Wait what? I'm doing my undergrad at uw madison right now in aerospace and this is the first time I've hear of them. But yeah the program is not bad at all.
Y’all seem to have done your homework for this awesome project. I have a suggestion for future options on the DarkAero, anti-lock brakes. And what ideas do you have for cabin heating and cooling? Waiting for the next video.
Ugh great channel guys. Love what ya'll are doing. Used to operate mori's in an ISO shop doing a ton of sub work for boeing. Now back in school working on my degree but man oh man do I miss this;. Keep these vids coming!
Nice! I machined parts for the Canadian space station arm and Canadian satellites back in the day! I hope you are using "flight" certified aluminium. Also have ndt done afterwards to make sure properties in aluminium haven't changed and or micro fisures haven't occurred.
Your shop is so clean. Really impressive. Then I was shocked that you threaded those holes freehand rather than on a drill press. I'm not a machinist, so I'm expressing surprise and not criticism.
Its probably already been said but I would really suggest a thread insert like a keen-sert or even through bolting, to avoid thread gulling, fastener corrosion, and the ability to take the components apart more than a couple of times.
Come on everybody watching the videos, I am not affiliated with them whatsoever… However, the work they do is so incredible; at least Subscribe to help these guys out… They need every nickel and dime they can get. Besides, their work is outstanding.
Have you guys considered anodizing the aluminum landing gear parts? It provides a strong finish and awesome aesthetics. Might be worth the time it takes to learn the process... :)
😁 Figured we would catch some heat over the threading. Agreed that chip evacuation is dodgy at best with the straight flute thread tap. Thank you for watching and thanks for the tip!
one way to help ensure your tap goes in straight when tapping by hand is to make a tapping block. just a square block with a reamed out hole very close to the major diameter of your tap to hold tight to your workpiece to guild the tap into the hole perpendicular to the hole. I have even 3d printed a tap guild before that I needed to tap a PVC end plug on center at home where I have a lathe (chucker) that can drill the hole but no good way to tap it. However, I think ultimately thread milling would be the best option in my opinion.
Jeremy, thank you for watching and the comment! We agree on the tapping block solution. Also agree that the thread milling is the best approach from a production stand point. The way we did it in the video doesn't represent our intended production approach. It was more of a temporary solution as we haven't invested in the proper tools yet.
@@DarkAeroInc cool. just wanted to give you some ideas. and the idea of using a 3d printed tap block if you need one in a pinch and in an awkward spot is something i have not seen done before. the one i made worked quite well for my application just another idea to add to the problem-solving book. thank you for making the video i love to see the tormach in action because i would like to get one in the future in my garage. looks like you guys are doing good work and i would love to see how the machine handles a thread mill.
you can use recycled PEEK and then reinforced it with long or short carbon fiber. PEEK can be cheaply produced with biobased chemicals and solar furnace. Also you can use topology optimization software and create parts with molds.
Super stuff! As an artist I thought of an idea that might help with fund raising. Not sure if it is feasible cost wise, but have some small display models made for purchase in addition to your apparel line.
Great question! The DarkAero 1 is intended for paved runways, not unimproved or rough fields. It is not a STOL or bush plane so you need to use a proper runway. You don’t typically find debris on a runway large enough to damage the brakes, so, not a likely risk. Thank you for watching!
Just curious, will you be using titanium hardware? Also, what are the requirements regarding safety wiring? Is that required in these applications? I'd assume so, as you don't want brakes/wheels to ever come off :)
Just curious if you have accounted for the squatting tendencies of a trailing arm suspension system when the brakes are applied heavily? Have you seen any Wilga / Draco videos from Mike Patey? Is it possible to increase the shock pressure proportionately with the brake pressure?
Great work. I don’t know why you made soft jaws on the part with parallel sides. I might drill and mill one of the holes through the part and use this hole center as the origin once the part is flipped.
Peter, thank you for watching and the comment! We had considered this. However, the backside holes are less than 0.25" in diameter and our probe diameter is 0.20". The concern was for errors that could arise from geometric multiplication effects.
@@DarkAeroInc You can use gage blocks at the ends of your workpiece to probe against and substract their width to x axis, or simply use a flat piece against the sides of your 2 vice jaws and push your piece against it, then probe the side of your fixed jaw (make sure your vice jaws are paralell.
