Hybrid Battery Pack Refurbish - Step-By-Step w/ Settings - 2nd & 3rd Gen Toyota Prius - CQ3 Charger
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- I show all hardware, settings, and steps to refurbish a bank of batteries from a pack that is found in 2nd and 3rd generation Toyota Prius.
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GreggFesto
#greggfesto #toyota #toyotaprius #toyota #toyotapriusv #toyotahybrid #hybrid #hybridbattery #refurbish #automechanic #auto #autorepair #automobile #carfix #automechanic #diy #cq3 #evpeak #2ndgen #3rdgen #3rdgenprius #2ndgenprius
Original hybrid battery on my 2006 failed at 150,100 miles. Bought a replacment from the dealer. It failed at 65,000. Followed Gregg's method. It took two weeks to refurbish but did not replace any modules. Found out in the process the dealer sold me a refurbished battery. It has now been 6 months and it is running like new, back to 52 mpg on the highway. Thanks Gregg.
I did this same job about 6 years ago & only had to replace 7 cells. I barely knew what I was doing but it made it 6 years before it failed again. Great video!
Now that was thorough how to! Love the welding wire rigging. Gives a chance to cycle /salvage /refurb cells that make your cut in numbers provided. Really great content using solid available affordable technology. Thank you
Hi Greg Festo I just wanted to pass and say THANK YOU SO MUCH. You have been an amazing help on the process of refurbishing my battery and your quick response to every question I had in the process.
I had 0% of understand the hybrid battery and even so I have plenty of family members that are mechanics nobody knew how to help either.
I will recommend this video as much as I can to every Hybrid owner I know to help your channel grow and if there’s any other way I could help please reach out.
Again thank you from the bottom of my heart sir you’re amazing in explaining and answering my tedious question. Wish you the best of luck in everything God bless 🙏🏽🙏🏽
And for anybody doubting they can do it stop thinking that way. You can best of luck and ask my friend over here he is the best.
Thank you for watching. I appreciate you writing such a nice response for the videos. God bless you too.
I like this video! So thank you for that! However, I see a train wreck happening if people “set it and forget it”. Here are some tips to avoid problems.
Lets say you set the NIMH settings to charge @ 3.0 amps, discharge @ 1.0 amps, discharge cutoff 6.0 volts, CAPA 7500 mAh, wait time 5 minutes, 3 cycles, safety timer 720 minutes (12 hours) (which is what Gregg suggests). The charger will discharge a module @ 1.0 amps down to 6.0 volts. It will wait 5 minutes, and then charge @ 3.0 amps until it has charged 7500 mAh or Deta V is triggered (aka “delta peak charging”), which occurs when the module is fully charged. Many chargers (such as the SkyRC charger) do not detect Delta V, but it appears this quad charger does detect Delta V. But some modules are old, and they will no longer trigger Delta V, so you will rely on CAPA of 7500 mAh to save you (or max charge time of 12 hours)? The problem here is that many older modules will be at their max potential voltage of 8.60 volts after applying just 4000 mAh.
A new hybrid pack will run over $2,000 and a rebuilt pack will run $750. An old module on Ebay runs $30. Here are some things you can do to avoid needlessly damaging your modules:
1) Set CAPA to 3300 mAh (for older modules), 4300 mAh (for good modules), 5300 mAh (for great modules). Watch max voltage reached and adjust.
2) Set charge to 3.0 amps. After two cycles, you can set charge to 3.2 amps.
3) Buy a SkyRC temperature probe ($10). Set max temperature to 83 F (for a single module), or set to 110 F (if left in the pack).
4) Set wait time between charge and discharge to 60 minutes (to allow module to cool).
5) Set discharge to 1.0 or 2.0 amps down to 6.50 volts. 6.0 volts is too low.
6) To refresh a module, you can discharge @ 0.1 amps from 6.5 volts down to 6.0 volts (once or twice). Following discharge, allow 20 minutes for voltage to drift back up to 7.20 volts. If the voltage does not rise on its own, apply a trickle charge of 0.1 amps up to 7.20 volts. Once a module is at 7.20 volts, you can apply a charge of 3.0 or 3.2 amps up to 8.60 volts.
7) When charging a module, the voltage may show 8.72 volts (or so). After stopping the charge process, the actual module voltage may be 8.55 volts or less (the max voltage for Prius modules is 8.60 volts). Delta V may be triggered around 8.72 volts. This quad charger appears to detect Delta V, but this is not guaranteed. Some modules are worn out, and will no longer trigger Delta V. If you have overcharged your modules, they may no longer trigger Delta V. If a module no longer triggers Delta V, this could be dangerous because the car’s BMS (battery management system) will not know when that module has reached it’s max charge.
8) When pairing modules for a pack rebuild, pair them based on similar resistance and mAh capacity. Do NOT pair weak modules with strong modules as an attempt to fool the BMS. It is better and safer to pair modules with similar capabilities. Pairing modules with similar characteristics will reduce the number of failures of a hybrid battery pack. If you have a super strong module, and you don’t have a good match, it may be best to leave that module out of the pack.
Excellent tips. Can you tell me how to best position the SkyRC temp probe to monitor external temperature? Just set it on top?
Great clarification, Thank you! What do you mean in step 1) watch max volts reached and adjust?
Gary, in your opinion, what is the minimum amount of mAh required per module in order to have a good, working battery pack? I have noticed with some of older modules, I am luck to achieve 3000mAh discharge, even after 5 cycles. Curious to know at what point does one just give up and classify a module as junk.
I kinda wonder what we are supposed to be shooting for. 4000 at 7.2 volts? 6500 at 8.5? or I guess more importantly, what should we be discharging in a real world scenario because there is no way in hell I can get 5000 like u r getting Mr. Festo
@@MervsServiceSecrets Someone who reconditions the batteries told me that 4500 mAh is the discharge cutoff for a single module.
I couldn't have done it without Mr. Gregg's help.
Thank you very much for the feedback. You are appreciated.
