After streaming part-time on RUclips for the past couple years (20-30 hours a week) I’d like share a few things: ⬇️ 1: My concurrent viewership has ranged from 100-5,500. Many of my smaller / medium streams 150-500 range actually tend to be better financially speaking. Being able to truly interact with the chat makes a big difference in terms of memberships & donations. 2: The difference in viewership from playing a brand new hype game vs an older game is astronomical and to be expected. I no longer get down on myself if I only have 150 people watching when the week before I might have played a new game and had 1200. Put these numbers in perspective for the size of your channel. You may go from 50 to 5. That’s the same as a larger channel going from 2000 to 200. 3: Streaming is one part of my job, and to be honest I’m happy that I don’t do it full time. Having other sources of revenue (videos) has made life a million times better. Not to mention if I had to be in the “spot light” for 40-60 hours a week, I’d rather go back to my old job. Oh and yea.. being in front of your computer for extended periods of time without being able to take real breaks (streaming) is very unhealthy for your body. 4: My video work still far outweighs my streams in terms of subscriber growth. It is also a significant contributing factor as to why some people donate during my live streams. My video work is what grew my channel and allowed me to reasonably incorporate live streaming as a viable addition to the overall business model. 5: If you are a RUclips streamer, there’s many ways to keep your channel active. You don’t necessarily have to stream every day to achieve good numbers. I can take a couple weeks off streaming and come back for a new game release and still do well. If you learn how to “catch the algorithm” you’ll never be a “dying streamer.” 6: Forget clout. Focus on your channel and giving your subscribers a good experience. Like Devin said you don’t need to be Asmongold to make a good living. If you are constantly focused on numbers and comparing those to others, you are in for a lifetime of mental health issues. Thanks for the video Devin. Always love listening to your thoughts & analysis. Huge help to content creators of all types 🙏
Hey just a note, probably already mentioned by someone, but this video and the last one: You aren't showing all of the Notepad window, so some of what you type is getting cut off. I love the content but especially being able to see what you're typing!
Hey Devin your notepad got cut off midway through, check 12:00 Edit: is this a elaborate plot to make us leave a comment because you didn't ask us for a comment if we were still watching
I think view count or viewers can help to an extent. You're on a public platform, and it is kinda barren or "disturbing" if you're looking at chat and NOTHING is going on. Seeing views can give you a sense of, "Ok. I have lurkers right now..people ARE still interested in what I'm doing.." But there is a point where it does get too much, where all I'm doing is looking at the number. THAT is the part where it gets obsessive and can be a problem. I got over the "I'm comparing myself to others phase.". Now it is just about getting more than my views. After all, there comes a point where, "why be on a public platform if no one is watching? I could just make a RUclips video or other social media thing with the time instead."
Just wanted to say at 20:55 when you notice poke has a discrepancy of -400, a lot of users use third-party programs such as Chatterino which counts them in multiple chats across twitch at any given time the program is open despite not actually being in the stream. Unfortunately this makes tools such as viewers vs chatters count irrelevant especially for those streamers with large offline chat communities. Hope this helps any confusion Devin :)
I think it's pretty neat that you manage expectations but still encourage people. When it seems like there's so many streamers its hard to balance telling them that it's probably futile but like.. don't let that stop you
I've actually been calculating my Minutes Watched per Unique Viewer for a while. You mentioned it being around 50-120 minutes. I'm currently sitting at around 10-20 minutes per unique viewer. What can I do to improve on that, other than "be more entertaining"?
Yep, I know I was guilty of watching the viewer count. I finally gave up on streaming in favor of using that time to create content for YT. I was horrible at keeping up with all the bells and whistles for twitch. not to mention I suck at keeping a conversation going. I'm awkward on live camera and I cant figure out how to relax. After streaming for more than a year, I cant keep an average of 3 viewers. I'm pretty sure that means I'm not entertaining or inviting or confident. I think I'm a party pooper. 😬
Well I’m just some random guy on the internet, so take what I say with a grain of salt. After taking a quick look at 2 of your RUclips vids, I don’t think there’s actually anything wrong with you personally. And instead just you’re content niche. I believe I heard you say mention in one of your older vids that “it’s not fun doing yard work all day”. Instead of putting it all into one vlog, why not see if it’s possible to stretch out these activities into tutorials of sorts?? Or individual videos of you completing these tasks
@Duat Chol Thank You for the supportive words. I like your idea about stretching activities into tutorials. That's definitely a good way to approach that kind of subject matter. Finding the right niche to create content for has always been a struggle for me. Gaming content is fun to make and I can usually spin a story idea into the mix. Vlogging seems like it requires a decent amount of planning which usually pushes me towards the lower hanging fruit. It feels like a balance process to figure out what you're good at creating vs what you enjoy creating vs the time you have available to create vs what people actually want to watch. I tend to be too hard on myself and usually come to expect too much too soon. But now that I'm not streaming on Twitch regularly that means I have more time to find the niche I can excel at. Thanks Again. 👍
Well I've officially watched so many of your videos I pretty much nailed it on the Cabbage Brain Take. I still appreciate your insights and hearing about something in different ways across time helps me understand things better and gives me more ideas. Thanks!
