Speaking of .40 cal, one thing I noticed between the Obama AND the latest Biden ammo shortages (in the area's I lived in in FL and now OH) is that 40 S&W was always the last on the shelves. just prior to the outbreak and lockdowns, a store I was working at was closing and we had some SMOKING deals on firearms, and I was able to pick up a brand new Beretta APX in 40 S&W for LESS than $250 after tax out the door. And even though it was the store closing and not an ammo shortage guess which ammo we still had plenty of on the shelf? (even at the discount price). We had at least 8 of these APX's in 40 S&W after the 9mm's sold, and when I pointed this out to my coworkers two of them also bought the same pistol in 40 S&W, and we each got around 300 rounds of 40 S&W defensive ammo at 40% off plus employee discount. People want to talk about what ammo will be available in a SHTF scenario, I say have firearm's in as many caliber's as possible.
I had no trouble selling a g19 or 17 but when it came to the g23 in 40s&w, nobody wanted it. It was so crazy. People have gotten caught up in this echo chamber of "9 or nothing" that anything in 40 was completely overlooked. Some people follow the trends they hear and nothing else, and they miss out on some really good firearms.
And I'm sorry it's a better option if you can handle it. Now I own and carry both, but I feel better with my 40. I live in Oregon and don't stay in city's, I prefer something I can shoot a bear with.
Why i eventually want to get a glock 19, you can get a 23 and 32 upper and basically have 1 gun in 3 calibers, all using the same holster and accessories
Right but 40 is always the last on the pistol shelf for a reason lots of snap for no real ballistic benefit other then it being readily available compared to 9mm or 45
It’s 💯 shot placement. As a retired paramedic, I picked a lot of folks killed with .22lr and all other calibers. It depends where the round hits. Picked up one guy shot in the chest with a .45acp and he talked all the way to the hospital. I love guns and carry a 380 or a 9mm for edc. It’s totally shot placement. I’ve actually been able to see what trauma and injuries people sustain from getting shot. Whatever caliber you carry, practice, practice, practice. I would not make fun of anyone who carries a .22 LR. Seen a lot of people killed with those. God Bless you guys
I don't know if this is true or some "old wives' tale" but I've heard it say, "there's more people in the grave over .22LR than any other caliber, because of the low cost and wide spread accessibility of the .22"
@@tommyseales6759 thanks for the reply you will do great work debunking the myth about .22 and other calibers how many cases have you seen fatal when it came to the .25 acp
Unproductive copout. There are calibers better at one job than another. Specific ammunition of the same caliber for one job or another. We all know this, but anyone that doesn't is only harmed by the idea that all calibers are equal at all things.
@@Sheridantank Oh BS. We all know fudds who say "45 or nuthin" who then don't carry their bulky 2 and a half pound gun. I carried a bodyguard 380 for years. Go ahead & tell me it is inadequate and I'll answer that it is if you are incompetent. Now I carry a p365. More powerful, more capacity. But if I was carrying a 22 cal mouse gun, it is a heck of a lot better than the gun you left at home, and you know it.
One, of many, issue with this topic is that it draws the, "It's not about the caliber. It is all about shot placement...blah blah!" crowd. The fallacy in their argument is that they are not Robocop with 100% headshot capability. In the end, the people who blabber that also just end up aiming "general center mass." Then wound volume does matter.
180 lbs/ft 22lr that you mentioned was measured using a rifle barrel. with pistol barrel lengths 2-6 inches, 22lr CCI only develops about 50 to 60 lbs/ft, whereas 9mm is measured in 4" barrel and 45 is usually measured in 5" barrel.
They didn't mention that the increase in bullet technology and powder technology also carries over to the 40 Smith & Wesson and the 45 so it's not like 9 mm is the absolute best.
Also there’s talks of law enforcement still failing their test with the duty 9mm in +p/+p+ and have been cheating by using regular ball ammo for the test due to the duty loads having recoil as the 40 s&w. As well the majority of civilians don’t carry police duty loads and use standard loaded self defense rounds. So when the 9mm acolytes say that the 9mm is better then id have to say they’re wrong. Even standard 40 s&w has good barrier penetration. But the 9mm acolytes don’t want to hear that because they only go to the range to plink and not train or practice.
Thanks for that conversation guys that was enjoyable. We just finished the deer and moose seasons here in Maine so I’m spending a few hours cleaning up the families guns this was a great background to listen to. Thank you again.
For me, what's more important defensively than what caliber I'm shooting, is what weapon I'm shooting it from (and is that weapon going to be readily available when I need it), can I shoot that weapon quickly and accurately (and does my ammo make that even more certain), am I using the best ammo for the particular circumstance with the most appropriate penetrating and permanent wound channel creating ability, and can I carry enough of it to deal with worst case situations. Bottom line: the best defensive ammo changes from shooter to shooter, gun to gun (because not all guns are created equal), and circumstance to circumstance.
Not as unpopular as you think. Especially right now. It's not my favorite, but I do carry my .40 the most often. I'd prefer either a p365 or something similar. I just don't have a good 9mm.
Same. My m&p shield 40 is my go to carry gun. I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to shooting it to get it accurate. But once I figured it out nothing beats it. I love having such a powerful punch in a small package.
~ .40 s&w/m&p 2.0 full size, on an orpaz defense owb thumbpress level #2 retention worn on right side hip canted 30° on a Blue Alpha Gear Hybrid EDC ~ 6.8 spc/ar-15 type platform, short-stroke piston non-reciprocating side charging handle with a 16" barrel, red dot attachment; single point sling; front foregrip; accessories ~.338 lapua magnum/Sako TRG 42 ~3 x knives, a utility, folding and fixed blade * no shotguns or smg's or pdw's or lever actions or machine pistols; Also or electroshock weapons or blunt force weapons or chemical sprays etc...
If you plan to go shoot with them every weekend like we do......it matters. These guys shoot a lot and their friends shoot a lot. Depends what kind of friends you have and how much yall shoot
Right, how about we be grown ass men and make our own decisions and keep our ish straight so we can afford what ever the hell we want. Within reason obviously lol
Some 30 years ago I was involved with IPSC. There was a Padre who shot a 22 lr. Some people blew him off at first but every round was center A zone and his double taps were phenomenal. Just sayin’.
@@networkinc.6825 Go to most gun ranges, indoors and outdoors, where almost all ranges today have some sort of action shooting events, IDPA, ASI, IPSC, USPSA, Steel shoots, 2 Gun or 3 Gun Shoots, Cowboy Action Shoots, etc.
Try .357 SIG. Best of both worlds. Love my Rhino as well in .357 Magnum but with everything that is going on, capacity and reloads just got more important.
I don't hate my .40. I carry it the most often because it is my highest capacity handgun at the moment. It's sufficient in every category. I just think I can do better with a different model of pistol. More of a strike against Glock than the caliber.
@@AverageJoe4063 Pure terminal performance wise, I would agree. However, the problem with 357 is that you will need a revoler or pistol of some odd design which does not meet my requirements. However, with 10mm M&P 2.0, I believe it would cover the need for semi-auto in 357 Magnum range.
@@AverageJoe4063 357 SIG is not a bad ammunition. However, sourcing it at an affordable price is a problem. Also, 40S&W with light weight bullets can cover most of what 357SIG can do.
Yea, my oldest once bought an H&R carbine in .500S&W, he already had a Super Redhawk .454 Casull, I asked him “What are you going to shoot with that?” “Anything I need to!” I said “Yep, that’s for the problem elephants in your neighborhood.” We shot a paint can full of water and the lid on tight, it launched the lid about 25-30 feet up with a geyser of water. I think it was a 300gr HP, it blew the can completely apart from about 50 yards. I told him “Geez, our neighbors really hate us now, that thing’ll echo for 2 weeks!” I wished he’d kept it, but he sold it a few months after he got it.