Thank you sir! Extremely informative and to the point! I recently purchased a 2008 Prius with a bad battery, currently following your process (with 2 cheaper chargers) and am saving thousands reconditioning the battery myself. You're a hero!
Thanks for this. Very detailed and clear explanations. You included many good tips that I haven’t seen anywhere else. I feel I can proceed with confidence. My 2007 Prius has less than 120,000 miles on it and I feel it has a lot of life left in it.
Another excellent video from Gregg. I watched your first video and followed your steps exactly and my results were excellent. As was shown in your video, use decent cables rather than the cheapies found online. I did notice that some of my modules required 5 cycles of discharge/charge while others required only 3. The torque values on the bus bar nuts are 48 in-lbs when reassembling the battery pack. Thanks again Gregg for sharing your valuable knowledge.
Whats your battery performance after reconditioning?
Just wanted to say 'Thank you' for your very helpful video. I was able to get my 2008 Prius back on the road. I appreciate it.
Thank you for watching and providing feedback. Glad I was able to help you.
Gregg, I want to thank you for both of your excellent prius battery videos, Your help was invaluable in taking on my battery rebuild project, setting up the charger, balancing, assembly and disassembly of the pack.
A couple of things that might help others. I had to coax a number of modules thru 5-7 cycles to get them to 5000 mah, In the end I did not trust those cells or thought they would be the problems of the future so I opted to only use modules that got to 5000 mah in 3 cycles. also, I choose to lower the charge rate to 2.5 or even 2 amps on modules that tended to swell excessively, though It really extended the overall charge/cycle time.
Thank you for watching and writing in with the feedback.
I couldn't have done it without Mr. Gregg's help.
Hi! Everyone. Im from LA. I have a camry 2007 and the HB is 12% state of charge. Im learning from Greg how to do this
process. Im using same charger same set up couple of days ago. This is a lot of fun! Thanks Greg. Great educational videos
I'm having lost of fun working on my 2007 toyota HV. I'm half way through and I have saved 4 modules so far after 10 or more cycles for each. If I can saved at least half of the HB I'll be so happy
Don't even own a Prius but enjoyed watching the video.
Excellent demonstration. I took your advice and bought 2 chargers and have discovered that I need 10 'new' blades, I am just testing them now, and some are not getting to 5 amp hours capacity. The ebay vendor claimed that they were all above 5 amp hours, so I am still cycling them but no joy yet....
Thanks for watching. I have had some batteries come in that took a few cycles to get back to good numbers. This may be from the batteries sitting on a shelf for a while before they are sold to us and shipped out? Not sure. Please write back and let us know how your pack turns out.
@@GreggFestoI think you are right, some have taken 7 cycles but they are all getting above 5 amp hours
Where can l buy the chargers & howmuch ? Thanks
Fantastic video Gregg! I learned so much from this and I thoroughly enjoyed learning your step-by-step process. I can't wait to start my 2006 Prius hybrid battery project soon!!
Thank you for watching and leaving a great comment.
Greg job on the video. Very clear on the steps to complete the job.
Thank you for watching and leaving a great comment.
One of the best videos I have ever watched ,you're a boss thanks for sharing
One of the best videos I've watched on this subject thanks.
I don't know if I will have the guts to try this,but this is a fascinating video!
Well done!
It is good to go outside of your comfort zone sometimes. It usually results in realizing that you actually can do it.
Go for it bro. Just watch and read on how disconnected the HB before you do anything
@@sueellenmcgoey6095 all you need to know Mr. Gregg has it. Remembered some modules should be cycle 10 t 20 times. So, be patient. I'd highly recommend that you get at least 4 chargers. Get the red ones. If possible!
waw , from the bottom of my heart thank you so much for making this video and making it so easy to understand and step by step, thank you thank you
Great video, the best one is come across for this topic.
Still waiting of cables and battery will follow to start refurbishing some batteries. I wanted to make a power bank out of a whole pack and connect it to a 3000 watt inverter to be used in black out. After asking around nobody could answer me. So went on Ai from Edge. If I run at 90% load so 2700 watt with fridge computer some stuff and let's say air conditioning, the final answer verified at 2 AI chats is 31 minutes so first that will kill the bank very quickly, and this makes this part of the project non feasible. Just wanted to let you know in case somebody ever wondered lol. Very dispointed, saved me couple of hours putting it together lol live and learn.
are U saying it doesn't work for your back-up
Already looked at your other videos, this ones completes information, thanks
Thank you for the detailed video! Great information that’ll help me refurbish my battery.
Hey there Gregg, so after watching your video I decided to go after the charger as well. While I am happy that your battery pack was in much better shape, unfortunately I can't say the same for mine. On avg all my modules end up below 1000 mah. I did find a guy who sells batteries with a range of 3500-4500 mah & so far one of his has passed the test. However, because of how many modules the pack has in general, I'm gonna have to make multiple orders to ensure that I can take care of bills at the same time. Just for reference, I do have an 09 Prius with 254k miles. So I did learn the hard way to give the battery pack at minimum 10 years before taking care of it each time in the future.
Thanks for watching. How many cycles did you give your batteries before deciding they were not recoverable? I have had to run some 15-20 times before getting to the 5000mah value. I recently purchased some very good replacements from seller aloyhybrid on ebay for around $33 each. Each one was over 5500mah discharge. Sorry to hear you are having issues and hope you get your Prius back on the road soon.
So I've only run each battery once with the exception of the one that I purchased through eBay. There's only one from the original pack that seems to show some promise, so I'll give it another go. However I just don't have time to go wasting my electricity bill on cycling cells that just aren't showing any immediate promise. The downside of my situation is that I don't really have a nearby place where I can safely dispose of the bad batteries, especially since I've read that these nimh batteries aren't exactly healthy for the environment.
You should for sure run at least 3 cycles on each battery. Many times the first cycle will show low values or even CAPA with low discharge value.
