CalTracs Traction Bars Before/After on my 1970 Challenger - Solving Vibration, Wheel Hop & Axle Wrap
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- Опубликовано: 31 дек 2021
- I diagnose and attempt to fix some driveline vibration and traction issues on my 5.7 Hemi Swapped 1970 Dodge Challenger by installing a set of Calvert Racing CalTracs traction bars. I used a GoPro mounted under my car to see if excess axle wrap is causing problems. I also do a before and after to see how much the CalTracs improve launches and fix axle wrap.
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Hard to find such a good go pro video. Instead of the text book explanations. Been hot ridding 15x years.. great video. My transam had been doing this for 10 yrs
4.10. T56
Dude the second you hit it and your ashtray fell out had me dying! Been there done that. Got to love old cars! LMAO!
I have VHS video of me launching cigarette butts from the ashtray to the rear package tray in my 70 340 Duster.
@@normal450 hahaha, epic!
Chrysler has made Super Stock spring sets for drag racing, for close to 60 years. When used with a pinion snubber, they were all you needed for traction and to eliminate wheel hop. They are stiffer and matched to the weight of your car. Left side is different from the right. I think your main issue is with the HK springs not being stiff enough for the weight of your car, for drag racing launches. Calvert also makes mono leaf springs to be used with their traction bars and they are also lighter for weight savings.
Very true, and I did consider the super stock springs but decided to go for more street driving/handling performance vs straight line. I think wheel hop is the price I paid. Luckily the traction bars help me do a little bit of both. I do run a factory pinion snubber, but the adjustable one was something I wish I looked into a bit more.
Frank Kwas - Hello Frank. On a 73 Challenger with 340 and old fatigued rear leaf springs, what do you think about the installation of a set of big block rear leaf springs? Will the car be at stock height but just be stiffer with these springs?
With ss springs the ride quality of a street car is ruined, with the caltracs you get the traction and ride quality together, and why I am installing them on my dart with stock leafs.
Uncle Tony is probably screaming, "traction bars don't work on mopars! They're already set up perfect from the factory!" 😂
That’s why I took video evidence! Haha
Pinion snubber!!! I never used traction bars on my Mopars..learn the suspension and how it works,Ford/gm you need traction bars Mopars you dont!
@@01trsmar The real question is do you not want to install track bars because a pinion snubber works better? Or do you not want to install track bars just to claim that Mopars have better suspension?
He has Hotchkis leaf springs, they are completely different then stock. Uncle Tony claim was on the stock design.
@@01trsmar
"𝘍𝘰𝘳𝘥/𝘨𝘮 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘯𝘦𝘦𝘥 𝘵𝘳𝘢𝘤𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘣𝘢𝘳𝘴 𝘔𝘰𝘱𝘢𝘳𝘴 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘥𝘰𝘯𝘵"
Superstock springs or pinion snubbers only stop wheel hop. That's it. There's a reason slappers or Caltracs are called TRACTION bars and not 'stop annoying wheel hop' bars. They use leverage and geometry to put more of a vehicles weight on the rear tires. Magic Mopar springs or pinion snubbers won't, and can't, do that.
3 degrees nose down at the pinion with a manual is the age old rule of thumb
A Mopar adjustable pinion snubber works well
Wheel hop is usually solved by longer shocks
Hey had a 69 gtx. Same problem traction bars. Adj bars so rubber is tight on spring. Good luck john
Just so you know you can put a adjustable pinion snubber on it to keep your front pinion from going up as you accelerate
I did consider this route, and did run the factory pinion snubber. I always wondered, wouldn’t a taller pinion snubber affect suspension travel?
I wouldn't think that your pinion on your 3rd member would ever really reach the top of the floor the tunnel, so just putting an adjustable pinion snubber is just that when your 3rd member starts to go higher than you would want before it starts to shake it just stabilizes it right before the pinion moves too high up
Pinion snubber. Easy to make.
Factory high horse cars had reinforcement to the underbody directly above the pinion snubber, and direct connection recommendations place the top of the pinion snubber in contact with the underbody reinforcement plate, with the car at rest, if I remember right.
Nice video and well represented as to what happens with 50 year old technology based on people running bias-ply tires. Your in the right direction. If you haven’t, go with the Cal-Tracs mono leaf. I did and haven’t looked back since
I’ve been thinking about trying those mono leafs, how is the handling and ride height on those? I like the handling of the Hotchkis, but the ride height is a bit too low.
