Valentina Anna Mihely As much as I can be, I'm sorry! It was just a comment in response to something someone below me said. I had no idea it would get so many upvotes and end up at the top of the thread.
My interpretation was Olenna determining if Joffrey needed to be poisoned. If Sansa said he was kind and gentle she may had just spared him. Then again I'm probably looking to far into a joke.
She knew how marriages could be good or abusive. There’s no way she would let her granddaughter be harmed so she decided then Jeoffrey must go. She had to look at her options and hoped the next son would marry her
@@justsomeguywithagoatee8337 she wouldn’t have killed him. She took a gamble because there’s no guarantees he next in line would marry margery. But she would make sure her granddaughter would be safe no matter what. No doubt she heard the rumors of how cruel jeoffrey was. Even if his family tired to keept played down
@@whitedragoness23 Your comment confuses me (I think I know why, it's probably on me). Margery and Olenna are there because at this point Margery is marrying Joffrey, no? Even Olenna's words to Margery: "I wouldn't let you be married to him(Joffrey)". Sum it up.
I'm glad it was her, if anyone deserved to condemn Joffrey, surely it was Sansa. Joffrey's done a lot of fucked up shit to a lot of people, but nothing tops the unbelievable completely unprovoked sadistic things he did to Sansa, one of the most innocent main characters on the show
Well since Olenna worked with Littlefinger to kill Joffrey she probably helped plan Sansa’s escape as well, meaning that she truly wanted Sansa to be safe. Plus she and Margaery showed themselves to have genuine human consideration for Sansa because they knew that even though they would have some control over the North by having Sansa wed Loras they also knew that Sansa would’ve been happier and safer in Highgarden than in King’s Landing and that she would be with a kind decent husband in Loras. Gay or not I think he would’ve treated her well and those 2 probably would’ve had a good relationship with each other down the line if they wed. And Olenna and Margaery knew that. Plus Margaery did still spend time with Sansa even after that plot failed and consoled her on her forced marriage to Tyrion. Plus she showed genuine concern for Sansa at the Purple Wedding, trying to get Joffrey away from the girl. And unlike Olenna, Margaery knew nothing of the plan to kill Joffrey, meaning that she never turned on Sansa at all or put her in danger in her schemes, despite her having an ulterior motive. Because of all of this I think Olenna and Margaery genuinely cared for Sansa to an extent and really were her friends. For Olenna I think 80% was just her playing the game but 20% of her cared and for Margaery I think 70% of her was playing the game but 30% she cared for Sansa. I think Margaery liked Sansa more than Olenna did.
I love how Sansa never breaks her masquerade of praising and adoring Joffrey for anyone but when she finally does, she tells the best possible person she could've told. Olenna decided to kill Joffrey the moment she found out he's a monster and it's all thanks to Sansa.
In the show, did Olena ever tell Sansa that she was the one responsible for killing Joffrey, and it was all because Sansa told her the truth that day? I can't remember, but I'd like to think that Sansa felt some type of personal revenge for being the one to tell the Tyrell's the truth about Joffrey, and also being the one who delivered the poison to the actual assassin who used it to kill Joffrey. His death remains one of the most satisfying deaths of Game of Thrones!
Olenna would’ve killed Joffrey with or without Sansa’s statement here. Everyone in King’s Landing knew that Joffrey was a monster, it’s not like Olenna found out in this scene. It’s not all thanks to Sansa.
Well...I mean Lady Olenna is many things, but she's no liar. She didn't betray Sansa's trust...she just used her as a mobile poison repository. I love this woman.
You're talking about the character, rather than the actress, who was in her mid 70's here. But to let you know: Diana Rigg was no hag back in the day. In 1999 the readers of TV Guide voted her the sexiest TV star of all time, male or female, for her work in the Avengers (1961 - 1969).
It wouldn’t have been in her best interest to do so. Sansa is still a Stark, a high born lady, and a potentially valuable ally. Keeping her on your side costs nothing and means everything. You don’t cash out an investment before it matures.
If the Lannisters rule by the stick, the Tyrell's rule by the carrot. They're a great showcase that devious and cunning doesn't actually mean cruel or evil.
@@hothotheat3000 I always liked the idea that Margaery genuinely likes Sansa and wants to help her stay safe and be her friend while doing her political maneuvering.
@Corey I like the idea, but I don’t know if it’s necessarily true. She does talk to Sansa more than she really needs to, but that could just be her maintaining an alliance that can be cashed in if she needs to in the future. She comforts Sansa about her marriage to Tyrion, but she also mentions that Sansa’s potential son with Tyrion would be the heir to Casterly Rock AND the North, AND says boys learn from their moms. If Margaery is in good with Sansa, Margaery’s kids will also be in good with Sansa’s kids. Long-term alliance building. I don’t think Margaery dislikes Sansa, but I also don’t think she’d be so caring if Sansa had absolutely no value.
*Olenna thinking*: Bitch, bring me my cheese, b/c Sansa is clearly hiding something and your presence is making her hide it! God Olenna is a smart woman.
Olenna asks specifically for the cheese. The boy has to run further to get it, so it takes longer for him to get back. So there are fewer interruptions. And Olenna and Margaery have time to win Sansa's trust and have her speak freely. Little details like that make Olenna all the better.
The Tyrell method of manipulation is one that uses trust and vulnerability. They make you feel safe with telling your thoughts and act as if they care, sometimes going far as telling something about themselves to you that seems like a personal secret but in reality doesn't matter much. Compare that to other characters like Tywin who use intimidation and fear to manipulate or Daenerys who uses silence or appears naive until she decides to show that she is smarter than everyone expected.
@@SwirlyisCool Dany doesn't use silence she uses the same one liner all the time about being mother of dragons and her family name and so on before she burns someone.
@@lorkhan8565 idk how to explain it other than saying silence, because two of her major achievements (Unsullied and Dothraki) happened because she starts out quiet before she tells everyone who she is or uses her one liner. When she got the Unsullied by pretending to not know Valyrian and only speaking when the translator responds before she told everyone who she was and burned them down. And there was the time when she was captured by the Dothraki and remained silent until she surprised them by speaking in Dothraki or speaks up in Vaes Dothrak before burning them all down. You can even see it when she meets Jon- she barely speaks to or towards him at first until she felt like making a statement about how she deserves to rule Westeros. The way I see it, she keeps silent before she speaks in order to leverage herself or appear as if she is carefully thinking about what to say next, which is why I said she uses silence. Of course that doesn't mean everything that comes out of her mouth is actually smart. Lol.
This scene was even better in the books. They met in a ball room rather then a garden with many of the other Tyrell women. When Sansa was hesitant to speak her mind Olenna ordered the court fool to sing a song to distract anyone who might be eavesdropping on them. When Sansa was still hesitant, she then ordered the fool to SCREAM the song and throughout the next few pages there is several breaks in the dialogue where the fool is screaming The Bear and the Maiden Fair in ALL CAPS. It’s honestly one of my favorite moments from the entire book series and serves as a perfect intro to Olenna’s character.
I think the Hound said it best that whoever Sansa was going to marry is going to be a killer and she will birth killers so Margery was more realistic that she was gonna mary a man that would likely create death for others but as long as she could manipulate him and he would be nice to her she can live with being a queen.
1:36 I think Olenna and Margaery had heard rumors and stories about Joffrey's sadism. It's not like he made any real effort to hide it. Hearing about it firsthand just confirmed what they already suspected.
In the books, when Petyr Baelish goes to settle the Lannister-Tyrell alliance, he praises Joff to the skies in front of the Tyrells, but makes his servants tell the true tale about Joff in the kitchens and yards, to make sure Olenna hears. It was all planned.
Yeah if you go back about 30 seconds you hear her mention that they have heard some troubling tales. Even in the first episode Robb says something along the line of "I hear the prince is a royal prick"
I think what Olenna is specifically doing here is 1) making an ally of Sansa. Having the North Kingdom as a friend would be advantagous if the Lannisters discorved the Tyrells poisoning of the king, and 2) verifying that Joff is truly a piece of shit in public AND private, to know if there was any chance of Margery safely controlling Joff.
Yeah, especially the way Olenna barely reacted to Sansa saying "he's a monster". She clearly had her suspicions but probably needed to hear firsthandhow bad he really was from someone who knew Joffrey the way Sansa did. Probably one of the most satisfying deaths in ANY SHOW. PLEASE COMMENT BELOW OTHER SATISFYING VILLAIN DEATHS IN SHOWS
Sansa's expression at the end is honestly my favorite part of this scene, she's just admitted out loud for the first time the horrible position that she's in, in front of two women who seem totally unfazed by it, and she comes to this realization that she's in deep shi**, alone, and has no idea how to play the game.
