Can Dark Magic Be GOOD? - The Dragon Prince Theory
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- Опубликовано: 24 июл 2024
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The Dragon Prince season 2 delivered strong with lore and worldbuilding, and Dark Magic is no exception. Could the morality of use of dark magic in The Dragon Prince come back into play? Is there a work around for it to be used for good in the eyes of the elves?
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It broke my heart when sorin said “Claudia I can’t move”
And then she instantly abandoned her mission to help him. That... that was... I'm not crying, you're crying.
considering her father told her to abandon her brother for the egg, yeah I cried. I love stries like this! I'm so excited!
They did say that dragon snot has power so it is possible to use byproducts like hair for magic... so any magical sheep could equal free dark magic.
But you would only be able to make things comfy. What you use to cast a spell Corresponds to what the spell does. For example Claudia needed the life magic of young spray deer to fix her brother. Or when she needed those cave warms for that tracking spell. There are rules to what you use will give a certain effect. So you cant just take raw magic power to cast any spell.
@@dustinmccollum7196 Killing a deer to heal a person at the cost of some slight draining effect to the caster seems like a good trade. Sacrifice is something a lot of people don't get now a days. People from soldiers to servants understand that, it's how our world developed so fast and why we are not like the small hostile tribes that still isolate themselves to this day.
Also it's only been two seasons, if they reached the conclusion about dark magic already then the rest of the show will be pretty boring as you will just be watching a series of very predictable events.
Yes, we have already seen them use things like flowers, bone ash, severed tentacles and etc. for their spells, so it is possible to use dead things, plants and animal byproducts for magic without actually killing others.
@@dustinmccollum7196
I've noticed that too which begs the question, [spoiler]
What reagents did she use to cast the resurrection spell of the season 3 finale. Merely healing her brother's shattered spine took the life of a young deer.
@@TheZombiesAreComing shes using that saff they stole from the sun elfs. Its a very powerful magic source. Now there are some inconsistencies to rules of dark magic. We haven't been told or seen exact rules but this is what I think how it works judging from what we see them do. So when using bark magic if you want to cast a spell with a desired effect you use the magic from a creature with the ability or effects Sociated. Example Claudia using those glowing larva. She used the there life/magic force to cast a located spell using the glow of the larva. Now I believe she could do this same thing with a powerful primal source but it would take greater Effort and power to do it. When it was easier to do it with the larva. Dark magic is death magic when your casting a spell using dark magic your using up life energy.
There's another example in Dragon Prince. After Soren got paralyzed, Claudia was worried that he wouldn't have a great life even if he said otherwise. She has shown more than once that she cares deeply about her brother and Soren also cares about his sister. She used dark magic to give Soren the ability to walk again. I mean, yeah, it sucks that a baby deer died in order for the spell to work, but Claudia did that to help Soren move again and a chance to live a decent life. In that situation, she killed one animal to help someone and one dead deer isn't going cause extinction.
Similar to the king when he had to decide between 10,000 people and one lava creature.
That’s part of the reason why I think that dark magic shouldn’t be proscribed outright, but instead heavily regulated. Making it illegal will only drive practitioners into hiding, and god only knows what kind of dangerous experiments they’d do there. Keeping a tight control without alienating the practitioners (see the relationship between mages and Templars in Dragon Age for what *not* to do) is most likely the optimal path. Thankfully, nobody seems to be summoning demons, so that’s a point in their favor.
And as far as Dragon Age games go, I know more than a few mages choose not to rebel and even managed to get along with the Templars. That doesn’t change the fact that enough mages did feel alienated so that they were easily swayed by those wanting to change the status quo for the rebellion to become a problem. This means that some part of the system wasn’t working right. Haven’t managed to find a play through that let me look into this (if there is one). It’s always one way or the other, and I can’t help but think that they’re doomed for a repeat if they can’t figure out what went wrong.
@@coltonwilliams4153 Oh my gosh, dark magic Prohibition. Dark magic Mafia. Dark Magic speakeasies.
@Kassquatch Watch I was thinking more along the lines of releasing an undead plague or demon horde upon an unsuspecting world, but that works to. Prohibition certainly wasn’t gonna do anything besides make everyone criminals.
So far the series has leaned on the idea of Dark Magic's worth being in the greater good it could establish. It might be interesting if it was revealed that Dark Magic was used as a tool of liberation for Humans against the oppression by Magical Creatures (as hinted at in the text on Aaravos). That the Elves and Dragons didn't just antagonise Dark Magic because of it's costly nature but also because it threatened their status and the status quo. The show could actually interrogate the idea of the "Greater good" vs "Slippery Slope" in situatione where violence might really have been needed to get out of a desperate situation.
If years of anime has taught me anything, it's that dark powers are always secretly good.
good comes from evil
and evil comes from good
geardog24 Yup, just like the entire Japanese culture in comic writing or anime writing atleast, believes a "demon" king is the savior of all...Fuckin ass backward, ehem
akcbawdr.
Actually sounds like a name...Strange.
@@emmanuelkings327 KRZi-O i get that
There is always a cost for using Dark powers though. It is not always secretly good.
