Is your GPU underperforming because of your NVMe SSDs?
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- Опубликовано: 8 янв 2024
- Prawn here looking at what can happen if you populate all the m.2 NVMe ports on your motherboard or if you're using a PCIe Gen 5 drive on a motherboard that supports it but at the result of reducing the GPU lanes.
In this video I'm using the MSI MAG Z790 Edge TI Max Wifi from a recent build. This motherboard offers the ability to use a Gen 5 NVME drive in the top slot, but if you do then you can only run your graphics card with x8 PCIe lanes instead of the usual x16. I thought this would be a perfect time to test the real-world difference this made so I benchmarked a few different games including Red Dead Redemption 2, Rainbow Six Siege, Assassin's Creed Valhalla and 3D Mark Port Royal.
I was hoping to show what would happen in this instance. So you can see the real impact of doing this. I will note that I've also run other motherboards where I filled all the ports on the motherboard with NMVe SSDs and the same thing happened, but I also used those systems as my daily driver and didn't notice a massive difference in performance even at 1440p.
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Perfect timing for my build, I have two M.2 drives to install on my Rog Strix Z790 gaming-e WiFi and was advised to use slots 2 & 3 and didn’t know if it was that much of an issue, and although performance is close it’s not worth the risk of damaging performance so will go with slots 2 & 3. Thank you
Youll only lose 1-2 fps on most games except on Metro Exodus which youll lose 15fps.
There's something comforting about his voice, a very "don't worry, it's going to be okay here have some hot cocoa" vibe. Your channels helped me make more decisions than I can count, thanks brotha!
Glad you liked my style and that I've been useful!
This has been tested extensively; on modern GPUs, you don't really see much of a performance hit until you drop down to PCIe 3.0 x8, and even then, it's pretty negligible.
Yes, except for the Radeon 6500 XT, due to it using only 4 lanes.
You mainly see the biggest difference in 1% lows at high fps or when the game is demanding a lot of work from the GPU, especially textures.
It’s a small but measurable difference on high end GPUs it was about 5% on my 3090
@@chincemagnet so it depends on mobo, but my gigabyte mobo let me stay in pciex16 even with an ssd in that slot. what i did lose was 2 sata slots by using 4 ssds. not a big deal for me as i was only using 4 hds and 4 ssds. also using a evga 3090
@@chincemagnet so i typed this before he said it in the video lol, also the mobo im using that it didnt matter wit is the aero g z690. i was using a 12700k/3090 but now im using a 14900k/4090 while still having my 3090 in the second slot.
The difference will only be at very high FPS, as that's where you start running into bandwidth slowdown. Basically the way it works is your CPU communicates with your GPU and gives it orders (draw calls), the faster the lane is the faster the CPU can order your GPU around, at some point the FPS becomes so large that the lane gets saturated, and the CPU can no longer give new orders to the GPU. When that happens the GPU simply waits for new draw calls, and that's why you had higher GPU utilization at 16 lanes at 4:42. At lower FPS the CPU has to wait for the GPU to render, so the bandwidth is not the limiting factor.
Thanks so much for posting this. I have had problems with getting optimum performance, even with a 5900X / RTX3060ti with 2x16 DDR4-3200. Sure enough, GPU-ID shows it running at x8. Started with a single M.2, now have a second one for aux storage. Fortunately, due to some issues combined with Asus taking a month to get moving on RMA, I replaced my Tuf Gaming B550 with an Aorus Master, and thinking about using one or the other for a NAS with the M.2s.
What a nice video! concise and well explained showing benchmarks! Thanks so much for the video!
Glad it was helpful!
This is only an issue with Intel CPUs.
Intel 12th/13th/14th gen CPUs only have 16 PCIe gen 5 lanes while AMD's Ryzen 7000 CPUs have 24 PCIe gen 5 lanes.
Incorrect it's just "More" of an Intel issue you can run pcie 5 off a motherboard and keep all lanes CPU to gpu
@@LeeBrothers5 This video talks about using both a GPU and a gen5 SSD.
Obviously if you only use a gen4 SSD, you won't have any problems. But as soon as you install a gen5 SSD, Intel just can't handle it.
Gen5 8x speed = Gen 4 16x. What GPU's using Gen5 PCIE?