Sansa did have some idea how to play the game though... she survived so long in Kings Landing because she essentially was playing the game. She was a sheltered child thrown into a place with cruel people who she couldn't trust and she never allowed herself to, how good she became at lying and twisting the truth to be better at lying progressed really well.
Your comment make me see this scene as a mirror of a scene it was just mentioned in the book (no fully narrated), Sansa goes to Cercei and tell her Ned is going to take his family back to the north. That let Cercei go ahead, she rejoice in the information she got without even looking for it. Now Sansa again share information with powerful women that are her hope. Still a innocent kid at this point
@@iris-xo i will add that she catching up late was the fault of her parents. All the other houses teach their kids about don't being naive and they tried to work together as a team. When Joffrey reveal his true nature with the incident of the baker boy (that lead to the kill of Sansa's wolf) Ned told to Arya that was okay that Sansa lied about Joffrey behavior, because now she was promised to him Sansa has to play in Joffrey team. Any other house would treat her daughter as a double spy into the enemy line. But Sansa and Arya learn the lesson and took down little finger, refusing to fight and recalling that ohana means family
@@jessicav931 exactly that's something many viewers till this day refuse to acknowledge. It's made clear as sheltered the stark GIRLS are. It's a fault that a lot of fathers have is sheltering their daughters to try and protect them from a cruel world, but it's better to raise them to know how cruel the world is so they won't be caught off guard and taken advantage of. Sansa's resiliency is extremely admirable, not many people can survive what she did, being so isolated and terrified for so many years with no one to truly trust and talk to. She adapted pretty quickly after her father's death. People like to pretend Ned was a perfect man, but he was far from it and was terrible at playing the game, he made dumb mistakes that could've been avoided honestly.
@@TheEvertw I didn't realize her work went back that far and she was such a hottie. Quite something, would like to see some of her work from back in the day sometime.
I always felt sorry that Tyrion or Sansa didn't actually get the chance for revenge on Joffrey. But after watching this scene again I realized it was Sansa who had indirectly killed Joffrey, saying he was a monster convinced Olenna to kill him.
There was no such justice in GoT. It's just about personal goals and vengeance, so implying Olenna giving a single care about Sansa's situation is pretty naive. I suggest she just realized Sansa isn't committed at all to the royal family since this dumb brat Joffrey unnecessarily executed her dad in public while having a boner about it. So she's not an obstacle in any mean to Olenna and basically, anyone who despises the Baratheon-Lannister's pack. Sansa was just a young girl victim of her own dreams about living the perfect life with the charmant prince.
Sansa telling Joffrey is a Monster to The Tyrells is ironically helping her out of her misery. Had Sansa still in King's Landing, she will be tortured forever by The Lannisters (Mostly to Cersei, Tywin and Joffrey). Eventhough later she met Ramsay and then she escaped and got her home back.
Anyone else find it actually comedic how the tension in the music builds up and she's like "he's a monster" and then the tense music stops and Olenna is just like "ah, well that's a pity"
@@MCSPARTAN501 Yes... they already knew. Lady Olenna even mention that she heard trouble news about Joffrey. They just want to know if his wife could suffer the same fate. When Sansa confirmed that he was a monster... Olenna find out that Margaery could suffer the same violence... This was the true information they wanted to Know. If Margaery as wife, was protected or would suffer like the rest!
1:32 and with that simple line, Sansa Stark sets off a series of events that nobody would have expected: Joffrey's murder; Oberyn's death, resulting in the revenge of Ellaria with Myrcella's murder and the fall of house Martell; Tywin killed by Tyrion; Margaery married Tommen; the faith militant taking power over King's Landing; the fall of house Tyrell; Tommen's suicide and Cersei's reign. *It was an amazing domino effect.*
I just want to say how wonderful it is that neither of them revealed what Sansa said and took it to their graves. Olenna even allowed Sansa and unknowing hand in the bastard's death.
They also tried to get her out of Kings Landing and to the safety of Highgarden by attempting to betroth her to Loras, and Margaery went out of her way to not only listen to Sansa when she was speaking about her betrothal to Tyrion but she also went out of her way to comfort her by reminding her that Tyrion isn’t like the rest of his family. And she tried very hard to try and keep BOTH Sansa in a low profile by trying to distract Joffrey as much as she could.
oddly enough, both Margery and Olenna Tyrell sold me, hook-line & sinker, on their ability to play the game in their own unique ways. Olenna always used her age and look to shock people with how sharp her mind and tongue were. Margery was very unique in that she was the only person in the shows history who outright made people do what she wanted because she made them like her.
Did anyone notice that Sansa has become something like an angel of death, similarly like her sister, Arya? Both sisters get retribution on those who have inflicted harm on their family--either indirectly or directly. Here, Sansa indirectly and unknowingly sets everything into motion by informing Lady Oleanna of Joffrey's cruelty and mania. By doing this, she unknowingly plays a hand in not only Joffrey's demise, but also the decline of the Lannister House--Joffrey's death caused Tommen to marry Margaery and assume the throne, and cause Tyrion to get arrested and later escape and kill Tywin which submerged their house into further instability and turmoil. As you recall, Tyrion had chosen Oberyn Martell to fight for him in a trial by combat. With Oberyn's death, Elia Martell and The Sandsnakes sought retribution by killing Myrcella. Back at King's Landing, by Tommen's marriage and infatuation with Margaery, Cersei becomes jealous and takes control of the Faith Militant and has Margaery arrested (and herself as well). Later, Cersei gets vengeance on both the Faith Militant and the Tyrells by blowing up the Sept, which thus caused Tommen to commit suicide. In S7, Jaime, Cersei's sole ally and arguably the only person she has loved with the exception of her children, abandons her to ride North to Winterfell for Sansa, claiming that "Sansa Stark is his last chance for honor," thus fulfilling the witch's prophecy of a "younger, more beautiful queen, coming to cast you down and take everything you hold dear." Similar events transpire with the Bolton House. By Sansa's marriage to Ramsay, she plummets that house into chaos and disorder. When she runs away with Theon, her actions cause Ramsay, fearful of losing his legitimization and inheritance, to kill Roose, Walda Frey and his baby brother, thus leaving him the last Bolton. When Sansa executes Ramsay (epic and poetic justice at its best), she causes another house to become extinct and vanquishes another enemy to House Stark. Lastly, Littlefinger, the man who masterminded and executed it all...By his execution, she helps get justice for her family for all the hell that visited them.
Wow, I've never seen it that way, it's a great point! Sansa is a cool character, regardless. No Faceless Assassin, no plot-armoured Mary Sue, no revived Messiah, just a normal girl with a normal upbringing for this era, her skills and flaws. Gotta love her evolution.
She's a Stark who can do politics. Of course her road was the hardest. Slow to learn indeed. Buncha snowheads. The last Stark who could play people was Sansa's grandfather, and he got Sansa's uncle killed.
The only times she ever killed someone was Ramsay through his hungry dogs who hadn't been fed for a week. You can see how satisfied she is after killed him.
Oh how I wish the whole show would have kept being this great for its entirety. The amazing script, the amazing acting, the amazing scenography, everything was perfect. These scenes keep you glued to the screen, they were just so well done.
It's a shame what happened. They ran out of source material and decided to rush the plot while butchering every character along the way. At the end, all who were still alive acted like complete idiots. And don't get me started on fast travel and "subverted expectations". Seasons 1 to 4 are still great and will always be.
Everything else aside, the acting remained great throughout. Every actor gave stunning performances. I wouldn’t blame the actors at all because this show had some of the best acting out there.
@@elliinspace Absolutely. The actors remained brilliant till the end. The show didn't do them justice enough. But yes, I wish GOT remained what it was until that stupid ending.
Yeah she throws Sansa under the bus, but it was either her or Margaery, and at least Sansa is out of King's Landing...and with one of the craziest people on TV.
Rosebunse She knew that somehow Sansa would be a suspect in Joffrey's death. No matter who took the blame Sansa will always have the greatest motivation to see him dead. The only person who was in a position to get her out of Kingslanding was Littlefinger . He's a dangerous and untrustworthy man, but at this point, Sansa would be safer North of the Wall then Kingslanding.
At the wedding, she offers to take Sansa to Highgarden. Her plan seemed to be to take her away from King's Landing. Tyrion, whoever, she DID throw under the bus (only after Cersei had "decided" it had been him).
All these people who watch the show and think that the Tyrells are good and honest are missing the whole point. They are just as manipulative and power-hungry as the Lannisters and aside from Tywin and Tyrion and they are much more clever as well. Margaery's "charity" is not kindness, is a tactic to gain support in the public eye. She is using Sansa and has already shown immense power over Joffrey through her use of flattery. Once she is Queen the true nature of the Tyrell's will surface.
I think so too. I haven't read the books so I don't know what she's going to do but every time I see Margaery do something nice there is always the question 'what's her angle'?