@@TwinWarriorGaming theres cost to magic always light or dark
2:46 The current issue with the line of thinking in TDP is that the killing of creatures for meat, material, medicine or other purposes hasn't been condemned in show yet. Unless the show address this or adds anything to the act, a lot of anti-Dark Magic characters look like hypocrites.
i dont dissagree with you i do agreee the the elves are kinda elitist pricks but it is possible that dark magic has some other implications like it could destroy the soul instead of just killing or mabe its just super painfull.but it is alo possibe the elves are just dicks who write off dark magic because it not "nateral" or they dont under stand it so its bad or some thing to do with the guy in the mirror
@@aawallace98 the elves are pricks abouth magic in a cultural level, the thing about dark magic is the risk for the user (dark side erosion) and the possible risk for the world since dark magic maybe totaly consume the primal energy in their spells so endegering the world (just like oil)
There is more to Dark Magic than just killing creatures for magic obviously. There is a price to be paid as the king said. It obviously corrupts the caster with every use. That is probably the main reason it is so despised. There also is the fact that it can cause miracles just like it can cause suffering. Remember when the elves were trapped in coins?
@@TwinWarriorGaming The latter could probably be applied to most magic, but aye, it's negative health impact seems to be the best legitimate argument against if it's more than just cosmetic. Still, that doesn't make it necessarily evil and could still be practiced in a socially responsible way.
I mean dark magic has its logical conclusion in TDP. The use of magical beings for power. elves and dragons are magical beings. they know they are eventually fuel for a dark mage trying to one up a rival. Its more akin to cannibalism than meat consumption. Its one thing to raise a cow to eat, its another to raise a child to eat.
When Claudia was describing the magical properties of Dragon mucus and saliva and horns and such, something occurred to me; why does a magical creature have to DIE for those? Humanity is well known to be pretty well versed in domesticating creatures that offer positive benefits- like cows and goats for their milk. I'm not saying to domesticate DRAGONS of course, because that doesn't really fit with the theme of the story, but I could see Dark Magic evolving into something similar to the ancient practice of Alchemy- specifically Spagyrics (alchemy focused on the use of plants) with some uses of animal byproducts like horns or shells- things that animals naturally shed and regrow.
I think the main reason why dark magic is looked upon as evil is because primal magic is the ability to BORROW the world's elemental powers and use them at will, whereas dark magic is the ability to TAKE from the world and use its power at will from stealing the life of another. This is the main reason why it is seen as taboo. Dark magic itself is usable after commiting an evil act, but can be ultimately used for good depending on the individual
Ultimately primal magic is the same way though. What ultimately matters is your application of said magic
Final fight will be between fully-realized Callum and Aaravos-enhanced Claudia. Calling it right now. I think the final idea will be that you can't not be corrupted by the dark magic.
It doesnt seem to actually corrupt people. The main conflict is between blimd idealism and cold pragmatism. Dark magic is pragmatic in its nature. Sacrifice one for the sake of many. And it isnt really that unnatural, because people (and elves) hunt animals for food and etc. anyway.
@@FerunaLutelou
From what I've seen, dark magic does indeed corrupt though, both the body and the mind. The most obvious sign of corruption after using dark magic is pitch black eyes which gets progressively worse depending on the strength of the dark spell. Viren's face tends to resemble that reassembles a demon's after using powerful dark magic.
There is also that more and more of Claudia's hair turns grey as she uses dark magic, for the purpose of healing at least. It's possible that using dark magic drains some of its user's life force along with the entirety of the life force of the creatures used to fuel it's spells.
@@TheZombiesAreComing that visual "corruption" doesnt prove anything.
@@FerunaLutelou
It does though, grey hair is symbolic of old age and in any series where a character gets artificially aged, their hair turns grey which is what seems to be happening to Claudia.
As for Viren the more he uses dark magic, the more demonic his face looks. This is why he is constantly consuming butterflies, they power an illusion spell he needs to keep renewing to hide his dark magic corrupted face.
@@TheZombiesAreComing we have no proof that it actually corrupts the user. The only ones who think it does are other races, and they are driven to think so by fear of being used as ingredients for a spell. We see the dark side of the force from Star Wars corrupting people, their whole being, and we know the force has a will of its own. We dont see much proof of that here with dark magic. Claudia is still Claudia, she didnt change much from season 1 episode 1.
There seems to be two loopholes that can make dark magic less morally questionable: magical creature don't have to die (like, dragon's horn still useful to mage, same with gryphon eye) and magical creature can be already dead, at least it look like so.
But isn't "dark magic" just a name for "magic used by killing a magical creature", like it isn't a "type" of magic like sky and moon magic is in dragon prince?
A lot of peeps in real life who are witches or pagans like to throw around the phrase "There is no good or bad, simply power- and how you choose to use it" - Saying that - "All magic has a price, the hardest decision is whether it's a price you're willing to pay"... In most fantasy black magic is magic where the cost of mana or life-force is too big to be paid by just the caster, meaning you either need to parasyte people to cast it - or do it as a part of a massive coven. You know - like 10,000 mages casting a spell that basically nukes a country. That's dark magic.
I'm a pagan I don't know anyone who says that... the only person I ever heard say that was professor quirrel and he had a dark wizard grafted on the back of his head.
In series they mention that there is a lot that can be done with things like dragon spit or snot . So it seems no kill dark magic is possible.
