Why Diablo's Creator Still HATES the Hellfire Expansion?
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- What is the real reason, David Brevik & Creator of Diablo 1 ex president of Blizzard North HATED Diablo 1’s Hellfire Expansion?
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Personally I 100% think that hiding the extra quest behind a command line was a better move than cutting them; Making them in the first place was stupid though.
I actually agree. Upon reflection, for consumers it was more free content... but business wise. Dick move
@@DarkLOREDash But, is it possible that this spawned the "secret cow level" meme in following games?
I actually really liked those in 2 and 3. I think they were the perfect blend between cute and brutal.
Seeing rainbow ponies get eviscerated isn't something you get to see alot, let alone in a AAA title.
i honestly seen minecraft mods seem more like diablo than this shitty dlc XD
@@Nerobyrne the secret cow level meme was already around in Diablo 1 before the expansion. They said you just have to click the cows in a certain patern to go into it. I think the cow quest in Hellfire was just inspired by that.
@@DarkLOREDash i love extra content, but yeah seems like there was no respect for each other
Wow..... the good old days when devs would actually try to SNEAK IN free content. How times have changed.
Games and books and music and film and television. In old days they all used to selectively edit "bad" content out to release only the best quality possible. These days they're so rushed that they desperately include whatever unfinished, broken, buggy, amateurish content they can get out the door - they plan to go back to "finish" and "polish" things later if the product gets enough revenue, there's no extra content hidden anywhere in these trashy thin titles.
@@pwnmeisterage truly, greed has poisoned the souls of people. This current society is beyond saving
not when it's fucking shitty crappy content that makes fun of the game itself... aerosmith tickets? wtf?
@@llVIU All the "cowquest" stuff - the bovine plate, the silly suits, the Aerosmith comedy act - was deliberately intended for humour. An in-joke commentary vs "there is no cow level". I would argue that it didn't break the game since it was fully optional anyhow, if you don't want it to break your immersion then don't go out of your way to activate it.
And as it turned out, all the other things Blizzard criticized - the barbarian class, the predictable dungeon map generation, the annoying little girl - they were stuff made with Blizzard's own code and they were stuff that Blizzard ended up including in their own Diablo titles.
You can rant like a rabid animal and hate the game or you can retain rational perspective and enjoy the game.
i mean, to be fair, the actual developers of games probably still would love to sneak in some hidden content and other things into their games for players to discover. but the companies they work for usually don't look too kindly upon people "wasting time" with such things. nowadays, people get 3 years to finish a 6-year-project, having to do 80-120 hour weeks during the last months, and once it's "done" (though still far from finished, but it hit the way too ambitious deadline so it just has to get released in whatever state it's in to avoid both anger from "fans" and having to spend money on continued development) they'll get laid off anyway so that the ceo, managers, and shareholders can take more money for themselves instead of having to "waste" it on people who are no longer needed to work on the game.
indie companies are usually just too small, they can barely even finish their games the way they intended, so obviously most indie devs don't have the time to create extra content either.
Polygon did a story about how this happened.
- The people at Blizzard didn't want an expension in the first place, but the company that owned Blizzard (before Activision) demanded it because of how profitable it would be.
- The expansion had to be developped in an insane short time.
- Blizzard was already working on Diablo 2, so a third party development team was hired.
- Blizzard assumed the expansion would be terrible so they explicitly forbade adding multiplayer so the expansion wouldn't mess with the online version they made. They wanted it to just be the cash-grab their management wanted, while changing as little to their version of the game as possible.
- Between the hostility against the idea of an expansion and the assumed failure, the people that took on the job were not happy with the attitude Blizzard gave them.
- The team wanted to produce a good product, but the design brief was set-up-to-fail and so they defied it and put features in secretly behind hacks.
Both sides wanted to create a good product, but were very childish about the situation they were forced into by upper management who just wanted money.
The most childish of them all would be Polygon.
Yeah, I understand resenting the direction of those above you, but this all sounds like very petty behavior. A little cooperation can turn a turd into a gold nugget.
I guess they never heard the saying about life and lemons
When money is an issue+ time = you get an average if the devs are prob art cannot be rushed. That’s why blizzard know they don’t set a date. And other good companies.
Personally I would take this drama any day over what we got with blizzard Activision. Sierra as a parent company was tame in comparison.
Monk gave us the very first ability to highlight loot.
That thing stuck around and still is there in most games in that genre nowadays.
I didn't like Hellfire either BUT making the items glitter was a HUGE quality of life improvement.
It's impossible to overstate how difficult it was to spot items in the dark.
I used to press and hold *ALT key* (I think) in the later games for the items to show up on the screen.
@@RanaRandom correct. In the initial release you were left to blindly mouse around the screen. It was awful lol
Yeah but that's QOL stuff that literally anyone would have tacked on including the original devs, just from time alone
Anyone that uses quality of life as a reason for anything in a game is subhuman
@@natecw4164 well, that's exactly how it would be in a dark dungeon. part of life.
