When I used to knit a lot I would get friends and strangers saying "I'll buy the yarn!" and I would say "And what about the time spent? I'm knitting from my own patterns, doing all the designing and calculating, and then spending time doing something I've got a lot of skill at. When I'm done, I get to enjoy things I've made or give them with love. You can't buy that for the price of yarn." Only my family understood, they're all makers and craftspeople too! 😄
Years ago, on our nephew's first birthday we gave him a very large x-stitch picture which I had added goldwork and beading. Everyone was amazed. Then a voice pipes up. His maternal grandmother snarling, "I want one." When I told her that there was over 100 hours of work in it and did £10.00 an hour sound fair to her, I was greeted with absolute silence. Strangely, the subject has never arisen again. I also put a provenance in the back and valued it at £800.00 for insurance purposes. I told my, now late, Mum about the 'confrontation', she said that no one ever realises how long it takes to make anything that requires skill and dedication. She's right.
I am reminded of the crochet doily treasures I have found in thrift shops for $2 or $5. I know what I am looking at...hours and hours of delicate work with fine threads and complex constructions. I snatch them up, always. I have several on display in my home now, and I always honor the unknown women who lovingly made these for their families. I have yet to run across an embroidery piece like yours, but I will be looking!
Very interesting Sarah. I had this exact conversation with an embroidery friend. She said she’d never sell her work. I said it was a matter of price. She disagreed. I started naming prices until she started to falter and then got to a price where she said yes. A lot of people have seen our work, and some nationalities ( I won’t name them!) think every thing is for sale. Usually they’re not prepared to pay a reasonable sum for them. I think most people don’t know the difference between ‘home made’ and ‘hand crafted’. If they baulk at the price, then I wouldn’t sell it to them anyway, as they wouldn’t appreciate the amount of work gone into it.
Perceived value is incredibly important. I love the way you think. So many people who do specialized creative crafts undervalue their work and this impacts not only them, but all those who who do similar arts. Be realistic about your skill of course, but you must value your own work, before others start to understand the value of your work.
Thank you for this! I don't know why I always feel a bit sheepish about putting a price on my work. I think it's because most people look at it as just a hobby! Even if it is--hopefully, it's enjoyable!--that doesn't negate the hours of work and cramped and pricked fingers, the supplies, the craftswomanship! Thank you for reminding all of us to value our work!
I know what you mean. When my mom she was a beginner artist, she would practically give her work away but discovered if the customer wants it they will buy it. You just have to barter. For example, she will offer a lower price if she removes the mat and no frame. That's about 1/2 the cost. The happy customer buys it and thrilled to have an original.
I once mentioned the low value someone was putting on their time (charging under £20, I think for a 6+ hour piece), and they got angry with me! :( Valuing one's own time and skill matters! ♡
I'm very new to embroidery, but there have been similar conversations happening in the fibre crafting communities (knitting and crochet). People are always telling knitters 'you should sell those' because they have no idea of the costs of materials or the time it takes to make something. I think too, people have got used to mass produced knitwear and are shocked that the materials to hand-knit a jumper in a good quality wool are actually quite expensive. With crochet, people just see it as a craft, although it's not one that can be done by a machine yet. I wonder does the ability to mass produce something affect what you can charge for it, or rather, what people will realistically pay? I can't imagine any machine could reproduce your goldwork piece, but there are domestic sewing machines now that can do embroidery.
Thank you for this Sarah. It's a subject that, I'm sure, everyone finds difficult at some time or other. Obviously, it doesn't just affect embroidery, it crosses every skill and craft.
Very interesting Sarah! I'm an artist, unfortunately only an armature one. In the past I have tried to sell my talents so this is particularly interesting for me. I wish I had known this after college graduation. This is something they didn't teach in school.
Very much food for thought and I emediately started scetching on a lecture about pricing for my students! Thanks a lot, inspiring and humble as always. Have a great weekend. 🙂🌸🙏
Great insight. I made a Honiton lace hanky for my Mum and got the “my Mum would love that”, but all goes silent when you say how much would you pay for 50 hours work! Enjoying your videos as I’ve been making a crazy quilt since May … on block 7 of 12. Also you’ve inspired me to make an accompanying fabric book as the fabrics are from special family occasion clothes. This is definitely for me to keep!
Thank you so much Sarah. I always enjoy your videos. It seems to me that the amount of work we put into stitching and art would never be properly repaid because I don't think most people are willing to pay the appropriate amount. So I think mine is a labor of love. Luckily I don't use expensive materials at this point. Thanks again for all the great videos. And many blessings to you
Great video! I think this is a common problem across most crafts. People may love the work, but unless they do similar work, they never realize the time and work that is put into a piece. Artists often undervalue their time in order to sell work. PS. I prefer your regular videos to lives. Thanks so much. 😃
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery Sarah, I realize that you haven’t gone live yet. What I was trying to say is that I don’t enjoy the live videos that I’ve watched from others, and I do enjoy your videos, as they have been. Maybe it’s just me, but when I see a live, I often come back another day to watch. That way I can fast forward through all the wait time and hello’s. I hope that makes sense.
Excellent information! This information is good for arts and crafts in general as well. I found it hard to figure out where to start with it. I got as far as what the materials costs are but this is giving me the whole picture. Important too about the sentimental value of something, whether you would actually do it again, or whether it’s a one time thing that turned out great but you would never do again. Great info! And a beautiful piece!
This is really brilliant advice and understanding. This is the very reason I do not sell any of my overall crafts. People just will not spend the money for the time put in.
Very useful information and... (thank you for) THE MATH! Your points about correct value/under value are critical to any sales environment and the set to proper perspective and the dignity of the work.
That's good information. I've wondered how to go about charging for something I've done. The video you did on knowing the laws concerning work we have done and selling it goes along well with this video.
That gold work is absolutely phenomenal, maybe try selling it at an auction, that should give you what it is worth. Personally I think it is a hobby. I crochet and stitch them onto material, I have made some beautiful work and given them as gifts to my family and friends.