"We dont know if ur afk, if it a cat" Not yet, but soon. But does this still apply to Utube Live? Pulling this out of my ass but I'd assume UT viewercount 'weights' more for an individual category, but as they have so many metrics it's relatively low still. Engagement, time/% watch time, click through, ineffablility, etc.
So if the "important metric" is followers per hour should we turn our chats to follower only mode? 🤔 I never done that but Im guessing it would help!? 🤔
I think that would actually decrease the amount of new followers. You don’t want to make new people jump through hurtles. If you are engaging with your chat people will follow. Give people a chance to get to know you first.
You call it a weighing system but it's not actually a weighing system other than that it works by attributing values to variables. It is attempting to be a predictive weighing system which is completely different than a true weight. The Algo is adjusting to predict how you will weigh (watch time, interaction, etc.) the choice. And then once it has the true weight given how you react/interact it will adjust to predict how you will weigh successive suggestions.
Very interesting. i genuinly thought it was a bigger deal. I do have a follow up question though: what about sponsorship activations? does the importance of viewership numbers change during sponsored streams? I noticed a lot of people have a giant boost of viewers during their sponsored streams. often because they get on front page, or, im assuming, because the brand is embedding it somewhere. As just one example, a streamer that i really like, ashley roboto, is currently doing a sponsored stream with Post It. Shes not on front page, but still has ruffly 15x her normal viewership. My info on all of it is a few years old, but if the brand is embedding the streams to boost viewership, wouldnt that add to their cost for the sponsorship? do brands no longer pay based on viewership during sponsored streams? if not, what else are the big factors now? if you do decide to do a follow up video on this, id love to hear you talk about stuff like that :)
1. View count matters. 2. View count doesn't matter for 90 % of streamers that are hovering at 50 to 300. In this case you will make all the revenue from donations, deals outside of Twitch, your own commercial in stream and favorite repeat viewers. Get smart. Diversify.
Since watching your videos from years ago, I always turn the viewer count off, good to know that's still a good decision 👍 Honestly many people come to my streams from Twitch recommended, I'm pleasantly surprised the algorithm works for me at times
Interesting enough that if you look at Twitch Affiliate/Partner vs. RUclips Partner vs. Facebook Level Up, Twitch is the ONLY platform that institutionally has ANY emphasis whatsoever on concurrents. 🤨 "Viewer Andy" references are just a bad habit from Twitch that should stay on Twitch, or better yet - stop being a thing on Twitch. 🧐
Hello, love your content, it helped as a small content creator. However, your focus being streaming I would love to see some of it translated to content creation such as RUclips video.
So around 5 minute mark, you've stopped remarking on the recommended system, and make the point of adding viewers for the people that have to be scrolled to for their channel to be on the screen. You say that adding 100 viewers doesn't matter, but I think the larger point is, growing their viewers steadily across time whether it's 100 or 150 or 200 is the part that doesn't matter. I think it's the increase in viewers proper that's irrelevant. If you grew it by 100 people, in a flash, the system as you noted recognizes that. I think that distinction is important! Also awesome video once again!
This is a bit of a tangent but is an ad every 10 minutes normal? We have streamers like Hasan that negotiate a 1:59 ratio of ads to content and others that say running frequent ads encourages exodus from the platform.
Why even show viewer count? I've always wondered why twitch, RUclips, FB, and sociaj media websites show views anyways. its meaningless for viewers in contrast to something like likes or comments.
Cabbage Brain Take: Stop thinking like a small streamer. Growth and multiple streams of income are all that matter, and your analytics and researching into the psychology of a viewer will take care of that. Some streams are going to be having less live viewers than others for any number of reasons. Maybe it's just a slow day. Maybe the game you're playing isn't as popular. Maybe people are watching some big event or something. Just pay attention to the analytics and trust them over a 90 day period at least before making any significant changes.