Love the video....being retired from the post office ..I had 2 year of cad /cam in my apprenticeship,....I’m interested IN the program you use to feature the 3D SCREEN SHOT AND moving it around dimensionally...(,that’s how long I’ve been out of it ) I would like to check it out or , try to use it or I ever get a cnc machine
7075 in T6 is susceptible to stress corrosion cracking (or at least that temper isn't in the "good" table of the MSFC paper on SCC). I think T7351 is on the "good" table. Is that an issue for an airplane? I sometimes think the SCC worry is overblown, but it is something that comes up. Maybe it's not an issue for you. FWIW, more tempers of 7050 are okay, and it machines easy. I really enjoy your channel, thanks for sharing.
In order to have SCC, you need to have residual stress (not likely on a non-welded component) and corrosion, again not likely if this part is to be coated.
Hello, I'm new to this channel and I really enjoy seeing machining + cad design combined, so thats really cool. How are you doing the strength calculations and/or simulations?
Can you post the cad drawing file. I am a high school engineering teacher, I would like my students to create the part in Inventor then 3D print the part out. As a project for the class. You have a great channel.
Beringer uses a floating brake disc design that is a bit different than standard brake designs that use a disc that is bolted to the wheel rim. The teeth fit into corresponding slots on the rim which rotationally lock the disc and the wheel while still allowing the disc to float in the axial direction on the rim. This ensures the disc remains aligned with the brake caliper and limits heat transfer from the disc to the wheel.
I doubt the CNC manufacturing capability is going to be the limiting factor early on. And once they get to the point where it is, CNC is very easily farmed out to outside shops. Send them a file, get back a part.
Pranoy, feel free to use an image of the trailing link. If you like, you can email us at info@darkaero.com and we can send you a higher resolution image.
That going to be a very expensive part for someone to purchase down the road. BUT, well done. With all of you having engineering degree's, I'm sure y'all know the meaning of KISS? Get a set or two of these Mighty Bites, save yourself possible fixture/soft jaw building/cutting. I have 3 sets in my t/box.
Those parts are pretty cool but look extremely expensive to produce. Do you ever do a cost analysis on individual parts and processes? I can think of many ways of producing this cheaper.
Thank you for watching and for the question! We do look at cost on all the parts we design and manufacture. :) We work with a few prototyping shops that have quoting software that can predict manufacturing costs of components. For a CNC machined part, the material choice, dimensional tolerances, surface finish, batch size, and part geometry can easily affect the cost by an order of magnitude. Incorporating auto quoting tools into our design process helps us design parts that can be manufactured cost effectively. In parallel, prototyping parts on our own CNC machine gives us a better understanding whether a part is easy or hard to manufacture. One thing we wanted to communicate with this video was that these parts could be successfully produced on a common, entry level CNC machine. There are other approaches that could produce components that look like the trailing link parts we made but the material strength requirements, dimensional tolerances, and surface finish narrowed down our options to a billet machined solution.
With the design, a slightly longer bolt and self locking nuts would be better. Threaded aluminum is never a good idea, especially fine threads in aluminum. A heli-coil or similar insert would be better, but with the room available a nut is the best option.
Ned, an ATC would be awesome! We would like to upgrade our CNC for production which would include an ATC. We are looking forward to optimizing our machining production with a more palletized, part batched approach.
Just saw you tapping into aluminum! With a power drill!!! That is a high stress part. THAT WILL FAIL on you! Those bolts will pop out on a hard landing. I am in a quality experimental dept for a reputable private jet company in Canada! High stress thread in aluminium you usually use a heli-coil. Even then, involved with an aircraft I would change idea on that concept.
I thought it was a decent video overall. I did cringe when you tapped with a hand drill, not saying it wouldn't work but a thread mill might be a better option on the tormach in lieu of rigid tapping.
What’s The maximum gross weight for your landing gear unit… What is it rated for Max? Also, eventually will you “guys” (“your company”, lol... that’s what you get for making yourselves feel like family to all of us Lookee lews and gawkers) sell your landing gear units for experimental aircraft builders?
