One of the best parts was Malcolm sneaking through the colony after the apes attack. It's very tense and terrifying, and Jason Clarke does a great job selling Malcolm's fear.
This is without a doubt my favorite one out of all 3 (so far). It such an intense and emotional story. I love Ceaser trying to lead the apes but try to prevent any conflict from happening with the humans while making a bond with Malcolm. And Koba: he’s such a great villain! I love how he ends up becoming so hungry for revenge against humanity that he literally betrays the apes who were basically his family. The attack on the colony is probably the best part of the movie with its intensity and chaos. Matt Reeves did an amazing job in this sequel. And happy 10 year anniversary to it as well
There are three scenes in particular that stand out to me: 1) Ceaser telling Malcolm that Will was a "good man like you." 2) Koba pointing to his scars one by one and saying "human work." 3) Koba switching from being a harmless clown to a cold blooded killer in the blink of an eye. This is just an awesome movie.
If I had to pick three scenes I would pick Koba joking around/killing the guards. Koba confronting Caesar about letting humans stay and getting his ass kicked. Koba on the tank.
The "human work" scene genuinely is the most empathy I feel for ANYONE suffering from animal abuse in the franchise and if it weren't for the literal concentration camps and ashs murder later in the movie, I'd say it's confidently the saddest thing a character technically goes through in these movies. I love that I can feel bad for koba, but feel even WORSE for the people he hurts, bc THAT is the point. It's done expertly
@MS-ii1sv koba on the tank is genuinely a scene that makes me feel so awful but in a good movie way. Like EVERY human and ape that dies here, to kobas direct hands or not, IS kobas fault and stems directly from his hatred and manipulation. He's not doing something he sees as "right" it just makes him feel better, he KNOWS its wrong
I literally watched all 4 reboot films in a row for the first time this week. I was aware of the hype and some of the critical reception, but Dawn BLEW my mind. What a pensive and thrilling blockbuster. It's already one of my favorite films I've seen in years. How did I sleep on these for so long...
It’s not the best story concept when it comes to demands for subtlety, but his take as a disgruntled special ops soldier in White House Down can’t be discounted, when compared to the similar role of a black site torturer in Zero Dark Thirty. A good soldier who will do what he’s told by believing in a cause, until similar treatment is inflicted on him…
I always got to laugh when they cut to Ash after Blue Eyes signs, "They almost killed you Ash." Ash gives this, "Welp, damn, yeah... I guess they did..." weirdly pathetic look that makes me lose it.
I actually think Gary Oldman plays the best human in this movie. Those few seconds where he sees his children on his Ipad, even though it's short, totally bring depth to the character. He does so much with so little. Dawn is my favorite Planet of the Apes movie out of all of them. Also, they literally bought a tank and did that rotating shot in one continuous take, including the explosions around it.
Agreed. And in a movie, nay a trilogy, nay a FRANCHISE of amazing characters, he absolutely kills it and it shows as it's one of the few movies Gary Oldman actually likes that he acted in
It was this film that made me a fan of Planet of the Apes, made Caesar one of my all time favourite characters in fiction and one of a few films that taught me how blockbusters can be made with depth and richness in its characters and storytelling.
@@mr.dr.prof.patrick7284 Lord of the Rings was something that I've grown up with for as long as I could remember. These were among the few that I mentioned.
What a coincidence, I'm going to watch this today as part of my yearly rewatch of the entire franchise. It's by far my favorite in the series. Koba, what an antagonist!
Terrific review of my 2nd favourite Apes movie. Happy 10th anniversary to this masterpiece 2014-2024. This was the first Planet of the Apes movie I ever saw on the big screen!
The story and drama, the insane level of bubbling tension has been praised so much but I want to take a moment to talk about that fact that so much of the dialogue in Dawn is simply sign language with the apes and how immersive it still manages to be. And not to just fans either, seeing how much money it made and how praised it is by critics and viewers. Proves how human and how connected they made everyone feel. This whole trilogy that's what I love maybe the most (many things to love haha). How connected they made me feel to these apes.
You know with the upcoming KINGDOM movie, when you said you felt underwhelmed when it came out and had to let it sit and ponder DAWN, I think I'll also let KINGDOM marinate in my mind once it comes out.
"Human work? Human work. Human. Work. HUMAN WORK" That whole scene is phenomenal, might be my favourite in a movie full of favourites haha. Just silence, the signing, the body language, insane detail on Koba and Caesar faces. I love everything about that scene. Another one is the first fight between them. The way Toby Kebbel screams for Caesar and his little monologue. God. I can recite it off the top of my head. "WHERE CAESAR. WANT CAESAR. CAESARRRR!!" That roar of "Caesar" especially, god. It's insanely powerful. "Humans attack your sons. You. Let. Them. Stay? Put apes in danger. Caesar love humans more than apes. More than. Your. Sons."
This is not my favorite movie, but I love the first act and Cesar’s genuine friendship with Malcom was really good. Seeing a human and an ape really seeing each others as equals, as friends, was incredible!
the shot of Koba hugging/forehead touching Blue Eyes with the fire in the backdrop is genius. A beautiful, terrible thing. Film is a tragic masterpiece
Thanks for reigniting a passion for this IP! I loved it for years when i was a kid, but had forgotten just how much. I hadn't engaged in the recent movie until I stumbled across your channel. Now I'm happily revisiting the old and discovering the new. So, thanks!
The scenes with Koba faking out the two guards by playing Silly Ape before ruthlessly gunning them down is legitimately terrifying. That is some serious mindgaming. But what always sends chills down my spine is the entire Compound Siege. The initial framing of the humans by Koba shooting Ceaser, rallying the apes to war... And the highlight: Koba, on horseback, duel-weilding machine guns while screaming bloody murder. Hell, apes in general blazing forward while firing enmass. That whole scene never fails to put the fear of God into me.