I'm a boomer. Up front. I've owned a 1911 for over 30 years. It's a Caspian Arms accurized and has a modified feed ramp on the frame because it's the old moveable link type barrel. The barrel is ramped to match the ramp mod on the frame and it eats EVERYTHING. Shoots small groups at extended pistol distances and R&D over the years has given us fast and deadly bullet design combined with advanced powder chemistry. I DO NOT carry it. It's bulky and heavy. I carry a compact Sig that holds 10 or 12 rounds in the mag and shoots good. I love my two 40 cal pistols too. Got one with a light that sleeps with me. It shoots great and I'm not a pistolero so that little extra snap is no biggie. I have big hands and 50 years in blue collar manufacturing. My grip is fine. I have a decent supply of ammo for each. Enough to scare the self-appointed antigunners. EFF em!
Not a single mention of .380 ACP? For concealed carry it's 2nd only to 9mm in popularity. I used to carry Hornady's XTP rounds but switched to Underwood Xtreme Defender, which in my opinion is a game-changer for .380. Challenging caliber to get 12-18" penetration with consistent expansion, but XDs don't rely on expansion, plus they're highly barrier-blind.
It's created for concrete jungles. The cities. Reduces collateral damage. It is a *responsible* choice if the gun owner lives in an apartment or neighbors directly next door. In reality, it all works. You could load a piece of old cheese into a case with powder and it'd be dangerous. Comes down to "do I care about the innocent bystanders (if any) or not"?
Agree...we use hardball in our autos for that hair thin extra reliability, and fancy ammo in our revolvers...of course, a 158gr .38 will do just fine, also...it still boils down to hit first usually wins, no matter the caliber or bullet style...
My opinion on defensive calibers- if it’s a handgun, caliber doesn’t matter it will take multiple shots unless you hit the heart, head, or spine. If it’s a rifle, caliber doesn’t matter a chest shot will kill everytime. To sum it up, rifles/shotguns are the best but you can’t carry them everyday, and just get whatever pistol you can put multiple rounds onto target quickly, and is comfortable to carry.
The problem with .22 isnt its lack luster kinetic energy, it that the ammo does not have reliable ignition due to it being rimfire. It also doesnt help that its increadibly dirty and their guns need a lot more maintainence to keep them functioning
I love 22 but those make it not usable for defense. I'm scary accurate with them. Well, I should say "safety inspiringly accurate" because the weapon isn't scary it depends on the user. Also,
I've shot enough 22lr to know it's good for plinking and small game and that's it. I will not depend my life on a 22lr. The smallest I would go for a pistol would be a 5.7, otherwise I just stick with 9mm, which gets the job done.
We are Americans in spirit, ie; freedoms, liberties and rights, especially firearm and defense rights, own and carry! But still want to live where we are! We shouldn't have to move to America, even though America is great, it is beside the point, we want our natural rights fully recognized and acknowledged in all western nations!
Although it's not the best choice for most people, 22lr or .22WMR is always going to be a better choice than nothing... Much better. Whatever works for you is fine, and of nobody's concern. Some people seem to think whatever they use, everyone must use... Other people have large caliber syndrome... I observe these types bragging about the size of their cartridge, like it makes them feel bigger in some way they may actually be short... It cracks me up!
Yup, we carry a .22wmr revolver most days, we're going to be okay...our artillery available if situation warrants carrying it, but those are very rare days...our NAA is carried just as rarely...rule #1 thankfully is wide open in application...
Would a pepperbox be acceptable? Also what about some of the X-bore hand cannons from the black powder days? A 2-bore stopping pistol should be interesting
Short barreled 14-18 inch double 12 gauge ( SXS or O/U) WHY? 2 guns in one (2 hammers, 2 barrels) so reliablity, light easy and simple to handle, multitude of extremely deadly ammo for a multitude of situations, will stop a rhino inside 10 yards and can be effective out to 50 yards on many targets , can stuff just about anything in a reloaded hull with many different propellants can be used, still need to aim but, not as critical as a hand gun or rifle! And can be used in just about all states, provinces and countries.
Instead of getting into debates and arguments, I choose to own multiple firearms in multiple calibers. Thus, I’m always right, seldom wrong, always prepared. But I’m f’ed up like that. I’m the same with truck, muscle cars, and even dirt bikes..
My idea of what to have is what is the Military round 223/556 308 9 mm 45. I say this because most common rounds are going to be available Unless you have everything to reload the smart grid down ammo is going to be the most common. 22 lr is key they are overlooked and quite effective like the Main said you can put 10 rounds in with accurate efficiency and deadly. That's my opinion
My favorite riffle Round is the 243 on the heavier side. (100/105 grs) Gives me very good Long Range performances. Heavy 24 inches barrel, very good single stage trigger and lots of practice.... 🖖🏻🇫🇷😎🇫🇷😎🇫🇷🖖🏻
Texas State Troopers used to carry .357 Sig for a while....then they switched back to 9mm. It was a cost issue only. The .357 is far superior in every way except in cost.
.40 s&w is the ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto though, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best with 155gr/150gr bullet weight being the best for the .40 s&w!
@@AverageJoe4063 it is a hot round for sure but i personally like the .40 s&w and think it is ideal, anything under .400" caliber diameter for a semi-auto handgun for self-defense is too small in my opinion, to be clear i know they are all lethal no matter what diameter, but i am talking ideal and factoring all variables for own/carry and use(barriers, power, capacity, size and much more)
@@AverageJoe4063 Excellent caliber. Just not too easy to find right now. And probably not a high priority for the ammo makers working around the clock to churn out 9mm.
Projectile development and design have made the performance differences in the standard self defense cartridges a very slim margin as long as the better projectiles are being used.
While I understand the differences in size, weight, velocity, and FMJ/HP, the reason 22LR is still lethal is because it still punches wholes in flesh. kind of like being stabbed with a sharp knife compared to being stabbed with a pickaxe, one might be felt more but they can both be lethal. That being said, I prefer to carry 9mm or larger depending on how I'm dressed and how I want to carry that day.
I would also like to throw my two cents in, that I would guess that a lot of people are injured with .22LR because of COMPLACENCY more than anything, just like the saying “how many people have been shot with an unloaded gun”, when people are taught that .22LR is a weak caliber (which it is) doesn’t mean that it doesn’t deserve the same respect as say .223, or .30-06 . Just my two cents. I firmly believe that a major portion of firearm related “accidents” can not just be avoided, but prevented completely if people gave firearms the respect they deserve. Yes they are fun, and we all love them here, but safety should always supersede fun. You own every bullet that comes out of that gun, I think that saying needs to be made very clear to all gun owners new and old. Not in a rude way, but as a firm and friendly reminder to protect a fun and inclusive hobby that more people should and need to get into so that we can teach them that guns are perfectly safe if given the right amount of respect
9mm and .45 BOTH were used extensively in 2 world wars. But behind the scenes, 2 dozen different wildcatters were experimenting with .40 caliber cartridges to make something ballistically superior to either one of those. The goal was to have more mass and penetration than a 9, and more velocity than a .45. They were all arriving at the same conclusion: split the difference between a .35 cal and a .45 cal to hit a sweet spot. Jeff Cooper collected and obsessed over all of their notes that he could get a hold of throughout the '50s and '60s. In the '70s and early '80s, he developed early prototypical .40s into 10mm Auto. The resulting loads wowed the gun industry in the early and mid-'80s, but there were no reliable guns to shoot it from. After the '86 Miami FBI shootout, the FBI decided to let science figure it out. And science showed that 10mm was the best all-around caliber for sidearms. If we set aside emotion, rigid objective empirical testing leads us to that conclusion. Program mismanagement lead the FBI to quickly abandon the 10mm gun that they had selected, but they still liked the performance of their .40 cal rounds, so they embraced .40S&W for the next 25 years. Follow the science. If your hands can fit the guns, shoot 10. If they can't, shoot .40. If you can't afford either, know that you are compromising, and then shoot whatever you can afford and access.
