Intermittent misfire, low power: 2014 VW Jetta GDI Turbo -Part 1
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- This late model VW Jetta with only 66k miles on the odometer is having some serious driveability problems!
Over the past few months it has developed a very rough idle, especially after a cold start. Customer also complains about a loss of power while driving...but other times it drives perfect.
Let's take a stab at this machine, sift through all the possible variables, and hopefully arrive at a definitive answer!
Enjoy!
Ivan
I have the same car and have been messing with it for a year until I watched this video. I just ordered the magnet and I’ll throw it in when it arrives. Thanks you are the best!
I had the very same symptoms with my 2009 1.8 TSI engine. One time the engine even managed to die while idling and overall vibrations were quite harsh on idle. But had no problems while revving the engine. Dealer couldn't fix it at the first attempt and they swapped out a part that didn't change anything but on second attempt they changed the PCV valve (they mentioned crankcase ventilation valve) for about $150 and it fixed the problem.
love your channel ivan. one of the most under rated automotive youtube channels. absolutely cannot wait until part 2
If I can't pay a dollar to watch part 2 I'm not watching it, he told us it was free of charge the nerve of him, I'm going back to SMA and watch tractor repairs
I agree, instant unsubscribe ;)
Great video, Ivan! Always learn so much from watching you go through the process.
VW's engine management engineering makes for interesting diagnostic videos excellent work Ivan thanks for showing this
That is an understatement lol
Ivan doesn't avoid problems, he goes hunting for them!
Some VVT engines (maybe all, I'm not sure) don't have separate EGR systems because they can achieve the same effects by adjusting camshaft timing. I suspect this is why it acts like a stuck EGR valve.
Yep. Same thing occurred to me.
You are really spoiling us with all these free videos :-D
haha I'll sneak in a paid one when you least expect it ;)
LOL Ivan, "Free of charge" definitely you got a lot of heat on that.... You're a great guy and excellent in diagnostics, keep working hard, we love your videos and the cases.
DITTO, I D. I can see that .99 cents really got all over poor Ivan. You act just like i use to with my customers Ivan, get it "USE" to, , bending over backwards trying to please them, after all these years i finally figured out there are some people that just don't want to be pleased. Two suggestions, one maybe you could start a fund to pay the bitchy, whiny peoples .99 or two just a go fund me.
I don't know if Ivan will ever be able to wash his hands of the charging for that video.
i bought one VW from a VW mechanic and he loved those cars...i however couldnt stand the fact it broke down nearly every day...i finally decided junking it would be the best thing to do for humanity...now i buy Toyotas and have not worked on a car in almost twenty years
I would be suspicious of that crankcase vacuum.... should not change the way it runs to pull the dipstick. The PCV diaphragm is known to fail, at least on the older models. Try to open the oil fill cap - if it is a failed diaphragm it will will be really hard to pull the cap off due to the vacuum. Believe the diaphragm is under the round looking thing directly on top of the engine towards drivers side.
No they still fail to this day & are more widespread than ever.
Audi tech chiming in here. I'd advise you to check the following things before replacing the cam adjuster. Do a leakdown test of all cylinders and see if you are getting blowby around the piston rings. The intake air leak fault is a very big clue here. I have had that fault set on more than one occasion due to piston ring failure. If you have excessive blowby, remove the oil pan and inspect for pieces of piston rings. A timing chain failure will also produce those symptoms. It is likely the dealer technician recommended a timing chain and tensioner, and the adviser was a moron who misunderstood and sold it as a belt (I say this only because it has happened to me as a tech). If you have repair information available, see if you can find a section for timing chain tensioner inspection. VW/Audi tensioners have an acceptable number of visible teeth showing. We check the timing chain by counting the tensioner teeth through an inspection port in the timing cover. I believe 3-5 is the acceptable number, but I'm not 100% sure on that engine. Lastly, spray down the front and rear crank seals with some brake cleaner to check for leaks. If a leak is found, replace the seal and the pcv breather assembly.
I really appreciate the tips from knowledgeable dealer techs. Thank you!
Yea some shops dont know how things work. My 1996 Honda Goldwing was in for work and the mechanic ( if you want to call him one) said my bike needed a carb rebuild (which I had already told him and he did not fix it. long story Just fixed what he wanted to and skipped the rest. Although he charged me. Like I said long story) and a valve adjustment. My bike was quiet and has Hydraulic lifters. So After I rebuilt my own carbs everything was great.
