So glad I came across this channel. I've had solar for 12 years now, but these vids are great. I'm looking into battery storage, but these portable battery are taking my interest. Especially the 3800wh by afinity.
Gary, your videos last year were what finally decided me to invest in Solar and you can imagine how delighted I was to hear your opinion on AIKO 455w panels, 18 of which now adorn our insulated re-roof on our house. Keep up the good work with your updates.
Cheers Gary. Like I said yesterday on fb, everything you do is useful to me... I watched most if not all of your videos early on last year and it certainly helped us make the decision to go for it. We had 4.3kwp of solar installed in Feb 2024 and a 14.3kwh diy battery was added by me in June. For anyone on the fence, with export added to equation, It's saved us a shade over £800 up to Jan 1st.
That’s great. I did similar and have had 7.5 kw of panels fitted in 2 stages a year apart. I also picked up a 6.5 kWh a year old on eBay for £1400. Fitted the battery myself and crossed my fingers that it would work. The battery, although a little undersized has worked perfectly and until the autumn we only imported around 5p per day of electricity.
My pleasure. I love what Artisan is doing! For anyone who wants to know more about what Artisan Electrics is planning for this year, I recommend you check out this video on their channel: ruclips.net/user/livecLGkVkEw_nk?si=MTJZTog9YnHnVHKr
@@artisanelectrics it would be great if you gave the actual pay back expected from one of your installations. I can't see it's ever possible to get your money back. I'm being quoted 10 KWh battery only £7000. over 10 years that's £700 but investing the money I'd get £350 to spend on electricity. The £700 means every KWh I store ( I use 3500 pa ) costs 20p in equipment costs. Am I wrong here? I was going to ask how much it would cost you to install a 10 KWh battery.
Thanks Gary. Really looking forward to seeing the developments this year. It’s such a pleasure to work in this industry and help people save money and become energy independent. -Tok
Cheers Tok - it's going to be a great year all round, I reckon! 😃 Spirit Energy is a great company-check out the latest videos on their channel here: www.youtube.com/@spiritenergy_uk
Hi Gary Great video again. We just added a new battery to our system here in the Philippines. I retired and relocated from the UK at age 55 (I am an ex CEO of Pirelli). My wife and I built our new home on the 1000 sq m lot we had in the province (countryside). At the same time we bought a 3 hectare farm to grow rice. We bought solar for the water pump on the farm too. For the new house, we installed 18 panels with a 6KW inverter and 2 x 51.2V 200ah 10.24 KW batteries. Only yesterday we had one more battery installed making it 3 x 10.24KW. Since the installation 1 year ago next month, we have had not one electricity bill! So happy with the system as we can easily run 3 x split AC, fridge, 1 built in electric fan assisted oven, 1 ceramic hob, 1 kettle, 1 washing machine, all lighting, 1 kettle, 4 fans, 1 water cooler and 3 TV's. Thanks for all the videos. Cheers, Simon
Hi Simon, thanks for your kind words and taking the time to let me know about your situation 😀 Congratulations also on your retirement and relocation to warmer climes! As it happens, I have just retired myself (at 59) and am looking forward to spending more time on solar topics and travelling the world 😀 You never know, I might be over your way at some point!
Thank you Gary. Coming back round to thinking thru fitting solar or not. I see the tech has moved on WRT the panels, how about converting electricity into heating/hot water creation. Is it a change the boiler scenario or...? Octopus may offer a plan for swapping credits, I'll take a look. Thank you.
Happy New Year, Mr EV 😀 Good luck persuading your wife-I’ve seen most of your videos and I’m sure you’ll be able to put forward compelling arguments! 💪 ❤️
Hi Gary. Which solar company did you use for your setup and do you have a referral code? I’m considering Octopus but not sure the Powerwall 3 is enough for my storage needs as I’m a high kWh user and aim to store as much overnight using octopus cheap rate and discharge during the day to remove as much reliance on grid.
Hi Shan, the company who installed my solar and battery setup was EcoBubl, based near Basingstoke. They don't offer a referral system yet, but please feel free to mention my name if you contact them. If you're looking at a PW3 but would like additional storage to go with it, then aTesla PW3 expansion pack could work for you. It's the same as a PW3 but without the inverter and some other circuitry, making it cheaper (maybe £2-3K less). I like your planned smart tariff strategy and wish you the best with everything! :-)
@ Thanks Gary. I read today also about the potential government grants coming for solar installs, pending Treasury approval I understand. That could be a game changer and I may just sit and wait for a while to see how this pans out before committing. Have you heard anything about this and a potential timeline?
You need to select a home battery that has EPS capability. The Tesla Powerwall 3 is a great example of such a battery. Have a chat with your installer about that. Good luck!
@@silverswimmer South Scotland for me. Another story but I'd never have panels.... I just want a 7 Amp EV charger..... I've been waiting for my supply to be improved by unlooping from my neighbour. The DNO is still talking about it after 8 months!!! Good luck with the DNO
You’re most welcome. Now, I’m not too familiar with how long SSEN take these days. I know for my own installation two year ls ago (near Oxford, but same DNO) I had to wait months! Hopefully, it’ll be down to days now, or maybe a few weeks at worst. I’d love to hear how long it took though, if you don’t mind 🙏
black Friday and new Year's deals .I SCOOPED UP ON HUGE SOLAR COMPONENTS DEALS TO EXPAND MY OFF GRID SYSTEM WITH. 💪💪💪💪. can't wait for spring to install everything
Be nice to explore the use of vertical panels on gable ends: Big numbers in ’ mid winter when you’re likely to be dipping deeper into higher priced energy periods.
many houses are not made for something pulling like a sail you might ending up pulling out bricks if your house is not made for it normally the presure comes from above on a wall. not from the side it makes more sense if you make a new house and make it flat with the surface also for the price of the house most people are not interested in adding a new layer on the outside of the house, even though it can insulate
Great channel, Gary. Thanks! I have 12 x 250W panels that are 11 years old. I'd love to swap them out but the installation cost would be significant and I'd probably need a new inverter. I'll consider it when I need a new inverter, probably in about 10 years as I swapped mine two years ago and couldn't afford panels then.
I've recently fitted 5.8kw array in my garden. Got the g98 approval but annoyingly can't get a required mcs certificate to allow paid export. I have 11kwh of battery storage but not sure this will be enough to contain all my generated power during the summer.
@kevinturner6621 Snap we have 16 installed 7 years ago on our new build. So got another 14 with 10.4khwz battery. £9k all in so still not cheap I hope it comes down so more people can get it. There is no Octopus here in NI so we pay 15p per unit at night.
Great news Gary even for Scotland (and a North facing roof) but the end of December and the start of January are just terrible even on our south facing array.
Gary, could you look at the risk of having too much solar PV? On my new house I'm going ahead with 9kwp split facing SE and SW. The panels are cheaper than roof slates. I think the more panels the further I can extend the solar season into winter. But am I going to have a future problem of too much summer power which grid providers might penalise me for? Maybe for those extreme sunny days I just switch some panels off?
The good news is that your inverter will automatically curtail its generation (by adjusting the IV curve) in order not to exceed any export limits etc.
Happy New Year Gary thanks for all the content The last couple of months my battery has being doing all the heavy lifting for cheap electric via my EV tariff Intelligent Octopus Go. And as my Installer says the bulk of the installation cost is not with the solar panels so get as many as you can.
If I bought this year rather than 2 years ago I would have spent $4000 less and have 12kw more storage. Even my 3.3kw array dropped in price by $240 past 5 months.
Wow - and, would you believe, I predicted exactly what you experienced in this video I made two years ago: ruclips.net/video/S_cB_9pYig8/видео.htmlsi=8IhFJ7vEZFJZtDxG
Great video as usual Gary, but I am recommending friends to get a battery first. That has a dramatic effect on reducing bills. I've got a 13.5kWh GivEnergy all in one, and with 2 EVs and ASHP (gas free household) my average unit rate is now 10p. As a heavy user (1100 kWh in December alone), it won't take too long to recoup the investment.
But the real rewards come from adding solar, especially if you can get a decent amount on the roof. If going battery first make sure it can easily have solar added later. The Powerwall3 has three solar inputs, and the new Give Energy all in one has six. I always recommend solar and battery, with a decent size inverter and battery that will last all day from an overnight charge.
I’m also curious whether a battery is a better first option for ROI. With current tariffs exporting solar at 15p hardly seems worth it but that’s what most RUclipsrs seem to recommend - charge battery at 7p overnight, consume that and export the solar generated. Would love to see a video comparing the two options - battery or solar.
@@jameswestcott4191 we just had days where the prices was 1€ per kwh in northern europe if you have a large battery then those days can make a bit of profit... (or save you a bit) and they say we will get more of those days as we shut down more and more power plants not that i dont have solar, but in december my 20kw produces a little over 1 kwh per day for example deffently my solar is the big saver.. but the battery also does its bit i am going to spend 15.000€ - 20.000€ more on batterys this year but im also mining bitcoins and get more from that then selling to the grid (while i can heat some of my house with it.)
Absolutely, I also have 4.3kWp, but I'm in a fortunate position to be able to have both. If you can afford only one - get a battery first.@TheRonskiman
@jameswestcott4191 Well, you generate little in winter (none today - covered in snow!) but you can still timeshift with a battery regardless. Solar Apr to Oct is great, but outside that period....you'd need to run the numbers.