Thanks for watching! You give us too much credit on the machining tolerances. ;) There is still enough room/slop for the additional thickness anodizing will add.
@@DarkAeroInc Just make sure you do Type II and not Type III. ;) Also make sure you nickle seal the parts if they are black. Will stop them from turning purple from UV light. I know the struggle. Have parts I made on the Mars rover and in a bunch of airplanes/jets/satellites. Plating is a bitch to deal with. Especially the platers... Hey we dumped a whole cart of your parts on the floor, but we will do the next batch for free.... Facepalm....
www.yardleyinserts.com/product/25020qs1-5/ press fit threaded insert, just a suggestion. Tougher threads and no need to get made fun of for your tapping technique.
It's very neat, simultaneously concerning for cost, production time and weight. Have you done yourself the favor of designing a welded tube solution and comparing relevant parameters? You are 4 smarts guys 2-3 years into this? and not close to finishing the first prototype yet. If welded tube is vastly superior then you cannot afford to be irrationally in love with milling and crash on its shores. Similarly if a tadpole body has plenty rigidity from its compound curves then why are you doing elaborate internal bulkheads with holes and custom fasteners. If a shell with perhaps a few strips of core material under a few more layers is plenty stiffness then what are you doing. If by believing you are doing it the proper engineering way you end up with something 10x more difficult to produce, weighing double and half as fast then was it really the proper engineering way. Keep it simple and optimization is king. I've seen several outfits stubbornly run out their clocks with darlings without merit. If milling only looks and sounds cool but fails on actual figures of merit, do you love it enough to fail over it.
all these young lads aren't old or experienced enough to know that nose gear goes through a lot of stress through bolts are a must just a university degree is not enough this from snobirdaircraft
"Crazy" all that CNC goodness and you used a hand-drill to drill them out. Just like some lazy school boys, and I saw the nut wobble when you was screwed in that nut. So when it all comes together it's just going rub the parts inside for no reason apart from your school boy antics.
I can't think of a better advertisement for The University of Wisconsin-Madison's engineering program than the DarkAero team.
Wait what? I'm doing my undergrad at uw madison right now in aerospace and this is the first time I've hear of them. But yeah the program is not bad at all.
You look like you're having so much fun... I'm happy to be along for the ride.
Guys this has to be my favorite DarkAero part
That is one beautiful piece of engineering. Joy to watch.
That's a piece of art!
Thank you! :)
I never thought I’d watch a video about machining landing gear parts, but... here I am!
2020 man 🤙🏼😂
Another way to prevent your screws from being too proud is to tell them to sit down and be humble
True! 😂
Awesome.. The details you show during building is really encouraging...
Y’all seem to have done your homework for this awesome project. I have a suggestion for future options on the DarkAero, anti-lock brakes. And what ideas do you have for cabin heating and cooling? Waiting for the next video.
You are better than my online manufacturing lesson. Thank you guys.
Epic. Looks great. Cutting the threads on the finished part free hand must have been scary!
Proud to see our French brake maker, Beringer, in your hands
Ugh great channel guys. Love what ya'll are doing. Used to operate mori's in an ISO shop doing a ton of sub work for boeing. Now back in school working on my degree but man oh man do I miss this;. Keep these vids coming!
Nice! I machined parts for the Canadian space station arm and Canadian satellites back in the day!
I hope you are using "flight" certified aluminium. Also have ndt done afterwards to make sure properties in aluminium haven't changed and or micro fisures haven't occurred.
Those are some good looking parts!
Your shop is so clean. Really impressive.
Then I was shocked that you threaded those holes freehand rather than on a drill press.
I'm not a machinist, so I'm expressing surprise and not criticism.
Its probably already been said but I would really suggest a thread insert like a keen-sert or even through bolting, to avoid thread gulling, fastener corrosion, and the ability to take the components apart more than a couple of times.
Come on everybody watching the videos, I am not affiliated with them whatsoever… However, the work they do is so incredible; at least Subscribe to help these guys out… They need every nickel and dime they can get. Besides, their work is outstanding.
I gotta get me a CNC mill. That looks sweet!
So awesome. Beautiful parts!
Thank you! 😊
Aerospace engineers AND master machinists!