The context for this science is Law Enforcement and Combat. Regular citizen carriers have a different mandate, and get little if any benefit from carrying around 10mm or 40 s&w guns. In fact, they get needless extra recoil and blast from high pressure rounds without a meaningful shift in outcome. I agree that the 10mm is the best auto pistol round for terminal performance, but most people will drop with a 22lr.
@@Subtlenimbus The benefit of 10/.40 is the added peace of mind that comes from more consistent barrier penetration and deep travel. It isn't a maybe or possibility with these calibers--it's an almost certainty and extreme likelihood. I've seen too many security camera videos of people walking or running off, or continuing to fight through, 9mm shots to trust that caliber. That's what I fear--not muzzle blast and flip. You're more than welcome to use a .22. But I don't trust it either. I'm not assassinating anyone at point blank range, and it's too little cartridge to make me feel comfortable at greater range than that.
.40 is the best one. Because there is figuratively and literally mountains of it everywhere for the last 2 years 9mm has been scarce and expensive. Right now it's only a couple cents more per cartridge and it never sells out.
I'm not going to vouch for one caliber over other, I'm just going to say. I chose 357sig because, per round and per magazine, is the most energy that I can stick, into the particular handgun that I carry, and in the only handgun that I currently have. However for the fun range time I switch to the 9mm barrel, because price. Everyone should carry what makes them comfortable, confident, and whatever they can shoot best.
Home defense, Hornady Critical Defense 00 Buck 2 3/4 12 GA. EDC, Hornady Critical Defense JHP 9mm. Truck Gun, 5.56 x 45mm 62 Gr. LAP. Fun at the range plinking targets, 22LR.
The “best” self defense caliber is whatever you have at hand, in my not well informed opinion. There are rounds that have been designed to do exactly whatever their designers had in mind but don’t do much if you don’t have a launcher and rounds available.
@@Austin-uq9ms Depends on the load. A 5.56 will have more penetration. A 9mm will have more penetration. Then again, some of us don't live in an apartment, so therefore if we feel like using a 50 cal, then so be it.
@@toddk1377 you reply to me as if you think I don’t know ballistics. My comment was directed towards the person who can’t spell 12 gauge and uses the term “stopping power.” It’s obvious most non gun enthusiast think they can load pappys pump with 00 buck and clear an entire room full of bad guys with one trigger pull. When extensive training tells us a solid AR with proper bullet selection gets the job done with less collateral damage and easier follow up shots, if the bad guy has a buddy. Also my wife can shoot an AR no problem if I’m not home, my shotguns not so easily. Just my opinion.
@@Austin-uq9ms Okay, I didn't sense the sarcasm vibe to the op from your comment. That's what sucks about texts or messages vs talking in face to face. Otherwise, yeah, you're right, I'd agree 100%. I myself prefer my AR-15 over my shotgun, for many reasons, but I wouldn't hesitate to use my shotgun if I needed to too and like you mentioned, the AR is more practical for my old lady to use as well.
The gun that is small and light weight enough that you will actually carry it is the right gun for you. Suggestions would be a light weight Smith & Wesson revolver in 38 Special or 357 magnum, Ruger 380 Max, Ruger LC9, North American Arms 22 LR. Be sure to try them all as they have unique advantages and limitations. Home defense a shotgun rules 12 gauge or 20 gauge if you need less recoil. Nothing else stops a threat with one shot as dependably. If you are defending enough land to grow and raise your own food a Tavor 7 in 308 is the answer.
We're close to the same page...having one gun is the most important thought, owning more options always good...you're correct about shotgun for the house, my opinion, but they do make lousy carry weapons...we're revolver people when it comes to carry, it's all good...
I severely underestimated this until 2020. I saw it as a range toy or something to let the inexperienced still shoot a real rifle.....Then all these people started wearing diapers on their faces and 22 became a viable option for me too.
Here’s the way I try to explain it to people: “You go out about 10 paces and I’m gonna shoot you. What caliber do you want me to use?” If that’s me? I don’t want you to shoot me with a BB gun. So, the last thing I’m gonna care about if a gun is pointed at me is whether it’s a 9 or a 40.
It comes down to marksmanship! Buy something you can shoot well. A heart shot with a 22LR will make you just as dead as a heart shot with a 45 ACP. The bigger calibers make bigger holes but your accurate rate of fire goes down. I have 22, 380, 9mm, 38 Special, 357 magnum, 45ACP, 45 LC. They will all kill you. If all you have is a 22, make sure you are accurate with it.
Growing up with a. 22 in hand hunting squirrels, rabbits, it is worthy of self defense. But i would never trust my life with a .22 for one reason. Reliability. Yes i know better ammo better odds of ignition. If its not 100% reliable , or as close as realistically possible, Im not carrying it. Murphy has followed me around for 57 years, I need the odds in my favor.
In my experience and opinion, with a couple of exceptions, pistol calibers have such low muzzle energies (compared to rifle calibers) that the differences between them are negligible. Then again, I’m a nobody.
Medical experts and other related field experts agree with the idea. When it comes to lethality and effects on the body, the difference from .380, 9mm, .45, 10mm, it is pretty negligible. Anything under a .380 like a .22 can still work but isn't ideal if any penetration is needed. Anything bigger than 10mm or 40 will work but take away capacity but are very effective when they hit the mark. A missed shot is always a missed shot and good placement is always good placement. I like the idea of carrying the largest caliber you can comfortably and accurately manage in the platform you're best with. I prefer 9mm for being common.
I agree. Being a musician, I actually make choices of carry guns based on chamber pressure. I would rather carry a 380 or 45 instead of a 9mm or revolver because of noise levels in the event I would ever need to use it. Of course, if life is in the balance, hearing damage takes a back seat, but I try to optimize the situation beforehand. Sometimes I carry a 22lr, and sometimes just a knife.
My mom has tried to shoot a multitude of calibers. She didn't like .357 Magnum because it was too heavy. She tried a couple of ultra light .38 specials and the recoil was too much for her to comfortably shoot. The Sig P365 and S&W Shield 9mm were both too hard for her to rack the slide, so she didn't like those either. So she is settling on a Ruger LCR in .22 LR. She's a damn good shot with a .22, so it'd be a no brainer for her to go with a .22 LR.
I always have a hard time deciding which to carry. 9mm with Buffalo bore 1400+ fps 500+ muzzle energy ft lbs go defensive ammo, or my 45acp with Hornady Critical duty 220 grain go, 475 ft lbs muzzle energy, I think around 1050fps. Either will do the job and then some, 9mm has 2x + the capacity though which is nice.
I own a 9mm and a .45ACP and I tell you I choose the .45. I once shot a pumpkin and recovered the bullet, 230 gold dot expanded to freaking .80 caliber.
Ive had an M&P40 and 9, Ive had a G17 and 19X, Ive had an FNX45...Im now back to a SW SD9VE, and PERSONALLY I like it the best...but thats 1000s of rounds through each learning what works best for me.