Carver does have a motivation, it's just not well explained without dialogue if you don't understand human nature. He explains it perfectly when he says "Don't you get sick at the sight of them" Humans are tribal, and this is a perfectly natural response to a threat, that isn't quite human. It's why the "uncanny valley exists" - some people are excited about the idea of aliens, while aliens would also terrify others. A little additional dialogue from him about, how they symbolize the end of man or they'll replace it or something would have gone a long way to flesh out his FEAR of them as not being irrational, but him seeing them as the end of humanity and hating that. That is exactly how I saw that. He hates them because of what they are, a threat to our existence. You cannot have to dominate species on a planet. This is why there are no neanderthals. Actually, one comment about them from him would have made it all make sense. He could have said something to the effect of, didn't work out for the Neanderthals and what do you think will happen when they get guns and there is more of them then us. Boom. Solved.
It might be sacrilege but over the years Iv begun to think that I like Dawn more than the original 1968 film and I think it has to do with it being more emotionally investing. I like the shock and intrigue of the original film and everything about it is great but since then the Apes movies have been focused more so on the emotional impacts of the characters rather than the spectacle of the setting. On Letterbox when I've put together my lists of films it was those two which I couldn't decide which is the best of the Apes series but I finally came down to Dawn being my favorite
It may not be the most nuanced writing that the film has to offer, but I think plot mechanics aside Kirk Acevedo’s character was meant to comment on the irrational nature of bigotry, and him not having a real motivation to hate the apes was kind of the point.
I think the idea of a character like that is great, and definitely fitting in a movie like this. I just don't think they did anything interesting with him writing-wise that leans into that aspect, and the movie ultimately uses him as nothing more than a plot device.
Incredible film and the movie that showed what Matt Reeves was capable of as a director. For me Caesar is at his best here, having to deal with the responsibilities of being a leader and realising how flawed he is by the end for trusting Koba too much and the CGI is an even bigger achievement than it was in Rise.
Oh nah bro, you got it wrong. I dug that scene with Carver around the camp fire. Its very telling. Carver doesnt have to have a reason to hate the apes, hes a racist. Racism doesnt make sense. Carver doesnt have to have a reason to hate the apes, he just wants an excuse to unleash the fear and the negativity inside himself.
13:25 Weirdly I’ve just arrived at the part in the video essay as I’m reading these comments. As I see it Carver is what many countries in the west have an abundance of. The UK, US & Europe all have their racists that started as dispossessed nationals which various governments have overlooked. These disenfranchised people feel they have already lost so much of what they once took for granted & now feel the disparity between the haves and have nots. The Apes could be the stand-ins for the sudden influx of migrants (legal or otherwise) that western civilisation now faces as they seek to find somewhere better where they can carve out a life for themselves. As @jonmichael6746 points out, the racist doesn’t have to make sense. It’s their fear of having to share what resources are left that stops them from thinking logically, & instead makes them able to justify anything in their mind - even fake news, alternative truths, conspiracy theories or hippy-dippy bs. We just have to look at how many politicians now & in the past have cleverly harnessed this disillusionment in some members of society to hate another group of people. We all know or can see a Carver in our everyday lives. Racists are everywhere just now because disenfranchised people have been everywhere & are growing in numbers since the financial crash of 2008, since Covid, & with yet another economic downturn. Even the middle classes are poorer & becoming the working poor. So Carver is simply one of the dispossessed.
I always found Carver’s reasoning to hate the apes is just pure racism. Everything he says about the apes is essentially that. He needs to blame something to make himself feel better so he blames what doesn’t look like him. I like him as a villain in that sense. Great video! Loved it. This is my favorite Apes movie.
Brother, as you talk about it, I feel the same way about Dawn. I remember picking up my son who was pretty young at the time and going straight to the movies with him. I was obsessed. Dawn is my favorite within the trilogy. I was blown away and loved it more than Rise that I love as well. Thank you for the analysis and your work.
This trilogy totally reworks the ideas of Conquest & Battle and does them way better. Looks fantastic. I thought this series would end with the world as it was at the beginning of the original film (which maybe Kingdom will be). Good and bad on both sides, misunderstandings lead to tragedy. If you ever saw classic Doctor Who, they did a similar story in 1970's The Silurians where a race of hibernating reptilians awaken and the Doctor tries to broker peace between them & the humans. For once, an alien race isn't evil and there are no easy solutions.
Not even joking, felt the exact same way as you for Dawn. Was stupidly excited for it and ended up being overwhelmed my first watch. Even my friends were saying it was leagues better than Rise and I couldn’t understand. With each rewatch though it got better and better. To this day I wouldn’t say it’s leagues better than Rise, but I do like it more. They’re both 10/10 movies for me but they’re so different from each other. Great video! We should collab sometime! I’ve done a video essay on planet of the apes (it’s like 6 yrs old now) but I’m a huge fan of the series. It’s always great to find another super fan.
Rise achieved a level of quality I didn’t think possible for a new Apes film, and Dawn did that again. It’s honestly hard to put one over the other, even if Dawn probably is a bit stronger, there’s so much to love for both. The prequel novel for this movie (Firestorm) gives us the pov of Koba and Dreyfus between movies, and Koba’s backstory. It makes this movie extra heartbreaking, really solidifying Koba’s admiration and loyalty for Caesar, and making his distaste for humans very understandable. I loved seeing them as surrogate brothers, and to see that relationship break down was tragic. I should probably reread it sometime, because either till after or near the end, I didn’t know Dreyfus was Gary Oldman’s character, so his story didn’t stick as well when I watched Dawn 😅 There’s a short run comic released by Marvel last year set during the Simian Flu pandemic, and it shows how the news media pretty much misinforms people about how responsible the apes are, and even though the truth has been long established, denier idiots become radicals and form an anti ape militia. And considering the similar idiocy we’ve seen in real life, in retrospect, Carver’s thick headed ignorance is more believable 😅 I see a couple pther people in the comments making good points about him also, tibalism and racism Wow, I _completely_ forgot Judy Greer was Cornelia, she does have so little to do. Reminds me of this video I saw where an ape expert says ape society was action movie-fied in this, giving the males a lot more prominence and focus, when in real life, it’s common for female chimps to be leaders. The prequel novel for war actually gives Cornelia some good focus. That’s one flaw I’ll say these practically perfect movies have, though not deal breaking. Lack of a major female ape character. They don’t have a Zira. Hell, I’m pretty sure Lisa had a bit more to do than Cornelia. War does give us Lake, and she’s cool, but she’s still not all that prominent.