@@devilzuser0050 Yeah, that's the interesting part...
In theory, there shouldn't be any performance drop since no GPU requires more than 8x gen5 lanes (or 16x gen4 lanes).
However this video clearly shows a considerable drop in perfomance.
My theory is that with Intel boards, when a gen5 SSD is installed and a gen4 GPU is plugged into a halved 16x gen5 slot; since the GPU physically has 16 lane traces that spans the whole length of the connector, half the lanes can't be used. 8 lanes take less physical space than 16, no matter the gen.
If true, that's terrible news for Intel. It would mean no gen5 SSD allowed for Intel users without a big GPU performance drop!
Or maybe the guy in this video simply forgot to enable some option in the BIOS or something, but I doubt it.
@@Nayah9 Intel is the issue imo
Just came across this. For Z790 chipsets, and a decent gen 13 or 14 CPU. You should be ok as long as you don’t use Gen 5 NVMe. CPU has 20 lanes (x 16 for the gpu and x 4 for the M.2. This leaves 20 lanes on the chipset, so you could have another 5 M.2 or 4 M.2 and a x4 PCIe card. The issue is if you use a gen 5 in the top slot. If you have a gen 5 in one of the other M.2 slots, if they support it. You won’t have an issue.
I'd love some videos of you delving into motherboards that can support gen 5 NVMe as well as a 16x GPU slot at the same time.
There arent any consumer level ones as far as I know.
@@jordanturner7821 Then go prosumer. Surely a threadripper board has enough PCIe? I'd like to see that covered practically since not everyone here is playing games with their systems.
@@soviut303 What you would see in that case, is even if a slot isn't compromised, there is a lower framerate overall due to the CPU single thread limitation in those chips. It wouldn't be relevant anyway if the slot was 16x or 8x. Not sure what you are trying to see there. The topic is much more relevant to consumer boards.
@@jordanturner7821 I'm saying I want to see boards reviewed that can handle one or more Gen5 SSDs without reducing the PCIe lanes on the GPU slot. I'm interested in fast storage without compromising the GPU because I have workloads that need both.
Sadly my ASUS ROG STRIX X670E-E GAMING WIFI mobo has this issue,great to see you cover this here,hope the 670 will be just as tolerant when i fill all my pcie slots in my build.
but is that only with gen 5 ssd ? becaus i have installed my gen 4 ssd in the top slot wich is the fastest one for gen 5 but obv it works with any gen , just want to know before i get my gpu end of this month with the 4080 s
@@inguspodnieks5040 im going to run a gen 5 in the top and second slots with a gen 4 in the gen 4 slot and leave the last gen 5 slot at the bottom bare,if im going to get a decent GPU im not going to risk reducing its capacity by filling all of the pcie slots,which is a shame as the ROG STRIX X670E-E looks like a nice board just wish id known its limitations before i brought it.
this dudes the best. once i left a stupid post on his video being rude and he was still so polite in his reply that ive never forgotten that. keep up the good vids man
You did? I get so many rude comments I forget them. 😂 Thanks though!
Nice vid. I have an MSI mag b760 tomohawk. Not sure if it restricts it yet, won't be able to check until I get home on friday!
Great video as usual.
Very kind.
I know the performance hit is very small in most games and applications, but gimping the most expensive part in a rig to have a drive that's also just a little faster in practice and can't be properly utilized by windows or most applications doesn't sit right with me either. I thought the z790 refresh boards would let you use a gen 5 nvme without throttling the gpu but nope, no gen 5 drive for me.
I'm better the gen5 SSD performance boost (almost double 4th gen) probably outweighs the 10% GPU loss
Yeah I remember reading up on my M.2 slots on my ROG Strix Z690-E Gaming mobo. The first slot is gen 5, but I read that if I use that slot it'll BRING DOWN MY GPU to 8. So I didnt use that slot. Something I'm defo going to be looking into in my future mobo.
My Z790 Aorus Elite AX is the same way, but you should be fine using a Gen4 SSD in that slot while still keeping your lanes at 16x for the GPU.
