Thanks for making this my most popular video to date! If you're here and just want the short answer basically, if you have solar and your state offers Net Energy Metering then financially it likely isn't a good investment. However, if you live somewhere with regular outages (such as in California these days) then it 100% makes sense for peace of mind. Sub for more soon, bye!
Or live in Hawaii as I do and paid $600-$700 electricity bill as I did before getting powerwalls and TOU PV net metering which brought my payments to $25.
Hey Ben, thanks for taking the time to make this. Over here in Massachusetts there aren’t any peak times and low times. They just trade one hour for one hour it’s all the same. We are still looking at if this is worth it. Wondering about maintenance? Is there much? And if so, is it like $100 every time the guy comes out? Thanks
metalhead4700 I cant remember but I suspect that the weather was mild enough that we didn’t have to. At least not when the sun wasn’t shining on the panels.
@@metalhead4700 obviously not....13.5kwh at best *.97 conversion leaves what 13kwh for 16 hours of effectively 0 zerolight a day? 800 watts per hour, not sure what you can run with that...all your lights tv and pcs. nothing mechanical
@@richardroberson9277 probably just a top loading fridge, super efficient! iPad with cell based internet for entertainment or since it's Australia must be a lot of things to do with friends and family away from home.
congratulations m8. The world needs all the help we can give. And if you watch the Australian 60 min - dok about black out, Expensive bill's and more. So sad to see how some Australian politicians behave!! Best of luck :0)
Homes cost money to maintain, and if any unfortunate thing happens it can cost you alot in repairs or high insurance rates for years, however you can cash out and get alot of your investment if you sell renters get zero return. However it is constant outflow of money dont get me started on the taxes. However if you can buy do it if you can't save so you can buy. M
I have had my PW2 for 3 years. I also have a solar. My annual net electricity bill each year is zero. I also use the PW2 and solar along with off-peak charging from my electricity vendor to provide the charge needed for both of our electric cars (Model 3 and Fiat 500e) to meet our daily driving needs. Which combined for my wife and I equal about 75 miles per day. Our life use case is taking full advantage and reaping the benefit of the Tesla PW2 and Solar. So far today I am 100% Self powered. Meaning I am only using electricity from my system.
for how much? you say you use off peak charging for cars but then say its 100% self powered...why use the powerwall at all then if youre using grid as battery.
@@FiveInDrive no. this is not a thing. nobody would ever want to. 1 single cloudy day and your sol with your (1) count em (1) day of energy storage. not even like 12 hours
We too have the PowerWall with our Solar. After the federal rebate and the SGIP rebate from SDG&E, the battery only cost us $2600 after all incentives. Our home runs by battery long after solar stops producing during the day and our home is about 87-90% off grid. SOOOO worth it!!
why is it worth it though? you used the governments money to buy an overpriced (even by tesla standards) battery that will never pay off before it devalues far below its purchase price
@@STho205 So a farm in 1905 had air conditioning, internet, refrigerator(s), lighting, and didn't have to pay a monopoly for the power to run these things? What country was that farm in???
The Real c too. Yeah they had AC. They opened some windows and lived outdoors. The world was many, many degrees cooler then, haven't you heard. They only used lighting at night, not in broad daylight with drapes closed. So you're going to reach the internet without an ISP monopoly utility you have to pay. Fun. AC...what do you hate the environment??!!???. Go outside and milk a cow...make sure she doesn't fart. If you want to be independent buy an island and interact with nobody...cept you have to buy all your stuff (and the island) from a monopoly with currency from the Federal Reserve Bank to be comfy and entertained. I hear there's a Mars flight leaving from Hawthorne, CA tonight.
Hello all!! I’m in Fl and have a 14.64kw system with 2 powerwalls. Where I live the power outages happen frequently. They average about once a week albeit for 5-8 min at a time. But that’s not the problem. Return on investment was not my primary concern for the powerwalls. I wanted piece of mind. I’ve been through several hurricanes and have gone a week without power. That was terrible and now have a family and it’s the best feeling in the world not having to worry about the power going out, ever!
@@shdwbnndbyyt Really?? I think thats probably a safety issue, because solar panels can feed back into the grid, and if powerlines are down, people could get electrocuted. You should be able to use stored battery power though.
I have solar and no powerwalls. My state has net metering, no time of use metering and very little power outages. So as neat as it would be it doesn't make financial sense for us. Great video Ben. Glad you discussed net metering because most have no clue about it.
Yeah but to get a small battery installed can cost $10k and they last about 10 years so you pay about $1k per year for the ability to arbitrage your power rate a small amount. That said if your power goes out a lot it's probably worth it to be able to limp along off the grid.
Really? Worth $14,000 just to have electricity for eight hours before the power from the grid was restored? That's a cost of nearly $2,000 an hour. I don't understand your economics.
Adam Thomson that’s a single instance. Over time there will be more outages and in that sense the ‘price per hour’ will decrease. Alongside that there are other benefits to solar (offsetting CO2 output of your household, selling your extra power back to the grid etc).
@@helenhuizenga9998 now that it is summer time with afternoon rain, i can do only three days with power modifications to reduce energy. i should have bought 3, it was half the price. the pv system doesn't produce as well as in the spring i am avg 50kw vs 60kw in the spring
in addtion if you have FPL you have the option of doing time of use where u can pay less for power because u use your pv and batteries during the day and use grid at night super cheap electricity
Love your videos. We have had solar and net metering for 8 years now. 53MWH so far and loving it. Tesla looks to be in our future as well. Neighbors have exactly what you have for Tesla products and they educate the rest of our neighborhood. Keep up the great work, you do make a difference. The more people learn, the better our world can be!
We are in GA and since the power walls were installed with 23 solar panels we have had a total of 9 hours of power outages . We have not lost power since the installment. We have been pretty much self powered in the fall and spring with giving back to the grid. In the winter we also had a a much lower electric bill . Now , in the summer we are about 70 % self powered. Absolutely love the system. Planning on buying a solar water heater system.
We've had 3 powerwalls for a little over a year. We added them to our existing solar PV system. We live in San Diego and have the EV-TOU-5 plan which gives us 9.3 cents/kwh at night and that 53 cents/kwh peak rate. We use the advanced feature so our two EVs charge of the grid at night. That may take 40 kwh, or about $4 (keep it simple). During the peak time we run off the batteries and send about 8 kwh to the grid, giving us that $4 credit to offset the 40 we used at night. Since we can now download the data I took the time to go back for every day and download the data. I then ran it through some analysis to see how much the powerwalls are saving us by allowing us to shift when we use our solar vs sending to the grid. My basic assumption was if you take the home usage and minus the solar generated you'd get what the power company would see had you no powerwalls. I then ran that through the EV-TOU-5 pricing structure and compared to running what actually the power company reports. The powerwalls saved us around $760 for a year. My out of pocket expense for three powerwalls and installation was around $14000 so in their guaranteed life of ten years they won't pay for themselves. Had we more power outages there would be more cost savings because my solar wouldn't be dormant, it can still produce. Of course I guess that's not a money savings because no power at all is free -- but I don't have to throw away the contents of our freezer either. If you want to chat about it sometime I can show you my data and analysis.
As a Floridian who lost power two years in a row to storms (for about 8 days total), this would be a game changer. Just wish I could afford it. I don't even have solar yet.
$50 bucks a month for a small solar system from tesla. and cancel anytime with no fee unless you want the system removed. If tesla can make it that if customers don't want to pay and they can harvest the power and resell it. it will be a complete game-changer:) lol
@@N8TheSnake 16k to have ac for 8 days a year if the power is out wouldnt you just be at home and if youre not at home why do you care about the ac. seems like you could easily just plug in the massive 50kwh+ battery in the car
The weather alert system is crucial for me being that I live in central Florida!! We have multiple storms a day and especially in the summer during hurricane season having a outage percentage is going to be extremely higher than normal. Glad you shared this data !
I can speak to this. I own a very large solar installation company that services SD, Orange, LA and Riverside counties as well as Phoenix, Tuscon and just now, last Vegas. Around 850 systems per month in total. We are brand agnostic and by that i mean we install solar and batteries both from and for companies such as Tesla, LG, Sunrun, SolarEdge, Enphase, Pika, Panasonic, sharp and sunpower. In the areas i mentioned, it makes the most sense to use batteries IF you pull around 950 kWhs from your utility or more AND you have enough roof space to offset 120% or more of your bill with panels in California due to Time of Use billing. Vegas, tuscon don’t need it. Phoenix should if you have SRP as your utility but not APS. As far as the SGIP credit (CA) you mentioned, use caution as that fund is limited and for FY2019 is already gone. Lastly if you don’t have enough capacity to fill the battery or batteries in 2.5 hours or less, skip it. It won’t serve you well and it won’t last near as long. Good luck with your system!
@@inkooh8 because if you do NPT own a at least 7 to 8kw Peak system it does not make any sense! A 8 or 9kw peak system means that at peak capavity aka maximum solar power output and optimal azimuth og the sun,it puts out 8 or 9kw an hour! If you have this 14kwh tesla battery and are not able to fill it up in 2 or 3 hours - it is not worth it since the sun does not stand at highest point for much longer. Also it varies a lot depending on your distance to the equator! During winter time I for instance could only get 1 or 2kw on a cloudy winter day. Whereas I would get 50 or 60 kw a day easily with a 9kwp system in june or july!
You mean those giant clusterf@cks of rechargeable power-tool battery cells by the thousands in a "battery pack"? Those "car batteries"? Better learn more about your Tesla products if you're unaware those "car batteries" are already used in your PowerWall(s).
Just looked up Tesla roofing and found you, great quality, really nicely explained things to someone who is just looking up for first time, I love to see someone making something good for them and still making easier to understand for others, btw love the calmnes of your speech.
"Are they worth the money?", a question being answered by a person who got $14k worth of Powerwalls for free. Not saying his points become moot, but I'll always have a hard time taking things at full face value when the person didn't put any of their money on the line for something that costs 10s of thousands of dollars.
I just signed a lease agreement with a Tesla system. I live in Puerto Rico where there’s not only multiple power outages weekly but several storms a year. This review helps a lot. Looking forward to using the app. Thanks
Definitely put solar panels on the beautiful house you're building, Dan, or at least on tall poles in your back yard. They make a great yard canopy, if you can't put them on your roof. I'd get a Powerwall, however, after installing my solar panels, and with my wind turbine, my power bill has been the connection fee of only: $10.30/mo., every month and we far overproduce so we have massive amounts of credits stored up that we never use. So even if I put a powerwall in, my bill would still be: $10.30/mo. But, I still want a Powerwall. :)
WHAT'S INSIDE? FAMILY I’m from Utah. I think this is all available in Utah. I just talked to my rep last week. But maybe I’m confused. What are you saying isn’t available?
