12:50 “Overall the energy storage market is predicted to attract over $620 million in investments by 2040”. Seriously? That’s an extremely low forecast. Could have been a mistake and they meant billions though. Edit: CNBC has commented below and clarified it was an error and they meant billions not millions. Good on them for doing that.
Never ever be able to replace fossil fuels. Not enough power!! Never ever will there be enough power other than fossil fuels!!!! No matter how you manipulate the words!!!
Hammer Ology your perspective is based on technologies available today and not what’s going to be available tomorrow. Your comment is very short-sighted. I’m glad you’re not a person of influence.
Joshua T you should try drinking some of your own koolaid, as your comment was far more ‘smug’ & aggressive than mine. Thanks for your 2 cents tho. When I feel I need a life coach, I’ll be sure to reach out.
Problem would be, that the sun isnt shining in all directions at the same time, so you would loose at least half of the energy you could potentialy produce using normal solar panels that trace the sun.
Pumped hydro is one of the most efficient for long-term storage. Usually 80-90% efficiency. But the environmental toll can be large, if we can find good spaces for them (like mountains with low populations) this could be big for this tech.
One aspect not mentioned here is integration of the grid over long distances. Even if the sun doesn't shine and the wind doesn't blow here, there are other places where they will. If you can distribute electricity over long distances, that also dampens the peaks and troughs, reducing the need for storage. This process is already ongoing in Europe.
Yeah and what about when it's dark, and the wind is only blowing a little bit in a few countries, but all of Europe needs a lot of energy? Where do you get your baseload energy?
@@richardnixon7248 I understand that several countries are working on large-scale storage solutions that can be used seasonally. It would also make sense to do studies on energy reliability for different sized electrical grids and I bet that's already ongoing. And note that existing fossil energy solutions have their problems too. Just think of the European natural gas situation right now. We will never have a perfect system, what you need to do is compare future options against the existing situation.
In my wildest dream, I've picture what you said into a huge solar/wind system expanding the whole Euroasia continent from Qingdao to Lisbon. It (only) covers 10-hour timezone, maybe not perfect but would be the longest possible. I guess that would need huge international corporation.
@@jasonstevenson110 I'm rather surprised that you say that, since here in Europe, we have an international grid already, so I don't really see where the actual costs would come from. I assume that the US already has a national grid as well.
About 10 years ago I was basing my university level student projects on the development of a FESS for use in the third world. My brief was that it must require minimal maintenance, it must have high energy density, it should be used for decades - even centuries with no loss of storage capacity or efficiency and it must be totally sustainable, require abundant and cheap materials and totally un-toxic to the planet - a challenging brief which only the FESS designs (or mechanical gravity based) designs come anywhere close to fulfilling. Over several years of development, we decided that it was much better to go for low angular velocity (
Hello Richard. I did not find you, but could you if your offer still stands write me on Linkedin :) ? I am writing a thesis and would like to have a look
This panel can put out close to 100 watts ruclips.net/user/postUgkxOqI2yqX0XVrhR2BMJciTWrHJpG8FhJyg when positioned in the appropriate southernly direction, tilted to the optimal angle for your latitude/date, and connected to a higher capacity device than a 500. The built in kickstand angle is a fixed at 50 degrees. Up to 20% more power can be output by selecting the actual date and latitude optimal angle.The 500 will only input 3.5A maximum at 18 volts for 63 watts. Some of the excess power from the panel can be fed into a USB battery bank, charged directly from the panel while also charging a 500. This will allow you to harvest as much as 63 + 15 = 78 watts.If this panel is used to charge a larger device, such as the power station, then its full output potential can be realized.
I have also heard of molten salt as an option. I love the idea of two lakes at an incline to each other. Solar can be used to pump water uphill. Also, rain water can be harvested to fill the ponds.
This is what I love about the United States of America! A country that takes the lead in innovative research. I hope this technology becomes cheaper in near future. It will indeed free my country from the incessant power failures and poor energy infrastructure. Thank you America. More power to the scientist.
The crane energy storage solution has been debunked multiple times. The math just doesn't add up. That's why it's only an animation, and not a real product.
I liked it. It is less dangerous than a high rise, since it isn't hollow. My only problem is why? We only have 2% green energy. They keep pretending we have all this energy to store. Harnessing energy still isn't that easy.
Considering that cranes cannot operate in heavy winds, it's pretty dull to depend on energy storage that cannot operate in heavy winds other than to complement wind farms...
Good point. Unless you are talking a solar farm in an arid area. I would use an enclosed structure and blocks within. Water would be a possible hazard if container broke. On top of the container could be the solar or wind to power the internal crane.
There's a reason why none of these alternative storage technologies have managed to displace lithium-ion battery: they all have some sort of tradeoff. In this video, flow batteries are said to be "Cost-competitive" with lithium-ion. In other words, they cost the same over the long term. If their lifespan is longer than lithium-ion, then that means a much higher up-front cost. But look at their density: ESS needs a whole shipping container just to store 400 kWh, many times more space than is required by lithium-ion solutions. In other words, it costs the same, but is worse. In order for alternative power storage to succeed, it is not enough to merely be as good, or as cheap. It must either be better, or cheaper, or both. None of the alternatives in this video have demonstrated that so far.
If electrons move through graphene like massless particles, this implies no energy loss through heat and the potential for a VERY long storage. Obviously, the most efficient battery conceivable would have this property. By twisting a long sheet of graphene densely into a cylinder-shape and isolating the edges well, you'd pretty much have the perfect battery, made out of pure carbon. It's just a matter of how long it takes to come up with a cost efficient graphene technology.
Any legitimate analysis would include the ultimate costs of dealing with the toxic battery components once they lose production capacity and are tossed.
This is not anything like analysis, they just listed random projects, and the part they shown is only a small part of larger problem, there are solutions to ups and downs in production in getting a source of energy which can be started anytime - like water dams, or gas power plants. This source then complements for the weaknesses of solar or wind, much cheaper than anything else.
@@rollerskdude If you toss away lithium battery we run out of it. Lithium is not easy to extract sinc eit is quite soluble in any form, once it gets disolved in seawater it is lost to us forever.
When this is scaled up and enough waste volume is being produced it becomes economically very viable to recyle the materials to build new things instead of mining.
@@Pyrochemik007 Nope. Any claims that we are short on lithium are false or a sign that a person doesn't know what they are talking about. We can in fact extract it easily from seawater too, all that takes is energy, and if we don't have enough batteries for storage, then we obviously have lots of free solar and wind power just asking to be used.
@just another human "no"? - How do you know? Let's atleast admit that we don't have a clue about how "hidden energy fields" work. As for now every single energy source humans have used have lead to environmental problems. I however believe in new reactors using nuclear waste as a primary energy source, in order to get rid of as much long lived waste as possible. In the longer run fusion mught be the best solution. It's better, but not totally "clean". To build machines that could harvest the energy from hidden energy fields might cost alot of money. In comparison; if nuclear fuel was free, it would only lower the cost of nuclear power with 10% or so.
The most difficult task for energy storage technology is to overcome the influence on bureaucrats of the vested interests in existing electrical energy utilities. Even if an energy storage solution is better for the consumer, powerful lobbies to maintain the status quo will be hard to overcome.
I'm surprised I didn't see any credits. Are they technically allowed to use your short clips like this without credit? I do see a lot of RUclipsrs using other RUclipsrs content.
“Hydrogen Storage” The video was beautifully made and informative. The only thing is that you forgot the hydrogen generation and storage as one of the biggest changes that will probably happen.
Amin R, things have changed in hydrogen storage and high pressure (15000 psi)carbon fiber tanks are now able to be replaced with low pressure tanks more in line with scuba tanks for the same mass in hydrogen. Stay tuned and be watching the progress in energy storage using hydrogen
Another thing missed, is flywheel inertial energy storage. Hydrogen energy storage isn't nearly as efficient as batteries are, or flywheels are likely to be. I don't dismiss it, I'm sure the efficiency will improve. The fact is, no ONE technology could do it alone. We need so much energy storage, that we will need all forms of energy storage. Nothing's off the table!
Pump hydro is all but reliable tech, granted. However, it's not as efficient as the stirage that will be needed in 2040 and beyond. The inefficiency comes from the cost. Its exoensive to build by MWh and expensive to run if you're buying electricity to oumo back up hill, even if you buy excess generation cheaply. It takes mote energy up to the top reservoir than it generates when water is released towards tha bottom resevoir. That makes the electricity generated more expensive than other sources. The only way hydrology generation is efficient and cheap is when you dam a strong running river and release water constantly. The generation virtually runs itself. A great example of that is URUGUAY. Most if their energy is hydro. One of tge cleanest countries on Earth when it comes to electricity. Emission per capita in Uruguay are 1.9 tons Australia and the USA are hovering at ovet 20 tons per person.