Have you guys considered anodizing the aluminum landing gear parts? It provides a strong finish and awesome aesthetics. Might be worth the time it takes to learn the process... :)
I machine landing gear too. Made from G5 titanium for the A380. Are all your parts aluminium? Good job and nice machine 👏🏻👍
Great videos guys, keep 'em coming. Use a spiral flute thread cutter in blind holes for proper chip evacuation though, makes all the difference.
😁 Figured we would catch some heat over the threading. Agreed that chip evacuation is dodgy at best with the straight flute thread tap. Thank you for watching and thanks for the tip!
Looking forward, what about the bond between the trailing link and the landing gear strut?.
What was the decision for not going metric?
How do you guys know how to build all of this stuff?
one way to help ensure your tap goes in straight when tapping by hand is to make a tapping block. just a square block with a reamed out hole very close to the major diameter of your tap to hold tight to your workpiece to guild the tap into the hole perpendicular to the hole. I have even 3d printed a tap guild before that I needed to tap a PVC end plug on center at home where I have a lathe (chucker) that can drill the hole but no good way to tap it. However, I think ultimately thread milling would be the best option in my opinion.
Jeremy, thank you for watching and the comment! We agree on the tapping block solution. Also agree that the thread milling is the best approach from a production stand point. The way we did it in the video doesn't represent our intended production approach. It was more of a temporary solution as we haven't invested in the proper tools yet.
@@DarkAeroInc cool. just wanted to give you some ideas. and the idea of using a 3d printed tap block if you need one in a pinch and in an awkward spot is something i have not seen done before. the one i made worked quite well for my application just another idea to add to the problem-solving book. thank you for making the video i love to see the tormach in action because i would like to get one in the future in my garage. looks like you guys are doing good work and i would love to see how the machine handles a thread mill.
you can use recycled PEEK and then reinforced it with long or short carbon fiber. PEEK can be cheaply produced with biobased chemicals and solar furnace.
Also you can use topology optimization software and create parts with molds.
What do you do with the waste aluminum?
Super stuff! As an artist I thought of an idea that might help with fund raising. Not sure if it is feasible cost wise, but have some small display models made for purchase in addition to your apparel line.
I'm curious why y'all are tapping the threads with a drill. The 1100 should have a tapping function. Awesome work non the less
Very interesting.. You guys know your stuff. Break assembly is very close to ground level. What about damage on rough surface, grass field, debris...
Great question! The DarkAero 1 is intended for paved runways, not unimproved or rough fields. It is not a STOL or bush plane so you need to use a proper runway. You don’t typically find debris on a runway large enough to damage the brakes, so, not a likely risk. Thank you for watching!
I Love IT thanks for This brautiful vidéo ❤
Just curious, will you be using titanium hardware? Also, what are the requirements regarding safety wiring? Is that required in these applications? I'd assume so, as you don't want brakes/wheels to ever come off :)
Do you actually feel a difference between a Beringer caliper and a lower end one?
Just curious if you have accounted for the squatting tendencies of a trailing arm suspension system when the brakes are applied heavily? Have you seen any Wilga / Draco videos from Mike Patey? Is it possible to increase the shock pressure proportionately with the brake pressure?
Great work. I don’t know why you made soft jaws on the part with parallel sides. I might drill and mill one of the holes through the part and use this hole center as the origin once the part is flipped.
Peter, thank you for watching and the comment! We had considered this. However, the backside holes are less than 0.25" in diameter and our probe diameter is 0.20". The concern was for errors that could arise from geometric multiplication effects.
DarkAero, Inc That explains it! Thanks for the videos. Keep it up.
@@DarkAeroInc You can use gage blocks at the ends of your workpiece to probe against and substract their width to x axis, or simply use a flat piece against the sides of your 2 vice jaws and push your piece against it, then probe the side of your fixed jaw (make sure your vice jaws are paralell.
Love the video....being retired from the post office ..I had 2 year of cad /cam in my apprenticeship,....I’m interested IN the program you use to feature the 3D SCREEN SHOT AND moving it around dimensionally...(,that’s how long I’ve been out of it ) I would like to check it out or , try to use it or I ever get a cnc machine
Not from mechanical background. Curious, how does one test equipment like this without actually flying?