That is what I always had a problem with the show, is that they keep saying that dark magic is bad but not really explaining why. Yes, it takes life from other creatures but how is that any different from killing an animal for food? Or chopping down a tree to build a house. Also if the translated text say anything about elves is that they oppressed the humans when they were in Xadia, because they were the only non magical creatures and were looked down because of it. So dark magic seems like the right answer because it was the only way to make the elves look at humans as equals. But the show tries to show that the humans were the ones who are the villains despite the fact that the Elves are just as guilty even more so than they are. The show tries tells you that the world is morally gray, but never actually showing it.
yes, but the unicorns (who were driven to extinction by humans) gave humans primal stones to use. so dark magic wasn't needed. the other fear is that humans will get so strong that they hunt elves and dragons for dark magic
What do you think will happen to Claudia? A part of her hair became white like the first dark mage from season 1 ep 1
"Dark side erosion"
Her ark in the second season kind of reminded me of Azula’s ark in the third season of the last Airbender. She was ok as long as things were going her way and she was able to predict what was happening, but the moment everything started collapsing around her, she got paranoid and went insane.
I think a part of Claudia’s sanity actually was lost the moment after she healed Soren. You can hear it in her voice right after that she is not mentally ok. If i had to guess, she’s either gonna realize whats happening to her and stop using dark magic for good, or continue on a downward spiral until she truly does go insane like Azula
@@davidblass3767
I don't know why but I'd probably cry if Claudia gets an Azula endgame.
As I see it dark magic despite being more pricey of the bunch is overall not a problem. But I can assume that in using it 1) the user can't be weak willed or severely inexperienced or else the flow/process will backfire to great effect. 2) It must be used in moderation or the use of it will become much more apparent on the user. 3) Also no high or grand tier spells less you run the risk of possible corruption or worse.
They call it dark magic but I think a better word for it suppose be forbidden or corruptive magic. Dark magic is the use of living things or anything with magic in it, drawing it's power out, killing the creature or burning said item in use. As for how it corrupts, not just visually but mentally the individual becomes more twisted or comfortable expending the lives of others to serve the users purpose. Like in Callum's fever dream, a part of him was trying to make himself more comfortable with the idea of using dark magic.
Also sorry to call you out, but yin and yang is not about good and evil (bad).
I have a theory that dark magic might be possible without killing anything. First, what about creature parts that either naturally come off or can be removed painlessly--feathers, antlers, shed skin/scales, hair/fur? Do they retain their energy, at least for a time? It seems like parts taken from dead creatures can be preserved for later, so...? Then there's the question of a magical creature allowing you to directly utilize some of its energy (since it seems like they expend and regain magical energy just like humans do with chemical energy), like a familiar who can transfer its energy into you. Y'know. If you're nice and you have snacks.
I consider Dark Magic as humans rising against their oppressors, only to be punished for it.
but they had primal stones.
It could be like in Dragon Age. In the Tevinter imperium, mages are allowed to use blood magic but only if it is their own blood. It is not considered blood magic as long as the source is the user. Maybe Dark magic can be use as a last resort by using their own life force ? Maybe it doesn't need a magical creature.
I've been thinking the same thing!
Gabriel Forget I friggin love DA, dope theory btw
Probably not
Yeah but why would any sane individual use their own life force when they could just kill a deer
Dark magic can do good, but it self cannot be good. It's an allegory for Machiavellian philosophy in the show, it can do good but it is morally dubious.
This is shown by Callum experience, that without his interference, both the dragon and Rayla would be dead, but he nearly died himself, and in the end he found one life more important than others.
The philosophical conflict presented is the elven idea that the actions define morality, and the human ideal that consequence defines it.
Many bring the point that dark magic is equivalent to eating meat, as one isn't wrong, thus neither is the other . For that argument, I'd say that there's a difference between need and want. You must eat to survive, but dark magic is a individual need for power. One is an instinct that you cannot ignore, the other is a conscious choice.
What I really like about what the dark prince did with dark magic is that they gave it a reason to be disliked and feared. It’s bad BECAUSE it takes another beings life, and the elves and dragons are the races that above all else, see value in all living creatures big or small. (It’s slightly hypocritical that the elves say this and look down on humans, but for the sake of that one episode with the dragon, let’s quote on Raylas philosophy here). However, it doesn’t erase that there may be a necessity for those that need to be eliminated in their eyes. For example, although Runaan understands Raylas sympathy for not killing a human, he understands that they have a job to perform and that it is necessary to kill them. And while the philosophy may not be agreeable, TDP really taps into sacrifice of one thing to save another (see Claudia with Soren, or Callum with the dragon).
I think that in the dragon prince dark magic is neither good or bad it’s just the act of taking magic from other creatures and using it for ur own purposes. However I think as the story progresses we will continue to see that doing dark magic is not only harmful for the creatures u use but also harmful to urself. It’s not the normal flow of magic so hurts u in ways that normal magic would not because it was not meant to be used like that.
We’re already seeing what it’s done to Viren, and how it’s already affecting Claudia’s appearance.
@@jbcatz5 Yeah exactly! Also how it effected Callum too. he just used it once and he immediately got sick. I wonder if Claudia and Viren got sick too when they first used dark magic and also had crazy fever dreams but chose dark magic right away instead of saying no like Callum did. I also wonder if all humans could learn magic like Callum. Maybe by using dark magic for the first time is sort of gave Callum a connection to magic, but by saying no to dark it opened the door for him to make a real connection with sky magic. Maybe humans aren't completely disconnected from magic they are just really really far away.
