1) The torque of the engine doesn’t affect props so you just need to look for high rpm:mass ratio 2) Planetary gears are glitched with props 3) Think about it, do you put vertical stabilisers all across the body of a plane to make it not yaw. No, you put them at the rear of the plane. (remove the shark fins on the body of your aircraft) 4) Body panels and stuff to that effect only slow down your vehicle. 5) The shark fin is the only viable vertical stabiliser.(just put billions of shark fins at the rear of your aircraft)
The reason why it tipped down all the time are the engines. They're what, 50kg each, sitting 3-5 ticks below the wings? That's a lot of hanging weight that offsets the center of mass. TBH I'd use a single engine in the center of the plane, gear it up in the center of the plane too, and then just lead prop shafts out through the wings to the propellers. The less weight you have to swing around in big circles, the more maneuverable you are, even if it's balanced. So keep the heavy stuff (like engines) in the center of gravity.
you're right- the centre of thrust is above the centre of mass. from what I've tried though, you can't gear an engine to control two different props in this game. no matter how you set it up, both will spin the same way, and the gears are kinda just for show
@@coryman125 Hm, that is true, didn't realize that. Is that true even about the "four-pronged cornerthingys" (can't remember the name now)? Because one could have a powered axle running through the wings (perpendicular to the main body), and if the corner gears are connected on the inside of the props, they might make the left prop spin in one direction and the right one in the opposite direction. But I guess even these are just for show.
There are discoverable starting points at places on the map, that are not reachable with any kind of ground vehicle. So the devs did intend for people to try and build planes or helicopters or similar.
I think every formula 1 designer thinks of their cars as land planes. You are using aerodynamics to stick the car to the road whilst trying to move forward the fastest.
the props are acting as a gyro keeping it from wanting to turn thats why they keep trying to go back to that original path you can also see that in the last of the video when he goes to land and turns the props off he can turn it a lot better and it stays turned
For more trust, ya could look at the old german do 335 design with push and pull prop in the center to fit in more gears while still reducing the torque pull problem
a better explanation would be that they provide a force normal to the surface of the wing, so it makes the craft more unstable when the fins are forward of the center of mass. I just wish he played some KSP so he'd get this lmao
i think that because you are using spoilers for lift surfaces, it could be that the slight angle of all of the spoilers is causing the plane to strafe. when you are going straight the plane slightly strafes upwards so you don’t notice it but when you roll the plane strafes in the direction of the roll causing it to slide instead of turn
Something to try Kan, using the air foils... as tails. 2 of them mounted in different directions to counter each other (then later using pistons to change their angle to give you a rudder effect)
Crazy, masochistic idea: Make a pushme-pullyou design with props at either end of the central body, mount the rear engine and propeller on a hinge with a stepper motor so that you can cant it back and forth. I think you will only be able to get a small amount of yaw safely out of this arrangement, it's really more of a method to make people slightly afraid of you than a good yaw scheme. You could also keep the motors on the wings and see if there's a way to change each motor's RPM slightly with the same keys you're using to manipulate the gyro. I think you will have problems getting unequal thrust to create yaw until you solve the rear fin drift problem. In that regard, you could just try putting two opposing downforce wings at the tail, each mounted 90 degrees off the central spine, giving you plane a lot of rear drag and probably stabilizing its flight quite a bit.
