A few years ago, a friend let me bust a few rounds from his AR in 6.5 Grendel (6.7 actual!). It was love at first ring of the steel for me! 5 for 5 at 500 yards! The more research I did into this cartridge, the more I had to have one. I chose a 20" HBAR, as Grendel likes a longer barrel. NO REGRETS!!! With Grendel, I feel the AR has finally grown up. A true Rifle with the capability to reach out several hundred yards. And with less than half the recoil of a .308! Grendel is now my GO TO platform.
Im probably the only person here, but i shoot the 6.5 Grendel in a bolt action rifle. And i really love the cartridge. Huge performance in such a small good looking package. Plus no recoil. Im a bolt gun fanatic.
I just got a howa 1500 in .300 blk out for suppressor use when I get approved. On month 5 right now. Ive been eyeing another in either 6.5 grendel or 7.62x39. I love those mini action howas.
One of the best thought out and information backed cartridge/ reloading video's I have ever seen. Your knowledge coupled with experience+time+testing=trustworthy, dependable, and knowledgeable data. A formula rarely found on RUclips. Your channel will be shared with many. Thank you for your dedication and time invested in these video's.
Took me about 400 rounds to figure out the 224 Valkyrie. I really like the way it shoots, but I only shoot steel and paper with it so far. Settled on the 88 ELD and RL-19. The secret for me was overall length. Once I loaded to magazine length, the groups shrank to sub MOA. Built a 6.8 SPC 16" light barrel and love it. Way more energy for Hogs and Deer over the 223. And yes, I have shot and killed deer with the .223 Wylde, but I shoot 70 gr Barnes bullets and they do a very nice job on deer and hogs here in Texas. I am building a light barreled 6.5 Grendel this weekend and expect good things from it as well. I finally got on the AR band wagon a few years back and now I am fully bought in. I have set up all my AR's essentially the same to accept the clip on night vision as well. Very little recoil, magazine fed, reliable...all are great guns to take in the woods or punch holes and ring steel. Johnny's channel has also inspired me to hand load for all my rifles.
The AR platform is an engineering marvel. I do not care for it. I won't own one. My 6.5 Grendel began life as a Mini-30. It is easily a better rifle than a 6.5 Grendel AR. If I were going to own a .224 Valkyrie. I disagree with your proclamation that owning a .223. I don't really see a use for .223/5.56. The 6.5 Grendel is best for me since I have 2 excellent 6.5x55 SE Mausers.
My 3 best AR15 cartridges: .300BO, 6.5G, and .458 SOCOM. With careful shopping you can have them all for a grand. A single, reliable acting lower, and no lack of compromise if unlawfully confronted. And the .458 can be subbed as well. I'm avoiding the 223/556 due to potential chambering issues with the BO. So, one becomes three. Subtle to devastating. Minimal spare parts requirement. :-)
It's only been a little over a year, but remaking/updating this video might make sense. Your suggestion for folks to first get a well functioning 223 rifle is excellent. We know there are hundreds of thousands of first time gun buyers who just bought a decent 223, but they want to know what else they can do with it. Buying a quality upper for varminting (22 Nosler) or deer hunting (6.5 Grendel) or long range precision (6mm ARC) is very appealing for folks with limited budgets. An expanded comparison with Hornady 6mm ARC and 300 Blackout would be very helpful. I notice you've been gone for 5 months now, I hope everything is good with you and your family. Take care,
Great point of view and summary from previous experience. Watching your 22 Nosler, 224 Val, and 6.5 Grendel videos my pick of the three is leaning towards 6.5 Grendel for the next upper. This video also gave me a lot to consider when deciding which cartridge to pick, other than 308, in a large frame AR. 260 Rem, 6.5 Creed, and 7mm-08 are in mind. More and more it seems like the mindset needs to be pick what bullet you want to shoot first and for what purpose then pick the cartridge best suited to shoot it.
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 isn't he talking about funny looking sponsored jackets that people wear at shooting competitions, not the military? Secondly, how is he making fun of the funny looking jackets, when he clearly said those are the guys to get info from?
I'm looking at a 6.5 grendel. Washington state doesn't allow hunting with a 5.56, .22 nozler or the .224 valkary. So looking to replace my 5.56 with a general purpose rifle I can hunt with and be a defense rifle. 6.5 meets this.
6.5 Grendel would be great for hunting but I would still stay with your 556 upper and get some good factory rounds that expand well. I think the 6.5 Grendel is great for long range over 556 but steel core 556 would be a great self defense round. I know a guy that was in the military and the green tip could go through a Humvee windshield and a standard 7.62x39 round wouldn't.
If 6.5 meets your requirements for a hunting rifle, go with that. I'm sure it will still work just fine, as long as you don't have any neighbors right beside your walls.
6.5 is e xelent for hunting I use mine more than any other rifle plus it out performs 556 in every single way. Ps u can find good defence ammo that won't over penetrate like Underwood controlled chaos
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 First off, Creedmore is a short action cartridge while the Ar-15 can only accept mini action cartridges. So Creedmore doesen't apply here. Sevond, in a short action rifle 6.5 PRC blows 6.5 Creedmore out of the water in every way possible. So in reality 6.5 Creedmore actualy wins nothing.
I use starline in 224 Valkyrie and I have not had any problems with the primer pockets.. although I did when I started this cartridge o 5 moths ago but now no issues at all.. great fun...
The most insightful group on how to reload the Valkyrie is the Facebook group Valkyrie Ascending focused on reloading this cartridge since it came out there is over 2+ years ago with tons of knowledge in the group.. facebook.com/groups/398943407218038/
Just finished my .224 Valkyrie build with a Wilson Combat 20" barrel with 1-6.5" twist, and first 10 shot group with factory Federal 90g smk had 8 of 10 shots inside 1" Number 8 landed 1" out of the group, right where my crosshairs were when I let it go, and shot 9 landed 1/8" low of the main group and pretty sure it was me. So far I am pleased, especially with almost everyone else having issues. I'll know more this spring when I can put more rounds through it.
6.8 is good enough for the DoD....a good intermediate round IMHO and 600 yards is the sweet-spot for most of us. (IOW can't hit shit past 500 yards anyway.)
I've said once and i will say it agian, Johnny your sir are my hero. Great info and outstanding for anyone who was on the fence about what caliber to go with. The Grendel all day and Twice on Sunday. Truly the most versatile cartridge for the AR15 platform. Love my 6.5G laod with the 130gr Berger AR Hybrid moving out at around 2500fps the Grendel is a great 1000-1300 yard round. Would love to see you get into the 3 big bore AR15 ( 50 Beowulf, 458 SoCom and 450 Bushmaster) rounds at some point. But whatever content you put out is always gold!!!
I had the same ejector-extractor slot impression problem with the .22 Nosler with the first few factory loads when it came out. I reckoned there was concentrated thrust pressure on the bolt face from ballooning out of the too-small-for-body-diameter rebated rim. I expected there would be no way to read over-pressure before blowing a primer in reloads. So I walked away. On the .224 Valkyrie loose primers: Check your bolt face to see if it shows tool-chatter radial cuts or convolutions radiating like spokes from the firing pin hole. This may indicate the bolt wasn't originally made as a 6.8/.224, but modified from a .223/5.56. On firing, examples I had caused brass distortion on the head mirroring the flaw, which might explain the oversized primer pockets. Resizing brass from the cheater bolts doesn't completely iron out the waves but perhaps opens the pockets.
Thank you for making this a separate video. I may not have watched one on the 22 Nosler or 224. They are not solid hits on my radar. I am working on a 223 Wylde, 300 Blackout and a 7.62x 39 builds and am really interested in the 6.5 Grendel, maybe next. And since I reload, your input on the brass issues really solidified my choices. Thanks again.
Love how you mentioned the backyard commando and “tactical” scam. So crazy how people buy the “cool factor” and will buy anything with a “tactical” stamp on it.
A great video Johnny, it really gets to the meat of what's the better caliber for the AR platform based upon needs. I really appreciate the detailed pros and cons concerning bullet weights and case longevity for the new offerings. Thank you.
Thank you for the great info. After watching I feel I made a good decision going with the 224 Valkyrie over the 22 nosler. And limiting the 223 to 77 grain. I have a bolt AR with 24" barrel 1-7 twist and plan on shooting 62gn to 77gn bullets. and shooting > 77gn in the 224 Valkyrie, also 24"barrel.