We're already seeing this. When Callum used dark magic for the first time he got one hell of an acid trip, When Claudia uses dark magic her hair becomes increasingly more gray (this effect may be limited to using dark magic for healing), and when Viren uses dark magic his face looks increasingly demonic (it only looks normal in public due to an illusion he maintains by sucking the life out of butterflies)
In addition to this, dark magic ALWAYS results in pitch black eyes that seems to return to normal after a while.
@@TheZombiesAreComing The fact that the dark eyes go away on their own makes me believe Virens corrupted look also goes away by itself it just takes longer proportionate to how much he used in a spell, he might just be using the butterfly's to speed it up. Also the issue with dark magic erosion is that Viren has been using dark magic for years (if not decades) and was fine by the start of the show so I don't think dark magic always hurts you, that might just be a cost for doing something ridiculous like healing someone that's paralyzed or bringing someone back from the dead
@@joeblazer3429
I do not understand why people go out of their way to defend Dark Magic, it is malicious at it's core and all the clues are there.
As the saying goes, "the eyes are the windows to one's soul" and with Dark Magic the eyes turn pitch black, symbolizing corruption of the soul.
Grey hair is symbolic of old age, both artificially and naturally. With Claudia's hair becoming increasingly more gray each time she uses Dark Magic for healing, I think it is safe to say the cost of using Dark Magic for healing is some of the caster's own life force in addition to the other reagents used. Since some of the caster's life forced is used to power the spell, they are artificially aged as a result. (Resulting in something like this: ruclips.net/video/2F-GTfi1pIc/видео.htmlm20s )
With Calum he only used dark magic once and fought against it's influence but it still resides inside him as evidenced by Sol Regem smelling the stench of Dark Magic on him.
That said, I doubt the butterfly magic speeds up the "healing process" on Viren was merely used to power illusion magic (aka glamour) to hide the corruption Dark Magic caused to his body
I think that somehow they'll find a way to make it good/neutral because of Claudia. Due to her good nature if dark magic was always going to be evil then she would need to eventually give up dark magic to complete her character arc, but I fell like that would be pretty unsatisfying because Claudia has already spent all this time becoming a badass mage and what really defines her is that she's so resourceful and adaptable. What I think will happen is that Claudia will get some sort of animal companion that allows her to draw energy from it and that will allow her to do dark magic in a morally good way.
We've already seen a lot of people in this world that have animal companions with whom they are a closely bonded team (Ellis and Ava, Villads and Berto, Lujanne and Phoe-Phoe, even King Harrow and Pip seem very close) So I don't think its too much of a stretch to think that Claudia could end up with an animal companion of her own and due to her being very resourceful it shouldn't be hard for her to figure out a way to use that creature's energy in a way that doesn't harm the creature or possibly is even beneficial to it.
I also was on the train of thought when I was watching the series. I just hate banning a magic form outright because of the stigma around it. I mean it can give someone the ability to walk! That's incredible. Honestly, I wouldn't mind killing insects to get the power needed, but more sentient creatures I have a problem with. So, it definitely would need to be regulated somehow, but not banned.
Yeah, but unfortunately, elves tend to be rather extremist.
@@haveagoodmourning dark magic isnt needed at all. humans had primal stones and the unicorns to help them.
Maybe Callum with Caldia's help can create a primal dark source for dark magic
Woo. I love the dragon prince
I do think we’re going to see some redeeming qualities to dark magic. But I don’t think Callum is going to be the one to unlock them- I think Claudia will. Claudia is set up for a tragic downfall, I doubt she will be redeemed honestly, but I think at the end of her character arc the forces of good will be able to salvage some things from her life’s work as a mage because ultimately she’s too complex a character to write off as simply evil.
I know Dragon Prince is all kid-friendly but Avatar gave us blood bending which makes this 'Dark magic' look tamed.
Counterpoint: It's tamer because it's used much more frequently than blood bending was
Claudia said that there's a a hole chapter on dark magic just on the use of dragon snot, so it can have a renuable source, but it does seem to to have a phisical negative efect evenon experienced users
The only issue I have with dark magic thus far is the apparent fact that constant usage of it can cause disturbing side effects such as physical corruption, violent dreams/hallucinations and possibly loss of rationality since Viren acts so violently with such little provocation.
Dark Magic is tricky. on one hand, it's easy to use so, you could get carried away with using it, even for evil purposes. on the other hand, you could use dark magic for good reasons, but like i said, it's tricky.
well there is a saying.
"Power doesn't measure a man nor does it corrupt, power reveals. when they obtain the power that they always wanted, their true nature are laid bare"
Nah man, any power that comes from negative source (like emotions or in this case death) may look good at 1st but end the end, its never good. For one thing, the cost of long-term use of Dark Mage seems to be.....corrupting (referring to Virin's monster-ish form & whatever happened to Claudia)
For dragons, they can use the horns and snot for dark magic.
So I’m not very smart, but for the episode that Callum used dark magic, why didn’t he and Ezren tell the guards and soldiers to stand down? They’re princes, and even though Ezren wasn’t aware that he is technically king, as Crown Prince, he should still be able to hold authority over the soldiers like Soren did as a Crown guard? Prince>Crown guard
Just a couple of episodes ago, Soren and Claudia tried to forcefully drag them home so I'm sure they would have preferred to avoid that of course it could also be a plot hole.
