The Nostalgic Spider-Man
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- [Verse 1: Hannibal Buress] Morpheus, Dorpheus, Orpheus Go eat some walruses Orifices, Porridges Morpheus,
Morpheus Going to the Buffet and Walruses Confidence, Corpseses Worcestershire sauce Go into your orifices Red pill, blue pill Morpheus,
Walruses Seashells by the Seashorpheus
[Outro] Morpheus drinking a forty in a death basket!
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The "Nostalgic" videos used:
Lego Halo: • Lego Halo
Dyansis breaking Megatron: • master piece megatron ...
DCompose: • Spider-Man 3 Movie Toy...
Spill.com: • 'Disaster Movie' Review
BlackspiderDavid: • Spider-Man 2 - The Abr...
The Comparing Spider-Men Epilogue video I mentioned a while back is now cut up, so each actor gets there own video, this is Part 1/3 (obvs).
Hey if you don't mind me asking, what do you use to edit your videos because they look amazing!
@@emilysanchez4584 Aww that's really kind of you! ☺️ It's Final Cut Pro on a 2020 IMac!
I've been looking forward to this and here it is
Idk where to ask but what's the song in the very 1st second?
Videos are half decent and half assed.
Spiderman in all forms always feels like the hero with the most heart.
A broke as nerd down on his luck fighting to do the right thing for a city that doesn't always appreciate him.
That type of person who makes sacrifices out of responsibilty, that character is important and we need it more than ever.
Love the vids.
I know it doesn't seem practical but Batman's morality touches me. In identity crisis, when you see the flashback to the late 60s Justice League wiping Dr. Light's mind, and Batman walks in and screams "PUT HIM DOWN!" I dunno man. That's pretty deep. It isn't that Dr Light is worth anything, but that human life itself is.
@@Frogman1212 Sometimes these stories present the perfect metaphors for morality.
Because the comic book world is often so different, so absurd and zany we focus extra hard on the parts of the stories we can directly relate too.
The costumes, powers and settings are unfeesable but we know how we'd react in those situations, we know what kind of feelings it would illicit and we ask our selves, what would we do.
These stories show heros and people making decisions we wouldn't, despite the absurd we still see an outline for how we as people could act.
The greatest heros show us how to be better, how to be human even in the face of adversity.
Glad you shared your personal experience with Batman in particular!
My favourite moments of Spiderman is during the ultimatum events in ultimate universe where everything goes wrong, an apocalypse happens in the city, almost all heroes are dying and Spiderman are scared and confused at whatever the hell is going on but despite that, he trying his best to help all the civilians around the city. I think it one of the most heroic moments of Spiderman beside the train scene in Spiderman 2.
I don't care if it is different from the comics. As long as what they create is good. Spiderman 1 and 2 are good. Even if they deviate from the comics spidey. Spiderman in the MCU is good and I don't care that Tony Stark is a big part of his story because they made it work. Spiderman PS4 is different from both of those versions and I still love it. I don't care that much about comic accuracy (as long as the core elements are there) if they make their version good.
Thank you !
I wish more people thought like you
I agree, sorta.
Comic accuracy matters, as long as the core is the same. Look at Spectacular! It worked!
And bruh, Spider-Man PS4 is just AMAZING! No cap!
@@ventusvanitas7544 Yeah that is what I mean. Some core elements should stay the same, but I am fine if a version of a character is vastly different than normal if it is done well.
Same!
What do you mean, you're not a native English speaker?
To me, each of the 3 live action Spider-Men: Tobey, Andrew, and Tom each represent different parts of Spider-Man which I think makes the Spiderman Fandom very toxic to these films. Tobey has the nerdy, shy, and dorky side of Spidey; Andrew has the quippy, cool, and confident side of Spidey; and Tom has the youth, excitement, and energy of Spidey.
One day we’ll get a Peter Parker and Spider-man with all of these qualities
@@avilalanceandrewt.7894 I think we already have those Spider-Men with Spectacular and Insomniac.
@@CamboxSpidey damn, thx for reminding me of Spectacular
I really need to rewatch that series, should’ve got more seasons…
Andrew was a wonderful Spider Man trapped in two awful movies
@@TheSchaef47 I recently rewatched both and honestly his films weren't even that bad. There's a whole bunch of comic book films that makes the Amazing series look like Shawshank in comparison, if anything they're more frustrating than bad. After researching into the production I truly believe Marc Webb made two brilliant films that got changed to build a cinematic universe around. My favourite part they cut was when Gwen dies Harry looks down, sees Peter holding her lifeless body and laughs like a maniac, so Peter swings up and just beats the shit out of him within an inch of his life.
As a Spider-man fan, I always felt that no Spider-man in the live action was comic accurate but they showed the character through a new lense and it always was always sad to see so many just hate each other just because they liked a different Spider-man and because their Spider-man wasn't "CoMiC AcCuRaTe".
As I grew up I began to realise that there isn't really a "comic accurate" Spider-man. After reading through 60 years of Spider-man, you will see how different writers envisioned him and that's how I accepted the movie Spider-men as......
They are just same characters with different writer styles and it doesn't make them any better than the other....
"After all anyone can wear the mask...what makes you different is what makes you Spider-man."
EXACTLY
100% agree. People tend to say one is more accurate then the other even though at best that version is like 40% accurate to the source material. I like all Spider-Man for different reasons but Tom is probably my favorite due to how they incorporate many little things for different eras and universes of Spider-Man. He’s not particularly accurate to one version but he’s still Spider-Man
This is the best comment
Best comentary ever. I think is really sad how people hate on Andrew Garfield or Tom Holland movies bcs they're not so comic acurate by their means. All movies are different interpretations of Spiderman with their own lens and different sources and i think this is the beauty of adaptation. If you need a Copy-paste movie to enjoy it, better just read de comics... and maybe, be surprised by how diferent they can be from your thoughts.
Actually, Andrew's Spiderman is comic accurate.
"A love that's imprinted straight into a generation's DNA" love that. I love the Tobey Maguire movies for what they are, but am glad we are getting a bunch of different depictions now.
¿?