Love the Grendel. I'm getting 1/2 moa out of mine out to 400 yds with several different loads including my whitetail load that pushes a 105gr MKZ over 2700 fps. It's did a great job on Indiana whitetail this year.
I'm a little confused cause I'm shooting 120-140grn bullets out of my grendel how does 224 valkyrie with its 60-90grn 22 cal bullet on avg longer and heavier? Heavy for caliber ? U mean ? Sure...
From my understanding (which admittedly isn't a ton) 224 supposedly performs better at longer ranges than 223. 300 yards plus, it seems like a round for long target shooters.
I own a 20", 16", and 10.5" Grendel. Built the last two myself. Love the 6.5. Next build is going to be a 22 Grendel, just because I can. Heard it gets better results than the 224 Val, and isn't having the accuracy issues folks are seeing with the 224 Val. I never shoot my 5.56 or 7.62x39 anymore. The Grendel does it all well. Keep up the great work Johnny!
MattFrmSac - 20” Odin Works 1:8 twist. 416R Stainless, Rifle Length gas port, that came with Odin Works BCG and an adjustable low profile Gas block that I’ve set opened up 45% flow for Suppression and Using a load work up as follows: - 30.8 gr of BL-C (2), Hornady Brass trimmed to 1.511”, CCI 450 Magnum primer. The COAL utilizing the Hornady 123gr ELD came out to 2.260”. This combo yielded 5 rounds that created one hole group that measured 0.457” in diameter Actual Velocity: 2,451 fps SD: 14.6. Did this just today. I own (2) 300 AAC BLK (also thanks to Johnny) and ROCK RIVER “Operator” 5.56 NATO ARs. Love that Grendel! Optic is the Sig Sauer BDX 5-14X44 “Sierra 3” that pairs via blue tooth to a phone app and the “Kilo 1800 BDX” range finder and provides your fire solution electronically to your crosshairs and lights up the correct ballistic holdover mark inside the reticle, which takes all the guess work out and provides the perfect point of impact. Essentially, making you look like a Rock Star at the range as you smack bullseyes all day long!
MattFrmSac The 16" BHW barreled rifle is my do everything Grendel. I mostly use the 20" AA GDMR for longer range target and varmint shooting. The 10.5" BHW barreled pistol is my truck gun. I travel a lot to some pretty remote places, and a 10.5" Grendel will reach out to 300 yards with some decent energy. Don't feel under-gunned even though it is such a concealable weapon.
MattFrmSac Forgot to mention optics. I use a 4-14 IOR w/MP8 on the 20". Minox 1-8 on the 16". ACOG 1.5 w/ ACSS on the 10.5". Have an OSS Helix Ti, that I mount on the 16 and 10.5. My preference is to stick with an 18" or 16" barrel. Don't give up much, and easier and lighter to carry around.
We should add an addendum of listing the awesome cartridges of .223, of course we have the .300 blkout and the awesome 22TCM! I recently learned of .22TCM while shopping reviews of the new Ruger 5.7. This awesome little pistol cartridge based on the .223 case cut and re-necked to .22 fires a 40 grain round out of a 17 shot 1911 at 2100+ FPS! Basically nearly the same as the 5.7! This smokes .22WMR by 250 FPS and 100 FtLbs! (it has roughly 400ft lbs of energy!) I have just found my next pistol that can be reloaded for cheap! There are rifles made for this amazing little caliber also. I will even get over my disdain for the poor politics of Illinois,Rock River Arms Co.who makes them. I see 1000 rounds .22TCM loaded are 149.95 or 200 rounds loaded sell for 31.99! Also we can reload it ourselves cheap! Lee and Hornady make dies! How did I miss this .22TCP ? I nearly bought a crappy trigger, expensive ammo, and hard to reload 5.7 cal Ruger. The 2 calibers handguns are about the same price, but the savings will continue forever with .223 based .22TCM! As a bonus the Rock River Arms 1911 handguns also come with a free 9mm barrel and a decent trigger that can be made like glass! Something FN and Ruger will never have with the 5.7.
Your idea about how people should use the pictures on the company website to determine who you're going to buy a barrel from is great, Really spot on! Guess I've thought about that subconsciously, but never put it in those words. Definitely going to plagiarize the term.
Try blowing out the .223 case to a straight walled case to .355--.358 diameter bullet diameter that can be saboted back to use a .243 diameter bullet centered into the bore and check out the internal ballistics which will also gain a lot of external ballistics while still using near stock magazines. The stock formula is easy to find to predict how much better than the 30 caliber blackout
Johnny, I have just recently started with 6.5 Grendel, and it's your channel that I reference for most of my information on this clambering. The hardest thing about the Grendel is that it is not as popular as the Creedmore, but I didn't want to get into an AR10 rifle. Thank you for all of your videos on the Grendel. Very mild shooting cartridge, and as soon as I can get a supply of brass, I'm hoping to show a lot more reloading and shooting videos on my channel. Good stuff, sir
Spot on, 223/556 first... Now I understand what you were saying about the 22noz, and the 224v being different animals. thanks... the confusion over the 6.5g type 1 or 2 bolt face, along with the type 1 or 2 chamber/throat, (chaos), being all but over, seems like it's really a better choice. all that confusion didn't do the 6.5g any favors with peoples opinions. I like that I can buy cheap, bulk, Wolf ammo for the 6.5g for plinking while hand loading the good stuff for hunting and accuracy. not much different than the 223/556. excellent vid, thanks.
So my first ar15 was 556 bushmaster Carbon15, it has a pencil barrel with a 1/9twist and coasted 500 bucks. And it shoots better then expected. However i recently bought a 300 blackout with a 16inch barrel that have fallen in love with. So now i got me a silencer and a new saint spring field armory pistol in 300 black oht and i love it. I may be building a ar10 pistol soon
Johnny. I gotta give ya 2 thumbs up! I have been listening and watching your vids about 2 months now. Mostly at work on company computer 😵😵 anyhow you know your stuff and give a lot of great info. Thanks for your time amd effort.
Well- i pulled the trigger on a 24in 22nosler frm cmmg-could nt be happier! .6 groups all day from cool barrel. No brass problems- 52gr @3750 & 70gr nosler ammo @3150 ! 52s turn coyotes inside out! 70gr trophy drop hogs & javelina DRT !
To really make the right decision on what rifle calibers are the best choices for you is to be completely honest about what is it that you are going to used it for and want to accomplish . Know what is the maximum range you can shoot where you live , how often are you going to go out and shoot and be completely honest with yourself about your goal ( AND A SUPER IMPORTANT POINT IS TO MENTION HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ARE WILLING TO INVEST IN THIS PROJECTS) could be hunting, sports, plinking, self defense, etc. I own almost all the ar15 platform rifle calibers just missing a couple (I really don't think I'm going to get them [ shot them plentiful and if I own them they wouldn't be shot that often ].... I own all kinds of rifles ( new and old. Ww1 ww2 and present times, bolt action, long barrels , short ones. Ar10,,, in different calibers, etc.) I have shot almost all calibers available in the gun world. Accuracy is my passion , every shot counts.... pushing the limits and learning how to place a shot right where you want it or need it to hit is my SPECIFIC goal!!! Is fun to learn about ballistic performance and accuracy along with the new technology that is becoming available to own!!! also own quite a few pellet rifles and let me tell you that is quite a challenge to really understand the perfomance of these guns which by the way they are no toys, some of them are as expensive and deadly ( at 10 to 15 yards) as an ar15. AND JUST LIKE ANY GUN JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE EXPENSIVE DOESN'T MEAN THEY ARE GOING TO BE INCREDIBLY ACCURATE OUT OF THE BOX. And yes the ones that are not so expensive can be amazingly accurate as well. But u have to find the pellet that you barrel likes. MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL IS: UNDERSTANDING THAT IF YOU WANT TO BE CONSTANTLY HITTING ON TARGET U NEED TO FIND THE BULLET WEIGHT AND BRAND YOUR RIFLE LIKES. UNDERSTAND THAT A WELL PLACED SHOT HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE BEEN PRACTICING:AND UNDERSTANDING THAT YOU AND YOUR RIFLE BECOME ONE.... BREATHING , TRIGGER PULL, KNOWING HOW USE YOUR SCOPE (IF YOU USE ONE) OR IRON SIGHTS . AND UNDERSTANDING BALLISTICS AND HOW THE BULLETS THAT YOU CHOSE PERFORM IN YOUR RIFLE. there is lots and lots of talk about bullet performance out there.... realistically any caliber is potentially deadly for hunting. Shot placing is specially important, distance, etc. In reality the great majority of hunting kills happens between 30 to a 150 yards away from the shooter.