"It's not the power that hurts people it's the people using it" Cole Mcgrath Infamous 2
Short aswer: yes.
Long aswer: yes, but long teem exposure and usege can be dangerous for the user and the world
I think this can be decided by whether or not the death of the animal is required for it to work or if you can just use for example, some cut fur, or some already shed blood, to use dark magic without actually causing the death of the creature.
Just got my mom hooked on this show and its amazing
It’s like Fullmetal Alchemist and concept of equivalent exchange, where there is a cost equivalent to the outcome. Characters who try to use alchemy for very ambitious ends pay an ambitious price, which the Truth entity ensures as a way to keep the balance and discourage others from pushing the boundaries too much. Trying to bring their mother back from the dead, which is simply not done, costs protagonists Edward and Alphonse Elric most of their very flesh, with Al’s soul forced to inhabit a suit of armour. The macguffin of the series is the Philosopher’s Stone, the only substance known to override equivalent exchange so Ed can restore himself and his brother.
Simple transmutations, like removing metal from a floor to form a sword, isn’t an issue nor is manipulating the elements like fire or water, because it’s playing within the natural order. Resurrection, souls, curing blindness or even playing god, that will have a price, and a hefty one at that.
the key factor is that is specifically said it steals the magic in any magical creature but depending on the magic of that creature the dark magic is limited in the regard it must steal just the amount from that life-form (basically if you need one of the 6 you must find the creature attaining that specific source before you can use it, this explains why Veran needs Aarovos to use the power he had for the final fight)
I however do believe we have seen light magic already for Callum was taping into it the sky primal has he was connected and found tranquility within(light would be the opposite of dark but have similar results so light magic just may be using the other 6 but ironically using them harmoniously as it is a extension of yourself and creation, this just may be his first step therefore not as immensely powerful as we think light magic would be), Aarovos May have already mastered it(his eyes were white/blue when using his powers and channeling that through veeran making his eyes the same color then returning dark once gone) but in order to test its existent it must be taught to a non magical being(for if just one elf of one of the 6 sources could do it, why not a human), the key of Aarovos May just be that a key that can only be used by a master of all 6 primal sources a master of light magic essentially, to use them all/any harmoniously(the key may just contain his teachings, much like the holocrons from Star Wars that contain information but only a force user can open it or used to unlock force walls in the temple) a dark magic user may not be able to use it for they must use a great amount magic which may prove to be difficult since they have to steal that from others born with it
whether or not Aarovos introduced dark magic the fact remains that he is trapped for an unknown reason, if he did then why did the elves and dragons deflect from isolating the humans rather then simply guiding them not to use it, and if he didn’t then he simply was on the side of elves but was commuting some form of treason in order to be the personal prisoner of thunder
In the end the there are 7 sources of magic in the dragon prince, the last source is light/dark magic the usage on the other primal 6 (light/dark magic are one in the same just the method is the only difference as well the side effects and the consequences)
The question is how or why you uses any if all the 6(7)
Light: for selfless reasons, being harmonious with creation(Good)
Dark: selfishly, to your own ends, taking creation for granted to form your own version for the world(evil)
Just my my own thoughts about it Let me know your own
i hope Claudia learns Star magic arcanum.
Hell yes. Me too. I've been hoping for that ever since Aaravos was officially introduced and we got to see Star magic.
It just really suits her aesthetic. And it would be neat if we saw humans other than the two brothers tap into primal magic.
Well it depends on how we see dark magic, if we see it as "using the magic of another (magical) being" then i could definitely see something like magical creatures willingly giving a bit of their magic to someone maybe even different creatures with different type of primal magic to be mixed and used by a single being, hey that could be "light magic"
*yandere claudia, please*
Honestly I think it's going to come down to: does dark magic corrupt the user like it's kinda looking like it does (the white hair on Claudia, Viren's messed up skin, etc). Because there are definitely spells they do that would require killing the creature, but others don't. Ones with feathers, hair, horns, etc. Also the ones that kill insects I find hard to sympathize with, especially the spider for the fire spell or the slugs. The use of magical creatures I think can be debated as at very least not evil, it's the corruption I am interested to see how they handle.
Dark magic seems fine in moderation. For starters it seems like body parts work, so you could drain creatures that died of natural causes for energy, or even cut their nails, hair or horns and use those for magic. Also it would probably be justifiable to sacrifice things like insects and stuff if it can benefit people greatly. Also it seems like event plants might work in some cases. You shouldn't be sacrificing rare endangered species, or intelligent creatures but sacrificing a worm or a mushroom is probably fine. It can be a slippery slope, but there definitely seems like you can come up with a reasonable balance.
I once heard somewhere that magic is neutral, and that is all depends on the wielder. As a fiction writer, I say while magic is for the most part neutral there are some forms of magic that shouldn't be dabbled in. For example, in the movie The Sorcerers Apprentice there was a spell that allowed one sorcerer to steal the magic from another. That kind of magic, should be outlawed. That, and dark magic is dangerous, unpredictable, can have unforeseen side effects, is like a really addictive drug, and... look at Claudia and Viren. Dark magic seemed to steal their sanity. Now I get wanting to help family, like when Claudia's brother lost the use of his legs, but murdering a living creature... that's the worst. I mean if you need an example on how bad dark magic is, just look at Voldemort. He was no longer human. All in all, I say dark magic is a short cut that comes at too high a price, and should be heavily off limits.
