I respect your opinion, but I've been playing as a healer since the official WOTLK and almost all subsequent expansions. In cata 4.3.4, I would put Disc Prist and Resto Shammy in TIER S, Holy Pala in Tier A, Resto Druid in Tier B and Holy Prist in Tier D.
@@MEYTRIXI feel like disc priest has its rogue, mage, hunter niche. (And sometimes feral) But resto druid is just a very good healer but not as good as rsham So all wars, locks, rets, dks, ferals etc, theyd prefer a rsham over a rdru While disc covers their own niche
yea, they do, but it's double edged sword - they dispel those UAs and damage their own team, enemy warlock then reaplies it and profits, leap of faith I forgot to mention, also a tremendous ability
Holy Pally being S tier makes sense. I remember playing them in BG's and nobody could kill me. They have a good amount of instant healing and defensives that it takes upwards of half a team tunneling you in order to bring you down. Can't wait to do it again haha.
The best disc is extremely good, but a decent disc struggles hard, so if you’re not the best player - then playing other healers will be easier and more rewarding
I think you really downplayed disc priest in 2s. Cata is the start of wow having the drain meta. Its no longer about your normal damage being able to kill. You need to use CDs or rot the other team. As such, i vividly remember disc being just below resto sham in 2s because of mana burn. Theres a reason blizzard soon added dampening in mists. Just play defensive and burn the other healer and you win. I was a 2600 rated feral in cata. Disc is far better in 2s than most healers. Also, lets be real, 3s doesnt exist anymore in classic. People only care about 2s. Same goes for rbgs. My comp back in the day had a dedicated disc priest that would only bubble, mass dispel, and mana burn. The mana burn would win every team fight. Some teams even ran double disc just to mana burn.
Good points, although Mana Burn is a long cast that requires a lot of CC to pull off, healers can still heal with close to 0 mana anyway against 1 dps, and any double dps will destroy the disc like it’s nothing, for these reasons I am not putting it higher
I have both Rshaman and Hpal played both to 2500ish in WOTLK playing with DK. Which out of the Rshaman and Hpal will pair better with the UHDK in cata?
Pretty much the same, they are both great with it, I personally like H pal for the Freedom and stronger defense against rogues/hunters but even R sham is still S tier
My two most played classes on cataclysm atm are Disc and Hpal and i must agree with you. I have much easier life with my paladin but on other side disc is much more fun for me thanks to ability like leap,mind control and also penance is so fun ability to press. But yes if you just want play meta no matter what you are better go with paladin.
in PvE, it's between holy and disc depending on the raid and specific encounter, there are bosses where disc's absorb is more beneficial and then there are fights where it's less useful
Is there a best race for alliance Disc Priest? I normally go NE for Shadowmeld, but I heard human could be good. Also Dwarf is sometimes solid when rogues are good.
@@muscadineman45pritchett82 it is, but chances that you will meld at the right time to dodge warlock Death Coil or similar are very slim even for a more experienced player
2:48 ele shaman would be a no go. You replace Lightning Shield with Earth Shield, meaning they won't have any burst with their Earth Shock. Which is necessary for using their burst well. Putting Disc below Druid is insane. First you must've not met many good fire mages if you're mentioning fire/disc as some second hand choice, while it has hardly any counters in the game (udk/hpala would probably be the only hard counter). And not mentioning fire/rdruid at all, even though it's easily best 2s set up for druid. And I don't think I need to explain why feral/disc is better than any shaman or paladin comp in 2s. Second, disc is the only healer that can be your win condition due to mana burn. Your dps can be doing dogwater pressure and you can still win. Third, best druid can count on in 3s is probably something like godcomp, maybe rogue/spriest. Meanwhile RMP, FMP, PHP, thug, jungle all either make perfect sense with a priest or straight up require a priest and they are all more relevant than druid's best options. Btw. 5:08 There is no universe in which disc dies to feral 1v1.