So is this the real reason multiple big name streamers left twitch for youtube? Because they knew they were going to get pushed down in the recommended?
No those streamers are already very established, if anything it would be worse for them on RUclips. They left twitch because they got offered more to stream on RUclips, it really is that simple
So glad you're back! Love this type of content!
Second that!
Devin can you update us about what happen to imjamine
After streaming part-time on RUclips for the past couple years (20-30 hours a week) I’d like share a few things: ⬇️
1: My concurrent viewership has ranged from 100-5,500. Many of my smaller / medium streams 150-500 range actually tend to be better financially speaking. Being able to truly interact with the chat makes a big difference in terms of memberships & donations.
2: The difference in viewership from playing a brand new hype game vs an older game is astronomical and to be expected. I no longer get down on myself if I only have 150 people watching when the week before I might have played a new game and had 1200. Put these numbers in perspective for the size of your channel. You may go from 50 to 5. That’s the same as a larger channel going from 2000 to 200.
3: Streaming is one part of my job, and to be honest I’m happy that I don’t do it full time. Having other sources of revenue (videos) has made life a million times better. Not to mention if I had to be in the “spot light” for 40-60 hours a week, I’d rather go back to my old job. Oh and yea.. being in front of your computer for extended periods of time without being able to take real breaks (streaming) is very unhealthy for your body.
4: My video work still far outweighs my streams in terms of subscriber growth. It is also a significant contributing factor as to why some people donate during my live streams. My video work is what grew my channel and allowed me to reasonably incorporate live streaming as a viable addition to the overall business model.
5: If you are a RUclips streamer, there’s many ways to keep your channel active. You don’t necessarily have to stream every day to achieve good numbers. I can take a couple weeks off streaming and come back for a new game release and still do well. If you learn how to “catch the algorithm” you’ll never be a “dying streamer.”
6: Forget clout. Focus on your channel and giving your subscribers a good experience. Like Devin said you don’t need to be Asmongold to make a good living. If you are constantly focused on numbers and comparing those to others, you are in for a lifetime of mental health issues.
Thanks for the video Devin. Always love listening to your thoughts & analysis. Huge help to content creators of all types 🙏
I greatly appreciate your comment. Subbed.
@@teddyshinobi thanks!
this is a very good feedback and insightful, thank you and subbed as well
Hey just a note, probably already mentioned by someone, but this video and the last one: You aren't showing all of the Notepad window, so some of what you type is getting cut off.
I love the content but especially being able to see what you're typing!
was about to say the same thing :)
Yep, never been an issue until the past two videos!
Hey Devin your notepad got cut off midway through, check 12:00
Edit: is this a elaborate plot to make us leave a comment because you didn't ask us for a comment if we were still watching
I find it weirdly touching that people are so immersed in Devin's stuff they really care about notepad info.
Jebaited. It's like how a lot of top 10 lists intentionally include a controversial pick so people will disagree with them.
I think view count or viewers can help to an extent. You're on a public platform, and it is kinda barren or "disturbing" if you're looking at chat and NOTHING is going on. Seeing views can give you a sense of, "Ok. I have lurkers right now..people ARE still interested in what I'm doing.."
But there is a point where it does get too much, where all I'm doing is looking at the number. THAT is the part where it gets obsessive and can be a problem.
I got over the "I'm comparing myself to others phase.". Now it is just about getting more than my views. After all, there comes a point where, "why be on a public platform if no one is watching? I could just make a RUclips video or other social media thing with the time instead."
Can you fix the size of the holy notepad?
Not being able to read the bottom section is quite frustrating.
Just wanted to say at 20:55 when you notice poke has a discrepancy of -400, a lot of users use third-party programs such as Chatterino which counts them in multiple chats across twitch at any given time the program is open despite not actually being in the stream. Unfortunately this makes tools such as viewers vs chatters count irrelevant especially for those streamers with large offline chat communities.
Hope this helps any confusion Devin :)
Hi Devon. Like your stuff
I think it's pretty neat that you manage expectations but still encourage people. When it seems like there's so many streamers its hard to balance telling them that it's probably futile but like.. don't let that stop you
Yes! So happy to have a new video!