Yeah, like I mentioned, and you brought up, about all the advancements in powder and bullet design, etc, is exactly why I choose a .45…you don’t need all that for it to be as effective as a modern 9mm defensive round. Cause 9mm ball sucks, for defensive carry, way over penetrates and doesn’t deliver as much energy, as with a person, 9mm ball will punch a small hole, straight through. A .45 ball does way more damage, delivers more energy. You need all the modern crap in a 9mm to equal or slightly exceed the terminal performance of a .45 ball round. So yes, .45 ball costs more than 9mm ball for practice, but it costs a lot less than the modern fancy 9mm, or any .40 cal…and is just as good as those two fancy rounds. So yeah, that’s why I choose .45, it’s better overall, economically, in the fact that your practice ammo is just as effective as other modern loadings in other common calibers. And it also works for me, yes you lose mag capacity, guess what, that’s what more mags are for, so carry an extra mag or two. Once again, works for me, I realize it won’t for all/others. Just saying why I do what I do. Plus an added bonus, it is a total icon, along with a 1911. And people who cry about mag capacity in a civilian sense, you shouldn’t need more than 50 rounds, at the upper end, in a pistol. If you’re shooting near that much in a gun fight, you are long past the point of running away as a civilian, or getting you’re rifle out and going to work. You shouldn’t be in a gun fight, with your pistol, it’s there to protect you, let you get away, while not being defenseless…if you’re gonna be in gun fight, grab a rifle. If you can’t, that’s a gun fight you can’t win, and get out of there while you can.
Elmer Keith as well as others hot rodded the 44Special. Elmer went to Remington first. He tried to get Remington to come out with factory loads like his. Remington said they couldn't. There were to many 44Special guns out there that couldn't survive such loads. With a bit more discussion they agree to build such load but to do it in bit longer case to prevent chambering in 44Special guns. Then Elmer went to S&W and talked to them. They agreed to build a revolver to handle anything Remington would load. This was in 1955. Elmer got the first tool room 44Magmun from S&W, and ammo from Remington. In January of 1956. From there it's all history.
I hunt hogs a lot. I carry for defense..9mm works great. But when I hunt hogs I carry my 40 glock because I think weight matters. Bigger bullets just thump a little harder if I have to switch from rifle to pistol. If I had a 10mm I would go that way. But for defense carry a 9mm is just fine.
All I can say is, is I promise, i carry/shoot my M&P 22 compact much more then anyone I know with a 9mm or 45acp. I also have not had a single jam with it in the 5k rounds I have put through it.
Cartridge selection is great, but 38 special will be fine vs a bipod mammal. Shot placement is critical, but any gun is better than no gun. If a 17 hmr is what it is, then it beats having nothing.
ARX is the brand making the self defense “screwdriver” projectile. I bought a bunch during the ammo apocalypse back in 2020/2021. They are good but I like the Critical D’s and Norma Monolithic’s more
We like to practice with those in our .22lr NAA...much easier recoil on our old hands...carry with velocitors or stingers...but at stick it up their nose range even that cb short would probably win the fight...
@@tylerwill5250 He said proven rounds. The 10mm has been around longer than the.40 .....,but .40 is way more common over the past 35 years or so. It has been proven.
Not the most effective for soft armor penitration, not the most effective on capacity, not the most effective for low recoil and follow up shots, and not the most effective for permanent wound cavity. .40 and .357 magnum are good at intermediate barrier penetration which is why they were designed for car fights and shooting through auto glass, the cops had a lot of car fights in the 1930's.
stay alive shoot 45 / stay free shoot 223 / dont be ill shoot 9 mil / dont hate use 308 / dont be blue you have 22/ are you sporty? then you shoot 40 / your not a bore if you shoot 44 / your only nifty if you shoot 50 / turn the page shoot 12 gauge / my goodness i am bored, sorry folks ......................................................
I bought a 40 off an older gentleman who just couldn't control it and the last time 9 became hard to find I could get 40 everywhere so sometimes it works out still wouldn't go without a nine either
Speaking of .40 cal, one thing I noticed between the Obama AND the latest Biden ammo shortages (in the area's I lived in in FL and now OH) is that 40 S&W was always the last on the shelves. just prior to the outbreak and lockdowns, a store I was working at was closing and we had some SMOKING deals on firearms, and I was able to pick up a brand new Beretta APX in 40 S&W for LESS than $250 after tax out the door. And even though it was the store closing and not an ammo shortage guess which ammo we still had plenty of on the shelf? (even at the discount price).
We had at least 8 of these APX's in 40 S&W after the 9mm's sold, and when I pointed this out to my coworkers two of them also bought the same pistol in 40 S&W, and we each got around 300 rounds of 40 S&W defensive ammo at 40% off plus employee discount.
People want to talk about what ammo will be available in a SHTF scenario, I say have firearm's in as many caliber's as possible.
I had no trouble selling a g19 or 17 but when it came to the g23 in 40s&w, nobody wanted it. It was so crazy. People have gotten caught up in this echo chamber of "9 or nothing" that anything in 40 was completely overlooked. Some people follow the trends they hear and nothing else, and they miss out on some really good firearms.
I def noticed 40 was the last on shelves too... kept buyin it for my neighbor cuz he has a glock in 40
And I'm sorry it's a better option if you can handle it. Now I own and carry both, but I feel better with my 40. I live in Oregon and don't stay in city's, I prefer something I can shoot a bear with.
Why i eventually want to get a glock 19, you can get a 23 and 32 upper and basically have 1 gun in 3 calibers, all using the same holster and accessories
Right but 40 is always the last on the pistol shelf for a reason lots of snap for no real ballistic benefit other then it being readily available compared to 9mm or 45
It’s 💯 shot placement. As a retired paramedic, I picked a lot of folks killed with .22lr and all other calibers. It depends where the round hits. Picked up one guy shot in the chest with a .45acp and he talked all the way to the hospital. I love guns and carry a 380 or a 9mm for edc. It’s totally shot placement. I’ve actually been able to see what trauma and injuries people sustain from getting shot. Whatever caliber you carry, practice, practice, practice. I would not make fun of anyone who carries a .22 LR. Seen a lot of people killed with those. God Bless you guys
I don't know if this is true or some "old wives' tale" but I've heard it say, "there's more people in the grave over .22LR than any other caliber, because of the low cost and wide spread accessibility of the .22"
RFK killed with a .22
Where was the .22 gunshot wounds located at on the victim's body that proved fatal
@@mikewade386 chest cavity and head
@@tommyseales6759 thanks for the reply you will do great work debunking the myth about .22 and other calibers how many cases have you seen fatal when it came to the .25 acp
Hell with it, carry em all! 😁 They’re all good hole punchers. Have a variety , have options
The best caliber is the one you're carrying.
Exactly.
Unproductive copout. There are calibers better at one job than another. Specific ammunition of the same caliber for one job or another.
We all know this, but anyone that doesn't is only harmed by the idea that all calibers are equal at all things.
@@Sheridantank dafuq you talkin bout Serj Tankian? The boy done said the one I's curryin. Dat means muh 22 snub is nuff
@@Sheridantank Oh BS. We all know fudds who say "45 or nuthin" who then don't carry their bulky 2 and a half pound gun.
I carried a bodyguard 380 for years. Go ahead & tell me it is inadequate and I'll answer that it is if you are incompetent. Now I carry a p365. More powerful, more capacity. But if I was carrying a 22 cal mouse gun, it is a heck of a lot better than the gun you left at home, and you know it.
My statement is true, but also weeds the true fudds from the masses. A 22 short is a better stand than your flat-range operator, unscarred knuckles.
One, of many, issue with this topic is that it draws the, "It's not about the caliber. It is all about shot placement...blah blah!" crowd.
The fallacy in their argument is that they are not Robocop with 100% headshot capability.
In the end, the people who blabber that also just end up aiming "general center mass." Then wound volume does matter.
I love the additional camera angles that you've been doing. Gives the videos a better feel.