Gary love the content. I spoke with Jim and finally got an EV. He spoke very highly of you. Snap we had 16 installed 7 years ago on our new build. So got another 14 with 10.4khwz battery. £9k all in so still not cheap I hope it comes down so more people can get it. There is no Octopus here in NI so we pay 15p per unit at night.
Cheers Michael, and please pass on my regards to Jim for me. He's a great guy and I'd like to meet up with him again this year. Great to hear about your installation, and hopefully Octopus Energy will find its way into NI before long! All the best! Gary
Copper Cable and the fixings needed for the roof are still pricey but it is never too late to install these start saving money 💰the more panels you can put the better as explained by Gary.
Ok you have motivated me to get a new quote. I suspect though that increased wages, scaffolding costs etc will swamp the price drop for what was already cheap panels. I'll report back on the re quote of 2 years ago. I've yet to understand how I can possibly get a less than 10 years return on a £11,500 system when my electricity bill is about £821 per annum
@@Harajukujin correct They never take into account the cost of money or if you have the money what it would return in interest.£10000 is £500 per annum. Three quarters of my bill for doing nothing and at the end of the 10 Years I still have £10000 😂
I got 6 panels front 6 on back with total 20kw battery even in winter iv been charging at night cheap rate cost me around £55 ish that with standing charge my house useing anywhere from 9kw to 18kw a day yesterday I used nearly 12kw cost me £1.52 that was with standing charge
@@allan4787I no some people who get around £350+back just in export hope I do only had my solar 3 months now 6 front and 6 on back with 20kw battery 455w panels
Funnily enough, I've just installed 10 Aiko neostar 455W panels split east/west. I don't have batteries installed - they are too expensive imo and don't last long enough, but if this improves I will definately move ahead.
Too expensive and don't last long enough??? You can buy a 15 kWh battery with 8 year guarantee for £2500 from Fogstar in the UK, you can buy even cheaper from them if you can put the battery together yourself. They state that £2.5k battery has 3500 cycles, but it uses the same cells I have and they are good for 6000 cycles, that's 1 cycle a day for 16 years, even then they will still work just have 80% of the original capacity.
@DSVWARE Depending on inverter, and if you go with one battery it's very simple, two battery cables and one data cable, setup the inverter and pretty much job done. I did all the DC work on my system, even built the batteries from scratch, 32 cells from Fogstar, I've got two batteries for a total of 29 kWh of storage. Doing it today, I would buy prebuilt or DIY kits.
@TheRonskiman majority of people won't be keen to do it themselves. Myself included, and I think although not an expert I am slightly more versed than the average Joe when it comes to electricity
As south facing panels are built out I can see a scenario where midday summer electricty comes less valuable where as east west hi value can be exported as generated negating the need for batteries
At this time of year I am counting the days for my west/north panels to start picking up. Even on sunny days I can tell when the sun is in the south, too long to hit the east and west at the same time
Hi Gary, I just got this reply from Huawei regarding the limited off peek charging to 3KWH with single phase homes. I have a 15 KWH battery so I can’t fully charge at night due to the limitations of the inverter. I complained to Huawei tech support and this is their response. Allan We apologize for the limitations of the Single Phase L1 Inverter. Currently, it is capable of charging the battery from the grid with a maximum output of 3 kWh. However, we would like to inform you that Huawei's new Single Phase 8-10KTL LC0 Inverter, expected to be available in the UK around mid-year, will offer a significantly higher capacity. This new model can support up to 50 kWh of AC energy input from the grid, providing much greater flexibility and performance. Thanks Regards I have a 6.4 KWH array SW facing. With a 6KW inverter. I don’t have an EV at the moment so I only get 3 hours of off peek from Octopus.
My own home battery is limited to a 3.6kW charging speed, so not much better. A Powerwall 3 can charge at 5kW so ideally, that kind of rate or higher is good to aim for.
Gary, your videos are always very helpful! Thank you! I will be getting solar panels and a Powerwall3 installed in another month or two. I also got a Tesla Cybertruck, which can act as an emergency backup power source for our house in event of a grid power outage. I am eager to see how all this equipment will work out.
Four months on and my Enphase solar is playing up for the second time (pre-snowy weather). The charge is prioritising exporting to the grid again when it gets to 86%. This happened back in November, caused by a software update bug and solved by a recalibration. I've reported it again and not getting a timely answer which is disheartening. Worse than that the solar showed a very low charge rate on the last very sunny day though the panels were showing good performance. I reported this to Enphase and they agreed the rate should be around 3kWH rather than the 0.8kWH it showed. I also haven't had an update on resolving this Enphase believe this is also a software error so I would advise anyone with one of their systems to check performance is correct and, in my opinion, anyone who is thinking of going solar to choose a different company's products. This is costing me money and Octopus have confirmed they have no responsibility to support me with it.
Hi Peter, your installer (Octopus?) will most likely have provided with you an estimate of monthly generation. If you're not achieving anything near that estimate, then you should take that up directly with the installer, in the first instance, not the equipment manufacturers... Worth getting some consumer advice on this too...
Here's something to check out and is what happened to my neighbour:- The electrician employed by the installer was a clueless numpty who changed the 'gender' of panel connecting cables, resulting in the voltage in some panels being negated by adjacent panels - I. E. negative to negative and positive to positive. I know this sounds hard to believe but is what happened. The fault was only discovered after a lengthy examination by another electrician who could scarcely believe what had been done!
@@GaryDoesSolarGary, thank you for your advice. The installer was Octopus. It was they who advised me to contact Enphase when I had the issue of the system not charging beyond 86% first time around. They said if I can provide evidence that this has cost me money e.g. the system importing from the grid when it shows 6% whereas it is in fact at 20% they will refund what I've paid. Enphase said they were investing investigating back in November and this ticket is still open with them but I can't get any feedback on progress. I have now tried emailing them. I wonder if Enphase is just too immature a system with their software as yet. Octopus have only been using them for perhaps the last 8 months.
Ofgem are considering allowing SC's as part of alternate tariffs, but sounds like we won't see this until 2026. Whilst I applaud the overall message, I agree with your previous vid about the likelihood of export payments going to collapse. With all the green energy being added to the grid, the costs are being added to the SC unfortunately, which Solar of course doesn't mitigate. Curtailment costs thanks to limited grid design cost: 945m - 2022 779m - 2023 1 billion - 2024 With Labour accelerating permissions for Windfarms, and an increase in residential solar ( hello Mr. Duck curve!) I don't think it's unrealistic to expect 1.5 billion of curtailment charges in 2025. This is unsustainable surely? All the while, 99% could be green generation, but if that 1% is gas powered, that dictates the price for the 99%. I see very little progress with grid storage. The 'plan' seems to be green energy saturation, but with enough that large portions can be turned off whilst not needing gas.
@martinmorgan9 Apologies. SC = standing charge. In the UK, for gas and electricity connections, each have a daily 'charge' regardless of unit / energy usage. Curtailment is when green energy is putting TOO much energy on the grid. The grid must be balanced (same all around the world) to regulate voltage and frequency to ensure that all appliances receive the power they need. So the ppl who invest and create windfarms will be funded independently. They want an ROI (return on investment) and they'd not invest (or be less likely to do so) if they didn't also get compensated for when the Nation Grid asks them to turn off. Hense the crazy payments. That bill / cost has to go somewhere, so it seems (I'm not 100% sure) that it's landing on SC payments. Here is a snippet of an article based on how much curtailment is adding to SC: "Wind curtailment, or when the grid can't handle the extra power generated by wind, can add a significant amount to energy bills: 2023 A think tank estimates that wasted wind power will add £40 to the average UK household's annual energy costs. 2026 The same think tank estimates that the figure could increase to £150. 2021 An independent report found that curtailing wind power added £806 million to energy bills in Britain. 2020-2021 The average amount of wasted electricity per annum was 2.9 TWh, enough to power 800,000 households. The cost of wind curtailment is passed on to consumers. When wind power is curtailed, gas-powered stations are paid to fire up, and the cost is passed on to consumers. Some say that the problem of wind curtailment will get worse as the rate of installation of new offshore wind outpaces the growth of network infrastructure. However, the government has said that major reforms will halve the time it takes to build energy networks to cope with extra wind power" So if these 'reforms' (which we'll all need to pay for of course!) Don't happen and energy remains tied to gas pricing, we'll all be cooking off candles lol. On a series note, a lot of anti-green misinformation out there, it's challenging knowing what is FUD (fear / uncertainty / doubt) from big energy etc. I do think it undermines the viability of EV's, at least for the two tier demographic who don't have a driveway and can't take advantage of cheap time of day home charging. Similar with Heat Pump rollouts. If you despite the 300-400% efficiency are still reliant on massive tax payer subsidies and time of day cheap energy (and with most HP owners they also have solar and home batteries) to make it cost effective, it's again a challenge to push to the masses. Both EV's and HP's are great and proven technologies, with irrefutable ecological benefits, but how practical and viable they are for those less well off I really do question..