No, that’s Bonobo’s who have female leaders chimps and gorillas follow males and orangutans live on their own also this is smart apes not wild apes so obviously they’re going to follow a male ape because it was a male ape who freed them
About the Carver character, I don’t think he’s a weak link. I completely got where he’s coming from and his purpose for the story. He comes across as the type of people that believe they are better than apes (can’t blame him). Apes (sans humans), although they are fairly smart animals, are seen in a lower regard to people, due to their mental capacity being a good deal lower, on average, at the most, compared to humans, like practically every other living animal. This and coupled with the fact that humans are the dominant species of the planet, by far, the intelligent apes are challenging these two aspects, with the fact that their physical strength alone is fatally threatening to humans and that the simian flu killed 99% of the human population, seriously threatens him. As it should. It makes sense for people like him to exist in such a world. To live, pretty much, your whole life as part of the dominant species of the planet, but a virus comes along and kills 99% of your species while making an animal species who before were seen as lesser, although frighteningly strong, are now intelligent enough to actually challenge you. Such a thing can make anyone scared and hostile, likely to the point of irrationality. Carver made perfect sense to the story, or in such a world at least.
He definitely makes sense in the world! It's just the way his character is utilized that I have a problem with. He isn't given any depth and is just used as a plot device.
How you felt about this movie is how I felt when I watched War for the Planet of the Apes then the more I watched it the more I loved and appreciated it. This movie took like 30 minutes for it to be one of my all time favorites
When it first came out I remember not loving it cuz it was so dark and I didn’t get to see it in imax . But rewatching it now it looks beautiful I think the theater I saw it in was just terrible lol.
My only nitpick is that, in my perfect world, the titles of the first two rebooted Apes movies would be swapped. To me, it makes much more sense that the beginning of the ape revolt would be a dawn, and the story of how ape society progresses would be its rise. But that's just me.
You saw at the end of Rise when that pilot who was Will's neighbour Hunisker started bleeding. That guy got sneezed on by Franklin who was Patient 0 for the virus passing it to him before dying later on. Then when he is about to get onto the plane, and the bleeding starts, you know what is about the happen next. I always knew this film would take place in a more post-apocalptic setting seeing how lethal the virus was. You also get a good hint of it in the end credits of Rise.
Love your videos! Do we know what happened to Malcom and his family in-between Dawn and War? Over the years I’ve heard various things such as the colonel killing Malcom and his family offscreen (I think).
The only thing we've ever gotten that's official is a deleted scene from War where the Colonel tells Caesar that he killed Malcolm, so I've always just assumed that's what happened. No idea about Ellie and Alex though.
Great video!! Funny, I felt the same way about this movie at first. I was underwhelmed due to having way too specific expectations. After 2 or 3 rewatches I’ve come to realize that it’s one of the better movies of the past 15 years. Great story that was incredibly integrated to a Sci Fi action drama. Totally agree with your opinion of the character Carver. Was so frustrated to watch him be such a jerk and not have a solid reason for being so. Serkis is so amazing as is Toby and the actors who play Rocket and Blue eyes. Wish they did more with Oldman, maybe connecting his character with Carver would’ve made for a better sub plot
To me, Carver's irrational hatred of apes made sense in an "emotions overrule logic" sense. He's lived in a word devestated by disease, war and death and, like SO MANY PEOPLE, is a scared man desperately looking for a scapegoat, for someone he can direct his anger towards because anger and hate are a comforting drug when you're scared. "Who else am I gonna blame?" That's the crux of it. He NEEDS to have SOMEONE to blame. Someone he can indulge that sweet, sweet drug of hatred towards. And like any addict, he'll do anything to keep his high going.
Are you planning to cover each episode of Planet Of The Apes: The Series and Return To The Planet Of The Apes *individually* , or just 1 overview video for each series?🤔
To address your one criticism. @13:35 - the character of Carver. Not having a real/valid reason for hatred/prejudice/bigotry is a very realistic character trait and one exhibited by a LOT of people in the real world. There are tons of prejudiced hateful bigots who have no actual reason to back up their views and only stubbornly double down when challenged and confronted with the truth. Carver is a very realistic character. I see the inclusion of his character in the narrative as something to praise, not criticize.
That's a totally fine and valid read on the character, but to me, that doesn't make him or his inclusion a positive for the movie. There are tons of realistic characters in the movie, but his is given no depth, and he isn't utilized in any way beyond "guy who hates apes who needs to exist in this story to create conflict." Sure, his TYPE of person is realistic, but the character himself doesn't come across as a real character, just a plot device imo.
@@Ape-Nation but some people lack depth. Some people are shallow. Yes, he creates conflict. He doesn't need to do anything more than that. People are like that. I just can't find fault in the movie or criticize it for presenting a character I've encountered dozens of times in real life. You might not consider his inclusion a positive, but I don't see how it's a negative.
I'm glad you touched on the politics of the film...because I saw a tweet that really rubbed me the wrong way about DAWN - saying that it's overrated and "politically incoherent" and doesn't have anything cogent to say. Basically, the person just wanted the film to be LESS nuanced and be more unequivocally about the oppressed fighting back against their oppressors. In terms of Koba, they say he's just a "problematic" trope of a character standing in for oppressed groups becoming "as bad" as his oppressors and how it reinforces fear of the other and POC and this and that. Now, I try to understand when people find a films underlying themes lacking. I really do. But... I just,...I have a harsh dislike for people who seem to want films to just reinforce their ideology back at them instead of taking a film on its own terms. Coming at film with the attitude of "how do I graft my politics onto this?" first and foremost is just childish and narrow-minded. What really gets about this particular criticism is how it incorrectly frames the film as "oppressed vs oppressor." No. That was RISE. The apes aren't oppressed in DAWN. They're doing their own thing. DAWN is about the clash of two cultures and the fallout that fear and prejudice wreaks when communication breaks down. IDK, I took the tweet a little too personally, lol.
And that's why I left twitter many years ago... Lol. But yes I agree, many peoples issues with movies that delve into those kinds of themes sometimes just boils down to "this doesn't represent my personal viewpoint and therefore it's bad." To each their own, but I've always found that to be a shortsighted way to watch movies!