I think people buy into marketing to much. The 6.5X47 and 260 Remington were out before the 6.5 creedmoor but hornady marketed it well. If people already reload a bullet in a rifle cartridge they should just get an AR cartridge that uses the same or similar weight bullet. I agree that most target and hunting distances are limited to where the differences in most cartridges is negligible.
This video has got everyone talking in the comments. I love the 223/556 and thrive on pushing it out down range. I also shoot 308 the same way. Have always been curious about the middle ground between 223/?/308. The Grendel seems to be that cartridge, and will be a build for me in the future. Thanks Johnny for your videos, it would take me way longer with more expense to get where I need to be.
Yes I love the 6.5 grendel IV taken many white tail with it it shoots 1200yds it's cheaper than the other cartridges wolf makes ammo 230$for 1000 mine gun shoots 11/2 in groups with it. and u can get really good bullet selection from 90grn to 147grain and higher and it has exelent barrel life
I agree with your cartridge choice and Kentucky is a great state for nice deer. My age and CWD has put a damper on my hunting. Thanks and have a good one 👍
Great video! I own 5.56, 223 Wylde, 6.5Gr, and 300blk. My bases are covered. I won't be getting into 22 Nosler or 224 Valkyrie any time in the foreseeable future.
Case Dismissed Guaranteed god. You’re just like creedmoor fanboys and you have no clue wtf you’re talking about. As stated in other comments you’re blasting on about the creedmoor, the creed is NOT an AR15 cartridge. It’s an AR10 cartridge. Completely different.
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 you are so dumb... why not just talk about how great .50 BMG is while youre at it... except unless you are getting a single shot AR-50bmg... then you arent fitting that in an AR-15 magazine.
Sadly I can’t have a AR15 because I live in Canada but I have a tikka t3x in 223 and it’s a ton of fun for coyotes and prairie dogs. I love the 223 it’s a good price with decent ballistics.
The 350 Legend is a purpose built cartridge to answer hunting regulations in certain regions. It does that very well. My personal issue with it is because it uses 355 diameter bullets while the common diameter for 35 caliber is 358. The cartridge is limited on bullet choice right out of the gate. Somebody wasn't thinking beyond the blueprints.
For the first time ever I've thought I might like to pick up an AR-15 (not a knock, just haven't picked up shooting with a carbine is all): Alexander Arms 6.5 Grendel Hunter. Dunno, the 6.5 Grendel Hunter from Alexander Arms has caught my attention, and I'm somewhat fascinated with the Grendel round that can turn an 18" barrel rifle into a 1000-yard shooter. I'm a complete novice mind you, but it seems there's something to a round that stays supersonic at 1,200-ish yards I think it is. Anyway, thanks for the vid.
Can't beat the 6.5 grendel I love mine IV taken many white tail with it bullet selection is great and wolf ammo is only 230$ for 1000rds. Plus 1200yd range can't beat it
Here is some facts about 22 Nosler for you. It is a pressure derated cartridge in the AR due to the fact that it has increased bolt thrust since the cartridge base diameter is larger than the rim diameter (rebated rim). Therefore a 55000 PSI load has more bolt thrust as a 60000 PSI 5.56. If anyone loads the cartridge until they see primer flattening or ejector swipes, they are producing close to 63000 PSI. That is a major overload, and getting to the point of failure. For 5.56 take the area of the rim and multiply by the pressure, and you will get the force on the bolt. I.E. 60000 PSI x .11222 base square inches = 6733 # of force on the bolt. For 22 Nosler, you have to factor the difference between the rim area and the base area. I.E. 55000 PSI x .13987 base square inches at the base = 7692 # of force that is squeezed onto a .11222 square inch bolt/rim face. That makes the equivalent force .13987 / .11222 x 7692# = 9587#. Now you understand why 22 Nosler mangles case rims. I invite you to read this. "thereloadersnetwork.com/2018/12/29/ar-15-reloading-do-not-let-this-happen-to-you/"
Definitely rethinking my 224 valk build. Dumped a lot of money for not much return. I don't have the stability issues some have with the 90 gr pills, but brass life is a severe concern. If that gets figured out I'd be happy, but right now it's not looking too good.
The most insightful group on how to reload the Valkyrie is the Facebook group Valkyrie Ascending focused on reloading this cartridge since it came out there is over 2+ years ago with tons of knowledge in the group.. facebook.com/groups/398943407218038/
I found this fascinating and I don't even shoot rifles, and certainly don't re-load. Learnt a lot in this one video. One thing that perplexes me is that for YEARS I thought .223 and 5.56 were the exact same thing - just one expressed in inches (civilian) and the other metric (military). But recently I discovered that there are differences, like 5.56 slightly more powerful. Maybe Johnny has a video on this.
Honestly, when it comes to the AR 15, I think Grendle and 5.56 are all you need to know. One should be a lightweight 16" carbine for SHTF and one should be a 20" rifle built to be as accurate as possible for hunting and ringing steel targets out to obscene distances.
I handload my .22 Nosler rounds and I use Nosler brass. After several reloads, not a single problem with the brass, and the performance is stunning. Granted it's not the cheap make-a-buck brass case that the market seems to be flooded with these days, but then, you get what you pay for.
As usual a great video Johnny thanks for all the information! I have built both, a great shooting 223 with a 16 inch Wyld barrel, and a great shooting 18 inch Grendel. So glad that I didn't jump on the 224 Valkyrie or 22 Nosler band wagon. I love reloading and buying cases all the time can get expensive. I also got an 18 inch 300 Ham"r barrel from Wilson Combat and love shooting a 30 caliber with ballistic comparison to a proven 30/30 cartridge, like a 300 Blackout on steroids just no sub sonic loads, but I have my 300 Blackouts for that.
Get it it out performs all other ar15 cartridges bullet selection is huge and ammo is cheap wolf makes 100grn fmj 6.5 grendel for 230$ for 1000rds. and my gun shoots 11/2 in with it. 350 for 1000 in privi partisan 120grn brass cased hp, or wold gold 120grn brass cased hp. Plus 1200yrd max range
I also really like the 300 blk for the shorter barrel length that allows a much handier lighter and smaller rifle for an easy carrying option in the field and for hd. I know this was about bullets and cartridges but just wanted to add the other benefits for that round besides the sub sonic suppressed factor.
To newer guys like myself he is 100% correct about .223/5.56 about being accurate. Bought a Sig tread removed the handgaurd and barrell almost immediately. Put a 24" H-Bar and went sub moa almost right away. Best group was .64moa @ 200 yards. Unfortunately havent been to a range over 200.
i like shooting the heavier .224Val for varmints and medium to large game also have hunted with my 125gr 7.62x39 on hogs at 150 to 250yrds.i also have two M4s in different twists with 1-7 and 1-9 twist rates and have a lot of fun with those.I 5think u sold me on a 6.5Grendel! LOL thats my next AR i want one in every caliber lol. Then ill start on AR 10s lol my wife was wonder i bought a 14gun gun cabinet....At the time my long guns were spread around my den in gun socks.I filled it 1/2 way when i finally put them in it!LOL and im still going strong i just added the 76.2x39 and havnt even had a chance to shoot it yet? lol great video keep it up bro!
Johnny, will you ever be doing a test or review on the new 350 Legend? Thanks sincerely for all you do for us guys & gals. I own both .300 BO and 6.5 Grendel uppers solely for the fun of developing accurate loads, but have interest in all AR 15 calibers. My major interest is in old/older cartridges and firearms Re: .22 K Hornet, .222 Rem Mag., .45 Colt, 6.5 X 55 Swede, 7mm Mauser, 8mm Nambu, .300 Savage, ad nauseum. I doubt the 350 Legend will last very long in the marketplace, but reloaders should be able to feed their guns forever. Tip...buy your brass soon and put it away!
