'Take the damn filter off.' Former Remnant leader says church needs to admit role in child's death
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- Опубликовано: 24 авг 2024
- It's time for Remnant Fellowship to come clean about its role in the 2003 child abuse death of a young Remnant boy, says a former leader in the controversial Brentwood, Tennessee, church.
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A spanking and what happened to this child is not the same thing. Not at all. Hiding behind the church to abuse children is all this is.
It’s always heartbreaking when people misrepresent Jesus!
Yes it really is, and it’s usually cruel mean people twisting his love and his words, to harm others.
So very many do too.
Jesus will survive this mistreatment. The mistreatment of His children and the child Joseph Smith who died because of this outrageous perversion is more heartbreaking and the greater sin.
It's disgusting. Satan goes to church though. He wants to continuously ruin the body of Christ.
The entire Republican Party!!!!
Spanking doesn’t involve glue, switches, cords, and wire hangers. Neither does the Bible mean to half kill your child as a form of discipline. If a child receives a bruise you’ve hit them to hard. That’s abuse not religion.
Spanking is the word people use to describe hitting children with extension cords, mop handles, wooden boards, broom sticks, glue sticks, etc. So yes, it DOES involve using those objects. When we become a more civilized society, we will outlaw this kind of brutality towards children. I have a teen child who has never been in trouble with the law. He does not keep bad company, use profanity, or behave disrespectfully. He is complimented over and over again by adults who have been his coaches, teachers, youth group leaders, etc. He was raised with nonviolent discipline. One does not have to assault a child in order to get them to behave. My views are in the minority at most churches, but I don't care; my job is to shepherd and train my child, not beat and brutalize my child.
This is simply yt hatred. God sees all.
@@lovevioletflowers3442 Liar, you hate your child.
Agree!💯
I, for one, am tired of people using “spare the rod” as an excuse to hit their kid. If the Lord is your shepherd, think of how a shepherd uses the rod. He doesn’t hit them with it. He uses it to gently nudge the sheep away from anything dangerous or prevents them from getting lost.
Only a f’n coward hits a kid. You don’t hit people you love. It’s not hard to understand.
Exactly don't spare the rod does not mean abuse your child
Thank you for the explanation about the usage of ROD. It's important for us to realize the true definition of words used in Scripture and not add our own interpretation.
👏👏👏👏👏👏
People who use the BIble as an excuse to abuse their children are lost, vile people. But done correctly, discipline is done in love with the idea of correction, not subjection or fear. There is a huge difference. No welts, no bruises, no shattered souls…just a child knowing his momma or daddy loved him or her enough to set them back straight.
Well said!! I have *never* believed that our loving, caring, full-of-grace, Lord, and Savior, Jesus Christ wants us to inflict pain upon our children (blessings from above) for *any* reason. Jesus embraced children, He *never* hit or "spanked" any of them. Interestingly enough, I have managed to raise my eight children (most of their lives as a single parent) without laying a hand or anything else, on them. They love God immensely. Two of my teenage sons have consistently attended church without me since Covid. My oldest three said they never knew any other way than Christianity. Overall, they're amazing young adults/teens/preteen/and 9 year old.
If u ever watched any of her videos for Weigh Down in the early 90’s u wouldn’t believe it’s the same woman.
Power changes people.
So glad Michael is free.
Americans are very bad judges of character.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely!
I did the weigh down workshop through my church back in the early 90’s, she looked totally different back then. I never heard her speak about discipline and I don’t think she had a church then, not sure ? But all of a sudden our church dropped the program, I wasn’t even sure why, I couldn’t afford to keep going to classes anyway. Then several years later I heard it was because she denied the trinity, not sure if that’s why my church dropped her or what the reason was. Fast forward 25-30 years and I heard she died in a plane crash, I looked up the story and was blown away at what she had become, Satan sure got a foothold on her !
Pride, Selfishness, Greed, and Satan, too. She fell in love with herself.
@@rnupnorthbrrrsm6123k
Michael, you were a child too. And you didn’t know anything else but that place and those people. You deserve all the peace and happiness too!
I feel so terrible for Michael. I can’t imagine watching your loving mother turn into….whatever it is that Gwen Shamblin Lara turned into.
She did not turn into anything. This was who she always was. Americans are very bad judges of character.
She became her own god. The enemy is very good at deceiving us just enough for us to fall into ourselves and not even realize it. He than let's our flesh do the rest.
@@meleascott6490she was always her own god.