It’s always so hard to find the balance of a livable wage and what people will pay. I don’t sell my pieces, at least for now, for several reasons. I do, however, gift them if I find someone who loves the piece and who I know will treasure it. I’m more interested in the personal connection that people have with textiles that have been worked by hand. I feel a connection to the person receiving it because they treasure it and they feel a connection because they understand the time and effort that goes into it.
I had done a piece a few years ago which someone asked if I would consider donating to a fundraising auction----but I had no idea what value to place upon it for a starting bid. So this video, Sarah, is very useful for that consideration. Thank you! Very insightful.
Mam I worked out different types of motifs on a cloth & have rated them too. If anyone is interested you can send me your email address to which I would love to send you the photos & I'll stitch them & send them to you as motifs & you can attach them to your sarees, dresses& whatever.
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery well, after listening to your video, I think I probably did drop it. But I was okay with that because of the cause. Someone did eventually bid fairly high and I didn't feel slighted.
I think we've all seen too many instances of hand-worked embroidered pieces not being sufficiently valued. The perception seems to be that if it's been hand made it's somehow not worth as much as something mass produced. That attitude is so demeaning as it puts no value on the talents - and time - being used to produce such beautiful items. We, as the makers of these treasures need to realise our own value and price our items accordingly. A wonderful video Sarah and I know it gives much food for thought... to me anyway😊. As a treat, check out the NSW Embroiderers Guild (Australia) Goldwork Festival coming up over the month of July... a conference, exhibitions, workshops, lectures, a feast! Thanks again for all you share with us 👏👏👏
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I don't think you'll be disappointed, and as an added bonus there's a 30+ page downloadable booklet with history/photographs/more info on the NSW Embroiderers Guild web site. Fabulous! ⭐💛
I only make things for others that I’m willing to give them. The time that goes in is ridiculous and I’m fine with it being free and for my own enjoyment of the craft to someone who is aware of the work that’s gone in, but I’m not willing to take pennies from someone who doesn’t appreciate it or mean something to me.
Thanks Sarah that was a fantastic insight on how to break down the costs like that, I would never have even thought of giving myself a minimum wage!. Although I've never tried to sell any embroidery myself, I have found when giving an embroidered gift, or when people find out you do embroidery and ask to see some of your work, it's really frustrating that time and again those who have no idea what's involved are mostly impressed just by how something 'looks" rather than any technical skill involved. They tend to go for the pretty ribbon work heart that only took a couple of afternoons to make, or the crewel work cushion that looks big and impressive but was far simpler to stitch than any intricate silk shading and goldwork that is completely overlooked. Sadly, it seems that these days embroidery doesn't have the same value it once did 100's of years ago, and unless you are working as an artist, or perhaps in the fashion/Interiors industry, working to commission or designing kits, there doesn't appear to be much demand for embroidered pieces, people just enjoy doing it as a hobby themselves rather than wanting to buy any completed work, which is such a shame!. As regards technology!, I'm exactly the same, and much as it would be lovely to be able to speak with you in person, I'm just really glad that you have not yet gone down the route of putting everything on Zoom, not to mention the problem of having to be there at a specific time to join in, total nightmare, in fact I'm having a hot flush now just thinking about it!!!.
I blame the Victorians for turning these skills into things women did at home by the fire place! You can do 'live' sessions on RUclips then upload to the channel later for anyone who couldn't make it but yes, I'm not overexcited about spending the time on working out how to do that!
Hello Sarah, I’m a quilter and was drawn to your videos because I need to improve my embroidery for a crazy quilt I want to do. Almost the first thing I hear when someone finds out that I quilt is “Oh can you make one for me?” It always stumps me. The time involved, the outrageous price of good fabric, the creative element… Do you have an answer to get through to these people? Your work is beautiful and worth every bit of $3,300. U.S. I’m so glad you did this video. Keep being you. Take care
I say No because my rates are steep and I wouldn't want that to come between us. Or"No you couldn't afford it" - if they say Try me- then say "ok I'll give you a cost estimate by the end of the day so you can put down a deposit". - I have not had one person follow thru after saying that!
I could go on & on with this subject, but will stick to just one example. The one and only time I put my work in a gallery I attended the opening and overheard two women exclaim how "outrageous" my prices were. I introduced myself; I pointed out that the prices were based on $10 per hour (which was about the same as minimum wage at the time) and that the gallery would get 30% of that. One said "your kidding" - I said no - and that was the end of the conversation.
Thank you for this video! Simple enough to calculate, it is such a difficult task to price. I have trouble finding a simple yet flexible format that can be applied to a range of embroidery projects. Would you be able to help with these queries: 1. How would you calculate the thread use/count? I know you did a guesstimate for this video, but do you have a format on how to calculate thread use for embroidery projects? 2. With the general materials used, I can understand fabric expense, but with materials like needles, do you charge the full purchase price for 1 needle (not the whole package)? For example, if it is 0.50 cents to buy 1 needle, then add that to the material cost. 3. In regards to the artist' qualification, experience or reputation, how did you end up with this guesstimate? Of course, the specific number is personal to each artist but again are there guidelines, any other advice or a format you would suggest as to how to get this number? Especially to newer artists or who are self-taught The perceived value and its impacts is an important one to learn. Thank you so much, your videos are so helpful! So appreciated.
Food for thought Sarah, thank you so much, my daughter sells her fashion embroidery mainly to friends (she has a full time job) and it is always difficult to give a price to pieces and due to the hours involved, yes, they can work out being quite dear! Thank you for reasoning on the subject. Very useful.
This is really interesting. Thank you. Can I ask, do you ever add extra to help cover all your other business expenses such as insurance, technical support, overheads for working from home etc? Or do you just accept that you will have to pay that out of your "per hour" calculation?