@martinmorgan9 I should also further explain, that one of Ofgems proposed ideas regarding electricity standing charge, is somehow incorporating the daily cost into the per kwh usage charges. So this would give additional incentives to reduce consumption. Otherwise, as (somewhat selfishly) as a solar owner myself, I spent £230 on electricity, but it cost me an additional £240 in standing charges. Obviously, the challenge is to offer something as an alternative, but not to punish those who don't have solar of course, but more importantly, those who for example need to run electrical medical equipment at home. In those cases, reducing consumption isn't an option for them, so its 'best' for them to be on the existing (scandalous) SC solution
Grid battery storage large scale is absolutley not financially viable, and wont be for decades, to install enough storage for wind and solar for just one day would cost 300 billion quid, and one day is not a reliable store of energy, for that we could install enough small scale nuclear reactors to supply reliable clean, cheap electricity to the whole of the UK for 60 years (including maintenance), solar and wind infrastructure to generate the same reliable 24 hour electricity would cost 1.2 trillion quid (plus one day battery storage of 300 billion), and would need to be replaced two times within the same 60 year period that a nuclear power plant would last Nuclear 300 billion for for 60 years power, or wind solar and batteries 4.5 trillion for the same 60 years .. in the 50's, nuclear was the future of reliable energy, it still is, and always will be.
@kevindavis8442 I do think moving away from Nuclear was a mistake. Especially when I learned that radioactive material can be recycled. Guess we'll see what the next few years bring. But unless it starts to bring down prices (below pre-2021 lvl) I can see a green backlash
There is a UK company, and quite a few RUclipsrs who always push those rather expensive Australian Bi-facials panels (they are pointless on a roof), they always push flawed videos where they don't compare like for like, their panels/system always have a hidden advantage and it's not what they tell you in the video.
The equipment has dropped but the installation companies aren’t passing on the price drop. I was quoted 6000 to 8000 for a 10 panel and inverter set up. 1400 worth of equipment 800-1000 scaffolding so £3600 to the electricians for 3 days work lol
Yeah, this is why it's always best to keep shopping around. It's a free market after all, and I'm sure there are installers out there who will pass on the costs...
I just wish there were more companies that would allow u to buy the equipment you want and they install. The problem most consumers have at the minute is all the MCS companies etc want to install equpment they provide or like to work with. it makes it hard for us to customize exsactly what u want as u might find a company you like but they only work with certin equpment. This is why i dont like having to reliant on MCS regisrated compaines for export. Surly we should be allowd to install what we want with DNO spec and have it then MCS signed of after for export that would be a much more consumer focused way of doing installs. And people would have systems that suit there needs more than been reliant on a installer telling what they think. Specially with like you north facing video imagine trying to tell a company u want north panels I guarantee 90% wouldnt even Install them
Very much agree with this. I know what I want in an install, but none of the quotes I've had have matched with that, even though I've been very explicit..
Just get rid of MCS, it is a con, and the only thing that makes it worth the paper it is written on is that most utilitie companies insist you have it if you want to get paid, not I said paid as they don't stop you exporting, you don't need it to do that, you just won't get paid unless you get on Octopuses non MCS trial.
@@TheRonskiman But that's exactly why it is worth the money its written on as of now. i agree with you but 99% of people installing solar want paying for export which means you need to go MCS at this time, MCS should be a cert that you get get after install i think not attached to the company installing, say you pay a fee to become MCS certified not the company doing it is MCS
@@UnitedSpotlight I agree, and also said that it's the only thing that makes it worth the paper it's written on. I've also posted another comment saying Gary needs to point out why MCS is important. What you suggest wound be a very good idea, but MCS has got too powerful to change now. They've got their fingers in the ASHP installs as well, and cause issues there as well.
Agreed. The recent appearance of very competitive 15kWh LFP FOGSTAR batteries makes them a very attractive option to save on battery installation, but that's only any good if an installer will agree to fit them rather than THEIR choice because of their procurement preferences.
The installation must be done by a professional. We have seen many inefficient and unsafe installations here in South africa. A professional installer takes onto account orientation and slope of panels as well as weight and wind loading. Then there is the actual installation. Poorly installed connectors cause intermittent failures and even fires. As far as inverters are concerned, they are not always plug and play. Many have sofisticated software and you need to know what you are doing to get maximum efficiency from the system. Finally the batteries and cabling. Perfect crimping and right size cable to avoid energy losses or fire hazzard. The LiFePo batteries are extremely stable and you can get 10 years with 90% discarge safely
Gary, you have gone through many seasons now in the UK. How often did you use grid electricity and how much. Australia has Sahara Desert latitudes and too much sunshine 🌞. As 80% of the world's population live in warm latitudes I believe that Australia's experience is useful. But UK latitudes would be interesting re: rooftop PV. You may have a video that I missed. Do you have a season with a home battery included ? Do you have gas heating ? I think a little fossil fuels in mid winter weeks is nothing.
Hi Stephen, so I still pull from the grid a fair amount during winter, but during the summer I’m not pulling from the grid at all and am instead exporting. The monies I receive from that export essentially cover the grid import during winter, so my overall annual electricity bill is zero. See my video here with year one numbers: ruclips.net/video/JE2q__wFck0/видео.htmlsi=dTXBozb2Tiv_aJnL
Interest rates are too high to make solar with batteries a good buy. I invested my $30,000 in the S&P 500 and it pays my electric bill. We also have MCE 100% wind and solar so my money pays for clean electricity. I’m also heavily shaded so solar isn’t a great investment. 😁
The other day batterygroup had JA Solar 460w panels for £34.17 inc vat obviously they sold out fast but if you can get anywhere near that kind of price its a no brainer. Also Fogstar had a black fiday sale on diy lifepo4 Seplos battery kits with 16kwh of grade A cells for around £1500. Combining the above with a victron inverter on the Tomato energy battery tariff at 5p a unit from midnight to 6am would be great. I think air source heatpumps will start to fall soon and the R290 heatpumps dont need an F-gas installer so can be done diy to save money too. In winter if you can get a scop of 4 or more and get all your electricity at 5p a unit even with inverter losses it should work out 1.5p to 2p per kwh of heat energy which is much cheaper than natural gas. The only possible downside is if the cheap night rates rise as more people use them for ev's and batteries, but I still think its worth it.
@@kevindavis8442 Yes they are, as I mentioned in another comment. I know of a few people online that have managed to get on it, but its not clear upfront what's required (seems to be DNO permission, building control notification and I believe they check the installation), and unless you know exactly what you are doing MCS is much easier. You try and find any up to date information about it, you won't, MCS pulled strings I believe.
Agreed, and I cover MCS in the "How to Choose a Good Installer" video referenced in that one: ruclips.net/video/N-7tyH6TIJ4/видео.htmlsi=5rMtJTjnZwLKMNje
Not exactly. I think t'as a bit too soon. Peroskite will change so much within a few month. Particularly in england. Because peroskite use will increase by 20% the quantity of energy, about 150 watts more under clouds due to captation of radiation
West facing panels are probably the most cost effective as this is when electricity is most in demand and is bound to be more expensive now and in the future
Hi Gary - Watched the majority of your clips and great info - However I have a question .... We buy electricity from Octopus as normal and we sell back electricity from solar and batteries as normal and we pay 5% VAT on our purchase of electricity but do we get the 5% VAT on what we sell back to them ???
Thanks for the great feedback, Craig! Good question on the UK VAT aspect. Here’s what Grok2 said: When you purchase electricity from Octopus Energy in the UK, you indeed pay 5% VAT on the electricity you consume. However, the VAT treatment on the electricity you sell back (export) through solar panels or batteries is different. According to the information available, VAT is not charged on the electricity you export back to the grid. The reason is that the export of electricity by households is not considered a taxable supply for VAT purposes. This means that you do not pay VAT on the export payments you receive from Octopus Energy. However, your energy supplier, in this case, Octopus Energy, pays VAT on the electricity it sells to you, but they do not charge you VAT on the payments they make to you for your exported electricity. This is consistent with the general VAT rules for energy in the UK, where the supply of electricity to domestic users is subject to a reduced rate of VAT at 5%, but there is no VAT applied to the payment received for exported electricity. Therefore, you pay 5% VAT on the electricity you import (buy) from Octopus, but you do not receive or pay any VAT on the electricity you export (sell back) to them. www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-on-fuel-and-power-notice-70119
In Australia the government opposition is promoting nuclear electricity. 14gW. In the land of Sahara Desert latitudes, with 8,000 billion m ² of sunshine all year long, many are thinking that Australia should embrace nuclear electricity. Nuclear electricity to replace Petroleum Gas heating Coal fired expensive grid electricity To have millions of mums and dads switch off rooftop PV to stabilise the grid. My wife just asked me what about the people living in tower apartments. Grid electricity remains in place remains available. This is the difficulty of stopping a distorted political pronuclear election campaign slogans. When the sun doesn't shine. 😮 I say when the sun does shine nuclear electricity will need to stop for hours daily.
@GaryDoesSolar my apologies Gary, I may have mislead you. Nuclear electricity can not load follow. That is why the Opposition political parties are pushing for BASE LOAD nuclear plants. My concern is that even daily demand for nuclear grid electricity will drop to zero and the nuclear generation plant will have to be turned off. In fact with EVs massive battery plugged into the home the demand for nuclear grid electricity will be zero for long after the daily sunset. As the only reason for nuclear electricity is no CO2 emissions then EVs must be included in the future. But, if the majority of electricity will not be nuclear electricity, then nuclear will not be needed. Nuclear needs 247 operating conditions. Nuclear needs 247 cashflow for economic survival. Australia is in Sahara Desert latitudes and sunshine is in abundance. Australia is the land of skin cancers sadly. Now if the Opposition political party gains government and starts construction of the nuclear electricity generation plants then it may have to tell mum's and dad's to switch off feed-in electricity and take grid electricity. But mum's and dad's with v2g EVs plugged into the grid and rooftop PV electricity may switch off grid electricity and never switch on expensive grid electricity. Grid owners cashflow will decline and the grid owners have the biggest problem as their business is an expensive infrastructure investment. It needs cashflow. Somebody said we rent the grid and buy the electricity. My old friend is working with the Opposition parties to promote nuclear electricity, he has no grid generation construction experience and no grid construction experience. We graduated CivEng together from the University of NSW. Best in Australia. He is wrong and can not understand why. He has invested 40 years into his dream. He has built earth dams and local council works. But I digress.