In defense of your parents, bootleg DVDs were all the rage in 02. I remember that finding a bootlegger was treated like finding a literal gold mine. Those dudes made a killing for like 5 years lol
Darn right they did
In hindsight, Spider-Man 3 is probably the closest that Tobey gets to being like Peter in the comics because he actually gets to be a bit of a snarky asshole with some suaveness. It's played a bit for comedy, sure, but there is a noticeable effect of Peter's confidence allowing him to successfully flirt with multiple women throughout the montage, from Ursula, to Betty, and even eventually Gwen.
My view of that scene is that Peter, a dork, is acting the way a dork thinks cool guys act, and it just comes off as cringe.
Don't say stupid things, he's great in the entire trilogy xd.
@@TheSchaef47 Nah, Bully Maguire is the best xd.
More than Iron Man Jr, fair enough. Andrew is probably the most accurate though-
Peter in the comics does not present confidence, flirtation, or anger in the same way as in Spider-Man 3. Bully Maguire is in no way comic accurate, and that's okay
I see Tobey Maguire and the Raimi trilogy: they made it possible. When I saw that first teaser, my baby brain lost it. We were getting a Spider-Man movie and I loved it.
"It's a good movie, but it's also a bad spider-man movie" LMAO I'm absolutely living for this shade at the SM Community's quarreling!
Also, THANK YOU! Spider-Man 3 is such a beautiful film in my eyes, I don't care what people say. The ending always gets me in my feels, and the ideas of choice and forgiveness hit hard, especially in today's world! Nobody's perfect, but it's so important to pick up the pieces when we let things fall apart and to forgive those who've hurt us.
Spiderman 3 is fucking amazing.....
It also was the birth of some great memes
Yeah I like the “I forgive you” scene and everything after but that’s it
The movie is pretty great xd.
@@everythingdibs344 No, the movie is pretty amazing xd.
2004 you were blessed with the greatest sequels of all time huh.
Yup Spider-Man 2, Shrek 2, Scooby-Doo 2 Monsters Unleashed. Man I miss childhood
I can literally listen to you talk all day about nostalgia and trauma and spiderman ❤️
☺️☺️
In my eyes nostalgia and trauma are 2 sides of the same coin. Nostalgia is a tinted mirror made out of love while trauma is a tinted mirror made out of fear.
I love tobey as Peter Parker and spiderman but people are way to harsh on Tom and Andrew, I love there versions as well, I respect everyone one's opinion but I think Tom and Andrew are great as well, I like the first amazing spiderman movie and homecoming and far from home are very good and entertaining af
Yup, Just go to any Raimi movie Spider-man comment section and you will realise how toxic it is.... granted tobey is my favourite Spider-man but this toxic behaviour is really not cool tho....
@@shadeop6773 I agree, i always try to avoid the comments when it has to do with favorite spiderman cause it's a big war with no one respecting the other
@@theonethatlovescartoons3196 You wouldn’t believe how many people try and justify liking Tobey better by making up stuff that’s blatantly untrue. Like saying Tom can’t do anything without Stark tech despite not having any Stark tech in the entire climax of his first movie.
What strikes me as particularly odd, is that these people feel the need to give a reason for liking one version more than another. They don’t. I, for some reason, prefer his organic web shooters over mechanical ones and I have no idea why. I could come up with multiple reasons why either the organic or mechanical ones are better, but when it comes down to it: I just like the organic webs a little better. And that’s fine. No one needs a reason to hold an opinion on a fictional character. I don’t know why so many Raimi fans feel they have to give one when often the reason they give doesn’t make much sense
He missed the part where that’s his problem thought.
I ran out of the theater after SM2 trying to swing at 20.
I always believed that the accuracy of a character isn't a linear graph but a multi-spectral compose. People need to understand it doesn't matter which version is more accurate what matters is do they all have spider-man's heart and all 3 have it in spades.
Hitop films: tHiS viDeO bRoKE mY hEArt
I’m glad this was the top comment
@@SomeoneWeird-vx5jx Same.
No 🧢.
HiTop is basically weaponized cringe
@@toshibazenith1966 i enjoy it tho, its beautiful in its own way
I like his version of Spider-man but by all account Toby the person isn't someone I would ever say I love. Theres been way to much revealed about what he's like in his everyday life.
Yeah I was going to bring it up, but I decided to keep it purely focused on what he represented as an nostalgic mascot, although there's a plan right now for an essay on the meme culture around him so I might throw it in there
@@ImplicitlyPretentious Understable. I love your content. Please keep making these amazing videos.
But revealing what his life was like (being in college, broke, no time but plenty responsibilities that you're struggling to meet, relationship troubles) made him relatable to a lot of people. It's one of the main reasons why ppl like Spiderman 2 the best, bc it wasn't afraid to get intimate with the character. But ya know I do see where you're coming from, how a lot was shown and some ppl really just don't care lol (and nothing wrong with that either, it's your/their opinion :D)
As an 8 year old I would watch the behind the scene stuff of Spider-man 2 and Hulk(2003) which also created my interest on how a film is made. So its cool to see another fan experience that. Also, love the Spider-man videos, and your opinions on the films👌🏽
Aww thanks! And yeah!!!! I remember watching the Hulk making of and being really confused when Avi Arad said "We made a living creature" when describing the CG
Did you enjoy hulk 2003 in theaters?
@@ceohstylinn6279 was really bored with it when I was like 8 but really grew to dig it in my teens cuz I dug the psychological approach!
I think many people are bias towards Tobey's Peter because he is more nerdy, awkward and emotional compared to Stan Lee comic version. Most of us who grew up with that and loved it were the same, I know I certainly was a quiet and shy kid without much confidence and who struggled to show emotion because "guys shouldn't show emotion" so in a way I saw a lot of myself in that version.
Spider-Man and Peter when created by Stan Lee was supposed to represent the young readers who were so used to only seeing grown men and women as superheroes and never anyone their own age and I think the comic Peter fit well for his time period in the same way Tobey's Peter resonated with the post 90's and post 9/11 anxiety generation who had a lot of uncertainty about the future and themselves. It was a new millenium and things were changing, old attitudes dying out with new political, social and econonomic climates to adjust to and a lot of kids around that time may have felt that uncertainty via how their parents responded to everything. Seeing a superhero who also didn't have all the answers, got emotional and had to struggle to find what was important to him in the end was nice.