@@mpettway6982 💯
How does a person even come up with these means of torture, much less for a small child? It's horrific. RIP sweet boy.
Yet the church is still operating like nothing happened.
And "tax exempt"! Absolutely disgusting, to say the least!
immoral doesn't always mean illegal....
@@turquoismama33 murder isn’t illegal.
It should be shut down the Feds.
@@FullFrontalExposure Not the murder part, the false teaching and convincing people to hand over their money and to listen to her teaching and all the other stuff that leads to illegal stuff like child abuse and murder.
It’s so unfair to say “Michael was all in” he was a child, he knew nothing else. Show me one child raised in a cult that knows it’s a cult. You don’t know until you know something else about life besides these lies. As a child this is your whole world, these are the only people you know. Inside somewhere you know something is wrong but you don’t know enough to understand it all - yet.
Speaking from first hand experience here, but Michael was only a "child" as in not 18 for the very early years of the church. Very different from babies and toddlers being raised in the church. Still, I do not hold any of it against him as even full grown adults join all the time willingly. everyone is human and capable of being misled, but not everyone is capable of acknowledging their past as a mistake and seeking to change, so I am proud of him for that
Victory has already been given to this child of God. Exposure of darkness is on the rise!! Hallelujah & Thank You Jesus🙌🏽
I was part of the classes for a while and hosted one myself. Gwen was really amazing early on, but she went off the deep end, and I left when the leaders of the last group I attended tried to pressure me into leaving my church and join them, claiming that if there were any "fat" people at my church it meant they were not saved. It's all outward based. Cults are so dangerous and the effects are horrifying. Funny that I could see how they were a cult but couldn't see that the church I was part of was one also. God opened my eyes and brought me out of it all after 24 years. Denominations are manmade and have zero to do with someone's salvation. My heart goes out to Michael, and I am beyond proud of him for leaving Remnant and making this stand.
Gwen: “Nothing can stop me!”
God: Stops her
The police did. “God” gets no credit.
@@Abcdefghijk920I believe they're referring to the plane crash that killed her.
She probably is in 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
There’s a famous story of a mighty fearless strong warrior who cursed God and told him to come fight him, so how did God deal with this string and big might warrior? He sent his tiniest creature a nat to fly down his throat while he screamed and cursed him on this mountain and it choked him and he died.
I found it interesting that the terms of her divorce had her pay out her ex-husband a lump sum every year for three years. Almost as soon as she completed the third and final payment, she died in the plane crash. God knows what He’s doing.
I pray that Michael and the others who have left this cult can find freedom and joy. I pray he can have renewed faith in Christ and the Word of God, and can be a light to others.
Thanks Michael. The truth will set you free!!
The violence committed against this boy is also what the Utah "mommy blogger" did to her kids, smh...
Gosh, that case was horrifying. I have relatives who live in that area and they didn’t know the family but the people they knew that went to church with them knew not to let their kids near them, people knew and tried to alert authorities for a while that something was wrong
@disneyprincessintraining2725 Yes, I read that many people spoke up about their concerns, and they were ignored. I've also read that child abuse is often ignored in Utah
How sad for this child & other children who have suffered. It seems like this woman was running a cult and was seriously mentally I’ll.
Those people are abusing kids in the name of a fake religion 😢 and getting away with it
I joined a church group in the 90s that was going to study The Way Down like a Christian Weight Watchers. I went once. The first lesson was that we should memorize a verse and repeat it when we were hungry so that we wouldn't eat. The verse was a distortion of Psalm 141:3: Shut my lips, oh Lord. She said that we should use that to remind us not to eat, to follow the scripture. What that verse says is "3: Set a guard, O LORD, over my mouth;
keep watch at the door of my lips. Verse 4: Do not let my heart be drawn to any evil thing
or take part in works of wickedness with men who do iniquity; let me not feast on their delicacies." It has nothing to do with food, but with not following evil people in their actions. I never went back. I don't know what happened to the group, but I do remember hearing people claim they lost weight due to the program.
Wow, that's twisted. I'm glad you didn't go back.
What's amazing about them picking that verse is it still fits...just not in the way they intended.
God in Jesus Christ proving once again that He can use all things for good...including humans evil, distorted choices.
Be well and be at peace.
I'm glad you left, right away!
This is sheer sadistic brutality! Those parents of that one little boy murdered him. They got the right sentence for brutalizing their son!
Remnant leadership could have intervened when Joseph's father was beating him in the church.