two thoughts: firstly, with the engines and wheels below the plane, but the props centered, i think your centre of mass is below the centre of thrust, which explains the pitching down on the runway. secondly, i believe having those vertical stabilisers in front of the centre of mass might be working against you? it's like how darts have all the drag at the back; if it was in the front, then it would try to amplify a turn rather than correct it. imagine dangling your plane from a string, turned a few degrees to the right. if you then imagine the wind going towards it and pushing the tail, it pushes it back towards the middle. but if you imagine it pushing the front, then it'll push the front backwards, away from the middle. making planes in this game is definitely weird, so i wish you luck in this endeavour
That giant aesthetic piece does have aerodynamics which is why if you check wind resistance you will see how the air flows around your vehicle and where the turbulence is at. (In other words how far the wind shifts) if you could turn it 90° and check wind it will help you plan out better
I had a funny thought, you could set up the props to run with a dual speed throttle capability, specifically for a "taxi" runway mode, and a flight/takeoff mode, by running two engines on the props, maybe even with two seperate gearings. Just use a weak lowest power electric engine geared in the torque boosting direction to slow the rpm, and then a big bad beefy engine geared up for rpm, and then set their input controls to different keys.
@@GummieI i havent used manual gears yet, but the fact your drivetrain cannot be examined and understood by the game is likely to interfere with the way the manual gear controls work, the left right shifting pattern using , and . seems like it wouldnt work well with the two gear changes needing to be done in tandem, simultaneously.
It'd work fine if we could assign controls direct to the gear change desired. Then like how multiple engines/motors can work together under one control, your suggestion would work. (and if it *could* work, it would be better yes.)
Try increasing the plane's mass. I know that doesnt make sense if your engines feel underpowered. However the air physics are a little funky in Screwdrivers. Thus a more massive plane doesnt float sideways as much.
its usually just the default setting on an RC esc to have less speed in reverse, you can program it for 100% in both directions, unless your using advanced timing on the motor then in that case it will be slower in reverse
@kANGaming, technically the tail of an airplane provides *downforce* to counter a tendency to nose-down. Also, get rid of the vertical fins ahead of the center of mass.
Yeah, the downforce in the back angles the wings IN THE MIDDLE NOT THE FRONT (sorry) to provide more lift. CoM should be just barely behind the wings/landing gear, just so it doesn't fall over on the runway. I've no idea if anything approaching real physics applies to this game.
it's pitching down because the CenterOfMass is lower then the CenterOfThrust. You need Yaw to counter the drift. the vertical surfaces should be mostly in the back, like the fletching on an arrow.
if you want it to be like a plane, you need the center of lift to be the main wings. the center of gravity should be in front of the center of lift. and the tail should actually produce life DOWNWARD instead of upward, enough to counter the center of gravity using the center of lift as a pendulum.
The reason the planetary gear doesn't work is that the game doesn't consider it as connected to anything if there isn't a wheel. If you put a wheel on a engine ANYWHERE on the vehicle it starts working last time I tried. When you put this one the game also starts tracking HP and acceleration better as well because it has a reference object to connect to the mass of the vehicle.
I do not think those shark fan used as wings are doing anything. Get rid of all the shark fins and the lift in the tail. Then put say 2 shark find in the tail on the top and both sides. You might need to reduce the lift in front.
If you put a stepper motor and a normal motor on one axel you can change the keys on the normal engine and the servo will copy it. When I did this servos where still broken so it was annoying to work with, but it nay still be that the order in which the engines are placed matters. I think it was servo last but im not sure. Stabilization wise you propably want to use 2 downforce wings stacked in opposite directions.
hinge connector directly connected to a planatery gear output doesnt work for some reason however you can transfer the power through some normal gears, then the hinge connector spins just fine
You need something to control yaw, in a normal prop plane you have the rudder which lets you fix that. I think you were actually way more on track when you were attempting to control your roll. The in game gyroscope really looks like it's only useful for pitch.
@@1mariomaniacyou would have to do something like a stepper motor to a vertical wing with a mirrored setup. Then have it return to neutral like he did with the other control surfaces
6:10 your plane doesn't move because planet gears are bugged with hinge connectors at the moment You can have them, but you need the power to pass through at least one set of normal gears somewhere between your planetaries and your hinge
Hey Kan, I know your plane doesn't work, but could you try it in the campaign where you have to go just from point A to B? I think it will be fairly competitive since everyone else will have to go on a long roundabout route.