You may wish to buy a used pack from a junk yard for $750 ($26 per module), or even $450 ($16 per module). I wish I did this instead of buying modules off of Ebay for $330.
One thing that I keep seeing about reconditioning these batteries is measuring resistance. Measuring Miliohm resistance in batteries requires specialized equipment. Nothing a multimeter can do. I've been trying to determine a cheap meter that will do this, that isnt in a multithousand dollar specialized hybrid battery restoration machine. I fond them in the $50 range with one paragraph of english instruction, designed for flashlight and 9v style batteries. Don't know if they would work.
------UPDATE-----
Just ordered one. See if it works.
Any more update?
Some skyrim type chargers can measure it can't they?
Hey greg i have 13 plug-in with 280,000 miles im in NJ averaging 50 mi to the gallon in the winter and somewhere between 60 and 80 in the summer when i first bought the car i got as Hi as 118mpg now I can't plug in as much so im down on mpg in the spring i might pull the pack and as i have RC chargers like what u use great videos 😊
I have the charsoon antimatter. Basically the same in operation and function.
When i started in 2018 it seems there was a lot less info.
Thankful for the recap on numbers for set up and what we want.
I can only charge at 7.2 or 8.4, it goes past 9v and upwards of 10v on 8.4. I dont like that, but unsure if its too much on the module
thanks for the DIY right to repair help - lets keep things working
Question why has Get FPV placed a disclaimer on these chargers that they NOT for use on Hybrid car batteries?
Have you experienced?
Seems like you have done many many cycles with your two units….
Perhaps others don’t get your settings correct?
I prefer your assessment method to many load test, and other options.
Let me/ us know please.
Thank you for watching. I have heard recently about this warning but not sure why this is the case. Have they changed something in the charger since I purchased mine? My units were purchased several years apart and seem to work exactly the same. I have been using CQ3 for over 6 years with fantastic results. I have the Red CQ3 running on a battery right now as I type. The only issues I have ever had with these chargers is with the small cooling fan inside which starts to make bearing noise. The fan is cheap and easy to replace.
Good Job Gregg,
Very thorough, that's rare.
I have a Prius, watched your video, bought both cahrgers.
programmed them as instructed, 3 cycles, discharge/charge, ran into something that you didn't mention.
About 2 hours into my time from start. all but 2 modules read FULL. I pressed the mode button as you stated if End was displayed, the screen didn't indicate and cycle information, discharge/charge... nothing, just battery type selection screen like from the beginning.
all of the 8 modules read Full but 2. Number 4 and number 28, they were still running the cycles.
Not sure what to do now. Start again? Not sure what full means pertaining to a discharged and charged module just a couple of hours into the process.
When I pulled the battery and tested each module, all tested at just over 8V but 2 at 7V. Figured that they may be the culprit
Thanks, Have a Great Evening
Thanks for watching. You are correct, FULL is the same as END. Not sure why you would not see results when pressing the same button I did. On both of my chargers it is the far left button even though they are labeled differently. You can see this at 8:55 in the video. I suggest try a different button on the next finished battery and see if you can get results. If you find that it is a different one, please let us know as someone else will have this issue too. The voltage reading is not going to tell you much about the health, remember it is the capacity that counts.
Also have this issue
How long can you expect it to take to run a module through 3 cycles of charge/discharge?
Takes about 3 weeks depending on health of the batteries to complete the pack.
Another great video! Hey i went to buy the charger and it has a warning "This charger is not designed for use with hybrid car batteries. Any such use will damage the charger and is not covered by warranty." Is this still the charger your using?
Thank you for watching. Yes I use the CQ3 charger for this process still. I have a red one and a silver one, they both work well and have refurbished many battery packs. There was no such warning when I purchased mine.
Hey Greg, great channel. I have configured settings from video, but for some reason it stops after first cycle. I set it to 3 cycles, and when the cell starts blinking “Capp” , I can use arrow button and cycle 2, shows zeros, and it will scroll 1,2,3,4,5, ..all zero’s except #1.
I’m still a beginner..
Thanks
John
Hey John, Thanks for watching. Sounds like you are having good results. The charger stopped doing cycles because it met the 7500mah CAPA on first Charge cycle. Pay attention to the Discharge mah value and start cycles again. The Discharge mah value should rise each time. When you get to 5000mah Discharge this is a keeper, if you have 7500mah CAPA Charge at the same time then this is even better.
Thanks for the battery vendor tip, will try them once I get this refurbish testing done. At time 8:56 of your RUclips video “Hybrid Battery Pack Refurbish - Step-By-Step w/ Settings - 2nd & 3rd Gen Toyota Prius - CQ3 Charger” you change from your older red CQ3 to a newer silver & blue CQ3 charger. This newer one is what I have and I am having trouble with the instructions for it. If a test ends with a flashing "FULL" and I press the BATT TYPE button, no cycle results are presented, it just return to the initial screen. What does a flashing "FULL" mean. It apparently is not the same as "CAPA' or END. The instructions that came with the charger say nothing about this. Any help appreciated.
My silver charger was purchased about 3 years before the red one. I have a video that shows comparison between them. The message "FULL" is the same as "END". Be aware of the buttons when a cycle has ended. If you press the wrong one then you will get no results. The red and silver chargers have different wording on the buttons but the button position for results is the same (I believe the far left button for each channel).
@@GreggFestowhere can l buy the charger & howmuch?
Process completed.... changed out 8 bad modules. Dr Prius app says I got 97% capacity left and battery is in new condition! 😊 Will see how long this lasts before I get the orange triangle of death again 😂
Thank you for watching and providing awesome feedback.
I have the charsoon antimatter. Basically the same in operation and function.
When i started in 2018 it seems there was a lot less info.
Thankful for the recap on numbers for set up and what we want.
I can only charge at 7.2 or 8.4, it goes past 9v and upwards of 10v on 8.4. I dont like that
All my modules all seems to be good on discharging but needed help getting up to full capacity.