Ben, we lose power here in Northern California every time it rains! Just today over 14k homes lost power for 2 to 3 hours from a thunderstorm. This is the third power outage this year, and we haven't gotten into the real power outage season and fire season. So, I ordered Tesla solar power with 24 panels and 2 Powerwalls. I ordered last April. It will be installed next week!! (Late August) Can't wait!
Tesla cars have huge batteries built in. Seems like it would be beneficial to the “Tesla Ecosystem” to allow the Tesla to connect to the power wall directly and share it’s battery if it was needed. Does the Tesla charging port allow for power to go both ways? If it doesn’t, it should. Then you could “fill up” another stranded Tesla on the road that ran out of power, etc. If a hurricane or snowstorm came through and took the power with it, the ability to connect an additional 75, 80, 90, 100 KWh battery to power the home seems like it would be beneficial. Like others, I would also love to know your yearly power bill before vs after solar/power wall.
of course....these things are beyond stupid you can buy a model 3 with 80kwh for what 40k? 500$/kwh and get a FREE CAR these things are 500$/kwh installed and are near useless in a hurricane you're either leaving. in said car or not driving to work so the battery is free to use protocol and laws dont allow car to back feed grid otherwise yes...its already there and cheap as hell and it would actually make money arbitraging power rates between night and day assuming you didnt need to drive it. using a battery already in a car=smart buying over priced battery that sits around doing nothing to power cycle a house = dumb
@@tonytaing8173 off grid yes...every ev has it technically....the 12V output. the s/x 3? at least have a 1500W inverter built in so yeah they could run a fridge no problem during a power outage and all your lights not sure what on earth you're going to do with 5000W output on a 13.5KW battery that you cant do with 1500W output on a 75KWH+ battery... i guess you could run your ac for 3/4 hours on 1 powerwall whatever use that is. any cooking etc would drain it crazy fast as it has the power but not the energy
John W correct, just trying to explain that you need some serious equipment, not just the power supply which isn’t even the ac/dc charger (which is onboard the car).
We have a 5kW solar system at our house. Living on the coast of Maine, we lose power several times a year, frequently for three or four days at a time. Most people around us have generators, but we've got a wood stove and that helps. But we're seriously looking at getting two powerwalls. Thanks so much for this helpful video.
Yes actually last I heard in 2018 supposedly they had about 11,000 renewable energy projects in Puerto Rico but mostly for few hospitals,schools, elderly homes but a lot of us never got a power wall and the power was out for us for more than 7 months. It was terrible and one of the main reasons I wish I could get one without having to go to a 3rd party because the authorize sellers for tesla gouging prices , musk apparently stopped sending to them but it hasn't stopped some over here from continuing. Furthermore as for getting an EV in Puerto Rico to use as a back up power also is rather difficult since it has to be shipped from Florida by a 3rd party also which adds to the price and wait time. I wish tesla would consider direct shipment to Puerto Rico like the rest of the USA but no so far not yet. We will be getting a service center at some point but no eta on it, all musk said about it was "Yes" and nothing else about it so far.
@@Allucardsin no market for it there sadly. if you can get your hands on an old leaf that thing even has a much larger battery than a powerwall and it can move and stuff. the batteries are only lasting longer and longer the model 3 pack could easily pay itself off energy shifting well within its expected lifetime and well below its replacement cost....the reason they dont want you to do it is safety and warranty issues most tesla drivers never even use their battery imagine using it 80% every single day.
@Marc Davidson horribly....it doesnt work...its one thing to build one thats zero emissions or very near. its another to make it all electric + energy storage you'd need alot of powerwalls for 1 day of storage....what about weather and 2+ days of little sun. far cheaper/easier to use diesel/conventional energy back up for the 1/2 times a year weather is horrible and just build enough storage to last 16 hours or between solar cycles
richard roberson there should be a market at some point it's just going slow at this time maybe in the next couple years lol I just don't want to wait awhile to get a model 3 , there is about 200 or so in the island. Musk did confirm he plans on bringing a service center here and possibly supercharging but he's not telling when, so until then only time will tell. I know battery technology is going to get much better in the near future. Maybe it is best I wait.
Very happy with my single powerwall. Wish I had bought two or three of them. You are right, the main benefit is not economic, but mental. I have done a few simulated power outages, and the powerwall has worked flawlessly, kicking in almost instantly. If I conserve energy, I can basically live completely off the electric grid forever if necessary, recharging the powerwall with solar each day.
@@chefgav1 ROI is that you get a chance to keep your planet habitable and give the finger to the fossil fuel industry. Personal energy independence is wonderful, so kudos to Mark for taking a leap into the future.
@1Energine1 ‘Virtue signalling’ is a cowardly term used by people who secretly worry that their beliefs and actions are unethical and don’t want you to make them feel bad by behaving differently.
@1Energine1 Baseless attacks? The fossil fuel industry is killing us. That is a fact with a list of evidence a mile long. Personal energy independence is great. That is a fact. Why are you so defensive? You work for the fossil fuel industry and want to do something better with your life instead? Those that share my values don't accuse me of "virtue signalling".
Living in Hawaii, the struggle is real with the highest rates per kWh in the nation. I don't have PV/solar because I'm in a situation where I have about 4-5 years before I need to replace my roof. It would be ideal to install solar when I replace my roof. But you brought up an interesting idea about installing power walls without solar to take advantage of peak shaving / rate arbitrage. Maybe that's my first step to bridge the gap on installing solar/roof replacement.
We just doubled our solar panels and a Powerwall or two is down the road. What a lot of people are missing is how beneficial solar is to everyone on the grid. S California used to have brownouts all the time. Now when the usage is highest - hot days with lots of A/C going during business hours - the distributed solar panels everywhere are performing at their max and sending power back into the grid. I feel good knowing that I'm helping the grid, helping the power company to NOT have to add more (coal or natural gas) power stations, and actually helping the community not to suffer through another brownout.
Ben, we got solar and the power wall. We installed in our garage on the wall. We live in riverside county where temps are over 100 daily in the summer. With our A/C set at 76 and charging our model 3 our electricity bill was $10 for June, July, and August! Totally worth it, last year was $3-400+ a month
There is also another reason you could go for a powerwall + sun setup: To ensure than most of your energy is clean. Maybe it would cost you a bit more than doing just solar + credit from your provider, but by putting everything (or at least most) of your production inside the powerwalls, this would mean that you only take from the grid when you really don't have a choice, and ensure that most of what you use comes from clean energy. I think it's what I would do if I had a house, and the money.
I have solar (not Tesla), net metering, a PowerWall and a Tesla Model 3. The grid power is fairly stable. One thing I see as lacking is, i would like to be able to use my car’s battery as part of the PowerWall circuit.
Robert Gamble exactly. Your car is the equivalent of 5 or more powerwalls sat on your drive. It beggars belief that there isn’t the technology to do so.
When I saw Elon telling Joe Rogan we don’t even know what the cars are capable of, I wouldn’t doubt Tesla will reverse the current to the house if possible. I am no engineer but if it is theoretically possible, that makes things very interesting.
David Beppler what I’m saying is you cannot use the car battery to power the house in preference to from the grid (in the absence of solar). The fact that a lot of Tesla’s (at least in the UK) have free supercharging forever means it’s not in Tesla’s interest to enable car to home power as then Tesla owners would simply need to fill up at the Supercharger and come home to run the house from the car for free.
Richard Cordova agreed, but the issue of free supercharging would need to be resolved as otherwise owners would potentially charge for free at the Supercharger and then bring the car home to run the house (for free) from it. I suspect this is the biggest barrier why this possibility has not been enabled yet.
@@davidbeppler3032 I'm in a similar situation. I just want a smart charger that charges my car when I'm producing extra solar power and tapers back when my AC kicks in, or clothes drier is running. Also, tapers off when the afternoon thundershower kicks in. Basically, a smart charger that uses any excess power we make with our PV system to charge the cars, and not use grid power. There is one available in Europe called the Zappi, but they won't sell to the US.
Very informative. I have owned a PV system (solar) with battery back up for more than 10 years in FL. There is another great advantage as you have mentioned with FL being prone to power outages due to storms (hurricanes) in that you do not need to purchase a generator for power outages. The generator is costly to install and maintain. The solar system pays its self back every day the sun comes out and the federal government paid for 30% of the entire cost including the batteries. There is no payback on the generator, only upfront costs and yearly maintenance. Thanks for your interesting and informative U tube site.
Well the main complaint about other companies is that the share the data with someone else or use it to sell you something. Let’s wait and see what Tesla will do with our data in the future.
I stay on the eastern coast and I find it priceless to have the ability to subsidize my power usage and store back-up power in the event of a power outage. I've had my solar panels and power walls for over 3 years and my power bill has gone from an average of $200 to $5.
Ben, great video, I am more than ever considering purchasing a power wall, mainly for the ability to use stored power during peak rate times here in Ca.
Usable Energy 13.5 kWh max size a powerall 2 , useless power say 2 tesla s 100 kwh battery 200 plus house used 25 kwh a day need total 225 kwh of powerwalls 2 , 16 batterys. cost of say 113 k . alot money , have long way to go on powerwalls need too hold say 100 kwh each one .
i wait for powerwall 3 haved 28kWh battery (~26kWh usable capacity)l only need 8 , still be short of need 100 kwh per powerwall need. get too 100 kwh in powerwall 5 if were lucky ?
In Puerto Rico it make sense to have it 100%. I just bought a PW system to my mom who's living in PR and I can't describe how much piece is bringing to her life by not worrying about power outage not to mention hurricanes.
One thing you didn't comment on the storm watch and why it's important, (maybe you didn't know about it) is that the grid will NOT charge your battery at all unless there's a storm coming. So on regular settings. The battery is ONLY being charged by the sun. So if you look at your settings, everything revolves around saving storage on the battery because the Grid will not charge the battery unless there's a storm. So for Backup Only, Sun charged the battery to the max, battery is only used during outage. Self-powered, sun charged the battery with remaining power after power your home, then use battery at night till it hits a power reserve limit, then it will use grid till sun comes up. for this to work, your solar panel must output much much more than your home usage so it can charge the battery in time before sunset, if not, your batteries won't be fully charged for the night. That means, you'll constantly be using the grid and solar while battery only help very little.
Pw2 absolutely will recharge from grid. We use this feature frequently. After dark, just raise the reserve level above the state of charge, Pw2 will begin charging from grid at 1.7kW.
Better to feed the grid during peak time if possible (even from the battery) to get the highest payback. Then recharge the battery with cheap off-peak grid power. 😉
Just found this video and I am strongly considering getting two power walls for my house in FL. Thanks for explaining this in laymen’s terms. Well done.