180 lbs/ft 22lr that you mentioned was measured using a rifle barrel. with pistol barrel lengths 2-6 inches, 22lr CCI only develops about 50 to 60 lbs/ft, whereas 9mm is measured in 4" barrel and 45 is usually measured in 5" barrel.
They didn't mention that the increase in bullet technology and powder technology also carries over to the 40 Smith & Wesson and the 45 so it's not like 9 mm is the absolute best.
Also there’s talks of law enforcement still failing their test with the duty 9mm in +p/+p+ and have been cheating by using regular ball ammo for the test due to the duty loads having recoil as the 40 s&w. As well the majority of civilians don’t carry police duty loads and use standard loaded self defense rounds. So when the 9mm acolytes say that the 9mm is better then id have to say they’re wrong. Even standard 40 s&w has good barrier penetration. But the 9mm acolytes don’t want to hear that because they only go to the range to plink and not train or practice.
@@totalnewb123 yea man we all have to train and trade with what we shoot.
Just remember: No caliber is worth a damn, if you can't hit your attacker!! PRACTICE with the caliber you want to use!!
Easy
My edc is a phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range
Hey, just what you see, pal.
.40 180 gr does spicy meat damage. I saw a bad shot placement to the arm. It took a huge chunk out the Tango’s arm. A nasty, but not a fatal wound.
So does 5.56 at point blank
@@NoNo_IStay lol I know what we're thinking of
@Unknown User Not a very good defensive Gaige😜
Thanks for that conversation guys that was enjoyable. We just finished the deer and moose seasons here in Maine so I’m spending a few hours cleaning up the families guns this was a great background to listen to. Thank you again.
rCleaning guns after Moose season?? How the heck many moose did you guys shoot? One or two each? Wipe the guns off and good till next season.
For me, what's more important defensively than what caliber I'm shooting, is what weapon I'm shooting it from (and is that weapon going to be readily available when I need it), can I shoot that weapon quickly and accurately (and does my ammo make that even more certain), am I using the best ammo for the particular circumstance with the most appropriate penetrating and permanent wound channel creating ability, and can I carry enough of it to deal with worst case situations. Bottom line: the best defensive ammo changes from shooter to shooter, gun to gun (because not all guns are created equal), and circumstance to circumstance.
Unpopular opinion: .40s&w is still my personal defense caliber
.357 SIG is mine.
Not as unpopular as you think. Especially right now. It's not my favorite, but I do carry my .40 the most often. I'd prefer either a p365 or something similar. I just don't have a good 9mm.
It is a great ammunition for number of reasons.
My channel has a video about ammunition and there is more details about the topic.
Same. My m&p shield 40 is my go to carry gun. I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to shooting it to get it accurate. But once I figured it out nothing beats it. I love having such a powerful punch in a small package.
Don't listen to 'popular' opinion...i worry about those folks...
~ .40 s&w/m&p 2.0 full size, on an orpaz defense owb thumbpress level #2 retention worn on right side hip canted 30° on a Blue Alpha Gear Hybrid EDC
~ 6.8 spc/ar-15 type platform, short-stroke piston non-reciprocating side charging handle with a 16" barrel, red dot attachment; single point sling; front foregrip; accessories
~.338 lapua magnum/Sako TRG 42
~3 x knives, a utility, folding and fixed blade
* no shotguns or smg's or pdw's or lever actions or machine pistols;
Also or electroshock weapons or blunt force weapons or chemical sprays etc...
Never based my ammo choice on what my friends shoot.
Unless they will let you use theirs? I use the same caliber as my brother. Mind it takes about 45 minutes to get to his house.
If you plan to go shoot with them every weekend like we do......it matters. These guys shoot a lot and their friends shoot a lot. Depends what kind of friends you have and how much yall shoot
@@NoNo_IStay nope doesn't matter to me, they shoot want they want and I'll do the same doesn't matter how often we shoot.
Right, how about we be grown ass men and make our own decisions and keep our ish straight so we can afford what ever the hell we want. Within reason obviously lol
Some 30 years ago I was involved with IPSC. There was a Padre who shot a 22 lr. Some people blew him off at first but every round was center A zone and his double taps were phenomenal. Just sayin’.
Like my dad always told me
"A trained 22 is ten times as dangerous as an inexperienced 45."
Jade,, sorry for being slow,, but what were you involved in???
@@NoNo_IStay damn right,,,
@@networkinc.6825 IPSC = International Practical Shooting Confederation. Moving and shooting at paper targets.
@@networkinc.6825 Go to most gun ranges, indoors and outdoors, where almost all ranges today have some sort of action shooting events, IDPA, ASI, IPSC, USPSA, Steel shoots, 2 Gun or 3 Gun Shoots, Cowboy Action Shoots, etc.
I'll take my .40 cal over 9mm all day, everyday, and twice on Sunday. But I'd take .357 Magnum over both of them.
I pretty much stick with the 357 have two lever actions in 357 and Cimmeron frontier in 357, a Rhino in 357. my preference as well.
Try .357 SIG. Best of both worlds. Love my Rhino as well in .357 Magnum but with everything that is going on, capacity and reloads just got more important.
I don't hate my .40. I carry it the most often because it is my highest capacity handgun at the moment. It's sufficient in every category. I just think I can do better with a different model of pistol. More of a strike against Glock than the caliber.
@@AverageJoe4063 Pure terminal performance wise, I would agree.
However, the problem with 357 is that you will need a revoler or pistol of some odd design which does not meet my requirements. However, with 10mm M&P 2.0, I believe it would cover the need for semi-auto in 357 Magnum range.
@@AverageJoe4063 357 SIG is not a bad ammunition. However, sourcing it at an affordable price is a problem. Also, 40S&W with light weight bullets can cover most of what 357SIG can do.
Love these videos Eric. Your camera angle with both of you on screen talking I think was superior to just seeing one of you at a time.
“If you carry anything less than a .500 Magnum, you’re a wuss.” “Shut up.”
Yea, my oldest once bought an H&R carbine in .500S&W, he already had a Super Redhawk .454 Casull, I asked him “What are you going to shoot with that?”
“Anything I need to!”
I said “Yep, that’s for the problem elephants in your neighborhood.”
We shot a paint can full of water and the lid on tight, it launched the lid about 25-30 feet up with a geyser of water. I think it was a 300gr HP, it blew the can completely apart from about 50 yards.
I told him “Geez, our neighbors really hate us now, that thing’ll echo for 2 weeks!” I wished he’d kept it, but he sold it a few months after he got it.
I'm a boomer. Up front. I've owned a 1911 for over 30 years. It's a Caspian Arms accurized and has a modified feed ramp on the frame because it's the old moveable link type barrel. The barrel is ramped to match the ramp mod on the frame and it eats EVERYTHING. Shoots small groups at extended pistol distances and R&D over the years has given us fast and deadly bullet design combined with advanced powder chemistry. I DO NOT carry it. It's bulky and heavy. I carry a compact Sig that holds 10 or 12 rounds in the mag and shoots good. I love my two 40 cal pistols too. Got one with a light that sleeps with me. It shoots great and I'm not a pistolero so that little extra snap is no biggie. I have big hands and 50 years in blue collar manufacturing. My grip is fine. I have a decent supply of ammo for each. Enough to scare the self-appointed antigunners. EFF em!
Not a single mention of .380 ACP? For concealed carry it's 2nd only to 9mm in popularity. I used to carry Hornady's XTP rounds but switched to Underwood Xtreme Defender, which in my opinion is a game-changer for .380. Challenging caliber to get 12-18" penetration with consistent expansion, but XDs don't rely on expansion, plus they're highly barrier-blind.
"Don't like ball" too many issues. Ball has ended more problems then all the fancy ammo combined. Old school works just fine. 😎
It's created for concrete jungles. The cities. Reduces collateral damage. It is a *responsible* choice if the gun owner lives in an apartment or neighbors directly next door.