Is there any updates on your battery? I hear people telling me that reconditioning doesnt worth it since the battery will be weak again in 2-3 months. Is that true? Cause i am thinking if taking a risk and buying tools and all that or just go pay for a new or refurbished battery?
@@MowgliLArefurbished/reconditioned is what he just did. This is the type of battery you'll be buying. If you have the time, patience an ls correct equipment to do it yourself, you can
Damn man that’s badass. I love this
A great teacher 👏 ❤️ 👍
great video - Gregg!! Thank You!
Thank you for watching
Thank you for the excellent video. I wish you could post a link to the exact make & model of the charger you talk about so I know I am buying the right one. I currently have a SkyRC but I am stupified over how the menu settings work. It all seems so confusing.
Thank you for watching. The charger I use is the CQ3 from EV-PEAK Corporation. They are available and many hobby shops and Amazon. There are 2 different colors (silver and red) that both work the same.
Wow great video. Ordering charger right now....
I already replace the bad battery cell and measured every battery cell and there all around 7.76 and 2 cells are 7.80. Would you recommend balancing them again and doing the process of discharging and charging them back up
Thank you for watching. You should be just fine to reassemble and drive down the road.
Do we necessarily have to load test and plug the cells into the CQ3? Wouldn’t I be able to just balance the cells by connecting all the cells together with the wire? The code usually pops up only because the voltage difference is high. Good work as always! Keep it up!
Thank you for watching and commenting. The code will return due to the low capacity of the failing cells.
Check your scan tool, you can determine the lower capacity cell by watching the charge and discharge rate, the cell block that has the lowest voltage when discharging would show you which block has the loss capacity.
Gregg an excellent video, doing everything per your recommendation in one Chanel I am getting flashing “TIME” what does this mean thank you
Thank you for watching. I have not seen message TIME before. It is possible that it is the same as WAIT message which will appear if the battery voltage is too low on initial discharge cycle. If I am correct you should be able to leave it connected for a while and the message will go away once the charger enters first charge cycle. You can get better answer you can contact EV-Peak customer service. When you verify what the TIME message means could you please write back in and let us know?
Thanks I reset the channel to factory reset and problem went away.
Does the welding wire has to be any specific one to make better contact?
Thanks for watching. I used stainless steel TIG wire but it can be any metal that conducts. If you ordered new bus bars then you can use them along with your old ones to get the job done. Bailing wire works well too.
Love seeing people diving into these subjects. Thank you!
I just got my hands on a 22 Venza from Hertz rental with 48k on the odometer and this gives me hope. I’m trying to find out how long my Lithium cells will last. Thinking if it would be a good idea to get a battery replacement to have while the inventory is available even though it’s still only 50k on the meter. Does this make sense to get something this early?
Thank you for watching. The more you drive the better battery will perform. Sitting for long periods is not good for them. For this reason I would not get a replacement pack and have it sitting around on a shelf - You may find out that it has gone bad on the shelf and you never got to use it.
would you happen to know the numbers for the Cells on a 2013 ES 300H? I'm looking at overhauling mine at the moment.
Thank you for watching. I have not worked on that model of battery, I do not know settings for it. Maybe try going to a chat group for that car if you can find one and see if they can be of help. If you find the specs and do the refurbish, please post on RUclips to help others.
Thank so much for sort of tutorial of refurbishing a battery, car we run a fan to cooling the battery during the charging process?
Thank you for watching. No fan is required when charging.
Thank you for the video, it was very informative....
Thank you for watching and leaving a comment.
Great video I'm learning so much. Question for example on cell 20 about how long did it take you to do one cycle?
Thank you for watching. I am not sure how long it takes to do a cycle as it will depend on the health of the battery. I set the charger up and check it a couple times per day. The whole process takes 2-3 weeks usually.
@@GreggFestowow😮 had no idea it was a long process! Thanks for the heads up!❤
Hey Gregg . Thanks for all efforts you did for the new beginner like me I am a big fan of all your videos. I have a question. When I try to start . It just flashes “DLY” I don’t know what does it mean. Thanks again
Thank you for watching. DLY = Delay. It should move past this step without issue. If your charger will not move past DLY on screen then you should check settings. If settings are correct then you should make sure that your leads are ok. If you still cannot move past DLY then you will want to contact EVPeak service.
Thanks for the great prius battery videos.
I watched this video and purchased the same charger that was in the first video, only it's a red model. It says "BGUAD" instead of "EV-PEAK" and the buttons are labeled differently.
I made sure the settings were exactly what was in the video. I ran my discharge & charge cycle (3x) and when the cycle was completed, I pressed the left button as Gregg did in the video, except I didn't get the same result. When he pressed "Batt. Type" he was able to see the low & high mAh. When I pressed the button located in the same location but labeled "Mode Esc", it took me back to the menu. I ran the scan again thinking I needed to hold it down, but it did the same thing. The other buttons do not take me to the desired menu.
Any thoughts?
Thanks in advance.
thanks for watching. I hit the same button location on both chargers even though they have different labels.
did you figure this out @andyaeschbacher7822? I just did the same thing, finished the scan and when i hit the Mode/Esc, it did not show my cycles at all, just went back to main menu. I also have the BGUAD, but it's EV-Peak on load screen when you turn it on.
i figured it out. the problem is not all chargers that come from amazon are always on 110. i bought two, one was 110 and the other was set to 220. when the 220 got done with the discharge, it would try to charge before failing with INPUT VOL ERR and quit. so what we thought was done was never done so there were no values to show when you clicked MODE/Esc.
@andyaeschbacher7822 and @leakingimplants - @GreggFesto, did you find a solution. I have the same thing, I hit the far left button and it goes to home on 1,3&4, but on 2 it works as Gregg showed. Since #2 works as shown, I think I must not have exactly the same settings, but I can't see where I went wrong.