Always important to keep in mind lifecycle and raw material requirement. How long do solar panels last before degradation? How much steel has to be smelted to create a windmill? How much concrete has to be poured to create the base? Look at the NET product, not just at the end. Likewise, I hope the energy storage methods are environmentally friendly and low resource production cost.
For me which I have Wind Water Solar power , it off grid and I just don’t want company interference government interference. I have propane generator back up as well I’m free not doomed to the will of someone else . Going green is crazy we just swap what we want to destroy. Everyone just pics what poison they want . Everyone just needs there own power not governments
So do pipelines. So do nuclear power plants etc. The iron salt water one in a transport truck is a very easy scale. Water related storage through lakes has always provided beauty even with large scale. Providing safe & renewal storage is important but we need to keep understanding its about improving on other systems, spills, fires, cost etc.
Solar panels are typically guaranteed at about 80-90% efficiency after 20 years. Recycling is possible but the industry for it is still developing as far as I know.
Pumped hydro is still the name of the game. In my country (Bulgaria) there is one of these systems (which BTW might be the largest in Eastern Europe), consisting of numerous facilities having a total installed capacity of 864 MW. This pumped storage hydro power system can partially ballance the only Bulgarian nuclear power plant which has 2 units with a total capacity of over 2000 MW... In Wikipedia there is an article about it called "Chaira Hydro Power Plant".
the few net contributing countries in the EU are in a lot of debt to pay for all these projects which, so far, are leaving the EU broke and lost without Russian gas.
Congratulations on this major achievement in the delivery of green energy! Thank you for being part of this project. Mega Solar Power Plant - Benban Aswan Egypt .
Many people talked about the demise of the lead acid battery for a long time. But it never went away. We will use li-ion batteries for a long time yet.
In fairness, they are talking utility scenarios, something that Li-ion doesn't really do. For small scall energy dense applications Li-ion is still better. Its more about cost at large scale compared to other mor bulky alternatives.
I really like the idea of compressed air and compressed air to liquid storege in the process of liquefying air you can squeeze out the CO2 or scrub out the CO2 in that process. There is the potential to have duelality of power storege and global CO2 sequestration.
@@바보Queen for a higher temperatures applications yes I agree. But there is really very simple designs involved with liquid air. But as I had pointed out. Duel purpose applications with the liquid air. Molten salt on its own for power storage Hmm 🤔 I would have to have a closer look at the efficiencies.
hmm that may be true. A heat absorbing PV panel would be focused on a fairly specific bandwidth of light, so perhaps that will allow it to be made more efficient within that range of light. How efficient would it need to be viable? It would depend on how much the storage solution costs but even 50% efficient could be enough to bring to market. It is an intriguing idea.
@@thedillestpickle Storing energy by heat is inefficient in nature due to the amount of entropy generated no matter how good your equipment is. The best steam turbine can have efficiency of maybe 50-60%, and they operate on the scale of hundread+MW. Photoelectric panels are notoriously inefficient and generally have efficiencies under 20%.
I have only heard a little about it. Only thing I know for sure is that graphene is still stupidly expensive to produce. Like couple of hundred of dollars for a gram
@@ideeyes4054 The latest I heard was that they found a burn method to rediculously cheap mass produce graphene from any carbon source, preferably waste material
I started to watch this thinking it was a researched program on energy storage, instead it is just a forum for tin-pot companies to advertise and justify their thoughts. Very disappointed. Energy Vault has been shown to be a waste of time, so why is this included? You really should have done your research.
I am a little upset that we are focusing on renewable rather than sustainable perpetual mantel or outer core earth's heat energy.. This is by my reasoning, the truly honest answer for limitless green energy...
I know most people might think you're and idiot and probably joking but I honestly think you are a genius the hard part is convincing people to try it out
This video is about the successful Tesla Powerpack huge wind farm grid battery. Now they are producing the 3 MWhr megapack grid battery!!! "South Australia's giant Tesla battery confounds critics | ABC News". October 1, 2018. ruclips.net/video/zMJdxX6Lw9Q/видео.html
Somebody has erased the word "efficiency" every place it appeared in this video, thus rendering the whole thing meaningless to nonsensical. We learn exactly nothing from the whole thing.
We learn that there are actually still people doing some research to work on solutions - instead of wisecracking in the comment sections of socialmedia..
@bowblizz Maybe you need to go to church and pray for forgiveness, move into a cave and eat raw uncooked tree bark. While you are at it, throw away your carbon foot print laptop, cell phone and sell your car. You will enjoy washing in the nearby stream running with polluted cold water. At least we will not have to read or hear from you anymore. Do not forget to run around screaming "the sky is falling" as loud as possible.
Alternate chemistries really should be used for static applications. This would have a number of valuable side effects. 1) The materials used in these alternate batteries are often common and cheap. They include ZnBr, SbCa, Fe, V and the up and coming Na batteries, 2) Most of the alternative batteries have much longer lives than Li batteries. Their only disadvantage, I can see, is that they don't have quite the cycle efficiency of Li batteries. 3) Using alternative chemistries for static applications would decrease the demand for Li and bring the cost of Li batteries down and hence the cost of EVs, thus making EVs available to a wider range of people. 4) Using other chemistries would bring the price of these non-Li batteries down below the price of Li batteries. They use common cheap elements and all they need is production volume to achieve very low costs. 5) Most of these batteries based on elements other than Li can be cycled from 0% to 100% charge without damage and hence all the energy stored in the battery is available to you, unlike Li batteries. 6) most of the alternatives are safer in terms of fire. They can be shipped, even by plane and certainly by ship in containers with no risk. Most of them can be safely used in a house (basement for instance) or in a factory. With Li batteries, it is wise to use have them outside, just in case. Extra land does not always exist for a battery unit.
"We have to figure out a way to store energy..." We did. 100 years ago. It's called hydro-electric. Store vast quantities of water at a high elevation and run it through turbines. Batteries as a grid-level storage solution is thought of by cell-phone and hybrid car users who have no idea the magnitude of energy storage required.
Wind and solar rich Alberta could beef up their electrical corridors with hydro rich BC for mutual benefit and success. All hydro dam regions could do this same strategy.
My fear is that we'll rush into solar and wind before the energy storage problem is solved. Tesla building LI batteries in South Australia seems to indicate it doesn't really have a real grasp on the situation.
What about storing it as hydrogen? Small amounts of hydrogen can be stored in pressurized vessels, or solid metal hydrides or nanotubes can store hydrogen with a very high density. Very large amounts of hydrogen can be stored in constructed underground salt caverns of up to 500,000 cubic meters at 2,900 psi, which would mean about 100 GWh of stored electricity electricity.
Alot of energy loss, compared to pumped hydro or batteries. But if we are looking at a future of abundant electricity, Hydrogen isn't a bad idea, because it isn't geography dependent like pumped hydro
If you could buy one for 5k you would chop your powerlines off at your house so you dont have to pay a connection fee for nothing. If it's legal where you live.
@@julesmoore1170 Yeah, wake me up when they reply to my 'Request an offer' query (I'll try to have some faith, I just posted it now). I'm in the camp of off-grid customer where grid-tie isn't even an option. We need more consumer focused solutions in this space. Industrial solutions only keep alive more of the same culture of a big power company binding people to cloud power, and a monthly bill.
1.What has happened withthe prices ofsolar panels?2.What is the English saying related to renewableenergy?3.What is the problem with the abundance of electricity generated by the sun?4.How can we store energy for later?5.How many maximum hours of energycan lithium batteries store at the moment?6.What is the difference between lithium battery and flow battery?7.What are the disadvantages of flow batteries?8.What is pumped hydro technology?9.How much energy can 20 Energy vault towersstore10.What does TPV stand for?11.What does the number 620 million refer to?
1. They went down 2. I dont know 3. Night no only day 4. Batteries 5. 4 hours 6. Flow is new gen 7. Cant store for long 8. Pumpes water and uses it later 9. Alot 10. Electricityb- heat - electricity 11. People
5:00 "Provides 25 kilowatts of power" I think this is a mistake because this isn't a measurement of capacity. I think you mean 25 kilowatt hours, but that's almost nothing, so I'm not really sure what you meant. Also as a side note those shipping container sized "Energy Warehouses" are only 400 kilowatt hours each. That's insanely tiny, equivalent to the batteries in 4 electric cars. From a battery the size of a shipping container, I would expect more.
@@HSFY2012 Dude, he said 25KWh is almost nothing. And it is. That's about the amount of energy a persons eats in 10 days. Hornsdale Power Reserve looks to have 108 power banks, and stores 194MWh. That's almost a Megawatt of power per device. And since we're talking about energy storage devices, it's reasonable for OP to assume they were talking about capacity.
Chemical storage tech is millions of times less energy dense than uranium. Uranium is also already pre-charged by the universe. What drives these silly battery fantasies is subsidies and the criminalization of nuclear.