I love your channel but I wish you pulled more data like what you pay per month with and without solar/battery . Value of the sole and storage after 20 years, etc. You need to honor your channels name! :) PD: I own 2 Tesla’s, I have solar panel but no powerwall yet. I want to know your numbers more in depth in the future :)
@@Avalanche2 it can depending on how much power u use, if you never use AC and can live off a AA battery than no sense, what so ever. But if your house have lots of peeps active at home in the daytime and the AC running all day and you have a few electric cars, than that can be a positive investment. But the most important is as a backup when your power goes out, and as a huge UPS.
Depends on your circumstances. If you are out of the house 8h+/day & have a 15c/kWh rate, it's probably not worth having a battery. Get a big solar array & defray your bills with feed-in tariffs. If you're retired or stay-at-home parents & have 30+c/kWh rates, it's a no brainer. A 6-7.5kW PV array, Fronius 8.2kW grid feed inverter & a Pw2 will give 100% RoI in about 6 years. That's my situation in eastern Australia. Power bill has dropped from $3700/yr to $350. Now never have power outages, either.
Ben, I am seriously considering purchasing the Powerwall. Have a Sunpower 29 panel system about 1.5 year old. Researching this now. Thanks for the video. Well done.
Had one for over two years, never use grid, all self powered.. I have an ev and winter charge it for free at a university that has 7,000 plus solar panels. No bills , just cheques from feed in. Best thing I've ever bought.
Hey Ben, if you want to charge the car off grid then plug it in and charge at lowest amperage basically like charging from a 110 outlet when solar is most active. Your car will charge and so will the powerwall Plus it won't overwhelm the Powerwalls at the same time I believe the max output from both PW is 10 kWh.
Wow the timing of this video on my feed couldn't have been more useful as I sit here alone in my house with no electricity and a single extension cord running to my fridge connected to a generator outside my kitchen screaming away at me for hours on end as I sit here and wait for power to be restored. Or death. At this point I don't care anymore.
Thanks for the insights into Powerwall sensibilities for those viewers who are wondering. Your reporting confirmed exactly what I figured about whether or not it made sense for me to get a Powerwall and that is - it did not. I was only considering the case for backup power and now thanks to you I know I would be better off going in a different direction.
Australian here, we currently have a 5.4kw solar system installed and at the end of May we are adding 1.2kw to the solar system to bring it up to 6.6kw. When we had the initial system installed 2 years ago our quarterly power bills went from $300-$450 a quarter to $80-$150. Hopefully the additional panels will reduce that even further. On top of the additional panels we are installing a PW2 as well, fingers crossed with the additional panels plus the PW2 we should have our bills reduced to zero if not a credit.
Martialman.45 my house in Houston is $.04 /kw for any amount, any time Meanwhile in San Diego I pay WAAAAAAY more. It’s insane how expensive it is in San Diego. Downright criminal.
@@codycast generally in Houston you need to pay Centerpoint a .04 delivery fee too along with others. It's not as cheap as it seems. In Baytown our old old plan was about 10 cents per kwh total with a 1$ fee per month. Current plan is .139$ with 1 to 1 net metering so we make 200-250$ per month with solar.
My cousin has NEC Retail with the free nights and weekends plan. His wife bought a 2019 Chevy Bolt a few months ago and only charges is it between 8pm and 6am.
Thanks for the video. We have had our Powerwall 2 for 3 weeks now and its great. We are in New Zealand and we get a lot of sun. We had a 3.99 KWp system for a start off and it was good but I could see the benefit of a battery added. So we put another 8 panels on taking us up to 22 panels or 6.55 KWp. Our inverter is a 5 KW solar edge HD inverter which allows for oversizing of panels up to 135% without voiding the warranty. This means we can get up to 5 KW solidly during peak sun filling the powerwall 2 up quickly. With a bit of discipline only using heavy use items during the day we can virtually stay offgrid onSolar and Battery for 24hrs. We are actually just going into our second week of doing this now without drawing from the grid at all and exporting out to the grid once the powerwall is full. Everything is expensive to buy here in NZ though. The powerwall only cost $16,800 NZD installed. So with the Solar System plus the powerwall 2 we have spent $32,000 NZD. There are no solar subsidies here in NZ yet either.
Only $10/month in CA for fixed fees? I wish... Here in Australia I have to pay AU$1.05 / DAY ! Yes, that's AU$31.50/ month (US$21.50) so basically double :-( 1 Powerwall 2 is AU$11k + installation making it a very expensive option compared to some others - but no-one makes a better app than Tesla.
An excellent presentation Ben. I’m in Québec which is a place unto itself. All the electricity is from hydro, ( a renewable source ) it has to be the lowest price per kilowatt in the American continent, north and south, we don’t have peak periods, it’s 6c low usage and 9c over a certain volume, that’s Canadian dollars,and yet during storms where I live it can be an unreliable supply. Solar is hard work during the snowy winter, and the days are short. Having powerwalls does not make economical sense but they would give me independence’s and a "peace of mind".
WA, Australia or US ? We are very fortunate to have a lot of rivers and lakes, I think Canada itself has somewhere near 15% of all the fresh water in the world ! On the other hand......long, and I mean long winters.
Any thoughts or insights on possible Vehicle to Home/Grid (V2G) application from Tesla. With a fleet of cars that drag around 75 or 100 kWh batteries, it would seem like a logical next step to be able to use a Tesla vehicle to power your home (or at least feed power into a Powerwall to conserve the cars battery chemistry). I imagine there are issues with battery life and resiliency of these expensive cars when it comes to V2G, but it seems like a worthwhile way to utilize a battery that is probably parked 95% of the time. I see a potential to drive a car to work, charge up on excess solar/renewables during the day, then drive home fully charged and use that power to run the house, all with a smart grid that can regulate when power is needed or stored, and compensate those who make their batteries available for distributed power supply. Would love to see Tesla lead on distributed supply. Thanks.
Yes. Only Nissan supports this mode of use so far. Mostly because Chademo was always designed as a bidirectional protocol, whilst the Tesla and CCS specs weren't. It's a pity that the unidirectional charging specs have been more popular in the market because now the vast majority of EVs just can't do this. You would expect Tesla to have been a bit smarter on this (but they've generally been against this type of usage due to worry about battery wear). Premature to make it impossible though IMHO (maybe the Tesla spec could actually do this - they just choose not to?)
I have solar and two powerwalls. ! 1) I haven't paid for electricity since September when I got the final approve from the Norman city inspectors. 2). we have had 5 major power outage and with the exception doing power control (using less than .6kw ). we have not been effected by power outage. 3). during the major artic blst we got hit with. we were charged $64 for that month of power. where our neighbors got $1000-$2300 bills that month. Thank you solar and Tesla powerwalls.
Thanks Ben. I went to the Tesla web site and found a different estimate for backup by a single battery of 3 days. The concept I have is overbilding and feeding the system with my panels while I run the home off the batter(ies) and making 23cents a kWh credit.
I’d be curious to know how these systems increase your property value as well. If you decide to sell in the future, the breakeven point my be a lot shorter than just based off power usage
I'm in Jersey. I have it and I love it! After Hurricane Isiaias, my neighborhood went 3 full days with no power and my house was perfectly normal. The lowest my powerwall went down to was 30% and then the sun simply recharged it in the morning. There is a 16k federal tax rebate that's being phased out so take advantage quickly. Also in New Jersey, 1 mega watt of power is worth about 230 bucks. You can actually sell your Srecs! So in Jersey, the system literally pays for itself!
@@Mistery7777 it's like how healthy people go work at co-ops then preach about the stuff there making them healthy as if they were ever fat in the first place. Or people who have never been depressed and don't have the depression predisposition gene they've discovered telling you what you need to do to stop being depressed. Again, they never were and what they're saying is largely worthless.
I LOVE that power use gauge/monitor! My 2019 Honda Insight has a gauge like that that tells me how the car is using the energy from the engine and batteries. Good shit!
Great video Ben. One thing - net metering isn’t an issue If you have a big electric bill. It never goes back, you use all the sun has to offer. So I have a 7kw propane generator I am using now on a critical circuit sub panel. Ordered a power wall and 6kw solar from Tesla. If the grid dies I can run off the battery and charge with solar or flip to the generator to charge the batteries. I could hang out for two weeks or more with no grid or sun. Can also plug my car 220v 30 amps into the 7kw propane. So the powerwall is an awesome micro grid and backup, so worth it for safety and power!
I thought about solar which I know is expensive, and in a new house voids warranty, need to wait a decade on that. I liked the generac emergency generator which has problems, that can be overcome, for when power goes off, this sounds like a great alternative to both. Musk guy is a genius.
Australian here, I had a 5.4kw solar system installed about 2 years ago and my average monthly bills went from an average of $400-$500 a 1/4 to about $150-$250 a 1/4. A few days ago (20 May 20) I added an extra 1.2kw added to our solar system bringing it to 6.6kw system, we also installed a Tesla Powerwall 2. I'm hoping with the extra 1.2kw's we have installed plus the PW2 we should either nil electricity bills from now on or maybe even a credit.
I'm not sure, but Tesla's charging connector may be capable of V2G -- vehicle to grid -- which turns the car's battery into a big powerwall/backup where the battery can charge and discharge via the connector. ChaDeMo can do it. And I think a future CCS standard could do it.
Gordon Chaffin It cannot. Only Chademo is currently capable of V2G. CCS is aiming for 2025. Elon Musk announced last year that Tesla may revisit V2G but they have no publicly announced plans a year later.
Barut Tech That would solve V2H but not V2G. V2G must communicate with the CAN buss in the car and turn on and off as required. Also Tesla must agree to warrant it’s batteries for this process. Not saying it can’t be done - Tesla already communicates with the car during supercharging, but they have to implement it and agree to honour the battery warranty. It’s something that only they can do. As is closing the contactor.
I recently upgraded my solar system to 6.2kwh, with NEM it covers for all my usage and lands me on the credit side against my utility company. I'm trying to take advantage of the PSPS CA rebates to cover for all of my Tesla power wall expenses. Can't wait to get the power wall 2s installed.
Great video, thanks! Here in Northern California we have Pacific Gas and Electric who doesn’t purchase power back from customers anymore. So all power generated over what you utilize is gone unless you can store it on site.
Aaron It would if you can sell the surplus. Solar is viable even in the U.K, we have a couple of million homes installed so far, not bad for a tiny island.
You covered a lot of data pretty quickly, great job. It seems like power companies could(?) go the way of land line telephone companies within the next couple decades. However, most Americans on average would struggle currently with that initial cost of the Powerwall 2 system (even with the 30% government tax break) without yet another monthly payment. For the few that can afford a cash purchase it's well worth it. I believe once we can get systems like the Powerwall 2 capabilities under $3000 most people will start to consider this as a gotta have purchase.