I'm looking at 11min, and you could put a servo on a servo with a drive shaft between them and have different directions and different buttons on the two servos sitting in a series.
Change your camera mode to get more useful camera behaviour, I think. There are several camera modes you can cycle through (don't remember which button it is)
Since the game isn't really aerodynamics simulator.... It's a lot better if you just have one set of wings in the middle then it won't torque strangely.. but the thrust of the engines over the center of mass is what's causing most of the pitching issues especially when starting.... As far as I can tell the straight panel doesn't provide any aerodynamics that big triangle thing you have as a tail it's just weight
Poor yaw. People always forget rudder control. You literally cannot roll without yaw. Put two vertical stepper motors on the tail for each direction with the aero fins attached
kAN you do realize that the horizonal stabilizer on aircraft produces negative lift to counter the lifting moment of the main wings. And for the engines use a revering gear in the drivetrain to change direction.
Sorry I'm late. The engines have maxed out their rpm's so if you want more thrust, you need more drive speed rather than power. Gear up the engines more.
So I'ma throw a really really REALLY dumb idea out there (because video game physics logic): Stop using front wheel drive? I'm not talking about your landing gear. I'm talking about how your thrusters (because that's how the physics seems to treat them) are in the front "pulling" your plane instead of in the back "pushing" your plane. . . you know, similar to how front wheel drive works vs rear wheel drive. Just make sure to balance your weight out after you do so the vehicle isn't back-heavy from it. I'm not sure what difference it would make, if at all, but here is how I understand the physics to work: - Lift in this game mostly is just push in direction. In other words, if the plane is level, it just reduced gravity based on angle in relation to speed. In short. Your vehicle is pretty much just a zero gravity platform. - Your thrusters (propellers) create forward force (much like your wings provide upward force). This force then creates momentum on all of your parts. - Aerodynamic drag doesn't seem to be much of a factor. I think drag only reduces your max speed rather than actually dampening your momentum. Conclusion: - These aren't aerodynamic physics. These are realistic space physics. - As such, you might want to practice in the trail makers space map without any quantum rudder and only using thrusters to see if you can figure out how to stop the drifting there. - Once you are able to get a grasp on how it works there, the same principle should be applicable in this game. I think you will find that if you try in the space map, the physics will line up pretty closely. - Alternatively, I'm not sure we understand exactly how the little fins work yet. As such, perhaps we should test making a plane using ONLY the little fins as wings (and none of the downforce part you are using currently) to get a better understanding of how they work. Because while the downforce part seems to just adds directional force, that doesn't seem to be how the fins work. Perhaps you can angle them as your actual wings to make them work to get actual aerodynamic physics? Probably not though. Just a shot in the dark. Counter theory: maybe the fins just don't do anything after you are given "roll control" and only apply to grounded vehicles?
Great comment, as an extension of your comments, do you think you could attach a bunch of stepper motors and make variable pitch blades? If you did this you might be able to make a propeller out of shark fins :/
I also was trying to make a neutrally bouyant wing section by using two downforce wings but one inverted, so they cancel each other's lift/downforce, and all thats left is the stabilisation of the vehicle. But, i couldnt be sure if it was working cos im playing career and didnt have enough wings yet hehe
@@nyscersul42 Well, it depends on what the blades are. I don't think the fins provide "force". If I had to guess, they only cap out vector velocity. And even then, it might only work grounded. I don't have enough data to know what the fins even do (on a internal-programming level I mean). As for the wings. You would only need 2 stepping motors for forward and reverse direction. Which, as kan pointed out, would be redundant because of roll control. The only reason you would want that is if there is a reotation axis that roll control doesn't provide. . . or if you wanted to avoid roll control all together because you think the game physics are being messed with in a negative way due to using roll control (which very well could be a possibility). I honestly do think the true "real" solution is going to end up becoming annoying thrust vectoring (to create artificial drag) until I learn more about about what the fins are actually doing on a programmers level.
