Kurzgesagt's Optimistic Nihilism Is a Bad Philosophy
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
- I have some problems with a video by the Kurzgesagt - In a Nutshell channel. This video is my attempt to explain why I think it's a bad philosophy and why I think happiness is not a good substitute for meaning.
Check out Kurzgesagt's video for yourself and let me know what you think!
Sources are generally in the video for this one because of no background music
The happy face chart I edited is the Wong-Baker Faces Pain Scale.
The Sisyphus Roblox image in the thumbnail comes from a channel called RobTosPro
The first Camus quote about Nietzsche is from "The Rebel"
The second Camus quote is from "The Myth of Sisyphus"
Nihilism is not that nothing matter in everyday life, it's the fact nothing matter at a cosmic level. There is no judge of right and wrong waiting for yo after death. We will just be dead. So, we have the choice to use that fact as an excuse for destructive behavior or to take things in our own hands. My takes on optimistic nihilism is that if you have only your life you get to live it the way you want, the way who will make you happy. If it mean for you to find the love of your life and have kids, dot. If it mean traveling the world or build something who would survive yourself, do it.
i really enjoy philosophical discussions and especially critiques on those. truly understanding (grok) a subject enough to find where the wrong turns are taken rather than just dismissing it as a whole really shows a nuance that many other "philosophical arguments" don't participate in.
this is the first vid by u i've seen, but i'd assume from this vid that ur very much in the absurdist camp (especially with all the camus quotes) and i'd love to learn more about ur relationship to that :3
good luck!
I for sure feel some connection to absurdism.
I brought it up in this video specifically because I think it's a more complete and consistent philosophy than optimistic nihilism, while at the same time touching on a lot of the same issues that optimistic nihilism addresses. I thought that might be appealing to fans of optimistic nihilism. I also brought up camus because I see discussions of absurdism that mention optimistic nihilism, and I wanted to gesture towards some differences.
I'll for sure talk about philosophy again in the future, thanks for watching!
I found your second last statement, "I would encourage you to ground yourself in that love of humanity and individuality that you undoubtedly have and then try and carve your own meaning out of the universe," to be one of the best quotes I have ever heard. You've been incredibly helpful, so thank you!
That’s so nice of you! Hope you have a good weekend.
I don’t think this is what they meant. They clearly said that there is no meaning, but the meaning we create. So there is a meaning, but the truth is everything will go away. That doesn’t mean there is no meaning. By the way, the video was amazing. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the comment! Glad you liked the video. Hopefully you got something out of it even if you disagreed!
@PRO_WRESTLE_HYPE didn't say that the universe cares about anything ☺️
You’re contradicting yourself here. Their position is that there is no objective meaning, but that subjective meaning can be created. These absolutely have to be differentiated from each other.
An example would be that most religions, let’s say Christianity, believe in objective, divine meaning to the world and describes the entire infinite universe as purposeful, every atom of it.
Nihilism only believes in subjective meaning that holds no weight beyond what a single person prescribes their life with.
These different views have massive consequences imo. Superficial meaning can placate one’s brain and DOES work for a lot of people, but at the end of the day this does make a difference for a lot as well. Religious people are on average happier and more fulfilled than atheists, and subjective vs objective meaning likely plays a role in this, but I could be wrong. My personal position is that subjective meaning isn’t meaning at all, but I won’t split hairs if people disagreeZ
@@vibechecktsundere4912 I disagree; perhaps religious individuals feel happier because they believe in external assistance, whereas atheists rely on themselves. However, based on my personal experience, I was once religious and disliked my life, but now, as an atheist, life has significantly improved.
@@unkind6070 the whole point I’m making is a wide spread statistical margin, not an anecdotal one. There’s plenty of miserable religious people and happy atheists, I’m saying it’s statistically shown that over a wider sample size there is a difference in fulfillment.
The reason this is relevant is because a huge crux of Kurzgesagt’s video is how happiness can be found in a post-religious world, even when the stats don’t pack it up as a healthy alternative(though I guess you could always say that truth matters more than happiness for society, but I digress)
A world without meaning does affect people more than others, is what I should say
People find happiness in different things. The fact that someone recognizes that we're all going to be forgotten and that our actions are meaningless in the grand scheme of things, doesn't mean that we can't find purpose or meaning on the things we do. Nobody will remember me or you in 100 years, and that's a fact. It's what you do while you´re alive that matters. once you are dead, that's it. Nothing after your corpse rots will matter to you or anyone about you. Search or ypur own definitions, your own meaning of things. I feel that's a very good take on nihilism. It's not that we don't care about anything. We know that in the end everything will just continue on woth or without us. Our thoughts, ideologies and personal experiences die with us, so do the best you can while you live.