7075 in T6 is susceptible to stress corrosion cracking (or at least that temper isn't in the "good" table of the MSFC paper on SCC). I think T7351 is on the "good" table. Is that an issue for an airplane? I sometimes think the SCC worry is overblown, but it is something that comes up. Maybe it's not an issue for you. FWIW, more tempers of 7050 are okay, and it machines easy. I really enjoy your channel, thanks for sharing.
In order to have SCC, you need to have residual stress (not likely on a non-welded component) and corrosion, again not likely if this part is to be coated.
Did you get Finite Element Analisys on these parts? Seems these are quite critical during an hard landing...
Hi Sergio, thank you for watching! We did use FEA on the landing gear parts to predict stresses and deflections.
@@DarkAeroInc Anyway incredible job and craftsmanship...
Hello, I'm new to this channel and I really enjoy seeing machining + cad design combined, so thats really cool. How are you doing the strength calculations and/or simulations?
good job guys
Can you post the cad drawing file. I am a high school engineering teacher, I would like my students to create the part in Inventor then 3D print the part out. As a project for the class. You have a great channel.
beautiful piece! how do you filter the coolant, is coolant a one time use?
I was starting to think you guys never made any mistakes... glad to see some apprentice marks in that vice 😉
🤫 no one needs to know 🤓
Power drawbar is well worth what it costs. Tapping head would be worth it too.
That’s an interesting brake disc. Are those “teeth” some sort of trigger wheel for ABS? Is that another video??
The disc needs to be able to expand and contract with heat cycles. So those teeth allow it to spin put keep it located in the middle.
Beringer uses a floating brake disc design that is a bit different than standard brake designs that use a disc that is bolted to the wheel rim. The teeth fit into corresponding slots on the rim which rotationally lock the disc and the wheel while still allowing the disc to float in the axial direction on the rim. This ensures the disc remains aligned with the brake caliper and limits heat transfer from the disc to the wheel.
Looks great. What's the plan for volume production of these machined parts once you start shipping kits?
I doubt the CNC manufacturing capability is going to be the limiting factor early on. And once they get to the point where it is, CNC is very easily farmed out to outside shops. Send them a file, get back a part.
Hello there! I'm working on a university project on structure optimization. Would it be okay for me to use an image of the trailing link on DarkAero?
Pranoy, feel free to use an image of the trailing link. If you like, you can email us at info@darkaero.com and we can send you a higher resolution image.
@@DarkAeroInc Much appreciated!
That going to be a very expensive part for someone to purchase down the road. BUT, well done.
With all of you having engineering degree's, I'm sure y'all know the meaning of KISS?
Get a set or two of these Mighty Bites, save yourself possible fixture/soft jaw building/cutting.
I have 3 sets in my t/box.
That is some risky tapping
I thought the same. Seems like a drill press or knee mill would be more rigid and better for such a critical hole.
Motorcycle brake calipers are often threads in 7075..
Uncoated polished carbide endmills work better. Good efforts
Those parts are pretty cool but look extremely expensive to produce. Do you ever do a cost analysis on individual parts and processes? I can think of many ways of producing this cheaper.
Thank you for watching and for the question! We do look at cost on all the parts we design and manufacture. :) We work with a few prototyping shops that have quoting software that can predict manufacturing costs of components. For a CNC machined part, the material choice, dimensional tolerances, surface finish, batch size, and part geometry can easily affect the cost by an order of magnitude. Incorporating auto quoting tools into our design process helps us design parts that can be manufactured cost effectively. In parallel, prototyping parts on our own CNC machine gives us a better understanding whether a part is easy or hard to manufacture. One thing we wanted to communicate with this video was that these parts could be successfully produced on a common, entry level CNC machine. There are other approaches that could produce components that look like the trailing link parts we made but the material strength requirements, dimensional tolerances, and surface finish narrowed down our options to a billet machined solution.
does it really work?
Are you 100% sure, that threading aluminum is the best solution?
With the design, a slightly longer bolt and self locking nuts would be better. Threaded aluminum is never a good idea, especially fine threads in aluminum. A heli-coil or similar insert would be better, but with the room available a nut is the best option.
And don’t forget to lock-wire whatever option of bolt or through bolt and nut fastening system you eventually finalise on using!