@@noboltsleftbehind ride height is great. You need to decide the direction you want. Hotchkiss nice ride, handling, poor at 1/4 mile. Cal-tracs gives height, stiffer ride on street, great on the 1/4 mile. You have limitations on both and need to choose what you are willing to give up.
The heavy overload bottom leaf on the Nissan stabilized the axle under hard load
I know its a quite a few Benjamins. But ride tech makes one excellent four link. I installed it into my 68 charger. Wow what a difference. Very easy to install ,very little welding.
Ah yes a four link is definitely the ultimate. I’ve never done one but I’m glad to hear it’s not too bad of an install, maybe someday I’ll have to bite the bullet.
This is a great video!
Something that I will want to look into when I get to that point with my own build. Thanks for posting it up!
Thanks! If you get wheel hop it seems like a good way to help plant your tires. I’ll make sure to post a test at the drag strip to see if it improves traction!
@@noboltsleftbehind Will be looking for that video!
Thank you for another informative video. Keep ‘em coming…
Love these videos great looking daily driver
Thanks!
Years ago, I had purchased an adjustable pinion snubber to help control wheel hop and traction. Turns out, the stock HD springs didn't raise the body enough to fit the snubber. Basically it's used with the SS springs. I wound up using a rubber bump stop that had a threaded rod and attached it to the stock snubber, after removing the stock rubber stop. Then experimented using washers to control the space between the snubber and body until optimum traction was determined.
Interesting, maybe I’ll have to build my own like that. I don’t have much gap with my stock snubber but I was told I needed to reduce it to less than an inch for it to work well. Do you have any experience with the CalTracs leaf springs? I’m curious how they ride.
Never used the CalTracs but I'm pretty sure they are mono leaf. I also had clamped the front half of the springs to make them stiffer. Lo buck stuff.
Got a deal on Competition Engineering adjustable drag shocks back in the day, but never installed them. Marriage and kids came. Priorities changed.
Lol.
You set your pinion angle at ride height, typically 3 degrees down so that when the pinion rotates up under load it is in line with the transmission tail shaft. That said, Mopar added leaves to reduce axle wrap from the factory, but many use a pinion snubber and some use old school traction bars. It somewhat depends on what you are trying to do meaning drag racing setup over a handling set up. Your setup is definitely on the loose side but those HK springs are designed for handling and should be used in conjunction with a good sway bar. Caltracs will get it done. Something else you can consider is adding a leaf and clamping the front and rear spring packs.
That’s some good advice, I do have the rear sway bar I haven’t installed yet so maybe that will help. I was seriously considering an additional leaf, partly due to the Hotchkis springs sitting way too low.
@@noboltsleftbehind An additional leaf will stiffen the spring pack so long as it is clamped to the pack. Many racers play with clamping only the front to resist axle wrap while allowing the rear springs to separate to help transfer power to the axles/tires. Its a game of sorts to find what works on both the street and the track in reference to drag racing.
@@MH-rb7lp I figured it would stiffen up, which I was ok with since the Hotchkis springs are a little soft. I didn’t know about clamping the springs though, that’s good to know! I’ll be doing some testing.
I thought it needed further adjustments myself
I watch all of your videos, thanks for your content. I have a 70 charger with a 440. Trying y to o get the nerves to do the swap. Your videos are very helpful, thanks
Do the swap, you got this! That’s a seriously awesome car, and the gen 3 Hemi fits very nicely in that nice wide engine bay.
Be sure to post it when you do the swap! I’d love to see it please
I appreciate the update
Absolutely! There’s more to come soon, I have a few more upgrades in the works and the racetracks are opening back up here soon…
Dude! I love your videos. I've watched the entire series so far. I'm considering doing a similar swap to my Charger project. I first want to find out what kind of HP I can get from my 383 first. Thank you for such detailed information. I'm now confident that if I decide to do a similar swap I will certainly be able to do it.
Thanks so much man! Glad I could help. Good luck with your Charger build, both are awesome engine options. Hard to beat the rumble of an old big block.
That will be some awesome videos!!!
700 hp from a 383 no power adders...and still can daily drive it..
You need to add preload. And as long as your spring leafs have gaps between them you will still get pinion lift
Since this video I’ve been to the drag strip a handful of times and tried different preloads, you’re definitely right about that. I seem to hook up beat at around half a turn.