My reading was pretty much in line with yours, they're just as power hungry and manipulative as the Lannisters the only differences being their methods don't inspire as much hate and they don't step on the toes of others unless it serves some higher purpose (which is why they have the better PR). Though it seems that Margery and Olenna (at least on the show) is capable enough of kindness so long as it doesn't harm their objectives.
The biggest difference between the Lannisters and the Tyrells is the one that really matters though. The Lannisters believe in using fear and terror to make people do what they want, the Tyrells use adoration and care. That forges stronger bonds
It is a tactic, but it doesn't mean that Margaery isn't sincere in her wish to help people. I see it almost as the "first lady's cause", which is expected that they have one, but they get to decide what cause is important to them to pursue. Especially with a house as rich as the Tyrell's and in a time of war where people on the streets are starving, charity will go a long way in establishing her PR.
This is when Sansa won me over. In S2 I felt so bad for her, but I loved her from this scene forward. People still really hate her guts because of her behavior in S1 and forget she was a child. Sansa was a pampered, spoiled child, and she wasn't raised to rule, so she didn't know better. She trusted Littlefinger for way too long, but I can understand what her thinking might have been: "He saved me, so he must want what's best for me." She learned how to wear a mask until it was safe. It's not until the last couple seasons that people start realizing how intelligent she is because she doesn't have to hide it anymore. Also, she even says she learned a lot from Cersei, so...that. I love that in the beginning she wanted to be a southerner so badly, but by the end she was a true northerner, and was loyal to her family and her people. Loveeee herrrrr
Yea it's good of course to have a character like her, exceptionally new to the game having to deal with all the intricacies. I was hoping they would actually have her do a bit more of the court intrigue at least come season 4 .. but well.. yea.
At 0:51 you can see Sansa’s face change, the mask slips off and Olenna sees that and stops talking so Sansa can speak, it’s a wonderful bit of acting on both of their parts. You actually see Sansa’s face become harsher and more alive.
+RikkiTikkiTavi Sansa is pretty but she has very sharp features, Margery has very delicate features - she 's more feminine. Natalie Dormer is stunning!!
Such a heart wrenching, bittersweet moment. Sansa was finally treated with some much-needed kindness by these two good souls, and allowed to speak her truth.
Sophie turner is impeccable in this scene. Just really sells the scattered and flustered mind of someone who’s been effectively held hostage for months/ years
Obviously Olenna rules every scene she's in, but Natalie Dormer really brought a huge amount to Margaery. She had very little to work with from the books too.
All the Tyrells do. None of them are POV characters. That they became fan favorites was die to the good casting and the changes made. The show was good when it was adapting or even improving on the material.
I love the detail where Margaery just raises her eyebrows and takes a bite like “lol okay then I guess I’ll work with that.” Because she’s that confident that she can manipulate him either way 😂
1:39 i really love how unsurprised and matter-of-fact they both are when it's confirmed that joffrey is a monster (and, by corollary, they were going to assassinate him rather than let margaery get married to him). margaery's little eyebrow flick as she eats a piece of fruit is just 👌🏻
Margaery didn’t know about that still. I think this is the face of someone who knew the level would be difficult, and just have it confirmed. A big « aaaand shit » hidden behind humor. On the other hand, Grandma and her « it’s a pity then » totally speak about the murder she just decided.
The thing you have to remember is that Joffrey was kept in line by his parents when he wasn't the one in power - he craved Robert's attention and Robert found Joffrey's cruelty horrific and beat him for it when it was caught. Cersei encouraged him to be cruel, but discrete, and the other Lannisters enforced his behavior. He only started acting out publicly post-crowning, and the people who would've seen it were commoners and members of the King's Court who didn't leave KL during the war.
@@nicholaskenneth113 Once. As a kid, Joffrey cut open a pregnant cat to see what's inside, and didn’t give two shits about the fact that he just killed a cat. Robert was rightly horrified and punched him hard enough to knock him out.
While the Tyrells are players of the game just like the Lannisters, I have yet to see the Tyrells kill someone good or decent on the show, so far only a monster. They have my sword!
+Landis963 Just for the sake of argument that was more Littlefinger's plan. Make sure Tyrion takes the fall helps cover his tracks AND frees Sansa up for marriage.
Landis963 Except it was Littlefinger who arranged the dwarf battle (according to a video I saw anyways) which brought Tyrion to attention. Cercei believes that Tyrion is going to kill her thanks to Maggy the Frog's prophecy.
The main thing which is missing from this scene is Butterbumps. ''AND DOWN THE ROAD FROM HERE TO THERE. FROM HERE! TO THERE! THREE BOYS, A GOAT, AND A DANCING BEAR!''
This scene was so much better in the books. I loved the show's version as well but it's more interesting in the books since it's the first time Sansa meets the Tyrells.
martythetickler No, actually. Edric Storm's parents were both highborn (Robert Baratheon and Delena Florent), but he is still called "Storm". Nymeria Sand's parents are both noble (Oberyn Martell and some noblewoman from Volantis), but she is still a "Sand". Bastards are named for where they were born (making it so half-sibilings may have different surnames, like Edric and Mya.), so technically, he would be Joffrey Waters (assuming he was born in King's Landing). However, he would only use that name if he were acknowledged by Jaime, but he hasn't been formally recognized as Jaime's son. That would make him like Gendry, who is an unacknowledged bastard and therefore unable to really use a surname.
This is one of my favorite scenes in the show. Turner is fantastic at conveying the subtle nuances in Sansa's brewing despise toward jeoffrey conflicting with the fear of punishment for telling the truth that had been burnished into her throughout her time in King's landing. So powerful when you think of it from Marjory and her Grandmother's point of view.
People hate on Sansa, but I love Sophie's acting here. You can truly feel the hatred in her voice when she tells them about Joffrey executing her father.
"Have no fear! The lord oaf of Highgarden is determined that Margaery shall be queen." Lord Tyrell may call the shots, but Olenna truly makes all of the plays.
They're so comforting to her...I think their comforting words made sansa feel listened to and cared about for the first time in a long time. They never lied to her or betrayed her...I wish Margaery would have lived, she would have taken care of Sansa or taken her to Olena
Margaery may have cared for Sansa but it was only to an extent. She would never die for her and would never fully risk her neck to lose her chance at becoming THE Queen. Plus, the two obviously saw the benefits of befriending Sansa too. They most certainly cared about her well being as a person but they cared about what she had to offer more.
The "that's a pity" and Maergery's side eye tell how strong the women of House Tyrell really are, Olenna is not surprised and already planning a way to protect her granddaughter, Maergery is not afraid and knows she'll have to handle (like when she seems fascinated by Joffrey's crossbow, it looked so out of character for viewers but she was seducing him because that's one of talent of Tyrells women).
Knowing Westeros and how its a cruel and harsh world I'm surprised Cersei didn't find out about the poison and switch it was Sansa's or something and kill her. Love her delivery of that line "He's a monster" chilling.
+ch5412 How would she have had the opportunity? The poison was in Joffrey's cup for less than a minute before he drank it. Also, she would have needed to notice a) Sansa's new necklace and b) Olenna's sleight-of-hand with said necklace. And she's not the most observant of people.
+ch5412 Littlefinger was trying to kill Joffrey. Littlefinger had the 2nd most impressive spy network in Westeros next to Varys. If Littlefinger didn't want Cersei to know about the plot, she wasn't going to know. Varys was literally the only person who could have tipped her off, but he didn't know about it (since so few people were involved and they covered their tracks well). Even if Varys had been aware, I doubt he would have done much to save Joffrey at this point, having seen firsthand on numerous occasions how terrible of a king he was.
Hahaha poor Joffrey his fate has been decided the moment they learned his true colours...there is a reason House Tyrell rose from nothing to be the second richest House in the Seven Kingdoms. A rose no matter how sweet has thorns after all.
House Tyrell gets is led by Olenna and she was born a RedWyne. There's no real indication that the Tyrells where a especially powerful house before than. They were granted the Reach by Aegon the conqueror. Simply for yielding to him after their Liege Lord (house Gardner) was killed in the field of fire.
ahahaha House Tyrell has always been cunning...they weren't the original ruling house they convinced the ruling house to fight the Targaryens then gave up to the Targaryens when the leading house was killed. In reward THEY were made the ruling house.
Whenever I see Olenna I can only think of my grandmother. She's also stubborn and smart, made her way through a successful business which my other relatives used to build their own careers. She's always bossing everyone and gives the best advices- sadly she's allergic cheese.
This scene just makes me emotional. To be so young in a position that Sansa is in. Where you can't trust ANYBODY. Not even other women. But to feel fully believed. In a single, solitary moment. Must have been such a relief.