They encouraged this type of discipline. Parents were instructed to do so in their pamphlets and church literature. Look at any one of the documentaries.
God bless Michael and give him the strength he needs through all of this!
5:42 Rest in peace, Joseph. They can’t do that to anyone else now.
No, his parents can't but how many other brainwashed ppl in that cult are still doing this to their children only hiding it better?
I got whooped but was never abused, theres a difference
Abuse it marks left is abuse. Color change ok but this is abuse
No shade, I got whooped too, but at the end of the day, it's abuse.
That poor young man. Sometimes churches are not houses of God I’m sad to say. They do not truly follow Christ’s teachings. I’m glad my church was a true House of God.
Every church I have ever been to preached hate.
@@DistrustHumanz try another. Christ taught us to love NOT to hate. You’re picking the wrong “churches”. If ya want to call them that. We follow the New Testament. That’s what you need to look for. Not hell fire and damnation. Jesus taught love thy neighbor, love even your enemies and those that sin as we all do.
@janwarriner6554 Just an encouragement Jan, the whole Holy Bible needs to be followed. The Old Testament is not just about "hell fire and damnation" it points to the need for a Savior in Jesus Christ. Plus God tells us not to take away (or add) to His word.
From the Holy Bible:
Deuteronomy 4:2 NASB1995
[2] You shall not add to the word which I am commanding you, nor take away from it, that you may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.
Revelation 22:18-19 NASB1995
[18] I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book; [19] and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his part from the tree of life and from the holy city, which are written in this book.
Be well and be at peace.
@@janwarriner6554What scripture do you think Jesus taught from? It was the Old Testament. Jesus is throughout the entire old testament, so why would you chose to ignore it and not study it?
@@dz7a756 I’ve read the entire Bible many times. The NT was written to record Christs teachings directly from God as opposed to using Prophets. I never stated the OT was anything lesser but the NT is more direct from zGod. Both parts are important for us to learn how to follow His way.
You need to study the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Michael, thank you. Phil, thank you too. I pray God will use this powerfully in many lives. I’m praying for you, Michael….God is there. Please stay in the word, pray for God to lead you in HIS truth. He promises that if we seek Him, we’ll find Him. God bless and keep you.
Omg she’s a bad liar. 🤥 that poor child.
When was the last time you saw or heard of a shepherd using his rod to beat his sheep? When you spare the rod, it means you are not guiding your children it doesn’t mean you should beat them🤦♀️ If you hit an adult it’s called assault but it’s okay to beat a child??? This world is seriously F’d up!
yes- a sheperd nudges the sheep in another direction!!
He has been hurt deeply. Poor guy, he has a big heart. He is eating his feelings.
Almost like a rebellion against his anorexic, narcissistic, psychopath mother.
This is not Christians. Real believers who know Jesus don’t beat their children.
Thank you for coming forward. ❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥
In situations like this. Seldom if ever does the church or the leader suffer for their actions. It's always the followers....
She died in a plane crash
Thank you to Michael for speaking out on this. It takes a great deal of strength to do so. God bless him. Where is this Ted Anger guy now? He isn't listed on the church's website as a leader there. I also thought his wife was quite involved there, too.
The fact that Gwen couldn’t say Joseph’s name. Telling
Indeed.
Thank god they are in jail.
too little too late, don't you think
@@larryhampton7587no. But God Almighty WILL still punish them. Their sweet boy is with Jesus now. Hallelujah 🙌
@@jesussaves7973So they don't deserve forgiveness?
@@RoyalMasterpiecethere is a difference between forgiveness and punishment. You can be forgiven but still be punished. Unfortunately if you do bad things you pay for it as you sow you will reap. You can’t destroy life and get away with it scot free, God will not be mocked. They may make it to heaven but rewards will be lost, 1 Corinthians 3:15 at least the little one is a peace with Jesus far away from wicked people.
My parents and brother go to this church. Have for over 20 years. My brother has two kids. He doesn’t like spanking and has resisted doing this. His children are NOT well-behaved. No better or worse than any other random kid in the world, but certainly not sweet angels. I know he is being counseled by their leadership to spank, but he resists and doesn’t do it often. I guarantee he has a pretty thick file on him. But their 5-year-old throws tantrums the same as any other kid. My parents put them up on a pedestal and act like they’re the most amazing kids, though. And the glue stick thing is 100% true. I’ve heard my parents talk about it.
Try to help him see that this is a high demand religion and he needs to get out.