Thought I would reply just in case it helps others along the way. After checking and even triple-checking to make sure my settings matched Gregg's instructions, I did a factory reset on all 4 QC3 modules and reentered Gregg's settings. 'Bingo', it seems to be working as planned. However, since the first 4 battery modules charged showed a flashing CAPA, therefore I could only see 1 cycle, and 2 of those modules had less than the desired D - 5000.
Thanks for all your help, I getting lots of cell with between low 4300-4800 should I pass them or replacing I have do multiple cycle of them
I was talking about discharge mili amp
I use 5000mah discharge value as my cut-off point.
When you take out the battery from the car are you charge battery to the full first or you straight away discharge the battery ?
Thanks for watching. State of charge does not matter when removed from car. The charger cycle should be set to discharge first then charge.
Great video. We have 3 gen 2 & 2 Gen 3 Prius's in family & I am the car guy. Bought 1 of the recommended chargers & may buy another per your recommendations before I start taking the batteries apart. Also have Dr. Prius app & various OBDII tools. Just one question before I start. Do you have any regen battery vendor you would recommend for purchasing modules from? Would love to hear if you do. Thanks much.
Thanks for watching. I bought 2nd charger just to speed things up a bit. If you are not pressed for time then a single unit is all you will need. On average it takes about 3 weeks per battery pack with a single charger. I have received really good batteries from vendor called AloyHybrid on eBay.
You are awesome!🎉
Great demonstration, what does the mpg looks like before and after the reconditioning?
Thank you for watching. Before reconditioning the car system reported lower 30's MPG average - after reconditioning it was back to upper 40's MPG average.
What should u set up the Input Power low cut off mines at 11.0v
Thank you for watching. I left input power low cut-off at 10.0V. If you are using AC power this setting will not make any difference.
Thanks Gregg for that amazing video, i have my Prius has been sitting for year cause the battery pack after watching your video i decided to refurbish all , i respect all your instructions. The voltage test before i started on each module are 7.94V on each only the first one i fund 6.69V . My worries is i fund CAPA message for every single module i restored at the first or second or third cycle i add one more cycle Example Discharge 3416 Charge: 7201 the second one is D-Ch 4952, C-7500mh two or three cycles on each module i tried to restore. If after 5 cycles the battery never reach 5000mh or 7500mh. do i have to replace all modules?
Thank you for watching. It looks to me as if your discharge value is increasing with each cycle and your charge value has reached CAPA of 7500mah. This is perfect results. Run cycles until you reach at least 5000mah discharge and you will be good. If you also have 7500mah on charge at same time then this is a great battery.
Question, which of the two chargers would you recommend the blue or red? I bought the red one. And bought the wires you suggested, the machine fried. I had four modules connected with the four sets of wires, with separation of three modules connected to prevent heat. Kinda not sure to buy another charger. Any suggestions? None of the modules are shorted.
Thank you for watching. I have not used Blue before. I have a Silver one and a Red one both of which have done very well for me. I have not had any problems with them other than needing to replace some cooling fans due to noisy bearings. Contact EV-Peak support and let them know about your charger, maybe you can get a replacement.
@@GreggFesto Thank you. I said blue instead of silver but mean the same. Do both units have same operating parameters? I assume both are equal in programming. Great videos!
Gregg, after you recondition the cells (cycling between discharge and charge) how much time do you let the pack rest, before unbolting the pack? I'm a little worried about the cells expanding if I unbolt the pack too early. Thanks for your help! Kevin
Thank you for watching. I forgot to mention that in the video. I feel the batteries with my hand, if do not feel any hot spots then I take apart, flip the batteries and balance. Please let me know how your pack does after you reinstall in car.
Thanks for the info on the "Full" ending message meaning the same as an END. I got my second "Full" message this morning. I am using your setup of running 3 cycles, but my problem is I can't figure out the key sequence from the FULL message to be able to see my 3 cycle DISCH and CHARGE values for the cycles completed resulting in the FULL message. If I press the BATT TYPE button as I usually do it does not not take me to the cycle values. Any ideas?
I suggest pressing the button furthest to the left on each channel. You can see this at about 6:35 in my video.
2 questions; Why not us dielectric grease on all the connections to eliminate corrosion? And, while the battery is still in the car, shift to N with the ac on (300+ volts) to draw down the battery. Then shift D to let it charge up. Doesn't that balance the modules too? Use and OBD2 like Dr. Prius to see the status of each block (2 modules) to get an idea of what's going on in the pack?
Thank you for watching. Dielectric grease is a fine idea and may help future corrosion. Cycling the battery in the car will cycle the pack as a whole unit which will not address the capacity of each individual battery. I do use dr prius app before doing this service as it enables me to verify that the blocks showing low capacity are the same as the ones I see when refurbishing.
@@GreggFesto Yes, I understand. But you recycled your batteries and got them up to decent ranges.(the ones that were good). My thought is to do the same thing on the car and then see which ones don't correct themselves. Might save time by having the car do the work instead of doing it on the bench. What am I missing with this logic?
When the pack is together the batteries are arranged series. This means that they are charged/discharged together. When charge capacity is reached on the strongest cell of the pack, could be 1 out of the 28, then the charging stops. When discharge capacity is reached on the weakest battery then the charging starts. This is the same way the charger works. The downside of this is the car does not fully cycle each battery in the pack. I believe that each of the 28 batteries you see me cycle is made up of smaller batteries. It is quite possible that only one of these smaller batteries inside of the gray battery has failed causing the gray battery to read as failed therefore causing the hybrid pack to read as failed. Your lowest capacity "weakest" and your highest capacity "strongest" battery of the 28 gray batteries in the hybrid pack will determine the way your cars charging system behaves. Your pack is only as good as your weakest gray battery.
great video, very helpful. i have a 2009 gs450h do you happen to know if these batteries have the same capacity and should i use the same charge and discharge amps when testing these⁉️
Thank you for watching. Your batteries are the same as these and can use the same settings. You will have 40 of them instead of 28.