The thing I find tragic about Sansa is not only did she have to deal with Joffrey being a monster, he wasn't even nearly as bad as the Monster she ended up with afterwords, Ramsay Bolton was worse to her then Joffrey was, seriously the torment and suffering this poor woman had to endure before eventually returning to "Winterfell" was unspeakable. What was unsettling about this scene was the reaction of Lady Olenna and Margaery Tyrell after Sansa says "he's a monster" they were kind of like Eh!🤷 🤨 almost like it didn't phase them in the way you anticipated they would.
They haven't suffered before. They don't understand. It's like telling a child that as a child you were bullied. Sometimes they just can't imagine it happening to them.
Man I feel for Sansa so much here. I’ve been in a situation similar to hers, where unless I towed the party line, and otherwise kept my mouth shut, I’d be physically harmed. It took a significant amount of effort from other people to get me to tell the truth of my situation, bc my fears of retaliation were so great. Honestly, Sansa held up better than I would have if I’m honest.
mmmmmmmmmmm.....................I'm gonna say Bran takes that title of GoT Winner. Must be nice to have everyone drag your half-paralyzed ass all over the kingdoms while you talk to ghosts and manipulate and old guy who can only repeat one word. You only have to say a couple of lines, and then just sit in a wheelchair doing nothing except watch everyone else kill each other off. Then at the very end you're crowned King of the Iron Throne.
1:19 This--she just totally starts to crack apart in panic. The poor girl.. She has been just....traumatized over and over again 1:38 i so love the flatline there. And Margaery's like, "Eh, typical."
This was such an emotional scene for me in the books, and I thought they adapted it well. It was Sansa's first real chance to release some pressure from all that abuse and trauma, and she's so broken already by mistrust that getting her to speak is like trying to hand feed a feral animal. She's just sure this is a trap, someone is listening, and she'll be abused or killed for speaking ill of Joffrey. Definitely an early glimpse of Sansa's backbone.
Кино
The moment Sansa sentenced Joffrey to die.
+Pierre C My god I never thought of it that way! It's so true tho!
+Shakira Daley cersei seems very capable of doing all that on her own.
Why are you spoiling? This is a season 3 video, people that are at season 3 watch this!
Valentina Anna Mihely As much as I can be, I'm sorry! It was just a comment in response to something someone below me said. I had no idea it would get so many upvotes and end up at the top of the thread.
Do not read the comments until you are done with all the seasons! I made the same mistake as you did and a lot was ruined for me :(
"he's a monster."
"oh. cool, we prepped for that"
um ofcourse they did , if it meant being queen shed marry a goat .
Hehehehe
Fantastic
Even Marjorie just looks mildly disappointed, like she said she caught a cold lol.
Marjorie
"Please don't stop the wedding"
"Have no fear, I will poison Joffrey anyway"
she stopped the wedding by weeding the weeds
My interpretation was Olenna determining if Joffrey needed to be poisoned. If Sansa said he was kind and gentle she may had just spared him.
Then again I'm probably looking to far into a joke.
She knew how marriages could be good or abusive. There’s no way she would let her granddaughter be harmed so she decided then Jeoffrey must go. She had to look at her options and hoped the next son would marry her
@@justsomeguywithagoatee8337 she wouldn’t have killed him. She took a gamble because there’s no guarantees he next in line would marry margery. But she would make sure her granddaughter would be safe no matter what.
No doubt she heard the rumors of how cruel jeoffrey was. Even if his family tired to keept played down
@@whitedragoness23 Your comment confuses me (I think I know why, it's probably on me). Margery and Olenna are there because at this point Margery is marrying Joffrey, no?
Even Olenna's words to Margery: "I wouldn't let you be married to him(Joffrey)". Sum it up.
"He's a monster." "Oh. That's a pity." -most understated reaction ever XD
Olenna's a savage. But in the good way xD
thats why she made a great mother for Marg, both are witty, and both look A LOT alike.
I know right. I was like... wtf? Daaaaaaaaaamn
Ahh here’s my cheese
And she looks at Margaery, who has this sort of "Yep, that checks out." resignation on her face.
In a way, Sansa cemented Joffrey's death here. Olenna wasn't going to let Margaery marry him after she'd heard that.
not as if anyones complaining
of course not! the asshole had to go
I'm glad it was her, if anyone deserved to condemn Joffrey, surely it was Sansa. Joffrey's done a lot of fucked up shit to a lot of people, but nothing tops the unbelievable completely unprovoked sadistic things he did to Sansa, one of the most innocent main characters on the show
***** This is the where you drop the gasoline. and in the wedding you set the flames on! =)
***** I thought so as well. The prick deserved much worse though.
“Have no fear, we shall never betray your trust…”
This is the only time someone said that truthfully to Sansa.
lmao she poisoned Joffrey and let sansa take the blame 😅
and used her necklace as the vessel
Well since Olenna worked with Littlefinger to kill Joffrey she probably helped plan Sansa’s escape as well, meaning that she truly wanted Sansa to be safe. Plus she and Margaery showed themselves to have genuine human consideration for Sansa because they knew that even though they would have some control over the North by having Sansa wed Loras they also knew that Sansa would’ve been happier and safer in Highgarden than in King’s Landing and that she would be with a kind decent husband in Loras. Gay or not I think he would’ve treated her well and those 2 probably would’ve had a good relationship with each other down the line if they wed. And Olenna and Margaery knew that. Plus Margaery did still spend time with Sansa even after that plot failed and consoled her on her forced marriage to Tyrion. Plus she showed genuine concern for Sansa at the Purple Wedding, trying to get Joffrey away from the girl. And unlike Olenna, Margaery knew nothing of the plan to kill Joffrey, meaning that she never turned on Sansa at all or put her in danger in her schemes, despite her having an ulterior motive. Because of all of this I think Olenna and Margaery genuinely cared for Sansa to an extent and really were her friends. For Olenna I think 80% was just her playing the game but 20% of her cared and for Margaery I think 70% of her was playing the game but 30% she cared for Sansa. I think Margaery liked Sansa more than Olenna did.
@@jonniefast no she didn't she let Sansa take the blame.
@@nightowl3218 you really think if things went south that they would stick their neck out for a dying/"treasonous" house stark?
I love how Sansa never breaks her masquerade of praising and adoring Joffrey for anyone but when she finally does, she tells the best possible person she could've told. Olenna decided to kill Joffrey the moment she found out he's a monster and it's all thanks to Sansa.
Yes exactly. I adore Sansa for that. She never made a mistake after her initial one because she knows how much it cost her the first time.
In the show, did Olena ever tell Sansa that she was the one responsible for killing Joffrey, and it was all because Sansa told her the truth that day? I can't remember, but I'd like to think that Sansa felt some type of personal revenge for being the one to tell the Tyrell's the truth about Joffrey, and also being the one who delivered the poison to the actual assassin who used it to kill Joffrey. His death remains one of the most satisfying deaths of Game of Thrones!
@@jamesteegardner2273 Olena never saw Sansa again after Joffrey's death.
@@jamesteegardner2273 No she didn't sadly. I'll add Little Finger's death on that list lol
Olenna would’ve killed Joffrey with or without Sansa’s statement here. Everyone in King’s Landing knew that Joffrey was a monster, it’s not like Olenna found out in this scene. It’s not all thanks to Sansa.
Well...I mean Lady Olenna is many things, but she's no liar. She didn't betray Sansa's trust...she just used her as a mobile poison repository. I love this woman.
She's a hag as well.
You're talking about the character, rather than the actress, who was in her mid 70's here. But to let you know: Diana Rigg was no hag back in the day. In 1999 the readers of TV Guide voted her the sexiest TV star of all time, male or female, for her work in the Avengers (1961 - 1969).
WHAT!!!!
Is Lady Olena Miss Emma Peel?
runs to look it up.
Holy Hell, I had no idea.
She's the best
She even planned to get her out of King's Landing, both in books and TV series. Only Petyr Baelish acted sooner.
I have always loved the fact that even though Margaery was slick and had an agenda, she NEVER betrayed Sansa...not once.
It wouldn’t have been in her best interest to do so. Sansa is still a Stark, a high born lady, and a potentially valuable ally. Keeping her on your side costs nothing and means everything. You don’t cash out an investment before it matures.
I wish we could’ve seen more interactions between the Starks and Tyrells through these ladies
If the Lannisters rule by the stick, the Tyrell's rule by the carrot. They're a great showcase that devious and cunning doesn't actually mean cruel or evil.
@@hothotheat3000 I always liked the idea that Margaery genuinely likes Sansa and wants to help her stay safe and be her friend while doing her political maneuvering.