Yes. They confuse power (kW) with energy (kWh). This is high school level knowledge to separate the two... I'm disappointed and this gravely affects how I value this video and perhaps also other items by CNBC. They haven't even bothered to make correction about this in the video description...
Why are you guys not discussing the most obvious, Hydrogen generation? If you use excess electricity to generate Hydrogen to be used later to generate electricity via fuel cell when the sun is down then there is no capacity limitation like conventional chemical battery technology? Chemical batteries capacity is limited with the size of the battery that is hooked up and adding additional batteries require more investments. With Hydrogen it only requires an empty storage tank which is much cheaper than adding another battery. Hydrogen can also be transported off the grid which gives viable options when the grid has gone down.
#1 Generate power in deserts #2 Use sand for mass that is required in gravity storage #3 Use high ratio epicyclic gear boxes to reduce height of installations
It's a brilliant application of a very old concept. It basically works the same as a classic Grandfather or CooCoo Clock. In those, you provide the energy to lift the chain-weights yourself, and gravity pulling them back down runs the clock. With these, excess solar energy lets the system stack the weights, which are then retrieved and pulled down to provide the stored potential energy back. Fascinating stuff, if it works. The engineer who thought of it should really get an award.
Startup 1- "our gimmicky approach is the best approach". Startup 2 - "Wrong. Our gimmicky approach is the best approach". Startup 3 - "NO! Our gimmicky approach is the best approach!".
You could design a system that would allow homeowners to run their dryer when the utility has excess solar instead of running it at night when solar is not avsilable. The utility would ave to have control over when your dryer ran and they would have to give you a cheaper rate for the period the dryer ran.
@@weneedcriticalthinking We don't require jobs for the sake of simply working. If this were true then we could always have 0% unemployment by having half of the population digging ditches and the other half putting the dirt back in. We need productive jobs.
It's not just about green energy - without storage you have to build huge power stations to meet the maximum demand. With it you can build to meet the average need.
@@dougmc666 I have yet to see green biofuel power plant. It either harms the enviroment by forcing farmers to grow one type of plant so they have to use ton of pesticides, or leads to overuse of resources like hay harming soil in the long run. Their largest problem is however you spend more energy on collecting, transporting and drying fuel, than you gain by burning it. Plus small plants are ineffective, low burining temperature, unclean smoke, upscaling hits the transportation issues. Hydro plants require dams, dams harm water quality and flood large area. Anything else does not produce enough power. Geothermal cant be build everywhere.
@@Pyrochemik007 I think corn ethanol is 0.2 gallons for each gallon-equivalent of energy you get out. So it's not as bad as you say, though I agree it's not worth it for the problems you mention A lot of venture capital went into producing cellulosic ethanol from waste stalks, wood waste, and algae in the 2000s to no discernible result ☹️
@@skierpage Using other parts of plants other than what we eat for fuel as biomass is a threat to soil quality. It is the organic mass which needs to return into soil, in order to keep itl alive. If you look through enviroment researches, most of them are concerned about organic carbon decrease in soil. While pesticides are responsible for killing off soil microorganisms, large areas of monocultures are destroying the variety in food pyramides (and thus soil ecosystem stability and resistance to outer changes) , open fields are allowing wind to dry the soil and temperatures of 50+°C after harvest when field is brown and empty literaly sterilise the topmost layers. Imagine how much carbon dioxide gets released from soil in every field every country if there is 30% decrease of carbon. So we need to return to agriculture using natural fertilizers (and add only certain part of manufactured ones), and close the field´s carbon cycle as much as possible to let the soil mend the damage we have done. We also need to reduce the used farmland, and since we cant stop eating, we should stop with the energy plants. Every field should have a "resting" period every decade or so. Next problem are the dotations in "green" energy, you get money to plant them, you get discounted fuel to harvest it, you get tax reliefs, you get damage repairs for bad harvest and you get guaranteed purchases of your energy/fuel. All of this greatly deforms the numbers farmers proudly declare - they do not care they profit.
If Shell invests in something, you can also be assured that its capacity to displace or replace fossil fuels is basically nil. It's the most basic litmus test for the viability of new energy tech.
We use a rod that has a string tied to it and we use solar or wind to wind the string around the rod like a fishing reel. Then when we need energy, we put a weight on the string and let it unwind the rod, turning an electric motor to produce energy when needed
Imagine if the falling weight was a magnet that not only unfurled a rotor by releasing the weight, but if you had coils of copper on the way down it would produce another electric current by running the magnet down alongside the coils
Hydrogen has one of the lowest stored energy densities of any technology available. Hydrogen gas is the least dense material commonly available in the universe. Its energy efficiency is poor, especially when high pressure storage or liquification is needed. Hydrogen electrolyzed from water as an energy storage medium is 3x to 4x less energy efficient than batteries.
that is bs it takes 10x the rate of normal electricity to compress hydrogen to a level to compare with solar energy , that is the basis of being the most stupid energy creation
Yes and it does not even have to be compressed to 700+bars but be mixed with methanol instead. Just like the crude oil today contains a vastly more higher amount of hydrogen %-wise. Therefore even oil companies today can switch to pumping up oil and release carbon, to extracr the hydrogen within the oil in the ground and never lifting the carbon to surface. Getting hydrogen down to less than 10c/kilo. Very exciting times
That is true and this is why hydrogen is particularly interesting in portable energy storage solutions. It will become one of the main contenders for energy storage
A gallon of gasoline stores about 33kWh of thermal energy, which is crummy low-quality energy compared with useful efficient electricity. A Tesla Model S battery stores 3 times as much energy, so a trailer of any of these technologies should be able to match a large gas tank. ... Except the Energy Vault crane, lifting and lowering even tons of stuff takes and gives so little energy that it is highly unlikely to be economical.
Using solar or wind to pump water up hill for a hydro electric system is the most logical & most effective system . But it is essentially a gravity generator. You can lift anything with a motor. Even a heavy weight.
I second this idea strongly... Mini packaged nuke plants are likely to emerge as future perennial battery packs ... These along with solid state thermo electric system holds good scope.
The future is storing the energy produced by wind/solar by using those wind/solar sources to produce hydrogen. You then have something -- hydrogen -- that is very energy dense and can be stored long term underground at a relatively low cost. That is the answer to a green energy economy my friends!
This is great and very educational... Only thing is that lithium, even though it’s the future, is NOT recyclable at all and this will cause a problem in the future.
Every year...no mention of their new 3 MWhr megapack grid battery...one going in New Brunswick, Canada right now and is projected to save $200,000 annually.
You can’t improve anything if your not making profit lol If your not bringing in as much less than you put out than your not in business that means you can’t expand the green energy. Plus you have zero money to improve the technology
There is an opportunity to change domestic electrical appliances over to DC, thus avoiding the need to use inverters to create AC power. Then it would be possible to encourage many distributed battery storage systems into people's homes. Lighting refrigerators and consumer electronics can all use this source. Cooking and laundry need grid power, but you can encourage off peak consumption for some of this load. Governments need to regulate to force the change here. If half the new build housing in the U.K. Was built this way around 100,000 more energy flexible homes per annum would start to make a difference.
It looks like it's not a great solution energy wise, but I doubt it's a major environmental consideration given that it's a one-time CO2 cost. I estimate 8000 blocks per tower, 35 tons a block, 20 towers in a plant, for 5.6M tons of concrete. If you assume a metric ton of CO2 per ton of concrete, that's 5.6M tons of CO2. Compare this to the ~10 gigatons of Co2 produced by the world each year, and that is .5% of total global emissions of CO2 for this plant. I found an article saying the world needed roughly 250GW of energy storage capacity. Each plant cited in this article provided 350MW of storage. That's 700+ of these plants. Back to my numbers,.5% * 700 plants, and that's 3.5 times more than total global emissions just to build these plants. Looks like you are 100% right, this idea is genuinely horrible for emissions.
@@gregh988 Waste concrete!!! "Energy Vault keeps costs low because it uses off-the-shelf commercial hardware. Surprisingly, concrete blocks could prove to be the most expensive part of the energy tower. Concrete is much cheaper than, say, a lithium-ion battery, but Energy Vault would need a lot of concrete to build hundreds of 35-metric-ton blocks. So Pedretti found another solution. He’s developed a machine that can mix substances that cities often pay to get rid off, such as gravel or building waste, along with cement to create low-cost concrete blocks. The cost saving comes from having to use only a sixth of the amount of cement that would otherwise have been needed if the concrete were used for building construction." qz.com/1355672/stacking-concrete-blocks-is-a-surprisingly-efficient-way-to-store-energy/
@@gregh988 You got your numbers wrong. Each plant cited in the article provides 350 MW*h* of storage. Where did you get the 250 GW? Because on a world scale that's nothing, even if it's power, let alone storage capacity (250 GWh). The World produces around 25,000 TWh/year, which is an average of 2.9 TW of power. 250 GWh would equate to 5 minutes of storage, which is clearly not enough. Maybe it was 250 TWh?