@VINCENTNATTI I think comic accuracy is important to a degree. Like Batman's core character trait is that he doesn't kill and doesn't use guns because they were used to kill his parents. So if you have Batman going full Punisher just to be edgey it can come off as missing the point, you don't want Batman at that point anymore, you want the Punisher but with Batman's look.
Sure you COULD still write a version like that but does that capture what the character represents? Is the importance of the character purely about aesthetic? About their methods? What they represent with the mask on or the person under the mask? It's certainly interesting to think about.
I mean, Peter in the main continuity grew up fast. Older than Nightwing.
And yeah, that’s what I tell people basically. That Raimi’s trilogy isn’t a direct panel to panel with the original run. Or at least takes only inspiration from it. It takes inspiration from many materials, even the later main continuity comics.
Spider-Man 2 scared the SH*T out of me when I was like 6 or 7 because of doc ock bro
I feel ya, to this day I still get the odd nightmare about Venom despite how outlandish the idea of him is in the real world
@@somerandomidioticnerd9769 i waited a while to watch spiderman 3 as a kid because it looked scary
The Raimi movies being loved has nothing to do with nostalgia
It has everything to do with nostalgia. If those films came out 5 years ago they would have been hated.
@@MrEffectfilms no
@@jjosell- yes.
@@MrEffectfilms How exactly? Because they're old? Funny how every single person I know who has never seen the movies before and watched it as adults say they're great movies.
You can say any movie made before 2010 is only liked "nostalgia". Its such a weak bullshit arguement. Its as dumb as saying that MCU Spider-man is liked because of recency bias
@@Snaoe except I'm older than those movies are. I was 10 when the first one came out and I used to love it. Now though it's hard to take seriously because I now have lived to see 2 better and more accurate versions of the character.
Let's be honest Spider-man PS4 is the best adaptation
Facts
We have to stop judging adaptations solely on their adherence to the source material. Raimi’s trilogy and the MCU movies are great because they both have specific visions for this character that are similar to Stan Lee’s original works in many ways but different in others. Those differences are what makes them exciting.
I love living in a world where I can choose between campy, introspective character dramas and innocent high school comedies set in a wider superhero universe.
Why would you want to restrain filmmakers to one vision of a character?
Because normies have weird ass views and shit. And most don’t read comics so we gotta show them why we come if and love these stuff than try to be too different. How about making a new character if nobody can respect what came before.
I know it's a bit of a hot take, but I personally prefer the narrative of Spider-Man 1 and 2 over the comics it's based on. Ithini the story of a nice nerdy kid becoming a jerk due to his new power, only to learn responsibility the hard way is more relatable and compelling, likewise I think Peter succumbing to his human desires and emotions and quiting as Spider-Man for more selfish reasons is more "human". Don't get me wrong, I love Stan Lee's work, I just personally prefer the film's story.
I think "comic accurate" in itself, is a critique that can hold many meanings and can change all the time. For example, the noble, heroic, complex, anti-guns and no-killing batman was not what the original depiction of the character was like, however it's the version we identify him as the most.
Half agree and half disagree
I just love your Spider-Man videos, man I just learn something new every upload. Please keep 'em coming.
Aww thanks! The plan is to atleast do a new Spider-Man video every fortnight cuz I've literally got like 12 written already!
Watch YoungRippa59, HiTops Films, and Comicstorian.
Also his life doesn’t improve all that much either in Spider-Man 2. Mary Jane is still getting married and is mad at him, Harry is still mad at him, and he spends the majority of that portion of the movie depressed.
@@nickname2239 We got a graph on a newspaper, we got a guy getting mugged and somebody dying in a fire, what more consequences do you need for Peter to realize that becoming Spider-Man again in that movie is the right thing to do? There were criminals and villains popping up while Spider-Man was STILL around. I can see if New York was this safe place before Spider-Man retired but that wasnt the case at all. I just finished from reading that comic again and quite frankly Peter's life improved alot more in the comic than it did in the movie but this guy in the video makes it seem like it's vice versa. Speaking of the Cafe scene, Mary Jane was going to ask Peter if he was Spider-Man and Peter was going to let go of Mary Jane for good in order to become Spider-Man again.
@@ericdxfan511 And to be honest with you, in the first movie, Peter DID had an upbeat attitude after he got his powers and they showcased that throughout the trilogy. How he was happy to see Mary Jane and with how he's talking to her, when he was talking to Harry, even when he was talking to Otto Octavius. Also he flirted a bit with Betty Brant which showed that he had some attraction to her and she seemed to be attracted to him too, also Ursala was attracted to him and even Gwen Stacy to some extent. In the backyard scene in the first film, he didn't show any shyness when he was talking Mary Jane. He might've been focused on just Mary Jane but he DID showed attraction to other girls, he just viewed Mary Jane as THE girl he wants to be with. Hell, even in his narration in the first film, he said that Mary Jane was the first girl he loved before he liked girls in general.
In Amazing Fantasy #15 when Peter was asking Liz Allen to out with him, she still rejected him because he was a geek. Also him saying that the bullies will be sorry for mistreating him, that could've meant anything it doesn't necessarily mean vengeance. In the first film, we've seen Peter getting annoyed by the constant bullying before he got his powers even telling Harry that the bullies are jerks and he had enough courage to ask Mary Jane to take a picture of her for the school paper.
In the comics, Peter wasn't really a jerk face before he got his powers, he was just tired of the constant bullying from his classmates and he seemed to be getting along with his aunt and uncle and even his teachers, he only became a jerk face after he got his powers and started using them for his own selfish desires until he caused his uncle being killed, that's what the first film displayed so I thought Raimi handled the origin really well. I respect this guy, but I just strongly disagree with him.
@@nickname2239
1. What I meant is that he flirted with Betty Brant a bit in the first film after he got the job in the Daily Bugle and she showed some attraction to him in the beginning of the second film.