@@soviut303I have the same board and my first m.2 is populated by a gen 4 nvme and it does in fact bring down the gpu lanes to 8x might have to do some moving around
@@mikef0x I have a Gen4 Samsung 990 PRO in my first m.2 slot and in HWInfo64, on both the System Summary window (that was shown in the video) it says "PCIe v4.0 x16 (16.0 GT/s) @ x16".
B650 carbon thankfully doesnt share with the e1(g5) slot, however it does share with the e2 and e3 m2 slots which would reduce gpu down to x8 lan3s
It's funny how hard it is for manufacturers to give the correct info in the manuals. My Asus ROG z790 extreme tells me that if I use the M2_1 slot, it shares bandwidth with the 2nd GPU slot and disables it, yet it still sets the GPU 1 to 8x. And if you install 2 m2s on the DIMM, they also share the bandwidth of the DIMM. They do not tell you that. Very frustrating when everything is installed
Yeah my Maximus Z790 Formula says DDR5 on the box and DDR4 in the manual
I'm using only 4x lanes to my GPU, due to using a ASUS Hyper M.2 x16 Gen 4 card (3 Nvme's installed, plus 1 in the motherboard). However just as you showcased in your video, I've got the same experience. Slightly less performance, but unnoticeable to me.
👍🏼👍🏼
This is actually a very common question that's often overlooked. It's a very small difference but a difference nonetheless. And there's no reason not to waste performance when you CAN do it with barely any difference.
BUT! This also raise a question, if you have alot of M.2 drives, when should you stop populating them with until you'll get hit with a speed drop, and/or the way to get around it? Could be a good followup video 😁
Interesting idea. So many potential questions unanswered but so many different motherboards with different problems 😂
I love how the vertical graphics card bracket is supported by the case fans. Great idea! Unfortunately, this is not possible with the O11D Evo XL, right? Not sure if the clamps allow installing the vertical bracket so low in the case that it actually sits on top of the case fan?
Thanks!
That's probably my incompetence tbh
@@TheProvokedPrawn haha I thought it was intentional. These Lian li brackets sag quite badly. Interestingly enough the graphics card itself doesn't seem to sit perfectly level in the PCIe slot itself (I have an rtx 4080 sitting in the VG4-4-V2 kit) even before installing the bracket and and card in the case.
Well I filled up all 3 internal nvme slots on my Apex Encore motherboard so that is 1 gen 5 ssd and 2 gen 4 ssds. Is there a setting I can adjust in the bios to slow down the gen 5 drive back down to pci 4 speed? I would rather keep all my ssds on my computer and give priority to the GPU but I don't know if I can do that in the bios, I was digging there earlier but couldn't really find it.
I've found my hdd 'falls asleep' and needs to 'wake up' when I'm opening files, even if they are on my ssd. As someone who uses Blender, needing to open different files at different locations at different times, that delay could be quite significant. I'm also running a strix board but I plan to fill the ssd slots as time goes on and eventually get rid of the hdd. Unless of course this would heavily decrease rendering performance in something like Redshift that is a 'gpu bias' rendering software.
Got a X670E Crosshair Hero board and i am still thinking of getting a Gen 5.0 Nvme drive
in your opinion would you think Corsair's MP700 or Crucial's T700 could be ranned on the standard heatsinks the boards give you
instead of going with pre-applied Heatsinks on them? i read if those go close to 80c they could instantly shut down the entire system or so xD
kinda frightening when thinking about it.
Can be run easily all ready doing it
Comparing your HWiNFO64 details to mine it looks like running at the full v4.0 x16 @ X16 (2.5 GT/s) speed/bandwidth, however my sole installed m2 NVMe drive (Samsung S990 Pro 2tb) is only showing as NVMe x4 16.0 GT/s.... is this correct? I can see one of your drives is x4 32.0 GT/s and was under the impression the 990 pro was one of the better/faster ones.
I did this too on my recent build and reverted to 16 lanes even though the FPS difference isn't huge. I noticed some added latency in certain games.
Hi Tom
What games did you notice more lantecy? That is quite interesting
@@TheProvokedPrawn 👋
@@diogopadrao4118 Largely in Destiny 2. It just felt off, like I was hitting 240fps locked but it didn't feel like I was running at 240Hz. As soon as I dropped it back it was fine. I'd have to measure it fully with LDAT to see if it really was latency or what. I was also using a PCIe 5.0 SSD in the first slot, so I do wonder if there's some firmware / BIOS stuff at play too.