Tax the church⚖️
Amen!!!!!!!
Sounds like a Earlier "Ruby Franke"
That Mormon love thing
I'm confused as to how one could whip a child with a glue stick.
Repeatedly Beating a Two Year Old Toddler is Beyond ABUSIVE! That Poor little girl - I hope she got away from her abusive parents and is doing okay now. 💔😢🙏❤️🩹
This sounds like what Carrie's mother did to her in the movie. These people are delusional.
Sadistic evil monsters😢
Oh my God Micheal Shamblin speaking out is actually a big deal.
That was terrible but Good for him to break free from Deception with GOD'S HOLY SPIRIT, HELP.
3:40 Body Language tells a lot. They answered No, but their heads said YES 😢.
Jezebel ‘s evil spirit arose in Gwen. I never knew or heard anything about this woman until now.
Thank God, her son was able to see the evil. He must now try to help these folks find the truth!
So sorry for this beautiful child! Such a heart break. I couldn’t watch this whole video bc I love my children, all children too much.
Sparing the rod” means that a parent must guide his or her child and teach the child right from wrong. It don’t mean beating the kids with rods or sticks and starving them to death, locking them up.
The south is awful.
Well it’s true children are never abused in the north. The kids up there are the ones who fart out the sunrise daily.
Read your bibles folks!
How about Understand your bible, folks! Takes more than just reading. understand
@@deniseandrews113Understanding will come from the Holy Spirit. But a number of Christians don't understand His role and ministry in their lives.
Be well and be at peace.
They beat their kid with hot coat hangers?!!
There is a difference in spanking and beating. I got spanked as a child but never beating.
How many more deaths IN THE NAME OF GOD
Wishing Michael healing and a peaceful life. One thing: I'm wondering why he said, "I now think something happened to little Joseph", after the child was cruelly and brutally abused until he died at the hands of his parents. 💔
Because he believed the lie that was told him, he now sees more of the truth, and no longer believes the lie that was told him.
@@turquoismama33 I appreciate your explaining that, thank you.
Looking at his picture, what a precious little boy. This is horrible. There is a difference between discipline and abuse. True Christians should never ever do this abuse. These people give, those of us who are believers, a bad name.
GOD is Love. REAL Love.
Some people have forgotten (or never known) what that is.
So I have been educated in scripture since childhood and even had four years of formal religious education in addition to normal school. Spare the rod spoil the child is not referencing hitting a child with a rod. It is a reference to a shepherd using his crook to remind sheep to stay together when traveling. He does not hit the sheep, he uses it like an extension of his hand/arm to guide. Sparing that guidance is what spoils a child, not refraining from hitting them, which we absolutely should not be hitting children
Gwen Shamblin had some nerve calling her CULT a "church." Smh. As she got more and more powerful that rat's nest on her head got higher and higher. How on earth did she even wash her hair??? Everything about her was bizarre.
Legal definition for abuse to a child: any time a child has bruises, bumps, welts, cuts, burns etc., it’s abuse, but there are some children, who have been starved to death, this is abuse as well; there are unseen methods of abuse to children, but it is still abuse! Neglect of children is leaving them alone or with irresponsible care takers, or no care takers, meaning they are left alone; not providing basic health and body needs including food!
I’m so very sorry for this handsome young child’s death, which if enough eyes had been on him and other children would not have happened! We, responsible adults are required to raise up a child in that admonition of The Lord, which means to teach them, guide them in LOVE, which excludes corporal punishment to a precious young child! We are our brother’s keepers therefore, we are required by law to report any suspicions of neglect or abuse of innocent children! You are protected by law when reporting abuse or neglect of any type, as you can remain anonymous!
Come on, everyone WAKE UP and RISE UP take a stand for RIGHTEOUSNESS, JUSTICE AND TRUTH, for everyone, especially children! We have an epidemic of missing children, teenagers and young adults, crying out for mercy from abductors and abusers! If you see or hear and can help, help, but you can also report any suspicious behavior or you can get vehicles information, addresses, etc!
Failure to to act to report abuse or neglect to a child, makes you part of the abuse and can be charged for failure to report, but willful false reporting can also met out legal charges! Children are our most precious valuable assets and must be protected!
Don’t use God’s Holy Word to justify abuse.
There’s a fine line difference of a spanking and a beating. And continued abuse.
Throw away the keys
Waa .. not religious if boy has bruises 😮😢👿🙏
How tragically wrong.