Great vid. I wish I could afford to buy you guys an atc because manually changing tools seems to be really annoying.
Ned, an ATC would be awesome! We would like to upgrade our CNC for production which would include an ATC. We are looking forward to optimizing our machining production with a more palletized, part batched approach.
I don't get notifications of your videos even though I've turned it on
Great vid as usual. What brand of shocks is the one you are using?
Ivan, thank you! We use shocks from TK1 Racing.
Tank God for CAM.rigth.
Just saw you tapping into aluminum! With a power drill!!! That is a high stress part. THAT WILL FAIL on you! Those bolts will pop out on a hard landing.
I am in a quality experimental dept for a reputable private jet company in Canada!
High stress thread in aluminium you usually use a heli-coil. Even then, involved with an aircraft I would change idea on that concept.
I thought it was a decent video overall. I did cringe when you tapped with a hand drill, not saying it wouldn't work but a thread mill might be a better option on the tormach in lieu of rigid tapping.
I think someone already asked, but will you guys do initial flight tests on your own?
Thanks for the question! The initial flight testing will be conducted by a test pilot.
oh no, this is giving me ptsd to my schooling with tormachs, 2 years of conversational only ;(
I think I would have made the parts in wood or plastic first to make sure everything fit!
Yea, that's jank tapping a hole with a power drill. Get a little manual tapping machine. But other than that, I want to buy one.
😁 My tap handle broke so I improvised. Thank you for watching until the end!
@@DarkAeroInc it totally works haha but why not do it with the CNC?
What’s The maximum gross weight for your landing gear unit… What is it rated for Max?
Also, eventually will you “guys” (“your company”, lol... that’s what you get for making yourselves feel like family to all of us Lookee lews and gawkers) sell your landing gear units for experimental aircraft builders?
Your 1100 is so much quieter than mine.
Looks like a nice fit. Would be a shame if some one plated them..... Dun dun dun...
Thanks for watching! You give us too much credit on the machining tolerances. ;) There is still enough room/slop for the additional thickness anodizing will add.
@@DarkAeroInc Just make sure you do Type II and not Type III. ;) Also make sure you nickle seal the parts if they are black. Will stop them from turning purple from UV light. I know the struggle. Have parts I made on the Mars rover and in a bunch of airplanes/jets/satellites. Plating is a bitch to deal with. Especially the platers... Hey we dumped a whole cart of your parts on the floor, but we will do the next batch for free.... Facepalm....
www.yardleyinserts.com/product/25020qs1-5/ press fit threaded insert, just a suggestion. Tougher threads and no need to get made fun of for your tapping technique.
It's very neat, simultaneously concerning for cost, production time and weight. Have you done yourself the favor of designing a welded tube solution and comparing relevant parameters?
You are 4 smarts guys 2-3 years into this? and not close to finishing the first prototype yet. If welded tube is vastly superior then you cannot afford to be irrationally in love with milling and crash on its shores. Similarly if a tadpole body has plenty rigidity from its compound curves then why are you doing elaborate internal bulkheads with holes and custom fasteners. If a shell with perhaps a few strips of core material under a few more layers is plenty stiffness then what are you doing. If by believing you are doing it the proper engineering way you end up with something 10x more difficult to produce, weighing double and half as fast then was it really the proper engineering way. Keep it simple and optimization is king. I've seen several outfits stubbornly run out their clocks with darlings without merit. If milling only looks and sounds cool but fails on actual figures of merit, do you love it enough to fail over it.
ruclips.net/video/w7s2LOW63Z8/видео.html these are the parts if you care to watch.
Ребята когда проект взмоет в небо
Lovely machining, but get yourself a tapping arm. You cannot hold a drill perfectly perpendicular to tap.
Aint no other way of putting it; tapping a hole with a hand drill is jank.
all these young lads aren't old or experienced enough to know that nose gear goes through a lot of stress through bolts are a must just a university degree is not enough this from snobirdaircraft
"Crazy" all that CNC goodness and you used a hand-drill to drill them out. Just like some lazy school boys, and I saw the nut wobble when you was screwed in that nut. So when it all comes together it's just going rub the parts inside for no reason apart from your school boy antics.