@GaryDoesSolar Edited @GaryDoesSolar my apologies Gary, I may have mislead you. Nuclear electricity can not load follow. That is why the Opposition political parties are pushing for BASE LOAD nuclear plants in Australia. My concern is that even daily demand for nuclear grid electricity will drop to zero and the nuclear generation plant will have to be turned off. In fact with EVs massive battery plugged into the home the demand for nuclear grid electricity will be zero for long after the daily sunset. As the only reason for nuclear electricity is no CO2 emissions then EVs must be included in the future. But, if the majority of electricity will not be nuclear electricity, but rooftopPV, then nuclear will not be needed. Nuclear needs 247 stable constant operating conditions. Nuclear needs 247 cashflow for economic survival. Australia is in Sahara Desert latitudes and sunshine is in abundance. Australia is the land of skin cancers sadly. Now if the Opposition political party gains government and starts construction of the nuclear electricity generation plants then it may have to tell mum's and dad's to switch off feed-in electricity and take grid electricity. But mum's and dad's with v2g EVs plugged into the grid and rooftop PV electricity may switch off grid electricity and never switch on expensive grid electricity again. Grid owners cashflow will decline and the grid owners have the biggest problem as their business is an expensive infrastructure investment. It needs cashflow. Somebody said 'we rent the grid for a dollar kWh and buy the 10cents kWh electricity'. My old friend is working with the Opposition parties to promote nuclear electricity, he has no grid generation construction experience and no grid construction experience. We graduated CivEng together from the University of NSW. Best in Australia. He is wrong and can not understand why. He has invested 40 years into his dream. He has built earth dams and local council works. But I digress.
@@stephenbrickwood1602 I need to research more on this. What I understand now is that fossil fuels have served us well to date in ensuring a constant supply of electricity, and if we are to phase them out, what do we do when there is little sun and little wind for several days? This is happening right now in the UK and natural gas is having to fill the gap.
when will you talk about the real price for installing solar, compared to what many installers charge often a days work cost more then 10.000€ in this kind of work also when it comes to heatpumps we have alot of local installers getting rich of the need for green energy and heating i paid 500€ for connecting 3 hybrid inverters to the grid + 2 batteries my total cost for a 20kw solar and 15kw batteries are 500€ when it comes to installing it i had to get installers from a webshop that sells solar panels, and not from any local workers and its not like those 500€ did not pay for that 2 hours job btw the quote i got was on the exact same brand, as i installed my self nothing fancy everything was from china no matter what but even the panels and inverters was almost 20% more expensive from the local installer then if i got them my self and they would not install anything i got my self, they also wanted to sell the equitment if they was going to install same with heatpump 8000€ for a half days work and a bit of a123 gas (50€)
I got these 3 months ago 6 front of house 6 on back with 10kw battery then 1 month ago i added 2x 5kw more batteries think total was aroubd £12k might have been little under that soar is cheap as hell its labour and scaffold that alot
Hi Dean, sounds great. Yeah, you’re right-scaffolding costs need to come down, and labour costs too. I think that will happen as more installers enter the market.
@@GaryDoesSolar i wish i would of got 1 more panel on front and 1 on back atm i am buying cheap rate and my electric bill is around £60 in my house we use 10kw-19kw depending if we had the washing machine and dryer on lot i think my bill would of been around £110 if i never bought cheap rate
Octopus are the best of a bad bunch. 18 months and still having problems getting working smart meters and correct billing. Octopus have no way of knowing their smart meters have stopped working. You will though, when Octopus charge you 3 times the tariff rate you should be on.
@@JunitafluxcyfatriciaJunita No worries! Now, bear in mind, those tariffs may never come into effect-instead, being used as a threat for Trump to get the deals he wants...
V2G EVs will make a massive change in mums and dads energy costs. Vehicles are parked 23hrs every day and all night long. Vehicles drive building to building. EVs battery is a massive FREE ELECTRICITY STORAGE 247. Rooftop PV is dirt cheap electricity. Just add the free capacity of the massive EV battery. Trickle currents all day long and all night long. Rapid charging on the main roads and at corner stores, if needed. Tax free savings from no: Petroleum $3,000 per vehicle. Gas heating $2,000 Grid electricity $3,000 Grid new capacity construction $TRILLIONS Grid capacity protection, no blackouts. No new central generation construction $BILLIONS Pornography made internet video cheap and profitable. EVs will make battery technologies cheap and profitable. Battery technologies will make rooftop PV electricity 247 cheap and profitable for mums and dads, and businesses
@@sang3Eta I have 18 x 445w Aiko panels (8.01kWp) and in the middle of summer I saw the 8kW Sunsynk Ecco inverter hit 8.2-8.4kW, so that's above the rated output. granted it was very brief, but they can get up to the rated output on the right day.
LOL, don't remind me, please! I paid a fortune for my equipment in 2022/23, everything from Victron is now half the price and the PV modules are less than a third of the original price 🥲 the only consolation is that, having bought so much equipment, I can now just add more panels and benefit from that without having to redesign the system
@@bazcurtis178 Definitely, just a few months after I bought all my gear the Victron inverter came down from £ 1600 to £ 920, I was so angry I purchased a second one but it's even a tad lower now. The two MPPTs were over £ 900 each, I saw them two days ago at £ 450 or thereabout. PV panels, £ 225 down to £ 78, diabolical. I wanted to experiment and so far I've gone just over £30.000, that's without my labour 🤦🏻♂
Yeah, would you believe I predicted this in a video I made two years ago, but nobody believed me 🤣 ruclips.net/video/S_cB_9pYig8/видео.htmlsi=8IhFJ7vEZFJZtDxG
Thanks for the offer. I am inundated with similar offers though and so really, I’m looking for installations that push the boundaries of innovation etc. Does your installation meet that criteria?
Switch to Octopus Energy using my code and we'll both get £50: share.octopus.energy/blue-wind-201 (UK only)
So glad I came across this channel. I've had solar for 12 years now, but these vids are great. I'm looking into battery storage, but these portable battery are taking my interest. Especially the 3800wh by afinity.
Thank you for producing these videos
You’re most welcome. It makes me happy to hear that they’re useful to people 👍🏻
Gary, your videos last year were what finally decided me to invest in Solar and you can imagine how delighted I was to hear your opinion on AIKO 455w panels, 18 of which now adorn our insulated re-roof on our house.
Keep up the good work with your updates.
That's great to hear, Martin! And thanks for your kind words 🙏 I'd love to hear how your array performs over time!
Cheers Gary. Like I said yesterday on fb, everything you do is useful to me...
I watched most if not all of your videos early on last year and it certainly helped us make the decision to go for it. We had 4.3kwp of solar installed in Feb 2024 and a 14.3kwh diy battery was added by me in June. For anyone on the fence, with export added to equation, It's saved us a shade over £800 up to Jan 1st.
That’s great. I did similar and have had 7.5 kw of panels fitted in 2 stages a year apart. I also picked up a 6.5 kWh a year old on eBay for £1400. Fitted the battery myself and crossed my fingers that it would work. The battery, although a little undersized has worked perfectly and until the autumn we only imported around 5p per day of electricity.
Thanks Kenny - it's really hard work making all the videos, but feedback like yours keeps me going! :-) Great news about your install too!
Thanks so much for the shoutout, Gary! 🙌
My pleasure. I love what Artisan is doing!
For anyone who wants to know more about what Artisan Electrics is planning for this year, I recommend you check out this video on their channel:
ruclips.net/user/livecLGkVkEw_nk?si=MTJZTog9YnHnVHKr
@@artisanelectrics it would be great if you gave the actual pay back expected from one of your installations. I can't see it's ever possible to get your money back.
I'm being quoted 10 KWh battery only £7000. over 10 years that's £700 but investing the money I'd get £350 to spend on electricity. The £700 means every KWh I store ( I use 3500 pa ) costs 20p in equipment costs.
Am I wrong here? I was going to ask how much it would cost you to install a 10 KWh battery.
Thanks Gary. Really looking forward to seeing the developments this year. It’s such a pleasure to work in this industry and help people save money and become energy independent.
-Tok
Cheers Tok - it's going to be a great year all round, I reckon! 😃
Spirit Energy is a great company-check out the latest videos on their channel here:
www.youtube.com/@spiritenergy_uk
Excellent videos Gary, all the best for the new year.
Thank you, Stephen 😀 I wish you the best for 2025 as well! Should be an interesting year all round!
@@GaryDoesSolar200% Import tax for solar panels from China and 60% import tax for solar panels from India and Southeast Asia
@@JunitafluxcyfatriciaJunita Which country are you in?
Hi Gary
Great video again.
We just added a new battery to our system here in the Philippines.
I retired and relocated from the UK at age 55 (I am an ex CEO of Pirelli).
My wife and I built our new home on the 1000 sq m lot we had in the province (countryside). At the same time we bought a 3 hectare farm to grow rice. We bought solar for the water pump on the farm too.