I thought that teddy bear quest was great because how creepy it was. Throughout the entire time you would think Theodore is a boy and terrible things may have happened to him. At the end it was just a teddy and the feeling becomes mixed: humored because “Theodore” is “teddy”, and that it’s just a toy; mildly terrified because the girl may have some mental problems.
Boogeyman is a demon in the game who drags children to hell. They're hiding in the shadows underneath the bed. They're seen as Hidden in the labyrinth.
"The Hidden are the boogeymen that haunt our dreams and live in the nightmares of children"
Yea that is exactly why it did NOT belong in D1 at all lol. The whole tone of the game is serious as fuck and death is coming. Fucking teddy bears, fuck off lol.
@@reitairue2073 It's not so much a teddy bear as assisting a child in distress. It's easily a current sidequest that doesn't draw any attention. I'm neutral. Kids to kid stuff.
Yeah the whole teddy bear quest destroys the vibe of Diablo that literally was somebody just thinking that they could put their own little personal touch to the game and say see I’m a genius but it blew up in their face because once again it does not mesh with Diablo.
imo lot of Diablo´s lore is so grim dark thought that it doesnt make me care about the characters at all, this teddy thing would make the world more humane
i loved Hellfire back then.. new weapons, armor, quests and your Hero was fast in town..
Yes. I dont know why people hate hellfire that much. Yes cow and teddy bear quest are bad, but rest of the expansion? Crypts are absolutely great as well as nest
Should add for context: Sierra proper didn't develop Hellfire. Synergistic Software, a company owned by Sierra, did. Sierra at the time was a massive company with about a dozen or so companies they owned, and was going through a lot of turbulence at the time. They had been bought at the same exact time as Davidson, who owned Blizzard. There was a lot of in-fighting and bad blood between Sierra and Davidson even before Hellfire. Technically, the head of Davidson was placed in charge of Sierra, also, indirectly, and Sierra's heads were resisting this for almost a year prior to Hellfire even entering development. To the extent that no one at Sierra was really certain who to answer to. Technically, Davidson forced Hellfire on Sierra. Davidson also waited until the head of Blizzard was on vacation, as well, which created bad blood on Blizzard's end out of the gate. Sierra then passed it to Synergistic. The project manager put in charge of the Hellfire project by Sierra was a guy who had limited gaming experienced and did not at keep communication flowing between Synergistic and Blizzard. Synergistic were massive fans of Diablo and were honored at the chance to work for Blizzard, but they felt they were being given a list of demands by Blizzard. Also, they finished Hellfire ahead of schedule and Blizzard or Davidson pushed the deadline back by months, making the developers feel annoyed, demanded to, and bored, so they added stuff like the teddy bear quest out of sheer boredom (with having a done game they couldn't release)
It was a game forced on Sierra and Blizzard by Davidson. Synergistic, Sierra's developers, tried to make the best of a bad situation. Blizzard became extremely anal and overly serious about it. There was miscommunication between Synergistic's project manager and Blizzard. Everything that could go wrong did, and Synergistic was basically put out of business by Blizzard who spitefully got most of the developers of Hellfire fired; and mind, Synergistic had been a respected RPG developer since 1979.
Would love a source to this! Genuinely intrigued!
Tons of turbulence at that, as this was about the same time period that CuC/Cendent with all their cooked books, acquired Sierra and their IP. I love this post though, it's nice to find someone else who's passionate about the history of the industry itself.
Yeah in recent years people have been shitting on blizzard hard, but what I think most people dont realize is that blizzard have been surprisingly stubborn and shitty behind the scenes for a long time. I like most blizzard games and many of the big personalities but as a company, they have always handled things very poorly; ESPECIALLY when working with others. Starcraft is a great example as well.
This was actually interesting to read.
Sometimes I tell myself it's a massive waste of time to dig into comment sections but then you find some obscure newspaper article like this.
To everyone rightly offened. I have this problem where I mix up Blizz North (d1 & d2) with Blizz South(d3 & d4) when I talk. I know the difference, but somehow always seem to muddle them in vids. Apologies!
I thought hellfire was weird but cool because it expanded what can be infected by Diablo. I'm kinda meh about it now.
Wait, why they didn't let Blizzard North do the Diablo 3 and 4?
@@RaphaSobral Blizzard North was shuttered in 2005, they had started on Diablo 3 more than once, their version just never happened unfortunately.
@@RaphaSobral why do you think they sucked ass? been living under a rock?
@@spectralthundr9525 which is one of the biggest tragedies in gaming
After all these years, I'm only just now playing Hellfire. The first two levels of the hive (or whatever it is called) kinda remind me of the bug tunnels in Diablo II. Only the Hellfire monsters seem more like alien things rather than demons. I guess I need to go back and look for new quests on the surface.
Look up a list of all the quests so you don't miss any. There are some obscure ones
There's one aspect of Hellfire though that is really great and that is the music in the crypts. I don't think anyone dislikes that particular little bit.