@@kimie126 to make hydrogen you need water and electricity. So to make electricity you need clouds of heat and cold. Then to make heat you must probably have planets to collide with each other. But to have planets to collide and orbit then you need a sun. To have a sun you need hydrogen that get ignited. I think the answer lies within the universe it keep on expanding.
@@kimie126 Not really. The materials that formed those hydrogen cloud was "already there" since the big bang. It just too a long time for those hot particles to cool down enough to get bound together into hydrogen atoms.
@@kimie126 no, not at all. Wikipedia is your friend "Fossil fuel is fuel formed by natural processes such as anaerobic decomposition of buried dead organisms to form organic (carbon) molecules". That's different than simple hydrogen atoms which undergo fusion in stars like our Sun to form helium. Carbon and other light atoms do form in red giant stars, and heavier elements are created in supernovas. Rough summary: The big bang at the start of our universe created subatomic particles, some particles form hydrogen atoms in space, stars form out of the hydrogen, nuclear reactions in stars create heavier atoms, and chemical processes on planets orbiting stars create molecules out of these atoms including fossil fuels.
Actually, more development should be placed on super conductors. Room temperature super conductors. Light weight, very powerful, and very durable. Induce a magnetic field in a closed loop, and the magnetic field will be there until you open the loop, at which time electric current will flow. Many loops much current. The true future of energy storage.
Oh I love that.. especially when the recent past was so full of success.. past advances do dont mean we will continue to advance that way. The future is not guaranteed to just keep getting better. Not if we keep counting on batteries.. there a dead end.. gotta be other ways.. and there are
Address it at the consumer side: use ice based thermal storage for air conditioning to shift the load to soften the duck curve, and have smart cloth dryers that start after peak hours is over.
As a MS on EE and experienced worker with coal-fired and gas-fired power generation, I would like to stress that power generation using fossil-fuel can be quite clean in fact, but quite expensive and complex. You could imagine how many high-temp high-pressure (reaching 1500F/25MPa or more) valves and pipes and seals are in those power plants, needing constant maintenance or they'll leak or even explode. Those turbines are actually quite fragile considering how expensive they are. Therefore, these renewable things should really tackle the complexity and lifespan parts of the problem. The last thing we need is another high cost and high maintenance government-subsidized thing that's supposedly good for the environment...
12:50 “Overall the energy storage market is predicted to attract over $620 million in investments by 2040”. Seriously? That’s an extremely low forecast. Could have been a mistake and they meant billions though.
Edit: CNBC has commented below and clarified it was an error and they meant billions not millions. Good on them for doing that.
My thoughts exactly. Would almost make sense if they said billion instead of million.
Never ever be able to replace fossil fuels. Not enough power!! Never ever will there be enough power other than fossil fuels!!!! No matter how you manipulate the words!!!
Hammer Ology your perspective is based on technologies available today and not what’s going to be available tomorrow. Your comment is very short-sighted. I’m glad you’re not a person of influence.
Joshua T I didn’t even state my perspective. Triggered much??
Joshua T you should try drinking some of your own koolaid, as your comment was far more ‘smug’ & aggressive than mine. Thanks for your 2 cents tho. When I feel I need a life coach, I’ll be sure to reach out.
This is the kind of news that I think we need more of. Rather than telling everyone we're doomed, this inspires people and gives them hope.
I agree
Exactly. All we hear usually is “the worlds gonna end and we need to do something” but here there’s actually some solutions being put forth.
Whats really dooming is politicians doing nothing about it and businesses disregarding the environment.
Rightly said.
We're doomed!!! Sorry! Usually science sites have a better viewer. Nobody abuses me for having a contradictory opinion... thanks people.
Hear me out:
Giant cranes moving around blocks of thermally insulated solid state batteries all covered in solar cells
It’s so meta it has to work!
Omg...you have to float this idea around silicon valley. Someone is going to give you billions.
i had the same idea
This video discusses, energy storage, not energy production, you are confusing these two as 1.
Problem would be, that the sun isnt shining in all directions at the same time, so you would loose at least half of the energy you could potentialy produce using normal solar panels that trace the sun.
Pumped hydro is one of the most efficient for long-term storage. Usually 80-90% efficiency. But the environmental toll can be large, if we can find good spaces for them (like mountains with low populations) this could be big for this tech.
One aspect not mentioned here is integration of the grid over long distances. Even if the sun doesn't shine and the wind doesn't blow here, there are other places where they will. If you can distribute electricity over long distances, that also dampens the peaks and troughs, reducing the need for storage. This process is already ongoing in Europe.
Yeah and what about when it's dark, and the wind is only blowing a little bit in a few countries, but all of Europe needs a lot of energy? Where do you get your baseload energy?
@@richardnixon7248 I understand that several countries are working on large-scale storage solutions that can be used seasonally.
It would also make sense to do studies on energy reliability for different sized electrical grids and I bet that's already ongoing.
And note that existing fossil energy solutions have their problems too. Just think of the European natural gas situation right now. We will never have a perfect system, what you need to do is compare future options against the existing situation.
In my wildest dream, I've picture what you said into a huge solar/wind system expanding the whole Euroasia continent from Qingdao to Lisbon. It (only) covers 10-hour timezone, maybe not perfect but would be the longest possible. I guess that would need huge international corporation.
Transmission is extremely expensive and wipes out the benefit of cheap wind and solar when the wind blows and the sun shines.
@@jasonstevenson110 I'm rather surprised that you say that, since here in Europe, we have an international grid already, so I don't really see where the actual costs would come from. I assume that the US already has a national grid as well.
About 10 years ago I was basing my university level student projects on the development of a FESS for use in the third world. My brief was that it must require minimal maintenance, it must have high energy density, it should be used for decades - even centuries with no loss of storage capacity or efficiency and it must be totally sustainable, require abundant and cheap materials and totally un-toxic to the planet - a challenging brief which only the FESS designs (or mechanical gravity based) designs come anywhere close to fulfilling.
Over several years of development, we decided that it was much better to go for low angular velocity (
Hello Richard. I did not find you, but could you if your offer still stands write me on Linkedin :) ? I am writing a thesis and would like to have a look
@@pascaltimmann2682 - OK - I've sent you a LinkedIn connect invite.
This panel can put out close to 100 watts ruclips.net/user/postUgkxOqI2yqX0XVrhR2BMJciTWrHJpG8FhJyg when positioned in the appropriate southernly direction, tilted to the optimal angle for your latitude/date, and connected to a higher capacity device than a 500. The built in kickstand angle is a fixed at 50 degrees. Up to 20% more power can be output by selecting the actual date and latitude optimal angle.The 500 will only input 3.5A maximum at 18 volts for 63 watts. Some of the excess power from the panel can be fed into a USB battery bank, charged directly from the panel while also charging a 500. This will allow you to harvest as much as 63 + 15 = 78 watts.If this panel is used to charge a larger device, such as the power station, then its full output potential can be realized.
I have also heard of molten salt as an option.
I love the idea of two lakes at an incline to each other.
Solar can be used to pump water uphill.
Also, rain water can be harvested to fill the ponds.
I'm also pumped about that concept. Needs land area though.
What we can do i use a celling fan to make wind and then blow wind mill from that wind
@@prateeksharma6706 right
pump hydro is great, but excessive rainwater may cost problems.
@@ericshen5374 The excess rainwater would just flow away like it normally would. That is how dams work.
This is what I love about the United States of America! A country that takes the lead in innovative research. I hope this technology becomes cheaper in near future. It will indeed free my country from the incessant power failures and poor energy infrastructure.
Thank you America. More power to the scientist.
Good
More so every western nation has its ideas and companies and an American media house promotes and American company
The crane energy looks like a disaster waiting to happen......
The crane energy storage solution has been debunked multiple times. The math just doesn't add up. That's why it's only an animation, and not a real product.
I liked it. It is less dangerous than a high rise, since it isn't hollow.
My only problem is why? We only have 2% green energy. They keep pretending we have all this energy to store. Harnessing energy still isn't that easy.
Considering that cranes cannot operate in heavy winds, it's pretty dull to depend on energy storage that cannot operate in heavy winds other than to complement wind farms...
@@c31979839 Can you link your sources please?
Good point. Unless you are talking a solar farm in an arid area.
I would use an enclosed structure and blocks within. Water would be a possible hazard if container broke.
On top of the container could be the solar or wind to power the internal crane.