For the new house, we installed 18 panels with a 6KW inverter and 2 x 51.2V 200ah 10.24 KW batteries. Only yesterday we had one more battery installed making it 3 x 10.24KW. Since the installation 1 year ago next month, we have had not one electricity bill! So happy with the system as we can easily run 3 x split AC, fridge, 1 built in electric fan assisted oven, 1 ceramic hob, 1 kettle, 1 washing machine, all lighting, 1 kettle, 4 fans, 1 water cooler and 3 TV's.
Thanks for all the videos.
Cheers,
Simon
Hi Simon, thanks for your kind words and taking the time to let me know about your situation 😀 Congratulations also on your retirement and relocation to warmer climes! As it happens, I have just retired myself (at 59) and am looking forward to spending more time on solar topics and travelling the world 😀 You never know, I might be over your way at some point!
@GaryDoesSolar Nice one Gary. Time to enjoy time.
All the best sir.
Thank you Gary. Coming back round to thinking thru fitting solar or not. I see the tech has moved on WRT the panels, how about converting electricity into heating/hot water creation. Is it a change the boiler scenario or...? Octopus may offer a plan for swapping credits, I'll take a look. Thank you.
You’re welcome, Sean 😀 Not sure if you saw this video I made last year-worth a watch:
ruclips.net/video/6zc1g1bz0eA/видео.htmlsi=zlYbDXKwt4RhcdFQ
Happy new year, Gary! My wife isn't convinced we should get any at all. Wish me luck! 😩
Happy New Year, Mr EV 😀 Good luck persuading your wife-I’ve seen most of your videos and I’m sure you’ll be able to put forward compelling arguments! 💪 ❤️
I am just getting surveys done, just moved and the plan for this year is PV and a battery.
Sounds great! I'd love to hear what tech you go with...
Hi Gary. Which solar company did you use for your setup and do you have a referral code? I’m considering Octopus but not sure the Powerwall 3 is enough for my storage needs as I’m a high kWh user and aim to store as much overnight using octopus cheap rate and discharge during the day to remove as much reliance on grid.
Hi Shan, the company who installed my solar and battery setup was EcoBubl, based near Basingstoke. They don't offer a referral system yet, but please feel free to mention my name if you contact them. If you're looking at a PW3 but would like additional storage to go with it, then aTesla PW3 expansion pack could work for you. It's the same as a PW3 but without the inverter and some other circuitry, making it cheaper (maybe £2-3K less). I like your planned smart tariff strategy and wish you the best with everything! :-)
@ Thanks Gary. I read today also about the potential government grants coming for solar installs, pending Treasury approval I understand. That could be a game changer and I may just sit and wait for a while to see how this pans out before committing. Have you heard anything about this and a potential timeline?
How do we get our solar system to work as whole home backup in a safe manner
You need to select a home battery that has EPS capability. The Tesla Powerwall 3 is a great example of such a battery.
Have a chat with your installer about that. Good luck!
@ we have three 5kw pylontech I an sure you can buy a device that can go between the circuit
Thanks Gary, watched all your videos and now have my system on order. Any idea how long a G99 normally takes (in Scotland) ?
@@silverswimmer
South Scotland for me.
Another story but I'd never have panels....
I just want a 7 Amp EV charger.....
I've been waiting for my supply to be improved by unlooping from my neighbour. The DNO is still talking about it after 8 months!!!
Good luck with the DNO
You’re most welcome. Now, I’m not too familiar with how long SSEN take these days. I know for my own installation two year ls ago (near Oxford, but same DNO) I had to wait months! Hopefully, it’ll be down to days now, or maybe a few weeks at worst. I’d love to hear how long it took though, if you don’t mind 🙏
black Friday and new Year's deals .I SCOOPED UP ON HUGE SOLAR COMPONENTS DEALS TO EXPAND MY OFF GRID SYSTEM WITH. 💪💪💪💪. can't wait for spring to install everything
Great stuff, Robert! 😃
Be nice to explore the use of vertical panels on gable ends: Big numbers in ’ mid winter when you’re likely to be dipping deeper into higher priced energy periods.
many houses are not made for something pulling like a sail
you might ending up pulling out bricks if your house is not made for it
normally the presure comes from above on a wall.
not from the side
it makes more sense if you make a new house and make it flat with the surface
also for the price of the house
most people are not interested in adding a new layer on the outside of the house, even though it can insulate
My gable end faces north into my neighbour's south facing gable end.
Agreed!
Great channel, Gary. Thanks! I have 12 x 250W panels that are 11 years old. I'd love to swap them out but the installation cost would be significant and I'd probably need a new inverter. I'll consider it when I need a new inverter, probably in about 10 years as I swapped mine two years ago and couldn't afford panels then.
Thanks Gary. Yeah, the newer panels will likely be dealing with far greater currents so a new inverter would most likely be required...
I've recently fitted 5.8kw array in my garden. Got the g98 approval but annoyingly can't get a required mcs certificate to allow paid export. I have 11kwh of battery storage but not sure this will be enough to contain all my generated power during the summer.
octopus still accepting non mcs certified installs for export payments. I have done it and saves you a fortune.
Another well done video, Gary!
Thank you Zach! 🙏
What is the best bifacial solar panel? I mean with the highest bifaciality factor.
I’m hoping to do some testing later this year with bi-facial and other panel technologies…
Perfect. Our 16 panel,10.6 KW battery array is due to install on the 14th January, Along with ASHP.
That’s brilliant, Kevin-hope the install goes well 😀👍🏻
@kevinturner6621 Snap we have 16 installed 7 years ago on our new build. So got another 14 with 10.4khwz battery. £9k all in so still not cheap I hope it comes down so more people can get it.
There is no Octopus here in NI so we pay 15p per unit at night.
Great news Gary even for Scotland (and a North facing roof) but the end of December and the start of January are just terrible even on our south facing array.
Thanks - yeah, weather not great at the moment,... but the sun is coming!! ☀😎
A 4kw array only produced 85kw in December. Half that is suggested by the graph.
Gary, could you look at the risk of having too much solar PV? On my new house I'm going ahead with 9kwp split facing SE and SW. The panels are cheaper than roof slates. I think the more panels the further I can extend the solar season into winter.
But am I going to have a future problem of too much summer power which grid providers might penalise me for?
Maybe for those extreme sunny days I just switch some panels off?
The good news is that your inverter will automatically curtail its generation (by adjusting the IV curve) in order not to exceed any export limits etc.
Excellent vlog and explanation. Thank you.
Cheers Andrew! :-)
Where can I buy these panels
If you're in the UK, here's an example retailer:
www.solartradesales.co.uk/aiko-neostar-455w-n-type-abc-gen-2-54-cell-all-black
Happy New Year Gary thanks for all the content
The last couple of months my battery has being doing all the heavy lifting for cheap electric via my EV tariff Intelligent Octopus Go. And as my Installer says the bulk of the installation cost is not with the solar panels so get as many as you can.
You're most welcome-Happy New Year! Agreed, fill those roofs! :-)
If I bought this year rather than 2 years ago I would have spent $4000 less and have 12kw more storage. Even my 3.3kw array dropped in price by $240 past 5 months.
Wow - and, would you believe, I predicted exactly what you experienced in this video I made two years ago:
ruclips.net/video/S_cB_9pYig8/видео.htmlsi=8IhFJ7vEZFJZtDxG
@GaryDoesSolar worst part was buying amen solar inverter,same as nhx with bad firmware. Too bad I missed that vid.
Great video as usual Gary, but I am recommending friends to get a battery first. That has a dramatic effect on reducing bills. I've got a 13.5kWh GivEnergy all in one, and with 2 EVs and ASHP (gas free household) my average unit rate is now 10p. As a heavy user (1100 kWh in December alone), it won't take too long to recoup the investment.
But the real rewards come from adding solar, especially if you can get a decent amount on the roof. If going battery first make sure it can easily have solar added later. The Powerwall3 has three solar inputs, and the new Give Energy all in one has six. I always recommend solar and battery, with a decent size inverter and battery that will last all day from an overnight charge.
I’m also curious whether a battery is a better first option for ROI. With current tariffs exporting solar at 15p hardly seems worth it but that’s what most RUclipsrs seem to recommend - charge battery at 7p overnight, consume that and export the solar generated. Would love to see a video comparing the two options - battery or solar.
@@jameswestcott4191 we just had days where the prices was 1€ per kwh in northern europe
if you have a large battery then those days can make a bit of profit... (or save you a bit)
and they say we will get more of those days as we shut down more and more power plants
not that i dont have solar, but in december my 20kw produces a little over 1 kwh per day for example
deffently my solar is the big saver..
but the battery also does its bit
i am going to spend 15.000€ - 20.000€ more on batterys this year
but im also mining bitcoins and get more from that then selling to the grid (while i can heat some of my house with it.)
Absolutely, I also have 4.3kWp, but I'm in a fortunate position to be able to have both. If you can afford only one - get a battery first.@TheRonskiman
@jameswestcott4191 Well, you generate little in winter (none today - covered in snow!) but you can still timeshift with a battery regardless. Solar Apr to Oct is great, but outside that period....you'd need to run the numbers.
Gary love the content.
I spoke with Jim and finally got an EV.
He spoke very highly of you.
Snap we had 16 installed 7 years ago on our new build.
So got another 14 with 10.4khwz battery.
£9k all in so still not cheap I hope it comes down so more people can get it.
There is no Octopus here in NI so we pay 15p per unit at night.
Cheers Michael, and please pass on my regards to Jim for me. He's a great guy and I'd like to meet up with him again this year.
Great to hear about your installation, and hopefully Octopus Energy will find its way into NI before long! All the best! Gary
Copper Cable and the fixings needed for the roof are still pricey but it is never too late to install these start saving money 💰the more panels you can put the better as explained by Gary.