I've built two 5.56's and one .300 BLK. My next two builds I've decided to go wildcat. First will be the .357 AR and the second will be a .277 Wolverine. Both use .223 brass, so no different BCG needed.
I have shot 223/556, 300blk, 350 legend and 450 bushmaster. Just built a grendel but need to get it tested at the range. I have a good feeling it will perform great. The 350 legend gave me problems (failure to feed) it was kind of a let down;( Will figure the problem out later! Thanks for your great video 👍
I love my Rock River AR15 .223 wylde .25" 100 yds three round groups out of the box. Full disclosure they were my own personal handloads. Oh yea great video first time watcher
The Grendel is the best caliber for the AR platform!!! As soon as you get past 300m it really shines. Inside of 300m, hard to beat 55g 556. After 300m, the 6.5 Grendel is the shit!!!
Grendel for me based on its great versatility. I load Hornady 100 gr. ELD-Ms on the light end and 123 gr. ELD-Ms on the heavier end, and a few in between. Currently playing with Sierra 107 gr. TMKs.
Liquidmetal I love my Grendel’s because I can shoot from 85gr bullets up to 156gr and everything in between with great accuracy from almost all, nothing says boom coyote than an 85gr bullet going 3000+fps!
@@joshualance6005 Let me guess, you looked at a ballistics chart to determine that it is a better round. There is much more to bullet performance than simply ballistic coefficient.
Some Hunters maybe bound by Law.. Where I live we have to use minimum 6.5mm Caliber with at least 2000J of Energy at 100m on Hogs. I choose the Grendel.
The Grendel is, so far, the cartridge that delivers the most energy to the longest range in the AR 15 platform. It manages to do this at fairly mild pressures and velocities. Very good balance between resources and capabilities.
Good stuff as always. I enjoyed the comparison. I agree that is all depends on what you want to do. I think they all have their place in the lineup somewhere. I am shooting and reloading for the .224 Valkyrie. Also agree with the brass life issue, hoping at some point that will get sorted out. Only time will tell.
I caught an old timer's opinion of the Valkyrie, and he was stating the angle of the shoulder focused the blast directly on the chamber walls causing rapid erosion. Other than that I can't say. For an intermediate shooter it wouldn't be an issue. If you shoot 10,000 rounds a year it might be an issue.
The Grendel is the way to go. Especially as long as we can still get the cheap import Russian ammo. I know this is a reloading channel but sometimes it's just fun to go out with some friends and blast away for an afternoon
I have pretty much ruled out 22Nosler due to its querks. And I already have a 223 and 224. I would love to see you create two videos. The first taking a given light bullet like the bobs bullets, or 60gr nosler, or 50gr v-max, and develope the best possible 223 load. And develope the best possible 224 load. Then compare velocities, sd, es, and accuracy. The second video would be the same thing but on the heavy end. I have never loaded heavy bullets in 223 so I'm not sure where the max falls. But potentially 68gr matchking/gamechanger, 72/75/77/88 hornady eld, 82.5 berger, etc. Would that be something you would consider?
Yano i have always purchased Faxon for barrels or in a pintch ill hit Ballistic Advantage? But i am just getting into long range shooting and thinking about competitions? I live in a very flat open state so i need range that can still humainly do the job at distance. So for both my 224Val and 6.5Gren i have 20" barrels on. I also have a 5.56 with a 20" as well as a few with 16: barrels in 5.56 as i love the M4 fixed front sight post carbines! I only have a couple of fixed M4's and both shoot great! one is a run of the mill Del-Ton sport gen2 and the other a bit higher up the food chain yet not crazy expensive a Stag Minimalist. Both shoot just as well as my all Aero Precision i finally built my self although it is a free floated barrel. All of my other AR's no matter the caliber are 16" carbines ,sadly. Although i just purchased a complete Lr/AR-10 upper and have just got all the parts in for the lower and its all on my storage cabinet! I have decided to clear out my work table in the garage and plan to finish it up and put it together next weekend? It's a .308 with a 20" barrel only because, I couldnt find a longer one any where else? LOL I would like a 24" barrel with a 17" forend! lthough when we get into these lengths the pressure put on the hand guards whether its a bi-pod or a stump in the field will effect your shooting. Personally i have found if i want to take a deer or elk i will go to my bolt guns. If its hogs or medium to smaller game the ARs are just fine. I have a nice 350Legend and a 458Socom if i need to take out a bear or larger hogs. the 224Val and 6.5Gren work best for me here. Although i have not built my 6.8SPC yet? lol i wonder do you have a video on 6.8SPC? hehe this one was great ,thanks
6.5 Grendel. Approximates 6.5x55 ballistics (at least with lighter projectiles) doesn't burn brass or barrels, and is pretty economical to reload. 5.56 . Effective within 300 meters or so, again, economical to reload. Ammo is light. I'm my opinion, those are the 2 most useful chamberings for the AR 15. Also, not difficult to work up loads that can do < 1MOA.
after checking my needs (which mostly consist of hunting rabbits), I have no choice but to go with .50 BMG.
Might have a issue with hitting the vitals.
Leave your skinning knife at home!
you mean "wabbits."
LMAO 🤣 🤣 🤣
@@bmstylee u funny
"Guys in funny jackets, shooting groups to win matches." Words of wisdom
A few years ago, a friend let me bust a few rounds from his AR in 6.5 Grendel (6.7 actual!).
It was love at first ring of the steel for me! 5 for 5 at 500 yards! The more research I did into this cartridge, the more I had to have one.
I chose a 20" HBAR, as Grendel likes a longer barrel. NO REGRETS!!!
With Grendel, I feel the AR has finally grown up. A true Rifle with the capability to reach out several hundred yards. And with less than half the recoil of a .308! Grendel is now my GO TO platform.
Im probably the only person here, but i shoot the 6.5 Grendel in a bolt action rifle. And i really love the cartridge. Huge performance in such a small good looking package. Plus no recoil. Im a bolt gun fanatic.
Absolutely nothing wrong with a bolt action rifle. Rock what you got. 2A 👍
I seen this same comment on a nutnfancy video.. Hmm..
Where did you find that? I own an AR15 but I enjoy shooting bolt guns more. I'm an odd duck myself. I want a 223 bolt gun.
@@bmstylee howa 1500
I just got a howa 1500 in .300 blk out for suppressor use when I get approved. On month 5 right now. Ive been eyeing another in either 6.5 grendel or 7.62x39. I love those mini action howas.
One of the best thought out and information backed cartridge/ reloading video's I have ever seen. Your knowledge coupled with experience+time+testing=trustworthy, dependable, and knowledgeable data. A formula rarely found on RUclips. Your channel will be shared with many. Thank you for your dedication and time invested in these video's.
Your mock ups really helped illustrate your points, thanks for sharing
6.5 Grendel!
Took me about 400 rounds to figure out the 224 Valkyrie. I really like the way it shoots, but I only shoot steel and paper with it so far. Settled on the 88 ELD and RL-19. The secret for me was overall length. Once I loaded to magazine length, the groups shrank to sub MOA. Built a 6.8 SPC 16" light barrel and love it. Way more energy for Hogs and Deer over the 223. And yes, I have shot and killed deer with the .223 Wylde, but I shoot 70 gr Barnes bullets and they do a very nice job on deer and hogs here in Texas. I am building a light barreled 6.5 Grendel this weekend and expect good things from it as well. I finally got on the AR band wagon a few years back and now I am fully bought in. I have set up all my AR's essentially the same to accept the clip on night vision as well. Very little recoil, magazine fed, reliable...all are great guns to take in the woods or punch holes and ring steel. Johnny's channel has also inspired me to hand load for all my rifles.
I knew I made the right choice on my Grendel.
6.5 grendel can kiss my grendel
Yes....yes you did. Tell me more...
@venom snake 6.5 Grendel is for those whom are transported about within a short bus - fact
The AR platform is an engineering marvel. I do not care for it. I won't own one. My 6.5 Grendel began life as a Mini-30. It is easily a better rifle than a 6.5 Grendel AR. If I were going to own a .224 Valkyrie. I disagree with your proclamation that owning a .223. I don't really see a use for .223/5.56. The 6.5 Grendel is best for me since I have 2 excellent 6.5x55 SE Mausers.
@@magicdaveable why do you think a 6.5 grendel in a mini 30 platform is better than the ar platform ? Just curious
Really enjoy the deep discussions like this. It makes you think.