2. Who's to say he didn't take long to build confidence to ask out Liz Allen in the comics before he got his powers. So what if it took him time to ask Mary Jane to take a picture of her, he still asked, he still took that opportunity. Also, in the comics, he didn't even have the stomach to stand up to the bullies before he got his powers, all he did was carry lots of resentment. My point is that in the first film, Peter finally had more courage and confidence after he got his powers and it shows throughout the whole film, not just talking to Mary Jane, the backyard scene I mention was just an example.
3. In the beginning of the first film, the bus driver didn't even want to stop for Peter and even enjoyed it until Mary Jane told him to knock it off, even after Peter got his powers and was trying to get the bus to stop, the driver still didn't stop for him and Mary Jane wasn't on the bus that time. At that moment in the comics RIGHT after he got by the spider, he didn't seem to care what the other scientist say or think because he was feeling sick after the spider bit him.
4. That was just Peter not caring for the world not threating it. He even stated in the comics that he looks after for himself. In the first film, after Peter got his powers, he selfishly let the criminal go for retaliation because he didn't get the money he wanted and even says to the fight promotor that it wasn't his problem.
@@nickname2239
1. While they were introducing each other in Spider-Man 1, Peter still tried to flirt with Betty in a way and thank you for seeing my point about their interaction in Spider-Man 2.
2. We can't just easily assume that Peter did it on a whim because of just one panel of him asking Liz Allen out, it's possible that in-universe, it took him time to ask her out. Also, that was my point of both Parkers weren't able to stand up to bullies before they got their powers.
3. I get what you mean about the scientists, which is why I brought up the bus driver that didn't stop for Peter in the first film that even the bus driver doesn't like him. It's just that in the comics he didn't seem to care what they said after he just got bit by the spider and was feeling sick afterwards.
4. While Peter did get the money in the comics, he still did a selfish thing because at the time, he used his powers for his own desires and didn't even bother to do the right thing of stopping the criminal, him saying that he doesn't look out for anyone but himself is called being selfish because he was only thinking about himself. It's the same difference in the first film despite Peter not getting the money, he still use his powers for his own desires instead of using them for something better. While it was understandable why he didn't use his powers to stop the robber in the first film, it was still a very selfish thing to do because he could've been the better man in that situation and done the right thing.
@@nickname2239 The movie showed a bunch of Police Cars driving somewhere where a crime was taking place during Peter's montage, it showed a mugging happening, A vague graph? It's not that hard to put two and two together to figure what they are talking about in terms of crime. The movie showed the Daily Bugle working on a Front Page about Ock still being at large and the Police expanding their Manhunt.
-Kingpin would've shown up sooner or later. Spider-Man being around hasn't stopped past crime bosses and supervillains from showing up before.
- His life did improve (more so than it did in the movie). Peter never made a move on Gwen which resulted in her having a date with Harry. Him saying that his friends and family not having time with him was him joking, it wasn't really meant to be taken literally. Notice how he wasn't in a rush to go back to being Spider-Man after he said that. It wasn't until a man he saves reminds him of his Uncle and why he became Spider-Man in the first place in which he decided that he had to become Spider-Man again and we've seen plenty of times later on where him being Spider-Man has got in the way of his normal personal life when people needed him. Foswell was a criminal who tried to get in on some of the action with Kingpin and failed.
-I guess you forgot she tried to do the upside down kiss with John in the scene before and it didn't give her the same feeling it did when she kissed Peter at the end of the first movie.
You did the worst thing a huge fan of Raimi's Spider-Man could do.... you actually went and read the comics, haha. The movies are dead wrong. I've got about 15 years on you, so I grew up reading the comics before the movies came out. I can only compare my experience to that of the Burton Batman movies. Amazing when I was a little kid, but then I learned who Batman was through the animated series and comics and now I'm conflicted with dealing with the nostalgia of an objectively bad interpretation vs my gooey feelings of watching them with wide eyes.
It's also quite a cool thing to notice is that 95% of the general comicbook movie. Watchers don't read the comics so when some characters like superman get misrepresented for a couple of years an entire generation begins to see them as something they are not.....
These days superman is mostly seen as this brooding cold guy with the power of God but in the comics superman is just a wholesome kid from Kansas....
c'mon Tobey is a lot closer to peter Parker than Burtons batman...
Except the Raimi trilogy is more accurate than MCU’s take. Though I prefer Insomniac’s version over the two.
Spider-Man two is not a bad Spider-Man movie. It sounds like what you’re trying to say is that it is in an accurate Spider-Man movie, and one of the most inaccurate. But that’s not necessarily true either. The nature of adaptation means that changes may occur all the time.
I personally think none of the Spider-Men are accurate to the Spider-Man comics, but I think tobey is the closest to the earlier ones
Fax
Agreed
Thank you for the part about Stan Lee/Steve Ditko and how so many people overlook the themes and character of that original run and cites adaptations to determine which Spider-Man is good or bad. Feels like too many people (although very understandable) cite Raimi's Spidey as the definitive version without awareness that it's Lee/Ditko Spidey.
Ever since I read the original comics, I relate more to Ditko Peter than I did for Raimi, TASM, or MCU Peter because the former is LIKE me or closer to it while the latters are just adaptations that I love and admire but their reliability is nowhere near Ditko Peter's reliability.
The one thing I can say about comic accuracy is keep the core elements and make one version good and true to their style of originality and creativity. Other than that, comic accuracy doesn't equal quality or a use of judgement IMO.
Half true and half wrong.
And same! Tbh, nothing can really capture the original runs. But tbh, I say it’s harder to capture the Ultimate comics since they really focused on a teenage Peter as where 616 was already growing.
I feel like, when they say that Tobey is the most accurate Spiderman, what they really mean is Sam Raimi made the comic book movies that felt most like reading comic books.
There a joy and lack of shame or irony to the original Stan Lee Spiderman comics that nobody else except James Gunn and Edgar Wright comes close to to recapturing, and even they do it in a way that feels distinctly more b-movie than comics. But even Raimi's b-movies feel like comic books, so when he put his entire heart and soul into making an actual comic book movie, it was near flawless.