@@Hadeks_Marow I meant to use the variable blade pitch as a method to moderate thrust, also, i guess my suggestion would work out as a good way to test whether the fins do exert forces or not, im still 100% unsure myself. :)
I'm playing it through via campaign tho, since it's more fun and elongates the exploration phase of the game, which means i have not entered creative mode, and am limited by the amount of money i have generated. I do love those fins tho, aesthetically, so i'll be grinding a bunch more either way :)
this might sound a bit weird, but i honestly think some of the problems could be fixed by going faster. the drifting for example: if you were going faster, more air would hit the fins to straighten you out and not drift as much. you are generally just very slow, and that is one of the main problems imo
oh and also, if you removed the back spoilers and just had one in the middle, i think that would be a good amount of upforce in the back end edit: also a way to be faster without stronger motors is by making the propellers longer
The problem seems to be that it's not aerodynamic physics. . . it's realistic (zero gravity) space physics. Speed + downforce = thrust. Zero drag when airborn. . . hence why we drift. We still have the momentum, but no drag to dampen that momentum, rather we just have velocity cap. It's like how the space map in trailmakers works if you don't use a quantum rudder. . . except you have a velocity cap.
bro's talking about dihedral before understanding center of pressure... the vertical fins are too far forward, remove the ones at the front, higher rpm is the only way to get more thrust with the same prop but i've never built a good plane, so feel free to ignore my advice
But he has them the way you would use them on a car. . . ? I just think they don't do anything when airborne because they would get in the way of roll control, which I don't think the devs wanted to deal with.
@@Hlebuw3k Then you are using the wrong term. The "shark fins"/"rocket fins" are the other ones. The curved parts that provide downforce have a different name.
I really want to watch this whole video. But I got seasick 😢 I've played about 30 hours of Screw Drivers and no matter what I try or the devs try to implement, the camera just sucks, it's such a shame.
Any suggestions on how to improve the plane? Seems like making a plane in Screw Drivers might be a bit of a project.
Love the content
1) The torque of the engine doesn’t affect props so you just need to look for high rpm:mass ratio
2) Planetary gears are glitched with props
3) Think about it, do you put vertical stabilisers all across the body of a plane to make it not yaw. No, you put them at the rear of the plane. (remove the shark fins on the body of your aircraft)
4) Body panels and stuff to that effect only slow down your vehicle.
5) The shark fin is the only viable vertical stabiliser.(just put billions of shark fins at the rear of your aircraft)
More gearing!!!
For planetary gears, you can't direct have it come off it. It's a glitch.
helicopters are hard because of the one source of propulsion, assuming you don't do chinook
The reason why it tipped down all the time are the engines. They're what, 50kg each, sitting 3-5 ticks below the wings? That's a lot of hanging weight that offsets the center of mass. TBH I'd use a single engine in the center of the plane, gear it up in the center of the plane too, and then just lead prop shafts out through the wings to the propellers. The less weight you have to swing around in big circles, the more maneuverable you are, even if it's balanced. So keep the heavy stuff (like engines) in the center of gravity.
you're right- the centre of thrust is above the centre of mass. from what I've tried though, you can't gear an engine to control two different props in this game. no matter how you set it up, both will spin the same way, and the gears are kinda just for show
@@coryman125 Hm, that is true, didn't realize that. Is that true even about the "four-pronged cornerthingys" (can't remember the name now)? Because one could have a powered axle running through the wings (perpendicular to the main body), and if the corner gears are connected on the inside of the props, they might make the left prop spin in one direction and the right one in the opposite direction. But I guess even these are just for show.
@@TarisSinclair I've tried with those before and same problem :( granted it has been a few weeks, but I've seen other people have similar trouble
There are discoverable starting points at places on the map, that are not reachable with any kind of ground vehicle. So the devs did intend for people to try and build planes or helicopters or similar.
I wonder if they added those after people started making helo's and planes?