Kind of taking the two ideas you presented, and combining them, suppose you had a large number of magical creatures, and took a small amount of magic from each one? You wouldn't hurt any of them, but would still be able to get enough magic to perform a spell. Obvoiusly not the most practical solution, but it is a potential one.
they can probably just store the magic that they collected. if all the creatures have magic imbued in them, then just have the Mages travel with Hunters when they get food. Each kill that they get they can just store the Magic into their Primal Stones. the stones managed to store all the other magic so it wouldn't be out of the ordinary if the stones can store the magic they accumulated. food is food
I was talking about this a few days ago. Killing these creatures is seen as evil. But that doesn't me what you do with the magic can't be good Claudia for example healed her brother and brought her dad back to life. I had a problem with sol regium so ready to kill Rayla and Zim after preaching about dark magic. At least like if life was that precious to you then you wouldn't try to killed two innocent people. At least dark mages use the animals and don't just kill it for no reason like you.
I think the answer is yes and no.
No in that dark magic requires the sacrifice of a living creature/thing to work.
Yes because it can be used for good like how they used dark magic to change the weather to avoid a famine or to help a paralyzed person to walk again.
Also, there may be some spells that require renewable parts of things like snot.
i think that killing a magic deer for magic isn't worst then killing non magical deer for food especially when it's for healing or feeding people
Why would he need dark magic now? He has sky magic
Yeeeeeee!!!!
You didn't touch on the most obvious workaround: using your own lifeforce. If Callum can use primal magic without a primal stone, then let us just assume that he is in fact a "magical being". If that's the case, maybe dark magic could be used by ways of a blood offering of sorts. That would be the most ethical way (maybe the only ethical way) of performing dark magic.
I love your video's
Magic being "dark" doesnt equals evil.
Is the same discussion as Star vs.
Magic isnt inherently good or evil. It just the person whose using it.
are you talk about star vs the forces of evil?
That's an interesting point. However you ARE Satan so...... grain of salt.
I see magic as a tool, it's use depends on the caster. It is similar to Dark Side from SW: it's not stronger, but faster, at a price.
I honestly don't agree with dark magic being shown as a shortcut. There is a big price to pay for using it.
Furthermore, shortcuts are shown as a bad thing, but honestly, that's literally how progress works: we are doing something hard way, then someone finds a better (easier) way to do it. There is nothing wrong with taking easier path, as long as it's really easier. Dark magic isn't. If anything, it's a harder way, where one has to constantly fight against corruption from within.
I would say, that unless this "cost" is rendered moot (someone who doesn't care about being corrupted), it's only advantages are being quicker path to power and being most available path for humans, as primal sources are too rare.
it's not a good argument when the magic you're wielding is literally corrupting you
@@floricel_112 I disagree. Just cause there are side effects to using something doesnt mean its evil.
Any such discussion is going to run head-long into our (or even their) limited understanding of how exactly this works? Where does the 'energy' come from? Where does it go? If a snail or deer has some type of primal energy in it... where did that come from? Can you create it by raising herds of deer? When you use the energy to cast a spell... where does the energy go? Back into a snail? Can you just kill old animals? Or could you just kill cows, chickens, or pigs which you were going to slaughter for food anyway? How about a diseased animal? Does it exist in bacteria or algae? It is wrong to then grew algae and then harm it? Where does the energy go? Back into the animals, or is it permanently gone?
*The Legends of Korra background music was greatly appropriated!*
Thanks for asking the question, even though you kinda got off-track a little bit by discussing other magic systems. But I digress.
I can see an argument being made for either way. I dont think the magic system has the traditional good/bad or light/dark magic dichotomy. The system in TDP seems to be that magic is power that comes from a source (more like an on/off switch). And that power can be drawn from one of the six primal sources, or it can be siphoned and warped into another form, which is dark magic. Arguably, this warping perverts the original magical form, which is what makes it evil. Alternatively, dark magic consumes life force for an optional activity, which is more destructive and less justifiable than simply killing a thing and consuming its flesh for sustenance (a necessary act).
On the other hand, Claudia makes a compelling argument. Humans (to their knowledge) cant do regular magic for lack of a primal connection. In order to have parity with other races, they took the necessary steps to acquire power via dark magic. And power is neutral; you can use it for cruel ends, or you can use it to save hundreds of thousands from starvation from one ritual. Its easy for magical races to condemn humans for using dark magic when they were privileged or fortunate to be born with power, as their magic would save them from many calamities and tragedies. Without dark magic, humans would not be so fortunate. Is it right or good to stand by and let lots of people die when you have the power to save them? Viren didn't, and he saved many lives. That kinda makes him a hero, his current actions notwithstanding.
Ultimately, I think we need more info. Specifically, we need to know more of the metaphysical reality of this world to make that judgment. What happens in the afterlife? Does using dark magic destroy the soul, depriving the creature of an afterlife? Or is it just wasted energy because the soul or individual consciousnesss does not persist after death? Knowing the answers to these questions would make it easier to answer this question.
