challenges and fitting boss battles and the second half was pretty much an entire giant battle facility with different minigames and activities integrated into it while still remaining completely separate from the Battle Tournaments themselves. There were multiple different competitions to be had aside from battles but there was still an emphasis on a single player story mode boss battle structure. And it seemed pretty great whole providing new story content, characters, lore, and certainly more challenging gameplay thrn in the bas game by itself.
The closest and most recent we got was the battle tree(?) In gen 7 in since they had a sort of mark and we got some post game characters
Not as fun as the frontier but close and fun (kinda)
The most hated games Pokemon-Brilliant-Diamond-Shining-Pearl might actually have one of the best battle towers ever like literally facing a Zapdos on your first Master Class run ever was so unforgettable for me. Also getting tonthat point. It abuses on RNG or NRG or whatever that Is called but that was also the challenge of the battle tower, beat ing the game at its best.
Pokemon GO ruined the main series by making these ridiculous raids the new post game grind. Oh well, I'm enjoying finally trying to complete Gen 4 battle frontier (f you battle factory I hate you) while Scarlet is collecting dust till the DLC. Wouldn't be terribly salty about the changes, but my friends who did play pokemon stopped after Gen 7, so I only play by myself (random players online wouldn't be an issue if you could just communicate with them)
I've been doing a lot of Battle Tower stuff thanks to a Ribbon quest I'm doing and after awhile, I now see the complete appeal of them. It's a shame that it no longer exist...
I wouldn't play pokemon anymore tbh if it weren't for the battle frontier in emerald and hgss/dpp, except for maybe a nuzlock challenge now and then
Training for firereds battle tower now. Please, show gamefreak you care by not purchasing new games and creating conversation about the older generations. Maybe even pick up a few old cartridges and talk about it online. Gamefreak and Nintendo will continue to lose faithful, hardcore consumers.
The gen 3 battle frontier was fun to explore but the moment you step into a battle facility, the fun drains out of the game real quick.
My issue with the gen 3 battle frontier is that it expects you to use competitive Pokémon, yet gen 3 is easily the worst gen to raise competitive Pokémon. It is more complex than gen 1 and 2 in that it revamped a lot of systems, yet it offers very little control and helps unlike gen 4+. EV training is extremely tedious in Hoenn, breeding for a good nature + IVs is pretty much near impossible. Like gen 1-2, most Pokémon still have garbage movepools. And TMs are still single use and most of the good ones are unique acquisitions.
I feel like if we ever get postgame battle facilities again it'll be in the in the form of DLC 🥲
ah, the battle tower. the only place ever where a fucking SNORLAX with 30 stat of speed outspeeds my alakazam
Not complete without the battle tower. I completely agree. Just one of the reasons why I never collected or played (Scarlet & Violet) I just hope they bring back something that does lockout leveling up. Forcing all monsters during battle to be at Lv.50. I hope they do it in (Legends Z-A.)
Has someone who has never seriously challenged the battlefrontier or any of the battle towers I had no idea Scarlett and violet lacked a battle tower.
Honestly I think the Battle Tower and battle facilities as a whole could be brought back if they were made a lot more newcomer friendly. Just make each of them a doubled Elite Four, you face eight trainers before fighting a notable strong trainer at the end, and you’re done. But if you want, you can keep your battle streak going and get rewards for reaching certain thresholds, allowing for endless replayability for those who want to challenge themselves, all the while lowering the point of entry and keeping that skill ceiling.
When I found out there's no post game battle facility in SV I was devastated, but I've kinda gotten over it because I've been having a lot fun with ranked battles in gen 9, I even have gotten to master rank in ranked I believe 3 to 4 times now, but it would still be nice to have a post game battle facility, I find them really fun, like there's a reason I play mostly the battle tower in my copy of HG to this day, it's a lot of fun to me
6:29
Pokémon Crystal at the second generation also lacked treiner card stars but had a Battle Tower. That was the first inception of the concept in the series, in fact.
THAT or a PWT like gen 5. It was so cool seeing all gym leaders and champions
Post game high level game content is always better than none at all, I agree.