My 3 best AR15 cartridges: .300BO, 6.5G, and .458 SOCOM. With careful shopping you can have them all for a grand. A single, reliable acting lower, and no lack of compromise if unlawfully confronted. And the .458 can be subbed as well. I'm avoiding the 223/556 due to potential chambering issues with the BO. So, one becomes three. Subtle to devastating. Minimal spare parts requirement. :-)
It's only been a little over a year, but remaking/updating this video might make sense. Your suggestion for folks to first get a well functioning 223 rifle is excellent. We know there are hundreds of thousands of first time gun buyers who just bought a decent 223, but they want to know what else they can do with it. Buying a quality upper for varminting (22 Nosler) or deer hunting (6.5 Grendel) or long range precision (6mm ARC) is very appealing for folks with limited budgets. An expanded comparison with Hornady 6mm ARC and 300 Blackout would be very helpful. I notice you've been gone for 5 months now, I hope everything is good with you and your family. Take care,
Great point of view and summary from previous experience. Watching your 22 Nosler, 224 Val, and 6.5 Grendel videos my pick of the three is leaning towards 6.5 Grendel for the next upper. This video also gave me a lot to consider when deciding which cartridge to pick, other than 308, in a large frame AR. 260 Rem, 6.5 Creed, and 7mm-08 are in mind. More and more it seems like the mindset needs to be pick what bullet you want to shoot first and for what purpose then pick the cartridge best suited to shoot it.
I've been reloading since '86 and I love your technical analysis of reloading... I'm still learning new stuff!
Johnny, that was some outstanding information. Your like a walking encyclopedia. Very knowledgeable. Thanks for caring and sharing......
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 isn't he talking about funny looking sponsored jackets that people wear at shooting competitions, not the military? Secondly, how is he making fun of the funny looking jackets, when he clearly said those are the guys to get info from?
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 Your response is totally inappropriate. You sound like a a hateful lefty. You have the right not to participate.
I'm looking at a 6.5 grendel. Washington state doesn't allow hunting with a 5.56, .22 nozler or the .224 valkary. So looking to replace my 5.56 with a general purpose rifle I can hunt with and be a defense rifle. 6.5 meets this.
6.5 Grendel would be great for hunting but I would still stay with your 556 upper and get some good factory rounds that expand well. I think the 6.5 Grendel is great for long range over 556 but steel core 556 would be a great self defense round. I know a guy that was in the military and the green tip could go through a Humvee windshield and a standard 7.62x39 round wouldn't.
If 6.5 meets your requirements for a hunting rifle, go with that. I'm sure it will still work just fine, as long as you don't have any neighbors right beside your walls.
6.5 is e xelent for hunting I use mine more than any other rifle plus it out performs 556 in every single way. Ps u can find good defence ammo that won't over penetrate like Underwood controlled chaos
@@yolo-qr2fq na u can get bullets for 6.5 that won't over penetrate like hornady A max or Underwood controlled chaos
@william terry Not in his, as all 22s are illegal to hunt with.
For the money it's hard to beat Faxon barrels but I also like Ballistic Advantage. Thanks Johnny!👍👊🇺🇸🇺🇸
6.5 Grendel all the way
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 Is that not an AR10?
Lol!!! Open mouth, insert foot!
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 The best part of your stupidity was that you needed to edit also .
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 the M5e1 uppers are for the ar10 sized rifles, not ar15.
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 First off, Creedmore is a short action cartridge while the Ar-15 can only accept mini action cartridges. So Creedmore doesen't apply here. Sevond, in a short action rifle 6.5 PRC blows 6.5 Creedmore out of the water in every way possible. So in reality 6.5 Creedmore actualy wins nothing.
I use starline in 224 Valkyrie and I have not had any problems with the primer pockets.. although I did when I started this cartridge o 5 moths ago but now no issues at all.. great fun...
The most insightful group on how to reload the Valkyrie is the Facebook group Valkyrie Ascending focused on reloading this cartridge since it came out there is over 2+ years ago with tons of knowledge in the group.. facebook.com/groups/398943407218038/
One of my favorite channels hands down. Great job putting out some great info for the shooting community!!!
Just finished my .224 Valkyrie build with a Wilson Combat 20" barrel with 1-6.5" twist, and first 10 shot group with factory Federal 90g smk had 8 of 10 shots inside 1"
Number 8 landed 1" out of the group, right where my crosshairs were when I let it go, and shot 9 landed 1/8" low of the main group and pretty sure it was me.
So far I am pleased, especially with almost everyone else having issues. I'll know more this spring when I can put more rounds through it.
How about 6.8 SPC? Works great on this platform and is a great hunting round. It's supersonic out to about 600 yds. and ballistics are pretty good!
6.8 is good enough for the DoD....a good intermediate round IMHO and 600 yards is the sweet-spot for most of us. (IOW can't hit shit past 500 yards anyway.)
@@amramhakohen7474 not the same 6.8 at all.
I heard the 6.5 Grendel is supersonic at 1000 yards.
@@kimrandall8135 Going to try to shoot deer or hogs at 1000yds?
I've said once and i will say it agian, Johnny your sir are my hero. Great info and outstanding for anyone who was on the fence about what caliber to go with. The Grendel all day and Twice on Sunday. Truly the most versatile cartridge for the AR15 platform. Love my 6.5G laod with the 130gr Berger AR Hybrid moving out at around 2500fps the Grendel is a great 1000-1300 yard round.
Would love to see you get into the 3 big bore AR15 ( 50 Beowulf, 458 SoCom and 450 Bushmaster) rounds at some point.
But whatever content you put out is always gold!!!
I had the same ejector-extractor slot impression problem with the .22 Nosler with the first few factory loads when it came out. I reckoned there was concentrated thrust pressure on the bolt face from ballooning out of the too-small-for-body-diameter rebated rim. I expected there would be no way to read over-pressure before blowing a primer in reloads. So I walked away.
On the .224 Valkyrie loose primers: Check your bolt face to see if it shows tool-chatter radial cuts or convolutions radiating like spokes from the firing pin hole. This may indicate the bolt wasn't originally made as a 6.8/.224, but modified from a .223/5.56. On firing, examples I had caused brass distortion on the head mirroring the flaw, which might explain the oversized primer pockets. Resizing brass from the cheater bolts doesn't completely iron out the waves but perhaps opens the pockets.
Thank you for making this a separate video. I may not have watched one on the 22 Nosler or 224. They are not solid hits on my radar. I am working on a 223 Wylde, 300 Blackout and a 7.62x 39 builds and am really interested in the 6.5 Grendel, maybe next. And since I reload, your input on the brass issues really solidified my choices. Thanks again.
Get the 6.5 can't beat it especially with cheap ammo like wolf and wolf gold. Really good bullet selection. And 1200yd range
Love how you mentioned the backyard commando and “tactical” scam. So crazy how people buy the “cool factor” and will buy anything with a “tactical” stamp on it.
A great video Johnny, it really gets to the meat of what's the better caliber for the AR platform based upon needs. I really appreciate the detailed pros and cons concerning bullet weights and case longevity for the new offerings. Thank you.
Thank you for the great info. After watching I feel I made a good decision going with the 224 Valkyrie over the 22 nosler. And limiting the 223 to 77 grain. I have a bolt AR with 24" barrel 1-7 twist and plan on shooting 62gn to 77gn bullets. and shooting > 77gn in the 224 Valkyrie, also 24"barrel.
My next upper will be in 6.5 Grendel, but love shooting the 223 and Johnny’s 223 videos are the best
Love the Grendel. I'm getting 1/2 moa out of mine out to 400 yds with several different loads including my whitetail load that pushes a 105gr MKZ over 2700 fps. It's did a great job on Indiana whitetail this year.
Love my Grendel! But I still have a lot of good shooting with .223/5.56. Do not see a practical need for 22 nosler and 224 valkyrie.
MOAR POWAR
224 valkyrie uses longer, heavier, higher bc bullets
Grendel is where i would go also besides the "normal" 223/308 :)
I'm a little confused cause I'm shooting 120-140grn bullets out of my grendel how does 224 valkyrie with its 60-90grn 22 cal bullet on avg longer and heavier? Heavy for caliber ? U mean ? Sure...