As an alternative to Powerall is a generator. We have 16.5 solar grid (60 panels) and a 10 kw propane generator. Cost 15 years ago was < $5k. Have separate sub panel to provide “essential circuits”. Works well.
I agree with every benefit you site. However, there’s a fatal flaw imo. The system is bricked if it loses Internet for 24-36 hours. One of the biggest reasons I’d want solar is to have power during a MAJOR crisis. It is unconscionable for Tesla to integrate so fragile of a kill switch. Mark my words.
Great video. You are the first person to say that Net metering and Tesla Powerwall makes no sense. A Powerwall for emergency power still makes no sense to me when you can buy a really nice generator and a whole house transfer switch and power your entire house until power returns (not just 3 days) . I have solar with net metering and a whole house generator for backup power in emergency situations. Any unused solar power is sent back to the grid and used at a later date/time. Most solar systems are built to zero out your electric bill. Powerwalls may be pretty and very informative but probably not for everyone. Thanks for the video.
I am an energy researcher and have been monitoring several Tesla Powerwalls for a while. This is a very helpful and thorough analysis but I would like to add some more insights. The best case scenario is to fully charge and discharge your battery everyday so that you make the best out of it. For an average electricity price of 0.15$/kWh you will get a payback of 10 years as 3650 cycles would save you approximately $7000. In the real world your PV will not generate everyday an excess for a full charge, your house demand will not always be as much as 13.5kWh from sunset to next day's sunrise and also the battery, especially when installed outside, is not 90% efficient as claimed but 70%-80%. A nice trick would be to use the grid for scheduling when you have access to variable tariffs; for example, charge your battery over the night and use it during the day. If your day import - night import deal is better than 0.15$/kWh and the battery is used daily for a full charge and discharge, you will get a better return that the 10 years. The combination of the above 2 would increase your benefits; however, currently the Powerwall 2 cannot combine charging from the grid and from your PV as these two modes are not working together. Also there is a maximum charge and discharge power at 5kW meaning that if you have a big PV , the charging power will be limited to 5kW and the rest will be exported. What is more important is that during discharge the battery can only handle simultaneous loads up to 5kW. Bottom line: TESLA Powerwall 2 is really cool and the monitoring is neat but it is not cost effective unless: you receive a generous subsidy or electricity price gets mad or you have an amazingly suitable time-of-use tariff deal, or you need a power-cut UPS frequently.
I wouldn't consider the Tesla tiles; they are much less efficient and way more expensive than modern PV panels (if you could even get them). I'm north of London and have a 7.5kW PV system and a Powerwall 2. It works superbly but it's the PW2 that really makes the most of the solar. Over the year we are averaging 89% self-powered (62% solar, 27% PW). From about April to November it's approx 100% and the battery is full every day and does not completely discharge. Only in the depths of winter where it's really dark and there are consecutive cloudy days does the PW2 become completely discharged and we go over to grid. On installation we estimated 16 years break-even but we are sending a lot of spare power to the grid in summer (generating 30+ kWh on a really sunny day) and by using this in an EV we can get this down to around 6 years with fuel-cost savings. We also get feed-in tariff government subsidies which has now ended in the UK but this also improves the economics. Most of all though, it's a great feeling to be using self-generated power both at home and in the car.
I live in Alabama. Our state is very unfriendly to solar sadly. I live in the country and my power is interrupted when the wind blows literally. I would love to have a power wall but it's just not in my budget so I had to come up with my own powerwall. I have a golf cart that has 8.4 kw of batteries so i purchased a 2500 watt pure sine wave 36 volt inverter from china with remote control for around $200. Also purchased a 30 amp automatic transfer switch for $75 and a small circuit breaker box for $15. Got some very thick wire, cant remember how thick, with plug in connecters that i can connect and disconnect my golf cart to the inverter. I have all this mounted on the wall in my garage where the golf cart is parked. I have a 20 amp circuit that comes from my outside box into my garage. It feeds into one side of the transfer switch and the inverter feeds into the other side of the transfer switch. The output of the transfer switch goes to the small circuit breaker box. I have a 15 amp circuit breaker in the box that is connected to my light in the garage. This light is on a circuit coming from the electrical box on the inside of the house. I basically just turned this circuit around. This is the same circuit that runs all my tv, satellite and computer and lights in my living room and luckily also feeds my tv in my bedroom. Where the circuit dead ends in the inside box, i put a interlock on the breaker so that it stayed off when the main breaker was on. So if the power goes off, I don't have to get out of my seat, i just push the button on the remote control for the inverter to turn on and it automatically changes over to the inverter power and feeds all my living room and more. If the power is going to be off for awhile, i go to the inside box and turn the main breaker off and also turn of any power hungry devices such as hot water heater and ac units and turn on the breaker to feed the box. I have all led lights and my refrigerator is very energy efficient so it all works very well and it's so nice not to have to deal with a loud generator outside. My next plans are to add solar panels and a controler and start leaving the inverter on to save electricity. So far i have less than $500 in this. I don't count the golf cart batteries because i already had them and it was something i was going to have anyway. And ps. I love your system and your so right, it is a good feeling knowing your not dependent on the power company so much!
Absolutely awesome video. Well done! I also have two of these and disconnected the grid entirely as I just love that awesome feeling of being self sufficient. And in Australia the monthly connection fee is an awful $50! You didn’t mention a fourth instance where batteries make sense from an economic point of view though.. in rural and remote areas the cost of installation of power lines can be easily upwards of $40k. I don’t know if it is like this elsewhere but we have to pay for the poles and the transformers. You could buy multiple powerwalls and be completely self sufficient for much less than the cost of the infrastructure to bring power to a rural lovarion, even one where powerlines are within half a mile or so.
I understand your feeling! When I drive my Volt for work and pay no gasoline. Gasoline is expensive here, about 3.41$/gal (US). Also, here in Quebec, the price of electricity per KWh is about 8.5¢, so going solar has no meaning except when we have a power outage. Thanks for the video.
As of today Sept 24, 2020 I live in So Cal and I dont have AC in the house as I live by the ocean and I use on average of 20.76 kWh a day and I live ALONE. Lat year I averaged 15.19 kWh/day. Where is this fing power goint to ... I dont know, maybe next door neighbor. Tier 1 is $0.11/kWh and tier 2 is $0.17 /kWh
My SunPower 3.35 kw solar PV system brings a smile to my face and being every morning while I enjoy a cup of coffee before work. Priceless. Next step is a Powerwall 2, small 500 watt wind turbine and electric vehicle.
For cost savings you also need to take into account when the Peak times are. For PGE in the SF Bay Area, the peak time is from 4:00PM to 9:00PM which is when you don't really produce much electricity. If you are running AC during the summer it can get really expensive. Being able to run off the battery during that time can save thousands a year.
Thanks for making this my most popular video to date! If you're here and just want the short answer basically, if you have solar and your state offers Net Energy Metering then financially it likely isn't a good investment. However, if you live somewhere with regular outages (such as in California these days) then it 100% makes sense for peace of mind. Sub for more soon, bye!
Or Florida where Hurricanes can be unpredictable. One year I was hit with Charley, Gene and Francis.
Ppu
Or live in Hawaii as I do and paid $600-$700 electricity bill as I did before getting powerwalls and TOU PV net metering which brought my payments to $25.
Hey Ben, thanks for taking the time to make this. Over here in Massachusetts there aren’t any peak times and low times. They just trade one hour for one hour it’s all the same. We are still looking at if this is worth it. Wondering about maintenance? Is there much? And if so, is it like $100 every time the guy comes out? Thanks
@@7511fsm wow!!!
Ran for three days off grid in Australia in December last year during a suburb wide blackout. Never lost power. Single Powerwall.
Keiran McManus No air conditioning?
*_priceless._*
metalhead4700 I cant remember but I suspect that the weather was mild enough that we didn’t have to. At least not when the sun wasn’t shining on the panels.
@@metalhead4700 obviously not....13.5kwh at best *.97 conversion leaves what 13kwh for 16 hours of effectively 0 zerolight a day? 800 watts per hour, not sure what you can run with that...all your lights tv and pcs. nothing mechanical
@@richardroberson9277 probably just a top loading fridge, super efficient! iPad with cell based internet for entertainment or since it's Australia must be a lot of things to do with friends and family away from home.
I just signed on my first home and it has paid solar with a power wall! I’m almost more excited about that than the home itself 😂
congratulations m8. The world needs all the help we can give. And if you watch the Australian 60 min - dok about black out, Expensive bill's and more. So sad to see how some Australian politicians behave!! Best of luck :0)
Stella Grace your home is going to bring you money, your Tesla is going to keep depreciating 😂
Anthony how does a home bring you money?
Hunter Wong by being smart
Homes cost money to maintain, and if any unfortunate thing happens it can cost you alot in repairs or high insurance rates for years, however you can cash out and get alot of your investment if you sell renters get zero return. However it is constant outflow of money dont get me started on the taxes. However if you can buy do it if you can't save so you can buy. M
I have had my PW2 for 3 years. I also have a solar. My annual net electricity bill each year is zero. I also use the PW2 and solar along with off-peak charging from my electricity vendor to provide the charge needed for both of our electric cars (Model 3 and Fiat 500e) to meet our daily driving needs. Which combined for my wife and I equal about 75 miles per day. Our life use case is taking full advantage and reaping the benefit of the Tesla PW2 and Solar. So far today I am 100% Self powered. Meaning I am only using electricity from my system.
Did your utility provider allow you to go off their service completely?
No. There are no options for off grid.
for how much? you say you use off peak charging for cars but then say its 100% self powered...why use the powerwall at all then if youre using grid as battery.
@@FiveInDrive no. this is not a thing. nobody would ever want to. 1 single cloudy day and your sol with your (1) count em (1) day of energy storage. not even like 12 hours
richard roberson of course that makes sense! Thanks Richard!
🤔 Don't even know why I'm watching this video.. I can't even afford rent 😅
It doesn't hurt to dream about it. Does it?
Getting aquainted with home economics and such is a good thing...you'll used it one day.
@Eddy Jin He bashed himself but that wasnt enough you had to shit on his face ..
I couldnt afford to watch this video 3:27 in what happened for the rest??
I’ve been there, now I own two homes. You’ll get there if you work for it!
We too have the PowerWall with our Solar. After the federal rebate and the SGIP rebate from SDG&E, the battery only cost us $2600 after all incentives. Our home runs by battery long after solar stops producing during the day and our home is about 87-90% off grid. SOOOO worth it!!
7 grand!!!! This won’t last that long
Walmart is suing the
Joselito Sosa seeing the what?