His Spiderman isn't the comic Spiderman, but his movie *is* The Comics as a Platonic Cinema Ideal; his Spiderman feels like A Comic Book Character at least if not the correct one.
(I second your support for emo!Spiderman; yeah it was cringe, that was the entire point. He's a little s**t who is only saved from being full Nice Guy Incel by being born ten years early and life kicking in the teeth on the regular to keep him humble; you give him a symbiote high and he's going to make a complete ass of himself. The fact that anyone was upset about it does prove your point about the failure of adaptation though. Peter's bestie is Johnny Storm because two peas in a pod, people!!)
Tobey’s is still accurate, I just feel people think it has to be directly off of one entire version or run, when Tobey’s was inspired both the later ones in 616 AND of 1610.
@@ventusvanitas7544 inspired by 1610? Not even
I think it’s often overlooked that Peter Parker wasn’t always confident and sometimes a jerk in the comics, but learned to grow out of that however. That being said, Tobey is the most accurate to that Peter Parker after the comics Spidey went through that phase. It’s truly difficult to fit all of Peter Parker’s characteristics from all comics, into a 2 hour film, so I think Raimi adapted the most likeable and the most relatable version of Peter Parker. A mature, kind man that still messes up, but always tries to do better.
Man, you say what I first thought when I read stan Lee's run. I was like, he is not like Spider-Man (because Raimi version was my defenetive Spidey) then as I read more and more. I found more in common with stan Lee's Peter, his arrogance, confidence and above all that his selfishness resonated with me. Peter being a flawed selfish person but always finds the courage to do selfless acts made him my hero, because I am a selfish guy who wants to be selfless but fails. Raimi Peter was a motivation but he didn't resonate with me, but the og Peter was just like me and also a motivation. He was at the pedestal but also in the ground along with me.
Tbh, a lot of people don’t get that there’s other runs canon to the same version Stan Lee (AND Steve Ditko) made. Plus there’s the Ultimate comics which is a different continuity.
Tobey’s is fairly accurate. I just feel people just half-assing stuff with excuses like “Tom is more Ultimate based” when Ultimate Peter was so different! Or say he’s based on early 616 when Andrew fits more with early 616.
@@ventusvanitas7544 actually the ultimate Spider-Man and Stanlee's Conway till 80s Spidey has same personality, 616 in teenage was quick to anger like 1610 but as he grew it went away. But the other traits like arrogance, witty comebacks, jerkish nature are same as ultimate spidey. Their personalities aren't different, at the time when USM came out 616 already had 40 years to grow out of his anger and arrogance but still has those when he is pushed. After Stan lee....Conway took and his Peter also had same personality...the only personality change I noticed came in 90s, after the kidnapping of Mary Jane and in JMS era. In JMS era he was more calm than his previous self, he grew into that in 40years
@@ventusvanitas7544 tom and Tobey's Peter's aren't accurate, but Andrew's is. Wt I learned from following the comics in a chronological order from stan lee run to current one, as I said earlier there was a moment we're I sensed the change in personality, but no too much and that came in JMS run along with Raimi Spidey release. I wonder if the popularity of Raimi Spidey did that. But, No hate on Raimi's iteration, other than Peter being his own personal version Raimi iteration encompasses the idea of Spider-Man better than the other two. Even though Peter's personality isn't accurate, his Spider-Man really remained true to the idea of Spider-Man. Tom is a bit more selfish than Raimi one and I like that, but he is not confident as the 616 one. 616 Peter was not socially awkward outcast. He was socially very cool, but he was an outcast in highschool because he had a superiority complex and he looked down on his classmates and made himself the outcast by his own choice because he didn't find interacting with them worth his time or effort. But Raimi peter was an outcast not by his own choice but because as a side effect of his own introvert personality. 616 realises his fault and then becomes more if a social being shedding his superiority complex when in college, but Raimi Peter doesn't grow, he still remained as that outcast even when he was in college
@@joelabrahammanoj9741 no cap but Andrew do be accurate though.
Tom’s ain’t more than Tobey’s version, how the fuck? He’s just Miles Morales as a white boy that’s softer. Tobey was honestly more selfish than Tom’s actually. This guy’s videos is just cherry picked at every angle and way while putting in sentimental bull crap. Actually reading the comics, bruh, Tom is super far from it.
And actually, Peter does grow to be more cocky and rude in the third film. Lmfao!
Also, you do realize Tobey’s also taken inspiration from the Ultimate comics as well, right? Not just 616.
I suggest Comicstorian and pirating comics to read instead of this guy’s Ridiculous stuff 💀🤣😂
@@joelabrahammanoj9741 no, their personalities are actually different if you actually read them. Dude, 616 Pete early on did get mad but not like Ultimate comics. Bro, you Must be sleep. There’s an actual difference if you read the stuff instead of Google searching panels like random. There’s huge differences.
I like the Raimi trilogy but it's not nostalgic to me like a lot of people my age. Which seems weird as I was a kid when the first film came out, and I was majorly upset at the time because I couldn't see it (I was 7 and it had a 12 certificate in the UK). I did see 2 and 3 in the cinema and loved them. But I think importantly they aren't nostalgic for me because weren't my introduction to Spiderman. The Spiderman 90s cartoon was. Spiderman the animated series was still airing here in the UK at the time so I actually have more nostalgia for that than the movies since it was on every week and informed my view on Spiderman way more.
The movies on the other hand made weird choices at times that annoyed kid me. Such as the Organic webbing, barely any quipping, making Doc Ock sympathetic (with the arms controlling his mind which I still find weird since they're arms), everything to do with venom. Also the ending fight of the first movie in the abandoned building actively scared me as a kid because of how dark it was with Spiderman getting all bloody and green goblin killing himself. So that also coloured my view of the Raimi trilogy.
I'm not hating, I still like those movies a lot but they're just not nostalgic in the same way for me. I think that's why with no way home I'm more excited about the Doctor strange aspect than the possibility of Tobey possibly coming back. Each to their own I guess.