@@alan4657 yeah, probably
That thing flies so smooth in a straight line, ALOT of vertical fins tho- almost a dragon instead of a plane😎
People are making planes...
In a game that, as far as I'm aware, isn't even *designed* for planes.
This is hilarious.
Any building game with decent aerodynamics will have aircraft, players just like flying, especially when they aren't expected to fly.
I´m just waiting until somebody builds a computer and plays doom on it.
@@Panzerpaul92mechanical logic gates exist irl, and Reid Captain made enemies in a 2D game into logic gates, so very possible.
I think every formula 1 designer thinks of their cars as land planes. You are using aerodynamics to stick the car to the road whilst trying to move forward the fastest.
the props are acting as a gyro keeping it from wanting to turn thats why they keep trying to go back to that original path you can also see that in the last of the video when he goes to land and turns the props off he can turn it a lot better and it stays turned
For more trust, ya could look at the old german do 335 design with push and pull prop in the center to fit in more gears while still reducing the torque pull problem
The fins should be at back. Vertical fins turn towards the back so if they are on the entire vehicle there is no back.
a better explanation would be that they provide a force normal to the surface of the wing, so it makes the craft more unstable when the fins are forward of the center of mass. I just wish he played some KSP so he'd get this lmao
i think that because you are using spoilers for lift surfaces, it could be that the slight angle of all of the spoilers is causing the plane to strafe. when you are going straight the plane slightly strafes upwards so you don’t notice it but when you roll the plane strafes in the direction of the roll causing it to slide instead of turn
Something to try Kan, using the air foils... as tails. 2 of them mounted in different directions to counter each other (then later using pistons to change their angle to give you a rudder effect)
Propellers that turn in different directions, for this have a universal joint
I swear you and Reid captain make a great duo. I see a plane video from Reid, then one from Kan. What a great week!
Crazy, masochistic idea: Make a pushme-pullyou design with props at either end of the central body, mount the rear engine and propeller on a hinge with a stepper motor so that you can cant it back and forth. I think you will only be able to get a small amount of yaw safely out of this arrangement, it's really more of a method to make people slightly afraid of you than a good yaw scheme.
You could also keep the motors on the wings and see if there's a way to change each motor's RPM slightly with the same keys you're using to manipulate the gyro. I think you will have problems getting unequal thrust to create yaw until you solve the rear fin drift problem.
In that regard, you could just try putting two opposing downforce wings at the tail, each mounted 90 degrees off the central spine, giving you plane a lot of rear drag and probably stabilizing its flight quite a bit.
two thoughts:
firstly, with the engines and wheels below the plane, but the props centered, i think your centre of mass is below the centre of thrust, which explains the pitching down on the runway.
secondly, i believe having those vertical stabilisers in front of the centre of mass might be working against you? it's like how darts have all the drag at the back; if it was in the front, then it would try to amplify a turn rather than correct it. imagine dangling your plane from a string, turned a few degrees to the right. if you then imagine the wind going towards it and pushing the tail, it pushes it back towards the middle. but if you imagine it pushing the front, then it'll push the front backwards, away from the middle.
making planes in this game is definitely weird, so i wish you luck in this endeavour
That giant aesthetic piece does have aerodynamics which is why if you check wind resistance you will see how the air flows around your vehicle and where the turbulence is at. (In other words how far the wind shifts) if you could turn it 90° and check wind it will help you plan out better
A lot of modern planes, especially fighter jets, use asymmetric spoiler extension to do roll: spoilerons (spoiler + aileron).
put sideways spoilers in a V on top to make it track straight is my guess
6:06 suspicious shaped lake
I had a funny thought, you could set up the props to run with a dual speed throttle capability, specifically for a "taxi" runway mode, and a flight/takeoff mode, by running two engines on the props, maybe even with two seperate gearings. Just use a weak lowest power electric engine geared in the torque boosting direction to slow the rpm, and then a big bad beefy engine geared up for rpm, and then set their input controls to different keys.