Thanks for sharing your experience! Mana burn is very hard to pull off unless the enemies are CCed, long cast is easy to LoS and most healers in 2v2 can be extremely mana efficient and keep going forever with low mana (paladin holy shock + word of glory, shaman earth shield + riptide, for example), you’re right about not meeting many rly good fire mages, they all seem to be making many mistakes still when I’d face them, and never met a very successful fire+rdruid, and I’d very rarely see the mentioned 3s comp ran with a disc priest, it would usually be a weak link of that comp and they’d prefer to go with a bulkier-safer healer, but the meta in 3v3 on privates is not so much about the comp as it is about the players since not so many play this bracket
@@MEYTRIX Mana burn is tailor made for combos such as maim on healer + cyclone on dps or DB/Deep + nova with CS while dps is ringed/poly'd. So obviously it works only in better disc comps with feral, rogue or mage. Long cast isn't a problem with proper set up. I think that what also takes away from shaman's strong position is it's 2s standing. Every dps in the game is better off with a priest or paladin, except for warlocks. And even warlocks should take a paladin if meta is mostly 2x dps. Shaman gets countered by every rogue double dps and link itself just isn't very good with just 2 players. Both end up at 40% which is comparable to NS heal and in addition you're vulnerable to swaps. Which also goes to highlight small amount of cds. Moreover shaman brings the least offensive to the comp. In 3s it for sure is the best but in 2s it just doesn't really stand out with anything that isn't replacable. But since my experience with rbg is next to none, how would you rank healers in that bracket alone?
It is great if you’re one of the better players, but any mistake will cost you, and you still struggle to stay alive and have to rely on your teammates to peel for you
@@MEYTRIX yeah that's true like if you make a mistake you got like a sec to fix that mistake if not your pretty much dead and the rely on your teammates is really important and a really good communication
i remember disc very differently than you. i was virtually unkillable during cata. you make them sound super squishy. maybe you private server guys found some tricks over the years. but back in actual cata, i found disc super tanky. like over 2k tanky.
the meta has definitely shaped up over the years, but even though disc is squishy - they can be played with a feral, sub rogue, or frost mage, and even go all the way to rank 1, they are just more limited in terms of viable arena compositions and require a lot of help from their partners, but it is absolutely a rank 1 viable spec in the hands of a skilled player
Holy priest is s tier pvp. I ran holy back then. Ppl would cry i wasnt disc. Then id carry the flag and get all the acheives. Probably coz bubble speed / nurf to dmg return from bubble
:( i am sorry i will have to disagree, all healers in cata are good for pvp...it depends on your team or team8's class and the team you face...but yea...the shamman is pretty damn hard to kil...and all this ofcurse until they fall on a pro warrior...i always said cata is the most balanced exp. for pvp, take priest for example, is it not mind control the best skill in game?...one time in a bg with my disco i managed to kill 6 people attacking me near a bridge void, and the last one...the last one did not take a mind control, he really suicided jumping down himself after watching his team getting mind controlled one by one feeling hopeless and desperate, so in other words i MCed 5 to their death and the 6th one got the real MC
when we compare classes, we do so expecting everyone's at same skill level and equal gear, ofc it comes down to the player more than a class, but if you have the same player being rank 1 with both classes - that's what a tier list compares
Matrix because you are Paladin guru 😂 help me out with this question is paladin viable class for hybrid like shockadin for example. I'm only asking because I like to messing about in world for solo wpvp. Ty in advance and thank you again for your motivation on private servers means a lot 🎉
well yea but with each class this list will look so different...example i could even kill your paladin with my disco priest or use you to kill your team8 than after making you beg me drop you to the void :D...@@MEYTRIX
@@XPISTOS-ANESTH nope, no hybrid specs on Cata since you need to spend at least 30 talent points in your main spec first before you can use any offspec talent points, but regular ret has crazy healing too, so you will be just fine with it in world PvP
You will struggle, unless you have a rly good rogue or feral partner that protects you from being killed, but it’s still a fun playstyle, one of my favorite healers just for Mind Control and things like that
For sure resto druid isn't A tier. too squishy.no defensive.even bearform sux in cata.your armor in bear form is equal to a resto shaman(a bit less!) Vs 2x dps there is no way you survive vs comps like ret/uhdk Your only way to surivev is playing with a ret paladin(not a good choice-endless arenas) or a rogue that peels & cc alot One of biggest problems is your hit!there is a big chance you miss your bash/pounce/maim on caster/healer specs cuz you only get spell hit(spirit dependant talent) Even if you want to use gear by hit on them,you loose stats and become weaker than usual You can't use your full potential And even full hotted vs some comps can't survive ,needs even more peels than disc Maybe some peaple say resto druid/mage is good too,but there are alot unholy/Rshaman Hpala/unholy that in high rating it's almost impossible for mages to connect and kill healer and can't do much vs uhdk! I don't say win chance is 0% but still very low chance vs those comps. I'm talking about +2200
If we’re only talking about arenas, but for BGs - r druid is S tier so that makes up for it, don’t forget the crazy mobility/CC and ability to LoS really well, a druid that doesn’t move isn’t a good druid
@@MEYTRIX believe or not that 20% dmg reduction barkskin do nothing vs 2x melee & they have cc too.its just enouugh for them to connect to you 1 time ... Maybe you should try resto druid for fun :D (ofc there is no fun when getting 1 shotted) & Ofc you're right .druid is good in BGs. But if this tier list was about arena,that wasn't the place for druid Your main comp in 2v2 is ret/uhdk.what do you think?is it possible a resto druid survive when his partner is something except ret?