How can you whip anything, never mind anyone, with a glue stick? they're only like 3-4 inches long 🤔
I googled "hot glue stick" and see that they are cylinders that can be 8 to 10 inches long and about a half-inch in diameter that are put into a hot glue gun that melts it to do bookbinding, carpentry, hobbies, shoemaking, upholstering and various other applications. You can see what they look like on google. I imagine they would be painful if hit with one. Very cruel and very sad.
There are foot long ones for the larger diameter glue guns.
@@alisoncampbell9025thank you, I was guessing so.
Is anyone else cringing at them bragging about beating that 3 year old child over and over and over like they say, all night long? That’s a sadistic controlling sadist.
Teaching FEAR! This is ABUSE!
It;s so sad that Michael's dad has now passed away.
A spanking is a SHOWDOWN? A showdown the child never forgot?
That poor baby He's being in the arms of Jesus Christ right now That's why everybodyCrashed in the plane I truly believe god made Made, , CARMA
amen
If Jesus cared he would have stopped what was happening and the child wouldn't have died
Praying for all that are easily deceived by evil
@@joeybeard6157God gave you and I free will. You and I can choose evil or good. God did not make us robots.
@mandybradley3079 that's funny. I love how the free will speach comes now. Where is god or jesus to protect that child from death? Nowhere. The moment God or jesus looks bad or the god or jesus churches preaches about gets criticized then the goal post is shifted to cover up for unanswered prayers, especially how children who are beat or beat to death are ignored by your boys in blue and called a liar, or the parent that does care and tries to help is illegally gone after because cops and courts don't want the truth out that they don't care if your child is breathing and healthy or six feet deep and god and jesus allow it. So, it's freewill or god and jesus doesn't give a shit. Shift shift shift
Is she that weight loss scandal minister?
I believe in biblically defined spanking, but there is loving discipline and then there is just plain old abuse!
I agree! Difference smacking a hand and beating someone. That poor boy!!!
That "spare the rod, spoil the child" is getting OLD and I'm a fervent Christian. The Lord will NEVER tell you to murder your child. You didn't spare the rod just like you didn't spare your son's life.
Marking your child up by instrumentation is absolutely abuse. Discipline does not go off on the child. That’s the parents’ getting out of control which is not biblical.
This is all so messed up, so she dies, money goes to kids and not the church yet they make daughter the preacher 🤯 and so many things wrong with this community I won’t call it church, they are not acting on biblical teachings.
Creepy religion strikes again!😂😂
Fake religion…due to evil people wanting power and of course money!!
The priesthood is dead, people. Cultivate your own connection with the divine by using your common sense, if you have any. RIP, little one. Hope the parents spend the rest of their lives behind bars.
This was my childhood due to my abusive parents involvement in a cult. It was absolutely horrific and a lifetime of PTSD. I went no contact with my parents.
Im so sorry they abused you. No child deserves to be abused by their parents.
@@Webbgurl2000 I’m now raising a child and was given legal guardianship. I give her all that I was not given… safety and so much love! 💗
Don't blame this on God. There is a huge difference between disaplining a child and beating a child. They tied his hands behind his back. He was just a little boy 😔
The church is not where most of the demons are in wolves clothing 😢
OMG I wish folks who like to say "Spare the rod" would also recall the even more known verse "Thy rod & thy staff, they comfort me." A shepherd used his rod/staff to lead and protect the flock, they do not hit them with it.
I never hit my boys but they had discipline. Every age they had a currency and they got less, none or more depending on their behavior. Both had zero behavior issues, did well in school and worked hard at jobs. Just like in life, if you mess up, no one strikes you, that's assault. But we do that to our little ones... Makes no sense.
I wish that more religious people, like Michael, would see these obvious patterns throughout religions and finally realize, “hey, this is all just a bunch of bull crap”.
Taking your kids to church is abuse.
the church is good, the people, well.....
So he had bruises all over his body. They were monsters and should be in jail. Them religious nuts are dangerous
Abuse is abuse, so don't blame your lack of self control on the bible.
"The rod" in that verse doesn't mean hitting. It's talking about a shepherd's staff. Shepherds didn't hit their sheep with their staff/rod. If they'd hit the sheep, that would be like a supermarket manager going over to the produce section and smashing all the apples and watermelons with a big stick. They wouldn't sell much if their stock was all beat up. The shepherds held the staff out next to the sheep as sort of a portable fence, so the sheep would know not to go that way. The verse has nothing to do with hitting.