I think I would if my business was selling embroideries regularly Victoria, but as I rarely do a commission I don't but something else to think about yes
There is a huge market for hand made items in the US but the mass market version of hand made. Make a bunch of bags or pot holders or what have you. There is a market for bespoke items but I never get paid for the amount of work I put into whatever it is. I take a project I've never done, quote it and then make it but it's always more time consuming than I figured lol so I run into the 'I should have charged more for that' scenario lol. I do have enough stuff to make crafting my career but I'm still attached to the medical insurance I get with my day job so not ready to pull that trigger yet haha!!!
Your efforts Sarah are priceless I would say but worth it…I would go the sentimental way personally but now that I seem to be so creative with different hobbies, I couldn’t possibly keep it all… I’ve already given away a sampler and want to donate some paintings… I feel so fortunate to have found you on RUclips and am grateful that your tutorials inspire me ☺️ A live chat would be wonderful but don’t stress about that. You are wonderful, just the way way you are and we’ll keep you anyway we can get you 😆😊 🙏🏽🙋🏻♀️👍🏽Mia
I think work can command higher rates especially if it is one of a kind. Some people get bored and will not make the exact same item more than once. If that is so tell your customer/client that this design will not be made again, so truly it will be a unique piece because there is only one.
This was, as always, very informative! You are incredibly talented and your piece is beautiful! I'm so sentimental, I would probably not sell. But as you said, if someone offered an amount you couldn't refuse, you'd at least consider it! I love to visit it with you❣
Also, if you intend selling through galleries and have added your 40/50% you should keep that price on the piece if you have it for sale from your website or home too. If you undercut the gallery they will drop you like a hot potato.
It's not just embroidery that's undervalued, quilting, sewing, dressmaking, crochet... Are all very much undervalued, some would argue that it's because they were traditionally women's pastimes. I think the fact that most women no longer learn to sew or make for themselves, means they no longer appreciate good quality work and materials. When I wore a velvet devore floor-length gown to a women's workshop, I did get many compliments, and someone asked if I could make one for her for £50 or £60. I had made the gown myself, from the design stages to draping the pattern on the stand, acid-burning the velvet (dangerous process), sewing and finishing all the pieces together and final touches, and it all took weeks of work...
Really interesting. It is amazing how hard it is to value your own work and the level of skill required to make it, be that embroidery, knitting or patchwork. I wonder part of the difficulty is that it is also something that the person loves to do so it feels odd to get paid for it. I think it is also true that other people don't appreciate how long it takes to make things.
I do love your goldwork piece! Just stunning!!! Does your goldwork video address how you care and display goldwork?? Also - I haven't noticed any, but do you sign your work in some fashion? Who can put a price on work you've sweated over? Even some of the greatest artists have had to sell work way below what they should have received. But what can you do? I have always felt that if an artist works with the main goal of trying to sell the work, then one is at the mercy of current popular tastes and what the majority want to buy. An artist is forced to push their own creativity into the mold of that common taste. I would rather keep the work and do it my way. Let my heirs find out what it's worth after I'm gone.
Thank you so much! I'm currently working on a full-scale Bayeux Tapestry replica and so far, I've completed 40.2 metres. It has taken approximately 5000 hours, which includes drawing the images and the embroidery, but not the washing, cutting and hemming of the fabric. I'm trying to get it valued and today I had a reply from an auction company, giving me a quote of £200-500. I was scanning the email for the missing 0s, but they were nowhere to be found. Giving myself an hourly rate of £30/h, considering I have a large following and have features rather heavily in media and have 20 years of embroidery experience, the current price should be £211,400 according to your calculations. That makes £200 sound like an insult. What would be your suggestion? I would really appreciate your input. Thanks.
I have seen your story Mia and it's fascinating, I'm glad you got in touch. I'm genuinely intrigued by your ability to complete such a huge project and your motivation to keep going and see such an enourmous undertaking through, I'm in awe. To be honest I'm not suprised that someone would have trouble valuing this, it sounds like a full time life times work, how could you value it? It's unique (there's only one more in the world!) and it's also new; auction houses are more used to valuing old stuff (did you try a textile specialist auction house?) and for some reason the older it is the more it is revered. In work hours, experience, materials and love it's probably priceless. In pure monetry value you would only know what someone will pay for it if you try to sell it, and that could change under different circumstances (if more than one person wanted it, how much you wanted to sell it, if they understood and appreciated everything that has gone into it etc). Put it on a wall in a church for 1000 years and once again it's priceless. It doesn't make sense I agree and yes £200 is an insult (so is £500), I imagine that doesn't even pay for the thread. Can I ask why you are trying to value it? Is it for practical purposes?
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery You already know about my 'little' project? Wow, that's cool. Such a small world, isn't it? From the very beginning, I've said that the tapestry is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Even so, I would like to have a figure, for insurance purposes. I have also had queries about lengthy exhibitions at venues and I need to make sure that their insurance will cover the pieces they hire. I'm hoping that knowing its value can guide me towards a rental fee as well. You see, I gain very little from having my work displayed in various places, unless I get paid for it. I'm not after fame and publicity. This is my business. Ultimately, I would like to know what ballpark to place it in when it comes to selling it, if I ever choose to do so. I hope that is a good enough answer. By the way, one of the members in my social media group guided me to your video and I'm so happy I found you.