Earpugs(Rank 1 in classic wotlk) just released his pvp tier list and honestly puts Holy in in more favourable light, he considers them viable and they have some strengths over Disc, mainly better healing throughput with instant casts,mobility and has an easier time setting CC, is Disc better? Of course. But holy os definitely viable and not a meme spec.. MoP is where Holy finally over takes Disc as the Better pvp healer.
I respect your opinion, but I've been playing as a healer since the official WOTLK and almost all subsequent expansions. In cata 4.3.4, I would put Disc Prist and Resto Shammy in TIER S, Holy Pala in Tier A, Resto Druid in Tier B and Holy Prist in Tier D.
I respect your opinion too 😁 why would you place them like that? Can you elaborate?
@@MEYTRIXI feel like disc priest has its rogue, mage, hunter niche. (And sometimes feral)
But resto druid is just a very good healer but not as good as rsham
So all wars, locks, rets, dks, ferals etc, theyd prefer a rsham over a rdru
While disc covers their own niche
The only S tier healer is rsham. Holy and disc are both A tier, holy being a little bit ahead of disc cause it just fits more comps
Nice video, I'm currently leveling healers on Whitemane so this video is perfectly timed thanks man!
awesome, glad you liked it! 😎
Keep up the good content 👍 It would be bomb if you did an all around pvp tier list with all specs. (melee,ranged,healer all included)
If is planned, I will have to cut a lot of talk out of it though to make it into 30 minute video even 🫠 that’s why I separated them
Soon as I saw him lifting weights I knew he knew his PvP
@@ElmodruuRavencrest 😆😆 smart
Personally i think disc is actually really good in bgs. They bring fantastic utility cds
yea, they do, but it's double edged sword - they dispel those UAs and damage their own team, enemy warlock then reaplies it and profits, leap of faith I forgot to mention, also a tremendous ability
Holy Pally being S tier makes sense. I remember playing them in BG's and nobody could kill me. They have a good amount of instant healing and defensives that it takes upwards of half a team tunneling you in order to bring you down. Can't wait to do it again haha.
Exactly 💀
Surprised with your positioning of the Disc priest, I always remembered them seemingly broken and a good disc almost impossible to kill.
The best disc is extremely good, but a decent disc struggles hard, so if you’re not the best player - then playing other healers will be easier and more rewarding
Top content, you channel will explode in a few months when Cata Classic becomes a thing.
and if Cata Classic doesn't come out - I will have to become a stripper irl 🤐
@@MEYTRIX can I have some pics on discord 👀
I think you really downplayed disc priest in 2s. Cata is the start of wow having the drain meta. Its no longer about your normal damage being able to kill. You need to use CDs or rot the other team. As such, i vividly remember disc being just below resto sham in 2s because of mana burn. Theres a reason blizzard soon added dampening in mists.
Just play defensive and burn the other healer and you win.
I was a 2600 rated feral in cata. Disc is far better in 2s than most healers. Also, lets be real, 3s doesnt exist anymore in classic. People only care about 2s.
Same goes for rbgs. My comp back in the day had a dedicated disc priest that would only bubble, mass dispel, and mana burn. The mana burn would win every team fight. Some teams even ran double disc just to mana burn.