Gold, currently doing a 2007 GS450h. I'll post on www.youtube.com/@HouseOnRoosevelt
On my 2013 Toyota Prius that I bought 3 years ago with 72,000 miles on it when I first got it I was getting about 45 mpg which was okay. 3 years later and 115,000 miles on it I am getting 39 mpg right now. Would refurbishing my battery like this bring that mileage back up or is there another problem with the car that you might know about? In advance thank you for any advice.
Thank you for watching. A hybrid battery pack that is declining in health can indeed be one of the reasons for MPG decrease. This is because the battery has less capacity so the car will use gas engine more to compensate.
Hi Greg, I'm working on a 2001 Gen 1 pack. The Modules are rated at 6500 mah. So, two questions, my Capacity cutoff should be set to 6500 mah?... and Second... should I be looking to reach 4000 mah on my discharge reading. Thanks
Thank you for watching. I am not sure of the difference between Gen1 and Gen2 batteries. I suggest checking PriusChat forums. Gen2 batteries are also rated at 6500mah, the reason the charger is set to CAPA at 7500mah has to do with the way it reads voltage while the battery charges, you can learn more on this by researching "delta peak charging". I see you have more batteries than a Gen2 to refurbish. Hope you will write back and let us know how your pack turns out.
Excellent video. How do you dispose of modules that have been determined bad? What is the charge voltage at 3amps?
Thanks for watching. We have recycle area at the dump in my city for batteries so I take them there. I do not know the answer to your volt/amp question.
Gregg, thank you for this video. I was able to purchase a “new” Dorman refurbed battery for $100 but it’s been sitting unused in a box since 2018. All of the cells I’ve tried read at over 6v but less than 7. When I try to do this, the most I’ve seen in the discharge mah is around 600. Are these modules all dead? I’m 0/8 right now.
Thank you for watching Aaron. You may have to run a couple of cycles on a battery that has been sitting for a long time. If the battery is able to be recovered then this process will do it. Usually I experience CAPA message with low discharge mah for the first couple cycles.
Thank you for the video Gregg, in the process of reconditioning. Do you load test these modules?
Thank you for watching. If the discharge capacity is 5000mah then they should be good to go. I put back in car, drive for a bit, then look at dr prius app for health.
thqnk you very much for teach❤❤❤
Thank you very much for watching and leaving a great comment.
Good vid but one thing, charge cap 7500 is not enough! Really good modules with near full capacity (6500) will charge to 9000 even a little more
Gregg, Thanks for all your help!!! I have one question, in your first video you put out a few years back (ruclips.net/video/FsPaO2HO8uI/видео.html) you had the NiMH Discharge settings set to 1.0A 6.3V. In this video the NiMH Discharge settings are set to 1.0A 6.0V. Just curious why you brought the voltage down? Again, thanks for all your help!!! Kevin
Hello Kevin, Thank you for watching and commenting. I have found that while both voltage settings work well, the 6.0 seems to provide desired results with fewer cycles.
Should I recharge the 12v battery with the charger?
THANKS MY FELLOW PRIUS BRO.
Very informative!! Question. How do you discharge the pack before installation into the vehicle?
Thank you for watching. You should not discharge the pack. After performing the steps in this video your pack will be charged, balanced, and ready to install.
Great Video!!! will this process work on a Chevy Volt? I actually have a Hybrid Cadillac CT6 and I have had problems finding reliable service for it, including the dealership. I know a lot about the vehicle, but lack the battery discharger that GM recommends. Could I use the one that you used in this video perhaps?
Thank you for watching. This charger and process should work on most any hybrid battery but the settings may change based on the battery type, voltage, and capacity. I suggest finding a forum for the Volt and see if someone there knows the specifics for battery and refurbish charging.
Thanks for the hands on instructional video. Would you use same voltage/amperage parameters for refurbishing 1st generation Honda Insight (2000-2006) and 1st gen Honda Civic Hybrid (long pipe 1.5v x 6 = 9v D type stacked) batteries? If not, which values (charge, discharge, volts, amps) would you recommend, or the same parameters used for Prius Gen 2 and 3 can be applied to 1st Gen Honda hybrid batteries? Thanks.
Thank you for watching. I am not familiar with the Honda batteries enough to provide setting details. I suggest visiting a Honda forum and getting that info from someone with more experience than myself.
@GreggFesto just fyi findings: Forum and RUclips users apply various similar setups, usually setting upper amperage capacity limit (charge) to 6500mV, that is the stock battery specs, but the later aftermarket batteries that came with 8Amp capacity (Bumblebee, Greentec, etc) seems to be handling your 7500mV charge capacity limit pretty well.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I'm currently about half way through reconditioning my 2007 battery pack.
Quick question, if you don't mind: Is the number of cycles required to hit the 5000/7500 values an indication of the remaining life in a module, or is that number irrelevant as long as those values are reached? Asked another way, does a module that required 10 cycles to reach 5000/7500 have less life remaining than one that required only 2 cycles? Thank you for your time.
Thank you for watching. That is a good question, unfortunately I do not know the answer. I suspect that the battery which took 10 cycles to recover is not as healthy as the one that took only 2 cycles but just don't know. This would be a good question for a forum such as PriusChat. I have had some take over 15 cycles to come back around and they seem to work just fine. If you do get an answer to this from someone that knows, please write back in and share with us.
@@GreggFesto Thanks for getting back to me. If I do find an answer I'll be back to share.
Another great video Gregg! On average how long did it take for 1 cycle per module to discharge and charge? Thank you!
Thank you for watching. I am not sure how long a single cycle takes on average. It depends greatly on the health of the battery of course. I setup for multiple cycles and check on charger a few times a day. Some batteries like that the really good one in video are finished in 24 hours, some like the one that had to be cycled multiple times take days. This pack took 21 days with 2 chargers which includes refurbishing the 14 replacement batteries.
I have just gone thru this with two packs. Many of the modules take 8 hours per cycle, so that can total 24 hours for 3 cycles. It takes longer to charge the better the module, also they reach "capa" or capacity of 7500 mah that you've set to protect the battery from overcharging. if that happens as Gregg shows, the charge "times out" and you have to manually restart the next cycle.