Have you tried somewhere like Witney Antiques in Oxford or Bonham's for a valuation Mia? Perhaps if you tell them it is for insurance purposes they might do their calculations differently? Works of painted art get valuations, it must be possible! Do the insurance companies need paperwork with an evaluation or can you decide what it's worth or what you want to insure it for? If you can decide, work out the material costs and the hours (estimate then add on some!)...then double it and see how you feel about that number. I don't know if it would be worth contacting someone like the V&A and asking their advice or perhaps the Embroiderer's Guild (who must have to insure their own huge collection of embroideries) and even Reading Museum where the copy is. The latter is Victorian in age and has not long been restored so perhaps they sound your best bet; might be more approachable than the big organisations. I can't remember the history of how this one got to Reading, I think they might have bought it off the Leek Embroiderer's who made it? I would have to look that up again. Yours certainly needs to go on display and I totally understand that you need it to pay for itself. Crowd funding? Maybe approach Hastings town, they should have a copy of the tapestry! I'm sorry I don't really know how to help, hope this has given you some ideas you haven't already thought of. Do email me if you want to ask anymore questions: sarahhomfray@blueyonder.co.uk. x
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I contacted the V&A, but they can't help me, because they are not allowed to according to their policies. I've also been in touch with the Royal School of Needlework and they already knew about me, after the Duchess of Gloucester showed photos from our meeting. They weren't able to help either. However, last week TV's antique dealer Simon Schneider came to our town and I met up with him. When I mentioned the quote the auction company gave me, he scoffed. He reckoned that my own estimate was way too low and he was pretty sure it would eventually be sold for my dream prize of £1M+, possibly through crown funding. That's good enough for me.
In a future chat, can you explain exactly what your apprenticeship is/was. Obviously I know in general what an apprenticeship is but being from the US I have never heard it applied to needlework. Very curious. Sharon Quinn, Americus KS USA
Your maths is wrong on your 40% unless the gallery's pricing system is incredibly strange; if the gallery take 40% of your sale price, your sale price needs to be grossed up at 100/60 which for a net price going to you of £2,654 would be a gross price of £4,423. If you priced it at £3,715 and the gallery took 40%, you'd only get £2,229.
Also, what if an artist wanted to sell functional embroidered items such as bags, purses, jewellery and other accessories which I find incredibly difficult to price. They still hold a lot of value, and a lot of time has been put into it but it is a harder task to price as it is not something that people place a lot of value on like they would with an artwork for instance. Any words of wisdom in this matter? Thank you
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery Thank you Sarah! Though, does this mean that it can seem like the bag is priced very high? If you have some time, could you please look at my message below, I had some queries I wanted to ask you! Thank you so much
That’s Great for your beautiful piece. Shall I move onto gold work now 🤔 ha ha I have 2 lovely framed Embroidery ones of a Chinese lady and the other is a bit of a funny pattern but I’ve seen it somewhere I’m not as fast as you yet 😂 so I plod on and on great video thanks xx
I very much appreciate this information. I just started a new business for my stitching, and I have grossly underpaid myself so far. Unfortunately, no one recognizes how much work goes into this and they all want to pay $50 for a huge project, which may not even cover materials. I’ve had so many people balk at $100 for a 8x10 in project (granted it was mostly outline work, replicating a child’s drawing, which was my original idea).
Don't be put off by people balking at the prices; they need to learn what these things cost! Also if you are just starting out you may be prepared to ask for slightly less while you establish yourself and get some sales. When I started I did lots of things I wasn't overexcited about doing as I needed to pay my bills!
I don't sell my work. I do it because I love doing it but if someone would like to buy it I probably would sell it. I leave all my embroidery without the finishing backing. I'm a bit lazy when it comes to that 😊
250,000 sounds right to me, if not more, for that beautiful unique embroidery, if l had that money to spare l would buy it fir sure with that provenance
It is so difficult to sell for a competitive price when many small businesses underprice their works and this drives the overall price of embroidery works down. Such a shame. Also it is hard when you compete on world market where prices are so diffierent, what I mean is that e.g. on Etsy there is such a wide range of prices on more or less similar embroidery items that it is hard for me to prince my works if I want to put them on Etsy. Any advice Sarah?
Yes, Etsy is an international platform so there are lots of other factors to think about such as the cost of living which can vary in different parts of the world, perceived value etc. I would still say choose a price that you want and stick to that although with places like Etsy, sales generate sales so maybe do some 'offers' that get things rolling (this means you can put the price up later!)
Yes mam I am in India, Hyderabad. I don't do Aari work. I work with the normal embroidery needles as you do mam. But I do a lot of work . It would be nice if you could forward me your email address so that I can send you some photos of my work. I only have an email address.
Mam Aari work is working embroidery with different types of crochet needles which doesn't last long. The normal embroidery that is done with the needles is stronger.
Thanks Sarah, for the lovely video, it was very interesting and informative, people don't realise the amount of work that goes into a lovely embroidery.🪡
When I used to knit a lot I would get friends and strangers saying "I'll buy the yarn!" and I would say "And what about the time spent? I'm knitting from my own patterns, doing all the designing and calculating, and then spending time doing something I've got a lot of skill at. When I'm done, I get to enjoy things I've made or give them with love. You can't buy that for the price of yarn." Only my family understood, they're all makers and craftspeople too! 😄
Years ago, on our nephew's first birthday we gave him a very large x-stitch picture which I had added goldwork and beading. Everyone was amazed. Then a voice pipes up. His maternal grandmother snarling, "I want one."
When I told her that there was over 100 hours of work in it and did £10.00 an hour sound fair to her, I was greeted with absolute silence. Strangely, the subject has never arisen again.
I also put a provenance in the back and valued it at £800.00 for insurance purposes.
I told my, now late, Mum about the 'confrontation', she said that no one ever realises how long it takes to make anything that requires skill and dedication. She's right.
Well done for being upfront with her Carole!
You made me laugh but so true.
I am reminded of the crochet doily treasures I have found in thrift shops for $2 or $5. I know what I am looking at...hours and hours of delicate work with fine threads and complex constructions. I snatch them up, always. I have several on display in my home now, and I always honor the unknown women who lovingly made these for their families. I have yet to run across an embroidery piece like yours, but I will be looking!
Grab it if you see one!!
Very interesting Sarah. I had this exact conversation with an embroidery friend. She said she’d never sell her work. I said it was a matter of price. She disagreed. I started naming prices until she started to falter and then got to a price where she said yes. A lot of people have seen our work, and some nationalities ( I won’t name them!) think every thing is for sale. Usually they’re not prepared to pay a reasonable sum for them. I think most people don’t know the difference between ‘home made’ and ‘hand crafted’. If they baulk at the price, then I wouldn’t sell it to them anyway, as they wouldn’t appreciate the amount of work gone into it.