From my understanding (which admittedly isn't a ton) 224 supposedly performs better at longer ranges than 223. 300 yards plus, it seems like a round for long target shooters.
I own a 20", 16", and 10.5" Grendel. Built the last two myself. Love the 6.5. Next build is going to be a 22 Grendel, just because I can. Heard it gets better results than the 224 Val, and isn't having the accuracy issues folks are seeing with the 224 Val. I never shoot my 5.56 or 7.62x39 anymore. The Grendel does it all well. Keep up the great work Johnny!
I'm REALLY wanting to do a 6.5 Grendel build this year, but I'm torn on the barrel length and profile. Any recommendations?
MattFrmSac - 20” Odin Works 1:8 twist. 416R Stainless, Rifle Length gas port, that came with Odin Works BCG and an adjustable low profile Gas block that I’ve set opened up 45% flow for Suppression and Using a load work up as follows:
- 30.8 gr of BL-C (2), Hornady Brass trimmed to 1.511”, CCI 450 Magnum primer. The COAL utilizing the Hornady 123gr ELD came out to 2.260”.
This combo yielded 5 rounds that created one hole group that measured 0.457” in diameter
Actual Velocity: 2,451 fps SD: 14.6. Did this just today. I own (2) 300 AAC BLK (also thanks to Johnny) and ROCK RIVER “Operator” 5.56 NATO ARs.
Love that Grendel! Optic is the Sig Sauer BDX 5-14X44 “Sierra 3” that pairs via blue tooth to a phone app and the “Kilo 1800 BDX” range finder and provides your fire solution electronically to your crosshairs and lights up the correct ballistic holdover mark inside the reticle, which takes all the guess work out and provides the perfect point of impact. Essentially, making you look like a Rock Star at the range as you smack bullseyes all day long!
MattFrmSac The 16" BHW barreled rifle is my do everything Grendel. I mostly use the 20" AA GDMR for longer range target and varmint shooting. The 10.5" BHW barreled pistol is my truck gun. I travel a lot to some pretty remote places, and a 10.5" Grendel will reach out to 300 yards with some decent energy. Don't feel under-gunned even though it is such a concealable weapon.
MattFrmSac Forgot to mention optics. I use a 4-14 IOR w/MP8 on the 20". Minox 1-8 on the 16". ACOG 1.5 w/ ACSS on the 10.5". Have an OSS Helix Ti, that I mount on the 16 and 10.5. My preference is to stick with an 18" or 16" barrel. Don't give up much, and easier and lighter to carry around.
6.5 Creedmoor will not fit in the AR15 platform, which is what this video is about.
We should add an addendum of listing the awesome cartridges of .223, of course we have the .300 blkout and the awesome 22TCM! I recently learned of .22TCM while shopping reviews of the new Ruger 5.7. This awesome little pistol cartridge based on the .223 case cut and re-necked to .22 fires a 40 grain round out of a 17 shot 1911 at 2100+ FPS! Basically nearly the same as the 5.7! This smokes .22WMR by 250 FPS and 100 FtLbs! (it has roughly 400ft lbs of energy!) I have just found my next pistol that can be reloaded for cheap! There are rifles made for this amazing little caliber also. I will even get over my disdain for the poor politics of Illinois,Rock River Arms Co.who makes them. I see 1000 rounds .22TCM loaded are 149.95 or 200 rounds loaded sell for 31.99! Also we can reload it ourselves cheap! Lee and Hornady make dies! How did I miss this .22TCP ? I nearly bought a crappy trigger, expensive ammo, and hard to reload 5.7 cal Ruger. The 2 calibers handguns are about the same price, but the savings will continue forever with .223 based .22TCM! As a bonus the Rock River Arms 1911 handguns also come with a free 9mm barrel and a decent trigger that can be made like glass! Something FN and Ruger will never have with the 5.7.
I have hunted Elk and Deer with my Grendel,a great round,with long range ability.
Your idea about how people should use the pictures on the company website to determine who you're going to buy a barrel from is great, Really spot on! Guess I've thought about that subconsciously, but never put it in those words. Definitely going to plagiarize the term.
Try blowing out the .223 case to a straight walled case to .355--.358 diameter bullet diameter that can be saboted back to use a .243 diameter bullet centered into the bore and check out the internal ballistics which will also gain a lot of external ballistics while still using near stock magazines. The stock formula is easy to find to predict how much better than the 30 caliber blackout
Johnny, I have just recently started with 6.5 Grendel, and it's your channel that I reference for most of my information on this clambering. The hardest thing about the Grendel is that it is not as popular as the Creedmore, but I didn't want to get into an AR10 rifle. Thank you for all of your videos on the Grendel. Very mild shooting cartridge, and as soon as I can get a supply of brass, I'm hoping to show a lot more reloading and shooting videos on my channel. Good stuff, sir
Spot on, 223/556 first... Now I understand what you were saying about the 22noz, and the 224v being different animals. thanks... the confusion over the 6.5g type 1 or 2 bolt face, along with the type 1 or 2 chamber/throat, (chaos), being all but over, seems like it's really a better choice. all that confusion didn't do the 6.5g any favors with peoples opinions. I like that I can buy cheap, bulk, Wolf ammo for the 6.5g for plinking while hand loading the good stuff for hunting and accuracy. not much different than the 223/556. excellent vid, thanks.
6.5 out performs 224 valkyrie in energy weight and bullet selection and ammo is cheaper 6.5 is better than 556 in every way possible
@JRB do an update video to this now that you have a 6 ARC to add to the mix. Thanks.
So my first ar15 was 556 bushmaster Carbon15, it has a pencil barrel with a 1/9twist and coasted 500 bucks. And it shoots better then expected. However i recently bought a 300 blackout with a 16inch barrel that have fallen in love with. So now i got me a silencer and a new saint spring field armory pistol in 300 black oht and i love it. I may be building a ar10 pistol soon
Johnny. I gotta give ya 2 thumbs up! I have been listening and watching your vids about 2 months now. Mostly at work on company computer 😵😵 anyhow you know your stuff and give a lot of great info. Thanks for your time amd effort.
I really recommend this guys mentality when looking for different rifle caliber modular rifles to choose from.
Well- i pulled the trigger on a 24in 22nosler frm cmmg-could nt be happier! .6 groups all day from cool barrel. No brass problems- 52gr @3750 & 70gr nosler ammo @3150 ! 52s turn coyotes inside out! 70gr trophy drop hogs & javelina DRT !
To really make the right decision on what rifle calibers are the best choices for you is to be completely honest about what is it that you are going to used it for and want to accomplish . Know what is the maximum range you can shoot where you live , how often are you going to go out and shoot and be completely honest with yourself about your goal ( AND A SUPER IMPORTANT POINT IS TO MENTION HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ARE WILLING TO INVEST IN THIS PROJECTS)
could be hunting, sports, plinking, self defense, etc.
I own almost all the ar15 platform rifle calibers just missing a couple (I really don't think I'm going to get them [ shot them plentiful and if I own them they wouldn't be shot that often ]....
I own all kinds of rifles ( new and old. Ww1 ww2 and present times, bolt action, long barrels , short ones. Ar10,,, in different calibers, etc.) I have shot almost all calibers available in the gun world.
Accuracy is my passion , every shot counts.... pushing the limits and learning how to place a shot right where you want it or need it to hit is my SPECIFIC goal!!!
Is fun to learn about ballistic performance and accuracy along with the new technology that is becoming available to own!!!
also own quite a few pellet rifles and let me tell you that is quite a challenge to really understand the perfomance of these guns which by the way they are no toys, some of them are as expensive and deadly ( at 10 to 15 yards) as an ar15.
AND JUST LIKE ANY GUN JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE EXPENSIVE DOESN'T MEAN THEY ARE GOING TO BE INCREDIBLY ACCURATE OUT OF THE BOX. And yes the ones that are not so expensive can be amazingly accurate as well. But u have to find the pellet that you barrel likes.
MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL IS:
UNDERSTANDING THAT IF YOU WANT TO BE CONSTANTLY HITTING ON TARGET U NEED TO FIND THE BULLET WEIGHT AND BRAND YOUR RIFLE LIKES.