I really dislike it when people critique films based on whether they are ‘faithful’ to the source material since, in reality, most of the characters have several wildly different interpretation that there is no real source material.
That and copying is boring and a unique, creative experience is what I want most. Maybe it’s cause I’m not really a hardcore comic book fan tho.
I wonder if Tobey Maquire's lack of response to this love letter will cause implicitly pretentious to experience
*trauma*
spiderman 2 is good in they way it shows the struggles of being spiderman balancing his life while he has j jhona slandering his name
calling spiderman 2 a bad spider movie is irrational in my opinion
Funnily enough, the behind the scenes for Shrek (not sure which I watched first) were what made me think I could be an animator.
I'm not an animator, I'm an art student, but I didn't really understand there were art jobs before then.
Watching your essays on them actually let me like the Raimi trilogy again. I liked the first one well enough when I was really young, but it was never the thing that kick-started my love of the character and comics in general. That was the Ultimate Spider-Man comics and later, Spectacular Spider-Man and the original Lee Ditko run. And when I came back to the Raimi films again later, the tone didn't vibe with me as well as it did when I was younger and I didn't recognize the Peter Parker I loved in Tobey's portrayal. And so when I kept seeing a bunch of fans touting Tobey as the one true Proper Peter Parker, and that the other actors were bad because they didn't play Tobey's version of Peter as a meek nerd, but instead different interpretations that were closer to the Peter that I loved in a lot of ways, it got very frustrating and sucked out a lot of enjoyment I COULD have had over Tobey's Peter.
Like, I still respected the Raimi films and could accept they were technically better movies than TASM 1 and 2 in terms of story structure, but Andrew brought so much of the Peter that I loved into those films, and brought a lot of the nuances of the comics version in all of his flawed, messy glory, so it really bugged me that people dismissed him because he had a skateboard and didn't have the same extremely shy and geeky shade of introversion that Tobey's Peter had. It made me unable to connect with the Raimi films for what they were for a long time.
Your essays on the Trilogy, where you acknowledge that however good these movies are, they are still a very different interpretation and that's ok, still celebrating those differences and what they did bring to the table was a breath of fresh air. It honestly made me want to go back and watch these movies again and appreciate them for what they actually did do, rather than for what some fan argue they did, which was perfectly portray the character of Peter Parker from the comics. Because while I do feel that a lot of nuances of the character were lost, different nuances were added in to still have a complete character. I think it's ok to change things as long as there's still depths and complexities there, even if not the same ones, and as long as we acknowledge that they ARE changes.
TL:DR, thanks for these. As a long time spidey fan who's frustrations with the Raimi worship made me lose a bit of love for that version, you've honestly convinced me to give them another shot.
I can’t help but feel you have a strong bias towards MCU Spider-Man , on all of your Spider-Man videos all your criticism (most of which I don’t agree with) is placed on Sam Raimis Spider-Man while you constantly praise MCU Spider-Man without talking about its fundamental problems .
Even in this video you make it sound like these movies are only loved on the basis of nostalgia . I can get behind your other videos but just not your videos on Spider-Man
i 100% agree
@@yagacomicart ye!
I agree with you. This dude just praises MCU when the Raimi trilogy is actually more accurate than Iron Man Jr’s take.
People just want to stop the MCU “Spider-Man” hate and I get that. But I feel the world is mostly filled with normies and people with Google research instead of actually reading the materials and comparing it fairly without nitpicking and editing too much.
yeah. he defends the boring and uninteresting side characters of FFH by saying they did their job well for the purpose they were serving in their movies but then says that spider-man 2 isn't accurate to the "spider-man no more" comic, forgetting that this was still a good portrayal even if it's not page for page accurate to the comic
@@jjosell- I agree!
Actually reading the comics, Tobey is more closer than Tom. I feel Tom just used the atmosphere but not the actual tone.
Tobey’s version is a bit of an asshole, especially in the third movie. Just like how Earth-616 Peter can be an asshole. The trilogy does honor Stan Lee’s work, it’s just ALSO inspired by other continuities. The Animated Series and the Ultimate comics are also influences for the trilogy, not just Earth-616.
MCU’s version of Spidey isn’t accurate whatsoever. I don’t hate Tom Holland but he’s far from the least. Tobey’s version is the most accurate. He’s not accurate as Spider-Man PS4 or Spectacular, but he’s the most accurate in terms of live action movies.
You say there’s a huge difference but looking at the consequences to New York in the movie then in the comics, it’s basically the same. Sure, the comics focused more on Spidey and the sequel movie focuses more on Peter but it’s actually accurate. It’s just pointing at different views of the whole storyline.
So 💀
He's discrediting the Raimi fanboys(like hi top films) who hate on the MCU spiderman because they consider Raimi's spiderman as the original Spider-Man because of the drama when in actuality MCU is more comic accurate with the first ditko comics by being a teen comedy and not mentioning much of uncle Ben.
He likes all three of them but doesn't like the glorification of the raimi trilogy as the original Peter Parker and spiderman when in reality tasm and MCU are more true to the original ditko comics(according to this channel).
@@epicmusic9029 MCU ain’t true to the comics like TASM or Raimi trilogy is. Bruh, his videos on this isn’t all that good. Go actually read the comics. They give different vibes from what the videos say. I would argue TASM is the most comic accurate out of the three.
So you can't just simply praise him without saying all those negative things. Got it.
I agree with you and this video is great, but I have one question. How exactly is Comic Spider-Man happy go lucky? I’m sure you will explain more in a future video but I remember reading the Ditko/Lee era and yeah he had moments but I wouldn’t say it was definitive trait as he also had bad luck as well
I remember when I was about 6 when Spider-Man 3 came out I was terrified of venom it was mainly that scene of Eddie becoming venom that freaked me out, after that I couldn’t stand to see him in any other media 🤣🤣
Raimi Spider-man villains vs Mcu Spider-man villains.
Damn, this video hit hard
Aww I'm glad you liked it, I was hesitant that it semmed too sentimental
Me and you both brother
I'm not crying your crying 🤧😭
😭😭
I officially re-christen the Implicitly Pretentious channel as Understanding Nostalgia.