Wouldn't it be better to have that as a (manual) gear, so you still can use the same basic controls for each mode?
@@GummieI i havent used manual gears yet, but the fact your drivetrain cannot be examined and understood by the game is likely to interfere with the way the manual gear controls work, the left right shifting pattern using , and . seems like it wouldnt work well with the two gear changes needing to be done in tandem, simultaneously.
It'd work fine if we could assign controls direct to the gear change desired. Then like how multiple engines/motors can work together under one control, your suggestion would work. (and if it *could* work, it would be better yes.)
Try increasing the plane's mass. I know that doesnt make sense if your engines feel underpowered. However the air physics are a little funky in Screwdrivers. Thus a more massive plane doesnt float sideways as much.
its usually just the default setting on an RC esc to have less speed in reverse, you can program it for 100% in both directions, unless your using advanced timing on the motor then in that case it will be slower in reverse
Try a jumping chalange with the plane
@kANGaming, technically the tail of an airplane provides *downforce* to counter a tendency to nose-down.
Also, get rid of the vertical fins ahead of the center of mass.
Yeah, the downforce in the back angles the wings IN THE MIDDLE NOT THE FRONT (sorry) to provide more lift.
CoM should be just barely behind the wings/landing gear, just so it doesn't fall over on the runway.
I've no idea if anything approaching real physics applies to this game.
it's pitching down because the CenterOfMass is lower then the CenterOfThrust.
You need Yaw to counter the drift.
the vertical surfaces should be mostly in the back, like the fletching on an arrow.
if you want it to be like a plane, you need the center of lift to be the main wings. the center of gravity should be in front of the center of lift. and the tail should actually produce life DOWNWARD instead of upward, enough to counter the center of gravity using the center of lift as a pendulum.
The reason the planetary gear doesn't work is that the game doesn't consider it as connected to anything if there isn't a wheel. If you put a wheel on a engine ANYWHERE on the vehicle it starts working last time I tried. When you put this one the game also starts tracking HP and acceleration better as well because it has a reference object to connect to the mass of the vehicle.
I do not think those shark fan used as wings are doing anything. Get rid of all the shark fins and the lift in the tail. Then put say 2 shark find in the tail on the top and both sides. You might need to reduce the lift in front.
If you put a stepper motor and a normal motor on one axel you can change the keys on the normal engine and the servo will copy it. When I did this servos where still broken so it was annoying to work with, but it nay still be that the order in which the engines are placed matters. I think it was servo last but im not sure.
Stabilization wise you propably want to use 2 downforce wings stacked in opposite directions.
hinge connector directly connected to a planatery gear output doesnt work for some reason
however you can transfer the power through some normal gears, then the hinge connector spins just fine
You need something to control yaw, in a normal prop plane you have the rudder which lets you fix that. I think you were actually way more on track when you were attempting to control your roll. The in game gyroscope really looks like it's only useful for pitch.
there's really no good way to do that in screw drivers unfortunately because the stepper motors only go in one direction.
@@1mariomaniacyou would have to do something like a stepper motor to a vertical wing with a mirrored setup. Then have it return to neutral like he did with the other control surfaces
You should do the jump distance challenge with the plane and see how far you can break it
6:10 your plane doesn't move because planet gears are bugged with hinge connectors at the moment
You can have them, but you need the power to pass through at least one set of normal gears somewhere between your planetaries and your hinge
Also; Make an Osprey (VTOL propellor plane)! XD
Hey Kan, I know your plane doesn't work, but could you try it in the campaign where you have to go just from point A to B? I think it will be fairly competitive since everyone else will have to go on a long roundabout route.