Good points, although Mana Burn is a long cast that requires a lot of CC to pull off, healers can still heal with close to 0 mana anyway against 1 dps, and any double dps will destroy the disc like it’s nothing, for these reasons I am not putting it higher
@@MEYTRIXyou can get an insane amount of burns when playing with rogue or mage in 2s. And they both can peel you easily against 2dps
@@jaimonji5503 yep, that’s why I say you are extremely limited to who you can play with
Id personally drop Resto druid, from what I've seen they've been struggling hard with the burst meta
Yea, they get bursted pretty fast, but when they use their snares and LoS effectively - they can be super hard to kill
Damn,u have some good gains there,congrats!
thanks 😳
What’s your thoughts on a 3v3 comp with a resto Druid, feral Druid, and enhance or elemental shammy? What tier would you place this comp in?
That would be below C tier, not much synergy and overlapping CC DRs from the druids, good for casual games with friends
I have both Rshaman and Hpal played both to 2500ish in WOTLK playing with DK. Which out of the Rshaman and Hpal will pair better with the UHDK in cata?
Pretty much the same, they are both great with it, I personally like H pal for the Freedom and stronger defense against rogues/hunters but even R sham is still S tier
What is the best healer for my emotional damage? Crazy to see shman in s tier, everyone I asked told me they suck but I got no idea how pvp works
resto shams are everywhere in PvP, it is also the best healer for your emotional damage if you choose to try arena since shaman is your OG class 😎
Thoughts on Disc Priest/Hunter at 2s? Great video
Thank you, the hunter can’t kill sht alone so the games would be long and boring, there’s much better comp options for both
How legit do you think rsham -UHDK will be ? I was 2.4 in mop as rsham never played cata tho . Thanks :)
Extremely good, both classes are OP and it’s one of the best comp options for both of them too!
My two most played classes on cataclysm atm are Disc and Hpal and i must agree with you. I have much easier life with my paladin but on other side disc is much more fun for me thanks to ability like leap,mind control and also penance is so fun ability to press. But yes if you just want play meta no matter what you are better go with paladin.
very true, disc is definitely way more fun playstyle
why isnt rsham more popular i thought rshams were better
@@goldenmemes51 I think they are very popular, I keep meeting them in PvP all the time
What's your unbiased opinion about resto druid?
@@XPISTOS-ANESTHafter reckful got them nerfed in season 9, they never really recovered in cata
im stuck what do you think is the best class for healing in cata 2's shaman or pally?
I would give the edge to paladin overall, but they are close
Love the content you provide! Please make a video on what are the best wow servers to join for new players. It would help a large amount of ppl.
thank you, good idea, I'll make a note of it, but will have to think about that a lot 🤔
How are disc priests in pve though? I’m leveling alt one up right now for raids and thought I’d start a healer. Priest is what I picked
in PvE, it's between holy and disc depending on the raid and specific encounter, there are bosses where disc's absorb is more beneficial and then there are fights where it's less useful
Is there a best race for alliance Disc Priest? I normally go NE for Shadowmeld, but I heard human could be good. Also Dwarf is sometimes solid when rogues are good.
Human is the best overall, extra trinket is too good, NElf and Dwarf are only situational
Shadowmeld has ALOT of situations its good tho in my experience
@@muscadineman45pritchett82 it is, but chances that you will meld at the right time to dodge warlock Death Coil or similar are very slim even for a more experienced player
Can you make dps tier list for pve cataclysm
I would have to refresh my memory, it's been a very long time since I actively played PvE on Cata 🤔
2:48 ele shaman would be a no go. You replace Lightning Shield with Earth Shield, meaning they won't have any burst with their Earth Shock. Which is necessary for using their burst well.
Putting Disc below Druid is insane. First you must've not met many good fire mages if you're mentioning fire/disc as some second hand choice, while it has hardly any counters in the game (udk/hpala would probably be the only hard counter). And not mentioning fire/rdruid at all, even though it's easily best 2s set up for druid. And I don't think I need to explain why feral/disc is better than any shaman or paladin comp in 2s.
Second, disc is the only healer that can be your win condition due to mana burn. Your dps can be doing dogwater pressure and you can still win.