Perceived value is incredibly important. I love the way you think. So many people who do specialized creative crafts undervalue their work and this impacts not only them, but all those who who do similar arts. Be realistic about your skill of course, but you must value your own work, before others start to understand the value of your work.
Thank you for this! I don't know why I always feel a bit sheepish about putting a price on my work. I think it's because most people look at it as just a hobby! Even if it is--hopefully, it's enjoyable!--that doesn't negate the hours of work and cramped and pricked fingers, the supplies, the craftswomanship! Thank you for reminding all of us to value our work!
I know what you mean. When my mom she was a beginner artist, she would practically give her work away but discovered if the customer wants it they will buy it. You just have to barter. For example, she will offer a lower price if she removes the mat and no frame. That's about 1/2 the cost. The happy customer buys it and thrilled to have an original.
I once mentioned the low value someone was putting on their time (charging under £20, I think for a 6+ hour piece), and they got angry with me! :( Valuing one's own time and skill matters! ♡
I have found that some people that are highly skilled but consider it a "hobby" are happy just to make enough money to keep them in supplies.
I'm very new to embroidery, but there have been similar conversations happening in the fibre crafting communities (knitting and crochet). People are always telling knitters 'you should sell those' because they have no idea of the costs of materials or the time it takes to make something. I think too, people have got used to mass produced knitwear and are shocked that the materials to hand-knit a jumper in a good quality wool are actually quite expensive. With crochet, people just see it as a craft, although it's not one that can be done by a machine yet. I wonder does the ability to mass produce something affect what you can charge for it, or rather, what people will realistically pay? I can't imagine any machine could reproduce your goldwork piece, but there are domestic sewing machines now that can do embroidery.
Thank you for this Sarah. It's a subject that, I'm sure, everyone finds difficult at some time or other. Obviously, it doesn't just affect embroidery, it crosses every skill and craft.
Very interesting Sarah! I'm an artist, unfortunately only an armature one. In the past I have tried to sell my talents so this is particularly interesting for me. I wish I had known this after college graduation. This is something they didn't teach in school.
Very much food for thought and I emediately started scetching on a lecture about pricing for my students! Thanks a lot, inspiring and humble as always. Have a great weekend. 🙂🌸🙏
Great insight. I made a Honiton lace hanky for my Mum and got the “my Mum would love that”, but all goes silent when you say how much would you pay for 50 hours work!
Enjoying your videos as I’ve been making a crazy quilt since May … on block 7 of 12. Also you’ve inspired me to make an accompanying fabric book as the fabrics are from special family occasion clothes. This is definitely for me to keep!
Thank you so much Sarah. I always enjoy your videos. It seems to me that the amount of work we put into stitching and art would never be properly repaid because I don't think most people are willing to pay the appropriate amount. So I think mine is a labor of love. Luckily I don't use expensive materials at this point. Thanks again for all the great videos. And many blessings to you
Thank you again Sarah! I always learn so much from watching you.
Great video! I think this is a common problem across most crafts. People may love the work, but unless they do similar work, they never realize the time and work that is put into a piece. Artists often undervalue their time in order to sell work. PS. I prefer your regular videos to lives. Thanks so much. 😃
I've never done a live video Elaine!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery Sarah, I realize that you haven’t gone live yet. What I was trying to say is that I don’t enjoy the live videos that I’ve watched from others, and I do enjoy your videos, as they have been. Maybe it’s just me, but when I see a live, I often come back another day to watch. That way I can fast forward through all the wait time and hello’s. I hope that makes sense.
Excellent information! This information is good for arts and crafts in general as well. I found it hard to figure out where to start with it. I got as far as what the materials costs are but this is giving me the whole picture. Important too about the sentimental value of something, whether you would actually do it again, or whether it’s a one time thing that turned out great but you would never do again. Great info! And a beautiful piece!
This is really brilliant advice and understanding. This is the very reason I do not sell any of my overall crafts. People just will not spend the money for the time put in.
Thank you for the video Sarah, it's always interesting to hear you speak about embroidery and this was no different.
Very useful information and... (thank you for) THE MATH! Your points about correct value/under value are critical to any sales environment and the set to proper perspective and the dignity of the work.
That's good information. I've wondered how to go about charging for something I've done. The video you did on knowing the laws concerning work we have done and selling it goes along well with this video.
That gold work is absolutely phenomenal, maybe try selling it at an auction, that should give you what it is worth. Personally I think it is a hobby. I crochet and stitch them onto material, I have made some beautiful work and given them as gifts to my family and friends.
Absolutely you need to value your work. I would add in something to cover equipment wear and replacement, your workspace etc.
Sarah, I appreciate what you have taught me
It’s always so hard to find the balance of a livable wage and what people will pay. I don’t sell my pieces, at least for now, for several reasons. I do, however, gift them if I find someone who loves the piece and who I know will treasure it. I’m more interested in the personal connection that people have with textiles that have been worked by hand. I feel a connection to the person receiving it because they treasure it and they feel a connection because they understand the time and effort that goes into it.
Very interesting even if you’re not going to be selling your work. Knowing it’s worth and not under valuing your own or other people’s work.
I had done a piece a few years ago which someone asked if I would consider donating to a fundraising auction----but I had no idea what value to place upon it for a starting bid. So this video, Sarah, is very useful for that consideration. Thank you! Very insightful.
I never thought of that scenario Kay! If it's for fundraising then that's another thing about, do you drop the starting price for a good cause?
Mam I worked out different types of motifs on a cloth & have rated them too. If anyone is interested you can send me your email address to which I would love to send you the photos & I'll stitch them & send them to you as motifs & you can attach them to your sarees, dresses& whatever.