Also the Auric Amulet. ^^
Meanwhile the music in the Hive is some beatnik on bongos, it's hilarious lol
I remember installing Hellfire off the disc and learning how to unlock the content, etc. Good times. The textures in Na Krul's area look great, and the Monk's innate ability (highlighting loot on the ground) became standard from Diablo II onward, so...
Yeah, the Demon Crypts are still some of my favorite areas in any Diablo game.
Despite its unapproved direction I think the Teddy bear quest was kinda funny. Thinking your saving a person to find out it’s an inanimate object is kinda funny. Could have made it dark and made it a possessed talking bear or something.
I loved the barbarian class in Hellfire. Innate magic resistance at the cost of 0 maximum magic skill was a good trade, and the faster attack with axes was powerful.
Yes and let's not forget the splash damage he can deal with a two-handed weapon. Quite OP though..
There was a monk..
@@yetanotherretroreview4476 Yes, but the monk was kind of... lackluster.
Interesting. Never played Hellfire but I played a "Barbarian" variant of fighter based on a challenge I read about. Basically used white items, no magic or scrolls. Self-sufficient; repaired things himself.
I later did a further variant of that via a hero editor. I intentionally edited any MP I gained to 0 and instead added it to HP. My guy also preferred an axe.
I played him as an actual Barbarian in Diablo 2 and imagined he was continuing the story from Diablo 1 (he wasn't the fighter who defeated Diablo but was part of clearing the dungeon, and also "thank goodness you've returned. Much has changed since you lived here my friend" had me decide he originated from Tristram, and since he had blacksmithing ability, was raised by Griswold. Yeah. Seeing dad as a zombie was fun. I again had him return in Diablo 3 as an aged Barbarian and complete the defeat of the prime evils that he had never managed in the past.
@@Syrenova you should try playing DnD. sounds right up your alley.
I always thought it was some fan made mod not an official expansion. >_
This is a very common read, because blizzard has disavowed it so hard. You kind find it anywhere on their official sites etc. (sure it is another developer technically, but still) you were supposed to forget about it.
It's hard to tell with Sierra...
@@alanhersch4617 yet they still released it when they made the cooperation with GOG.
But I guess that kind of fits thematically, since that was also a cooperation with another game studio ^^
Originally developed by Synergistic Software and released in 1997, Hellfire was not an official Blizzard product and did not carry Blizzard’s endorsement or label.
I threw by big box of it away when I was 15-18. But also traded the jewel case in as well. Never should have done that for DIablo or Hellfire.
Personally I loved the Hellfire expansion. Mostly because it struck me as something totally silly and tongue-in-cheek. I get that it isn't really a lore-friendly thing but it sure was fun and humorous. I really enjoy that side of fantasy so it was cool to see it touch on comedic fantasy.
The tone of diablo is so crucial to the gameplay though. It's not space quest with wacky characters around every turn. I mean just watch the original cinematic intro, *that* is the tone of the game.
@@koalanectar9382 I mean on one hand I get why people would be upset about the shift in tone for the quests and I acknowledge that I am far more flexible about these kinds of thinigs vs the internet at large though I would wish people would lighten up a bit.
@@koalanectar9382 And that's why there is a smart ass drunk or a not so hidden cow level. Diablo needs its goofy side, because without it, it becomes a dull experience.
It's theme ruins it, aliens, instead of demons.
@@koalanectar9382 Yeah, totes crucial...like the cow level in D2 where they all walk on their hind legs and say "Moo!" as they attack you in hordes. Demon cows are so dark and serious, I'm just glad they didn't besmirch the gritty tone.
The Sierra devs went to later on create Diablo 3 based on the hellfire expansion 🤣🤣
now we know who to blame for the most disappointing release in human history
would explain the rainbow level lol
This is an outright falsehood. Sierra nor literally of its developers had ANYTHING to do with Diablo 3. The team who developed Diablo 3 were Blizzard South people going all the way back to the early 1990s such as Metzen, Rob Pardo, etc. Not a single Sierra person.
@@Bklyn93 guess you don't know what sarcasm is.
@@marcello4258 The Warcraft 3 Reforged devs ask you to hold their beer. ;P
I personaly, really enjoyed Hellfire expansion and find history behind it intriguing.
Also, without Hellfire we couldn't play Hell & Hell 2 mods years later.
Still, I can understand original creators hated it and I have to admit, the finding theo quest is cringe.
So, they complain about Hellfire has goofy stuff yet we have a secret cow level in the sequel?
They did it after rumor had it D1 had it so its there sort of a spoof on that. You don't have to do the cow level, but sometimes it helps
Don't forget Diablo 3's "Whimsyshire"
Ego is a hell of a thing. Honestly it's a shame that you can't get Diablo hellfire expansion for the old game b/c you can acquire and replay the original pretty readily.
@@pfistor Whimsyshire.....that pony land still annoys me. Unreasonably so perhaps.
I wouldn't be surprised if the cow level was inspired by the cow costume guy. I also wouldn't be surprised if the devs of Diablo 2 envisioned all the humanoid cows you slaughter as the devs from Sierra.