I've actually been calculating my Minutes Watched per Unique Viewer for a while. You mentioned it being around 50-120 minutes. I'm currently sitting at around 10-20 minutes per unique viewer. What can I do to improve on that, other than "be more entertaining"?
Thanks for the info Devin. We appreciate you.
2 Devin videos within a week? Nice
back with a vengance. great breakdown of this topic 😲
Great to see new videos! Again, this was very insightful
Yep, I know I was guilty of watching the viewer count. I finally gave up on streaming in favor of using that time to create content for YT. I was horrible at keeping up with all the bells and whistles for twitch. not to mention I suck at keeping a conversation going. I'm awkward on live camera and I cant figure out how to relax. After streaming for more than a year, I cant keep an average of 3 viewers. I'm pretty sure that means I'm not entertaining or inviting or confident. I think I'm a party pooper. 😬
Well I’m just some random guy on the internet, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
After taking a quick look at 2 of your RUclips vids, I don’t think there’s actually anything wrong with you personally. And instead just you’re content niche. I believe I heard you say mention in one of your older vids that “it’s not fun doing yard work all day”. Instead of putting it all into one vlog, why not see if it’s possible to stretch out these activities into tutorials of sorts?? Or individual videos of you completing these tasks
@Duat Chol Thank You for the supportive words. I like your idea about stretching activities into tutorials. That's definitely a good way to approach that kind of subject matter.
Finding the right niche to create content for has always been a struggle for me. Gaming content is fun to make and I can usually spin a story idea into the mix. Vlogging seems like it requires a decent amount of planning which usually pushes me towards the lower hanging fruit. It feels like a balance process to figure out what you're good at creating vs what you enjoy creating vs the time you have available to create vs what people actually want to watch. I tend to be too hard on myself and usually come to expect too much too soon. But now that I'm not streaming on Twitch regularly that means I have more time to find the niche I can excel at.
Thanks Again. 👍
Genuinely feels like view botting ia so rampant in new-mid range streamers that people's idea of what their view count should be is totally off
glad ur back
Loving some new Devin RUclips content! Super interesting deep dive as always! Thanks! 👍
W video, Devin! Thanks for your insight.
Well I've officially watched so many of your videos I pretty much nailed it on the Cabbage Brain Take. I still appreciate your insights and hearing about something in different ways across time helps me understand things better and gives me more ideas. Thanks!
Woah, another vid in few days time. Devin is on a roll.
I still had sort by viewer count by default. Changed to recommended and now everytime its recommended. Is enable by Twitch or have to do it yourself?
Beautiful sermon father
I don't think there was a like and sub CTA in the middle of this video because I literally didn't remember until you were wrapping up.
"We dont know if ur afk, if it a cat" Not yet, but soon.
But does this still apply to Utube Live? Pulling this out of my ass but I'd assume UT viewercount 'weights' more for an individual category, but as they have so many metrics it's relatively low still. Engagement, time/% watch time, click through, ineffablility, etc.
He’s back!
two videos in a week. You're spoiling us
He's back lets GOOO
So if the "important metric" is followers per hour should we turn our chats to follower only mode? 🤔
I never done that but Im guessing it would help!? 🤔
I think that would actually decrease the amount of new followers. You don’t want to make new people jump through hurtles. If you are engaging with your chat people will follow. Give people a chance to get to know you first.
@@shainewarren1173 yep thats what we do :)
I am still waiting for that video about Facebook you promise awhile back.
Such an amazing content... I missed this videos 😢
Thank you for this video! I found it very helpful and informative.
Babe Wake up! New Devin Nash video just dropped.
Loving this sort of contnet! Keep it up, Devin!
He's back PagMan
On Point! Thanks For the Video!
okay new lighting and maybe cam. i see you.
2 videos in a week. I'm blessed
Holy shit this was so informational
Welcome back to regular uploads champ 🏆
You call it a weighing system but it's not actually a weighing system other than that it works by attributing values to variables. It is attempting to be a predictive weighing system which is completely different than a true weight. The Algo is adjusting to predict how you will weigh (watch time, interaction, etc.) the choice. And then once it has the true weight given how you react/interact it will adjust to predict how you will weigh successive suggestions.
Love your stuff, keep it up!
Yo, dev, resize your notepad, for some reason it gets cut off on the bottom. Thanks.
Thank you.
Thanks Devin
What do you think, its better to hide stream after it ends, or leave on channel? It isn't look like a mess?
Very interesting. i genuinly thought it was a bigger deal.