J/k
@@americanrroyalty ? are you saying Walmart want to bankrupt tesla? they ordered big rigs and probably just want tesla to fix clean up there mess.
why is it worth it though? you used the governments money to buy an overpriced (even by tesla standards) battery that will never pay off before it devalues far below its purchase price
The real hack is to have 3 Powerwalls, a wind turbine, water catchment, and self-filtration. Don't even connect to the mains.
Gordon Chaffin. Congratulations you are now a farm in 1905. Go milk a cow and cut some firewood.
@@STho205 So a farm in 1905 had air conditioning, internet, refrigerator(s), lighting, and didn't have to pay a monopoly for the power to run these things? What country was that farm in???
The Real c too. Yeah they had AC. They opened some windows and lived outdoors. The world was many, many degrees cooler then, haven't you heard. They only used lighting at night, not in broad daylight with drapes closed. So you're going to reach the internet without an ISP monopoly utility you have to pay. Fun. AC...what do you hate the environment??!!???. Go outside and milk a cow...make sure she doesn't fart.
If you want to be independent buy an island and interact with nobody...cept you have to buy all your stuff (and the island) from a monopoly with currency from the Federal Reserve Bank to be comfy and entertained. I hear there's a Mars flight leaving from Hawthorne, CA tonight.
@@STho205 Please be on that flight. The world will be immensely better.
The Real c too. Nah Rosey O'Donnel and Tom Arnold are going. It may not be the ship going to Mars.
Hello all!! I’m in Fl and have a 14.64kw system with 2 powerwalls. Where I live the power outages happen frequently. They average about once a week albeit for 5-8 min at a time. But that’s not the problem. Return on investment was not my primary concern for the powerwalls. I wanted piece of mind. I’ve been through several hurricanes and have gone a week without power. That was terrible and now have a family and it’s the best feeling in the world not having to worry about the power going out, ever!
I am also in FL, can you say approximately what your system cost here?
What if the hurricane blews your house over or cracks your solar panels??
@@tubester4567 then power wouldn't be the main concern???
@@tubester4567 In Florida, you are actually forbidden to use a solar panel system if the main power system is down. Stupid, but true.
@@shdwbnndbyyt Really?? I think thats probably a safety issue, because solar panels can feed back into the grid, and if powerlines are down, people could get electrocuted. You should be able to use stored battery power though.
I have solar and no powerwalls. My state has net metering, no time of use metering and very little power outages. So as neat as it would be it doesn't make financial sense for us. Great video Ben. Glad you discussed net metering because most have no clue about it.
“Buy power when it’s cheap, use battery when it’s expensive. And the battery is useful if you have blackouts all the time”
INSIGHTFUL STUFF
Yeah but to get a small battery installed can cost $10k and they last about 10 years so you pay about $1k per year for the ability to arbitrage your power rate a small amount. That said if your power goes out a lot it's probably worth it to be able to limp along off the grid.
We have three PW2s. Within a month of installation, we had a 8hr power outage. Everyone else lost power except us. That alone was worth it.
Really? Worth $14,000 just to have electricity for eight hours before the power from the grid was restored? That's a cost of nearly $2,000 an hour. I don't understand your economics.
Adam Thomson that’s a single instance. Over time there will be more outages and in that sense the ‘price per hour’ will decrease. Alongside that there are other benefits to solar (offsetting CO2 output of your household, selling your extra power back to the grid etc).
@@g4ngmemberash300 He said "that ALONE was worth it". I'm responding to what he wrote.
@@scrumpymanjack are you the same person in different accounts?
@@scrumpymanjack then you're completely missing the point of his comment lmao
Thanks, Ben, one of your best videos.
Love how your eyes just light up at the sight of all that data!
I’m glad you mentioned severe weather.
I’m in Florida and I think this system should be considered as an alternative to whole house generator backup.
i have two power walls with 11.4 pv system, recently as in march turned grid off and went 10 days off grid in fl
Steve Faulkner Wow. 10 days off grid is amazing.
@@stevefaulkner4678 My husband and I wondered if 2 would be enough here in FL
@@helenhuizenga9998 now that it is summer time with afternoon rain, i can do only three days with power modifications to reduce energy. i should have bought 3, it was half the price. the pv system doesn't produce as well as in the spring i am avg 50kw vs 60kw in the spring
in addtion if you have FPL you have the option of doing time of use where u can pay less for power because u use your pv and batteries during the day and use grid at night super cheap electricity
Love your videos. We have had solar and net metering for 8 years now. 53MWH so far and loving it. Tesla looks to be in our future as well. Neighbors have exactly what you have for Tesla products and they educate the rest of our neighborhood. Keep up the great work, you do make a difference. The more people learn, the better our world can be!
Similar here, though we are going to be getting a used Chevy Bolt or something like that.
We are in GA and since the power walls were installed with 23 solar panels we have had a total of 9 hours of power outages . We have not lost power since the installment. We have been pretty much self powered in the fall and spring with giving back to the grid. In the winter we also had a a much lower electric bill . Now , in the summer we are about 70 % self powered. Absolutely love the system. Planning on buying a solar water heater system.
8:04 The other good point about self powered is that the electricity will be smoothed out. No up and down peaks like the grid.
:
We've had 3 powerwalls for a little over a year. We added them to our existing solar PV system. We live in San Diego and have the EV-TOU-5 plan which gives us 9.3 cents/kwh at night and that 53 cents/kwh peak rate. We use the advanced feature so our two EVs charge of the grid at night. That may take 40 kwh, or about $4 (keep it simple). During the peak time we run off the batteries and send about 8 kwh to the grid, giving us that $4 credit to offset the 40 we used at night.
Since we can now download the data I took the time to go back for every day and download the data. I then ran it through some analysis to see how much the powerwalls are saving us by allowing us to shift when we use our solar vs sending to the grid. My basic assumption was if you take the home usage and minus the solar generated you'd get what the power company would see had you no powerwalls. I then ran that through the EV-TOU-5 pricing structure and compared to running what actually the power company reports. The powerwalls saved us around $760 for a year. My out of pocket expense for three powerwalls and installation was around $14000 so in their guaranteed life of ten years they won't pay for themselves. Had we more power outages there would be more cost savings because my solar wouldn't be dormant, it can still produce. Of course I guess that's not a money savings because no power at all is free -- but I don't have to throw away the contents of our freezer either.
If you want to chat about it sometime I can show you my data and analysis.
As a Floridian who lost power two years in a row to storms (for about 8 days total), this would be a game changer. Just wish I could afford it. I don't even have solar yet.
27kwh with solar could even power our energy hungry AC units for a conceivable period of time. Wouldn't that be nice?
$50 bucks a month for a small solar system from tesla. and cancel anytime with no fee unless you want the system removed. If tesla can make it that if customers don't want to pay and they can harvest the power and resell it. it will be a complete game-changer:) lol
Drive a Prius. Buy an inverter to keep a refrigerator, a small fan , some led lights etc. going. save on gass and cover the basics in an emergency.
@@N8TheSnake 16k to have ac for 8 days a year
if the power is out wouldnt you just be at home and if youre not at home why do you care about the ac.
seems like you could easily just plug in the massive 50kwh+ battery in the car
Just get a good gas generator.
The weather alert system is crucial for me being that I live in central Florida!! We have multiple storms a day and especially in the summer during hurricane season having a outage percentage is going to be extremely higher than normal. Glad you shared this data !
I can speak to this. I own a very large solar installation company that services SD, Orange, LA and Riverside counties as well as Phoenix, Tuscon and just now, last Vegas. Around 850 systems per month in total. We are brand agnostic and by that i mean we install solar and batteries both from and for companies such as Tesla, LG, Sunrun, SolarEdge, Enphase, Pika, Panasonic, sharp and sunpower.
In the areas i mentioned, it makes the most sense to use batteries IF you pull around 950 kWhs from your utility or more AND you have enough roof space to offset 120% or more of your bill with panels in California due to Time of Use billing. Vegas, tuscon don’t need it. Phoenix should if you have SRP as your utility but not APS.
As far as the SGIP credit (CA) you mentioned, use caution as that fund is limited and for FY2019 is already gone.
Lastly if you don’t have enough capacity to fill the battery or batteries in 2.5 hours or less, skip it. It won’t serve you well and it won’t last near as long. Good luck with your system!
Smarter Than You May I ask what company you own? Thanks!
Mile High V - Justin B. I sent you a message
"Lastly if you don’t have enough capacity to fill the battery or batteries in 2.5 hours or less, skip it." Why so?
@@inkooh8 because if you do NPT own a at least 7 to 8kw Peak system it does not make any sense!
A 8 or 9kw peak system means that at peak capavity aka maximum solar power output and optimal azimuth og the sun,it puts out 8 or 9kw an hour!
If you have this 14kwh tesla battery and are not able to fill it up in 2 or 3 hours - it is not worth it since the sun does not stand at highest point for much longer.
Also it varies a lot depending on your distance to the equator!
During winter time I for instance could only get 1 or 2kw on a cloudy winter day. Whereas I would get 50 or 60 kw a day easily with a 9kwp system in june or july!
What is the name of your company?? I would like a quote. I'm in Bakersfield. I have Vivint but PG&E is killing me!!
So 2 or 4 more battery for car charging. Very cool, i'm jealous. Workin hard to get there.
And once you have your Powerwall, that is where you store the family Joules
Tesla needs to use the car batteries as a backup for our home power supply systems. Hope they’re working on this.
That is already the case, isn't it?!
It is just that in europe regulations permit that... in the US you can use your tesla to power your home!
@@kniefi no
You mean those giant clusterf@cks of rechargeable power-tool battery cells by the thousands in a "battery pack"? Those "car batteries"? Better learn more about your Tesla products if you're unaware those "car batteries" are already used in your PowerWall(s).
They do. The PowerWall 2.
DEEREMEYER1 he probably means car should connect to the house and share it’s 60-70-80-90 kWh battery as a backup power
Just looked up Tesla roofing and found you, great quality, really nicely explained things to someone who is just looking up for first time, I love to see someone making something good for them and still making easier to understand for others, btw love the calmnes of your speech.
"Are they worth the money?", a question being answered by a person who got $14k worth of Powerwalls for free. Not saying his points become moot, but I'll always have a hard time taking things at full face value when the person didn't put any of their money on the line for something that costs 10s of thousands of dollars.
Exactly
I just signed a lease agreement with a Tesla system. I live in Puerto Rico where there’s not only multiple power outages weekly but several storms a year.
This review helps a lot. Looking forward to using the app.
Thanks
I'm in Puerto Rico and at the end of the 25 year lease you end up paying 3 times the cost. No thanks.