Well, the first 30sec of the video explains it
I remember finding this in store, being shocked that diablo 1 had an expansion pack. I also remember being dissappointed in the new content, the monk class and laughing at the power walk "jog" option. Always felt really off, now i see why 😄
Its ironic Blizzard would go on to riddle Diablo 3 with exactly what was hated about Hellfire.
I like D3
Spot on. Besides, it's not like D2 didn't add lots of bug enemies like those found in the Hive.
D2 and D3 retroactively made Hellfire feel much better.
Hellfire exists.
Diablo 3: "And then we doubled it"
Played this when i was a kid, kinda enjoyed it tho
Next please " why Rakanishu is a genius?"
cus he keistered Wirts leg for later?
Prison wallet
Ewww, all of you
Me at the beginning: aww, can't be that bad...
me at the end: BURN IT! BURN IT WITH FIRE!
Burn it with.......
*HELLFIRE?!*
I'll see myself out, thanks.
@WINRetrogaming98 I do like the INSANE difficulty levels. Try getting past the first creep on Nightmare with a rogue or warrior -- takes about 10/15 minutes to take them down!
Considering how disappointing I was with Diablo, after asking at a shop for a game similar to Fallout- the expansion was not really that bad (and the game itself is a bit simplistic, but it grows on you. In the end, it is really good for what it is).
Loved Hellfire! Was a cool edition.
The best weapon description was Doppelganger! Had a 25-50% cancel to doppelganger the foe you were attacking.... amazing for farming! Could find a tough foe, use my staff of doppelganger with my monk.
Increase my foes from say 4 to 50.. switch weapons, cull them to 4 again, rinse and repeat!
On my Bard, I had twin Dopple war hammer drop early in the game. So I had a massive 150+% chance to hit, and that carried me all the the way to Nightmare. Bard is OP as hell.
I actually played Hellfire for the first time this year and was shocked at how incredibly weird and disconnected it is.
I bought and downloaded Diablo+Hellfire yesterday at 21:30, and still played until 00:30, despite having to be up at 5:00.
What do I like about Hellfire? The increased town speed, the extra affixs, and most of all, being able to play on a higher difficulty on single-player without having to use LAN. The extra classes are good, but frankly the extra areas I can take or leave.
Fun fact- I actually bought Hellfire first as a kid to try to manipulate my parents into getting the base game for me, which I had just borrowed long term from someone. Somehow that _didn't_ backfire, and I got it for myself.
Also, since I was just reminded of it by finding it, Hellfire kinda came up with the proto-alpha version of the shared stash with The Cornerstone Of The World.
Is it wrong that I grabbed Diablo 1 and play it with the belzebub mod?
N-no? It's not a bad mod, and if your modern sensibilities can't deal with 1996 style, you do what you need to make it palatable, I guess.
Lol that’s clever manipulation I wish I thought of that
The Bard and Barbarian classes were probably behind a text prompt because they were incomplete and overall not very interesting. Hiding this kind of cut content in the game was pretty common back then. It's probably not attempts to hide it from Blizzard North.
Additionally the Barbarian in Hellfire could wield two two-handed weapons, an ability later used by the Diablo 2 barbarian.
I personally think that the theo quest is extremely well scripted. The girl excactly behaves (in) and describes this situation like a real one would. She does not feel a difference between a human friend or a toy friend. The twist might be funny (for some maybe infuriating) when you find theo, but at the same time it is so relatable.
Hellfire was fine.
The Defiler's speech in the bug nest was hilarious.
"soon now we shall feeeeeeeeed!!!!"
Best part of the game.
Na-Krul’s “OUT OF MY WAY HUMAN!” right as soon as you pull the lever he bolts out the door
@@MetalHead093 or the easter egg dialogue lol
But for real, the Cornerstone of the World was rad.
*Diablo 1 had most of it's cut content left in the game (thank goodness). Thanks to the Beelzebub mod, they incorporated all the cut content back into the game. I am so thankful.*
Sierra was ahead of their time, to perceive one self as a cow is very socially progressive!
I SAID MOO!
Hell shit! 😂😂😂
Ha ha, and to think, back then, we just called it insanity!
IT IS MOO. IT IS MOO…
Say sir one more fucking time I’LL SHOW YOU A SIR!
Doja Cat probably played this as a child
02:53 This sounds like they were actively trolling Blizzard.
Sounds like Blizzard had a real chip on their shoulders. How dare thy soil my precious and perfect art!
@@tzuyd Sure, but it is their right.
@@tzuydwell yeah, imagine you spend months/years making a custom build high spec sports car, and a few months later your kid brother decides to paint it bright pink and add teddybear sounds to the exhaust, and while they're on they add some stupid hydraulics that completely runs counter to the original design of the car - moments after you told his ass to NOT do that.
You'd be rightly fucking pissed too. They weren't acting entitled, they had every right and their criticism was squarely earned.