Let me ask you this what difference is there between eating a fish to survive or using a fish for dark magic to survive? Also some spell don't require the creature to die Some spells require a unicorn horn and if unicorns are like deer or rhinos you can cut off their horns and let them grow back or you can go with the use every part logic where you use the meat and fur for food and clothes and everything else for magic.
I will acknowledge that there have been times in the Dragon Prince in which Dark Magic Spells have been used to good effect, that it is possible to misuse the more traditional Arcanum, and that one extreme can be, and often is, just as bad as the opposite one. In return I ask you to consider the following points.
1 Calumn, Claudia, and Viren have all suffered negative physical effects from the use of Dark Magic, and if the dreams Calumn experienced during his coma are anything to go by, there are also negative psychological and possible spiritual impacts as well.
2 Viren and Claudia have both been observed to use increasingly destructive spells. It's implied in the last scene of Book 3 that she killed someone, possibly more than one, to "heal" her father, and Viren's coin spell is downright sadistic. This shows the addictive nature of Dark Magic.
3 The dragons and elves consider Dark Magic to be an abomination and, since they are magical creatures, I think their opinion should be respected, out of common curtesy if nothing else.
4 In at least one fantasy franchise I know of, magic has been described as a weave or fabric. If the same holds true in the Dragon Prince, then it is reasonable to assume that ripping the magical lifeforce from a magical creature to power a spell might do more damage to that fabric than simply killing it for its meat or hide.
5 Calumn has learned to use the Sky Arcanum without a Primal Stone. I know some people believe it's because he's of elven decent, or even a descendent of Aavaros, but I do not think that is the direction the creators of the series will go and would not be surprised if they've written a scene specifically to debunk that hypothesis. In that case, there is an alternative to Dark Magic for humanity and the above reasons say they should take it.
6 Viren, under Aaaros's direction, tried to suck the life from Zym and intended to do the same to his comatose mother. I believe that the fear that a Dark Mage would eventually try to take the lifeforce of a dragon or elf was precisely why the dragons and elves sought to put an end to Dark Magic, in which case their worst fears have been realized. The fact that it was a Star Touched Elf, supposedly the noblest and most enlightened of them, makes it all the more frightening.
7 What if there is no creature that can be "infinitely harvested" for Dark Magic spells without harm?
The video is fantastic and I love how shows are showing Different types of different of morality and how everything is not always black and white or good vs evil back then tv shows only show that white is good and good guys never do bad things or that bad guys are inherently evil and do bad things because it’s fun I Especially love the legend of korra the bad guys were very morally gray the still did horrible and cruel things but they always had Justifiable reasons and motives justifiable reasons motives to why they did those actions and you feel sympathetic for them even though they did bad things and that’s what I love about the new era of cartoons and how it’s teaching people that things aren’t always one sided and that humans are flawed and that we both have light and darkness/good and evil and that’s ok because we all can learn and grow from our actions
You might want to consider punctuation... that was a handful.
I don't think yin and yang works in a western mythology based world though i don't think dark magic is inherently evil either.
I don't think it's evil. It's just another source of.. things? I mean, killing a frog and a deer to save someone's ability to move is not that evil. The magic itself is not really evil. It's the after things that is, and the way people treat the magic. I love dark magic, and I think some people control it for good.
Many people kill and eat farm animals, but they very rarely end up killing and eating other people. Claudia's progression over the first three seasons shows the danger of dark magic.
Nope, dark magic is dark because it's derived by dark actions, I suppose you could bring into, does the ends justify the means, argument into it, but to me it doesn't. Plus I'm pretty sure Aaravos manipulated the world by creating dark magic and getting the humans to believe it's the only kind of magic that they can use so he can manipulate that, idk maybe when people use dark magic he then dark magics them, like if humans take energy from creatures, then Aaravos can take magic from those humans. Idk. It's definitely bad mostly. I don't think that the people that use it have to be bad, as seen with Claudia and a bit with Callum, but as a magic, it is bad.
As other people have said, it not only takes, it corrupts.
We kill cows chickens and pigs for food So what's the problem in killing them for magic
*possible spoiler* I don't think dark magic is inherently bad. You don't necessarily have to use live creatures you can use things like their carcass after death or any natural piece of them like a tooth/horn that may grow back without harming the creature to its death. I think it can be used for good so long as you don't lose yourself in it. Like what you were talking about in that episode with callum where he was fighting off the dark side in him he was able to keep his mind from corruption whereas we kinda see the opposite with Claudia.
👏
"Like what you were talking about in that episode with callum where he was fighting off the dark side in him he was able to keep his mind from corruption"
Here the thing about that, he was fighting against it in it's entirety, not just it's corruption. When the cube lit up as dark magic for him, it was as bad for him as "I am your father" was for Luke. He knew dark magic was wrong and didn't want to use dark magic, he wanted to use primal magic. By fully rejecting dark magic, the sky arcanium made itself known to him.
Also, dark magic seems to take a toll on the body. You're already familiar with Callum's dark magic induced acid trip, in addition to that we have Viren who's face resembles a demon's now and Claudia who is is developing an increasing amount of gray hair (which symbolizes old age)
I mean I don’t really have a problem with them killing insects, but when it’s like sentient magical creatures, then that’s when the water gets muddy...