I want this at my house. Sad they aren’t available in Utah 😢
Definitely put solar panels on the beautiful house you're building, Dan, or at least on tall poles in your back yard. They make a great yard canopy, if you can't put them on your roof. I'd get a Powerwall, however, after installing my solar panels, and with my wind turbine, my power bill has been the connection fee of only: $10.30/mo., every month and we far overproduce so we have massive amounts of credits stored up that we never use. So even if I put a powerwall in, my bill would still be: $10.30/mo. But, I still want a Powerwall. :)
I know a guy that knows a guy...
Hi whats inside. Im a fan of Tesla and you
WHAT'S INSIDE? FAMILY I’m from Utah. I think this is all available in Utah. I just talked to my rep last week. But maybe I’m confused. What are you saying isn’t available?
all of Utah or just So Utah?
Ben, we lose power here in Northern California every time it rains! Just today over 14k homes lost power for 2 to 3 hours from a thunderstorm. This is the third power outage this year, and we haven't gotten into the real power outage season and fire season. So, I ordered Tesla solar power with 24 panels and 2 Powerwalls. I ordered last April. It will be installed next week!! (Late August) Can't wait!
Tesla cars have huge batteries built in. Seems like it would be beneficial to the “Tesla Ecosystem” to allow the Tesla to connect to the power wall directly and share it’s battery if it was needed. Does the Tesla charging port allow for power to go both ways? If it doesn’t, it should. Then you could “fill up” another stranded Tesla on the road that ran out of power, etc.
If a hurricane or snowstorm came through and took the power with it, the ability to connect an additional 75, 80, 90, 100 KWh battery to power the home seems like it would be beneficial.
Like others, I would also love to know your yearly power bill before vs after solar/power wall.
of course....these things are beyond stupid
you can buy a model 3 with 80kwh for what 40k? 500$/kwh and get a FREE CAR
these things are 500$/kwh installed and are near useless
in a hurricane you're either leaving. in said car
or not driving to work so the battery is free to use
protocol and laws dont allow car to back feed grid otherwise yes...its already there and cheap as hell and it would actually make money arbitraging power rates between night and day assuming you didnt need to drive it.
using a battery already in a car=smart
buying over priced battery that sits around doing nothing to power cycle a house = dumb
would love it too. the upcoming Big rig and Truck should have some options
@@tonytaing8173 off grid yes...every ev has it technically....the 12V output.
the s/x 3? at least have a 1500W inverter built in so yeah they could run a fridge no problem during a power outage and all your lights
not sure what on earth you're going to do with 5000W output on a 13.5KW battery that you cant do with 1500W output on a 75KWH+ battery...
i guess you could run your ac for 3/4 hours on 1 powerwall whatever use that is. any cooking etc would drain it crazy fast as it has the power but not the energy
You need a pretty robust dc to ac inverter. It would have to be proprietary to work well I think. Designed around a specific range of volts.
John W correct, just trying to explain that you need some serious equipment, not just the power supply which isn’t even the ac/dc charger (which is onboard the car).
We have a 5kW solar system at our house. Living on the coast of Maine, we lose power several times a year, frequently for three or four days at a time. Most people around us have generators, but we've got a wood stove and that helps. But we're seriously looking at getting two powerwalls. Thanks so much for this helpful video.
Over here in Puerto Rico we could definitely use more power walls with power outages being a pretty regular thing over here.
any old ev should be able to do this task. people dont usually work during power outages. just leave the car plugged in and free battery pack
Yes actually last I heard in 2018 supposedly they had about 11,000 renewable energy projects in Puerto Rico but mostly for few hospitals,schools, elderly homes but a lot of us never got a power wall and the power was out for us for more than 7 months. It was terrible and one of the main reasons I wish I could get one without having to go to a 3rd party because the authorize sellers for tesla gouging prices , musk apparently stopped sending to them but it hasn't stopped some over here from continuing. Furthermore as for getting an EV in Puerto Rico to use as a back up power also is rather difficult since it has to be shipped from Florida by a 3rd party also which adds to the price and wait time. I wish tesla would consider direct shipment to Puerto Rico like the rest of the USA but no so far not yet. We will be getting a service center at some point but no eta on it, all musk said about it was "Yes" and nothing else about it so far.
@@Allucardsin no market for it there sadly. if you can get your hands on an old leaf that thing even has a much larger battery than a powerwall and it can move and stuff.
the batteries are only lasting longer and longer
the model 3 pack could easily pay itself off energy shifting well within its expected lifetime and well below its replacement cost....the reason they dont want you to do it is safety and warranty issues
most tesla drivers never even use their battery
imagine using it 80% every single day.
@Marc Davidson horribly....it doesnt work...its one thing to build one thats zero emissions or very near.
its another to make it all electric + energy storage
you'd need alot of powerwalls for 1 day of storage....what about weather and 2+ days of little sun. far cheaper/easier to use diesel/conventional energy back up for the 1/2 times a year weather is horrible and just build enough storage to last 16 hours or between solar cycles
richard roberson there should be a market at some point it's just going slow at this time maybe in the next couple years lol I just don't want to wait awhile to get a model 3 , there is about 200 or so in the island. Musk did confirm he plans on bringing a service center here and possibly supercharging but he's not telling when, so until then only time will tell.
I know battery technology is going to get much better in the near future. Maybe it is best I wait.
Very happy with my single powerwall. Wish I had bought two or three of them. You are right, the main benefit is not economic, but mental. I have done a few simulated power outages, and the powerwall has worked flawlessly, kicking in almost instantly. If I conserve energy, I can basically live completely off the electric grid forever if necessary, recharging the powerwall with solar each day.
Thanks for the update. I have an order in for 3 of them and am second guessing the cost.
Mark Krieger what’s your ROI? will be more than the 10 year warranty which will be pointless
@@chefgav1 ROI is that you get a chance to keep your planet habitable and give the finger to the fossil fuel industry.
Personal energy independence is wonderful, so kudos to Mark for taking a leap into the future.
@1Energine1 ‘Virtue signalling’ is a cowardly term used by people who secretly worry that their beliefs and actions are unethical and don’t want you to make them feel bad by behaving differently.
@1Energine1 Seek help. You need counselling.
@1Energine1 Baseless attacks?
The fossil fuel industry is killing us. That is a fact with a list of evidence a mile long.
Personal energy independence is great. That is a fact.
Why are you so defensive? You work for the fossil fuel industry and want to do something better with your life instead?
Those that share my values don't accuse me of "virtue signalling".
Living in Hawaii, the struggle is real with the highest rates per kWh in the nation. I don't have PV/solar because I'm in a situation where I have about 4-5 years before I need to replace my roof. It would be ideal to install solar when I replace my roof. But you brought up an interesting idea about installing power walls without solar to take advantage of peak shaving / rate arbitrage. Maybe that's my first step to bridge the gap on installing solar/roof replacement.
Hey I have been planning to get into the Tesla eco system . This is very informative great channel !
sure fish, better alternative would be just to get back into the water
We just doubled our solar panels and a Powerwall or two is down the road. What a lot of people are missing is how beneficial solar is to everyone on the grid. S California used to have brownouts all the time. Now when the usage is highest - hot days with lots of A/C going during business hours - the distributed solar panels everywhere are performing at their max and sending power back into the grid. I feel good knowing that I'm helping the grid, helping the power company to NOT have to add more (coal or natural gas) power stations, and actually helping the community not to suffer through another brownout.
A cool feature would be an app switch to disconnect from the grid in thunderstorms.
Ben, we got solar and the power wall. We installed in our garage on the wall. We live in riverside county where temps are over 100 daily in the summer. With our A/C set at 76 and charging our model 3 our electricity bill was $10 for June, July, and August! Totally worth it, last year was $3-400+ a month
There is also another reason you could go for a powerwall + sun setup: To ensure than most of your energy is clean. Maybe it would cost you a bit more than doing just solar + credit from your provider, but by putting everything (or at least most) of your production inside the powerwalls, this would mean that you only take from the grid when you really don't have a choice, and ensure that most of what you use comes from clean energy. I think it's what I would do if I had a house, and the money.
I have solar (not Tesla), net metering, a PowerWall and a Tesla Model 3. The grid power is fairly stable. One thing I see as lacking is, i would like to be able to use my car’s battery as part of the PowerWall circuit.
Robert Gamble exactly. Your car is the equivalent of 5 or more powerwalls sat on your drive. It beggars belief that there isn’t the technology to do so.
When I saw Elon telling Joe Rogan we don’t even know what the cars are capable of, I wouldn’t doubt Tesla will reverse the current to the house if possible. I am no engineer but if it is theoretically possible, that makes things very interesting.
David Beppler what I’m saying is you cannot use the car battery to power the house in preference to from the grid (in the absence of solar). The fact that a lot of Tesla’s (at least in the UK) have free supercharging forever means it’s not in Tesla’s interest to enable car to home power as then Tesla owners would simply need to fill up at the Supercharger and come home to run the house from the car for free.
Richard Cordova agreed, but the issue of free supercharging would need to be resolved as otherwise owners would potentially charge for free at the Supercharger and then bring the car home to run the house (for free) from it. I suspect this is the biggest barrier why this possibility has not been enabled yet.
@@davidbeppler3032 I'm in a similar situation. I just want a smart charger that charges my car when I'm producing extra solar power and tapers back when my AC kicks in, or clothes drier is running. Also, tapers off when the afternoon thundershower kicks in. Basically, a smart charger that uses any excess power we make with our PV system to charge the cars, and not use grid power. There is one available in Europe called the Zappi, but they won't sell to the US.
Very informative. I have owned a PV system (solar) with battery back up for more than 10 years in FL. There is another great advantage as you have mentioned with FL being prone to power outages due to storms (hurricanes) in that you do not need to purchase a generator for power outages. The generator is costly to install and maintain. The solar system pays its self back every day the sun comes out and the federal government paid for 30% of the entire cost including the batteries. There is no payback on the generator, only upfront costs and yearly maintenance. Thanks for your interesting and informative U tube site.
Tesla: Shares with you the data
Every other company: Hold up.
Well the main complaint about other companies is that the share the data with someone else or use it to sell you something. Let’s wait and see what Tesla will do with our data in the future.
I stay on the eastern coast and I find it priceless to have the ability to subsidize my power usage and store back-up power in the event of a power outage. I've had my solar panels and power walls for over 3 years and my power bill has gone from an average of $200 to $5.
Ben, great video, I am more than ever considering purchasing a power wall, mainly for the ability to use stored power during peak rate times here in Ca.
Usable Energy 13.5 kWh max size a powerall 2 , useless power say 2 tesla s 100 kwh battery 200 plus house used 25 kwh a day need total 225 kwh of powerwalls 2 , 16 batterys. cost of say 113 k . alot money , have long way to go on powerwalls need too hold say 100 kwh each one .
i wait for powerwall 3 haved 28kWh battery (~26kWh usable capacity)l only need 8 , still be short of need 100 kwh per powerwall need. get too 100 kwh in powerwall 5 if were lucky ?