There's literally nothing wrong or pink in this expansion.
@@tzuyd you literally don't get metaphorical speaking do you?
The point of the metaphor is the tone is ENTIRELY different in the expansion to the original game, much like how the purpose of the custom built car changes completely from a functional purpose to a aesthetic purpose.
You also missed the point how it wasn't their game to completely change so drastically like that.
And as someone who played both the original, and hellfire when they first launched originally, I distinctly remember - as does my older brother - how VASTLY different the tone and setting felt, as well as some of the game mechanics changing so wildly for the worse.
So no, you're wrong. Learn what a metaphor is, and understand the context before shouting "yOuRe WrOnG bCoZ I SeZ sO"
You literally added nothing. Just like Shitefire.
At the beginning of this video, I thought the "teddy bear" mission was a exaggeration or metaphor. It was not...
I'd be pissed to.
Hellfire was glorious! Crypts music alone was worth getting it.
I love how the main issue was quality and tone… I love D1 and Hellfire, but it makes me smile now to know the fate of the series after hearing this.
Honestly i like Hellfire, yes it seemed a bit odd but it was neat to have at the time, and with he monk it felt like a real D&D party.
I actually enjoyed Hellfire, it was what it was, more Diablo.
I think this right here, is why some nerds hate fan service. Cause with out randomly generated maps, it really isn’t Diablo. People that just buy anything put out related to their favorite IP lower the quality.
@@bobpope3656 Just because someone likes something you don't doesn't make their opinion any less valid. I enjoyed hellfire, live with it or return to your cave.
It didn't lower the quality at all, Diablo 2 came out afterwards and was fantastic.
@@mesothelimoa341 I didn’t say your opinion is less valid, My opinion is when people blindly support developers it leads to lower quality games
@@bobpope3656 kinda have to agree with Bob. Hellfire cheapened the base game in a lot of ways, it wasn’t even "more Diablo" because it didn’t even have the tone, aesthetic and level design of the base game.
@@bobpope3656 It's hardly blindly supporting them, especially when you consider that 20 years ago that culture hadn't even crept into the zeitgeist yet. Sierra were a fantastic developer that made some of the most memorable games of the early to mid 90s.
I loved the Hellfire expansion because it was more of Diablo 1.
Theo was living in a van DOWN BY THE RIVER!
Thank you for catching this
Hmm it's just feel so strange for me people hate Hellfire. It's added 2 new dungeons with plenty kind of new monsters, 3 classes, more spells and jog in town. It took away nothing from how the game works added plenty optional content and i love it.
Mechanically it is/was great, but lore wise it is wacky and all over the place. When I go back and play I do play with hellfire but I understand why people dont like it.
It's a lot of people who go into it with their opinions already set after reading about it or seeing videos like this. Some people desperately want to fit in and to confirm their biases
Actually a lot of the mechanics were changed from the original game. More doesn’t mean better. Hellfire has a lot of unbalanced mechanics and the new dungeon levels are piss poor. Especially the Hive.
@@ARescueToasterthats not even remotely what happened here. For a start, these opinions existed before RUclips lore videos were a thing. Before RUclips was even a thing.
The expansion does *not* fit the theme of the game, it does not fit the lore of the game, it does not fit the atmosphere, and its poorly thought out.
People are allowed to have an opinion and like or dislike something for their own very much valid reasons.
I remember distinctly playing it as a young'n when it first released, alongside my older brother and while I did enjoy it I couldn't help but feel the content largely felt jarringly out of place and out of touch with the main game.
You might not agree, and thats fine. It does not, however, invalidate the opinions of people who don't agree with *you*.
@@Helikaeon Not even sure how to begin to respond to this...
"That's not even remotely what happened here". Oh, really? How do you plan to even begin to prove that? You are literally just speaking for yourself, so perhaps you should take your own advice?
What's ironic here is how you are trying to tell me I don't have a valid opinion because you want me to believe that even as a child you disliked Hellfire. And that you have never been influenced by anything over the last nearly 30 years in how you think and feel about Hellfire.
Because you, along with virtually everyone else who says the same things about it, sharing the same opinions that a number of RUclips videos made recently say about it, not only played Hellfire back then (rather than not even knowing it existed like most people. I'll have to look at the number of copies sold now..) but you had such exquisite taste as a child that you couldn't even stomach it. None of you were simply excited to have more Diablo, because some of it was 'different', or not 'balanced' (as if Diablo 1 was ever balanced...).
I know for a fact that some people didn't like Hellfire back then because I've talked with some of those people on ancient forums, irc channels, AOL chatrooms, etc. decades ago. But most people weren't even aware of Hellfire. And the ones that were typically enjoyed it even with the issues and oddities it had. Maybe their tastes changed over the years and they no longer find t interesting, but when so many people today try to say "I hated it back then too!" I simply don't believe most of them. It's like people who say "I always hated Elon Musk!" when just a few years ago they couldn't shut up about how he was saving the world with Tesla.