UNDERSTAND THAT A WELL PLACED SHOT HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE BEEN PRACTICING:AND UNDERSTANDING THAT YOU AND YOUR RIFLE BECOME ONE.... BREATHING , TRIGGER PULL, KNOWING HOW USE YOUR SCOPE (IF YOU USE ONE) OR IRON SIGHTS . AND UNDERSTANDING BALLISTICS AND HOW THE BULLETS THAT YOU CHOSE PERFORM IN YOUR RIFLE.
there is lots and lots of talk about bullet performance out there.... realistically any caliber is potentially deadly for hunting.
Shot placing is specially important, distance, etc.
In reality the great majority of hunting kills happens between 30
to a 150 yards away from the shooter.
I think people buy into marketing to much. The 6.5X47 and 260 Remington were out before the 6.5 creedmoor but hornady marketed it well. If people already reload a bullet in a rifle cartridge they should just get an AR cartridge that uses the same or similar weight bullet. I agree that most target and hunting distances are limited to where the differences in most cartridges is negligible.
This video has got everyone talking in the comments. I love the 223/556 and thrive on pushing it out down range. I also shoot 308 the same way. Have always been curious about the middle ground between 223/?/308. The Grendel seems to be that cartridge, and will be a build for me in the future. Thanks Johnny for your videos, it would take me way longer with more expense to get where I need to be.
Yes I love the 6.5 grendel IV taken many white tail with it it shoots 1200yds it's cheaper than the other cartridges wolf makes ammo 230$for 1000 mine gun shoots 11/2 in groups with it. and u can get really good bullet selection from 90grn to 147grain and higher and it has exelent barrel life
I agree with your cartridge choice and Kentucky is a great state for nice deer. My age and CWD has put a damper on my hunting. Thanks and have a good one 👍
Great video! I own 5.56, 223 Wylde, 6.5Gr, and 300blk. My bases are covered. I won't be getting into 22 Nosler or 224 Valkyrie any time in the foreseeable future.
Case Dismissed Guaranteed god. You’re just like creedmoor fanboys and you have no clue wtf you’re talking about. As stated in other comments you’re blasting on about the creedmoor, the creed is NOT an AR15 cartridge. It’s an AR10 cartridge. Completely different.
soilrulz13 well he got blocked
@@casedismissedguaranteed49 you are so dumb... why not just talk about how great .50 BMG is while youre at it... except unless you are getting a single shot AR-50bmg... then you arent fitting that in an AR-15 magazine.
Awesome advice in the beginning about getting a good .223 barrel that shoots small groups.
I love my 300 blackout. I also have a 6.8 AR. If it was not so expensive to shoot. Awesome and accurate.
Great no nonsense, right to the point video. Absolutely fantastic
Sadly I can’t have a AR15 because I live in Canada but I have a tikka t3x in 223 and it’s a ton of fun for coyotes and prairie dogs. I love the 223 it’s a good price with decent ballistics.
Love the 6.5G. The 300blkout is fun to. But now we have the 350 Legend to check out soon and see where that fits in.
The 350 Legend is a purpose built cartridge to answer hunting regulations in certain regions. It does that very well. My personal issue with it is because it uses 355 diameter bullets while the common diameter for 35 caliber is 358. The cartridge is limited on bullet choice right out of the gate. Somebody wasn't thinking beyond the blueprints.
@@kirkboswell2575 Yeah I came to the same conclusion.
THE BEST cartridge comparison EVER!
It IS pretty legit
Great video with excellent information ! Thanks for sharing !
I put together a ar recently and have been nothing but happy with it, seems to shoot good regardless of the bullet weight i load for it!
For the first time ever I've thought I might like to pick up an AR-15 (not a knock, just haven't picked up shooting with a carbine is all): Alexander Arms 6.5 Grendel Hunter.
Dunno, the 6.5 Grendel Hunter from Alexander Arms has caught my attention, and I'm somewhat fascinated with the Grendel round that can turn an 18" barrel rifle into a 1000-yard shooter.
I'm a complete novice mind you, but it seems there's something to a round that stays supersonic at 1,200-ish yards I think it is.
Anyway, thanks for the vid.
Love the video! I would like to also say that I've had really good luck with Faxon barrels. They are reasonably priced as well.
Agreed. They are legit. Buttoned barrels are top notch
You've made up my mind. My next upper is gonna be 6.5 Grendel . Thanks
Can't beat the 6.5 grendel I love mine IV taken many white tail with it bullet selection is great and wolf ammo is only 230$ for 1000rds. Plus 1200yd range can't beat it
Oh dear, not another one
You didn’t mention 6.8SPC, the round I use for Wisconsin Whitetail. I have found it is deadly on a deer. Usually DRT.
The 6.5 Grendel and 300Blackout are my favorites.
👎🏼
458 socom with the 325gr Hornady FTX. In WI we rarely shoot over 50 yards.
I always learn something on Johnny’s channel. Great videos!
Here is some facts about 22 Nosler for you. It is a pressure derated cartridge in the AR due to the fact that it has increased bolt thrust since the cartridge base diameter is larger than the rim diameter (rebated rim). Therefore a 55000 PSI load has more bolt thrust as a 60000 PSI 5.56. If anyone loads the cartridge until they see primer flattening or ejector swipes, they are producing close to 63000 PSI. That is a major overload, and getting to the point of failure. For 5.56 take the area of the rim and multiply by the pressure, and you will get the force on the bolt. I.E. 60000 PSI x .11222 base square inches = 6733 # of force on the bolt. For 22 Nosler, you have to factor the difference between the rim area and the base area. I.E. 55000 PSI x .13987 base square inches at the base = 7692 # of force that is squeezed onto a .11222 square inch bolt/rim face. That makes the equivalent force .13987 / .11222 x 7692# = 9587#. Now you understand why 22 Nosler mangles case rims. I invite you to read this. "thereloadersnetwork.com/2018/12/29/ar-15-reloading-do-not-let-this-happen-to-you/"
That's why I like 6.5 grendel lower pressure better barrel life
Definitely rethinking my 224 valk build. Dumped a lot of money for not much return. I don't have the stability issues some have with the 90 gr pills, but brass life is a severe concern. If that gets figured out I'd be happy, but right now it's not looking too good.
The most insightful group on how to reload the Valkyrie is the Facebook group Valkyrie Ascending focused on reloading this cartridge since it came out there is over 2+ years ago with tons of knowledge in the group.. facebook.com/groups/398943407218038/
Fellow Kentuckian here who just stumbled upon your channel. I subscribed.
I found this fascinating and I don't even shoot rifles, and certainly don't re-load. Learnt a lot in this one video. One thing that perplexes me is that for YEARS I thought .223 and 5.56 were the exact same thing - just one expressed in inches (civilian) and the other metric (military). But recently I discovered that there are differences, like 5.56 slightly more powerful. Maybe Johnny has a video on this.
I agree with everything.... a possible contender for a light bullet varmint caliber other than the 22 Nosler in the AR is the 204 ruger.
Honestly, when it comes to the AR 15, I think Grendle and 5.56 are all you need to know. One should be a lightweight 16" carbine for SHTF and one should be a 20" rifle built to be as accurate as possible for hunting and ringing steel targets out to obscene distances.
I handload my .22 Nosler rounds and I use Nosler brass. After several reloads, not a single problem with the brass, and the performance is stunning. Granted it's not the cheap make-a-buck brass case that the market seems to be flooded with these days, but then, you get what you pay for.
As usual a great video Johnny thanks for all the information! I have built both, a great shooting 223 with a 16 inch Wyld barrel, and a great shooting 18 inch Grendel. So glad that I didn't jump on the 224 Valkyrie or 22 Nosler band wagon. I love reloading and buying cases all the time can get expensive. I also got an 18 inch 300 Ham"r barrel from Wilson Combat and love shooting a 30 caliber with ballistic comparison to a proven 30/30 cartridge, like a 300 Blackout on steroids just no sub sonic loads, but I have my 300 Blackouts for that.
Great Information ! I have a good 5.56, looking to 6.5 Grendel and rock the 120-123gr for bigger game.
Get it it out performs all other ar15 cartridges bullet selection is huge and ammo is cheap wolf makes 100grn fmj 6.5 grendel for 230$ for 1000rds. and my gun shoots 11/2 in with it. 350 for 1000 in privi partisan 120grn brass cased hp, or wold gold 120grn brass cased hp. Plus 1200yrd max range
Have been reloading the 25x45 sharps... 90 grain gmx. at2850fps. can use it in any state.