I don’t think I agree with this, if maybe for a slightly less tangible reason. The butterfly effect is well known, and to some extent we influence things far after were forgotten. What my ancestor in the 12th century did in that sense did matter, as it set into motion the domino effect that made me and their actions affected what others did, which influences the next generation, so on and so forth. Yes, it’s a very weak sort of influence compared to having our names and actions remembered directly, but for me it’s more than good enough.
but why try then? why is it that my life matters to me? should it? if the things that i do in my life matter, that means that things must have some value, i.e. not nihilism?
@@bekfastdude8022 That's you to discover. nobody cares to, or will, find it for you. The value comes from you, not from others. The memory of you will last, at most, 2 generations and then you will be completely forgotten. The important thing is that you enjoy your life now that you're living it and not trying to find an ultimate meaning in a meaningless universe. When you die, 100 other children at least will be born, you¿ll n ot be the only one buried that day and the day will go on as normal for the rest of the world. Only the people that know you will mourn you and life continues.
I mean its conceivable that the correct answer to a question can be unpleasant / unnatural enough to human brains that our intuitions are unchanged even after recognizing the correct answer. It would have been better had you clarified if you think nihilism is wrong and why, or you think we ought to pretend as if it is ( and for what reasons).
while I have a new found appreciation of nihilism/existentialism/whatever-people-feel-like-calling-it-this-time-ism through simply being able to realize that if nothing matters, i can simply forgive myself for my mistakes instead of simply disregarding those mistakes and their ramifications because nothing matters yadda yadda
I do take an issue with not necessarily how the message itself is fundamentally but rather how it is presented
the people who extol the virtues of this philosophy tend to oversimplify it let alone life in general
it's the inverse of how pessimistic nihilists say "nothing matters, and there's nothing but sadness"
just replace the latter with "you might as well be happy"
it takes away the nuance of life that makes philosophy what it is
I think it depends on how you define Nihilism. If you think it means a belief in no OBJECTIVE meaning, then their video is fine. But if you think it means that life has no meaning, and meaning cannot be ascertained, I can get your problem with it. As an absurd nihilist, I think their video lacks depth, but I do not have a problem with it. Whether it is nihilism or not, I do not care, I understand the philosophy enough. If you disagree, that is fine, but keep in mind that it is okay to have different opinions then others.
Thanks for the comment! Obviously the philosophy as they present it in the video isn't fully fleshed out. That's just not the style and purpose of the channel. I've got no problem with that, and I actually like a lot of the stuff on this channel. I'd even credit this video specifically for making me more interested in philosophy years ago. I think, my video, in practice, mostly functions as a way for me to articulate my problems with the philosophy in the video as a self-contained unit, and hopefully articulate to other people who identified with the general idea of this philosophy one way they can "go deeper."
@RyanGeddie ok, thanks for the clarification. I understand why nihilism might appear depressing on the surface, but imo it is the most liberating philosophical sub-branch and actually helps me when I feel depressed. There are lots of people who just associate nihilism with depression and bleak but it really isn't. Kurzgestart is a positive nihilist which does differ from my view (Camus Absurdism), but I nevertheless don't mind it.
By all means, if some flavor of nihilism works for you, don't let some guy with a camera and too much time on his hands dissuade you! Camus is an interesting thinker. I hope I can make a video specifically about "The Rebel" one day.@@JNB0723
@@RyanGeddie Thank you. I often wish more people understood that there are a multifarious number of philosophies, and as long as people can consistently make proper arguments for them, there is no such thing as a wrong philosophy. Camus' "The Rebel" and "The Myth of Sisyphus" are most certainly worthy of a read! Absurdism is quite peculiar.
Great video! I also love the Jane Austen connection!
humans can do anything but they should do great good things, and not bad things. they should use their potential with good intentions
you can do whatever you want. the whole question is what will come of it
I am 10 happy watching the video.
Nice
Thanks!