There's a reason why none of these alternative storage technologies have managed to displace lithium-ion battery: they all have some sort of tradeoff. In this video, flow batteries are said to be "Cost-competitive" with lithium-ion. In other words, they cost the same over the long term. If their lifespan is longer than lithium-ion, then that means a much higher up-front cost. But look at their density: ESS needs a whole shipping container just to store 400 kWh, many times more space than is required by lithium-ion solutions. In other words, it costs the same, but is worse.
In order for alternative power storage to succeed, it is not enough to merely be as good, or as cheap. It must either be better, or cheaper, or both. None of the alternatives in this video have demonstrated that so far.
TBH everyone is waiting till Tesla Battery day.
The iron salt water battery seemed worth it for recycling and repurposing.
We need nuclear power
@Jeff Holland jeff lol how does it feel to be alive in the early 1900's?
Jeff, you're absolutely right because there is too much money to be made and no viable alternatives
If electrons move through graphene like massless particles, this implies no energy loss through heat and the potential for a VERY long storage. Obviously, the most efficient battery conceivable would have this property. By twisting a long sheet of graphene densely into a cylinder-shape and isolating the edges well, you'd pretty much have the perfect battery, made out of pure carbon.
It's just a matter of how long it takes to come up with a cost efficient graphene technology.
This gravity storage method has been BUSTED by 'Voice of Thunder'
Just looking for this comment...
@@Delfontes Mee toooo... T Maaaannnnn .... We love dat guy
I cant find it, can i get a link please?
Thunderfoot
@@Gwenpool2369 ruclips.net/video/NIhCuzxNvv0/видео.html
Any legitimate analysis would include the ultimate costs of dealing with the toxic battery components once they lose production capacity and are tossed.
This is not anything like analysis, they just listed random projects, and the part they shown is only a small part of larger problem, there are solutions to ups and downs in production in getting a source of energy which can be started anytime - like water dams, or gas power plants. This source then complements for the weaknesses of solar or wind, much cheaper than anything else.
Butt tossing stuff is free. Wouldn't that just be a replacement/recycling cost.
@@rollerskdude If you toss away lithium battery we run out of it. Lithium is not easy to extract sinc eit is quite soluble in any form, once it gets disolved in seawater it is lost to us forever.
When this is scaled up and enough waste volume is being produced it becomes economically very viable to recyle the materials to build new things instead of mining.
@@Pyrochemik007 Nope. Any claims that we are short on lithium are false or a sign that a person doesn't know what they are talking about. We can in fact extract it easily from seawater too, all that takes is energy, and if we don't have enough batteries for storage, then we obviously have lots of free solar and wind power just asking to be used.
Flow battery 4:14
Iron flow batteries 6:10
Pumped hydro 8:17
Gravity batteries 9:02
Thermal Storage 10:26
Thermo Photovoltaic Cell 11:09
Compressed air 11:58
Cryogenic Storage 12:04
Videos like these give a good insight in technologies that one might not yet heard of.
@just another human But how is energy free? Wind is free, sun is free but the conversion to electricity costs money.
@just another human Are you sure that won't upset the balance in the universe?
@just another human "no"? - How do you know? Let's atleast admit that we don't have a clue about how "hidden energy fields" work. As for now every single energy source humans have used have lead to environmental problems.
I however believe in new reactors using nuclear waste as a primary energy source, in order to get rid of as much long lived waste as possible. In the longer run fusion mught be the best solution. It's better, but not totally "clean".
To build machines that could harvest the energy from hidden energy fields might cost alot of money. In comparison; if nuclear fuel was free, it would only lower the cost of nuclear power with 10% or so.
These CNBC video essays are a wealth of knowledge. I love these.
WSJ also has a lot of these type of mini docs.
The most difficult task for energy storage technology is to overcome the influence on bureaucrats of the vested interests in existing electrical energy utilities. Even if an energy storage solution is better for the consumer, powerful lobbies to maintain the status quo will be hard to overcome.
Hey, I and my bald spot are in this video starting at 6:04. Maybe link to the video you used from The Good Stuff in the description, CNBC?
Hey I thought that was you was expecting you to come In at some point but nope they just used your vid lol
Yooooo
Make a claim?
You’re also walking towards the cam later on.. ooof.
I'm surprised I didn't see any credits. Are they technically allowed to use your short clips like this without credit? I do see a lot of RUclipsrs using other RUclipsrs content.
Imagine Energy Vault stacking ESS Shipping Container batteries. Long and short term energy storage at the same time :)
Yep such hybrid ideas sound really cool
“Hydrogen Storage”
The video was beautifully made and informative.
The only thing is that you forgot the hydrogen generation and storage as one of the biggest changes that will probably happen.
Amin R, things have changed in hydrogen storage and high pressure (15000 psi)carbon fiber tanks are now able to be replaced with low pressure tanks more in line with scuba tanks for the same mass in hydrogen. Stay tuned and be watching the progress in energy storage using hydrogen
Another thing missed, is flywheel inertial energy storage. Hydrogen energy storage isn't nearly as efficient as batteries are, or flywheels are likely to be. I don't dismiss it, I'm sure the efficiency will improve. The fact is, no ONE technology could do it alone. We need so much energy storage, that we will need all forms of energy storage. Nothing's off the table!
@@vincentrobinette1507 yeah batteries efficient but short storage duration, hydrogen not so efficient but long duration. Whats your pick?
Energy Vault - when will it move past the CGI cartoon phase? Just sayin’.
I still think pump storage is underrated
Conroy Boothe not really
@@HAMID___ "I think" - no
Pump hydro is all but reliable tech, granted. However, it's not as efficient as the stirage that will be needed in 2040 and beyond.
The inefficiency comes from the cost. Its exoensive to build by MWh and expensive to run if you're buying electricity to oumo back up hill, even if you buy excess generation cheaply.
It takes mote energy up to the top reservoir than it generates when water is released towards tha bottom resevoir.
That makes the electricity generated more expensive than other sources.
The only way hydrology generation is efficient and cheap is when you dam a strong running river and release water constantly. The generation virtually runs itself.
A great example of that is URUGUAY. Most if their energy is hydro. One of tge cleanest countries on Earth when it comes to electricity.
Emission per capita in Uruguay are 1.9 tons
Australia and the USA are hovering at ovet 20 tons per person.
It's incredibly inefficient, both at storing AND generating.
@@reelreflections1okay name a energy storage that is 100% efficient
Always important to keep in mind lifecycle and raw material requirement. How long do solar panels last before degradation? How much steel has to be smelted to create a windmill? How much concrete has to be poured to create the base? Look at the NET product, not just at the end. Likewise, I hope the energy storage methods are environmentally friendly and low resource production cost.
For me which I have
Wind
Water
Solar power , it off grid and I just don’t want company interference government interference.
I have propane generator back up as well
I’m free not doomed to the will of someone else .
Going green is crazy we just swap what we want to destroy.
Everyone just pics what poison they want .
Everyone just needs there own power not governments
So do pipelines. So do nuclear power plants etc. The iron salt water one in a transport truck is a very easy scale. Water related storage through lakes has always provided beauty even with large scale. Providing safe & renewal storage is important but we need to keep understanding its about improving on other systems, spills, fires, cost etc.
Solar panels are typically guaranteed at about 80-90% efficiency after 20 years. Recycling is possible but the industry for it is still developing as far as I know.
Pumped hydro is still the name of the game. In my country (Bulgaria) there is one of these systems (which BTW might be the largest in Eastern Europe), consisting of numerous facilities having a total installed capacity of 864 MW. This pumped storage hydro power system can partially ballance the only Bulgarian nuclear power plant which has 2 units with a total capacity of over 2000 MW... In Wikipedia there is an article about it called "Chaira Hydro Power Plant".
the few net contributing countries in the EU are in a lot of debt to pay for all these projects which, so far, are leaving the EU broke and lost without Russian gas.
Congratulations on this major achievement in the delivery of green energy!
Thank you for being part of this project.
Mega Solar Power Plant - Benban Aswan Egypt .
Many people talked about the demise of the lead acid battery for a long time. But it never went away. We will use li-ion batteries for a long time yet.
In fairness, they are talking utility scenarios, something that Li-ion doesn't really do. For small scall energy dense applications Li-ion is still better. Its more about cost at large scale compared to other mor bulky alternatives.
I really like the idea of compressed air and compressed air to liquid storege in the process of liquefying air you can squeeze out the CO2 or scrub out the CO2 in that process. There is the potential to have duelality of power storege and global CO2 sequestration.
It simplifies many of the other chemical processes involved with the actual. Bonding of CO2 with the higher concentrations of CO2.
im a bigger fan of molten salt!
@@바보Queen for a higher temperatures applications yes I agree. But there is really very simple designs involved with liquid air. But as I had pointed out. Duel purpose applications with the liquid air. Molten salt on its own for power storage Hmm 🤔 I would have to have a closer look at the efficiencies.
Chef's kiss. These technologies are wonderful and should have more money & resources put into their development.