Cheers! 😀
Ok you have motivated me to get a new quote. I suspect though that increased wages, scaffolding costs etc will swamp the price drop for what was already cheap panels.
I'll report back on the re quote of 2 years ago.
I've yet to understand how I can possibly get a less than 10 years return on a £11,500 system when my electricity bill is about £821 per annum
@@Harajukujin correct
They never take into account the cost of money or if you have the money what it would return in interest.£10000 is £500 per annum. Three quarters of my bill for doing nothing and at the end of the 10 Years I still have £10000 😂
There wasn't Vat on batteries via installers. None if you installed solar some suggested battery only could come with a non existent solar panel 😂
I got 6 panels front 6 on back with total 20kw battery even in winter iv been charging at night cheap rate cost me around £55 ish that with standing charge my house useing anywhere from 9kw to 18kw a day yesterday I used nearly 12kw cost me £1.52 that was with standing charge
@@allan4787I no some people who get around £350+back just in export hope I do only had my solar 3 months now 6 front and 6 on back with 20kw battery 455w panels
@@deanwhittle1301 are you in the UK. How much did your system cost?
panel prices will not drop much, while inverters and especially batteries will be much more affordable for a few years...
Agreed-the price drops will occur in other parts of a solar installation, as you say 👍🏻
Excellent
Thank you! 🙏
Funnily enough, I've just installed 10 Aiko neostar 455W panels split east/west. I don't have batteries installed - they are too expensive imo and don't last long enough, but if this improves I will definately move ahead.
Too expensive and don't last long enough??? You can buy a 15 kWh battery with 8 year guarantee for £2500 from Fogstar in the UK, you can buy even cheaper from them if you can put the battery together yourself. They state that £2.5k battery has 3500 cycles, but it uses the same cells I have and they are good for 6000 cycles, that's 1 cycle a day for 16 years, even then they will still work just have 80% of the original capacity.
@@TheRonskiman the problem with fogstar is finding someone to install it for you. Not many options as far as I can see in my area
@DSVWARE Depending on inverter, and if you go with one battery it's very simple, two battery cables and one data cable, setup the inverter and pretty much job done. I did all the DC work on my system, even built the batteries from scratch, 32 cells from Fogstar, I've got two batteries for a total of 29 kWh of storage. Doing it today, I would buy prebuilt or DIY kits.
@TheRonskiman majority of people won't be keen to do it themselves. Myself included, and I think although not an expert I am slightly more versed than the average Joe when it comes to electricity
As south facing panels are built out I can see a scenario where midday summer electricty comes less valuable where as east west hi value can be exported as generated negating the need for batteries
At this time of year I am counting the days for my west/north panels to start picking up. Even on sunny days I can tell when the sun is in the south, too long to hit the east and west at the same time
Great stuff! And sunnier days are coming now! 😀
Hi Gary, I just got this reply from Huawei regarding the limited off peek charging to 3KWH with single phase homes. I have a 15 KWH battery so I can’t fully charge at night due to the limitations of the inverter. I complained to Huawei tech support and this is their response.
Allan
We apologize for the limitations of the Single Phase L1 Inverter. Currently, it is capable of charging the battery from the grid with a maximum output of 3 kWh.
However, we would like to inform you that Huawei's new Single Phase 8-10KTL LC0 Inverter, expected to be available in the UK around mid-year, will offer a significantly higher capacity. This new model can support up to 50 kWh of AC energy input from the grid, providing much greater flexibility and performance. Thanks
Regards
I have a 6.4 KWH array SW facing. With a 6KW inverter. I don’t have an EV at the moment so I only get 3 hours of off peek from Octopus.
My own home battery is limited to a 3.6kW charging speed, so not much better. A Powerwall 3 can charge at 5kW so ideally, that kind of rate or higher is good to aim for.
Gary, your videos are always very helpful! Thank you! I will be getting solar panels and a Powerwall3 installed in another month or two. I also got a Tesla Cybertruck, which can act as an emergency backup power source for our house in event of a grid power outage. I am eager to see how all this equipment will work out.
Four months on and my Enphase solar is playing up for the second time (pre-snowy weather). The charge is prioritising exporting to the grid again when it gets to 86%. This happened back in November, caused by a software update bug and solved by a recalibration. I've reported it again and not getting a timely answer which is disheartening. Worse than that the solar showed a very low charge rate on the last very sunny day though the panels were showing good performance. I reported this to Enphase and they agreed the rate should be around 3kWH rather than the 0.8kWH it showed. I also haven't had an update on resolving this Enphase believe this is also a software error so I would advise anyone with one of their systems to check performance is correct and, in my opinion, anyone who is thinking of going solar to choose a different company's products. This is costing me money and Octopus have confirmed they have no responsibility to support me with it.
Hi Peter, your installer (Octopus?) will most likely have provided with you an estimate of monthly generation. If you're not achieving anything near that estimate, then you should take that up directly with the installer, in the first instance, not the equipment manufacturers... Worth getting some consumer advice on this too...
Here's something to check out and is what happened to my neighbour:-
The electrician employed by the installer was a clueless numpty who changed the 'gender' of panel connecting cables, resulting in the voltage in some panels being negated by adjacent panels - I. E. negative to negative and positive to positive.
I know this sounds hard to believe but is what happened. The fault was only discovered after a lengthy examination by another electrician who could scarcely believe what had been done!
@@martinmorgan9 Wow!
@@GaryDoesSolarGary, thank you for your advice. The installer was Octopus. It was they who advised me to contact Enphase when I had the issue of the system not charging beyond 86% first time around. They said if I can provide evidence that this has cost me money e.g. the system importing from the grid when it shows 6% whereas it is in fact at 20% they will refund what I've paid. Enphase said they were investing investigating back in November and this ticket is still open with them but I can't get any feedback on progress. I have now tried emailing them. I wonder if Enphase is just too immature a system with their software as yet. Octopus have only been using them for perhaps the last 8 months.
Ofgem are considering allowing SC's as part of alternate tariffs, but sounds like we won't see this until 2026.
Whilst I applaud the overall message, I agree with your previous vid about the likelihood of export payments going to collapse.
With all the green energy being added to the grid, the costs are being added to the SC unfortunately, which Solar of course doesn't mitigate.
Curtailment costs thanks to limited grid design cost:
945m - 2022
779m - 2023
1 billion - 2024
With Labour accelerating permissions for Windfarms, and an increase in residential solar ( hello Mr. Duck curve!) I don't think it's unrealistic to expect 1.5 billion of curtailment charges in 2025.
This is unsustainable surely?
All the while, 99% could be green generation, but if that 1% is gas powered, that dictates the price for the 99%.
I see very little progress with grid storage.
The 'plan' seems to be green energy saturation, but with enough that large portions can be turned off whilst not needing gas.
Your posting looks interesting, but could you please elaborate:-
1) What does SC stand for?
2) Please explain about CURTAILMENT.
@martinmorgan9 Apologies.
SC = standing charge. In the UK, for gas and electricity connections, each have a daily 'charge' regardless of unit / energy usage.
Curtailment is when green energy is putting TOO much energy on the grid. The grid must be balanced (same all around the world) to regulate voltage and frequency to ensure that all appliances receive the power they need.
So the ppl who invest and create windfarms will be funded independently. They want an ROI (return on investment) and they'd not invest (or be less likely to do so) if they didn't also get compensated for when the Nation Grid asks them to turn off.
Hense the crazy payments.
That bill / cost has to go somewhere, so it seems (I'm not 100% sure) that it's landing on SC payments.
Here is a snippet of an article based on how much curtailment is adding to SC:
"Wind curtailment, or when the grid can't handle the extra power generated by wind, can add a significant amount to energy bills:
2023
A think tank estimates that wasted wind power will add £40 to the average UK household's annual energy costs.
2026
The same think tank estimates that the figure could increase to £150.
2021
An independent report found that curtailing wind power added £806 million to energy bills in Britain.
2020-2021
The average amount of wasted electricity per annum was 2.9 TWh, enough to power 800,000 households.
The cost of wind curtailment is passed on to consumers. When wind power is curtailed, gas-powered stations are paid to fire up, and the cost is passed on to consumers.
Some say that the problem of wind curtailment will get worse as the rate of installation of new offshore wind outpaces the growth of network infrastructure. However, the government has said that major reforms will halve the time it takes to build energy networks to cope with extra wind power"
So if these 'reforms' (which we'll all need to pay for of course!) Don't happen and energy remains tied to gas pricing, we'll all be cooking off candles lol.
On a series note, a lot of anti-green misinformation out there, it's challenging knowing what is FUD (fear / uncertainty / doubt) from big energy etc.
I do think it undermines the viability of EV's, at least for the two tier demographic who don't have a driveway and can't take advantage of cheap time of day home charging.
Similar with Heat Pump rollouts.
If you despite the 300-400% efficiency are still reliant on massive tax payer subsidies and time of day cheap energy (and with most HP owners they also have solar and home batteries) to make it cost effective, it's again a challenge to push to the masses.
Both EV's and HP's are great and proven technologies, with irrefutable ecological benefits, but how practical and viable they are for those less well off I really do question..
@martinmorgan9 I should also further explain, that one of Ofgems proposed ideas regarding electricity standing charge, is somehow incorporating the daily cost into the per kwh usage charges.
So this would give additional incentives to reduce consumption. Otherwise, as (somewhat selfishly) as a solar owner myself, I spent £230 on electricity, but it cost me an additional £240 in standing charges.