I agree that carver is very annoying but I think he’s very compelling in my most recent rewatches because he is very comparable to ignorant people now, like people who blame china and the Chinese people for the coronavirus and how ignorance can become very antagonistic
im not sure if you’ll see this comment but im curious, as to if subtitles for the sign language was shown in the first screening of the planet of the apes movies? I want to see Kingdom with my friends and im just curious as to if the sign language segments would be captioned lol
I think somebody else asked you this question, but will you do a review video of the game Planet Of The Apes Last Frontier? Because even though it's not a movie, it has a really good storyline and generally feels like a movie instead of a game. I like how it is set between Dawn and War, it has really good music, and the ape characters and human characters feel quite well balanced.
A Combination of several events that year led it to being the first year in did a ranking of every movie i see in the summer which i still continue this year i gave dawn of the planet of the apes 2nd place with guardians of the galaxy and xmen days of future past sharing the #1 spot
Rise was so watchable, intelligent and logical. The characters were so good, with the scientist, his father, the business owner, the zoo keeper, Ceasar, Maurice and the Gorilla were all excellent. The story was thread so well. But this one i barely remember anything except I didn’t like the human characters, they were completely underwhelming and boring, the whole plot seemed like nothing much happened and it ended with the requisite CGI heavy over the top long fight between the good ape and bad ape which was done in every single marvel movie that it seemed a little boring. Maybe I should watch it again but I felt let down. Then the third was even more of a let down. I barely remember anything about that one. However the new one seems really good.
My first experience watching this sitting next to a family and the mother was reading the subtitles out to the kid for the whole film. Wasn't the best. Outstanding movie though.
For me, all the Planet Of The Apes movies were about the danger of intelligence in the first place. It’s not about human’s being worst than apes or vice versa. Yes humans are greedy, self destructive, and cruel. But as soon as the apes gain human level sentients they begin to develope those negative attributes as well. Perhaps not to the same extent, but still. Even in the original movie series we see they discriminate against eachother based on sociatal place. (orangutan, chimp, gorilla) They can be religous fanatics. They have corrupt leadership wich keeps information and stop science from progressing because they are afraid of losing their power. They hunt and kill humans simply because they are supposedly evil, out of sport basically. And in this movie with Koba we see just how evil and violent they can be towards one another. Everything with Koba proves this. That apes can be as bad as humans. But really it’s the fact that both species are intelligent. Sentient. They are no longer controlled by extincts. But emotions. Wich is a good thing, except when only by emotion. So the real threat to life, is actually intelligence, as backwords that might seem. Or at least thats how I see it.
In my opinion, Carver's character could have been "fixed" with one simple change to one of his lines of dialogue. I just re-watched all these last weekend so I might be paraphrasing a bit here but there is a scene where many of the human characters are sitting at a campfire at night and of course Carver is being a dick and lashing out at the others as well as of course blaming the apes while the other characters are mourning and remembering their lost loved ones. As he gets up to leave the campfire he basically says "I'm the asshole.." If he would have instead said "I had a family too.." as he got up to leave it would have at the very least given his anger and hostility some direct context. It's not subtle but it's a hell of a lot better than "Asshole character is an asshole and even directly acknowledges it so that makes it okay."
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
One of the best parts was Malcolm sneaking through the colony after the apes attack. It's very tense and terrifying, and Jason Clarke does a great job selling Malcolm's fear.
Love that scene! The camerawork and music during it is incredible. So much tension.
This is without a doubt my favorite one out of all 3 (so far). It such an intense and emotional story. I love Ceaser trying to lead the apes but try to prevent any conflict from happening with the humans while making a bond with Malcolm. And Koba: he’s such a great villain! I love how he ends up becoming so hungry for revenge against humanity that he literally betrays the apes who were basically his family. The attack on the colony is probably the best part of the movie with its intensity and chaos. Matt Reeves did an amazing job in this sequel. And happy 10 year anniversary to it as well
There are three scenes in particular that stand out to me: 1) Ceaser telling Malcolm that Will was a "good man like you." 2) Koba pointing to his scars one by one and saying "human work." 3) Koba switching from being a harmless clown to a cold blooded killer in the blink of an eye. This is just an awesome movie.
If I had to pick three scenes I would pick
Koba joking around/killing the guards.
Koba confronting Caesar about letting humans stay and getting his ass kicked.
Koba on the tank.
I love Maurice attack Koba's apes inside the bus
The "human work" scene genuinely is the most empathy I feel for ANYONE suffering from animal abuse in the franchise and if it weren't for the literal concentration camps and ashs murder later in the movie, I'd say it's confidently the saddest thing a character technically goes through in these movies. I love that I can feel bad for koba, but feel even WORSE for the people he hurts, bc THAT is the point. It's done expertly
@MS-ii1sv koba on the tank is genuinely a scene that makes me feel so awful but in a good movie way. Like EVERY human and ape that dies here, to kobas direct hands or not, IS kobas fault and stems directly from his hatred and manipulation. He's not doing something he sees as "right" it just makes him feel better, he KNOWS its wrong
I literally watched all 4 reboot films in a row for the first time this week. I was aware of the hype and some of the critical reception, but Dawn BLEW my mind. What a pensive and thrilling blockbuster. It's already one of my favorite films I've seen in years.
How did I sleep on these for so long...
The film should be in the national film registry
The Malcom/Caesar connection is executed so damn good. Jason Clarke delivers such an underrated performance. Masterpiece in my eyes
Yes!! He's such an underrated actor.
It’s not the best story concept when it comes to demands for subtlety, but his take as a disgruntled special ops soldier in White House Down can’t be discounted, when compared to the similar role of a black site torturer in Zero Dark Thirty.
A good soldier who will do what he’s told by believing in a cause, until similar treatment is inflicted on him…
I always got to laugh when they cut to Ash after Blue Eyes signs, "They almost killed you Ash."
Ash gives this, "Welp, damn, yeah... I guess they did..." weirdly pathetic look that makes me lose it.
I actually think Gary Oldman plays the best human in this movie. Those few seconds where he sees his children on his Ipad, even though it's short, totally bring depth to the character. He does so much with so little. Dawn is my favorite Planet of the Apes movie out of all of them. Also, they literally bought a tank and did that rotating shot in one continuous take, including the explosions around it.
Oldman is SO GOOD!