That heat thing probably has less than 1% efficiency.
hmm that may be true.
A heat absorbing PV panel would be focused on a fairly specific bandwidth of light, so perhaps that will allow it to be made more efficient within that range of light.
How efficient would it need to be viable? It would depend on how much the storage solution costs but even 50% efficient could be enough to bring to market.
It is an intriguing idea.
@@thedillestpickle Storing energy by heat is inefficient in nature due to the amount of entropy generated no matter how good your equipment is. The best steam turbine can have efficiency of maybe 50-60%, and they operate on the scale of hundread+MW. Photoelectric panels are notoriously inefficient and generally have efficiencies under 20%.
"The sea was angry that day my friends, like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli."
I don't get it
@@ab3040 it's a Seinfeld reference I think
@@severusrogue259 oh. That's why.
I looked into the the eye of the great fish
@@jbw6823
"Mammal"
"Whatever"
Keep updating this information as new technologies become available. Don't stop!
What about Graphene battery Technology ??? Did the world already forgot about it ??
Yeah everybody's now acting like that wasn't a thing
@@LegendLength hurry the memory is spreading
I have only heard a little about it. Only thing I know for sure is that graphene is still stupidly expensive to produce. Like couple of hundred of dollars for a gram
They're just not nearly as revolutionary as people thought they would be.
@@ideeyes4054 The latest I heard was that they found a burn method to rediculously cheap mass produce graphene from any carbon source, preferably waste material
I started to watch this thinking it was a researched program on energy storage, instead it is just a forum for tin-pot companies to advertise and justify their thoughts. Very disappointed. Energy Vault has been shown to be a waste of time, so why is this included? You really should have done your research.
I am a little upset that we are focusing on renewable rather than sustainable perpetual mantel or outer core earth's heat energy.. This is by my reasoning, the truly honest answer for limitless green energy...
Giant hamsters in giant hamster wheels -- now *THAT*'s the future of renewable energy. I'm surprised they missed that one :-)
I know most people might think you're and idiot and probably joking but I honestly think you are a genius the hard part is convincing people to try it out
That wouldn't be very good, because you would have to feed the hamsters. And Giant hamsters, require a lot of food XD
I like it, but change the hamster's into human, that make money for doing it.
Great idea! However, the radioactivity of those mutants is harmful to humans. You have to keep them underground...
These giant hamsters already exist in the form of gym junkies who run or cycle miles on treadmills and exercise bikes
Probably the most useful video. Whoever figures it out in a mass scale, will be the richest man by far.
Or woman.
@@hello2jello4mellow34 or monkey or lizardman
Who know?
This video is about the successful Tesla Powerpack huge wind farm grid battery. Now they are producing the 3 MWhr megapack grid battery!!! "South Australia's giant Tesla battery confounds critics | ABC News". October 1, 2018. ruclips.net/video/zMJdxX6Lw9Q/видео.html
a b I don’t think it’ll come down to mass scale, rather many people putting in a MWh per month off rooftop solar.
Whoever creates the first commercial smr you mean
Somebody has erased the word "efficiency" every place it appeared in this video, thus rendering the whole thing meaningless to nonsensical. We learn exactly nothing from the whole thing.
We learn that there are actually still people doing some research to work on solutions - instead of wisecracking in the comment sections of socialmedia..
6:53 That’s definitely Wheezy Waiter.
13:40 - 20%, peak demand means power (W), storage is energy (Wh). This doesn't make sense.
It does to comic book super crooks.
Maybe few parts and:
1. Water electrolysis
2. Dividing H from O
3. CO2 from air obtaining
4. Methane producing by using Fischer-Tropsch synthesis :D
Cheapest and longest living storage technology is Pumped hydro storage.
Was already nixed quite a few years ago in the state of WA. Refer to the proposed Blackrock Dam project off of the Columbia River.
@@rekky213 No what's funny were still paying the Tax for that .
It is really cool to recognize in which kind of future we can live!!!
One where we messed around with ineffective, Rube Goldberg energy production systems for so long that we caused a catastrophic warming event?
@bowblizz Maybe you need to go to church and pray for forgiveness, move into a cave and eat raw uncooked tree bark. While you are at it, throw away your carbon foot print laptop, cell phone and sell your car. You will enjoy washing in the nearby stream running with polluted cold water. At least we will not have to read or hear from you anymore. Do not forget to run around screaming "the sky is falling" as loud as possible.
@@tiredofbs6835 Facts don't care about your feelings, bud.
Alternate chemistries really should be used for static applications. This would have a number of valuable side effects. 1) The materials used in these alternate batteries are often common and cheap. They include ZnBr, SbCa, Fe, V and the up and coming Na batteries, 2) Most of the alternative batteries have much longer lives than Li batteries. Their only disadvantage, I can see, is that they don't have quite the cycle efficiency of Li batteries. 3) Using alternative chemistries for static applications would decrease the demand for Li and bring the cost of Li batteries down and hence the cost of EVs, thus making EVs available to a wider range of people. 4) Using other chemistries would bring the price of these non-Li batteries down below the price of Li batteries. They use common cheap elements and all they need is production volume to achieve very low costs. 5) Most of these batteries based on elements other than Li can be cycled from 0% to 100% charge without damage and hence all the energy stored in the battery is available to you, unlike Li batteries. 6) most of the alternatives are safer in terms of fire. They can be shipped, even by plane and certainly by ship in containers with no risk. Most of them can be safely used in a house (basement for instance) or in a factory. With Li batteries, it is wise to use have them outside, just in case. Extra land does not always exist for a battery unit.
"We have to figure out a way to store energy..." We did. 100 years ago. It's called hydro-electric. Store vast quantities of water at a high elevation and run it through turbines. Batteries as a grid-level storage solution is thought of by cell-phone and hybrid car users who have no idea the magnitude of energy storage required.
Wind and solar rich Alberta could beef up their electrical corridors with hydro rich BC for mutual benefit and success. All hydro dam regions could do this same strategy.
Now this is the video I wanted to see
@@LegendLength Nah, maybe it's one of their boys/employees.
I’m glad someone smart is working on this , because I have no idea what is going on .
😂😂🤣
My fear is that we'll rush into solar and wind before the energy storage problem is solved. Tesla building LI batteries in South Australia seems to indicate it doesn't really have a real grasp on the situation.
The tech for the 21st century is "Liquid Air." That's air not wind. Air is free, you can't beat free !!!
Completely agree, could also be used for vehicle propulsion
What about storing it as hydrogen? Small amounts of hydrogen can be stored in pressurized vessels, or solid metal hydrides or nanotubes can store hydrogen with a very high density. Very large amounts of hydrogen can be stored in constructed underground salt caverns of up to 500,000 cubic meters at 2,900 psi, which would mean about 100 GWh of stored electricity electricity.
yap, it will be the future
Alot of energy loss, compared to pumped hydro or batteries. But if we are looking at a future of abundant electricity, Hydrogen isn't a bad idea, because it isn't geography dependent like pumped hydro
Wake me up when I can buy one under 5k to store enough to go 3 days when there's a power outage
If you could buy one for 5k you would chop your powerlines off at your house so you dont have to pay a connection fee for nothing. If it's legal where you live.
Look at a company called voltstorage. They are selling vrfb batteries for houses
@@julesmoore1170 Yeah, wake me up when they reply to my 'Request an offer' query (I'll try to have some faith, I just posted it now). I'm in the camp of off-grid customer where grid-tie isn't even an option. We need more consumer focused solutions in this space. Industrial solutions only keep alive more of the same culture of a big power company binding people to cloud power, and a monthly bill.
You'll be sleeping forever. The laws of physics aren't changing anytime soon. The only reason these companies exist is to waste tax dollars.
Gonna be sleeping for a century
1.What has happened withthe prices ofsolar panels?2.What is the English saying related to renewableenergy?3.What is the problem with the abundance of electricity generated by the sun?4.How can we store energy for later?5.How many maximum hours of energycan lithium batteries store at the moment?6.What is the difference between lithium battery and flow battery?7.What are the disadvantages of flow batteries?8.What is pumped hydro technology?9.How much energy can 20 Energy vault towersstore10.What does TPV stand for?11.What does the number 620 million refer to?
1. They went down
2. I dont know
3. Night no only day
4. Batteries
5. 4 hours
6. Flow is new gen
7. Cant store for long
8. Pumpes water and uses it later
9. Alot
10. Electricityb- heat - electricity
11. People
@@nejcskornsek5161
5:00
"Provides 25 kilowatts of power"
I think this is a mistake because this isn't a measurement of capacity. I think you mean 25 kilowatt hours, but that's almost nothing, so I'm not really sure what you meant.
Also as a side note those shipping container sized "Energy Warehouses" are only 400 kilowatt hours each. That's insanely tiny, equivalent to the batteries in 4 electric cars. From a battery the size of a shipping container, I would expect more.