🔥🔥🔥
hey, i've done a manual swap, had a vibrations on 4th and 5th gear after 60mph, turned out i have a bent axle shaft! (it's a 8 3/4 rear end)
I have the same setup 70 gen 3 Hemi challenger. Im in the process to installing the caltrac. As I can see. You are able tu use your 5/8 bolt from the leaf spring bracket, mine come with a 9/16 bushing. I'm stuck there😥
Nevermind. I've drilled the bushing to 5/8. Now it's installed 🤘
Nice! Well done
Longer shocks a pinion snubber and clamping the spring pack are the traditional fixes
For wheel hop
Beautiful car just saying
Thank you sir
So now that you’ve had them for a year have you messed with them more? Dialed them in? Is the driveability of the car affected (is the suspension any stiffer or does it still ride as nice as it did prior to the cal tracks)?
I have tried different preloads, the ride gets stiffer the more preload you set for sure but with a bit of preload the car launches much harder drag racing. The solid front leaf spring bushings do add a little bit of harshness and vibration. The pin that pushes down on the spring for preload also rattles a bit, but I fixed this for the most part by putting a rubber hose around it. I'd call them a huge help for drag racing and a bit annoying for the street, but not unbearable.
@@noboltsleftbehind I wonder if using a polyurethane front bushing instead of the metal one would work. I’m sure it wouldn’t work as good at the strip, but would cut down on harshness while on the streets.
@@chrisw5837 I thought about trying that, but it would require a bit of engineering. The solid bushing has a sort of second bushing within the bushing that the traction bars connect to.
I have been fighting wheel hop for a while on my torino, I cannot even do a burnout from it. I cannot find the issue
No burnouts? Tragic! Have you tried a set of traction bars like the CalTracs yet? I’ve hear from a lot of people that have had good results from them.
Looks like the pinion rotated much more after CalTracs were installed.
Is it an actual rt car
A four link, or a Watts link would be the best way to completely eliminate that.
Yeah, that’s definitely the ultimate setup. Pretty expensive but maybe someday I’ll upgrade.
@@noboltsleftbehind Look forward to those videos, and the results at the track. 😉👍
How's the car corner with the Caltracs?
No difference that I noticed after installing them. They might even help control body roll a bit.
What size are your Rims?
They're 15", 15x7 in the front and 15x8 in the back.
Has anyone recommended a pinion snubber?
Yes, and I actually do have a factory snubber on there in the videos. I’ve heard the adjustable snubber is the way to go, though my axle is pretty close to the floor and I wondered about suspension travel.
@@noboltsleftbehind i have one as well but my cuda is not running and have no need on my other Mopar cars.
Surprised you needed track bars. Mopar rear suspension is designed so you never get axle wrap since the rear axle sits more forward with more spring in towards the rear.
I was surprised too when I saw the footage. Could be partly due to the fact that I’m running the Hotchkis springs, they’re meant for cornering more than they are drag racing.
@@noboltsleftbehind I bet you the Hotchkis mono-leaf design is the reason. I’ve ran stock springs with 600+ hp and did not have a problem.
that pinion angle is not right.
How so?
@@noboltsleftbehind your pinion angle is going from positive to negative angles under acceleration, this should never happen. The bearings on the u joint caps need a bit of pinion angle for the needle bearing in the u joint caps to rotate, this allows lubrication to happen. Im very surprised your drive line shop did not tell you this.
@@69NOMAN69 I understand the concept of a u-joint working angle, I thought the idea was you didn’t want a driveline sitting at zero angle for prolonged periods of time like at cruising speeds. I’m not sure how you would achieve a permanent downward angle under extreme load (like in the video) with so much pinion deflection? From what I can tell you can see the same happening to my xTerra which is an OEM setup. Unless I’m missing something?
@@noboltsleftbehind been down this rabbit hole with lots of people. If your drive line can maintain a negative pinion angle, even one degree it will stay happy. your 4 wheel drive and your car are 2 very different platforms. The caltracks solved most of your problem but you want about 6 to 8 degrees pinion angle without the caltacks. Just letting you know what works for me. take care.
@@69NOMAN69 thanks for the info, maybe I’ll try out shimming again. I’ve gotten lots of opinions on pinion angle from dead even with the transmission all the way down to 5 degrees off for leaf spring deflection. Right now I’m at about 2 degrees downward shimmed for my CalTracs, I think that’s per their directions.
You were NOT experiencing wheel hop. Your driveline went into NEGATIVE pinion angle under power. You're lucky the driveline stayed in the car.