@@tomwarren that is very curious indeed. Response times got me curious about it. Thank you Tom for the answer.
Which ASUS ROG Strix 2 motherboard is the video mentioning? I would like to see the tech specs! I really want to utilize my Gen 5 M2 and my 3090ti 😢
funny i just realized yesterday that i was running 8 lanes instead of 16 in my case im using the rog strix b650e-e and i had a drive in m.2_3 and it created the issue also in that board if you used the m.2_4 it is on the chipset so another potential bottleneck. so I ended up putting my 2nd ssd into m.2_2. m.2_1 and m.2_3 are both 5.0 to bad the m.2_3 slot interferes with the lanes to basically nullify its usefullness as a 5.0 slot. not there there is much use to 5.0 slots at the moment anyway but good video regardless and ya its definitely something people should take into consideration when placing ssd's
3:20 - I mean, of course it'll be CPU-limited if you use 50% render scaling on top of 1080p. 1360x764 is what you end up benchmarking.
Still good info since a lot of people don't realize that m.2 (and previously, SATA 6Gb/s) ports often reduce or outright disable *other* motherboard slots.
hey a question The Provoked Prawn kann i use both the pcie 4.0 port on the
ASUS TUF Gaming X670E-Plus with out cutting performance ??
Thank you for reminding me to just check GPU-Z. Lol. Turns out my mobo is functioning at its full potential. Just got a water cooled 3080 and would hate for it to be getting its bandwidth robbed by my 3 NVMe drives. I don't OC MY CPU, so why I bought the Z690, was so that I could go full NVMe on the storage.
Thank you for this, it has helped me to understand the impact this may have on the performance. I am new to this, and I am building a new PC for the first time. I have an MSI Z790 Godlike Max motherboard, which has 16 x lanes routed to 2 x PCIe Gen 5 slots. If I connect a Gen 5 SSD to the Gen5 m2 slot and the graphics card to the other PCie 5 slot, the lanes will be split (8+8). I believe that with the PCIe Gen 5 lanes, this should be the same as 16 lanes of PCIe Gen 4, and my setup should still allow the graphics card to operate at the levels that it would if it was connected to a 16-lane PCIe Gen 4 with 16 lanes. What I do not know is whether or not an RTX 4090 would perform better using the full 16 x PCie gen 5 lanes? OR, will the GPU work fine but my Gen 5 SSD speeds would be impacted? If anyone can clarify this for me, I would really appreciate it? Otherwise, I guess I will find out once I complete the build. Thanks.
Great video thank you
Thanks for watching
I think for games it doesn't matter that much if your GPU is running on x8 or x16 lanes. this will have big impact more on 3d modeling and rendering something like that.
Wrong. This only matters if you're using an old gpu and an old platform. Anything from the last 5-7yrs, this is negligible loss.
Does that GPU need a support bracket? Looked like it was slightly sagging.
It does. In my own experience my zotac 4090 was sagging after I built it for two weeks. (I just got lazy and forgot to use my bracket) it was working fine until
It started crashing with a black screen. I reseated the gpu and put the sag bracket in and now no more crashes
Those 4090's are chonky! Should come with their own support brackets, but i guess if you're spending over $2000 for one you can buy a $10 bracket support yourself :\@@RyanLBC
Do I need to worry about this on a B650E Taichi Lite? I put a gen 4 nvme into the PCIe Gen5x4. It also says If M2_3 is occupied, PCIE2 will be disabled.
As long as the card runs smoothly I won't miss those frames.
hi! I've a question: what if I have only a single M.2 slot? will that also affect the GPU performance/PCIe bandwidth?
I was thinking of getting an NVMe stick to store/run games on, so I'd really appreciate an advice
the setup is as follows:
MB: MSI B460M PRO
CPU: Intel i5 10400
GPU: Gigabyte GeForce RTX 3060 Gaming OC 12Gb Rev. 2.0
Storage: currently 2 SATA drives - Kingston A400 240Gb SSD (for an OS) and WD Purple Surveillance 4Tb HDD (sadly, for games)
possibly a stupid question, but I've been looking everywhere for an answer and I can't seem to find it, so my head is spinning rn
Sorry if I missed this - but does running gen 4 in the top 5th gen slot still affect the GPU performance/lane usage?