In reality, it all works. You could load a piece of old cheese into a case with powder and it'd be dangerous. Comes down to "do I care about the innocent bystanders (if any) or not"?
🤦🏻♂️
Agree...we use hardball in our autos for that hair thin extra reliability, and fancy ammo in our revolvers...of course, a 158gr .38 will do just fine, also...it still boils down to hit first usually wins, no matter the caliber or bullet style...
@@JustDefense the person is right though regular ball ammo is just fine all the other new crap is just a force multiplier / bonus
My opinion on defensive calibers- if it’s a handgun, caliber doesn’t matter it will take multiple shots unless you hit the heart, head, or spine. If it’s a rifle, caliber doesn’t matter a chest shot will kill everytime. To sum it up, rifles/shotguns are the best but you can’t carry them everyday, and just get whatever pistol you can put multiple rounds onto target quickly, and is comfortable to carry.
The problem with .22 isnt its lack luster kinetic energy, it that the ammo does not have reliable ignition due to it being rimfire. It also doesnt help that its increadibly dirty and their guns need a lot more maintainence to keep them functioning
Not to mention feed issues.
I love 22 but those make it not usable for defense. I'm scary accurate with them. Well, I should say "safety inspiringly accurate" because the weapon isn't scary it depends on the user.
Also,
Whaaat?? That doesn't make any sense. How is rimfire less accurate than centerfire? I can hit a shirt button at 100 yds with m 10-22..
I've shot enough 22lr to know it's good for plinking and small game and that's it. I will not depend my life on a 22lr. The smallest I would go for a pistol would be a 5.7, otherwise I just stick with 9mm, which gets the job done.
@@MyFathersBusinessLLC pretty sure the OP said less reliable, not less accurate….
We are Americans in spirit, ie; freedoms, liberties and rights, especially firearm and defense rights, own and carry! But still want to live where we are! We shouldn't have to move to America, even though America is great, it is beside the point, we want our natural rights fully recognized and acknowledged in all western nations!
Although it's not the best choice for most people, 22lr or .22WMR is always going to be a better choice than nothing... Much better. Whatever works for you is fine, and of nobody's concern. Some people seem to think whatever they use, everyone must use... Other people have large caliber syndrome... I observe these types bragging about the size of their cartridge, like it makes them feel bigger in some way they may actually be short... It cracks me up!
Yup, we carry a .22wmr revolver most days, we're going to be okay...our artillery available if situation warrants carrying it, but those are very rare days...our NAA is carried just as rarely...rule #1 thankfully is wide open in application...
6mm arc is great! But I don't think I'll switch from 6.5 grendel until the ARC is more out there and prevalent.
6mm arc isn't all its cracked up to be 224 valkyrie is the better bet
If you're not shooting .45-70 from a derringer are you even _trying_ to kill that Grizzly?
Would a pepperbox be acceptable? Also what about some of the X-bore hand cannons from the black powder days? A 2-bore stopping pistol should be interesting
I think we can all agree,
A hollowpoint shotgun slugs on an unarmored target is devastating..
Soft lead buck shot ... same effect but 9 balls in stead of one.
@@blueduck9409
Dependent on range
Better be if you only got 5
Gotta love a shotgun
Short barreled 14-18 inch double 12 gauge ( SXS or O/U) WHY? 2 guns in one (2 hammers, 2 barrels) so reliablity, light easy and simple to handle, multitude of extremely deadly ammo for a multitude of situations, will stop a rhino inside 10 yards and can be effective out to 50 yards on many targets , can stuff just about anything in a reloaded hull with many different propellants can be used, still need to aim but, not as critical as a hand gun or rifle! And can be used in just about all states, provinces and countries.
Instead of getting into debates and arguments, I choose to own multiple firearms in multiple calibers. Thus, I’m always right, seldom wrong, always prepared. But I’m f’ed up like that. I’m the same with truck, muscle cars, and even dirt bikes..
My idea of what to have is what is the Military round 223/556 308 9 mm 45. I say this because most common rounds are going to be available Unless you have everything to reload the smart grid down ammo is going to be the most common. 22 lr is key they are overlooked and quite effective like the Main said you can put 10 rounds in with accurate efficiency and deadly. That's my opinion
Knowing the military, do not just copy the military. The military might be using something for some unbelievably stupid reasons than you might think.
Once I landed on 10mm Auto, it was a wrap.Great, great round.
This ladies and gentlemen is by far one of THE best gun shows on RUclips to date. Lots of respect for these guys and the knowledge that they have
My favorite riffle Round is the 243 on the heavier side. (100/105 grs)
Gives me very good Long Range performances.
Heavy 24 inches barrel, very good single stage trigger and lots of practice....
🖖🏻🇫🇷😎🇫🇷😎🇫🇷🖖🏻
.243 Win. is an excellent cartridge for medium size game such as deer and pronghorn.
Texas State Troopers used to carry .357 Sig for a while....then they switched back to 9mm. It was a cost issue only. The .357 is far superior in every way except in cost.
I truly believe the reason PD's Switched to 9mm was to Pinch Pennies.. 40 Cal Really has Good Stopping Power All the Vids that I've seen says it All..
Yep and it is very impressive when it comes to penetrating body armor. 9 not so much.
.40 s&w is the ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto though, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best with 155gr/150gr bullet weight being the best for the .40 s&w!
Have you tried .357 SIG? More energy, less recoil.
@@AverageJoe4063 it is a hot round for sure but i personally like the .40 s&w and think it is ideal, anything under .400" caliber diameter for a semi-auto handgun for self-defense is too small in my opinion, to be clear i know they are all lethal no matter what diameter, but i am talking ideal and factoring all variables for own/carry and use(barriers, power, capacity, size and much more)
@@AverageJoe4063 Excellent caliber. Just not too easy to find right now. And probably not a high priority for the ammo makers working around the clock to churn out 9mm.
Projectile development and design have made the performance differences in the standard self defense cartridges a very slim margin as long as the better projectiles are being used.
While I understand the differences in size, weight, velocity, and FMJ/HP, the reason 22LR is still lethal is because it still punches wholes in flesh. kind of like being stabbed with a sharp knife compared to being stabbed with a pickaxe, one might be felt more but they can both be lethal.
That being said, I prefer to carry 9mm or larger depending on how I'm dressed and how I want to carry that day.
one stinger round flying out of a 24 inch barrel at 1650 fps will f anything up
I gotta know...what is the black 1911 in the background ?
It's about shot placement under stress and number of targets being engaged
High velocity .22 ammo depends on rifle barrel to be high velocity. Shoot a .22 Stinger out of a pistol and you will see what I am talking about.
I would also like to throw my two cents in, that I would guess that a lot of people are injured with .22LR because of COMPLACENCY more than anything, just like the saying “how many people have been shot with an unloaded gun”, when people are taught that .22LR is a weak caliber (which it is) doesn’t mean that it doesn’t deserve the same respect as say .223, or .30-06 . Just my two cents. I firmly believe that a major portion of firearm related “accidents” can not just be avoided, but prevented completely if people gave firearms the respect they deserve. Yes they are fun, and we all love them here, but safety should always supersede fun. You own every bullet that comes out of that gun, I think that saying needs to be made very clear to all gun owners new and old. Not in a rude way, but as a firm and friendly reminder to protect a fun and inclusive hobby that more people should and need to get into so that we can teach them that guns are perfectly safe if given the right amount of respect
You guys always put out entertaining, informative content. Thanks
80 countries! That's Amazing guys!