@Corey I like the idea, but I don’t know if it’s necessarily true. She does talk to Sansa more than she really needs to, but that could just be her maintaining an alliance that can be cashed in if she needs to in the future. She comforts Sansa about her marriage to Tyrion, but she also mentions that Sansa’s potential son with Tyrion would be the heir to Casterly Rock AND the North, AND says boys learn from their moms. If Margaery is in good with Sansa, Margaery’s kids will also be in good with Sansa’s kids. Long-term alliance building. I don’t think Margaery dislikes Sansa, but I also don’t think she’d be so caring if Sansa had absolutely no value.
Olenna: bring me my cheese
Servant: your cheese will be served after your cake
Olenna: bitch I said bring me my cheese
Olenna knows her priorities.
"did I fucking stutter?"
*Olenna thinking*: Bitch, bring me my cheese, b/c Sansa is clearly hiding something and your presence is making her hide it!
God Olenna is a smart woman.
You just don't fuck around with cheese though. It's IMPORTANT! It's cheese!
Lol
Olenna asks specifically for the cheese. The boy has to run further to get it, so it takes longer for him to get back. So there are fewer interruptions. And Olenna and Margaery have time to win Sansa's trust and have her speak freely.
Little details like that make Olenna all the better.
I never thought about that! So true! Damn I miss these two. I still love Sansa, though. She has grown into quite the strong character.
The Tyrell method of manipulation is one that uses trust and vulnerability. They make you feel safe with telling your thoughts and act as if they care, sometimes going far as telling something about themselves to you that seems like a personal secret but in reality doesn't matter much. Compare that to other characters like Tywin who use intimidation and fear to manipulate or Daenerys who uses silence or appears naive until she decides to show that she is smarter than everyone expected.
@@SwirlyisCool Dany doesn't use silence she uses the same one liner all the time about being mother of dragons and her family name and so on before she burns someone.
@@lorkhan8565 idk how to explain it other than saying silence, because two of her major achievements (Unsullied and Dothraki) happened because she starts out quiet before she tells everyone who she is or uses her one liner. When she got the Unsullied by pretending to not know Valyrian and only speaking when the translator responds before she told everyone who she was and burned them down. And there was the time when she was captured by the Dothraki and remained silent until she surprised them by speaking in Dothraki or speaks up in Vaes Dothrak before burning them all down. You can even see it when she meets Jon- she barely speaks to or towards him at first until she felt like making a statement about how she deserves to rule Westeros.
The way I see it, she keeps silent before she speaks in order to leverage herself or appear as if she is carefully thinking about what to say next, which is why I said she uses silence. Of course that doesn't mean everything that comes out of her mouth is actually smart. Lol.
This scene was even better in the books. They met in a ball room rather then a garden with many of the other Tyrell women. When Sansa was hesitant to speak her mind Olenna ordered the court fool to sing a song to distract anyone who might be eavesdropping on them. When Sansa was still hesitant, she then ordered the fool to SCREAM the song and throughout the next few pages there is several breaks in the dialogue where the fool is screaming The Bear and the Maiden Fair in ALL CAPS. It’s honestly one of my favorite moments from the entire book series and serves as a perfect intro to Olenna’s character.
Sansa: He's a monster
Margery: meh
Actually i dont really know about her expression
Margery: Meh.... As if we didn't know that already
Actually it was the moment she decided to murder him.
Sansa sentenced Joffrey to die here. Olenna is merciless
I think the Hound said it best that whoever Sansa was going to marry is going to be a killer and she will birth killers so Margery was more realistic that she was gonna mary a man that would likely create death for others but as long as she could manipulate him and he would be nice to her she can live with being a queen.
Considering the actress, Margery, played Anne Boleyn she’s used to monster kings.
I feel sorry for Sansa.She learned the hard way that the fantasy prince she dream of doesn't exist
+Andreea Cozma Her princes are Sandor (My baby) and Tyrion with a hint of Petyr
mabye, but surely not what she expected. Also hope Sandor is alive.
Tyrion exists.
Sandor is alive
GORDON'S ALIVE
Margaery's face at 1:38
"Oh well. I got this."
Kyle Shire More like "Oh.. I thought as much"
"Well damn."
Oh well, so it’s Tommen then
"Oh, that's a pithy" ahem guess I'll just kill him then ahem
Well, she could, actually. Even Cersei admitted that she could manipulate Joffrey, which is an amazing feat considering how witless he is.
1:36 I think Olenna and Margaery had heard rumors and stories about Joffrey's sadism. It's not like he made any real effort to hide it. Hearing about it firsthand just confirmed what they already suspected.
In the books, when Petyr Baelish goes to settle the Lannister-Tyrell alliance, he praises Joff to the skies in front of the Tyrells, but makes his servants tell the true tale about Joff in the kitchens and yards, to make sure Olenna hears. It was all planned.
Yeah if you go back about 30 seconds you hear her mention that they have heard some troubling tales. Even in the first episode Robb says something along the line of "I hear the prince is a royal prick"
yupp. Like , oh looks like the rumors weree true
I think what Olenna is specifically doing here is 1) making an ally of Sansa. Having the North Kingdom as a friend would be advantagous if the Lannisters discorved the Tyrells poisoning of the king, and 2) verifying that Joff is truly a piece of shit in public AND private, to know if there was any chance of Margery safely controlling Joff.
Yeah, especially the way Olenna barely reacted to Sansa saying "he's a monster". She clearly had her suspicions but probably needed to hear firsthandhow bad he really was from someone who knew Joffrey the way Sansa did. Probably one of the most satisfying deaths in ANY SHOW. PLEASE COMMENT BELOW OTHER SATISFYING VILLAIN DEATHS IN SHOWS
oh there's my cheese lol
Matt here is your 101th like and i would like to say LOL!
lol
Almost as good as Margery saying "Oh there's the cake!" at tge wedding.
Sansa's expression at the end is honestly my favorite part of this scene, she's just admitted out loud for the first time the horrible position that she's in, in front of two women who seem totally unfazed by it, and she comes to this realization that she's in deep shi**, alone, and has no idea how to play the game.
Sansa did have some idea how to play the game though... she survived so long in Kings Landing because she essentially was playing the game. She was a sheltered child thrown into a place with cruel people who she couldn't trust and she never allowed herself to, how good she became at lying and twisting the truth to be better at lying progressed really well.
Your comment make me see this scene as a mirror of a scene it was just mentioned in the book (no fully narrated), Sansa goes to Cercei and tell her Ned is going to take his family back to the north. That let Cercei go ahead, she rejoice in the information she got without even looking for it. Now Sansa again share information with powerful women that are her hope. Still a innocent kid at this point
@@iris-xo i will add that she catching up late was the fault of her parents. All the other houses teach their kids about don't being naive and they tried to work together as a team. When Joffrey reveal his true nature with the incident of the baker boy (that lead to the kill of Sansa's wolf) Ned told to Arya that was okay that Sansa lied about Joffrey behavior, because now she was promised to him Sansa has to play in Joffrey team. Any other house would treat her daughter as a double spy into the enemy line. But Sansa and Arya learn the lesson and took down little finger, refusing to fight and recalling that ohana means family
@@jessicav931 exactly that's something many viewers till this day refuse to acknowledge. It's made clear as sheltered the stark GIRLS are. It's a fault that a lot of fathers have is sheltering their daughters to try and protect them from a cruel world, but it's better to raise them to know how cruel the world is so they won't be caught off guard and taken advantage of. Sansa's resiliency is extremely admirable, not many people can survive what she did, being so isolated and terrified for so many years with no one to truly trust and talk to. She adapted pretty quickly after her father's death. People like to pretend Ned was a perfect man, but he was far from it and was terrible at playing the game, he made dumb mistakes that could've been avoided honestly.
@@jessicav931 Ohana means family😌
RIP Diana Rigg. Thank you for this absolute LEGEND of a character.
My first boyhood crush, she was.
In her role as Emma Peel, just to clarify.
@@TheEvertw I didn't realize her work went back that far and she was such a hottie. Quite something, would like to see some of her work from back in the day sometime.
We love you SO much Dame Diana Rigg
I really thought you meant Margery, then I googled, damn son she was a such a beauty
Whaaaaaaaaat nooooo
I always felt sorry that Tyrion or Sansa didn't actually get the chance for revenge on Joffrey. But after watching this scene again I realized it was Sansa who had indirectly killed Joffrey, saying he was a monster convinced Olenna to kill him.
Olenna and Margaery would have caught on to Joffrey soon enough, even without Sansa having said anything.
There was no such justice in GoT. It's just about personal goals and vengeance, so implying Olenna giving a single care about Sansa's situation is pretty naive.
I suggest she just realized Sansa isn't committed at all to the royal family since this dumb brat Joffrey unnecessarily executed her dad in public while having a boner about it.
So she's not an obstacle in any mean to Olenna and basically, anyone who despises the Baratheon-Lannister's pack.