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery well, after listening to your video, I think I probably did drop it. But I was okay with that because of the cause. Someone did eventually bid fairly high and I didn't feel slighted.
I think we've all seen too many instances of hand-worked embroidered pieces not being sufficiently valued. The perception seems to be that if it's been hand made it's somehow not worth as much as something mass produced. That attitude is so demeaning as it puts no value on the talents - and time - being used to produce such beautiful items. We, as the makers of these treasures need to realise our own value and price our items accordingly. A wonderful video Sarah and I know it gives much food for thought... to me anyway😊.
As a treat, check out the NSW Embroiderers Guild (Australia) Goldwork Festival coming up over the month of July... a conference, exhibitions, workshops, lectures, a feast!
Thanks again for all you share with us 👏👏👏
I'll have a look for that Jane; a goldwork festival sounds super!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I don't think you'll be disappointed, and as an added bonus there's a 30+ page downloadable booklet with history/photographs/more info on the NSW Embroiderers Guild web site. Fabulous! ⭐💛
I only make things for others that I’m willing to give them. The time that goes in is ridiculous and I’m fine with it being free and for my own enjoyment of the craft to someone who is aware of the work that’s gone in, but I’m not willing to take pennies from someone who doesn’t appreciate it or mean something to me.
Thanks Sarah that was a fantastic insight on how to break down the costs like that, I would never have even thought of giving myself a minimum wage!. Although I've never tried to sell any embroidery myself, I have found when giving an embroidered gift, or when people find out you do embroidery and ask to see some of your work, it's really frustrating that time and again those who have no idea what's involved are mostly impressed just by how something 'looks" rather than any technical skill involved. They tend to go for the pretty ribbon work heart that only took a couple of afternoons to make, or the crewel work cushion that looks big and impressive but was far simpler to stitch than any intricate silk shading and goldwork that is completely overlooked. Sadly, it seems that these days embroidery doesn't have the same value it once did 100's of years ago, and unless you are working as an artist, or perhaps in the fashion/Interiors industry, working to commission or designing kits, there doesn't appear to be much demand for embroidered pieces, people just enjoy doing it as a hobby themselves rather than wanting to buy any completed work, which is such a shame!. As regards technology!, I'm exactly the same, and much as it would be lovely to be able to speak with you in person, I'm just really glad that you have not yet gone down the route of putting everything on Zoom, not to mention the problem of having to be there at a specific time to join in, total nightmare, in fact I'm having a hot flush now just thinking about it!!!.
I blame the Victorians for turning these skills into things women did at home by the fire place! You can do 'live' sessions on RUclips then upload to the channel later for anyone who couldn't make it but yes, I'm not overexcited about spending the time on working out how to do that!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I don't blame you Sarah!, and very good point about the Victorians , I hadn't thought of it like that x
Hello Sarah, I’m a quilter and was drawn to your videos because I need to improve my embroidery for a crazy quilt I want to do. Almost the first thing I hear when someone finds out that I quilt is “Oh can you make one for me?” It always stumps me. The time involved, the outrageous price of good fabric, the creative element… Do you have an answer to get through to these people? Your work is beautiful and worth every bit of $3,300. U.S. I’m so glad you did this video. Keep being you. Take care
Tell them what it's worth up front Peggy so you don't waste your time in uneccesary conversations! If they don't like it it isn't your problem...
I say No because my rates are steep and I wouldn't want that to come between us. Or"No you couldn't afford it" - if they say Try me- then say "ok I'll give you a cost estimate by the end of the day so you can put down a deposit". - I have not had one person follow thru after saying that!
I could go on & on with this subject, but will stick to just one example. The one and only time I put my work in a gallery I attended the opening and overheard two women exclaim how "outrageous" my prices were. I introduced myself; I pointed out that the prices were based on $10 per hour (which was about the same as minimum wage at the time) and that the gallery would get 30% of that. One said "your kidding" - I said no - and that was the end of the conversation.
Well done D'Ann! It would be interesting to ask them what they thought a reasonable price would be...
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery They didn't stick around for any more conversation.
Thank you for this video! Simple enough to calculate, it is such a difficult task to price. I have trouble finding a simple yet flexible format that can be applied to a range of embroidery projects.
Would you be able to help with these queries:
1. How would you calculate the thread use/count? I know you did a guesstimate for this video, but do you have a format on how to calculate thread use for embroidery projects?
2. With the general materials used, I can understand fabric expense, but with materials like needles, do you charge the full purchase price for 1 needle (not the whole package)? For example, if it is 0.50 cents to buy 1 needle, then add that to the material cost.
3. In regards to the artist' qualification, experience or reputation, how did you end up with this guesstimate? Of course, the specific number is personal to each artist but again are there guidelines, any other advice or a format you would suggest as to how to get this number? Especially to newer artists or who are self-taught
The perceived value and its impacts is an important one to learn.
Thank you so much, your videos are so helpful! So appreciated.
Food for thought Sarah, thank you so much, my daughter sells her fashion embroidery mainly to friends (she has a full time job) and it is always difficult to give a price to pieces and due to the hours involved, yes, they can work out being quite dear! Thank you for reasoning on the subject. Very useful.
And I forgot to mention 'mates rates' too Raffi!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery 🤣❤️
This is really interesting. Thank you. Can I ask, do you ever add extra to help cover all your other business expenses such as insurance, technical support, overheads for working from home etc? Or do you just accept that you will have to pay that out of your "per hour" calculation?
I think I would if my business was selling embroideries regularly Victoria, but as I rarely do a commission I don't but something else to think about yes
There is a huge market for hand made items in the US but the mass market version of hand made. Make a bunch of bags or pot holders or what have you. There is a market for bespoke items but I never get paid for the amount of work I put into whatever it is. I take a project I've never done, quote it and then make it but it's always more time consuming than I figured lol so I run into the 'I should have charged more for that' scenario lol. I do have enough stuff to make crafting my career but I'm still attached to the medical insurance I get with my day job so not ready to pull that trigger yet haha!!!