I personally enjoyed Hellfire, yes it always felt different to the base game and some of the stuff added wasn't great. However it also added a lot of QoL and some good content as well, so overall I much prefer playing with Hellfire to playing without it.
It was a fun enough piece of extra content with enough game play/engine improvements to make it worth while without even playing the optional area. This spilt milk just comes across as really petty.
If you were making oh idk...hotcakes! and someone comes by and puts a topping on it that you dont like. Are you going to eat it? or tell them it sucks?
This isn't a topping, it's a side. You can ignore the side. The gameplay improvements that were made to the core game were universally liked.
@@tzuyd Fair enough. If someone sticks something as a side..Are you going to eat it? or tell them it sucks?
A bard would actually be interesting in Diablo 4 lol. I mean, does Sanctuary not have music?
A bard is a good idea, but who in their right mind would wanna play music when you're in a camp surrounded by demons and know the camp will fall sooner or later but end up being "liberated" by a combat willing bard? Would be off from the rest of the cast and tone of the game and lore.
Bards typically have AoE buffs and debuffs in games and we technically already have those with pallies and monks. Would mostly be redundant.
Man with a cow disguise: Did you just assume my species?
Sierra was secrectly annoucing the future.
The cow level rumor already existed by Hellfire
"Ummmm excuuuuse me Prince but my pronouns are bovine/maverick, not 'man' thank you and check your privilege."
You can get sick gear in Hellfire, and difficultly settings!
That's the thing ahah Sierra took assets for the future and tried to rush them into a game that didn't support them
As I understand it, they hated the fact that they were expected to do an expansion and were given such a tiny window to complete it by. The. Great three had said that that was impossible and so it was outsourced to another team, which was Sierra Games. This was done because they were working on diablo 2 and couldn't give up the resources.
I’ve played Diablo one a ridiculous number of hours. I was completely obsessed with it. And it was a long time before Diablo two came out. So, when hellfire was released, or should I say when I discovered it, I was so ecstatic. And I played the hell out of it. 😉 I liked it and I was super grateful to have something more while I waited for Diablo two.
I've never played any Diablo games. But I think fetching a lost teddy bear could work in a dark fantasy setting. It's like the world is so horrible that the hero is willing to risk his life to protect even the smallest amount of innocence, because it is just that valuable in such a dark world. Maybe that small act of kindness could inspire that girl to do some good in the future.
i duuno why people are upset about it, many of theses type of games have similar quests, and you don't know it's a teddy until you find it,
They should have made theo a real kid
> _"(...) the world is so horrible that the hero is willing to risk his life to protect even the smallest amount of innocence (...)"_
That shifts the tone from "dark" to "heroic", which was the exact problem.
Na Krul's speech is still kinda epic tho
Just played diablo 1 for the first time and I don't understand 1 bit why the developers would hate hellfire. Hellfire adds walking in town and item Twinking, which enough for me to say it's amazing.
The actual hive lever is awesome, nd the crypt level feels VERY diablo. There is nothing about hellfire that isn't fucking awesome.
There was huge demand for a D1 expansion. You decided not to make one, you don’t get to complain when someone else meets that demand. Hellfire did a lot of things right imo and much of it not “feeling” like Diablo is simply because the sound and artwork was made by a different studio, which, again, is a consequence of the original team snubbing their own product.
The monk, bard, and barbarian brought new and interesting ways to play through the game. Hellfire also removed the completely pointless restriction of not being able to access higher difficulties in single player and added several other quality of life improvements.
Complaints about camp and getting away from dark gothic horror are particularly rich because the artwork for D2’s actual gameplay wound up looking like a Hanna Barbera fantasy adventure cartoon. Compared to D1, D2 looks like an anime.
Since we are getting a D2 remake can we get a D1 remake as well?
Ugh, please no. lolz I don't even think I'd get D2 rez'd. It's been too overcooked these decades.
@@WereWade D2R looks amazing
@@SaltySeaCaptain So did Warcraft 3: Refunded before it came out.
@@SaltySeaCaptain yea, pay for your shitty reskin.
They added a diablo 1 mode/event/thing to d3 and for me it was unplayable because they of the dodgy grain filter they slapped on top to make it look "old" causing really bad headaches and nausea.
Blizzard are a hollow shell of what they used to be and are relying on nostalgia for their franchises rather than making games worth playing.
I really love Diablo 1, because of it's atmosphere so I was super stoked to get more content with Hellfire. The problem is that Hellfire's environments and enemies don't fit the tone of the main game. I do love the extra magic spells and ability to jog around town though. Dave Brevik probably thought Hellfire looked outdated when it was released and thus didn't want it to be canon.
I forgot all about the Hellfire expansion. I used to love playing Diablo on my Playstation 1. That coach co-op was a damn blast.
I recently played diablo 1 on a ps emulator on a tablet. I have played on pc and beat the game many times, it is a great game anywhere.
I put the PS1 version on my PSP. It's a little clunky to play, but still pretty cool.