That's a fantastic example of show not tell those pictures and his reaction told the entire story
Agreed. And in a movie, nay a trilogy, nay a FRANCHISE of amazing characters, he absolutely kills it and it shows as it's one of the few movies Gary Oldman actually likes that he acted in
I love that scene too! The man is the GOAT
I’m sure I read or heard that the kids on the iPad are actually Gary Oldman’s real kids.
It was this film that made me a fan of Planet of the Apes, made Caesar one of my all time favourite characters in fiction and one of a few films that taught me how blockbusters can be made with depth and richness in its characters and storytelling.
something tells me you’ve never watched lord of the rings
@@mr.dr.prof.patrick7284 Lord of the Rings was something that I've grown up with for as long as I could remember. These were among the few that I mentioned.
What a coincidence, I'm going to watch this today as part of my yearly rewatch of the entire franchise. It's by far my favorite in the series. Koba, what an antagonist!
Terrific review of my 2nd favourite Apes movie. Happy 10th anniversary to this masterpiece 2014-2024. This was the first Planet of the Apes movie I ever saw on the big screen!
I can't even believe it's been that long
The story and drama, the insane level of bubbling tension has been praised so much but I want to take a moment to talk about that fact that so much of the dialogue in Dawn is simply sign language with the apes and how immersive it still manages to be.
And not to just fans either, seeing how much money it made and how praised it is by critics and viewers. Proves how human and how connected they made everyone feel.
This whole trilogy that's what I love maybe the most (many things to love haha). How connected they made me feel to these apes.
You know with the upcoming KINGDOM movie, when you said you felt underwhelmed when it came out and had to let it sit and ponder DAWN, I think I'll also let KINGDOM marinate in my mind once it comes out.
"Human work? Human work. Human. Work. HUMAN WORK"
That whole scene is phenomenal, might be my favourite in a movie full of favourites haha.
Just silence, the signing, the body language, insane detail on Koba and Caesar faces. I love everything about that scene.
Another one is the first fight between them.
The way Toby Kebbel screams for Caesar and his little monologue. God. I can recite it off the top of my head.
"WHERE CAESAR. WANT CAESAR. CAESARRRR!!" That roar of "Caesar" especially, god. It's insanely powerful.
"Humans attack your sons. You. Let. Them. Stay?
Put apes in danger. Caesar love humans more than apes.
More than. Your. Sons."
I say it word for word every single time I watch it. Love it !
Preach!
Koba steals the show completely. Hard to think of a better villain in all of cinema.
Ash... 😢
@@MS-ii1svhe's up there! Seeing him in the first, I knew there was gonna be some sort of payoff with him later.
But HOLY S#!T I wasn't ready...
I've seen this movie so many times. This to me just the perfect sequel and also just a perfect movie in general
Same, my favorite movie of all time
I feel the same way ! I could watch this movie a million times ! I’m really excited for the new one to come out ! Already got my tickets! 🖤💯
This is not my favorite movie, but I love the first act and Cesar’s genuine friendship with Malcom was really good. Seeing a human and an ape really seeing each others as equals, as friends, was incredible!
the shot of Koba hugging/forehead touching Blue Eyes with the fire in the backdrop is genius. A beautiful, terrible thing. Film is a tragic masterpiece
Thanks for reigniting a passion for this IP! I loved it for years when i was a kid, but had forgotten just how much. I hadn't engaged in the recent movie until I stumbled across your channel. Now I'm happily revisiting the old and discovering the new. So, thanks!
Love that!!! Glad you're giving the new movies a chance, thanks for checking out the channel!!
The scenes with Koba faking out the two guards by playing Silly Ape before ruthlessly gunning them down is legitimately terrifying. That is some serious mindgaming.
But what always sends chills down my spine is the entire Compound Siege. The initial framing of the humans by Koba shooting Ceaser, rallying the apes to war...
And the highlight: Koba, on horseback, duel-weilding machine guns while screaming bloody murder. Hell, apes in general blazing forward while firing enmass.
That whole scene never fails to put the fear of God into me.
Love watching your reviews. Your enthusiasm for the films is contagious!
Thank you!!
Carver does have a motivation, it's just not well explained without dialogue if you don't understand human nature. He explains it perfectly when he says "Don't you get sick at the sight of them"
Humans are tribal, and this is a perfectly natural response to a threat, that isn't quite human. It's why the "uncanny valley exists" - some people are excited about the idea of aliens, while aliens would also terrify others.
A little additional dialogue from him about, how they symbolize the end of man or they'll replace it or something would have gone a long way to flesh out his FEAR of them as not being irrational, but him seeing them as the end of humanity and hating that.
That is exactly how I saw that. He hates them because of what they are, a threat to our existence. You cannot have to dominate species on a planet.
This is why there are no neanderthals. Actually, one comment about them from him would have made it all make sense.
He could have said something to the effect of, didn't work out for the Neanderthals and what do you think will happen when they get guns and there is more of them then us.
Boom. Solved.
My personal favourite POTA film out of all of them!
We relate so much on our PotA experiences and takes. Great job again!
Thanks for watching!!
It might be sacrilege but over the years Iv begun to think that I like Dawn more than the original 1968 film and I think it has to do with it being more emotionally investing. I like the shock and intrigue of the original film and everything about it is great but since then the Apes movies have been focused more so on the emotional impacts of the characters rather than the spectacle of the setting.
On Letterbox when I've put together my lists of films it was those two which I couldn't decide which is the best of the Apes series but I finally came down to Dawn being my favorite
It may not be the most nuanced writing that the film has to offer, but I think plot mechanics aside Kirk Acevedo’s character was meant to comment on the irrational nature of bigotry, and him not having a real motivation to hate the apes was kind of the point.
I think the idea of a character like that is great, and definitely fitting in a movie like this. I just don't think they did anything interesting with him writing-wise that leans into that aspect, and the movie ultimately uses him as nothing more than a plot device.
I love that rotating shot on top of the tank as well!
24:04 - I like how in this scene the framing of it kinda makes Caesar look like his younger self
Incredible film and the movie that showed what Matt Reeves was capable of as a director. For me Caesar is at his best here, having to deal with the responsibilities of being a leader and realising how flawed he is by the end for trusting Koba too much and the CGI is an even bigger achievement than it was in Rise.