Ok I know this has nothing to do with the price of Tea in China but just had to spill that out. Ill be quiet now......
That large screen reminds me of the days I worked with the Sun tune up machine. Identifying direction was way cool!
I'm watching this now and thankful I have an extended warranty. I own the same car. I'm finding this very interested Ivan.
GET RID OF IT RANDY!!!!
but I love it. my last Jetta I converted to veggie oil. I don't think that turbo was spooling up when I was watching. it might be, it was unloved?
thank you, i have a 2014 VW Jetta SE 1.8L with these same exact issues. 166k it was exactly the same and this video helped me save money and time. Thank you again (I actually understood your analysis).
well done once again Ivan shows the dealer what to do. i think the dealer would have charged the owner for a timing chain or belt but would have just replaced the vvt activator possibly a cheaper job but would have charged for the bigger job, that they would have not done.
No Pico? Aw man,lol. Bet you will have it in the next video.🙂
Thank you! I have been fighting this issue for so long. My 2014 VW Jetta SE 1.8t has the EXACT same symptoms. New part should be here .... soon (new years is gonna slow it down). THANK YOU!!
Mines having the same issue. 2014 VW Jetta SE 1.8T. I’m new to all this car stuff and just want it fixed. What did you change?
@@jocnissa6801 lol, well, in the end I just needed to change out the spark plugs and coil packs. I did swap out the part he mentioned though. I forget what it’s called, but it was a quick/easy part to swap out.
@@chadsvb I changed the spark plugs just a few months ago. What was that other part you mentioned? I didn’t get through the whole video
@@jocnissa6801 did you also change the coil packs? If not, definitely change them. As for the part mentioned in this video: www.ecstuning.com/b-febi-parts/camshaft-adjuster-magnet-with-connector/06l109259akt~feb/
Could be infrequent oil change intervals, some debris or other shit clogged the intake phaser- jacking up the pressure and commanding it on.
great vid as usual mate love the ending part 2 free of charge very funny hahahah we just need you to say the word sorted!!!!! next on the end of your videos
Leon you have most of us saying it already...SORTED!
Hayward's Automotive hahahahah good to hear we need to spread the good word or sorted!!!!!!
Dealerships (aka STEALERships) never cease to amaze me! Guess they're used to the old adage, "There's a sucker born every minute".
A GM dealer would perform the "timing belt" replacement, find it has a chain, then charge you labor for digging into it. LOL
Guess the days of 300k miles VWs are long gone. If it's having problems this soon, it doesn't have a chance!
Hey Ivan! How do you compare MAP data in inches of Mercury with a conventional vacuum gauge? Do they match? Because when I saw the MAP data, to me it was a little high and I really don't know if specs change for turbo engines. Those high readings might indicate problems with engine not breathing which also explains the rich condition. What do u think? Thanks for this awesome case!
you subtract it from 30 inches to get your vacuum. you don't take that number as the engine's vacuum. thats the manifolds pressure
Great diagnostic video and well up to the usual standards.
Another cliff hanger.......
Looking forward to part II
Interesting. O2 pegged rich. So, one O2 sensor and one wideband sensor? Or, are they both lambda sensors in which case 1.25 is normal? Waiting to see what you found. Thanks!
These VVT problems are so interesting.... I would have thought diagnostics would be more straight forward, looking at timing advance. Perhaps OEM scanners are better tuned to find this problem. Have you found out why the second O2 sensor was fixed at 1.25, was it a substituted value?
We'll dig deeper into OEM data in Part 2. The results were really neat!
Here's a drinking game. Every-time he says it's running like garbage you take a shot.
Interesting! ECM setting plausibility codes or could ECM have issues or were they created during diagnostics? The P0011 & P0016 get my attention and puts it on track with your current path which would also account for low manifold vacuum and other plausibility faults. Perform same test cold when it's acting up & if it's valve timing then you won't have any change when you energize the solenoid validating it. Still lots of questions. Can you see cam timing advance PID in OEM side of Verus? Also there is a TSB that Maic Salazar has already mentioned that could be your issue. Looking forward to Part 2.
a dealer shop does not have to guarantee to fix your car , they only have to guarantee to take your money!
Same as Doctors.....If it dosent fix the problem you dont get your money back,,No guarantee...Come back and I will look some more, for more money.
How great of a job would that be.