Amen 🙏🏼 I never knew that and thanks for the clarification 🙏🏼
This entire case is horrible and yet fascinating. I can't get enough I try to read and watch everything I can related to Gwen and Joe's rise and fall.
Poor little boy. He looked just like his father.😢
Remember Judah had the best teacher, best friend, and best counselor! It doesn’t define Jesus teachings of what Judah did to Him!
Jesus said:
“Here is the clear difference between God's children and the Devil's children: those who do not do what is right or do not love others are not God's children.”
1 John 3
However what is right is subjective to many. If one is still an unbeliever then the world dictates what is right not scripture. 🫤. Also many a fake preacher justifies what is wrong.
Tragic. I pray that the child is with the Lord Jesus’ everlasting arms 🕊🙏🏻
I don't have an ounce of sympathy for the Smiths, who murdered little Joseph. They were incompetent parents who killed their child. They abused that baby and they make me sick to my stomach. To me, the mistake that was made here is that the prosecuter who pressed charges against the Smiths missed an opportunity to also prosecute Gwen Shamblin and David Martin as accessories to murder. There are too many churches around that tell people they are supposed to hit children. The quote from David Martin in this video talking about a "showdown" where he kept spanking the child's leg over and over and over is sick and twisted and violent, and is typical for people who misuse the bible to play the game of "I'm bigger than you are so do what I say or I'll hurt you". Gwen Shamblin said at 3:24 that "if they're not scared of spanking then you haven't spanked them" is part of the problem of people in the pulpit who encourage their flocks to commit acts of violence against young children. As far as I'm concerned, both parties should have been sent to prison along with the Smiths, because they encouraged them to commit violence, and the Smiths were dumb enough to listen to them. 1 John 4:18 reads, “There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love." You cannot simultaneously make your child afraid of you AND teach them what it is to be perfected in God's love. We are not called to punish our children. Instead, we are called to discipline them - and ourselves. People who don't know the difference between discipline and punishment because abusers and they mishandle the word of God terribly. Poor Joseph. He deserved better. Gwen Shamblin is deceased, but if David Martin is still alive, he needs to be prosecuted for aiding and abetting child abuse and being a accessory to the murder of Joseph Smith. People like that are why I trust very few people, not even church people, with my child.
All of them need to go to jail. Whoever knew about it!
These cult, and the people who worshiped them.🤦🏽♀️🤦🏽♀️🤦🏽♀️
The son is compliant. His speaking up now does not absolve him.
The guy speaking now could've been asked and asked over and over. Why wait now? RIP the parents did this why did they? I know that verse but never beat my kids anything like that. How sad.
Killing kids in the name of Jesus, OMG. what is wrong with these people.
Imagine how many that would live if you listened nc5 or heĺped be a voice to stop the ongoing abuse and illegal attacks of a caring innocent parent. You only care after the child passes or suicide
They went far beyond spanking.
I don’t believe that the church was involved in the child’s death. Non of the other people hurt their children this same way. That’s crazy!!!
How did Gwen not treat her kids the same way? Then her son would know the facts to your questions.
Spare the rod spoil the child doesn't mean beat the child. Sometimes you dont even need to spank them and you can talk to them. Sometimes kids have emotions they dont understand and they need guidance more than redirecting. I feel lots of parent punish their kids for unnecessary reasons. I personally think the only reason you should spank them is when they are a danger to others as in violent or to themselves like getting upset and putting themselves in dangerous situations. I don't care if the child steals, lies, or talks back there is a way to redirect them in those situations too. When my daughter would lie I told her about the boy who cried wolf. Why its important to be trusted and how lying detroys trust. She will try to lie here and there and i tell her God sees all and hears all and she will tell the truth. Thats simple as that. When she use to steal i told her what she does to others will happen to her. You reap what you sow. I also told her how some things may be important to that person and irreplaceable. Later something was stolen from her and i did comfort her and told her how wrong it was but also reminded her of when i told her it would come back on her. She hasnt stole since. Sometimes they just need a understanding of why they shouldn't do something rather than automatically punished for it. Every mistake is a learning opportunity. We also must remember we made mistakes as kids too and dont want kids feeling mistakes are terrible. Mistakes are how we learn. If we make no mistakes we are doing nothing and learning nothing. My kids are well behaved and i dont have to spank them
Prayers and condolences
Michael your truly appreciated for standing up and telling your truth especially against these fake ass beliefs....