Toby Kebbel should have gotten an Oscar. The " Human work!" Scene alone sells Koba for what he is. Just a great film.
Can't believe I forgot to mention that scene, but yes!! Incredible writing and acting.
Oh nah bro, you got it wrong. I dug that scene with Carver around the camp fire. Its very telling. Carver doesnt have to have a reason to hate the apes, hes a racist. Racism doesnt make sense. Carver doesnt have to have a reason to hate the apes, he just wants an excuse to unleash the fear and the negativity inside himself.
That's fine, but that doesn't make him a good character to me. He only exists in the movie to be a plot device.
13:25 Weirdly I’ve just arrived at the part in the video essay as I’m reading these comments. As I see it Carver is what many countries in the west have an abundance of. The UK, US & Europe all have their racists that started as dispossessed nationals which various governments have overlooked. These disenfranchised people feel they have already lost so much of what they once took for granted & now feel the disparity between the haves and have nots. The Apes could be the stand-ins for the sudden influx of migrants (legal or otherwise) that western civilisation now faces as they seek to find somewhere better where they can carve out a life for themselves. As @jonmichael6746 points out, the racist doesn’t have to make sense. It’s their fear of having to share what resources are left that stops them from thinking logically, & instead makes them able to justify anything in their mind - even fake news, alternative truths, conspiracy theories or hippy-dippy bs. We just have to look at how many politicians now & in the past have cleverly harnessed this disillusionment in some members of society to hate another group of people. We all know or can see a Carver in our everyday lives. Racists are everywhere just now because disenfranchised people have been everywhere & are growing in numbers since the financial crash of 2008, since Covid, & with yet another economic downturn. Even the middle classes are poorer & becoming the working poor. So Carver is simply one of the dispossessed.
I always found Carver’s reasoning to hate the apes is just pure racism. Everything he says about the apes is essentially that. He needs to blame something to make himself feel better so he blames what doesn’t look like him. I like him as a villain in that sense.
Great video! Loved it. This is my favorite Apes movie.
How you felt about Dawn at first is how I felt about The Last Jedi. Left mixed, then rewatched it again and again and now I love it.
I love comments like these.
Reading the book Firestorm adds a lot to an already great film.
Also, Koba was named after Vladimir Stalin, who picked Koba as his codename when he first became a political rebel
There is no Vladimir Stalin)
There are Vladimir Lenin and Iosif Stalin
But, yes it's him codename
@@antonkharitonov3832 hahaha yes sorry I meant Joseph stalin
This was the first Ape film I ever saw, and in theaters nonetheless. It instantly made me a fan and I had to go back and watch Rise!
The beginning sequence of this film is awesome.
Agreed!
Brother, as you talk about it, I feel the same way about Dawn. I remember picking up my son who was pretty young at the time and going straight to the movies with him. I was obsessed. Dawn is my favorite within the trilogy. I was blown away and loved it more than Rise that I love as well. Thank you for the analysis and your work.
Thanks so much for watching!
Of the new trilogy, I think this one was my personal favorite. I'm excited to see how this new one will compare! Koba was a great villain.
I think Carver might have a phobia of Apes, I mean, that's what I think and probably the reason why he hates the Apes
This trilogy totally reworks the ideas of Conquest & Battle and does them way better. Looks fantastic. I thought this series would end with the world as it was at the beginning of the original film (which maybe Kingdom will be). Good and bad on both sides, misunderstandings lead to tragedy. If you ever saw classic Doctor Who, they did a similar story in 1970's The Silurians where a race of hibernating reptilians awaken and the Doctor tries to broker peace between them & the humans. For once, an alien race isn't evil and there are no easy solutions.
Same thing happened with me. Thought Rise was a lot better at first but this movie grows on you, to a lesser extent Reeves The Batman the same thing
Rise is a tighter movie to me but Dawn has more spectacular scenes and has better direction, cinematography and special effects.
Not even joking, felt the exact same way as you for Dawn. Was stupidly excited for it and ended up being overwhelmed my first watch. Even my friends were saying it was leagues better than Rise and I couldn’t understand. With each rewatch though it got better and better. To this day I wouldn’t say it’s leagues better than Rise, but I do like it more. They’re both 10/10 movies for me but they’re so different from each other. Great video! We should collab sometime! I’ve done a video essay on planet of the apes (it’s like 6 yrs old now) but I’m a huge fan of the series. It’s always great to find another super fan.
Keep up the great work! FYI, it would be cool to have a livestream after Kingdom comes out. It would be great to get a real community going.
That's actually something I've considered doing! Not 100% sure yet.
Rise achieved a level of quality I didn’t think possible for a new Apes film, and Dawn did that again. It’s honestly hard to put one over the other, even if Dawn probably is a bit stronger, there’s so much to love for both.
The prequel novel for this movie (Firestorm) gives us the pov of Koba and Dreyfus between movies, and Koba’s backstory. It makes this movie extra heartbreaking, really solidifying Koba’s admiration and loyalty for Caesar, and making his distaste for humans very understandable. I loved seeing them as surrogate brothers, and to see that relationship break down was tragic.
I should probably reread it sometime, because either till after or near the end, I didn’t know Dreyfus was Gary Oldman’s character, so his story didn’t stick as well when I watched Dawn 😅
There’s a short run comic released by Marvel last year set during the Simian Flu pandemic, and it shows how the news media pretty much misinforms people about how responsible the apes are, and even though the truth has been long established, denier idiots become radicals and form an anti ape militia. And considering the similar idiocy we’ve seen in real life, in retrospect, Carver’s thick headed ignorance is more believable 😅 I see a couple pther people in the comments making good points about him also, tibalism and racism
Wow, I _completely_ forgot Judy Greer was Cornelia, she does have so little to do. Reminds me of this video I saw where an ape expert says ape society was action movie-fied in this, giving the males a lot more prominence and focus, when in real life, it’s common for female chimps to be leaders. The prequel novel for war actually gives Cornelia some good focus.
That’s one flaw I’ll say these practically perfect movies have, though not deal breaking. Lack of a major female ape character. They don’t have a Zira. Hell, I’m pretty sure Lisa had a bit more to do than Cornelia. War does give us Lake, and she’s cool, but she’s still not all that prominent.