I also really like the 300 blk for the shorter barrel length that allows a much handier lighter and smaller rifle for an easy carrying option in the field and for hd. I know this was about bullets and cartridges but just wanted to add the other benefits for that round besides the sub sonic suppressed factor.
To newer guys like myself he is 100% correct about .223/5.56 about being accurate. Bought a Sig tread removed the handgaurd and barrell almost immediately. Put a 24" H-Bar and went sub moa almost right away. Best group was .64moa @ 200 yards. Unfortunately havent been to a range over 200.
I love the wealth of info that you and your channel are. Thank you for sharing.
i like shooting the heavier .224Val for varmints and medium to large game also have hunted with my 125gr 7.62x39 on hogs at 150 to 250yrds.i also have two M4s in different twists with 1-7 and 1-9 twist rates and have a lot of fun with those.I 5think u sold me on a 6.5Grendel! LOL thats my next AR i want one in every caliber lol. Then ill start on AR 10s lol my wife was wonder i bought a 14gun gun cabinet....At the time my long guns were spread around my den in gun socks.I filled it 1/2 way when i finally put them in it!LOL and im still going strong i just added the 76.2x39 and havnt even had a chance to shoot it yet? lol great video keep it up bro!
Johnny, will you ever be doing a test or review on the new 350 Legend? Thanks sincerely for all you do for us guys & gals. I own both .300 BO and 6.5 Grendel uppers solely for the fun of developing accurate loads, but have interest in all AR 15 calibers.
My major interest is in old/older cartridges and firearms Re: .22 K Hornet, .222 Rem Mag., .45 Colt, 6.5 X 55 Swede, 7mm Mauser, 8mm Nambu, .300 Savage, ad nauseum.
I doubt the 350 Legend will last very long in the marketplace, but reloaders should be able to feed their guns forever. Tip...buy your brass soon and put it away!
I've built two 5.56's and one .300 BLK. My next two builds I've decided to go wildcat. First will be the .357 AR and the second will be a .277 Wolverine. Both use .223 brass, so no different BCG needed.
there are also a bunch of wildcats based on the 6.5 Grendel, 6mm AR, 6MM Rat, 6mm Fat Rat that really make the Grendel case sing.
I have shot 223/556, 300blk, 350 legend and 450 bushmaster. Just built a grendel but need to get it tested at the range. I have a good feeling it will perform great.
The 350 legend gave me problems (failure to feed) it was kind of a let down;(
Will figure the problem out later!
Thanks for your great video 👍
I love my Rock River AR15
.223 wylde .25" 100 yds three round groups out of the box. Full disclosure they were my own personal handloads. Oh yea great video first time watcher
Great reloading info, thanks
The Grendel is the best caliber for the AR platform!!! As soon as you get past 300m it really shines. Inside of 300m, hard to beat 55g 556. After 300m, the 6.5 Grendel is the shit!!!
Grendel for me based on its great versatility. I load Hornady 100 gr. ELD-Ms on the light end and 123 gr. ELD-Ms on the heavier end, and a few in between. Currently playing with Sierra 107 gr. TMKs.
Liquidmetal I love my Grendel’s because I can shoot from 85gr bullets up to 156gr and everything in between with great accuracy from almost all, nothing says boom coyote than an 85gr bullet going 3000+fps!
You should update this info to include the 350 legend.
I hope he reads this, and makes his comeback to you tube soon, social regressive has a few videos with 350 legend
Very interesting. Thanks for the info. This makes choosing a round much easier.
My choices are 5.56mm and 6.8 SPC II for my reasons.
6.5 outperforms 6.8 and ammo for 6.5 is cheaper and more manufacturers make it so better bullet selection
@@joshualance6005 Let me guess, you looked at a ballistics chart to determine that it is a better round. There is much more to bullet performance than simply ballistic coefficient.
Some Hunters maybe bound by Law.. Where I live we have to use minimum 6.5mm Caliber with at least 2000J of Energy at 100m on Hogs. I choose the Grendel.
the 6.5grendel is the best hunting cartridge in the ar15 it outperforms all other ar15 cartriges
@@joshualance6005 at range I agree. For short range 458 Socom and 50 Beowolf have more punch
The Grendel is, so far, the cartridge that delivers the most energy to the longest range in the AR 15 platform. It manages to do this at fairly mild pressures and velocities. Very good balance between resources and capabilities.
Good stuff as always. I enjoyed the comparison. I agree that is all depends on what you want to do. I think they all have their place in the lineup somewhere. I am shooting and reloading for the .224 Valkyrie. Also agree with the brass life issue, hoping at some point that will get sorted out. Only time will tell.
My suggestion : Always go with CHROME for bolt carriers as they will generally present less problems cycling.
Chrome bcg is sweet
That was the best explaination of ogive I've ever heard. Thanks for that. And I like Grendel a lot as well.
Any commentary on the 6.8 spc? Why was this handy round left out? The 224 Valkyrie uses the same bolt and mags
I caught an old timer's opinion of the Valkyrie, and he was stating the angle of the shoulder focused the blast directly on the chamber walls causing rapid erosion. Other than that I can't say. For an intermediate shooter it wouldn't be an issue. If you shoot 10,000 rounds a year it might be an issue.
The Grendel is the way to go. Especially as long as we can still get the cheap import Russian ammo. I know this is a reloading channel but sometimes it's just fun to go out with some friends and blast away for an afternoon
Well, it’s still a great round but not so much due to the Russian ammo ban.
I wasn't planning on a 223 AR after I made one in 6.5 but I guess I should get one now.
I have pretty much ruled out 22Nosler due to its querks. And I already have a 223 and 224. I would love to see you create two videos. The first taking a given light bullet like the bobs bullets, or 60gr nosler, or 50gr v-max, and develope the best possible 223 load. And develope the best possible 224 load. Then compare velocities, sd, es, and accuracy.
The second video would be the same thing but on the heavy end. I have never loaded heavy bullets in 223 so I'm not sure where the max falls. But potentially 68gr matchking/gamechanger, 72/75/77/88 hornady eld, 82.5 berger, etc.
Would that be something you would consider?
300BO is going to be the pistol build I do. Got 6.5G and 22Nosler already along with .223/5.56.
Yano i have always purchased Faxon for barrels or in a pintch ill hit Ballistic Advantage? But i am just getting into long range shooting and thinking about competitions? I live in a very flat open state so i need range that can still humainly do the job at distance. So for both my 224Val and 6.5Gren i have 20" barrels on. I also have a 5.56 with a 20" as well as a few with 16: barrels in 5.56 as i love the M4 fixed front sight post carbines! I only have a couple of fixed M4's and both shoot great! one is a run of the mill Del-Ton sport gen2 and the other a bit higher up the food chain yet not crazy expensive a Stag Minimalist. Both shoot just as well as my all Aero Precision i finally built my self although it is a free floated barrel. All of my other AR's no matter the caliber are 16" carbines ,sadly. Although i just purchased a complete Lr/AR-10 upper and have just got all the parts in for the lower and its all on my storage cabinet! I have decided to clear out my work table in the garage and plan to finish it up and put it together next weekend? It's a .308 with a 20" barrel only because, I couldnt find a longer one any where else? LOL I would like a 24" barrel with a 17" forend! lthough when we get into these lengths the pressure put on the hand guards whether its a bi-pod or a stump in the field will effect your shooting. Personally i have found if i want to take a deer or elk i will go to my bolt guns. If its hogs or medium to smaller game the ARs are just fine. I have a nice 350Legend and a 458Socom if i need to take out a bear or larger hogs. the 224Val and 6.5Gren work best for me here. Although i have not built my 6.8SPC yet? lol i wonder do you have a video on 6.8SPC? hehe this one was great ,thanks
Helll yesss another reason to do my faxon 6.5 grendel pistol build
Grendel can kiss my grendel but Faxon barrels are legit
Best info on ammo choices and reloading by far!! Thanks man!!
6.5 Grendel. Approximates 6.5x55 ballistics (at least with lighter projectiles) doesn't burn brass or barrels, and is pretty economical to reload. 5.56 . Effective within 300 meters or so, again, economical to reload. Ammo is light. I'm my opinion, those are the 2 most useful chamberings for the AR 15. Also, not difficult to work up loads that can do < 1MOA.