I wonder if maybe Aaravos has used dark magic despite being an elf? After all, he is there when Callum is in his dream like state. Or maybe he helped humans discover this source? I am not sure but I think he may have been the catalyst for dark magic to be discovered by human mages.
While it hasn't been mentioned yet and there is always the possibility of a twist down the line, Aaravos definitely seems like some shady evil guy that they are setting up to be the cause of a lot of problems.
Well even if their a way to use Dark magic for good it will still results in negotiate feed back.
or you could use plants
If there’s dark magic.......
Then is there light magic 😱🤔
There are 6 of those
That would be Primal Magic
@@blackvial Yeah.
As dark magic is only "dark" because it is considered a corrupt counterpart to primal magic, the "light" magic in comparison would be primal magic.
Any magical power is like a gun the gun isn't evil it's just a tool to be used by a person.
Guns are killing machines, dark magic is fueled by death, but its purpose isn’t to kill. There’s literally no good thing you can do with a gun.
@@felipevasconcelos6736 it can be used to save yourself or other people how is that not a good thing ? For example I much rather shoot a threat in the brain or heart instead of watching them kill a loved one in front of me.
Dark magic seems to damage the user
@@codyhamilton7716 That's still murder. It's understandable in such a case, and I wouldn't say you're evil for killing someone to protect your life or someone else's life, but it's still not a good thing. We don't trade lives.
@@felipevasconcelos6736
You sound like a typical liberal, but hey if you welcome a random stranger to shoot you because you don't want to shoot them, that's your problem.
Only the way Callum used it is good.
Just as I finished season 2
I mean it’s no more immoral then eating meat really
You don’t have to do it , you have other options (plants) but it makes things easier and the alternatives (supplements to replace things only found in meat/expensive alternatives) can either not be gotten or won’t help in the situation
So in the real world would anyone refuse a cure for full body paralysis just because it was made from a cute baby animal.
Oh my gosh, thank you.
I mean they do eat animal, so what’s wrong with using it to make magic? And most of the animals they kill are things like bugs, or slugs
The problem with Dark Magic is that it's like drugs.
Callum never used dark magic again...
It's because his relationship with Rayla gave him an empathy for magical creatures that Viren and Claudia never developed.
Cool
Was hesitant to click on this bc I didn’t really know how you were gonna make murdering animals good but the idea you may not need to kill them is pretty rad
Sith murder people for dark magic ritual all the time and they can heal by draining the life force from people. People just don't talk about it because they just watch lore video and like the idea about dark power.
It kinda makes no sense why its thought to be evil amongest humans like we have done way worse things to animals for like for instance hunting some species of whales to a exstinction for fuel so we wouldn't have a problem hunting them down for power
It is on the cube thing so i think it’s not ‘bad.’
Is that the atla theme I hear in the background ?? :))
I was about writing it
1+1=11
2 + 2 = Fish
3+3= infinite
@@StevengcCR well done
I think it would only be good if the creature he killed to obtain dark magic was bad to begin with. Otherwise I don't think they'd say killing creatures is ok
dark magic seem more like a drug
Not my baby Callum
it can be used for good
I want to know why Callum's body rejected dark magic
Not body, mind. He desperately wanted to be a mage again, but he knew dark magic was wrong.
@@TheZombiesAreComing He didn't "know dark magic is wrong" he used it wrong. There's nothing wrong with dark magic if you know what your doing
I think looking at the universe of the dragon prince dark magic is evil. The character of Sarai who I think story wise is the wise warning that dark magic is evil. Now with that being said the origin of drak magic may not be inherently evil.
Ok dark magic call it necromancy Ok? And I don't see a slug dying oh no but a dragon or human or phoenix no
Just listen to dumbledore
**FFXIV Shadowbringers theme intensifies**
The Greater Good is in itself a logical fallacy.
How?
@@wasserruebenvergilbungsvirus People that think they know what's best for everyone tend to not listen to anyone. This is why you get people like Dan Harmon has encouraged the death of people the deaths of people that they disagree with over video games because they think their standing up for women.
@@wasserruebenvergilbungsvirus not everyone agrees on what is good
I'm wondering if all the elves are vegan...?
Dark Magic so far appears to be the most versatile of the 7 sources of magic, which of those have some flexibility but ultimately constrained by its source's limitations.
The benefit of the primal 6 sources, is that they can be drawn from the source and use the caster as the focus with little negative effect that has yet to be perceived.
Dark Magic on the other hand, has no known "source", and forcibly consumes the magic energy from creatures to power the spells. The problem with Dark Magic is that as it's being drawn to the focus, it consumes a small part of the user as it's expelled.
Aavaros may have found the "source" of Dark Magic, which may be why he doesn't look corrupted like Viren does after he casts Dark spells.
I personally suspect that the "source" of Dark Magic may be Outer Space itself or a singularity like a Dark Hole.
Aether Veilborne The six primal sources are renewable (the primal stone Callum used contained a storm, which he used to channel wind and lighting) and those able to access them understand how not to take too much. Dark magic doesn’t require this understanding, so practitioners aren’t averse to taking too much of what’s pretty much life energy, regularly killing magical creatures instead of taking not so much that they’d still live. It can also give them something of a god complex, they think themselves above the natural order and make their decisions accordingly.