Hmmm, not something I checked. I'd have to retest. As i said though it varies from board to board, so it would be specifically for this one.
@TheProvokedPrawn I'm pretty sure it's only if it's pcie 5 nvme. 13th 14th gen intel chips have 16+4 lanes on the cpu. From my understanding the 16 are gen 5 to gpu and the +4 are pcie 4. So technically a pcie 4 nvme should use the +4 lanes and Still get 16 pcie 5 lanes to gpu
@@claysmurthwaite2386 yeah probably correct.
Thank you everyone! Appreciate the vid and input :)
@@fgdvdszedsa on a z790? I put my 3 ssds down low worried it would strip 4 lanes. But the more I've seen the more shows 16 pcie 5 lanes + 4 pcie 4 lanes. So a pcie 4 nvme should not affect the gpu
Question. What if you did install an nvme in the g5 slot that shares lanes with gpu and it happens to have windows on it? Can you just switch slots to a gen 4 and everything will be fine? Asking for a friend lol
you can move drives around and Windows will still load.
Would this issue be the same with the MEG ACE z790 Motherboard? I have a 4090 and a 13700k cpu, currently using a Samsung 1TB 990 Pro NVME in the top slot, I bought a new 2TB Seagate FireCuda 540 M.2 PCIe 5.0 NVMe SSD and have been wondering where to place this in my PCIe slot, the last thing I want is for this to flop. I'm wondering if the rule of "The ability to use a Gen 5 NVME drive in the top slot, but if you do then you can only run your graphics card with x8 PCIe lanes instead of the usual x16." applies to my Motherboard as well. I game at 4K so I'm wondering if this would have a bigger consequence as well in performance. Any support/advice would be appreciated.
I'd recommend checking your motherboard manual as unfortunately it's specific to each board.
My x670e Hero maintains x16 even with all NVME slots populated. Im curious of this is because the m.2 populating the gen 5 slot is a gen 4 980 pro.
will a gen 4 m.2 nvme ssd put in the cpu side slot also cut the gpu lanes?
ssd: samsung 990 pro
motherboard: asus z790-e wifi 2
gpu: asus strix 4090
Thank you!!
I have Asus strix wifi-F version 1 and 2 nvme Drive Controller: NVMe (PCIe x4 16.0 GT/s @ x4 16.0 GT/s) one is on top slot.
and GPU is Video Bus: PCIe v4.0 x16 (16.0 GT/s) @ x16 (2.5 GT/s)
I guess if your MB support, you can use GPU on X16 still while having nvme on top slot, right?
I am planning to buy the msi edge wifi but I cant find the little things on the storage section
My Mobo only drops the gen 5 lanes down to X8 if you use both x16 slots but even with half the lanes, the Gen 5 speeds should be equal to PCIE 4.0 X16 which means until GPUs actually require Gen 5 speeds there should be negligible difference if any. You seem to be running your GPU on Gen4 x16 and x8, G4x8 being equal to Gen 3 x16, I do believe a modern GPU can outpace that bandwidth but I'm not sure about the 4070 Ti specifically
Theoretically I should be able to put in an NVME add-in card and install up to four Gen4 NVME drives (I think) or two Gen5 NVME drives (if only I could find low-profile Gen 5 add-ins with less than 4 slots...) with no hit to performance until a GPU that absolutely requires Gen 5 x16 for maximum workload comes along.
Does this issue effect the MSI MEG Z490 UNIFY LGA 1200 Intel Z490
?
Good info thanks
No problem 👍
Yes, if the m.2 gen 5 slot is populated, the PCIE x16 slot will run at x8. My z790 Aorus Master has a gen 5 x16 slot so I can run at x8 and not lose bandwidth. X8 PCIE gen 5 is roughly the same as x16 gen 4.
You’d need a gen 5 gpu for that to be true…
@@PaulWMurray32 I’m pretty sure it still works, it’s still a physical x16 slot the bandwidth is just scaled down to x8 speed
@@chincemagnet if what you say is true you are running at gen 4 x8 speed. Check with gpu-z if you want.