Delete the horizontal shark fins in the Front and it will fly straight, just use fins as a tailfin
I'm looking at 11min, and you could put a servo on a servo with a drive shaft between them and have different directions and different buttons on the two servos sitting in a series.
you should add a suspension setup to the landing gears
Change your camera mode to get more useful camera behaviour, I think. There are several camera modes you can cycle through (don't remember which button it is)
Since the game isn't really aerodynamics simulator.... It's a lot better if you just have one set of wings in the middle then it won't torque strangely.. but the thrust of the engines over the center of mass is what's causing most of the pitching issues especially when starting.... As far as I can tell the straight panel doesn't provide any aerodynamics that big triangle thing you have as a tail it's just weight
I was thinking props behind the wings might work better.
you want to have the fins behind the com, because when they get to the front of the plane they start to make the wobble worse
Poor yaw. People always forget rudder control. You literally cannot roll without yaw. Put two vertical stepper motors on the tail for each direction with the aero fins attached
You can roll without yaw lol, you just need a vertical stabilizer symmetric across the horizontal plane.
kAN you do realize that the horizonal stabilizer on aircraft produces negative lift to counter the lifting moment of the main wings. And for the engines use a revering gear in the drivetrain to change direction.
the problem you have is that you actually want downforce in the back not lift
also gear the props together and you might pull a little less
Sorry I'm late. The engines have maxed out their rpm's so if you want more thrust, you need more drive speed rather than power. Gear up the engines more.
Try building a walker :D
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAW WHERE IS MY RUDDER
Needs yaw control. Youre experiencing adverse yaw when you roll.
For people with little patience the video gets good at 0:01
Thanks luv
For kAN haters, the video ends at 0:05 (real)
Stop. Just stop. This joke isn’t funny anymore.
you need at least 1 open space after the planet gears or else it wont spin
really cool
So I'ma throw a really really REALLY dumb idea out there (because video game physics logic):
Stop using front wheel drive?
I'm not talking about your landing gear. I'm talking about how your thrusters (because that's how the physics seems to treat them) are in the front "pulling" your plane instead of in the back "pushing" your plane. . . you know, similar to how front wheel drive works vs rear wheel drive. Just make sure to balance your weight out after you do so the vehicle isn't back-heavy from it.
I'm not sure what difference it would make, if at all, but here is how I understand the physics to work:
- Lift in this game mostly is just push in direction. In other words, if the plane is level, it just reduced gravity based on angle in relation to speed. In short. Your vehicle is pretty much just a zero gravity platform.
- Your thrusters (propellers) create forward force (much like your wings provide upward force). This force then creates momentum on all of your parts.
- Aerodynamic drag doesn't seem to be much of a factor. I think drag only reduces your max speed rather than actually dampening your momentum.
Conclusion:
- These aren't aerodynamic physics. These are realistic space physics.
- As such, you might want to practice in the trail makers space map without any quantum rudder and only using thrusters to see if you can figure out how to stop the drifting there.
- Once you are able to get a grasp on how it works there, the same principle should be applicable in this game. I think you will find that if you try in the space map, the physics will line up pretty closely.
- Alternatively, I'm not sure we understand exactly how the little fins work yet. As such, perhaps we should test making a plane using ONLY the little fins as wings (and none of the downforce part you are using currently) to get a better understanding of how they work. Because while the downforce part seems to just adds directional force, that doesn't seem to be how the fins work. Perhaps you can angle them as your actual wings to make them work to get actual aerodynamic physics? Probably not though. Just a shot in the dark. Counter theory: maybe the fins just don't do anything after you are given "roll control" and only apply to grounded vehicles?
Great comment, as an extension of your comments, do you think you could attach a bunch of stepper motors and make variable pitch blades? If you did this you might be able to make a propeller out of shark fins :/
I also was trying to make a neutrally bouyant wing section by using two downforce wings but one inverted, so they cancel each other's lift/downforce, and all thats left is the stabilisation of the vehicle. But, i couldnt be sure if it was working cos im playing career and didnt have enough wings yet hehe
@@nyscersul42 Well, it depends on what the blades are. I don't think the fins provide "force". If I had to guess, they only cap out vector velocity. And even then, it might only work grounded. I don't have enough data to know what the fins even do (on a internal-programming level I mean).