I do have a follow up question though: what about sponsorship activations? does the importance of viewership numbers change during sponsored streams?
I noticed a lot of people have a giant boost of viewers during their sponsored streams. often because they get on front page, or, im assuming, because the brand is embedding it somewhere. As just one example, a streamer that i really like, ashley roboto, is currently doing a sponsored stream with Post It. Shes not on front page, but still has ruffly 15x her normal viewership.
My info on all of it is a few years old, but if the brand is embedding the streams to boost viewership, wouldnt that add to their cost for the sponsorship? do brands no longer pay based on viewership during sponsored streams? if not, what else are the big factors now?
if you do decide to do a follow up video on this, id love to hear you talk about stuff like that :)
New video hype!
Babe wake up Devin Nash posted
1. View count matters.
2. View count doesn't matter for 90 % of streamers that are hovering at 50 to 300. In this case you will make all the revenue from donations, deals outside of Twitch, your own commercial in stream and favorite repeat viewers. Get smart. Diversify.
7250 subs on RUclips but I get 100+ concurrent on lives. We have an Engaged community
hey, could you fix the bottom of your notepad so its visible in the video. keep up the good vids, thank you
Cutting off the notepad to get a YT comment Devin you genius 😂
Since watching your videos from years ago, I always turn the viewer count off, good to know that's still a good decision 👍
Honestly many people come to my streams from Twitch recommended, I'm pleasantly surprised the algorithm works for me at times
I would say that view counts still matter, but indirectly. View counts influence the stats that do matter.
Interesting enough that if you look at Twitch Affiliate/Partner vs. RUclips Partner vs. Facebook Level Up, Twitch is the ONLY platform that institutionally has ANY emphasis whatsoever on concurrents. 🤨
"Viewer Andy" references are just a bad habit from Twitch that should stay on Twitch, or better yet - stop being a thing on Twitch. 🧐
Hello, love your content, it helped as a small content creator. However, your focus being streaming I would love to see some of it translated to content creation such as RUclips video.
Miss you dad
Asmongold will end stream and go on a 3 month break if hes wiev
count gets to low. i also think half of the wievs on twitch is bots =)
Another great video Devin. Your content is so valuable, I wish more people would see it that way.
So around 5 minute mark, you've stopped remarking on the recommended system, and make the point of adding viewers for the people that have to be scrolled to for their channel to be on the screen. You say that adding 100 viewers doesn't matter, but I think the larger point is, growing their viewers steadily across time whether it's 100 or 150 or 200 is the part that doesn't matter. I think it's the increase in viewers proper that's irrelevant. If you grew it by 100 people, in a flash, the system as you noted recognizes that. I think that distinction is important! Also awesome video once again!
Is that math right? Shouldn't it be (Hours watched * 60 / # Unique Viewers)?
“She has huge… tracts of land….” That’s why she gets eyeballs.
This is a bit of a tangent but is an ad every 10 minutes normal? We have streamers like Hasan that negotiate a 1:59 ratio of ads to content and others that say running frequent ads encourages exodus from the platform.
A Devin Nash video that’s not an hour long???
Can you do one on content creators who lie and their fanbase eats it up?
I call those streamers Viewership Mongers. They will cut a throat for more views.
Why even show viewer count? I've always wondered why twitch, RUclips, FB, and sociaj media websites show views anyways. its meaningless for viewers in contrast to something like likes or comments.
someone please tell Devin that his notepad is being cut off at the bottom of the screen
Cabbage Brain Take:
Stop thinking like a small streamer. Growth and multiple streams of income are all that matter, and your analytics and researching into the psychology of a viewer will take care of that. Some streams are going to be having less live viewers than others for any number of reasons. Maybe it's just a slow day. Maybe the game you're playing isn't as popular. Maybe people are watching some big event or something. Just pay attention to the analytics and trust them over a 90 day period at least before making any significant changes.
So is this the real reason multiple big name streamers left twitch for youtube? Because they knew they were going to get pushed down in the recommended?
No those streamers are already very established, if anything it would be worse for them on RUclips. They left twitch because they got offered more to stream on RUclips, it really is that simple
Pog I was here Pog
or in the ase ;)
Damn, you still exist?
ludwig = cringe lord
Amoranth has a huge..... network. She has big.... goals.
damn only 23mins ? you have changed :/
Mizzy dumped his ex Maya to maximise his viewership with lewd female streamer 😂
Long time no Devin. I’m in 🤌🏼