@@PaulWMurray32 I don’t have a gen 5 SSD so I can’t do that
Same scenario with the AM5-based Asus ROG Strix B650E-E. Populating The PCIe 5.0 M.2_3 slot will reduce the PCIe x16_1 down to 8 lanes.
As I wanted to run all my drives in RAID 1, this lane-sharing is not ideal... .
Another interesting topic that I'd love to see addressed by an avid tester ( such as yourself :D ) is comapring CPU "connected" M.2 slots vs. chipset-controlled slots. Again, I'm faced with possible degredation as I will also run RAID 1 with two PCIe 4.0 M.2 slots, one provided by the CPU, the other by the chipset... *sigh*
Cheers :)
So would the GPU still run at x8 if you have a gen 4 SSD installed in the top Gen 5 slot? Or could I put a Gen 4 SSD in one of the other slots for it to run at x16?
Just tested installing Gen 4 NMVe in top slot on my board, still knocks the GPU down to x8. Moving the NMVe to one of my other slots lets the GPU run at x16. My MB is the MSI MAG Z790 Max Wifi.
@@kilohjonson thanks! I got the Aorus pro X and same thing. I don’t see the point of putting any drive there
Cheap motherboards have a LOT of shortcomings that people aren't aware of. I will never own one again unless it's for a PC that will never see gaming use.
The issue described in a video is not a motherboard problem, but rather stems from how cpu pci lanes are allocated. Modern consumer Intel CPU’s have 16 pcie 5 lanes and 4 pcie lanes. Any pcie 5 ssd slot will steal pcie 5 lanes off the GPU. But you’re absolutely right in saying that this is not a well known fact.
@@TOM452 The problem only exists on the cheap boards though. They don't enough power delivery and/or pcie lanes to run more than 1 nvme drive, yet they often have the capability to run 2 or more. As soon as you get into a better grade of motherboard, the manufacturer already makes sure all the optional features work.
The second major issue I had myself was the VRM circuits are terrible as far as consistency of the power being delivered, as well as their cooling efficiency.
Would you say a meg z790 ace max is in the right price range/quality to sleep tight on such issues mentioned?
@@DATRecords604 Yes, that looks like a very nice motherboard
So what is the solution? Not using the m.2. ssd 1 port?
My motherboard have the same warning, so i don’t know what to do.
Don't have to worry about that with my computer. Not PCIEx5 but x4. I have enough lanes for 3 x4 NVMEs and my GPU to run at x16. Isn't this an Intel issue?
What happens if you install a gen 4 m.2 into the gen 5 slot? Will it still take PCIE 5.0 lanes away from the GPU slot?
Depends on the motherboard
does this happen with a samsung 990 pro in an asus z790-h motherboard??
is it the same thing true on a 4090? and is it worth it for a gen 5 nvme? I run my PC @120Hz
I'm going to be using the MSI meg Z790 Ace Max in my new build , it says something similar about halving the 16 lanes to 8 if you use the top M.2 slot but that slot is a gen 4 on this boars and the gen 5 slot is at the bottom with 2 to more gen 4 slots above it and a gen 4 to the right of it , I'm not 100% certain but I'm guessing that the top gen 4 slot is the only M.2 slot is the only one that is direct from the CPU and the rest is through the chipset because that's for most part the norm... Just not sure if I should leave the top slot empty and use the middle to slots for my drive's as im only using gen 4s anyway even if they're through the chipset vs using the top slot and sacrificing 8 lanes
Did you end up buying that board? I was considering that as well but am a bit put down by this 8 lane reduction. What if u put a gen 4 in the 1st slot, will the bw be reduced to 8 lanes as well if doing so?
@@DATRecords604 yes I'm using that board , you don't really notice any difference in performance without testing for it , maybe a couple FPS , it still states the gen 5 slot is at the bottom so it's not even being used atm , the board is solid
How does it work exactly? I currently have gen 4 ssd and plan to buy another one should I opt for 3 gen to avoid this gpu throttling or is 4 fine?