Third, best druid can count on in 3s is probably something like godcomp, maybe rogue/spriest. Meanwhile RMP, FMP, PHP, thug, jungle all either make perfect sense with a priest or straight up require a priest and they are all more relevant than druid's best options.
Btw. 5:08 There is no universe in which disc dies to feral 1v1.
Thanks for sharing your experience! Mana burn is very hard to pull off unless the enemies are CCed, long cast is easy to LoS and most healers in 2v2 can be extremely mana efficient and keep going forever with low mana (paladin holy shock + word of glory, shaman earth shield + riptide, for example), you’re right about not meeting many rly good fire mages, they all seem to be making many mistakes still when I’d face them, and never met a very successful fire+rdruid, and I’d very rarely see the mentioned 3s comp ran with a disc priest, it would usually be a weak link of that comp and they’d prefer to go with a bulkier-safer healer, but the meta in 3v3 on privates is not so much about the comp as it is about the players since not so many play this bracket
@@MEYTRIX Mana burn is tailor made for combos such as maim on healer + cyclone on dps or DB/Deep + nova with CS while dps is ringed/poly'd. So obviously it works only in better disc comps with feral, rogue or mage. Long cast isn't a problem with proper set up.
I think that what also takes away from shaman's strong position is it's 2s standing. Every dps in the game is better off with a priest or paladin, except for warlocks. And even warlocks should take a paladin if meta is mostly 2x dps. Shaman gets countered by every rogue double dps and link itself just isn't very good with just 2 players. Both end up at 40% which is comparable to NS heal and in addition you're vulnerable to swaps. Which also goes to highlight small amount of cds. Moreover shaman brings the least offensive to the comp. In 3s it for sure is the best but in 2s it just doesn't really stand out with anything that isn't replacable.
But since my experience with rbg is next to none, how would you rank healers in that bracket alone?
it's kinda funny that Disc is on B Tier wheni am just toying with players on it... have always done it sins way back in vanilla
It is great if you’re one of the better players, but any mistake will cost you, and you still struggle to stay alive and have to rely on your teammates to peel for you
@@MEYTRIX yeah that's true like if you make a mistake you got like a sec to fix that mistake if not your pretty much dead and the rely on your teammates is really important and a really good communication
shocked you rated rdru so high i might consider it now
It is a solid option for everything, not super impressive and it takes time to learn it if you wanna be able to use its entire toolkit effectively
i remember disc very differently than you. i was virtually unkillable during cata. you make them sound super squishy. maybe you private server guys found some tricks over the years. but back in actual cata, i found disc super tanky. like over 2k tanky.
the meta has definitely shaped up over the years, but even though disc is squishy - they can be played with a feral, sub rogue, or frost mage, and even go all the way to rank 1, they are just more limited in terms of viable arena compositions and require a lot of help from their partners, but it is absolutely a rank 1 viable spec in the hands of a skilled player
I dominated bgs in holy priest
Might try more disc this time.
I started sod p3 and priest is target practice in bgs =[
Did you carry flag too?
Got all the achieves.
Bubble speed ftw
Sod I be missing speed buff so much
@Chayliss what's bis bg healer these days in sod?
Whats better with a warrior in 2s - shaman or paladin ?
Both have their pros and cons and their own counters, one isn’t better than the other
@@MEYTRIX I guess Pala is the safer option for a beginner?
Holy priest is s tier pvp.
I ran holy back then. Ppl would cry i wasnt disc. Then id carry the flag and get all the acheives.
Probably coz bubble speed / nurf to dmg return from bubble
don't forget - ppl used to run double blood DK back then and be successful, 2010 and 2024 is quite a difference in meta
Tank spec pvp tier list pls
Thanks for the content ser
Gonna make a note and start working on it 🫡
Are warlocks or elemental shamans good in PvP?