No, that’s Bonobo’s who have female leaders chimps and gorillas follow males and orangutans live on their own also this is smart apes not wild apes so obviously they’re going to follow a male ape because it was a male ape who freed them
6:40 - Summer 2014 also featured Guardians Of The Galaxy & X-Men: Days Of Future Past
2014 was an incredible year for movies in general
About the Carver character, I don’t think he’s a weak link. I completely got where he’s coming from and his purpose for the story. He comes across as the type of people that believe they are better than apes (can’t blame him). Apes (sans humans), although they are fairly smart animals, are seen in a lower regard to people, due to their mental capacity being a good deal lower, on average, at the most, compared to humans, like practically every other living animal. This and coupled with the fact that humans are the dominant species of the planet, by far, the intelligent apes are challenging these two aspects, with the fact that their physical strength alone is fatally threatening to humans and that the simian flu killed 99% of the human population, seriously threatens him. As it should.
It makes sense for people like him to exist in such a world. To live, pretty much, your whole life as part of the dominant species of the planet, but a virus comes along and kills 99% of your species while making an animal species who before were seen as lesser, although frighteningly strong, are now intelligent enough to actually challenge you. Such a thing can make anyone scared and hostile, likely to the point of irrationality. Carver made perfect sense to the story, or in such a world at least.
He definitely makes sense in the world! It's just the way his character is utilized that I have a problem with. He isn't given any depth and is just used as a plot device.
Love this channel!
Thank you!!
The more I watch this movie the more I feel Koba’s emotions and feeling of betrayal with Cesar’s care for humanity
Caesar had no right impacting my life, the way he did.❤❤😫
Like your videos and great commentary on this can't wait for more of your videos including on the cartoon and a comic book run.
That opening credits is so much more terrorfiing in a post-COVID world. It just very real now.
How you felt about this movie is how I felt when I watched War for the Planet of the Apes then the more I watched it the more I loved and appreciated it. This movie took like 30 minutes for it to be one of my all time favorites
When it first came out I remember not loving it cuz it was so dark and I didn’t get to see it in imax . But rewatching it now it looks beautiful I think the theater I saw it in was just terrible lol.
My only nitpick is that, in my perfect world, the titles of the first two rebooted Apes movies would be swapped. To me, it makes much more sense that the beginning of the ape revolt would be a dawn, and the story of how ape society progresses would be its rise.
But that's just me.
Koba is without question one of the greatest movie villains of the 21st century.
Wow I cant believe people say Dawn has no social or political commentary
It's not as obvious as it is in the original films so I somewhat get it, but yeah, the new movies definitely have a lot to say about our own world.
I agree with everything you said
Damn I love Koba and Rocket.
You saw at the end of Rise when that pilot who was Will's neighbour Hunisker started bleeding. That guy got sneezed on by Franklin who was Patient 0 for the virus passing it to him before dying later on. Then when he is about to get onto the plane, and the bleeding starts, you know what is about the happen next. I always knew this film would take place in a more post-apocalptic setting seeing how lethal the virus was. You also get a good hint of it in the end credits of Rise.
Yes dawn is so good I love it
I do like the idea of Carver’s brother being in the helicopter
Love your videos! Do we know what happened to Malcom and his family in-between Dawn and War? Over the years I’ve heard various things such as the colonel killing Malcom and his family offscreen (I think).
The only thing we've ever gotten that's official is a deleted scene from War where the Colonel tells Caesar that he killed Malcolm, so I've always just assumed that's what happened. No idea about Ellie and Alex though.
Great video!! Funny, I felt the same way about this movie at first. I was underwhelmed due to having way too specific expectations. After 2 or 3 rewatches I’ve come to realize that it’s one of the better movies of the past 15 years. Great story that was incredibly integrated to a Sci Fi action drama. Totally agree with your opinion of the character Carver. Was so frustrated to watch him be such a jerk and not have a solid reason for being so. Serkis is so amazing as is Toby and the actors who play Rocket and Blue eyes. Wish they did more with Oldman, maybe connecting his character with Carver would’ve made for a better sub plot
To me, Carver's irrational hatred of apes made sense in an "emotions overrule logic" sense. He's lived in a word devestated by disease, war and death and, like SO MANY PEOPLE, is a scared man desperately looking for a scapegoat, for someone he can direct his anger towards because anger and hate are a comforting drug when you're scared.
"Who else am I gonna blame?"
That's the crux of it. He NEEDS to have SOMEONE to blame. Someone he can indulge that sweet, sweet drug of hatred towards.
And like any addict, he'll do anything to keep his high going.
Damn this movie and the godzilla movie came out the same summer, crazy
I personally find Carver to be extremely realistic after seeing how many people handled covid.
Are you planning to cover each episode of Planet Of The Apes: The Series and Return To The Planet Of The Apes *individually* , or just 1 overview video for each series?🤔
Both!
You made me interested in ai generating Planet of the Apes crossing with Warhammer 40k
Looks awesome
To address your one criticism. @13:35 - the character of Carver.
Not having a real/valid reason for hatred/prejudice/bigotry is a very realistic character trait and one exhibited by a LOT of people in the real world.
There are tons of prejudiced hateful bigots who have no actual reason to back up their views and only stubbornly double down when challenged and confronted with the truth.
Carver is a very realistic character.
I see the inclusion of his character in the narrative as something to praise, not criticize.
That's a totally fine and valid read on the character, but to me, that doesn't make him or his inclusion a positive for the movie. There are tons of realistic characters in the movie, but his is given no depth, and he isn't utilized in any way beyond "guy who hates apes who needs to exist in this story to create conflict." Sure, his TYPE of person is realistic, but the character himself doesn't come across as a real character, just a plot device imo.
@@Ape-Nation but some people lack depth. Some people are shallow. Yes, he creates conflict. He doesn't need to do anything more than that. People are like that. I just can't find fault in the movie or criticize it for presenting a character I've encountered dozens of times in real life. You might not consider his inclusion a positive, but I don't see how it's a negative.
I'm glad you touched on the politics of the film...because I saw a tweet that really rubbed me the wrong way about DAWN - saying that it's overrated and "politically incoherent" and doesn't have anything cogent to say. Basically, the person just wanted the film to be LESS nuanced and be more unequivocally about the oppressed fighting back against their oppressors. In terms of Koba, they say he's just a "problematic" trope of a character standing in for oppressed groups becoming "as bad" as his oppressors and how it reinforces fear of the other and POC and this and that.