It depends on the motherboard. It's worth checking the spec because it's about how many PCIe lanes are available. Because PCIe gen 5 is so fast it's using more and thus reducing the gpu. Sometimes it happens if you fill all the slots on the motherboard but I've also seen it where it doesn't happen. So you really need to check the specs and manual. It's unlikely to be a problem with a new motherboard and gen 4 drives, so I wouldn't worry
did you do it with a 4090, really push the bandwith
The mb I'm getting delivered tomorrow doesn't have this "problem" listed in the specs. MSI B760M-A WIFI DDR4
Have gen 3 & 4 nvmes. I usually just keep in one, reinstall fresh periodically.
Does my ASUS ROG Strix B650E-F do this too?
If you go into where? how did you get that GUI up plz? 2:33
Should be there when you open HWinfo64 www.hwinfo.com/download/
@@TheProvokedPrawn All I get is the one window. And I have never seen that before.
The question you really have to ask here, is why the Rainbow 6 test is such a massive outlier whereas all the other tests (3DMark, Heaven, Red Dead, Assassin's Creed) seem to show a negligible performance difference?
1) Look at your GPU loads at the Rainbow 6 results 4:55 you are only at 80% and 86% respectively yet your frames are in the 400's.
2) Now we can assume that the synthetic benchmark tests 3DMark and Heaven are actually maxing your GPU load because that's what they're designed to do. And the only other game test where we can see GPU load is Assassin's Creed where you are at 99% GPU load 6:44 .
3) In all of the tests where the GPU utilization is maxed, the performance is very close to the same or negligible. But in the game with uncapped FPS and lower GPU utilization, the performance difference is huge. I suspect what's happening is that there's a difference between GPU utilization and bandwidth utilization, and that you can actually bottleneck on one before you reach the limit of the other. With Rainbow 6 you were bottlenecking on the PCIe 4.0 bandwidth because of the HUGE number of frames being generated (400+ compared to
This only happens when installing an SSD in a PCIE 5.0 slot (regardless of generation of drive) correct?
On this board, yes.
@@TheProvokedPrawn How about populating all nvme slots on a board like the MSI tomahawk z790 where all such nvme slots are PCIE 4.0, including the top slot? I looked at the specs on MSI's website and there is no asterisk on the storage section. It is however unclear if populating all or more than 1 nvme slots would cause the GPU to drop to x8
Not mine. I have an Asus X670E Crosshair Hero motherboard and AMD 7950X. I can run two Gen5 NVME drives and it has no impact on my GPUs speed.🙂
If my GPU uses 16 PCIe lanes will my performance be affected if I use a M.2 NVME which uses 4 PCIe lanes with a Motherboard with 20 PCIe lanes
This is a non-issue on Asus X670e boards unless you use a PCI-e m.2 expansion card.
Hi ! do you know if I am fine with ROG STRIX X670E-A
I just had the same issue with my x570 board, I put my 970 Evo in the chipset slot and using my sn850x in the gen 4 m.2. Honestly there's not much fps difference between x16 and x8 so it's not too big an issue.
Doesn't seem to matter much from my testing. Maybe a different story when gaming at 8K 😂
@@TheProvokedPrawn Siege in vulkan just eats up fps not surprised the difference was huge.
Which CPU was that? Zen has 16 lanes directly to the CPU for the first GPU slot, and an additional 4 lanes directly to the CPU for first NVMe slot; these should not be sharing / stealing bandwidth from each other. Were you using one of the cut down CPUs by chance?
@@WSS_the_OG 5800x3d. My mobo has 3 m.2. if I put one by the CPU and the other by the bottom pcie slot it will go x8/x4/x4.
@@bluej511 Very interesting. I never realised that could happen with with Zen 3. Which board do you have?
i thought the same when building my latest pc but upon checking it says this "PCIe v4.0 x16 (16.0 GT/s) @ x16 (16.0 GT/s)"
Excellent
Ty
Gen 5 at 8x is the same as gen 4 at 16x and a 4090 works on gen 4 so in a gen 5 slot that is working at 8x thats the same as gen 4 at 16x which is what a 4090 runs at.
You're right about gen 5 at 8x being the same bandwidth as pcie 4.0 at 16x, but if the slot is running 8x because of an nvme, it doesn't matter if the slot is pcie 5.0. The 4090 at 8x is limited to pcie 4.0 bandwidth. It will remain at 4th gen 8x.