A bit of a pain in the ass to hit the target you want or to use potions, but this is how I got into Diablo as well! Still have my game somewhere around here..
There's a bunch of quests and dialogue in Diablo 3 that feels like a 'teddy bear quest'.
Brevik was *long* gone from Blizzard by the time Diablo 3 started development, let alone came out.
I don't give a damn if the creator hate it, I love this expansion and I can't play Diablo 1 without it. He sounds like he disliked it just because he wasn't the creator.
The jogging in town option alone is already a good enough reason to prefer Hellfire over vanilla D1.
There are new classes, new spells, new dungeons, you can highlight items on the floor and you can have the Book of Apocalypse. There are certainly other differences that I can't recall now, but this expansion is amazing.
Personally i would be interested in knowing what David Brevik´s original intend for the Hellfire expansion was.
I know, right
Hate hellfire... but I'll play it since you move like 17% faster in town.
Gotta be more than 17%
I think it's a whole 2x. Hellfire makes the sorcerer even more broken lmao but I like the barbarian a lot. It's like an even more minmaxed warrior
why would anyone hate this amazing expansion?
i hate it too
I liked Hellfire because it was more Diablo either way but, I understand Civerbs's disdain.
I love learning about game bts drama, it always makes the game spicier.
Hellfire was bit of a fun expansion to D1, though I never played the secret quests. Although, I cannot describe the pain of playing it with a Monk or Warrior chasing endless FAST enemies around ☠️
The Hive is just a reskinned version of the Caves levels of the original game. They also removed the lava rivers from their layout.
And the Crypt is a reskinned version of the dungeon.
But are they randomized each run? This is why I like D1 the most.
@@tokiwartooth4404 Yes they are randomized as well
It's not, you could just as well claim every area in the game is a reskin of sorts because they function the same. There's only so much you can make out of dungeon designs.
@Fnd Yeah there's only so much you can do with the random dungeons in D1. They are just a set of rooms layed out randomly on each dungeon level.
The reason I say they are reskins, is when you look closely at the "rooms" used in the hive, and the crypt, you can clearly recognized they are the same as the caves and dungeon, respectively.
Only differences I see, are obviously the textues and that they removed the "lava rivers" rooms in the layouts for the hive and added the "cornerstone of the world" in the crypt.
Hellfire Expansion was instead created by Relic Entertainment who have had nothing to do with Blizzard North at the time.
But it does exist.
Players today about Hellfire back then: "Oh, Hellfire was fine"
Players today if Hellfire released for D3/D4: "OMG, THIS IS HORRIBLE, IT RUINED MY DEAR FRANCHISE ENTIRELY, I CANNOT LIVE ANYMORE"
Exactly. We got it when all we had was D1 and very little lore. It's only a weird disconnect when you know the unexplained lore of D1 (that you only learn in books/website lore posts/ D2 + 3). With only D1, it's a shift in horror genre, because we beat the gothic/demonic one.
Except it is the developers being mad at the game. Apparently only they can "ruin" the game.
Every time I see reference to Hellfire, it feels like something I remember from a fever dream. I'm positive that I played it, but part of my brain still refuses to believe it ever existed. I think I must have compartmentalized the entire experience after the trauma of hearing those voice-lines.
Funny, I actually loved hellfire lol.
Me too
This was before diablo 2, so the legacy of diablo hadn't been cemented yet. It was just a game about the most powerful evil in hell appearing on earth and being defeated in 16 floors. You literally walked into hell after going just 12 floors down.
Sure, this was retconned later, but at the time it wasn't such a stain on the franchise to explore a Lovecraft vibe. The original concept was kind of already silly.
The whole argument about barbarian or bard tainting the diablo 2 perception is also a joke. No one conflated the two. Most didn't even play Hellfire, let alone hack its text files to unlock a class. I mean sure, the level design wasn't as strong and the quest from the girl was silly, but at the end of the day it brought more life to a game people already loved along with a few QoL improvements over the original. Seems kind of silly for Blizzard to take themselves so seriously over it.
I knew there was a reason I didn't think the bugs fit, aha. Good video!
Some what of a good thing that you could do aswell, after finnishing the game, you could play the game at higher difficulty levels Nightmare and Hell mode.
I still remember getting this way back when it realeased. And i'm sure there was a patch to add Network Lang play as it was only single player only.
Has the hellfire design doc ever seen the light of day? Would be neat to see an expansion that stays true to what was originally envisioned.
690 views with 69 likes. I should make a wish
I got my brand new copy of Hellfire back in the day during a random outing that led me to TJMaxx, and there it was, in the clearance bin, lol
I enjoyed it. Should have been official.
Personally I always feels that Hellfire expansion enhanced the original diablo. Hive and crypt scenarios, new quests were great in my opinion.
David B's just a little butthurt that they put jogging in the game while his team couldnt, and it was the best thing to ever happen to Diablo.
the fact that Bragg is still salty about this two decades later really shows how petty and pathetic he really is lmfao gotta love Sierra for just slapping him in the face when he tried to cut content
If the original Blizzard Diablo 1 had so much cut content, why wasn't that released as the expansion instead?