yep, both are, affliction warlocks and ele shamans are both the kings of BGs and 3v3, not so good in 1v1 and 2v2 though
you didnt talk much about paladins sadly! like their upsides and downsides ! good video thank you
I also made a separate video on how holy paladin is in Cata PvP, that might answer more of your questions
:( i am sorry i will have to disagree, all healers in cata are good for pvp...it depends on your team or team8's class and the team you face...but yea...the shamman is pretty damn hard to kil...and all this ofcurse until they fall on a pro warrior...i always said cata is the most balanced exp. for pvp, take priest for example, is it not mind control the best skill in game?...one time in a bg with my disco i managed to kill 6 people attacking me near a bridge void, and the last one...the last one did not take a mind control, he really suicided jumping down himself after watching his team getting mind controlled one by one feeling hopeless and desperate, so in other words i MCed 5 to their death and the 6th one got the real MC
when we compare classes, we do so expecting everyone's at same skill level and equal gear, ofc it comes down to the player more than a class, but if you have the same player being rank 1 with both classes - that's what a tier list compares
Matrix because you are Paladin guru 😂 help me out with this question is paladin viable class for hybrid like shockadin for example. I'm only asking because I like to messing about in world for solo wpvp. Ty in advance and thank you again for your motivation on private servers means a lot 🎉
well yea but with each class this list will look so different...example i could even kill your paladin with my disco priest or use you to kill your team8 than after making you beg me drop you to the void :D...@@MEYTRIX
@@XPISTOS-ANESTH nope, no hybrid specs on Cata since you need to spend at least 30 talent points in your main spec first before you can use any offspec talent points, but regular ret has crazy healing too, so you will be just fine with it in world PvP
The last patch Sub + Disc can explode people
Yep, last patch rogue is brokeeeen
Do resto shamans have friendly dispel in cata or not yet?
Yep, they do
Excited to run RLS and RPS…is DK or feral better for 2’s push? A chance they might give titles in 2’s classic servers
@@Capabletango both DK and feral are S tier in 2s, you won’t go wrong with either one of them 😎
Wanted to play Disc priest for Cata. Is it really that bad?
You will struggle, unless you have a rly good rogue or feral partner that protects you from being killed, but it’s still a fun playstyle, one of my favorite healers just for Mind Control and things like that
I agree the playstyle is a lot of fun. Thanks for the response!@@MEYTRIX
Why your thumbnail not match ur list in video lol
Idk it’s not supposed to 🤔
data please
For sure resto druid isn't A tier. too squishy.no defensive.even bearform sux in cata.your armor in bear form is equal to a resto shaman(a bit less!)
Vs 2x dps there is no way you survive vs comps like ret/uhdk
Your only way to surivev is playing with a ret paladin(not a good choice-endless arenas) or a rogue that peels & cc alot
One of biggest problems is your hit!there is a big chance you miss your bash/pounce/maim on caster/healer specs cuz you only get spell hit(spirit dependant talent)
Even if you want to use gear by hit on them,you loose stats and become weaker than usual
You can't use your full potential
And even full hotted vs some comps can't survive ,needs even more peels than disc
Maybe some peaple say resto druid/mage is good too,but there are alot unholy/Rshaman Hpala/unholy that in high rating it's almost impossible for mages to connect and kill healer and can't do much vs uhdk!
I don't say win chance is 0% but still very low chance vs those comps.
I'm talking about +2200
If we’re only talking about arenas, but for BGs - r druid is S tier so that makes up for it, don’t forget the crazy mobility/CC and ability to LoS really well, a druid that doesn’t move isn’t a good druid
@@MEYTRIX believe or not that 20% dmg reduction barkskin do nothing vs 2x melee & they have cc too.its just enouugh for them to connect to you 1 time ... Maybe you should try resto druid for fun :D (ofc there is no fun when getting 1 shotted)
& Ofc you're right .druid is good in BGs.
But if this tier list was about arena,that wasn't the place for druid
Your main comp in 2v2 is ret/uhdk.what do you think?is it possible a resto druid survive when his partner is something except ret?
B tier: blood DK
Heh true
Boooo, was going to play HPriest for Cata, sigh. Blizz and their lack of ability to balance classes in PvP.
Earpugs(Rank 1 in classic wotlk) just released his pvp tier list and honestly puts Holy in in more favourable light, he considers them viable and they have some strengths over Disc, mainly better healing throughput with instant casts,mobility and has an easier time setting CC, is Disc better? Of course. But holy os definitely viable and not a meme spec.. MoP is where Holy finally over takes Disc as the Better pvp healer.