Obviously, the challenge is to offer something as an alternative, but not to punish those who don't have solar of course, but more importantly, those who for example need to run electrical medical equipment at home.
In those cases, reducing consumption isn't an option for them, so its 'best' for them to be on the existing (scandalous) SC solution
Grid battery storage large scale is absolutley not financially viable, and wont be for decades, to install enough storage for wind and solar for just one day would cost 300 billion quid, and one day is not a reliable store of energy, for that we could install enough small scale nuclear reactors to supply reliable clean, cheap electricity to the whole of the UK for 60 years (including maintenance), solar and wind infrastructure to generate the same reliable 24 hour electricity would cost 1.2 trillion quid (plus one day battery storage of 300 billion), and would need to be replaced two times within the same 60 year period that a nuclear power plant would last Nuclear 300 billion for for 60 years power, or wind solar and batteries 4.5 trillion for the same 60 years .. in the 50's, nuclear was the future of reliable energy, it still is, and always will be.
@kevindavis8442 I do think moving away from Nuclear was a mistake.
Especially when I learned that radioactive material can be recycled.
Guess we'll see what the next few years bring.
But unless it starts to bring down prices (below pre-2021 lvl) I can see a green backlash
There is a UK company, and quite a few RUclipsrs who always push those rather expensive Australian Bi-facials panels (they are pointless on a roof), they always push flawed videos where they don't compare like for like, their panels/system always have a hidden advantage and it's not what they tell you in the video.
I'm hoping to do some real-world testing of different types of solar panels throughout this year...
The equipment has dropped but the installation companies aren’t passing on the price drop. I was quoted 6000 to 8000 for a 10 panel and inverter set up. 1400 worth of equipment 800-1000 scaffolding so £3600 to the electricians for 3 days work lol
Yeah, this is why it's always best to keep shopping around. It's a free market after all, and I'm sure there are installers out there who will pass on the costs...
@@GaryDoesSolarhave to agree someone will do the install for a reasonable price just not the two chancers I have stumbled upon.
Are there panels that create energy through rain!!!?? Now those I WOULD buy!!!
Haha - with the sheer amount of rain we're getting in the UK at the moment, count me in too! :-)
I have 44 of these Aikos 🥰
Brilliant! 😀
I just wish there were more companies that would allow u to buy the equipment you want and they install. The problem most consumers have at the minute is all the MCS companies etc want to install equpment they provide or like to work with. it makes it hard for us to customize exsactly what u want as u might find a company you like but they only work with certin equpment. This is why i dont like having to reliant on MCS regisrated compaines for export. Surly we should be allowd to install what we want with DNO spec and have it then MCS signed of after for export that would be a much more consumer focused way of doing installs. And people would have systems that suit there needs more than been reliant on a installer telling what they think. Specially with like you north facing video imagine trying to tell a company u want north panels I guarantee 90% wouldnt even Install them
Very much agree with this. I know what I want in an install, but none of the quotes I've had have matched with that, even though I've been very explicit..
Just get rid of MCS, it is a con, and the only thing that makes it worth the paper it is written on is that most utilitie companies insist you have it if you want to get paid, not I said paid as they don't stop you exporting, you don't need it to do that, you just won't get paid unless you get on Octopuses non MCS trial.
@@TheRonskiman But that's exactly why it is worth the money its written on as of now. i agree with you but 99% of people installing solar want paying for export which means you need to go MCS at this time, MCS should be a cert that you get get after install i think not attached to the company installing, say you pay a fee to become MCS certified not the company doing it is MCS
@@UnitedSpotlight I agree, and also said that it's the only thing that makes it worth the paper it's written on. I've also posted another comment saying Gary needs to point out why MCS is important. What you suggest wound be a very good idea, but MCS has got too powerful to change now. They've got their fingers in the ASHP installs as well, and cause issues there as well.
Agreed. The recent appearance of very competitive 15kWh LFP FOGSTAR batteries makes them a very attractive option to save on battery installation, but that's only any good if an installer will agree to fit them rather than THEIR choice because of their procurement preferences.
The installation must be done by a professional.
We have seen many inefficient and unsafe installations here in South africa.
A professional installer takes onto account orientation and slope of panels as well as weight and wind loading.
Then there is the actual installation. Poorly installed connectors cause intermittent failures and even fires.
As far as inverters are concerned, they are not always plug and play. Many have sofisticated software and you need to know what you are doing to get maximum efficiency from the system.
Finally the batteries and cabling. Perfect crimping and right size cable to avoid energy losses or fire hazzard.
The LiFePo batteries are extremely stable and you can get 10 years with 90% discarge safely
Agreed, choosing a good installer is vital.
Gary, you have gone through many seasons now in the UK. How often did you use grid electricity and how much.
Australia has Sahara Desert latitudes and too much sunshine 🌞.
As 80% of the world's population live in warm latitudes I believe that Australia's experience is useful.
But UK latitudes would be interesting re: rooftop PV.
You may have a video that I missed.
Do you have a season with a home battery included ?
Do you have gas heating ?
I think a little fossil fuels in mid winter weeks is nothing.
Hi Stephen, so I still pull from the grid a fair amount during winter, but during the summer I’m not pulling from the grid at all and am instead exporting. The monies I receive from that export essentially cover the grid import during winter, so my overall annual electricity bill is zero. See my video here with year one numbers:
ruclips.net/video/JE2q__wFck0/видео.htmlsi=dTXBozb2Tiv_aJnL
@GaryDoesSolar thanks Gary.
Interest rates are too high to make solar with batteries a good buy. I invested my $30,000 in the S&P 500 and it pays my electric bill. We also have MCE 100% wind and solar so my money pays for clean electricity. I’m also heavily shaded so solar isn’t a great investment. 😁
Investing in the S&P500 is certainly a good move (I have been invested in that for years) 👍🏻 Sorry that you have shading issues where you are…
The other day batterygroup had JA Solar 460w panels for £34.17 inc vat obviously they sold out fast but if you can get anywhere near that kind of price its a no brainer. Also Fogstar had a black fiday sale on diy lifepo4 Seplos battery kits with 16kwh of grade A cells for around £1500. Combining the above with a victron inverter on the Tomato energy battery tariff at 5p a unit from midnight to 6am would be great. I think air source heatpumps will start to fall soon and the R290 heatpumps dont need an F-gas installer so can be done diy to save money too. In winter if you can get a scop of 4 or more and get all your electricity at 5p a unit even with inverter losses it should work out 1.5p to 2p per kwh of heat energy which is much cheaper than natural gas. The only possible downside is if the cheap night rates rise as more people use them for ev's and batteries, but I still think its worth it.
Pretty good-thanks for Sharing! :-)
Solar & Battery the way forward without a doubt.
Agreed! 😀👍🏻
Gary, you need to mention the need for MCS, as much as I hate MCS, that pointless bit of paper makes it much easier to get paid for expert.
Octopus are now doing a self install export, i think it may still be in trial, but they are pushing the boundaries for sure
@@kevindavis8442 Yes they are, as I mentioned in another comment. I know of a few people online that have managed to get on it, but its not clear upfront what's required (seems to be DNO permission, building control notification and I believe they check the installation), and unless you know exactly what you are doing MCS is much easier. You try and find any up to date information about it, you won't, MCS pulled strings I believe.
Agreed, and I cover MCS in the "How to Choose a Good Installer" video referenced in that one:
ruclips.net/video/N-7tyH6TIJ4/видео.htmlsi=5rMtJTjnZwLKMNje
Not exactly.
I think t'as a bit too soon.
Peroskite will change so much within a few month.
Particularly in england.
Because peroskite use will increase by 20% the quantity of energy, about 150 watts more under clouds due to captation of radiation
I'm hoping to do some research into Perovskite technology this year... I agree on the efficiency gain, but it might come at a price initially...
In india we have 575 watt latest and greatest pv panel 😅
Check loom solar
Yeah, I wanted to show a popular and inexpensive panel, not the best possible.
Gary, youre saying this as im looking out at 6 inches of snow outside.
Yesterday might have been a good day, today certainly isnt
Don’t worry-the snow will disappear soon enough. Summer is coming… ☀️
West facing panels are probably the most cost effective as this is when electricity is most in demand and is bound to be more expensive now and in the future
Good point-although I guess you just have to go with what your property allows... Fill as many roofs as you can! :-)
Hi Gary - Watched the majority of your clips and great info - However I have a question .... We buy electricity from Octopus as normal and we sell back electricity from solar and batteries as normal and we pay 5% VAT on our purchase of electricity but do we get the 5% VAT on what we sell back to them ???
Thanks for the great feedback, Craig!
Good question on the UK VAT aspect. Here’s what Grok2 said:
When you purchase electricity from Octopus Energy in the UK, you indeed pay 5% VAT on the electricity you consume. However, the VAT treatment on the electricity you sell back (export) through solar panels or batteries is different.
According to the information available, VAT is not charged on the electricity you export back to the grid. The reason is that the export of electricity by households is not considered a taxable supply for VAT purposes. This means that you do not pay VAT on the export payments you receive from Octopus Energy. However, your energy supplier, in this case, Octopus Energy, pays VAT on the electricity it sells to you, but they do not charge you VAT on the payments they make to you for your exported electricity.
This is consistent with the general VAT rules for energy in the UK, where the supply of electricity to domestic users is subject to a reduced rate of VAT at 5%, but there is no VAT applied to the payment received for exported electricity.