You could say he's some kind of... nostalgia critic.
going of "comicbook accuracy" to evaluate how good a character is, is a majorly flawed arguement. That's why everytime i see tom holland fans bring that up as one of their, if not their biggest reason to why he's the best spidey, I can't do anything but cringe... not gonna lie.
It might not be the most accurate but you have to give it credit for being so important to the development of modern super hero movies. I think Raimi made exactly the Spiderman movie that audiences needed at the time, and without it enthusiasm to allow the mcu to happen might not have ever occurred.
What is the background music?
But who says the comics are the "accurate" or "definitive" versions of the character? Just because it came out first? I think it's just a different interpretation and based on what you've described in comparing the original comic version of Peter Parker and Tobey's version I much prefer the latter. I love the theme of being Spider-Man taking a toll on his personal life and when he quits things turn around for him personally but ultimately he decides that... Well... With power comes great responsibility and all that shit and CAN'T NOT be a hero despite it fucking things up for himself personally
But I still thought this was a great video - hopefully this doesn't sound too much like a massive "HEY FUCK YOU ASSHOLE" type of a comment 😂
I say the original source materials are THE characters. But, these depictions are for normies. However, I wouldn’t say they suck, because if they HONOR the source materials, then it’s beneficial for both parties and shows respect.
I prefer Tobey too and I think he’s the most accurate in live action, but it matters because most people slowly stops reading books these days. And we’ll just forget what came first and how they were liked.
But I somewhat agree.
Man, you actually made me cry. You really made me recall how of an impact this films had on my childhood. Even though I now realize they are not the most accurate, they're still darn good movies. Fantastic video.
Imagine crying because of a Spider-Man video on RUclips
@@liltree8382 Imagine being a jerk to a stranger on the internet getting emotional about nostalgia
Based video.
Sam Raimi's Spider-Man and its consequences have been a disaster for all Spider-Man stories going forward.
I'm definitely rewatching this after No Way Home
Thanks so much for this video man. I'm very much sometimes feeling like I don't know if I'm a person who understands quality but I will always feel like I'm a person who gets the heart of stories cause they mean so much to me. I know some people label nostalgia as a bad thing but there is a difference between bad and wholesome and Movies are the perfect place to showcase these things, just so long as it doesn't interfere with a narrative it's trying to tell in spite of nostalgia.
Also like any adaptation, I do think that there is a case where the directors have full reason to adapt a character in their own style, many of the best films have done this from Jurrasic Park, Lord of the Rings, and even The Dark Knight.
Hey implicitly pretentious, just a quick question,Have you watched Neon genesis evangelion?
I can’t express nearly enough just how much this video moved me. Like so many other people the Raimi films were incredibly special parts of my childhood - Spider-Man 2 is still to this day my #1 favorite movie of all time over anything else (and yes I’ve even seen citizen kane 🤭). But you said it perfectly - it’s accuracy or lack of accuracy isn’t what makes them memorable for so many people. They’re kinda like time capsules that we can all always go back to. And on top of that, they’re genuinely beautiful films. Ive been a big fan of your channel for a while but this is without a doubt my favorite video of yours! Thank you! 😊❤️
Spider-Man 2 and shrek 2 are the ultimate Christmas gifts!
There were also some Buzz Lightyear socks too
@@ImplicitlyPretentious even better!😂
I don’t find comfort in my past the way many seem to…
hey each to their own! 😁
For someone who says they sound American so much, you sure do sound extremely English and nothing like American
Really? Literally almost all my early videos had someone comment "stop trying to sound american"
@@ImplicitlyPretentious I can't speak for your early videos, I'm a more recent subscriber. But when I found your channel I just assumed you were British before I heard you mention learning English from media! For reference, I am British
@@andrewdickins2 Aww that's oddly relieving cuz over the last 2 years with these videos I've delibrately worked on reducing my lisp and sounding more British with my pronounciations and slang!
Too me the comic Peter Parker was kinda unlikeable, even after he learned with great power comes great responsibility. Honestly the early Spider-Man comics, while important, made a lot of choices that don't gel with me. It wasn't until the 90's show that I think Spider-Man found his audience, and that show made a lot of changes that have become a main stay for Spidey fans. The Raimi Trilogy took these changes a step further and Spectacular perfected them. The comics are important, but I think the 90's show, the Raimi Trilogy, and Spectacular just made the characters and story better and far more relatable.
These movies will forever hold a place in my heart as my childhood movie’s. Scorcase was right, these movies were truly cinema. Also Spider-Man 3 wasn’t *that* bad. Not as good as the rest of the trilogy, but still better then current MCU
Shrek 2 & Spiderman 2 are such great movies
Something that’s always confused me is people saying “Andrew was too cool to be Peter Parker but the original Peter couldn’t walk two feet without 6 girls falling in love with him”
BRO, I HAD BOTH OF THOSE VENOM TOYS!!!
Peter to Harry once he figures out his identity
" Harry , I was there the night you're father died.... the man who stole his glider and performance enhancers killed him. He was tieing up a lose end after killing your father's colleagues . I couldn't save him . I'm sorry , I didn't have the strength to tell you before . I can assure you I did NOT kill your father , the Goblin did . I loved your father , we both loved him Harry , I'm so sorry . "
0:03 what's the song??
3:00 i wouldnt say its a bad spider-man movies, spider-man has change a lot with the pass of time and with many writters, and i feel like spider-man 2 still have a story that fits the character of spider-man and his style, just with a different message than the one stan lee told, just like how many spider-man stories tell different messages, and sam raimi did a good job representing the character sending a good message even if its different from the one stan lee originaly told
Still really good video man, it was interesting to see your story with this trilogy
fax
Dude you’re 100% right, this guy seems to think that telling a Spider-Man story that has a different theme than the first 100 issues is inaccurate and bad, I actually read the first 100 issues because of how much this guy talked about them and in all honesty, Peter says numerous times that he would love to hang up the mask but that he knows that Spider-Man is the right thing to do. His relationship with Gwen suffers, he loses his chance to get with Mary Jane because of Spider-Man, he needs to get to the hospital to sign some papers for Aunt May’s operation (she needs medical attention way too much in the first issues) but he can’t because he’s fighting the green goblin, he nearly flunks out of college because he needs to be Spider-Man so much, his friends think he’s an irresponsible jerk a lot of the time, “implicitly pretentious” really cherry picks his evidence to an annoying degree
wait, you native language isn't English? Man, your accent is phenomenal.