Now, I try to understand when people find a films underlying themes lacking. I really do. But...
I just,...I have a harsh dislike for people who seem to want films to just reinforce their ideology back at them instead of taking a film on its own terms. Coming at film with the attitude of "how do I graft my politics onto this?" first and foremost is just childish and narrow-minded.
What really gets about this particular criticism is how it incorrectly frames the film as "oppressed vs oppressor." No. That was RISE. The apes aren't oppressed in DAWN. They're doing their own thing.
DAWN is about the clash of two cultures and the fallout that fear and prejudice wreaks when communication breaks down.
IDK, I took the tweet a little too personally, lol.
And that's why I left twitter many years ago... Lol.
But yes I agree, many peoples issues with movies that delve into those kinds of themes sometimes just boils down to "this doesn't represent my personal viewpoint and therefore it's bad." To each their own, but I've always found that to be a shortsighted way to watch movies!
I would say that dreyfus (sp?) is not even an antagonust. Yes he did threaten an attack, but never did anything. He defended his colony
You are awesome thank you!
Thank you for watching!
I agree that carver is very annoying but I think he’s very compelling in my most recent rewatches because he is very comparable to ignorant people now, like people who blame china and the Chinese people for the coronavirus and how ignorance can become very antagonistic
I was thinking the exact same thing as I was listening to that part of the video. I can’t believe he didn’t make that connection himself. 🙊
im not sure if you’ll see this comment but im curious, as to if subtitles for the sign language was shown in the first screening of the planet of the apes movies? I want to see Kingdom with my friends and im just curious as to if the sign language segments would be captioned lol
All three movies had subtitles during the sign language bits when I saw them in theaters.
I feel like Michael Giacchino's best work is medal of honor Frontline
I'll have to give that a listen sometime
I think somebody else asked you this question, but will you do a review video of the game Planet Of The Apes Last Frontier? Because even though it's not a movie, it has a really good storyline and generally feels like a movie instead of a game. I like how it is set between Dawn and War, it has really good music, and the ape characters and human characters feel quite well balanced.
Yep! Planning on doing a review for it eventually. A full play through is something I'm considering doing as well. It's a really good game!
A
Combination of several events that year led it to being the first year in did a ranking of every movie i see in the summer which i still continue this year i gave dawn of the planet of the apes 2nd place with guardians of the galaxy and xmen days of future past sharing the #1 spot
I know it’s incredibly unpopular but I honestly like the colonel more than Koba as a villain. I think Koba is AMAZING though
Rise was so watchable, intelligent and logical. The characters were so good, with the scientist, his father, the business owner, the zoo keeper, Ceasar, Maurice and the Gorilla were all excellent. The story was thread so well. But this one i barely remember anything except I didn’t like the human characters, they were completely underwhelming and boring, the whole plot seemed like nothing much happened and it ended with the requisite CGI heavy over the top long fight between the good ape and bad ape which was done in every single marvel movie that it seemed a little boring. Maybe I should watch it again but I felt let down. Then the third was even more of a let down. I barely remember anything about that one. However the new one seems really good.
Definitely give Dawn and War a rewatch!
0:36 Ceasar got rizz
My first experience watching this sitting next to a family and the mother was reading the subtitles out to the kid for the whole film. Wasn't the best. Outstanding movie though.
For me, all the Planet Of The Apes movies were about the danger of intelligence in the first place. It’s not about human’s being worst than apes or vice versa. Yes humans are greedy, self destructive, and cruel. But as soon as the apes gain human level sentients they begin to develope those negative attributes as well. Perhaps not to the same extent, but still. Even in the original movie series we see they discriminate against eachother based on sociatal place. (orangutan, chimp, gorilla) They can be religous fanatics. They have corrupt leadership wich keeps information and stop science from progressing because they are afraid of losing their power. They hunt and kill humans simply because they are supposedly evil, out of sport basically. And in this movie with Koba we see just how evil and violent they can be towards one another. Everything with Koba proves this. That apes can be as bad as humans. But really it’s the fact that both species are intelligent. Sentient. They are no longer controlled by extincts. But emotions. Wich is a good thing, except when only by emotion. So the real threat to life, is actually intelligence, as backwords that might seem. Or at least thats how I see it.
2014 was a great year for sequels, with this and Captain America: The Winter Soldier being better than their originals in every way.
I think Judy Greer was cast because her husband is a HUGE Planet of the Apes fan
I never knew that, but could be!
It was Alfred vs Alfred.
Caesar is Ape Toretto confirmed
In my opinion, Carver's character could have been "fixed" with one simple change to one of his lines of dialogue.
I just re-watched all these last weekend so I might be paraphrasing a bit here but there is a scene where many of the human characters are sitting at a campfire at night and of course Carver is being a dick and lashing out at the others as well as of course blaming the apes while the other characters are mourning and remembering their lost loved ones. As he gets up to leave the campfire he basically says "I'm the asshole.." If he would have instead said "I had a family too.." as he got up to leave it would have at the very least given his anger and hostility some direct context.
It's not subtle but it's a hell of a lot better than "Asshole character is an asshole and even directly acknowledges it so that makes it okay."
I typed this before finishing the video lol seems like you covered it too.
You have to watch the new teaser trailer it left me speechless
Maybe it’s just me but I prefer the original ones where they had prosthetics on. Not a fan of CGI
I agree, the Carver character is the most annoying thing in this film
Only when the Bear appears I saw a bad CGI in the apes. Worst than Rise... Apart from that, CGI was better
I agree with e
2014 man we had xmen days of future past winter solider dawn of the planet of the apes and guardians of the galaxy
One of the best years for movies of the entire 2010s!
@@Ape-Nation yessir
Your lack of objectivity made this "review" redundant.
I talk about movies as a fan of the franchise and a lover of film. I'm not a movie critic and have never claimed to be one.
Cesar weak, Koba weaker
Burn!
hi
Yo
To be fair racists don’t really need logic to hate something that’s different
I might make people mad with this but koba was aldo done right
Dawn is my favorite movie of the trilogy and my least favorite title
Cgi > make up