Thank you so much for this. I am thinking that I can pull this off with the help of your video. Do you think it's possible? Im 50 yrs old and smart enough to have never voted for Joe Biden. Tell me whatcha think. Thanks!!
Thanks for watching. I do not know you personally but am about the same age and voting status so I do think you can do it. Please let me know how it goes if you do.
So I just started doing this process thank you so much for making it so easy to follow by the way. Am on day 3 now have already done the process on about 11 modules and the low numbers don't go higher than two digits. Should I continue trying to bring them back or just buy new modules?
Thank you for watching and commenting. It is acceptable to have low values on discharge mah for a few cycles particularly if the batteries have been sitting for a bit. Have you double checked charger settings? If you have run more than 12 cycles on a battery and still are getting only double digits on the discharge mah values then that battery may not be salvageable.
I have it exactly as you instructed on video one other thing it's only showing me results for one cycle.
Are you getting display of CAPA or END or FULL at completion of cycles - before you look at the result(s)? There should be a reason your charger will only run 1 cycle instead of the 3 it is set for.
Capa at the end
From your description and the CAPA message it appears you are meeting the charge set point of 7500mah on first cycle. This is fine but you will need to run the cycles again until your discharge value is at least 5000mah.
Hi Gregg what’s the minimum you suggest for the discharged number? I found some of mine that reach around 3,800 till 4,000 is always the range of my minimum
Thanks for watching. I use Discharge value of 5000mah as my minimum.
@@GreggFesto so if they don’t reach the 5,000mah discharged there not good
Great resource! Any parameters for ford escape batteries?
You should also measure from positive post to bottom mounting lug. I had a battery pack that was leaking through the boss and causing a high voltage leak to ground fault.
Thank you for watching and commenting with a great suggestion.
What relationship does the 7500mAh upper limit have to the stated capacity of the cell? I’m trying to figure out what the parameters would be be for my escape.
The Toyota gen2 mAh is 6500, but I believe you set an upper limit of 7500.
The escape cells are rated 6V @ 5500mAh.
Is the 1000 over an arbitrary amount?
I’m not criticizing, I just want to approach the escape batteries with some reasonable test scheme.
I’ve been charging cells and subjecting them to a load test.
I’m using the ebc-a10h unit.
Btw the escape batteries are a real headache to get to. My daughters 08 Prius had the ground fault and I could probably tear down 10 Prius packs in the time it took me to do one escape.
I am not a charger expert by any means and do not know what the settings for Escape would be. I am using settings that were acquired from forum called PriusChat where there are many discussions about refurbishing the battery packs. Perhaps you can find the settings you need at a forum for Escape or join the PriusChat forum where one the people there who have better knowledge than I do about this subject could help. I appreciate you watching my video and hope you get the Escape going. A video of how you do it could be very helpful to others if you have time to produce one.
@@irritantno9 It sounds like there are 5 cells in a module (1.2v x 5 = 6v). Personally, I think a better mah for Prius is 6500 mah. For the Prius, the max voltage of a module is (6 cells x 1.433333v = 8.60v). For the Escape, it sounds like you have 5 cells (which are likely 1.2v each). Max voltage for Escape may be (1.4333v x 5 cells = 7.16666v. This is just extrapolating the data you provided here (of 6V @ 5500 mah).
why not use the prolong charger/discharger? seems like it would take way less time and not that much more expensive.
I was taught this process with the CQ3 and it works so well I have continued to use it. Have not tried prolong charger before. Thank you for watching and commenting.
Note: they're called modules, not cells. Each module has six cells.
There is the Hybrid Automotive Prolong stuff and the Maxx-Volts stuff - they both do the same thing (also called a "grid charger).
These chargers deal with the whole pack at once (ie not the individual modules).
The Prolong equipment will NOT repair a dead module.
If you've got a few dead modules in a pack then you have to identify and replace those modules, which is what this video clip shows.
Once you've tested all the modules and replaced the dead ones you need to balance the pack (ie get all modules to the same voltage, or as close as possible to that).
That's what a Prolong charger will do - it will pump current into the whole pack at a slow rate.
Each cell in each module will "fill up". When a cell is full it will convert the current into heat, but as it's such a low current there won't be enough each to damage the module.
So, by charging with a Prolong charger you'll end up with all cells fully charged and a lukewarm battery pack (but not so hot that it damages any modules).
A Prolong charger is good for:
1) balancing the back once you've got a good set of modules together, and:
2) regular maintenance - balancing the pack regularly will help to make it last longer (eg every six months).
@philmeupbaby: The reason is that you're only charging up the entire pack and discharging the entire pack - as a complete thing with the Prolong charger. That might be fine, but what's happening here is looking at the individual 28 modules. If you've not got any bad blocks (14 of them) meaning some bad modules (the actual 28 blades), you might be OK with the 'charge and discharge the whole battery' approach, but in many of our cars at 150K+ miles, we have a couple bad modules. It will do little good to the bad modules to be part of the Prolong process, as far as I know. When I manually tried to condition the 4 bad modules in my battery, no amount of CHG/DCHGing helped them - they stayed failed...
how many have done it exactly this way and had luck? Reading comments where people make this process more complex.
Hi Greg,
I'm getting ready to do this process on 2008 Prius and thanks to your videos I feel confident about doing it myself. However i do have a couple questions I'm hoping you could answer for me!
First question, when i find bad cells and order replacements do i need to discharge and charge them, or is there a way I can check to make sure im getting a good cell?
Second, when i balance the pack im simply connecting all the positive/negative terminals in a row and letting it sit like that for 48 hours? I don't need to discharge and charge it all together?
Thank you for your time putting these great videos together!