You know, I'm something of a Spider-man fan myself.
Well, that was a Really Nice video. Yeah, the whole thing with the Raimi Films and Tobey had nothing to do with Nostalgia. Yeah, Tobey is more soft spoken abd honestly much nicer than the actual Peter Parker. But, Tobey Does have some aspects to him in anger, frustration, and everything. But, with Andrew, he captures Alot more of that abd fully captures everything with Peter Parker. Same goes with Tom. Really, each of them have perfectly captured what makes Peter Peter. But, while Tom DOES have the WEAKEST SUPPORTING CASTS, they are all fine Peters.
I think the fond memories of Tobey Spider Man more than anything come from the fact that they were the first really good superhero movies. Sure Superman and Batman were big hits but the technology just wasn't there to make a really spectacular (no pun intended) superhero movie that really lived up to the potential of the genre, and at the time more recent superhero movies were basically seen as jokes. It wasn't until these movies that you had both the technology and the talent being put into it that could really blow people away.
Word
The comics made it seem like he was a good kid who loved his Aunt and Uncle and was liked by his teachers. I’m failing to understand how him reacting to other students making fun of him after he asked a simple harmless question makes him a jerk face before he gets his powers
What about the conversation with the police officer?
@@SomeoneWeird-vx5jx BEFORE he got his powers
@@ericdxfan511 oh, well he still was a jerk to people
@@ericdxfan511 well it's pretty easy to draw two and two together throughout the story he's been kind of a jerk, and yes while alot of that's after he got his powers, alot of the thing's he says indicates that's this has been happening for a while before he got his powers.
@@mr.spring-miser3034 Are you talking about just his origin story or are you bringing up later issues? If we are just focusing strictly on his origin story, there is no evidence to prove that he was jerk prior to him getting his powers. Only time we see him act like a jerk was to the officer but that can easily be written off as him being full of himself due to his newly gained powers (not how he was before). If you're going to use that as evidence then this guy's video argument on Maguire's origin not being like the comic origin falls apart because you could use that same logic on Maguire when he lashes out at his Uncle.
Wait, this guy is not gringo? dunno where ur from
But i luv u more than before now
@implicitly pretentious you should do power Rangers
I think you would like mech x4
hell yeah, I started writing a Power Rangers Time Force video a while back so that's 100% in the pipeline!
@@ImplicitlyPretentious dope
@@ImplicitlyPretentious would u do other seasons maybe the newer ones
You should collab with this guy on what would be the perfect Spider-Man movie (MCU, animated, both, or neither): ruclips.net/video/iXS3Zz0_4VY/видео.html
Love these vids... they talk about stuff I've never realized about films
Aww thanks! The hope is to make this whole season of Spidey essay be about as many under-discussed Stan Lee stuff as possible!
@@ImplicitlyPretentious awesome!!
YoungRippa59 does things better.
waiting for tobey to be in "spider-man: no way home" and hopefully "doctor strange in the multiverse of madness" to give his peter parker a proper farewell.
Maquire is the character Spider-Man grew into.
I got a slight sinking feeling that he'd died for a second eheh.
Boy, am I glad I was wrong.
Kirsten Dunst was my celebrity crush
You learned English by yourself? Wow.
Toblerone McIntyre is my favourite Spider-Man too
Love the vid man. Keep up the great work
3:03 high-tops films wants to know your location
I don’t like Tobey and his Spider-Man only because of nostalgia. He’s more comic accurate, has better films, and better action.
bruh did you not listen to the parts explaining how its not comic accurate :/
@@sebastianhaney1425 we respectfully disagree lmao...
In comparison to the other movies, it's far and above the most accurate
@@sebastianhaney1425 his videos are cherry picked. Please!
Same.
I loved Tobey and arguably, he’s more comic accurate. But when reading the materials, I want a more accurate depiction. Tbh, Insomniac made THE best Spider-Man. Better than Tobey. But tbh, I rather have Andrew than Tom’s.
@@sebastianhaney1425 Yes, I did. And as someone who has read the same material, I can unabashedly say this guy misrepresents spider-man comics in bad faith, on purpose, to try and make his own biased opinion seem like a fact.
The real question is, have YOU even read the actual comics yourself, or are you just swallowing the load from this dude who is obviously wrong to anyone who knows what they’re talking about?
2:59
Anyone who says that has zero understanding of the character.
I think you would like mech x4 @implicitly pretentious
good video but spiderman 2 is a great spiderman movie its a cool depiction of the character
i'm a braziliam guy who not even know ur name, but the way that you brought the theme about nostalgia (specially talking about Mary Jane) tears me up, this could really be something elucidator, made me thuunk about some of my old relashionships and memories and how i treat them. congrats for ur job and your art.
His name is Leo.
I think that what people mean when they say that tobey maguire is the most comic accurate version of spider man is that the quality and theme of 1. He can’t catch a break 2. Sacrifice, are best explored in those movies. And yeah he’s not really a trickster in the sam raimi movies, but he has what I think many fans find the most relatable and important elements down. Because these ideas are essentially what makes spider man great and these movies focus on those elements in the greatest manner. But I think you’re right, I don’t think it should be about accuracy either, I think it should be about taking the core message and giving it a vessel.
So accuracy matters? As long as it’s in the core.
What’s the name of song in the beginning?
I basically wrote an essay about the previous video comparing Stan Lee and Tobey. In it, I basically wrote the same thing u said. "It's not accurate to the original, and that's all right. It's still fantastic."
It’s still accurate, just not 100%.
Also, the Raimi films took influences from other materials. And materials that’s canon to 616. Stan Lee’s original run ain’t the only run in 616.
Spiderman 2 isn't a bad Spiderman movie.