Sansa was just a young girl victim of her own dreams about living the perfect life with the charmant prince.
Sansa telling Joffrey is a Monster to The Tyrells is ironically helping her out of her misery. Had Sansa still in King's Landing, she will be tortured forever by The Lannisters (Mostly to Cersei, Tywin and Joffrey). Eventhough later she met Ramsay and then she escaped and got her home back.
@@marysueeasteregg but maybe much later on... but people never seem to recognize sansa's parts in the story as important...
Sansa let the dogs out
and Tyrion had his double murder.
They got theirs plenty, both giving and taking.
Anyone else find it actually comedic how the tension in the music builds up and she's like "he's a monster" and then the tense music stops and Olenna is just like "ah, well that's a pity"
And Margaery is like: mehh
And to think Sansa stark cemented Jeffrey's fate with those words "he's a monster"
"Jeffrey" lol that sounds like Joffrey's lesser known twin who has a rock collection and wants to be an accountant
+Hannah Marie hahaha.
Hannah Marie
You just made my day
Bruce Willis
Read the first comment under this comment (it's his lesser known twin)
Sansa sort of got revenge in the end. If she never told them what Joffrey was really like, Olenna would probably never bother to kill him.
The commentary for this episode was hilarious. The actor who played as Joffrey was there and he was like "DON'T YOU DARE TELL THEM"
Haha jack gleeson is so chill. It's amazing he can play a monster so well
Sansa: "He's a monster"
Maergery and Olenna:
"Eye brows raised in mock surprise"
"We were going to kill him anyway"😎
Not we. Only Olena planned the killing of Geoffrey. Margery knew nothing about Olena's involvement until she told her well after the deed was done.
I love how Margery and lady Olenna weren't even surprised at what sansa said lol
She confirmed what they already knew
@@MCSPARTAN501 Yes... they already knew. Lady Olenna even mention that she heard trouble news about Joffrey. They just want to know if his wife could suffer the same fate. When Sansa confirmed that he was a monster... Olenna find out that Margaery could suffer the same violence... This was the true information they wanted to Know. If Margaery as wife, was protected or would suffer like the rest!
Margaery was even like "See, I told you"
1:32 and with that simple line, Sansa Stark sets off a series of events that nobody would have expected: Joffrey's murder; Oberyn's death, resulting in the revenge of Ellaria with Myrcella's murder and the fall of house Martell; Tywin killed by Tyrion; Margaery married Tommen; the faith militant taking power over King's Landing; the fall of house Tyrell; Tommen's suicide and Cersei's reign. *It was an amazing domino effect.*
Technically Jamie banging his sister started everything since that was what got Bran pushed out of the castle
@@anoxfordman2269 well actually bran climbing the tower started everything as if he hadn't seen it none of this would've happened
@@teamgogreen5504 Well technically the first living being started everything.
@@teamgogreen5504 But Jamie was already banging his sister before Bran climbed the tower
Best set of responses! I laughed a lot.@@raphaelfillos6120 a little before that GRRM started having ideas. And way before that we had the Big Bang.
Sophie played very well in this scene.
She did. Completely sold me on Sansa being completely terrified and paranoid that anything she said could be used against her
I just want to say how wonderful it is that neither of them revealed what Sansa said and took it to their graves. Olenna even allowed Sansa and unknowing hand in the bastard's death.
They also tried to get her out of Kings Landing and to the safety of Highgarden by attempting to betroth her to Loras, and Margaery went out of her way to not only listen to Sansa when she was speaking about her betrothal to Tyrion but she also went out of her way to comfort her by reminding her that Tyrion isn’t like the rest of his family. And she tried very hard to try and keep BOTH Sansa in a low profile by trying to distract Joffrey as much as she could.
oddly enough, both Margery and Olenna Tyrell sold me, hook-line & sinker, on their ability to play the game in their own unique ways. Olenna always used her age and look to shock people with how sharp her mind and tongue were. Margery was very unique in that she was the only person in the shows history who outright made people do what she wanted because she made them like her.
"Hello, Littlefinger? I hear you have access to some potions..."
Joffery comes in "DONT INSULT MEH"
"I AAM DA KIINNG!
XD
LOOOOOOL!
Olenna: Since Tyrion isn't here, I'll do it. *Slaps Joffrey to the shadow realm*
Joffrey: I'm telling Mother.
I love Margaery's shrug after Olenna said "that's a pity".
He's a monster
Well that's a pity
I laughed so hard xD
+Jessica Tang lmao sansa is so frightened, Grandma tyrell is like "monster? meh, ive seen better monsters in my day child"
C3PO's Bottom Bit hahahhaha yep XD
+Jessica Tang Maergary seems preety unimpressed too :D
JUST WANT MY DAMN CHEESE
+Jen Neville SING LOUDER!
+Jen Neville She's like Sandor. She needs her cheese. He needs his chicken.
Did anyone notice that Sansa has become something like an angel of death, similarly like her sister, Arya? Both sisters get retribution on those who have inflicted harm on their family--either indirectly or directly. Here, Sansa indirectly and unknowingly sets everything into motion by informing Lady Oleanna of Joffrey's cruelty and mania. By doing this, she unknowingly plays a hand in not only Joffrey's demise, but also the decline of the Lannister House--Joffrey's death caused Tommen to marry Margaery and assume the throne, and cause Tyrion to get arrested and later escape and kill Tywin which submerged their house into further instability and turmoil. As you recall, Tyrion had chosen Oberyn Martell to fight for him in a trial by combat. With Oberyn's death, Elia Martell and The Sandsnakes sought retribution by killing Myrcella. Back at King's Landing, by Tommen's marriage and infatuation with Margaery, Cersei becomes jealous and takes control of the Faith Militant and has Margaery arrested (and herself as well). Later, Cersei gets vengeance on both the Faith Militant and the Tyrells by blowing up the Sept, which thus caused Tommen to commit suicide. In S7, Jaime, Cersei's sole ally and arguably the only person she has loved with the exception of her children, abandons her to ride North to Winterfell for Sansa, claiming that "Sansa Stark is his last chance for honor," thus fulfilling the witch's prophecy of a "younger, more beautiful queen, coming to cast you down and take everything you hold dear."
Similar events transpire with the Bolton House. By Sansa's marriage to Ramsay, she plummets that house into chaos and disorder. When she runs away with Theon, her actions cause Ramsay, fearful of losing his legitimization and inheritance, to kill Roose, Walda Frey and his baby brother, thus leaving him the last Bolton. When Sansa executes Ramsay (epic and poetic justice at its best), she causes another house to become extinct and vanquishes another enemy to House Stark.
Lastly, Littlefinger, the man who masterminded and executed it all...By his execution, she helps get justice for her family for all the hell that visited them.
Wow, I've never seen it that way, it's a great point! Sansa is a cool character, regardless. No Faceless Assassin, no plot-armoured Mary Sue, no revived Messiah, just a normal girl with a normal upbringing for this era, her skills and flaws. Gotta love her evolution.
She's a Stark who can do politics.
Of course her road was the hardest. Slow to learn indeed. Buncha snowheads.
The last Stark who could play people was Sansa's grandfather, and he got Sansa's uncle killed.
The only times she ever killed someone was Ramsay through his hungry dogs who hadn't been fed for a week. You can see how satisfied she is after killed him.
@@margarethmichelina5146 considering what he had done to her, I'd be satisfied, too!
I always thought she should be the queen at the end. And they make it Bran?!?!?!/ because he tells stories?
I bet that servant spit all in that cheese.
lol lol
Oh how I wish the whole show would have kept being this great for its entirety. The amazing script, the amazing acting, the amazing scenography, everything was perfect. These scenes keep you glued to the screen, they were just so well done.
It's a shame what happened. They ran out of source material and decided to rush the plot while butchering every character along the way. At the end, all who were still alive acted like complete idiots. And don't get me started on fast travel and "subverted expectations". Seasons 1 to 4 are still great and will always be.
I can't rewatch the show because it's heartbreaking to see how good it was and what they reduced it to.
Everything else aside, the acting remained great throughout. Every actor gave stunning performances. I wouldn’t blame the actors at all because this show had some of the best acting out there.
@@elliinspace Absolutely. The actors remained brilliant till the end. The show didn't do them justice enough. But yes, I wish GOT remained what it was until that stupid ending.
"AH! here comes my cheese." Priorities.
F*cking awesome, love her! xD
Olenna = Badass
Yeah she throws Sansa under the bus, but it was either her or Margaery, and at least Sansa is out of King's Landing...and with one of the craziest people on TV.
Rosebunse She knew that somehow Sansa would be a suspect in Joffrey's death. No matter who took the blame Sansa will always have the greatest motivation to see him dead. The only person who was in a position to get her out of Kingslanding was Littlefinger . He's a dangerous and untrustworthy man, but at this point, Sansa would be safer North of the Wall then Kingslanding.