25kW is not nothing, and "providing 25kW of power" is not talking about capacity, but the draw of power.
@@HSFY2012 Dude, he said 25KWh is almost nothing. And it is. That's about the amount of energy a persons eats in 10 days. Hornsdale Power Reserve looks to have 108 power banks, and stores 194MWh. That's almost a Megawatt of power per device. And since we're talking about energy storage devices, it's reasonable for OP to assume they were talking about capacity.
Chemical storage tech is millions of times less energy dense than uranium. Uranium is also already pre-charged by the universe.
What drives these silly battery fantasies is subsidies and the criminalization of nuclear.
Yes. They confuse power (kW) with energy (kWh). This is high school level knowledge to separate the two... I'm disappointed and this gravely affects how I value this video and perhaps also other items by CNBC.
They haven't even bothered to make correction about this in the video description...
You left out another important energy storage method, Hydrogen storage method (1mW - 1000mW)
1 milliwatt is not a lot of energy.
@@Oivaras depends on the time over which it is applied.
@@Oivaras Solid Hydrogen could replace gasoline. Could be run as Fuel in electric cars with out having to charge your car up every night.
Why are you guys not discussing the most obvious, Hydrogen generation?
If you use excess electricity to generate Hydrogen to be used later to generate electricity via fuel cell when the sun is down then there is no capacity limitation like conventional chemical battery technology?
Chemical batteries capacity is limited with the size of the battery that is hooked up and adding additional batteries require more investments. With Hydrogen it only requires an empty storage tank which is much cheaper than adding another battery. Hydrogen can also be transported off the grid which gives viable options when the grid has gone down.
Energy Vault wonder how wind would affect the placement of the blocks cos it would end up being jenga in a storm
5:00 It would be 5kWh to measure capacity, that's the instant power delivery
#1 Generate power in deserts
#2 Use sand for mass that is required in gravity storage
#3 Use high ratio epicyclic gear boxes to reduce height of installations
I've never heard of that gravity crane thing before. These are exciting times to live in.
It's a brilliant application of a very old concept. It basically works the same as a classic Grandfather or CooCoo Clock. In those, you provide the energy to lift the chain-weights yourself, and gravity pulling them back down runs the clock. With these, excess solar energy lets the system stack the weights, which are then retrieved and pulled down to provide the stored potential energy back. Fascinating stuff, if it works. The engineer who thought of it should really get an award.
@@michaeldougherty6036 Its a terrible idea. Its been debunked multiple times already ruclips.net/video/NIhCuzxNvv0/видео.html
my same reaction. The gravity crane thing reminded me of playing with erector sets in the 1950's when I was a brazen tike with blond curls.
@@allending8753 Thunderf00t is very shortsighted and lacks vision. The arguments he makes are absolutely myopic.
@@quelorepario How exactly? I find his videos very interesting and informative.
Startup 1- "our gimmicky approach is the best approach".
Startup 2 - "Wrong. Our gimmicky approach is the best approach".
Startup 3 - "NO! Our gimmicky approach is the best approach!".
Ok, then tell us about the non-gimmicky approach that you've invented and are developing.
I like the idea of Tesla's virtual power plant far more than I do off site storage.
And here I am... Laying down on my bed, watching the ceiling and thinking about the meaning of my life... While others changing the world
Give it a meaning with something that makes you happy and is not harming others.
You could design a system that would allow homeowners to run their dryer when the utility has excess solar instead of running it at night when solar is not avsilable. The utility would ave to have control over when your dryer ran and they would have to give you a cheaper rate for the period the dryer ran.
Same here haha
That energy storage brick tower seems to be a maintenance nightmare.
You mean dusting? There are no moving parts.
Jobs are important for a society.
@@weneedcriticalthinking We don't require jobs for the sake of simply working. If this were true then we could always have 0% unemployment by having half of the population digging ditches and the other half putting the dirt back in. We need productive jobs.
@@macioluko9484 A sustainable green economy supplies much more jobs, , less death and money than a fossil fuel war economy.
@@weneedcriticalthinking Agreed.
Eos Energy seems pretty promising
looks very interesting
Good compilation of pipe dreams.
Energy storage is always the cost bottleneck for all green energy technology.
It's not just about green energy - without storage you have to build huge power stations to meet the maximum demand. With it you can build to meet the average need.
By `all green energy technology` you mean wind and solar right? Run-of-river hydro, geothermal and biofuels are a few that have no storage costs.
@@dougmc666 I have yet to see green biofuel power plant. It either harms the enviroment by forcing farmers to grow one type of plant so they have to use ton of pesticides, or leads to overuse of resources like hay harming soil in the long run. Their largest problem is however you spend more energy on collecting, transporting and drying fuel, than you gain by burning it. Plus small plants are ineffective, low burining temperature, unclean smoke, upscaling hits the transportation issues.
Hydro plants require dams, dams harm water quality and flood large area. Anything else does not produce enough power.
Geothermal cant be build everywhere.
@@Pyrochemik007 I think corn ethanol is 0.2 gallons for each gallon-equivalent of energy you get out. So it's not as bad as you say, though I agree it's not worth it for the problems you mention A lot of venture capital went into producing cellulosic ethanol from waste stalks, wood waste, and algae in the 2000s to no discernible result ☹️
@@skierpage Using other parts of plants other than what we eat for fuel as biomass is a threat to soil quality. It is the organic mass which needs to return into soil, in order to keep itl alive. If you look through enviroment researches, most of them are concerned about organic carbon decrease in soil. While pesticides are responsible for killing off soil microorganisms, large areas of monocultures are destroying the variety in food pyramides (and thus soil ecosystem stability and resistance to outer changes) , open fields are allowing wind to dry the soil and temperatures of 50+°C after harvest when field is brown and empty literaly sterilise the topmost layers. Imagine how much carbon dioxide gets released from soil in every field every country if there is 30% decrease of carbon. So we need to return to agriculture using natural fertilizers (and add only certain part of manufactured ones), and close the field´s carbon cycle as much as possible to let the soil mend the damage we have done. We also need to reduce the used farmland, and since we cant stop eating, we should stop with the energy plants. Every field should have a "resting" period every decade or so.
Next problem are the dotations in "green" energy, you get money to plant them, you get discounted fuel to harvest it, you get tax reliefs, you get damage repairs for bad harvest and you get guaranteed purchases of your energy/fuel. All of this greatly deforms the numbers farmers proudly declare - they do not care they profit.
If Shell invests in something, you can also be assured that its capacity to displace or replace fossil fuels is basically nil. It's the most basic litmus test for the viability of new energy tech.
Why do you say that? I’m just curious is all
5:26
4:07 I thought she would say graphene battery, lol.
Graphene would never make it in terms of cost
@@vicyelt7551 flash graphene is gonna change that
Good luck Fossil fuel replacement is huge to replace and the infrastructure too ! You need to directly store and collect energy at the quantum level!
@Cecelia Hops wrong scale ,oh yeh definitely not the a genius though!
Supper, mind-blowing. What a energy is eden in small knowledge.
We use a rod that has a string tied to it and we use solar or wind to wind the string around the rod like a fishing reel. Then when we need energy, we put a weight on the string and let it unwind the rod, turning an electric motor to produce energy when needed
Yeah yeah yeah, I know my idea is basically at 9:00
Imagine if the falling weight was a magnet that not only unfurled a rotor by releasing the weight, but if you had coils of copper on the way down it would produce another electric current by running the magnet down alongside the coils
Add a flywheel or Tesla turbine to help maintain efficiency and also to help power loading
Addicted to these mini docs
Forgot to mention hydrogen storage, which would have a much higher energy density than any battery or pumped hydro
Hydrogen has one of the lowest stored energy densities of any technology available. Hydrogen gas is the least dense material commonly available in the universe. Its energy efficiency is poor, especially when high pressure storage or liquification is needed.
Hydrogen electrolyzed from water as an energy storage medium is 3x to 4x less energy efficient than batteries.
that is bs it takes 10x the rate of normal electricity to compress hydrogen to a level to compare with solar energy , that is the basis of being the most stupid energy creation
Let's keep that under your bed, good night...
Yes and it does not even have to be compressed to 700+bars but be mixed with methanol instead. Just like the crude oil today contains a vastly more higher amount of hydrogen %-wise. Therefore even oil companies today can switch to pumping up oil and release carbon, to extracr the hydrogen within the oil in the ground and never lifting the carbon to surface. Getting hydrogen down to less than 10c/kilo. Very exciting times
That is true and this is why hydrogen is particularly interesting in portable energy storage solutions. It will become one of the main contenders for energy storage
Problem is not battery storage. Problem is getting enough power into them from solar and wind turbines to avoid blackouts.