Your efforts Sarah are priceless I would say but worth it…I would go the sentimental way personally but now that I seem to be so creative with different hobbies, I couldn’t possibly keep it all… I’ve already given away a sampler and want to donate some paintings… I feel so fortunate to have found you on RUclips and am grateful that your tutorials inspire me ☺️ A live chat would be wonderful but don’t stress about that. You are wonderful, just the way way you are and we’ll keep you anyway we can get you 😆😊 🙏🏽🙋🏻♀️👍🏽Mia
You have raised a good point Maria, what happens when you make so much stuff and you don't have room to keep it!
Very interesting Thank you, my embroidery isn’t worth anything I wouldn’t think, but I enjoy it x
Then it's worth alot Jacqui...
Interesting exercise. And I hope we all get the actual message. 💕
I think work can command higher rates especially if it is one of a kind. Some people get bored and will not make the exact same item more than once. If that is so tell your customer/client that this design will not be made again, so truly it will be a unique piece because there is only one.
This was, as always, very informative! You are incredibly talented and your piece is beautiful! I'm so sentimental, I would probably not sell. But as you said, if someone offered an amount you couldn't refuse, you'd at least consider it! I love to visit it with you❣
I'm not very sentimental Rebecca, there is always something new to make!
Also, if you intend selling through galleries and have added your 40/50% you should keep that price on the piece if you have it for sale from your website or home too. If you undercut the gallery they will drop you like a hot potato.
It's not just embroidery that's undervalued, quilting, sewing, dressmaking, crochet... Are all very much undervalued, some would argue that it's because they were traditionally women's pastimes.
I think the fact that most women no longer learn to sew or make for themselves, means they no longer appreciate good quality work and materials.
When I wore a velvet devore floor-length gown to a women's workshop, I did get many compliments, and someone asked if I could make one for her for £50 or £60. I had made the gown myself, from the design stages to draping the pattern on the stand, acid-burning the velvet (dangerous process), sewing and finishing all the pieces together and final touches, and it all took weeks of work...
Really interesting. It is amazing how hard it is to value your own work and the level of skill required to make it, be that embroidery, knitting or patchwork. I wonder part of the difficulty is that it is also something that the person loves to do so it feels odd to get paid for it. I think it is also true that other people don't appreciate how long it takes to make things.
Hello! Great chat! You always have such great videos and ideas. I hope you have a wonderful week ahead. Thank you for sharing your video!
I do love your goldwork piece! Just stunning!!! Does your goldwork video address how you care and display goldwork?? Also - I haven't noticed any, but do you sign your work in some fashion?
Who can put a price on work you've sweated over? Even some of the greatest artists have had to sell work way below what they should have received. But what can you do? I have always felt that if an artist works with the main goal of trying to sell the work, then one is at the mercy of current popular tastes and what the majority want to buy. An artist is forced to push their own creativity into the mold of that common taste. I would rather keep the work and do it my way. Let my heirs find out what it's worth after I'm gone.
I have nearly 300 pieces so you can get to the point when you have to realistically say 'Maybe I should sell some of them...'!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I would too if I had your fame and credentials!
Just curious. Do professional, highly-skilled graduates of the Royal School of Needlework get hired to do embroidery on bespoke gowns or dresses?
They do yes! The Duchess of Cambridge's wedding dress was one...
Thank you Sarah, very interesting and stunning gold work piece
Thank you so much! I'm currently working on a full-scale Bayeux Tapestry replica and so far, I've completed 40.2 metres. It has taken approximately 5000 hours, which includes drawing the images and the embroidery, but not the washing, cutting and hemming of the fabric. I'm trying to get it valued and today I had a reply from an auction company, giving me a quote of £200-500. I was scanning the email for the missing 0s, but they were nowhere to be found. Giving myself an hourly rate of £30/h, considering I have a large following and have features rather heavily in media and have 20 years of embroidery experience, the current price should be £211,400 according to your calculations. That makes £200 sound like an insult. What would be your suggestion? I would really appreciate your input. Thanks.
I have seen your story Mia and it's fascinating, I'm glad you got in touch. I'm genuinely intrigued by your ability to complete such a huge project and your motivation to keep going and see such an enourmous undertaking through, I'm in awe. To be honest I'm not suprised that someone would have trouble valuing this, it sounds like a full time life times work, how could you value it? It's unique (there's only one more in the world!) and it's also new; auction houses are more used to valuing old stuff (did you try a textile specialist auction house?) and for some reason the older it is the more it is revered. In work hours, experience, materials and love it's probably priceless. In pure monetry value you would only know what someone will pay for it if you try to sell it, and that could change under different circumstances (if more than one person wanted it, how much you wanted to sell it, if they understood and appreciated everything that has gone into it etc). Put it on a wall in a church for 1000 years and once again it's priceless. It doesn't make sense I agree and yes £200 is an insult (so is £500), I imagine that doesn't even pay for the thread. Can I ask why you are trying to value it? Is it for practical purposes?
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery You already know about my 'little' project? Wow, that's cool. Such a small world, isn't it? From the very beginning, I've said that the tapestry is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Even so, I would like to have a figure, for insurance purposes. I have also had queries about lengthy exhibitions at venues and I need to make sure that their insurance will cover the pieces they hire. I'm hoping that knowing its value can guide me towards a rental fee as well. You see, I gain very little from having my work displayed in various places, unless I get paid for it. I'm not after fame and publicity. This is my business. Ultimately, I would like to know what ballpark to place it in when it comes to selling it, if I ever choose to do so. I hope that is a good enough answer. By the way, one of the members in my social media group guided me to your video and I'm so happy I found you.