9mm and .45 BOTH were used extensively in 2 world wars. But behind the scenes, 2 dozen different wildcatters were experimenting with .40 caliber cartridges to make something ballistically superior to either one of those. The goal was to have more mass and penetration than a 9, and more velocity than a .45. They were all arriving at the same conclusion: split the difference between a .35 cal and a .45 cal to hit a sweet spot.
Jeff Cooper collected and obsessed over all of their notes that he could get a hold of throughout the '50s and '60s. In the '70s and early '80s, he developed early prototypical .40s into 10mm Auto. The resulting loads wowed the gun industry in the early and mid-'80s, but there were no reliable guns to shoot it from.
After the '86 Miami FBI shootout, the FBI decided to let science figure it out. And science showed that 10mm was the best all-around caliber for sidearms. If we set aside emotion, rigid objective empirical testing leads us to that conclusion.
Program mismanagement lead the FBI to quickly abandon the 10mm gun that they had selected, but they still liked the performance of their .40 cal rounds, so they embraced .40S&W for the next 25 years.
Follow the science. If your hands can fit the guns, shoot 10. If they can't, shoot .40. If you can't afford either, know that you are compromising, and then shoot whatever you can afford and access.
The context for this science is Law Enforcement and Combat. Regular citizen carriers have a different mandate, and get little if any benefit from carrying around 10mm or 40 s&w guns. In fact, they get needless extra recoil and blast from high pressure rounds without a meaningful shift in outcome. I agree that the 10mm is the best auto pistol round for terminal performance, but most people will drop with a 22lr.
@@Subtlenimbus The benefit of 10/.40 is the added peace of mind that comes from more consistent barrier penetration and deep travel. It isn't a maybe or possibility with these calibers--it's an almost certainty and extreme likelihood.
I've seen too many security camera videos of people walking or running off, or continuing to fight through, 9mm shots to trust that caliber. That's what I fear--not muzzle blast and flip.
You're more than welcome to use a .22. But I don't trust it either. I'm not assassinating anyone at point blank range, and it's too little cartridge to make me feel comfortable at greater range than that.
90 gr. Underwood pretty good. In my Shield 3.1"
I carry the 2mm kolibri, amazing knockdown power.......🙂
🤣
Freddy Krueger shirt
.40 is the best one.
Because there is figuratively and literally mountains of it everywhere for the last 2 years 9mm has been scarce and expensive.
Right now it's only a couple cents more per cartridge and it never sells out.
Whatever caliber you are carrying or using is the correct one. Go with what you have.
I'm not going to vouch for one caliber over other, I'm just going to say.
I chose 357sig because, per round and per magazine, is the most energy that I can stick, into the particular handgun that I carry, and in the only handgun that I currently have.
However for the fun range time I switch to the 9mm barrel, because price.
Everyone should carry what makes them comfortable, confident, and whatever they can shoot best.
Home defense, Hornady Critical Defense 00 Buck 2 3/4 12 GA.
EDC, Hornady Critical Defense JHP 9mm.
Truck Gun, 5.56 x 45mm 62 Gr. LAP.
Fun at the range plinking targets, 22LR.
The “best” self defense caliber is whatever you have at hand, in my not well informed opinion. There are rounds that have been designed to do exactly whatever their designers had in mind but don’t do much if you don’t have a launcher and rounds available.
I find thats its difficult to beat a 12gage for defense. As for one shot stopping power there is little else thats practical.
Yeah except your kids in the next room or your neighbor in the next apartment. Collateral damage is a thing
@@Austin-uq9ms
Depends on the load. A 5.56 will have more penetration. A 9mm will have more penetration. Then again, some of us don't live in an apartment, so therefore if we feel like using a 50 cal, then so be it.
@@toddk1377 you reply to me as if you think I don’t know ballistics. My comment was directed towards the person who can’t spell 12 gauge and uses the term “stopping power.” It’s obvious most non gun enthusiast think they can load pappys pump with 00 buck and clear an entire room full of bad guys with one trigger pull. When extensive training tells us a solid AR with proper bullet selection gets the job done with less collateral damage and easier follow up shots, if the bad guy has a buddy. Also my wife can shoot an AR no problem if I’m not home, my shotguns not so easily. Just my opinion.
@@Austin-uq9ms
Okay, I didn't sense the sarcasm vibe to the op from your comment. That's what sucks about texts or messages vs talking in face to face.
Otherwise, yeah, you're right, I'd agree 100%.
I myself prefer my AR-15 over my shotgun, for many reasons, but I wouldn't hesitate to use my shotgun if I needed to too and like you mentioned, the AR is more practical for my old lady to use as well.
@@toddk1377 with all that said, all things aside, if you live alone in a house in the woods, 00 buck in a 18 inch 590 = lights out
I’m actually married to the 45ACP. Almost caught me cheating one time😂
The gun that is small and light weight enough that you will actually carry it is the right gun for you. Suggestions would be a light weight Smith & Wesson revolver in 38 Special or 357 magnum, Ruger 380 Max, Ruger LC9, North American Arms 22 LR. Be sure to try them all as they have unique advantages and limitations. Home defense a shotgun rules 12 gauge or 20 gauge if you need less recoil. Nothing else stops a threat with one shot as dependably. If you are defending enough land to grow and raise your own food a Tavor 7 in 308 is the answer.
We're close to the same page...having one gun is the most important thought, owning more options always good...you're correct about shotgun for the house, my opinion, but they do make lousy carry weapons...we're revolver people when it comes to carry, it's all good...
I definitely shoot/train more often with my edc since acquiring the Advantage Arms 22lr conversion kit for it. 10/10 would recommend.
I severely underestimated this until 2020. I saw it as a range toy or something to let the inexperienced still shoot a real rifle.....Then all these people started wearing diapers on their faces and 22 became a viable option for me too.
Seconded
Thanks guys... That was a great conversation and entertaining too.... Keep up the awesome work.
We had deputies who just HAD to have a 10mm against advice. None of them could qualify with it.
Here’s the way I try to explain it to people: “You go out about 10 paces and I’m gonna shoot you. What caliber do you want me to use?”
If that’s me? I don’t want you to shoot me with a BB gun. So, the last thing I’m gonna care about if a gun is pointed at me is whether it’s a 9 or a 40.
It comes down to marksmanship! Buy something you can shoot well. A heart shot with a 22LR will make you just as dead as a heart shot with a 45 ACP. The bigger calibers make bigger holes but your accurate rate of fire goes down. I have 22, 380, 9mm, 38 Special, 357 magnum, 45ACP, 45 LC. They will all kill you. If all you have is a 22, make sure you are accurate with it.
FNX45 is one of the best pistols you can get! Less recoil then a 9mm and 15round capacity!
Growing up with a. 22 in hand hunting squirrels, rabbits, it is worthy of self defense. But i would never trust my life with a .22 for one reason. Reliability. Yes i know better ammo better odds of ignition.
If its not 100% reliable , or as close as realistically possible,
Im not carrying it. Murphy has followed me around for 57 years, I need the odds in my favor.
We usually carry .22wmr in a double action revolver...not ideal, but every day is better than the .45 in the safe...
22 punch auto glass video! 😁😁😁
Yes, with different barrel lengths! 2" to 20"
In my experience and opinion, with a couple of exceptions, pistol calibers have such low muzzle energies (compared to rifle calibers) that the differences between them are negligible. Then again, I’m a nobody.
Medical experts and other related field experts agree with the idea. When it comes to lethality and effects on the body, the difference from .380, 9mm, .45, 10mm, it is pretty negligible.
Anything under a .380 like a .22 can still work but isn't ideal if any penetration is needed. Anything bigger than 10mm or 40 will work but take away capacity but are very effective when they hit the mark. A missed shot is always a missed shot and good placement is always good placement.