@@hillbillyintheasia6122 Amen brother.
In Puerto Rico it make sense to have it 100%. I just bought a PW system to my mom who's living in PR and I can't describe how much piece is bringing to her life by not worrying about power outage not to mention hurricanes.
One thing you didn't comment on the storm watch and why it's important, (maybe you didn't know about it) is that the grid will NOT charge your battery at all unless there's a storm coming. So on regular settings. The battery is ONLY being charged by the sun. So if you look at your settings, everything revolves around saving storage on the battery because the Grid will not charge the battery unless there's a storm.
So for Backup Only, Sun charged the battery to the max, battery is only used during outage.
Self-powered, sun charged the battery with remaining power after power your home, then use battery at night till it hits a power reserve limit, then it will use grid till sun comes up. for this to work, your solar panel must output much much more than your home usage so it can charge the battery in time before sunset, if not, your batteries won't be fully charged for the night. That means, you'll constantly be using the grid and solar while battery only help very little.
Pw2 absolutely will recharge from grid. We use this feature frequently. After dark, just raise the reserve level above the state of charge, Pw2 will begin charging from grid at 1.7kW.
Better to feed the grid during peak time if possible (even from the battery) to get the highest payback. Then recharge the battery with cheap off-peak grid power. 😉
Just found this video and I am strongly considering getting two power walls for my house in FL. Thanks for explaining this in laymen’s terms. Well done.
I love your channel but I wish you pulled more data like what you pay per month with and without solar/battery . Value of the sole and storage after 20 years, etc. You need to honor your channels name! :)
PD: I own 2 Tesla’s, I have solar panel but no powerwall yet. I want to know your numbers more in depth in the future :)
RonPaulgirls she can’t find his bill wtf
It likely doesn't make any financial sense, that's why.
Give him a year.
@@Avalanche2 it can depending on how much power u use, if you never use AC and can live off a AA battery than no sense, what so ever.
But if your house have lots of peeps active at home in the daytime and the AC running all day and you have a few electric cars, than that can be a positive investment.
But the most important is as a backup when your power goes out, and as a huge UPS.
Depends on your circumstances.
If you are out of the house 8h+/day & have a 15c/kWh rate, it's probably not worth having a battery. Get a big solar array & defray your bills with feed-in tariffs.
If you're retired or stay-at-home parents & have 30+c/kWh rates, it's a no brainer. A 6-7.5kW PV array, Fronius 8.2kW grid feed inverter & a Pw2 will give 100% RoI in about 6 years. That's my situation in eastern Australia. Power bill has dropped from $3700/yr to $350. Now never have power outages, either.
Ben, I am seriously considering purchasing the Powerwall. Have a Sunpower 29 panel system about 1.5 year old. Researching this now. Thanks for the video. Well done.
Great video, very interesting to see the difference between the setup in the US versus Australia.
I am English, just taken possession of an Electric Vehicle, I am interested in Solar but know very little yet, this Video is Awesome. Thank you.
Had one for over two years, never use grid, all self powered.. I have an ev and winter charge it for free at a university that has 7,000 plus solar panels. No bills , just cheques from feed in. Best thing I've ever bought.
Hey Ben, if you want to charge the car off grid then plug it in and charge at lowest amperage basically like charging from a 110 outlet when solar is most active. Your car will charge and so will the powerwall Plus it won't overwhelm the Powerwalls at the same time I believe the max output from both PW is 10 kWh.
Wow the timing of this video on my feed couldn't have been more useful as I sit here alone in my house with no electricity and a single extension cord running to my fridge connected to a generator outside my kitchen screaming away at me for hours on end as I sit here and wait for power to be restored. Or death. At this point I don't care anymore.
Well i hope you did't die..........
Thanks for the insights into Powerwall sensibilities for those viewers who are wondering. Your reporting confirmed exactly what I figured about whether or not it made sense for me to get a Powerwall and that is - it did not. I was only considering the case for backup power and now thanks to you I know I would be better off going in a different direction.
My Powerwall and solar are going in right now!!
Australian here, we currently have a 5.4kw solar system installed and at the end of May we are adding 1.2kw to the solar system to bring it up to 6.6kw. When we had the initial system installed 2 years ago our quarterly power bills went from $300-$450 a quarter to $80-$150. Hopefully the additional panels will reduce that even further. On top of the additional panels we are installing a PW2 as well, fingers crossed with the additional panels plus the PW2 we should have our bills reduced to zero if not a credit.
In Texas our old energy plan before solar system was free power 8pm to 6am. You could have a bill of 0$ with maybe 3 or 4 powerwalls.
Martialman.45 my house in Houston is $.04 /kw for any amount, any time
Meanwhile in San Diego I pay WAAAAAAY more. It’s insane how expensive it is in San Diego. Downright criminal.
@@codycast generally in Houston you need to pay Centerpoint a .04 delivery fee too along with others. It's not as cheap as it seems. In Baytown our old old plan was about 10 cents per kwh total with a 1$ fee per month. Current plan is .139$ with 1 to 1 net metering so we make 200-250$ per month with solar.
My cousin has NEC Retail with the free nights and weekends plan. His wife bought a 2019 Chevy Bolt a few months ago and only charges is it between 8pm and 6am.
Thanks for the video. We have had our Powerwall 2 for 3 weeks now and its great. We are in New Zealand and we get a lot of sun. We had a 3.99 KWp system for a start off and it was good but I could see the benefit of a battery added. So we put another 8 panels on taking us up to 22 panels or 6.55 KWp. Our inverter is a 5 KW solar edge HD inverter which allows for oversizing of panels up to 135% without voiding the warranty. This means we can get up to 5 KW solidly during peak sun filling the powerwall 2 up quickly. With a bit of discipline only using heavy use items during the day we can virtually stay offgrid onSolar and Battery for 24hrs. We are actually just going into our second week of doing this now without drawing from the grid at all and exporting out to the grid once the powerwall is full. Everything is expensive to buy here in NZ though. The powerwall only cost $16,800 NZD installed. So with the Solar System plus the powerwall 2 we have spent $32,000 NZD. There are no solar subsidies here in NZ yet either.
Only $10/month in CA for fixed fees? I wish... Here in Australia I have to pay AU$1.05 / DAY ! Yes, that's AU$31.50/ month (US$21.50) so basically double :-( 1 Powerwall 2 is AU$11k + installation making it a very expensive option compared to some others - but no-one makes a better app than Tesla.
An excellent presentation Ben. I’m in Québec which is a place unto itself. All the electricity is from hydro, ( a renewable source ) it has to be the lowest price per kilowatt in the American continent, north and south, we don’t have peak periods, it’s 6c low usage and 9c over a certain volume, that’s Canadian dollars,and yet during storms where I live it can be an unreliable supply. Solar is hard work during the snowy winter, and the days are short. Having powerwalls does not make economical sense but they would give me independence’s and a "peace of mind".
Victor Seal $0.027/kWh all day long here in hydro-powered central WA.
WA, Australia or US ? We are very fortunate to have a lot of rivers and lakes, I think Canada itself has somewhere near 15% of all the fresh water in the world ! On the other hand......long, and I mean long winters.
Any thoughts or insights on possible Vehicle to Home/Grid (V2G) application from Tesla. With a fleet of cars that drag around 75 or 100 kWh batteries, it would seem like a logical next step to be able to use a Tesla vehicle to power your home (or at least feed power into a Powerwall to conserve the cars battery chemistry). I imagine there are issues with battery life and resiliency of these expensive cars when it comes to V2G, but it seems like a worthwhile way to utilize a battery that is probably parked 95% of the time. I see a potential to drive a car to work, charge up on excess solar/renewables during the day, then drive home fully charged and use that power to run the house, all with a smart grid that can regulate when power is needed or stored, and compensate those who make their batteries available for distributed power supply. Would love to see Tesla lead on distributed supply. Thanks.
Yes. Only Nissan supports this mode of use so far. Mostly because Chademo was always designed as a bidirectional protocol, whilst the Tesla and CCS specs weren't. It's a pity that the unidirectional charging specs have been more popular in the market because now the vast majority of EVs just can't do this. You would expect Tesla to have been a bit smarter on this (but they've generally been against this type of usage due to worry about battery wear). Premature to make it impossible though IMHO (maybe the Tesla spec could actually do this - they just choose not to?)
I have solar and two powerwalls. ! 1) I haven't paid for electricity since September when I got the final approve from the Norman city inspectors. 2). we have had 5 major power outage and with the exception doing power control (using less than .6kw ). we have not been effected by power outage. 3). during the major artic blst we got hit with. we were charged $64 for that month of power. where our neighbors got $1000-$2300 bills that month. Thank you solar and Tesla powerwalls.
Thanks for the video! Suggestion: don't use "basically" so often.
Thanks Ben. I went to the Tesla web site and found a different estimate for backup by a single battery of 3 days. The concept I have is overbilding and feeding the system with my panels while I run the home off the batter(ies) and making 23cents a kWh credit.
I’d be curious to know how these systems increase your property value as well. If you decide to sell in the future, the breakeven point my be a lot shorter than just based off power usage
@Cass Johnson 10 years is the warranty expiration, not the technical expiration
I'm in Jersey. I have it and I love it! After Hurricane Isiaias, my neighborhood went 3 full days with no power and my house was perfectly normal. The lowest my powerwall went down to was 30% and then the sun simply recharged it in the morning. There is a 16k federal tax rebate that's being phased out so take advantage quickly. Also in New Jersey, 1 mega watt of power is worth about 230 bucks. You can actually sell your Srecs! So in Jersey, the system literally pays for itself!
I'm a poor and can't afford this but I'm doing a DIY powerwall based on (your mate) jehu's PCB, it's a lot of work but can be done for under $1k.
IF ONLY, you could channel all that effort into making money...I'M POOR is a mindset :)
adsas asdasd very true brother!
@@aaronc8571 it's largely a birthright.
WhoRu all I here is a list of excuses
@@Mistery7777 it's like how healthy people go work at co-ops then preach about the stuff there making them healthy as if they were ever fat in the first place. Or people who have never been depressed and don't have the depression predisposition gene they've discovered telling you what you need to do to stop being depressed. Again, they never were and what they're saying is largely worthless.
I LOVE that power use gauge/monitor! My 2019 Honda Insight has a gauge like that that tells me how the car is using the energy from the engine and batteries. Good shit!
I love your hammy thumbnail. "Hmm, this corner will surely reveal its secrets to me!"
Great video Ben. One thing - net metering isn’t an issue If you have a big electric bill. It never goes back, you use all the sun has to offer. So I have a 7kw propane generator I am using now on a critical circuit sub panel. Ordered a power wall and 6kw solar from Tesla. If the grid dies I can run off the battery and charge with solar or flip to the generator to charge the batteries. I could hang out for two weeks or more with no grid or sun. Can also plug my car 220v 30 amps into the 7kw propane. So the powerwall is an awesome micro grid and backup, so worth it for safety and power!