Have you tried somewhere like Witney Antiques in Oxford or Bonham's for a valuation Mia? Perhaps if you tell them it is for insurance purposes they might do their calculations differently? Works of painted art get valuations, it must be possible! Do the insurance companies need paperwork with an evaluation or can you decide what it's worth or what you want to insure it for? If you can decide, work out the material costs and the hours (estimate then add on some!)...then double it and see how you feel about that number. I don't know if it would be worth contacting someone like the V&A and asking their advice or perhaps the Embroiderer's Guild (who must have to insure their own huge collection of embroideries) and even Reading Museum where the copy is. The latter is Victorian in age and has not long been restored so perhaps they sound your best bet; might be more approachable than the big organisations. I can't remember the history of how this one got to Reading, I think they might have bought it off the Leek Embroiderer's who made it? I would have to look that up again. Yours certainly needs to go on display and I totally understand that you need it to pay for itself. Crowd funding? Maybe approach Hastings town, they should have a copy of the tapestry! I'm sorry I don't really know how to help, hope this has given you some ideas you haven't already thought of. Do email me if you want to ask anymore questions: sarahhomfray@blueyonder.co.uk. x
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I contacted the V&A, but they can't help me, because they are not allowed to according to their policies. I've also been in touch with the Royal School of Needlework and they already knew about me, after the Duchess of Gloucester showed photos from our meeting. They weren't able to help either. However, last week TV's antique dealer Simon Schneider came to our town and I met up with him. When I mentioned the quote the auction company gave me, he scoffed. He reckoned that my own estimate was way too low and he was pretty sure it would eventually be sold for my dream prize of £1M+, possibly through crown funding. That's good enough for me.
So interesting, thank you for sharing
In a future chat, can you explain exactly what your apprenticeship is/was. Obviously I know in general what an apprenticeship is but being from the US I have never heard it applied to needlework. Very curious. Sharon Quinn, Americus KS USA
I mention it in my first chit chat Sharon but I will do a longer video on this so keep watching!
Your maths is wrong on your 40% unless the gallery's pricing system is incredibly strange; if the gallery take 40% of your sale price, your sale price needs to be grossed up at 100/60 which for a net price going to you of £2,654 would be a gross price of £4,423. If you priced it at £3,715 and the gallery took 40%, you'd only get £2,229.
You are right that' s how we priced spare parts in resale business!
Yes maths is wrong
Should also factor in other costs such as electricity if you expect to make a living from your work.
Also, what if an artist wanted to sell functional embroidered items such as bags, purses, jewellery and other accessories which I find incredibly difficult to price. They still hold a lot of value, and a lot of time has been put into it but it is a harder task to price as it is not something that people place a lot of value on like they would with an artwork for instance. Any words of wisdom in this matter? Thank you
I would apply the same rules whether it's on the wall or as a bag lyly! If you lowered the price you would be undervaluing your skills
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery Thank you Sarah! Though, does this mean that it can seem like the bag is priced very high?
If you have some time, could you please look at my message below, I had some queries I wanted to ask you! Thank you so much
I would love to join a zoom talk with you online. It can’t be that difficult because I managed to do it!
It would be on RUclips Live Helene which is another technology to have to learn!
That’s Great for your beautiful piece. Shall I move onto gold work now 🤔 ha ha I have 2 lovely framed Embroidery ones of a Chinese lady and the other is a bit of a funny pattern but I’ve seen it somewhere I’m not as fast as you yet 😂 so I plod on and on great video thanks xx
Great info. Thank you x
I very much appreciate this information. I just started a new business for my stitching, and I have grossly underpaid myself so far. Unfortunately, no one recognizes how much work goes into this and they all want to pay $50 for a huge project, which may not even cover materials. I’ve had so many people balk at $100 for a 8x10 in project (granted it was mostly outline work, replicating a child’s drawing, which was my original idea).
Don't be put off by people balking at the prices; they need to learn what these things cost! Also if you are just starting out you may be prepared to ask for slightly less while you establish yourself and get some sales. When I started I did lots of things I wasn't overexcited about doing as I needed to pay my bills!
@@SarahHomfrayEmbroidery I very much appreciate your encouragement! 😊
I don't sell my work. I do it because I love doing it but if someone would like to buy it I probably would sell it. I leave all my embroidery without the finishing backing. I'm a bit lazy when it comes to that 😊
250,000 sounds right to me, if not more, for that beautiful unique embroidery, if l had that money to spare l would buy it fir sure with that provenance
Yes definitely
It is so difficult to sell for a competitive price when many small businesses underprice their works and this drives the overall price of embroidery works down. Such a shame. Also it is hard when you compete on world market where prices are so diffierent, what I mean is that e.g. on Etsy there is such a wide range of prices on more or less similar embroidery items that it is hard for me to prince my works if I want to put them on Etsy. Any advice Sarah?
Yes, Etsy is an international platform so there are lots of other factors to think about such as the cost of living which can vary in different parts of the world, perceived value etc. I would still say choose a price that you want and stick to that although with places like Etsy, sales generate sales so maybe do some 'offers' that get things rolling (this means you can put the price up later!)
Mera new kot ft gya uske liye koi disjayn bta iye pliz
How to keep up with time spent on a project?
Check the time you start and finish and write it down Eden!
Which does not last long
Mam I also do a lot of embroidery but here in my place there is no worth for hand work embroidery. Every one wants only Aari work.
What is Aari work? Please tell us about it. Thank you so much. Best wishes, Carole.
Yes, what is Aari work? I’d like to know as well! 😊
Are you in India? I guess once you are skilled at Aari work it's much faster
Yes mam I am in India, Hyderabad. I don't do Aari work. I work with the normal embroidery needles as you do mam. But I do a lot of work . It would be nice if you could forward me your email address so that I can send you some photos of my work. I only have an email address.
Mam Aari work is working embroidery with different types of crochet needles which doesn't last long. The normal embroidery that is done with the needles is stronger.
7:47 … what?
Thanks Sarah, for the lovely video, it was very interesting and informative, people don't realise the amount of work that goes into a lovely embroidery.🪡