There are dealerships with competent technicians. They do exist 😉
I have been in the business since 1973, my dad owned a shop for 33 years until he retired. I have a unique perspective, I guess, since I spent 20 years in the independent aftermarket with him and now 24 years and counting in a GM dealership where I have been the shop foreman since 2001. Dealerships are like independent repair shops in many ways, there are good ones and bad ones overall. Within individual shops, whether indy or dealership, you may find techs who are decent, honest and skilled and techs who are hacks. When my dad's shop was open, we endeavored to be an honest and competent shop, and the same for the dealership I'm at now. Both indies and dealerships draw on the same pool of technicians to hire. It is up to owners and managers to set the tone for their business and it is up to the individual technician to choose what kind of person and technician he/she wants to be. I look for technicians who's values align with the ASE Code of Ethics and the Automotive Service Association Code of Ethics (you can google them). There are horror stories from both indy and dealership shops, and I've seen it and heard them from both "sides". In the area I'm in, we have a good relationship between the dealerships and independent shops. I have many friends working in most of them. Our dealership does a lot of work for other dealerships and indy shops alike, and we send work to them. I don't mind helping them when I can, I get calls and personal visits all the time, and I'll stop and look up schematics and TSB's, talk through diagnosis, etc. If someone has had a bad experience at a dealership, they should take that concern to upper management. And please remember dealership's are privately or corporately owned just like independent shops, except they have a franchise agreement to uphold and therefore car-maker standards to meet, and so the experience at one can be very different from another, just like independent shops.
Totally agree, I worked around many dealerships as a communications tech, Your right some are pretty good and some are terrible, same as Independents. We cant paint them all bad. Lucky Ive been able to work on most repairs myself, otherwise I would have been walking.
Gm producer the best engine ever, the slant 6 225 cu in, but then made the 2.7 engine in the Chrysler Sebring, many people lost allot of money, these people did everything to get there money back ,but could not!
Hello sir,thank you for sharing your knowledge with us!! I want to ask you about the yourself energized the magnetic actuator, can we do it before check the timing? I mean if the chain is stretched or the chain has jumped 1 or 2 teeth and the engine run bad as your video can we energize the magnetic without the risk the valves bent to pistons?? Thanks in advance!
Drill a weep hole in the bottom of the cooler, cold idle fixed! Moisture
I got a suggestion please check timing sprockets they may get loose and the time is off the time those cams are adjustable by actuators all is related to the timing.
Rear O2 still reading rich ?? no matter what position vavle is ?? hmmm weird !!
Looking str8 for part 2. thanks for sharing Ivan, nice video
Can a scan tool fry the pcm in a Volkswagen? I replaced a rear wheel bearing in a 2009 Tiguan, took it for a test drive then attempted to diagnose the faulty left rear blinker with the scan tool and now it cranks but doesn't start and the throttle body, cooling fans and fuel pump are turning on and off rapidly. This car already ruined this week's progress so I've had to do everything else after hours to get caught up. One man show. Ever seen that tho?
Hi Ivan, I also believe that you have a problem with the PCV system, that amount of vaccum is not right. But that would give you lean codes. Maybe since you have a bad running engine MAP values are all over the place and ECM has not flag that yet.
Yet another interesting diagnosis on a European car lol Theres also a guy whose channel is positive lead diagnostics on yt that specializes on these. Hes done a few videos regarding these phasers
What is his channels name?
Maybe something is making the ecm command the vvt system on idle, I would check what this particular vvt system depends on to be activated, and go from there. Looking forward for part 2
Nice post! Great diagnostic workup.
What are the voltage/signals supposed to be at the connector of the cam timing thing? Check it with a voltmeter or scope starting with the engine cold. Check at various RPMs. Does AllData have anything about how and when the cam timing adjust becomes active?
Maybe not relevant, but noticed at 19:44 in the actuator test list there is an oil pressure control valve test - if the engine actually has a variable oil pump it might be worth checking there is sufficient/stable oil pressure as that could cause VVT control issues - not super likely, but may be worth a quick check to rule out before doing expensive rebuild (especially easy if there is a PID for measured oil pressure in OEM data)
Hell Ivan I'd pay $1.99 for part two. JFWY. LOL
Sounds like a top fuel dragster with a large bump stick.
Waiting for the Pico waveform of the driver when idling smooth vs when idling rough etc. Am I getting warm? Looking forward to the next installment!
Great video. Great case study
seems to me the phaser works when commanded on. why would the solenoid be bad? is the phaser itself sticking or is it even being commanded on at the proper times or at the proper amount?