At the wedding, she offers to take Sansa to Highgarden. Her plan seemed to be to take her away from King's Landing. Tyrion, whoever, she DID throw under the bus (only after Cersei had "decided" it had been him).
All these people who watch the show and think that the Tyrells are good and honest are missing the whole point. They are just as manipulative and power-hungry as the Lannisters and aside from Tywin and Tyrion and they are much more clever as well. Margaery's "charity" is not kindness, is a tactic to gain support in the public eye. She is using Sansa and has already shown immense power over Joffrey through her use of flattery. Once she is Queen the true nature of the Tyrell's will surface.
Cool. A proper clash of players. This will get interesting.
I think so too. I haven't read the books so I don't know what she's going to do but every time I see Margaery do something nice there is always the question 'what's her angle'?
My reading was pretty much in line with yours, they're just as power hungry and manipulative as the Lannisters the only differences being their methods don't inspire as much hate and they don't step on the toes of others unless it serves some higher purpose (which is why they have the better PR). Though it seems that Margery and Olenna (at least on the show) is capable enough of kindness so long as it doesn't harm their objectives.
The biggest difference between the Lannisters and the Tyrells is the one that really matters though. The Lannisters believe in using fear and terror to make people do what they want, the Tyrells use adoration and care. That forges stronger bonds
It is a tactic, but it doesn't mean that Margaery isn't sincere in her wish to help people. I see it almost as the "first lady's cause", which is expected that they have one, but they get to decide what cause is important to them to pursue. Especially with a house as rich as the Tyrell's and in a time of war where people on the streets are starving, charity will go a long way in establishing her PR.
... RIP sweet Margaery. You will be missed. :-( I'm glad Lady Olenna's still here, though.
rip
I'm devastated. I loved House Tyrell so much. But I'd say the baddest bitch in Westeros didn't give a fuck, and it was glorious.
She's dead now so gg
Well this comment aged poorly 😕
This is when Sansa won me over. In S2 I felt so bad for her, but I loved her from this scene forward. People still really hate her guts because of her behavior in S1 and forget she was a child. Sansa was a pampered, spoiled child, and she wasn't raised to rule, so she didn't know better. She trusted Littlefinger for way too long, but I can understand what her thinking might have been: "He saved me, so he must want what's best for me." She learned how to wear a mask until it was safe. It's not until the last couple seasons that people start realizing how intelligent she is because she doesn't have to hide it anymore. Also, she even says she learned a lot from Cersei, so...that.
I love that in the beginning she wanted to be a southerner so badly, but by the end she was a true northerner, and was loyal to her family and her people. Loveeee herrrrr
Love the character but the actress displays all the emotion of a brick. 🧱
Yea it's good of course to have a character like her, exceptionally new to the game having to deal with all the intricacies. I was hoping they would actually have her do a bit more of the court intrigue at least come season 4 .. but well.. yea.
Sansa is a great character and people still misinterpret her. She had some brilliant development. 👍
@@user-rs9bc4qr2s what? Did you even watch the show.....
She shows emotions extremely well
Incredible (and incredibly underrated) character. I love Sansa.
At 0:51 you can see Sansa’s face change, the mask slips off and Olenna sees that and stops talking so Sansa can speak, it’s a wonderful bit of acting on both of their parts. You actually see Sansa’s face become harsher and more alive.
"When the Tyrell's fart it smells like a rose". WTF?!
Barzin Nasrati House Tyrell's sigil is a golden rose, so...
So when a Martell farts it smells like a spear through a sun?
A Person What dimension are you from?
What do you mean?
LMAO
Sansa is beautiful.
true
+ScottieGirl20 I'm glad she's 18+. Now I don't feel odd when I see her. Margy is better looking imo tho.
+Zappah x Margery has better 'assets' but Sansa has a better more even face and complexion. Sansa ftw
+RikkiTikkiTavi Sansa is pretty but she has very sharp features, Margery has very delicate features - she 's more feminine. Natalie Dormer is stunning!!
+RikkiTikkiTavi Plus she's a natural redhead. In my book, that definitly gives her a few bonus points.
Such a heart wrenching, bittersweet moment. Sansa was finally treated with some much-needed kindness by these two good souls, and allowed to speak her truth.
Sophie turner is impeccable in this scene. Just really sells the scattered and flustered mind of someone who’s been effectively held hostage for months/ years
Sansa: “he’s a monster”
Lady O: *prepares poison*
"Oh...that's a pity". Classic. At that moment she decided Joffrey must die
Translated to mafia: I'm whacking the bastard.
Sansa basically signed his death sentence here without knowing (and good for her!)
Obviously Olenna rules every scene she's in, but Natalie Dormer really brought a huge amount to Margaery. She had very little to work with from the books too.
All the Tyrells do. None of them are POV characters. That they became fan favorites was die to the good casting and the changes made. The show was good when it was adapting or even improving on the material.
I love the detail where Margaery just raises her eyebrows and takes a bite like “lol okay then I guess I’ll work with that.” Because she’s that confident that she can manipulate him either way 😂
- He's a monster.
- Ah, that´s a pity. Now if you excuse me, I need to order some blue crystals.
1:39 i really love how unsurprised and matter-of-fact they both are when it's confirmed that joffrey is a monster (and, by corollary, they were going to assassinate him rather than let margaery get married to him). margaery's little eyebrow flick as she eats a piece of fruit is just 👌🏻
Margaery didn’t know about that still.
I think this is the face of someone who knew the level would be difficult, and just have it confirmed. A big « aaaand shit » hidden behind humor.
On the other hand, Grandma and her « it’s a pity then » totally speak about the murder she just decided.
The thing you have to remember is that Joffrey was kept in line by his parents when he wasn't the one in power - he craved Robert's attention and Robert found Joffrey's cruelty horrific and beat him for it when it was caught. Cersei encouraged him to be cruel, but discrete, and the other Lannisters enforced his behavior. He only started acting out publicly post-crowning, and the people who would've seen it were commoners and members of the King's Court who didn't leave KL during the war.
Robert beat Joffrey? That's new to me
@@nicholaskenneth113 Once. As a kid, Joffrey cut open a pregnant cat to see what's inside, and didn’t give two shits about the fact that he just killed a cat. Robert was rightly horrified and punched him hard enough to knock him out.
While the Tyrells are players of the game just like the Lannisters, I have yet to see the Tyrells kill someone good or decent on the show, so far only a monster. They have my sword!
+El Manimal They don't kill the decent people. Only frame them for the murders of monsters.
+Landis963 Just for the sake of argument that was more Littlefinger's plan. Make sure Tyrion takes the fall helps cover his tracks AND frees Sansa up for marriage.
biffyqueen It was probably Cersei's idea to blame Tyrion, now I think of it. And Olenna jumped on that idea in a heartbeat.
Landis963 Except it was Littlefinger who arranged the dwarf battle (according to a video I saw anyways) which brought Tyrion to attention. Cercei believes that Tyrion is going to kill her thanks to Maggy the Frog's prophecy.
Not sure if it's purely on littlefinger but Dontos died too
The main thing which is missing from this scene is Butterbumps.
''AND DOWN THE ROAD FROM HERE TO THERE. FROM HERE! TO THERE! THREE BOYS, A GOAT, AND A DANCING BEAR!''
Ninja'd by a month
This scene was so much better in the books. I loved the show's version as well but it's more interesting in the books since it's the first time Sansa meets the Tyrells.
Mike Hunt I love that bit in the book😂😂
1:39 Margaery going, "Great...if it's not the guy who likes guys, it's Joffrey. "
"I can't get a fucking break"
Queen of Thorns And she got a wicked burn at the end.
@@queenofthorns6746 "I must be cursed" lol
.....aaaaannd Joffery's dead.
“Oh. That’s a pity…”
is when Lady Tyrell finalized her decision on what to do at the purple wedding.
I miss Joffrey he was an interesting character and very entertaining to watch.
hell yeah! Entertainment is Joffrey's second name))
Rome Werty no baratheon... i mean lannister... i mean hill... i mean waters... ah fuck it
DrWhopotte Technically he has no second name.
DrWhopotte No, he's Joffrey Lannister. Both his parents were highborn.
martythetickler No, actually. Edric Storm's parents were both highborn (Robert Baratheon and Delena Florent), but he is still called "Storm". Nymeria Sand's parents are both noble (Oberyn Martell and some noblewoman from Volantis), but she is still a "Sand". Bastards are named for where they were born (making it so half-sibilings may have different surnames, like Edric and Mya.), so technically, he would be Joffrey Waters (assuming he was born in King's Landing). However, he would only use that name if he were acknowledged by Jaime, but he hasn't been formally recognized as Jaime's son. That would make him like Gendry, who is an unacknowledged bastard and therefore unable to really use a surname.