Therefore, you pay 5% VAT on the electricity you import (buy) from Octopus, but you do not receive or pay any VAT on the electricity you export (sell back) to them.
www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-on-fuel-and-power-notice-70119
In Australia the government opposition is promoting nuclear electricity. 14gW.
In the land of Sahara Desert latitudes, with 8,000 billion m ² of sunshine all year long, many are thinking that Australia should embrace nuclear electricity.
Nuclear electricity to replace
Petroleum
Gas heating
Coal fired expensive grid electricity
To have millions of mums and dads switch off rooftop PV to stabilise the grid.
My wife just asked me what about the people living in tower apartments.
Grid electricity remains in place remains available.
This is the difficulty of stopping a distorted political pronuclear election campaign slogans.
When the sun doesn't shine. 😮
I say when the sun does shine nuclear electricity will need to stop for hours daily.
Is nuclear the best technology available to support renewables then?
@GaryDoesSolar my apologies Gary, I may have mislead you.
Nuclear electricity can not load follow.
That is why the Opposition political parties are pushing for BASE LOAD nuclear plants.
My concern is that even daily demand for nuclear grid electricity will drop to zero and the nuclear generation plant will have to be turned off.
In fact with EVs massive battery plugged into the home the demand for nuclear grid electricity will be zero for long after the daily sunset.
As the only reason for nuclear electricity is no CO2 emissions then EVs must be included in the future.
But, if the majority of electricity will not be nuclear electricity, then nuclear will not be needed.
Nuclear needs 247 operating conditions.
Nuclear needs 247 cashflow for economic survival.
Australia is in Sahara Desert latitudes and sunshine is in abundance.
Australia is the land of skin cancers sadly.
Now if the Opposition political party gains government and starts construction of the nuclear electricity generation plants then it may have to tell mum's and dad's to switch off feed-in electricity and take grid electricity.
But mum's and dad's with v2g EVs plugged into the grid and rooftop PV electricity may switch off grid electricity and never switch on expensive grid electricity.
Grid owners cashflow will decline and the grid owners have the biggest problem as their business is an expensive infrastructure investment.
It needs cashflow.
Somebody said we rent the grid and buy the electricity.
My old friend is working with the Opposition parties to promote nuclear electricity, he has no grid generation construction experience and no grid construction experience.
We graduated CivEng together from the University of NSW. Best in Australia.
He is wrong and can not understand why. He has invested 40 years into his dream. He has built earth dams and local council works.
But I digress.
@GaryDoesSolar Edited @GaryDoesSolar my apologies Gary, I may have mislead you.
Nuclear electricity can not load follow.
That is why the Opposition political parties are pushing for BASE LOAD nuclear plants in Australia.
My concern is that even daily demand for nuclear grid electricity will drop to zero and the nuclear generation plant will have to be turned off.
In fact with EVs massive battery plugged into the home the demand for nuclear grid electricity will be zero for long after the daily sunset.
As the only reason for nuclear electricity is no CO2 emissions then EVs must be included in the future.
But, if the majority of electricity will not be nuclear electricity, but rooftopPV, then nuclear will not be needed.
Nuclear needs 247 stable constant operating conditions.
Nuclear needs 247 cashflow for economic survival.
Australia is in Sahara Desert latitudes and sunshine is in abundance.
Australia is the land of skin cancers sadly.
Now if the Opposition political party gains government and starts construction of the nuclear electricity generation plants then it may have to tell mum's and dad's to switch off feed-in electricity and take grid electricity.
But mum's and dad's with v2g EVs plugged into the grid and rooftop PV electricity may switch off grid electricity and never switch on expensive grid electricity again.
Grid owners cashflow will decline and the grid owners have the biggest problem as their business is an expensive infrastructure investment.
It needs cashflow.
Somebody said 'we rent the grid for a dollar kWh and buy the 10cents kWh electricity'.
My old friend is working with the Opposition parties to promote nuclear electricity, he has no grid generation construction experience and no grid construction experience.
We graduated CivEng together from the University of NSW. Best in Australia.
He is wrong and can not understand why. He has invested 40 years into his dream. He has built earth dams and local council works.
But I digress.
@@stephenbrickwood1602 I need to research more on this. What I understand now is that fossil fuels have served us well to date in ensuring a constant supply of electricity, and if we are to phase them out, what do we do when there is little sun and little wind for several days? This is happening right now in the UK and natural gas is having to fill the gap.
when will you talk about the real price for installing solar, compared to what many installers charge
often a days work cost more then 10.000€ in this kind of work
also when it comes to heatpumps
we have alot of local installers getting rich of the need for green energy and heating
i paid 500€ for connecting 3 hybrid inverters to the grid + 2 batteries
my total cost for a 20kw solar and 15kw batteries are 500€ when it comes to installing it
i had to get installers from a webshop that sells solar panels, and not from any local workers
and its not like those 500€ did not pay for that 2 hours job
btw the quote i got was on the exact same brand, as i installed my self
nothing fancy everything was from china no matter what
but even the panels and inverters was almost 20% more expensive from the local installer then if i got them my self
and they would not install anything i got my self, they also wanted to sell the equitment if they was going to install
same with heatpump
8000€ for a half days work and a bit of a123 gas (50€)
I got these 3 months ago 6 front of house 6 on back with 10kw battery then 1 month ago i added 2x 5kw more batteries think total was aroubd £12k might have been little under that soar is cheap as hell its labour and scaffold that alot
Hi Dean, sounds great. Yeah, you’re right-scaffolding costs need to come down, and labour costs too. I think that will happen as more installers enter the market.
@@GaryDoesSolar i wish i would of got 1 more panel on front and 1 on back atm i am buying cheap rate and my electric bill is around £60 in my house we use 10kw-19kw depending if we had the washing machine and dryer on lot i think my bill would of been around £110 if i never bought cheap rate
Octopus are the best of a bad bunch. 18 months and still having problems getting working smart meters and correct billing. Octopus have no way of knowing their smart meters have stopped working. You will though, when Octopus charge you 3 times the tariff rate you should be on.
Yeah, the smart meter rollout has not been anywhere near as good as it should have been
200% Import tax for solar panels from China and 60% import tax for solar panels from India and Southeast Asia
Which country are you?
@@GaryDoesSolar Southeast Asia. But I made a joke for America. Because Trump wants to give tariffs to our solar panels too
@@JunitafluxcyfatriciaJunita No worries! Now, bear in mind, those tariffs may never come into effect-instead, being used as a threat for Trump to get the deals he wants...
V2G EVs will make a massive change in mums and dads energy costs.
Vehicles are parked 23hrs every day and all night long.
Vehicles drive building to building.
EVs battery is a massive FREE ELECTRICITY STORAGE 247.
Rooftop PV is dirt cheap electricity.
Just add the free capacity of the massive EV battery.
Trickle currents all day long and all night long.
Rapid charging on the main roads and at corner stores, if needed.
Tax free savings from no:
Petroleum $3,000 per vehicle.
Gas heating $2,000
Grid electricity $3,000
Grid new capacity construction $TRILLIONS
Grid capacity protection, no blackouts.
No new central generation construction $BILLIONS
Pornography made internet video cheap and profitable.
EVs will make battery technologies cheap and profitable.
Battery technologies will make rooftop PV electricity 247 cheap and profitable for mums and dads, and businesses
High marginal taxpayers will love the tax-free savings.
High income people are early adopters.
V2G is coming, but not fast enough!
They will generate 343W not 455W. NOCT is the realistic output number for anyone not living in a desert.
I disagree. I have 9 panels of a slightly lower spec and get 3.5kWH maximum.
@sang3Eta Sorry, but you're wrong. I have 415W panels on my property in the UK and they generate 415W on many days of the year.
@GaryDoesSolar I have 415W panels in the UK, too, and on the sunniest days, they will only generate the NOCT rating, not the STC one.
@@sang3Eta Which direction are your panels facing, and at what pitch? Also, are they connected to microinverters or optimisers?
@@sang3Eta I have 18 x 445w Aiko panels (8.01kWp) and in the middle of summer I saw the 8kW Sunsynk Ecco inverter hit 8.2-8.4kW, so that's above the rated output. granted it was very brief, but they can get up to the rated output on the right day.
LOL, don't remind me, please! I paid a fortune for my equipment in 2022/23, everything from Victron is now half the price and the PV modules are less than a third of the original price 🥲 the only consolation is that, having bought so much equipment, I can now just add more panels and benefit from that without having to redesign the system
We bought in December 2022. I am sure it would be miles cheaper today, but still pleased we got on the solar/battery train then and didn’t wait
@@bazcurtis178 Definitely, just a few months after I bought all my gear the Victron inverter came down from £ 1600 to £ 920, I was so angry I purchased a second one but it's even a tad lower now. The two MPPTs were over £ 900 each, I saw them two days ago at £ 450 or thereabout. PV panels, £ 225 down to £ 78, diabolical. I wanted to experiment and so far I've gone just over £30.000, that's without my labour 🤦🏻♂
Yeah, would you believe I predicted this in a video I made two years ago, but nobody believed me 🤣
ruclips.net/video/S_cB_9pYig8/видео.htmlsi=8IhFJ7vEZFJZtDxG
Do you like to make an interesting video on Solar Energy Implementation, if yes kindly share your email id, so PPT can be shared with you
Thanks for the offer. I am inundated with similar offers though and so really, I’m looking for installations that push the boundaries of innovation etc. Does your installation meet that criteria?
@GaryDoesSolar yes, it's better way to implement solar around the world