Was the problem ever found or fixed? I have a 2014 passat tsi 1.8 and it is doing this same exact thing and it comes up with random misfire in all cylinders . Multiple misfires. . Has the vacuum in the dipstick and the oil fill cap. The rough idle . . Was told it's the PCV oil separator valve. So I changed it with the OEM one. Not cheap aftermarket one. And it's still doing it. Any idea what the problems?
I just upgraded to 17.2 on my solus edge. Next go around is 17.2 for the vantage ultra.
Leaking PCV valve. Is there massive vacuum under the oil filler cap? Or signs its forcing the dipstick out under boost?
Didn't Eric replace the valve cover that had the pcv diaphragm on a 1.8 earlier this year that was doing the same thing here? Oh wait I didn't hear it whistle so never mind when the diaphragm goes out it usually makes the rear main seal whistle
Ivan, some thoughts and observations
This is a forced induction system, so the MAP pid does not seem to be off...
Bidirecional control will work only once per ignition cycle and test item. This might have been the reason you were not able to run the cam phaser a second time.
As the problem happens at cold engine only it might be related to oil pressure / timing chain tensioner and or wrong/dirty oil. The oil is absolutely critical with these engines.
I was initially suspecting a skewed engine coolant temperature sensor, since it seems like the ECM is undecided whether to stay in open loop or enter closed loop. I don't figure the ECM would set a code for this either, since the ECM will usually only set a code if the sensor circuit is open or shorted to ground. Adjusting the fuel metering based on skewed coolant temperature information seems like it would cause similar symptoms.
Hi.. my Jetta is at vcds between 7 and 9 degrees when it heats up. He makes a strange noise. could it be my magnetic? No error codes but the car hesitates a little at idle and stopped.thanks.
my dad is having same problem with his passat,the mechanic changed plugs and cleaned injectors,same problem,I suggest coil packs,what else could it be?
11:50... Yes, it does upset some people ;)
Greetings from Serbia.
Great diagnostic video as usual...., i have a sensor simulator would it be appropriate to use for this test on a vvt system . It can simulate voltage and frequency i use it for sensor wire integrity testing .
Are the torx screws reverse threaded on the adjuster magnet. I'm worried about stripping them. And if so what size where to replace them I have a 2915 Jetta 1.8 l turbo w same issue.
monitor the phaser to see if it is getting communication from ECM? while cold , warming up , hot . might be temp sensor ? just a thought
I wonder why the 2nd O2 was not pegged when power was applied to the valve solenoid?
I suppose this is the 1.8 TSI ? Turbocharged Direct Injection ? I see you get more VWs, you should get a VCDS to be able to read all the VW specific data...
Thank you Ivan.
I was thinking IAC valve, but I don't know if the VW's use one or not. Because when the engine is warm the faulty IAC valve acts normal. On some vehicles, a bad IAC valve will not set a specific code telling you hat the valve is faulty.
Off the wall guess before I watch the video: gunked up intake valves as a consequence of the direct injection setup?
gtemnykh That's just what I was thinking too.
But how would that explain the intermittent nature of the beast?
Ford direct injection engine had that same problem,runs garbage when cold,when they got to operating temp they run fine
I avoid GDI setups. I had a 2014 KIA Forte with 2.0 GDI and had a shaky running engine when cold after 25000 miles and progressed to rough idle when it was warm. I did an intake system cleaning and I noticed a drastic improvement but within 5000 miles performance problems and my mpg dropped about 5 mpg. These setups are susceptible to carbon build up because there is no wash of fuel over the intake valves to remove deposits. I have heard that Lexus/Toyota have employed a secondary fuel delivery system to wash the intake valves in GDI setups but that does not seem practical to me and I think would waste more fuel because if this were the case the fuel washing the intake valve is going to go into the combustion chamber and so at this point why not stick with the sequential port injection. GDI certainly shoots down the advertisements that fuel companies pitch such as driving your engine clean
I obviously did not read the full video description! :)
I have this exact issue occurring to my 2014 VW Jetta SE 1.8 T and the issue has not been successfully diagnosed yet. Maybe I should ask my mechanic to look into the same component causing the problem as described in this video.
My 1st gut feeling: PCV and the purge valve check.
Don't know if it was mentioned but CAC is the charge air cooler (Intercooler).
Just thinking some more here... the intermittent issue could be due to the ECU eventually adapting to a relatively small vacuum leak in PCV system. Just a thought...