Thank you for watching. I always run at least 1 cycle on the replacement batteries so I know what I received. This lets me know how it compares to my others and lets me know where to place it in the pack after balancing. During the balancing step you do not need to charge or discharge, just let them equalize. I hope you will write back in and let me know how your pack refurbishment comes out. How many miles are on your car and what year? Why are you refurbishing your pack? Did you get red triangle or are you experiencing reduction in mileage?
@@GreggFesto The Prius has 134,000 miles and I got the red triangle confirmed by a mechanic to be a hybrid battery failure, he also told me it was specifically cell block ten. However I plan on going through each cell as you do to see if there's any other performing poorly.
Lets said my car is 2007 can i used modules from the 4th generations?
On the bad modules, why didn't you go lower voltage on cycles? With a lower current
Thanks for watching and commenting. I have been told that it could be detrimental to discharge under 6.0V but have done it before and did not see much difference. Lowering the current does seem to help some but adds considerable time. I may try the lower current settings on some of the batteries I replaced from this pack and see whats happens. If good results, I will make a video.
Thanks for sharing
Thanks for watching!
Hey first I want to say great video.
I want to do the same thing to my prius battery. So I went to order the same charger you're using and there a statement saying
This charger is NOT designed for use with hybrid car batteries. Any such use will damage the charger and is not covered by warranty. Updated firmware since its release now allows this charger to support high-voltage charging. Do you see this same message and it still work for you. The purpose of me buying this charger is to do the same thing you did. I don't want to buy it and can't use it. What do you think
Thank you for watching. I have not seen this warning. I am not sure why it says this now. I suggest contacting EV-PEAK customer service for more info. Please write back and let us know what you find out.
Hello Gregg thanks for the video
quick question though, each cycle discharge and charge the battery 3 times or 5?
also how long does 1 cycle take ?
Thank you for watching. Yes, I usually set the charger up for 3 cycles to get a feel of how the battery does. If I see it will need a while to recover or I do not want to check on it as often, then I change to 5 cycles. The time it takes to go through the cycles will depend on how the battery responds to the charging and discharging.
I noticed you aren't using any temperature probes and your temperature setting is very high. How is this safe?
Thank you for watching. I am showing this process the way I was shown. Yes the batteries do get warm when cycling but not enough to cause a fire. I believe this is due to the settings. Low amps for charge and discharge to keep it in a safe zone.
Thank you.
Hi Greg, great video thanks for sharing, however I’m interested in purchasing the same battery chargers but I’m curious how long it takes to discharge and recharge each battery module normally? I’ll be using the chargers for business so it’s not for personal use, thanks in advance
Thanks for watching. The time it takes to cycle each battery module will vary based on health of the battery. Some batteries you can run 3 cycles and it is good while others may require 15 or more cycles. I start the charger then check it a couple times throughout the day so I am not usually around when a cycle ends. In my experience it takes around 16-20 days to do the whole pack.
Thank you, I just received my CQ3 charger today so I’m currently testing it on one module, I followed your settings to set up mines 👍🏼
Question:
Hey so what if a cell/ module has inconsistent results for the discharge and charge?
On one of my cells the numbers kept going down and up and down and up again, so on so forth.
But it did eventually hit 5000/7500 after 20 or so cycles.. should I use this module/cell? In my mind I shouldn’t because it’ll probably still be inconsistent when it’s in the car and will give me the red triangle.
But I’m no expert! Please help!
I agree with your logic on that one. Consider that battery borderline but still good. If you have the additional funds to purchase extra one then replace it but if you do not then I believe it will last long enough for you to save up some more money while driving around. I have a pack with a bunch of those borderline batteries, it comes in handy to drive on while I am rebuilding the pack that actually belongs in the car.
I cannot detect any heating on the batteries. If I program 10 cycles and 720 minutes, does each cycle last for 72 minutes? Of the 72 minutes, will it discharge for only 36 minutes? Why wait 5 minutes from charge to discharge? Is there any limit to the charge voltage? Where can I get a manual that answers these questions?
Thank you for watching. The batteries will get warm when using this process and will expand. The 720 minutes is a safety timer. The cycle time will depend on the health of battery and how long it takes to reach Delta Peak based on the settings. Waiting time between cycles is to let the battery cool down. Setting the charge voltage over 6.3V could cause damage to the battery so I stay around 6.0V-6.3V. There should have been a manual shipped with your charger. If your charger is the same as mine then EV-Peak is the place to contact.
Question Gregg, I’ve had a set of 4 cells that have said ended and full, but when I press the “Mode” button, it doesn’t show me the charge/discharge cycle periods. It just goes to the presets of the charge/discharge rates. Any help would be nice thank you and thank you for the helpful video👌🏽
Thank you for watching. If you got the END message the charger should have run all cycles that you selected without achieving the capacity setpoint. Is it possible that you are selecting the wrong button to view results? I believe it should be the one on far left. If you press the wrong button the results will be lost. Please let me know what you find out.
@@GreggFesto hey thanks for the response, the first time when I read Full, I made sure to press the far left button but the results were lost, I tried again when the modules read End and then I was able to see the results, I don’t know why I didn’t see the results the first time.
Another question if you don’t mind, how long did it take to “refurbish” the 28 cells with your 2x4 chargers before starting the balance?
The time it takes to do this job will vary based on the health of the batteries. Some could take 2 cycles to bring back to 5000mah while others could take 15 cycles to achieve the same results. I estimate 2-3 weeks is average for me to get the job done.
Hey Gregg, quick question for ya... I have the exact same BGUAC CQ3 Charger and in the User Settings, you didn't cover one section which says "Input Power Low Cut-Off"?? Mine seems to be set by default to 11V, but wondering if that's what you use as well since you didn't mention it in the video? Thanks. :)
Ps. Also in User Settings, there is another section for "Battery end volt" and then has options for LiPo, LiIo, LiFe, LiHv, and Pb but no NiMH... So just curious what you have that section set to as well or if it even matters? Thanks again. :)
Thanks for watching. All settings that I did not mention were left as factory. Please write back and let us know how your pack turns out.