These are the type of videos I wish my chemistry teacher showed in high school.
lol they have "serious potential" 1:27
Mass "producing": water, energy and food is not longer the option. The key market move is transforming each home a self sufficient cell.
trailer containing so much energy as full gas tank - I smell BS, and that huge crane is on whole another level
A gallon of gasoline stores about 33kWh of thermal energy, which is crummy low-quality energy compared with useful efficient electricity. A Tesla Model S battery stores 3 times as much energy, so a trailer of any of these technologies should be able to match a large gas tank.
... Except the Energy Vault crane, lifting and lowering even tons of stuff takes and gives so little energy that it is highly unlikely to be economical.
Using solar or wind to pump water up hill for a hydro electric system is the most logical & most effective system . But it is essentially a gravity generator. You can lift anything with a motor. Even a heavy weight.
Forget wind and solar. Thorium is where the big talk of green energy should be.
I second this idea strongly...
Mini packaged nuke plants are likely to emerge as future perennial battery packs ... These along with solid state thermo electric system holds good scope.
Another hell of way to boil water unessesary risk Einstine warned against.
Winds wasted energy between blades embedded in ignorance of no invention possible Betz limits claim in 1919.set in oil wealth now nuclear. .
It will be exciting to see 10 years from now when the grid contains all these different types of utility scale battery farms!
The future is storing the energy produced by wind/solar by using those wind/solar sources to produce hydrogen. You then have something -- hydrogen -- that is very energy dense and can be stored long term underground at a relatively low cost. That is the answer to a green energy economy my friends!
That's actually a very good idea. It might even help make clean water in the process
This is great and very educational... Only thing is that lithium, even though it’s the future, is NOT recyclable at all and this will cause a problem in the future.
It seems to me that all these companies are trying to play catch up with Tesla. Meanwhile, Tesla keeps improving Lithium-Ion cells every year...
Every year...no mention of their new 3 MWhr megapack grid battery...one going in New Brunswick, Canada right now and is projected to save $200,000 annually.
Tesla doesn't make battery
@@marvistv6551 wtf you talking about... stay off the crack homie
I think it is really crazy how things focus so much on profit, I get it. But how about the unseen profit of keeping the Earth.
That is why innovation is so slow, the end goal is to make worthless paper and digital money
don't tell me you guys forgot that our society is built on capitalism? it's always money first, then all the rest.
@@sn0wdon and most of the time hinders it. :)
You can’t improve anything if your not making profit lol
If your not bringing in as much less than you put out than your not in business that means you can’t expand the green energy. Plus you have zero money to improve the technology
There is an opportunity to change domestic electrical appliances over to DC, thus avoiding the need to use inverters to create AC power. Then it would be possible to encourage many distributed battery storage systems into people's homes. Lighting refrigerators and consumer electronics can all use this source. Cooking and laundry need grid power, but you can encourage off peak consumption for some of this load. Governments need to regulate to force the change here. If half the new build housing in the U.K. Was built this way around 100,000 more energy flexible homes per annum would start to make a difference.
Just Ask Aliens how they do it
I'm still waiting for Voyager 2 to return my call.
Hello... anyone out there?
@mr fantastic you are wrong and insane
Well, Elon says batteries is the way :)
They don't store energy. They have it on demand Using plasma and radioactive materials.
@@victorbar3567 elon is a fake person they are the government in disguise..
Those concrete brick towers... Did anyone check the CO2 cost of producing that much concrete?! :-|
It looks like it's not a great solution energy wise, but I doubt it's a major environmental consideration given that it's a one-time CO2 cost. I estimate 8000 blocks per tower, 35 tons a block, 20 towers in a plant, for 5.6M tons of concrete. If you assume a metric ton of CO2 per ton of concrete, that's 5.6M tons of CO2. Compare this to the ~10 gigatons of Co2 produced by the world each year, and that is .5% of total global emissions of CO2 for this plant.
I found an article saying the world needed roughly 250GW of energy storage capacity. Each plant cited in this article provided 350MW of storage. That's 700+ of these plants. Back to my numbers,.5% * 700 plants, and that's 3.5 times more than total global emissions just to build these plants.
Looks like you are 100% right, this idea is genuinely horrible for emissions.
@@gregh988 if you ran the numbers on most "renewables" they don't make sense financially or environmentally.
ruclips.net/video/NIhCuzxNvv0/видео.html
@@gregh988 Waste concrete!!!
"Energy Vault keeps costs low because it uses off-the-shelf commercial hardware. Surprisingly, concrete blocks could prove to be the most expensive part of the energy tower. Concrete is much cheaper than, say, a lithium-ion battery, but Energy Vault would need a lot of concrete to build hundreds of 35-metric-ton blocks.
So Pedretti found another solution. He’s developed a machine that can mix substances that cities often pay to get rid off, such as gravel or building waste, along with cement to create low-cost concrete blocks. The cost saving comes from having to use only a sixth of the amount of cement that would otherwise have been needed if the concrete were used for building construction."
qz.com/1355672/stacking-concrete-blocks-is-a-surprisingly-efficient-way-to-store-energy/
@@gregh988 You got your numbers wrong. Each plant cited in the article provides 350 MW*h* of storage. Where did you get the 250 GW? Because on a world scale that's nothing, even if it's power, let alone storage capacity (250 GWh). The World produces around 25,000 TWh/year, which is an average of 2.9 TW of power. 250 GWh would equate to 5 minutes of storage, which is clearly not enough. Maybe it was 250 TWh?
Thanks for making this video!!
6:53 The perfect WheezyWaiter impersonator.
I saw that and shat my self
Literally thought the same thing. Someone needs to let him know.
When stars are forming, where did they get their collection of material to generate energy?
Over hundreds of millions of years a cloud of hydrogen gas clumps together. Then it also accretes other material in its path.
skierpage so its a kind of fossil energy too.
@@kimie126 to make hydrogen you need water and electricity.
So to make electricity you need clouds of heat and cold.
Then to make heat you must probably have planets to collide with each other.
But to have planets to collide and orbit then you need a sun. To have a sun you need hydrogen that get ignited.
I think the answer lies within the universe it keep on expanding.
@@kimie126 Not really. The materials that formed those hydrogen cloud was "already there" since the big bang. It just too a long time for those hot particles to cool down enough to get bound together into hydrogen atoms.
@@kimie126 no, not at all. Wikipedia is your friend "Fossil fuel is fuel formed by natural processes such as anaerobic decomposition of buried dead organisms to form organic (carbon) molecules". That's different than simple hydrogen atoms which undergo fusion in stars like our Sun to form helium. Carbon and other light atoms do form in red giant stars, and heavier elements are created in supernovas.
Rough summary: The big bang at the start of our universe created subatomic particles, some particles form hydrogen atoms in space, stars form out of the hydrogen, nuclear reactions in stars create heavier atoms, and chemical processes on planets orbiting stars create molecules out of these atoms including fossil fuels.
Amazing #progress The #future is #green. #solar #zerocarbon #energy #IAmTheSonOfAfrica
Why not just use dilithium crystals? I hear Star Fleet uses them to power all their ships.
Autocorrect always malfunctions when you are trying to make a point
6:54 wheezywaiter
Yeah! From what video is that "cameo"?
@@GabrielAlejandroZorrilla
I guess it must be stolen or bought from some The Good Stuff video.
+
@@nannyoggsally +
Actually, more development should be placed on super conductors. Room temperature super conductors. Light weight, very powerful, and very durable.
Induce a magnetic field in a closed loop, and the magnetic field will be there until you open the loop, at which time electric current will flow. Many loops much current. The true future of energy storage.
“Keeelowatts”
"The future is not a mirror of the past", let's meditate on that for a moment ...
History reapeats itself
Oh I love that.. especially when the recent past was so full of success.. past advances do dont mean we will continue to advance that way. The future is not guaranteed to just keep getting better. Not if we keep counting on batteries.. there a dead end.. gotta be other ways.. and there are
Address it at the consumer side: use ice based thermal storage for air conditioning to shift the load to soften the duck curve, and have smart cloth dryers that start after peak hours is over.
These are so cool, this is the kind of thing I want to invest in
I'd be skeptical if I were you. Ideas like Energy Vault's simply cannot work. A lot of these are just scams.
Im make my own hydrogen now , thanks 💵
Interested in hydrogen low energy densities and high volume? How do you do it!
As a MS on EE and experienced worker with coal-fired and gas-fired power generation, I would like to stress that power generation using fossil-fuel can be quite clean in fact, but quite expensive and complex. You could imagine how many high-temp high-pressure (reaching 1500F/25MPa or more) valves and pipes and seals are in those power plants, needing constant maintenance or they'll leak or even explode. Those turbines are actually quite fragile considering how expensive they are. Therefore, these renewable things should really tackle the complexity and lifespan parts of the problem. The last thing we need is another high cost and high maintenance government-subsidized thing that's supposedly good for the environment...