My dad has 2014 VW Golf with 1,2 petrol engine and a while ago the VVT unit was replaced at the dealership as it started running poorly and check engine light came on.
Nice when the engine has intake and exhaust cam sensors,, you can scope them for comparison. Can't always trust scan data.
FREE is good. So part 1 is the bait to get you hooked and part two is when you charge 99¢....hahaha. Could be a stretch timing chain and the dealer service writer just called it a timing belt.
Some of the Volkswagen cars use a belt to drive everything then use another sprocket and chain to drive the cams so it may have a belt as well as a chain
The 2.0t BPG and BWT engines have both belt up front and chain rear of head
The complaint was duplicated. Was the actuator the problem or was there a control problem?
Part 2 will be for you!
You could have used a freezing agent to cool down the solenoid while randomly applying variable/full voltage and listen to the solenoid to stop clicking.
it needs a timing chain job. Had identical issues and that fixed it.
Hi Ivan, where we can buy wiring diagram for all cars brand? thank you.
So what was the problem???
I'm surprised you didn't backprobe the circuit to see if the commands are coming through from the ECM before you threw battery voltage on it.
Wait for Part 2!
01 16 07May 9, 2016 2037620 Supersedes Technical Bulletin V011513 dated June 03, 2015 to update part number and software levels as well as Beetle/Beetle Convertible 1.8L applicability.UpUpdate Programming ECM to Correct Engine Load Calculationns Update Programming, for rough idle and/or stumbling. ECM may contain various fault codes.
Technical Background
Current ECM programing does not efficiently control engine valve timing causing stumbling and rough idle.
Good thought here! Definitely warrants some investigation!
I believe CAC refers to "Charge Air Cooler" or intercooler.
I'm going with a sludged engine. Those 1.8 turbo engines are a giant stinking pile of turd. The best engines VW make are the 2.5 5 cyl and the 1.9 PD diesel. Great case study Ivan. Loving a dose of the old euro trash. 😂
"cac not exactly sure what that stands for"
charge air cooler (intercooler)
Ah yes of course! :)
What ended up being your problem ?
Watch part 2 lol
the cac replaced the focac years ago as the focac (free of charge air cooler) was costing them money.
My Wife got a letter from our VW dealer wanting to change her timing belt, as the car was 5 years old, I pointed out to them that it didn't have one. Wonder if they would have charged her for doing nothing!
Give them a call and setup the appointment. Tell them you'll be wanting free service for life if they fail to produce the old parts......Better yet. Do a "hidden camera" like the news crew did in CA for the bogus oil change jiffyspeedy places. Selling services and never doing them.
Probably just one of those letters they send to everyone. Like when they say your car is in high demand and we want to buy it back from you. Except, you have a 250k mile clapped out Golf.
Its going to run bad like that when you change the timing that is completely normal. Some of them volkswagen had problems with the timing chains failing early
Awesome
The autozone guy will say "Just put some seafoam in it"
Went to two big box auto stores several weeks ago and the respective employees did not know what plastigauge was or if they had any....
I heard people complain about that a TON of times. You have to explain it to them. Every smart person at a parts store seemed to of moved on to better things. I wonder why.....
Actually that might work as the fix lol
Two cans. Buy one get 1 50% off sale :D
Thats a good question. Years ago the employees had a lot of wrenching experience. This is probably why Ivan is so popular.
checking the oil level would have been a good idea !
Cant tell you how many nissans we have had with the same issue because of a bad timing solenoid valve.
Time to get your tipple squares out!
Our car is acting like this, what do we do?
Nice ! ❤❤❤❤❤
Could it be the command from the ECM?
We will explore this in some detail in Part 2 :)
so I understand part 2 will be 99c? :P
JH come- on, lets stop thjs whinning, i bought the $2.99, and yes i own a rogue.
For a fine taste of German engineering, take a look at the first 4matic system sometime...
My car was doing this today and then it stalled on me. I just drove it hard for a little bit and the CEL went away haha.
carbon on the intake valves
Bent valves?
CAC = charge air cooler, is my guess lol
you're right. its what they call a turbo chargers air cooler
Me wants part 2! 🙃
i want part 2 also
and i am greedy and want to see Ivan take his 2010 Nissan Rogue to Krown or Fluid Film and film the process.
Sorry Ivan ....i justs hates the rusts so much
you sure the dealership didn't mean the timing chain in the first place
Scotty give me the phasors.