This is one of my favorite scenes in the show. Turner is fantastic at conveying the subtle nuances in Sansa's brewing despise toward jeoffrey conflicting with the fear of punishment for telling the truth that had been burnished into her throughout her time in King's landing. So powerful when you think of it from Marjory and her Grandmother's point of view.
"...and when a Tyrell farts, it smells like a rose." lmfao😂😂😂😂
People hate on Sansa, but I love Sophie's acting here. You can truly feel the hatred in her voice when she tells them about Joffrey executing her father.
"Have no fear! The lord oaf of Highgarden is determined that Margaery shall be queen."
Lord Tyrell may call the shots, but Olenna truly makes all of the plays.
Olenna tyrell was one of the most badass characters in game of thrones
Let's not overlook the spectacular backdrop if this scene. The view is breathtaking 🤩
Her frightened face brings up some bad memories for me.
They're so comforting to her...I think their comforting words made sansa feel listened to and cared about for the first time in a long time. They never lied to her or betrayed her...I wish Margaery would have lived, she would have taken care of Sansa or taken her to Olena
Margaery may have cared for Sansa but it was only to an extent. She would never die for her and would never fully risk her neck to lose her chance at becoming THE Queen. Plus, the two obviously saw the benefits of befriending Sansa too. They most certainly cared about her well being as a person but they cared about what she had to offer more.
oh here comes my cheese
The "that's a pity" and Maergery's side eye tell how strong the women of House Tyrell really are, Olenna is not surprised and already planning a way to protect her granddaughter, Maergery is not afraid and knows she'll have to handle (like when she seems fascinated by Joffrey's crossbow, it looked so out of character for viewers but she was seducing him because that's one of talent of Tyrells women).
Knowing Westeros and how its a cruel and harsh world I'm surprised Cersei didn't find out about the poison and switch it was Sansa's or something and kill her. Love her delivery of that line "He's a monster" chilling.
And Olenna's anti-climactic...
"Ah. That's a pity."
+ch5412 How would she have had the opportunity? The poison was in Joffrey's cup for less than a minute before he drank it. Also, she would have needed to notice a) Sansa's new necklace and b) Olenna's sleight-of-hand with said necklace. And she's not the most observant of people.
+ch5412 Littlefinger was trying to kill Joffrey. Littlefinger had the 2nd most impressive spy network in Westeros next to Varys. If Littlefinger didn't want Cersei to know about the plot, she wasn't going to know. Varys was literally the only person who could have tipped her off, but he didn't know about it (since so few people were involved and they covered their tracks well). Even if Varys had been aware, I doubt he would have done much to save Joffrey at this point, having seen firsthand on numerous occasions how terrible of a king he was.
In a way, this is Sansa signing the death warrant for Joffrey.
Hahaha poor Joffrey his fate has been decided the moment they learned his true colours...there is a reason House Tyrell rose from nothing to be the second richest House in the Seven Kingdoms. A rose no matter how sweet has thorns after all.
House Tyrell gets is led by Olenna and she was born a RedWyne. There's no real indication that the Tyrells where a especially powerful house before than. They were granted the Reach by Aegon the conqueror. Simply for yielding to him after their Liege Lord (house Gardner) was killed in the field of fire.
Rutger Holtzer That was long before Olenna's time, though. I guess the Tyrells have always been suck-ups.
ahahaha House Tyrell has always been cunning...they weren't the original ruling house they convinced the ruling house to fight the Targaryens then gave up to the Targaryens when the leading house was killed. In reward THEY were made the ruling house.
James GJ I think it's been said that it's the women of the family who lead House Tyrell.
Ah fuck. *goes to store to buy cheese*
She never betrayed Sansa. And she kept her word. The wedding happened. She never said Joffery would live to see the wedding night.
In the books, Sansa begged Margaery to NOT marry Joffrey. She displayed courage and selflessness and the show turned that upside down.
In the books, had Olenna already planned to murder Joffrey by this time? Had it been her plan to have Margaery marry Tommen all along?
@@tanler7953 I don't think so. I think it all depended on Sansa's answer.
If you think that the Tyrells are an honorable house, you haven't been paying attention.
If you think there is even such a thing as a honorable house that wants to join the royal family, you definitely havent been paying attention.
***** You can be good people and still deceptive. At least they manipulate with false compassion and not fear
Emily Foster I rather have the second. Because its easier to stop.
shihoblade What about the Boltons ? Their nice and honorable
James White Is that a joke?
Arya is my favorite female character but Sansa is so damn beautiful!
Whenever I see Olenna I can only think of my grandmother. She's also stubborn and smart, made her way through a successful business which my other relatives used to build their own careers. She's always bossing everyone and gives the best advices- sadly she's allergic cheese.
You can see the genuine fear, and PTSD in her throughout the show from here on out.
Glad you didnt cut out the moment when the cheese finally arrives
10/10
This scene just makes me emotional. To be so young in a position that Sansa is in. Where you can't trust ANYBODY. Not even other women. But to feel fully believed. In a single, solitary moment. Must have been such a relief.
"Oh. That's a pity,"--What Olenna said.
"Oh. I'll have to kill him,"--What Olenna meant.
The thing I find tragic about Sansa is not only did she have to deal with Joffrey being a monster, he wasn't even nearly as bad as the Monster she ended up with afterwords, Ramsay Bolton was worse to her then Joffrey was, seriously the torment and suffering this poor woman had to endure before eventually returning to "Winterfell" was unspeakable.
What was unsettling about this scene was the reaction of Lady Olenna and Margaery Tyrell after Sansa says "he's a monster" they were kind of like Eh!🤷 🤨 almost like it didn't phase them in the way you anticipated they would.
They haven't suffered before. They don't understand. It's like telling a child that as a child you were bullied. Sometimes they just can't imagine it happening to them.
She confirmed what they already knew
She endured terrible things but now she is the charismatic Queen in the Norh.
Man I feel for Sansa so much here. I’ve been in a situation similar to hers, where unless I towed the party line, and otherwise kept my mouth shut, I’d be physically harmed. It took a significant amount of effort from other people to get me to tell the truth of my situation, bc my fears of retaliation were so great. Honestly, Sansa held up better than I would have if I’m honest.
I love Margaery's reaction at 1:37
In a way, Sansa won the Game of Thrones. Her character endured. She went from a naive little girl to the Queen of the North in the end.
in the cheapest way possible, yeah. But it doesn't really count.
@@Gadget-Walkmen does anything in the last seasons count?
@@unemilifleur yes, it counted in ruining the show’s reputation for a LONG while. Yeah that incredibly counted big time there!
mmmmmmmmmmm.....................I'm gonna say Bran takes that title of GoT Winner. Must be nice to have everyone drag your half-paralyzed ass all over the kingdoms while you talk to ghosts and manipulate and old guy who can only repeat one word. You only have to say a couple of lines, and then just sit in a wheelchair doing nothing except watch everyone else kill each other off. Then at the very end you're crowned King of the Iron Throne.
Margareys’ face when they say “they are determined she’s going to be queen”. It’s like a sarcastic yay me 😂
“How naïve is he? How easy to manipulate?”
“He’s a monster.”
“Ah, so not very easy to manipulate. Well, he’s dead. Cheers for that!”
Intelligent conversations and scenes like this are entirely missing from season 8.
After Margery hears she's marrying a monster she just kind of shrugs it off like "Huh, well that kinda sucks"
I honestly did love the Tyrell family.
Cheese boy ❤️❤️❤️
wat
I think Lady Olenna is more concerned with her cheese than Sansa telling them Joffrey is a "monster" lol
1:19 This--she just totally starts to crack apart in panic. The poor girl.. She has been just....traumatized over and over again
1:38 i so love the flatline there. And Margaery's like, "Eh, typical."
The Cheese is all that matters...
I wonder what kind it was
@@girth_goblin Poison cheese.
@@Maw0 still better than mozzarella
@@girth_goblin I like Mozzarella though...
@@Maw0 mozzarella is basic af tho. Cant complete with a good Swiss or Edam cheese
i didn't know elijah wood was in game of thrones
People say Sansa Sealed Joffrey’s fate, But he did that the moment he cut of Ned Stark’s head,
“Hes a monster”
“Oh. That’s a pity.”
Olenna is a fuckin OG of the game for real lol
This was such an emotional scene for me in the books, and I thought they adapted it well. It was Sansa's first real chance to release some pressure from all that abuse and trauma, and she's so broken already by mistrust that getting her to speak is like trying to hand feed a feral animal. She's just sure this is a trap, someone is listening, and she'll be abused or killed for speaking ill of Joffrey. Definitely an early glimpse of Sansa's backbone.