How can you see with your eyes while playing the game the difference in fps between 421 and 478? How can a highspeed Monitor with 120Hz show more then 400 fps anyway? I dont understand this.
Have you not seen the insane fast refresh rate monitors announced now
@@TheProvokedPrawn I first need better replacements for my eyes and probably my brain, too.
@@usurpinesusanti3149 me too 😂
This is very motherboard dependant. On an ASUS TUF X570 board it seems to make zero difference. I have some FAST NVME drives too.
Yes indeed and I said as much :)
Just reading the specs of a board would be enough.. can't really understand why you only knew that afterwards.. (the PCIe x16 only working at x8 thing...)
You think people read things?
i have 2 nvmes and 2 other PCIE cards and my gpu still gets X16 not 8X
Excellent
And thats why I love AMD X570/X670(E) systems. CPU has enough lanes for one M.2 and the GPU and the chipset has enough of its own PCIE lanes for JUST the NVME drives so you don't risk this. But even at PCIE gen 4 x8, you still are getting full GPU performance as even a 4090 doesn't fully saturate an x8 lane.
*We're not destroying the performance of our GPU cards....the *manufacturers of these motherboard (and processors) are. However, yes, I see what you're saying. I'd like to think that when Samsung, Crucial, etc, etc....are bench testing these M.2's, they're doing it under these pretext's, so at LEAST we know we're getting advertised speeds from those M.2s (which I also doubt).* It's old news at this point, but a lot of people to this day aren't aware that the GPU shares bandwidth or "Lanes" with the the M.2 in the #1 slot. That's ALL "fine print', that's done intentionally. To my understanding there is NO MB that supports 100% exclusive M.2 (or GPU) performance, because apparently the processors can't handle it. So, the industry needs to collectively call out the people who are misleading all us fine consumers who THINK they're getting max performance our of the obscenely expensive hardware we're buying. *I even thought about putting the GPU into a separate PCI slot, to see if I could get max performance from my M.2, given speed and performance is more important to me (as a music producer) than how pretty it looks on the screen.* But, there's a VERY fine line between music processing PC's and game PC's. Maybe, you or a viewer can shed more light on that approach....
Gotcha! (•̀ᴗ•́ )و The funniest joke from motherboard developers! )
The cpu would be a Ryzen 7 7800x3d
O11 rgb vs king95?
I do have the King95 to do at some point. Are you in my house?
Hahaha
that gpu looks more bend than my ex
Only an issue on Intel
Not enough to keep me from running all 3 slots on my mog b650 edge wifi😊
haha fair
@@TheProvokedPrawn yea thankfully it seems minimal so i think i’ll be good at 1440p 165hz… i may see some issues though when i get a 240 hz oled lol
🥰
Non-issue on my z790 Gigabyte mb. Has 2 dedicated slots from the CPU. If you use the top one for a gen 5 ssd, you can still run gpu at 16x. As long as you don't put another SSD in the second cpu ssd slot. But all the other slots run from the chipset on the mb running full bandwidth..
Also something to note. Most people now days with heavy GPUs. Run vertical mounts which the cables that's used makes the card run in 8X anyways
I'm not sure that's 100% accurate. Unless they're using PCIe gen 3 riser cables for some reason. A lot of current good brackets use the right cabling for max bandwidth
@@TheProvokedPrawn thanks for the info. I didn't know that. Must of the ones iv seen were all gen 3
@@RobH2022 how many have you seen? Lol. Not very many I'm guessing.
@skypallman6169 Well, I've built my first pc when i was. 15 I'm 38 now. So you guess lol 😆
Actually the assholes making motherboards are slowing down my gpu
not really much of a hit to performance.
Nope not at 1080p anyway
@@TheProvokedPrawn and most of us do play at 1080p.
no reason to use a gen5 as gamer.
well aint that great
The gayest voice in RUclips pc channels.
Wow! You must be real fun at parties…. NOT!
Not gay but if I was it shouldn't matter. 🤷🏼♂️
Hey do you have discord? I would like to ask you a few questions
Yes. Links in the description and all over my channel
@@TheProvokedPrawni dmed you on discord found it on the server