I think part of that cut content WAS released as part of Hellfire. Some things from Hellfire were dummied out content from original D1 that was enabled for the expansion. It makes Brevik's criticism more hypocritical...
In terms of artistic expression, this must feel like finishing something in line with a Monet, and then have your cousin who's three come over and draw his family in the corner with a crayon
Ok this is without question the top comment. I could try for 1000 years to come up with some as accurate as this and I wouldn't even come close. 5/5.
I wish that happened more often
I'm a bit premature saying this. But I read David Brevik 'loves D3' and so, I feel like tone isnt the issue.
It's just a matter of control. Narcissism, the blight of society.
Lets be honest, if Hellfire wasent made. The expansion for diablo 2, wouldnt even be a thing. They would make diablo 3 with a diablo 2 graphic.
hey that teddy bear quest voice over is miles away better than anything they do now
Hellfire was really cool I wanted it more than Diablo 1 vanilla as a kid , the bug layer seemed sick
"SomeWhere Down There...I Ain't Too Sure...But SomeWhere, There's a Whole Pile O' Gold! Gleaming & Shinning, Just Waiting For SomeOne to Get It!"
Hellfire is what it is, it's a mod baked into an expansion. I guess that isn't what Blizzard's intent was, but Brevik could grow a sense of humour too. One could always just play the vanilla game.
Na'krul giving away Aerosmith tickets made me laugh then, still makes me laugh now.
To be fair at least it was some extra content.
Blizzard was always super lazy to make a decent amount of content for the Diablo games.
Now its almost 10 years we're waiting for D4, and i'm sure we get 3.5 acts... again.
Simply untrue
Blizzard should do, nay MUST do a proper remastered of the first game as they did with diablo 2, and put in everything they imagined originally with the expansion, i would buy the shit out of that game!
It was fine. I bought two retail copies, the first around 2001 and it was fairly cheap. I really dont think its worth playing now, but im currently playing through Bezlebub as a sorcerer.
Another weird thing I recall about Hellfire is that the drop system was way worse than D1. I remember going through entire playthroughs without finding a single unique. Anyone else have this experience?
Magic items overall were better than uniques in D1.
2:53 my Hellfire save from Games with Galaxy crashed and wouldn't load but I finished the Hive and man only regret missing this part.
Activision: let's outsource the Warcraft remake
Diablo devs: This should be fun to watch.
This makes a lot of sense considering the type of games Sierra typically makes.
One of the first games I ever played as a little kid was King’s Quest 6. That game is a charming mix of both silly and serious.
That cow suit guy could have straight up been put in that game.
For context: that game has you, at one point, journey to a magical island full of puns. Iceberg Lettuce is used to cool off boiling water. You meet a creature called a “Dangling Participle”. There’s a patch of Wall Flowers (literal flowers) that you have to coax out of their shyness so you can grab a “hole in the wall” (it’s a bug that allows you to see through it when placed down), and there’s also a bump on a log and a stick in the mud (literally: the log and the stick speak to you) who are pivotal to your quest.
Then it also has you journey to the land of the dead in order to find the murdered king and queen of the land you’re in and confront Samhain, the Lord of the Dead, who was a mortal that defied the gods. For his transgressions, he was bound to a throne and forced to watch over all of the dead. He slowly grew physically fused to his throne over time and is now this hideously deformed thing. He claims to have never once cried over any of the tragedies he has witnessed. It’s dark and metal AF.
Also you team up with a clown who has a silly voice to beat the main villain later on :)
Because it was better than anything they've done with Diablo since. Diablo 2 added some good stuff, went overboard in some stuff, but also lost the atmosphere from Diablo 1, which makes their main criticism of Hellfire hilarious. Then comes Diablo 3 and they stray even further from their original atmosphere.
I get why it may be bad business wise, especially for the time and how well Diablo was doing. But to still be hung up on it now (in more recent times) when "modding" has been such a huge part of the community is just plain ridiculousness and sounds to be more of an ego situation than anything else, "they didn't listen to us so I'm mad" mentality.
Just having a peek at the absolute mountain of “lore” these guys write for Diablo, Starcraft, etc. is enough to show how DEADLY SERIOUS they take these games 😆
@@slayedtorest No one's denying that, but when modding is such a huge part of the community then there needs to be some leeway instead of everything in black and white. Maybe not back then or even in the early 2000s but now when lots of people take original game files and make unofficial DLCs like was the case with some Elder Scrolls games, then we should also evolve with the times and be more accepting of 3rd parties wanting to go their own way with things and just accept it as an unofficial expression of creativity.
I think it's hillarious how non-randomly generated levels were ostracized 25 years ago but in Diablo 3 the devs just didn't care. Same thing happening in d4. The series' most unique feature is gone forever.
Fun fact, the levels are randomly generated, this is a factual error in the video.
the music of second maze in hellfire was astonishingly good.