Thanks for explaining this so well. Really helps in my decision making!
You are a WEALTH of actually USABLE information! Thank you for persistence.
Do an update after 1 year, 5 year, 10 year ect
I thought about solar which I know is expensive, and in a new house voids warranty, need to wait a decade on that. I liked the generac emergency generator which has problems, that can be overcome, for when power goes off, this sounds like a great alternative to both. Musk guy is a genius.
“28 kilowatts is a snack”...love it.
problem is need 1millon mile battery help alot used mobile for battery
Australian here, I had a 5.4kw solar system installed about 2 years ago and my average monthly bills went from an average of $400-$500 a 1/4 to about $150-$250 a 1/4. A few days ago (20 May 20) I added an extra 1.2kw added to our solar system bringing it to 6.6kw system, we also installed a Tesla Powerwall 2. I'm hoping with the extra 1.2kw's we have installed plus the PW2 we should either nil electricity bills from now on or maybe even a credit.
They should make a box that plugs in to tesla and converts tesla to powerwall
I'm not sure, but Tesla's charging connector may be capable of V2G -- vehicle to grid -- which turns the car's battery into a big powerwall/backup where the battery can charge and discharge via the connector. ChaDeMo can do it. And I think a future CCS standard could do it.
Gordon Chaffin It cannot. Only Chademo is currently capable of V2G. CCS is aiming for 2025. Elon Musk announced last year that Tesla may revisit V2G but they have no publicly announced plans a year later.
Well contactor used for supercharging could be switched on and it would provide power to a inverter trough the connector
Barut Tech That would solve V2H but not V2G. V2G must communicate with the CAN buss in the car and turn on and off as required. Also Tesla must agree to warrant it’s batteries for this process. Not saying it can’t be done - Tesla already communicates with the car during supercharging, but they have to implement it and agree to honour the battery warranty. It’s something that only they can do. As is closing the contactor.
I recently upgraded my solar system to 6.2kwh, with NEM it covers for all my usage and lands me on the credit side against my utility company. I'm trying to take advantage of the PSPS CA rebates to cover for all of my Tesla power wall expenses. Can't wait to get the power wall 2s installed.
Solar and power wall is a must get for any home . Period.
Great video, thanks! Here in Northern California we have Pacific Gas and Electric who doesn’t purchase power back from customers anymore. So all power generated over what you utilize is gone unless you can store it on site.
my powerbill is about 35$ a month.. Yeah Solar would never pay for itself where i am, freaking cool though
Aaron It would if you can sell the surplus. Solar is viable even in the U.K, we have a couple of million homes installed so far, not bad for a tiny island.
You covered a lot of data pretty quickly, great job. It seems like power companies could(?) go the way of land line telephone companies within the next couple decades. However, most Americans on average would struggle currently with that initial cost of the Powerwall 2 system (even with the 30% government tax break) without yet another monthly payment. For the few that can afford a cash purchase it's well worth it. I believe once we can get systems like the Powerwall 2 capabilities under $3000 most people will start to consider this as a gotta have purchase.
8:23 It may start to make more sense depending on what SDG&E does.
As an alternative to Powerall is a generator. We have 16.5 solar grid (60 panels) and a 10 kw propane generator. Cost 15 years ago was < $5k. Have separate sub panel to provide “essential circuits”. Works well.
I agree with every benefit you site. However, there’s a fatal flaw imo. The system is bricked if it loses Internet for 24-36 hours. One of the biggest reasons I’d want solar is to have power during a MAJOR crisis. It is unconscionable for Tesla to integrate so fragile of a kill switch. Mark my words.
Is this true?
Great video. You are the first person to say that Net metering and Tesla Powerwall makes no sense. A Powerwall for emergency power still makes no sense to me when you can buy a really nice generator and a whole house transfer switch and power your entire house until power returns (not just 3 days) . I have solar with net metering and a whole house generator for backup power in emergency situations. Any unused solar power is sent back to the grid and used at a later date/time. Most solar systems are built to zero out your electric bill. Powerwalls may be pretty and very informative but probably not for everyone. Thanks for the video.
That bass on the intro music was dope bro
I am an energy researcher and have been monitoring several Tesla Powerwalls for a while. This is a very helpful and thorough analysis but I would like to add some more insights.
The best case scenario is to fully charge and discharge your battery everyday so that you make the best out of it. For an average electricity price of 0.15$/kWh you will get a payback of 10 years as 3650 cycles would save you approximately $7000. In the real world your PV will not generate everyday an excess for a full charge, your house demand will not always be as much as 13.5kWh from sunset to next day's sunrise and also the battery, especially when installed outside, is not 90% efficient as claimed but 70%-80%.
A nice trick would be to use the grid for scheduling when you have access to variable tariffs; for example, charge your battery over the night and use it during the day. If your day import - night import deal is better than 0.15$/kWh and the battery is used daily for a full charge and discharge, you will get a better return that the 10 years.
The combination of the above 2 would increase your benefits; however, currently the Powerwall 2 cannot combine charging from the grid and from your PV as these two modes are not working together. Also there is a maximum charge and discharge power at 5kW meaning that if you have a big PV , the charging power will be limited to 5kW and the rest will be exported. What is more important is that during discharge the battery can only handle simultaneous loads up to 5kW.
Bottom line: TESLA Powerwall 2 is really cool and the monitoring is neat but it is not cost effective unless: you receive a generous subsidy or electricity price gets mad or you have an amazingly suitable time-of-use tariff deal, or you need a power-cut UPS frequently.
I really want it, i have been looking at Tesla tiles recently. I'm in the UK London
I wouldn't consider the Tesla tiles; they are much less efficient and way more expensive than modern PV panels (if you could even get them).
I'm north of London and have a 7.5kW PV system and a Powerwall 2. It works superbly but it's the PW2 that really makes the most of the solar. Over the year we are averaging 89% self-powered (62% solar, 27% PW). From about April to November it's approx 100% and the battery is full every day and does not completely discharge. Only in the depths of winter where it's really dark and there are consecutive cloudy days does the PW2 become completely discharged and we go over to grid.
On installation we estimated 16 years break-even but we are sending a lot of spare power to the grid in summer (generating 30+ kWh on a really sunny day) and by using this in an EV we can get this down to around 6 years with fuel-cost savings. We also get feed-in tariff government subsidies which has now ended in the UK but this also improves the economics. Most of all though, it's a great feeling to be using self-generated power both at home and in the car.
@@alanwatt223 there's sunny days I'm London?
I live in Alabama. Our state is very unfriendly to solar sadly. I live in the country and my power is interrupted when the wind blows literally. I would love to have a power wall but it's just not in my budget so I had to come up with my own powerwall. I have a golf cart that has 8.4 kw of batteries so i purchased a 2500 watt pure sine wave 36 volt inverter from china with remote control for around $200. Also purchased a 30 amp automatic transfer switch for $75 and a small circuit breaker box for $15. Got some very thick wire, cant remember how thick, with plug in connecters that i can connect and disconnect my golf cart to the inverter. I have all this mounted on the wall in my garage where the golf cart is parked. I have a 20 amp circuit that comes from my outside box into my garage. It feeds into one side of the transfer switch and the inverter feeds into the other side of the transfer switch. The output of the transfer switch goes to the small circuit breaker box. I have a 15 amp circuit breaker in the box that is connected to my light in the garage. This light is on a circuit coming from the electrical box on the inside of the house. I basically just turned this circuit around. This is the same circuit that runs all my tv, satellite and computer and lights in my living room and luckily also feeds my tv in my bedroom. Where the circuit dead ends in the inside box, i put a interlock on the breaker so that it stayed off when the main breaker was on. So if the power goes off, I don't have to get out of my seat, i just push the button on the remote control for the inverter to turn on and it automatically changes over to the inverter power and feeds all my living room and more. If the power is going to be off for awhile, i go to the inside box and turn the main breaker off and also turn of any power hungry devices such as hot water heater and ac units and turn on the breaker to feed the box. I have all led lights and my refrigerator is very energy efficient so it all works very well and it's so nice not to have to deal with a loud generator outside. My next plans are to add solar panels and a controler and start leaving the inverter on to save electricity. So far i have less than $500 in this. I don't count the golf cart batteries because i already had them and it was something i was going to have anyway. And ps. I love your system and your so right, it is a good feeling knowing your not dependent on the power company so much!
jonathan crump i liked without reading it all
this is a very well done video
Absolutely awesome video. Well done! I also have two of these and disconnected the grid entirely as I just love that awesome feeling of being self sufficient. And in Australia the monthly connection fee is an awful $50!
You didn’t mention a fourth instance where batteries make sense from an economic point of view though.. in rural and remote areas the cost of installation of power lines can be easily upwards of $40k. I don’t know if it is like this elsewhere but we have to pay for the poles and the transformers. You could buy multiple powerwalls and be completely self sufficient for much less than the cost of the infrastructure to bring power to a rural lovarion, even one where powerlines are within half a mile or so.
I don’t understand what you’re saying but I know I want one ..
I understand your feeling! When I drive my Volt for work and pay no gasoline. Gasoline is expensive here, about 3.41$/gal (US). Also, here in Quebec, the price of electricity per KWh is about 8.5¢, so going solar has no meaning except when we have a power outage. Thanks for the video.
WHAT!!! 28kw a day!!! what are you guys doing with all of that power damn…. i use only 7kw a day sometimes less my total use in a year is 2500kw
bareld nijboer Aircon and electric water heating probably. Typical US.
As of today Sept 24, 2020 I live in So Cal and I dont have AC in the house as I live by the ocean and I use on average of 20.76 kWh a day and I live ALONE. Lat year I averaged 15.19 kWh/day. Where is this fing power goint to ... I dont know, maybe next door neighbor.
Tier 1 is $0.11/kWh and tier 2 is $0.17 /kWh
I LOVE the silent guitar at your back 😊😊
And after all.... you’re my powerwall...
oasis
My SunPower 3.35 kw solar PV system brings a smile to my face and being every morning while I enjoy a cup of coffee before work. Priceless. Next step is a Powerwall 2, small 500 watt wind turbine and electric vehicle.
So at what year do you break even with this investment? Will you come out ahead.
It takes about 20 years for solar anything to make business sense. The only reason to get solar is still that solar makes your farts smell nice.
For cost savings you also need to take into account when the Peak times are. For PGE in the SF Bay Area, the peak time is from 4:00PM to 9:00PM which is when you don't really produce much electricity. If you are running AC during the summer it can get really expensive. Being able to run off the battery during that time can save thousands a year.