As for the wings. You would only need 2 stepping motors for forward and reverse direction. Which, as kan pointed out, would be redundant because of roll control. The only reason you would want that is if there is a reotation axis that roll control doesn't provide. . . or if you wanted to avoid roll control all together because you think the game physics are being messed with in a negative way due to using roll control (which very well could be a possibility).
I honestly do think the true "real" solution is going to end up becoming annoying thrust vectoring (to create artificial drag) until I learn more about about what the fins are actually doing on a programmers level.
@@Hadeks_Marow I meant to use the variable blade pitch as a method to moderate thrust, also, i guess my suggestion would work out as a good way to test whether the fins do exert forces or not, im still 100% unsure myself. :)
I'm playing it through via campaign tho, since it's more fun and elongates the exploration phase of the game, which means i have not entered creative mode, and am limited by the amount of money i have generated. I do love those fins tho, aesthetically, so i'll be grinding a bunch more either way :)
this might sound a bit weird, but i honestly think some of the problems could be fixed by going faster. the drifting for example: if you were going faster, more air would hit the fins to straighten you out and not drift as much. you are generally just very slow, and that is one of the main problems imo
and you say the exact same thing right after i posted the comment lol
oh and also, if you removed the back spoilers and just had one in the middle, i think that would be a good amount of upforce in the back end
edit: also a way to be faster without stronger motors is by making the propellers longer
The problem seems to be that it's not aerodynamic physics. . . it's realistic (zero gravity) space physics. Speed + downforce = thrust. Zero drag when airborn. . . hence why we drift. We still have the momentum, but no drag to dampen that momentum, rather we just have velocity cap.
It's like how the space map in trailmakers works if you don't use a quantum rudder. . . except you have a velocity cap.
it's a DTOL!
Helicopter!
larger rear fins and fix lift
Maybe you should rely on actual control surfaces instead of the in-game air control?
bro's talking about dihedral before understanding center of pressure... the vertical fins are too far forward, remove the ones at the front, higher rpm is the only way to get more thrust with the same prop
but i've never built a good plane, so feel free to ignore my advice
It's my birthday
There is a flat map if you click the white flag in top left
This... Sound different from normal kan. Did you get a new mic or something?
move the weight forward. no fins in front.
the physics are clearly not meant for planes XD
sin 45 is 0.707 , sin 30 is 0.5 XD
Now build a helicopter
Is the game just trying to force you to go in whatever direction you launched from?
For speed/power your propellers are backwards
It drifts cus this plane got no rudder control
tail fins need downforce.
Using downforce to go up. Are you an architect?
It’s my birthday 🎉
Happy Birthday!
Bappy hirthdæe
@@apersunthathasaridiculousl1890 Thks
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haby birtb hday 😀
I think you're drifting because the shark fins are left to right instead of front to back
But he has them the way you would use them on a car. . . ? I just think they don't do anything when airborne because they would get in the way of roll control, which I don't think the devs wanted to deal with.
@@Hadeks_Marow You're thinking of the wrong ones.
@@Hlebuw3k Aren't the shark fins the small things he has all over his car?
@@Hadeks_Marow Yes, I'm talking about the ones on the wings
@@Hlebuw3k Then you are using the wrong term. The "shark fins"/"rocket fins" are the other ones. The curved parts that provide downforce have a different name.
you got way to many fins and wings especially on the tail
I really want to watch this whole video. But I got seasick 😢 I've played about 30 hours of Screw Drivers and no matter what I try or the devs try to implement, the camera just sucks, it's such a shame.
Day 15 of asking kAN to teach me how to play scrap mechanic
Too many fins.
23 min
Bro. Your titles are terrible. They genuinely never catch my interest, you need to have more engaging titles