I have a feeling that hope is not lost, it seems like the second half of the DLC is going to be some kind of battle school. Which hopefully will be a return to a battle tower. And I know people will complain that something like that is behind DLC, and yeah it sucks. However, with the scope of the pokémon games ever growing and the difficulties that Scarlett and Violet have had I feel that them getting extra time and money to possibly make this really really bad ass battle tower alongside a cool new story and new pokémon is going to be worth the wait and frankly worth the DLC. I know people have mixed feelings on this and it's valid to want the game to just come out finished. But the cycle that these games are made on is just not attainable for that to happen, especially with how divergent this game is from the entire rest of the franchise and the sheer amount of content that's within it. Game freak has about 169 employees, and this game was made in about 3 years being worked on at the same time as Legends Arceus so that team was already split. People think because pokémon makes an assload of money game freak also makesan absurd amount of money, but in reality most of that pokémon money is coming from and going back into merchandising. Game freak is a small company with an absolutely ridiculously popular IP with which they must continue to match demand with. In conclusion, it's okay to be upset about the current state of the video game industry. It's not just pokémon, most video games will launch kind of broken and need a day one patch. Frankly outside of some visual glitches for me Scarlet Violet has been pretty much glitch free the entirety of my 200 plus hours in that game. And I have a really good feeling that the second half of the DLC is going to be exactly what we want, I could be wrong and that would suck. However I genuinely think it's going to be worth the wait
If it's in the dlc then that's nice but too little too late.
The battle frontier should be in the base game. It being in a dlc is better than nothing - but still bad.
Pokemon games started to be very underwhelming when the games became 3d, but the switch era was when the games became garbage, there are good developers and with good ideas in GF but they are very few people and they get no time to make a multimillionaire dollar franchise game, now they even sell the postgame in a dlc couse they didnt even finish making the game...
compleying the pokedex remains the main objective of every pokemon game, and doing that take some time
btw the reason lorelei is called prima in the 4kids dub of the anime is cuz her japanese name, kanna, is 2 syllables so the lip flaps wouldnt match saying "lorelei", and while they couldve edited the flaps to support 3 syllables, that would take too much time, effort, and money for something like 4kids, who are trying to cut costs to make as much money as possible by bringing over popular shows from japan. her other 2 appearances in pokemon animated material (pokemon generations and origins) both never verbally mention her name, so if they ever bring her back then we just kinda dont know what they would do, but i assume they would edit the lip flaps to fit 3 syllables
I did not even know there is no battle tower how do people praise this game omg!
I'm a fan of competitive taking the place of the post game! I loved Gen 6 and street pass battling random people! That was the peak multiplayer system
Perhaps fans should petition for a more mild version of the Battle Frontier. Maybe Game Freak can do something like Orre Colosseum in XD: Gale of Darkness. There is not massive amount of trainers to fight; however, it does offer a good endgame challenge to players while being relatively easy for developers to create.
everything changed when they took our pixels and added a new dimension
My game's Victory Road is gonna be a tower. In a sense. And I'm probably gonna have some battle facility in the form of a Champion's Hall or something.
Switch post games: What's post game???
3ds post game: we know what post game is
Ds post game: we are still at our peak in post games
Gba post game: we reached our peak in post game
Gbc post game: were still young
The Battle Tower itself fucking sucks. I hate it. BUT, the other facilities with different rules? I love them. It's more than just throw hands with a cheating AI.
miss the old days of pokemon, i dont ply anything above gen 4.
I'm guessing most, like me, never bothered much, so that's probably why.
I tend to just go as far as i can in post game see and do everything but i found battle tower more luckbased and annoying except for blazing emerald hack, that was good if bullshit somewhat often.
Most players i've seen just thinks 'oh i beat the e4 and became champion im done' and anything post that feels like grinding on even if there is story or anything there, until they grind to a stop.
Atleast before you could play with others for free but now with switch online you need to PAY for postgame content (also dlc i guess)
I dunno I kinda despise that it didn't have evasion clause cause I always to because they double team spam but on the other hand I see where are people coming from
BDSP not having Battle Frontier was criminal. Even from the beginning, being a Pokémon master was more than a singular goal. Gen 1 wanted you to be the champion AND catch em all. The franchise becoming more social with humans has reduced the social interaction between the player and Pokémon.
I did not purchase the DLCs specifically because they did not add a battle tower
Gen 8 battle tower sucked too
pokémon would have to care enough about making good games to actually bring these back, but we clearly are far past that point nowadays
Thank you. This needs to be shouted
I still play the old games all the time on my 3ds. Currently I've been doing gen 2 and I actually managed to find a shiny spinarak lol