I like the idea of carrying the largest caliber you can comfortably and accurately manage in the platform you're best with. I prefer 9mm for being common.
@@Sheridantank my wife is an e.r. nurse and my years of asking her about gsws is definitely part of where my humble opinion is from. Right on.
I agree. Being a musician, I actually make choices of carry guns based on chamber pressure. I would rather carry a 380 or 45 instead of a 9mm or revolver because of noise levels in the event I would ever need to use it. Of course, if life is in the balance, hearing damage takes a back seat, but I try to optimize the situation beforehand. Sometimes I carry a 22lr, and sometimes just a knife.
You should have referenced your older video on the lethality of the .22. It was very interesting. Nice call out on the Lehigh designs.
Oh jeez. This discussion of .22LR is killing me.
Hails and cheers from Canada.
My mom has tried to shoot a multitude of calibers. She didn't like .357 Magnum because it was too heavy. She tried a couple of ultra light .38 specials and the recoil was too much for her to comfortably shoot. The Sig P365 and S&W Shield 9mm were both too hard for her to rack the slide, so she didn't like those either. So she is settling on a Ruger LCR in .22 LR. She's a damn good shot with a .22, so it'd be a no brainer for her to go with a .22 LR.
I always have a hard time deciding which to carry. 9mm with Buffalo bore 1400+ fps 500+ muzzle energy ft lbs go defensive ammo, or my 45acp with Hornady Critical duty 220 grain go, 475 ft lbs muzzle energy, I think around 1050fps. Either will do the job and then some, 9mm has 2x + the capacity though which is nice.
I own a 9mm and a .45ACP and I tell you I choose the .45. I once shot a pumpkin and recovered the bullet, 230 gold dot expanded to freaking .80 caliber.
I carry Winchester T-series 230 grain .45 ACP. It’s an incredible cartridge.
Some of those copper bullets are very impressive as well.
Great episode guys! Such a fun discussion to geek out on. Have a great weekend fellas.
Ive had an M&P40 and 9, Ive had a G17 and 19X, Ive had an FNX45...Im now back to a SW SD9VE, and PERSONALLY I like it the best...but thats 1000s of rounds through each learning what works best for me.
Yeah, like I mentioned, and you brought up, about all the advancements in powder and bullet design, etc, is exactly why I choose a .45…you don’t need all that for it to be as effective as a modern 9mm defensive round. Cause 9mm ball sucks, for defensive carry, way over penetrates and doesn’t deliver as much energy, as with a person, 9mm ball will punch a small hole, straight through. A .45 ball does way more damage, delivers more energy. You need all the modern crap in a 9mm to equal or slightly exceed the terminal performance of a .45 ball round. So yes, .45 ball costs more than 9mm ball for practice, but it costs a lot less than the modern fancy 9mm, or any .40 cal…and is just as good as those two fancy rounds. So yeah, that’s why I choose .45, it’s better overall, economically, in the fact that your practice ammo is just as effective as other modern loadings in other common calibers. And it also works for me, yes you lose mag capacity, guess what, that’s what more mags are for, so carry an extra mag or two. Once again, works for me, I realize it won’t for all/others. Just saying why I do what I do. Plus an added bonus, it is a total icon, along with a 1911. And people who cry about mag capacity in a civilian sense, you shouldn’t need more than 50 rounds, at the upper end, in a pistol. If you’re shooting near that much in a gun fight, you are long past the point of running away as a civilian, or getting you’re rifle out and going to work. You shouldn’t be in a gun fight, with your pistol, it’s there to protect you, let you get away, while not being defenseless…if you’re gonna be in gun fight, grab a rifle. If you can’t, that’s a gun fight you can’t win, and get out of there while you can.
Kel-tec PMR 30 22WMR all you will ever need!
Elmer Keith as well as others hot rodded the 44Special. Elmer went to Remington first. He tried to get Remington to come out with factory loads like his. Remington said they couldn't. There were to many 44Special guns out there that couldn't survive such loads. With a bit more discussion they agree to build such load but to do it in bit longer case to prevent chambering in 44Special guns. Then Elmer went to S&W and talked to them. They agreed to build a revolver to handle anything Remington would load.
This was in 1955. Elmer got the first tool room 44Magmun from S&W, and ammo from Remington. In January of 1956.
From there it's all history.
I still think 40 s&w is a great round
I'm watching videos on RUclips everyday and somehow today is the first time I recall hearing of the 6mmARC in two different videos!!???
You're talking about the ARX that looks like a boat propeller. You're so speaking of the maximum penetrator around and the fort Scott
Winchester RangerOne in any caliber is my current carry round. Sku RA9B1
That is an intense color contrast.. I can't tell if I love it or hate it lol
Got a Ithaca 16 gauge featherweight very old gun. Was my father's.
It's not the size of the bullet but where you put it.
I hunt hogs a lot. I carry for defense..9mm works great. But when I hunt hogs I carry my 40 glock because I think weight matters. Bigger bullets just thump a little harder if I have to switch from rifle to pistol. If I had a 10mm I would go that way. But for defense carry a 9mm is just fine.
My photon blaster won 7 intergalactic wars!
All I can say is, is I promise, i carry/shoot my M&P 22 compact much more then anyone I know with a 9mm or 45acp. I also have not had a single jam with it in the 5k rounds I have put through it.
A bazooka bro
Yep that will stop the threat as long as your not to close to the attacker of course
Cartridge selection is great, but 38 special will be fine vs a bipod mammal. Shot placement is critical, but any gun is better than no gun. If a 17 hmr is what it is, then it beats having nothing.
Best caliber is the one you didn’t leave at home
ARX is the brand making the self defense “screwdriver” projectile. I bought a bunch during the ammo apocalypse back in 2020/2021. They are good but I like the Critical D’s and Norma Monolithic’s more
“There’s no magnum 9mm”
Russia with 9x39: am i a joke to you?
And that’s before even talking about their 9mm +P+ loads with an armor penetrator designed for their Vityaz SMG’s.
9x23 Win
9x33 rimmed anybody? Better known as .357 .... Magnum.
9x25 dillon
9x29mm Winchester Magnum
22 short CB from a NAA mini. debate over.
Guaranteed raging headache right there
We like to practice with those in our .22lr NAA...much easier recoil on our old hands...carry with velocitors or stingers...but at stick it up their nose range even that cb short would probably win the fight...
Accidents are the majority of gun injury so the most common calibers always have more casualties even.22
For me, it comes down to effectiveness. And the .40 and .357 magnum have been PROVEN to be the most effective.
No 10mm? Step up your 40 game
@@tylerwill5250 He said proven rounds. The 10mm has been around longer than the.40 .....,but .40 is way more common over the past 35 years or so. It has been proven.
Not the most effective for soft armor penitration, not the most effective on capacity, not the most effective for low recoil and follow up shots, and not the most effective for permanent wound cavity.
.40 and .357 magnum are good at intermediate barrier penetration which is why they were designed for car fights and shooting through auto glass, the cops had a lot of car fights in the 1930's.
And .45????
I like 147 grain JHP 9mm out a 5 inch barrel for 9mm.
stay alive shoot 45 / stay free shoot 223 / dont be ill shoot 9 mil / dont hate use 308 / dont be blue you have 22/ are you sporty? then you shoot 40 / your not a bore if you shoot 44 / your only nifty if you shoot 50 / turn the page shoot 12 gauge /
my goodness i am bored, sorry folks ......................................................
Also, most every officer has a AR15 in his patrol car/SUV. So the 40 S&W is not your absolute high capacity hard hitter at the ready.
I bought a 40 off an older gentleman who just couldn't control it and the last time 9 became hard to find I could get 40 everywhere so sometimes it works out still wouldn't go without a nine either