How To Set Valve Lash on Non Hemi Predator Hisun GX200 Clone engines
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- Опубликовано: 31 окт 2020
- Valve lash is critical to the operation and performance of any small engine. This guide shows you how to set the lash on a Predator 212cc non hemi. You can use this guide for other small engines on your mini bike or go kart.
Check out www.ombwarehouse.com for performance engine parts for Predator 212, Predator 420, and others.
I like how you always get right to business without jabber jawin' like so many others. Also you are thorough and correct in what you say. I appreciate your efforts, they helped me. Thank you.
Definitely just helped me with my brand new 440 duromax. Came out the box not being able to pull the cord all the way. Opened it up and of course the valve lash was set so low. But now it runs like a champ. Thank you!!
So glad this helped you!
Ordered a MB200 stage 1 kit. Havent done the timing key or valve springs yet - it slowed my stuff down. Weird how most places show gains but mine didnt. Bought two MB200s, the stock one is faster - even swapped riders and it was the same. Hoping after I add the key and springs this will change things - good video, showed me how to complete my task.
Greatly Appreciated! I followed an 18# valve spring installation video from another channel that provided loose factory valve lash. I appreciate the details and explanation; I couldn't figure out if i was going too tight or too lose - but you solved my problem by tightening down to .003 then checking to make sure its snug on the .002
Thanks for the detailed video brother! Saved my life!
Love OMB Warehouse better than the OTHER competitors AHEM lol.
Hey nice video I'm going to apply that to my motor I have it attached to a bike I took it off the mini bike a Coleman ct200u and I put it on a fern strong steel frame beach cruiser it does about 54 miles an hour but I'm going to put the 26 lb valve springs in there to see if I can get it to rev higher thanks nice video
Great video. I was referred to this video on FB group. I hope you see this and can help. Coleman CT200U with stock 196cc engine. Only mods are removing throttle limiter screw and zip tie trick on governor spring. Hits about 33mph. I let it set and wouldn't start. Cleaned carb and verified jets were clear. Checked oil, replaced spark plug, new gas and swapped carb with known good carb. Starts now but dies when I give it gas. At 33 mph I'm told I may have floated valves. Not sure if I need 18lb springs or trashed the engine
Any help is greatly appreciated.
Great video awesome info. Im building from 3 buckets of parts, no idea how to tell if lash caps were used or not. Can you tell me what to look for so its correctly assembled?
Hey Grey goat! Just discovered your channel. I have a 196cc Ct200u-ex I've had for 9 months. I want to make sure my valve lash is good, but they are a little loose from the factory clearances. Should I set them tighter? I have a Mikuni, Torque converter, Straight pipe and govenor is bypassed. I don't know if that matters when setting it tighter or not. Thanks
Wouldn’t the lash get tighter as the motor gets hot ? Could you speak a little on this so I can understand ? Thanks for all your hard work and your wisdom God bless.
Thanks for very necessary info😊
Thank you sir, very informative
What is the stock length for push rods on a Coleman 196cc clone and how important are push rod length ?
So I've got a billet rod with a flat top piston and 26lb springs with champion rocker and my firend told me to put it to .00 and I did that and it sorta work I've got the engine running but sometimes does after so what would u recomend putting the valve lash too?
I did this when I installed my new 26 lb springs on my hemi predator as part of a stage 2 kit and during a test run a spring broke, the people I bought it from said it was my fault for a couple reasons... I was over reving it, I didn't check for valve I forget the term 😅 spring smash... every thing looked good when I set it. It ran great. I never went past 6k peak rpm not driving at 6k but peak like 0 to where I feel the engine shake as a test run. Nothing crazy. Every thing in the engine was fine the only damage was only to the one spring, the valve, and a spot on the piston where it pushed the valve through the head.
Sounds like a mis aligned cam
If coil bind was the issue you would have bent pushrods.
With race type parts things can happen! Maybe it was just a bad spring assuming you have a stock cam
The Hemi head has shallow spring pockets and we really need to keep the lift under .300”
Great video!
Going to try this today after yesterdays defeat. I was setting valve lashes terribly wrong.
Can I do the same step for 22lbs spring?
Hey Mr maybe you can help me out I bought a predator motor last year and the winter and I used it in the spring probably ran good I had the mud motor 105-in shaft on it ran good about 5 or 6 times out seven by seventh time out sort of making a noise like that I would drive for about 20 minutes and then all of a sudden it would go into like a bad vibration and I thought it was the shaft so when I came home and took a shift off started the motor headed to bed 10-15 minutes did the same thing and of course my warranty was up so I couldn't take it back I missed it by like 2 days no I was just wondering if you could help me out I'd appreciate it thank you
Can I ask why do you put them at .003 each and other people say .004x2 and things like .003/.007?
Different cams require different valve lash
I got a 224cc predator stock just put a bigger carburetor and no governor and oil sensor off what would yall recommend like the metal things that he’s using size or what point I should use someone help me plz
Tengo una A-¡power dr 2700 psi es de 6.5HP Cual seria la calibracion correcta
I also have my pool start in that same position great minds think alike
Thanks for video-
Gray goat, I just recently installed 18lb springs in my non hemi predator 212 and my minibike is actually 4mph slower now. Any ideas or insight on what may have caused this? Thanks
There is no reason it should be slower unless the valve lash was not properly set. I don't believe this has anything to do with the valve springs. If you have removed the governor and you are still using the stock connecting rod, it may be starving for oil and us getting ready to exit the block!
So I set the valve lash and it pulls easy but bro it don’t wanna start im kinda worried but I pulled out the spark plug and it was black so I’m hoping it was just the spark plug I ordered a whole lotta spark plugs because I was freaking out
Is it ok to set my valve lash at .002 on my exhaust and intake on a honda clone 212cc non hemi engine? I'm replacing my valve springs with 18lbs.
Yes. That is fine. I will set some of my engines at.001” to .0015”. These engines expand when hot and tight lash does not cause any issues
Just got my upgrad kit for my 212 non hemi. (Billet rod/flywheel. Mod 2 cam). At first when i put everything together i like to spin the engine by hand to see if it clears everything. But at opposite of tdc theirs a clicking noise, which by checking it, its the intake lifter thing by cam, whwn its about to press on it, it sounds. So send an email to OMB & they said it was maybe the valve release but it wasnt. So went ahead & decided to turn it on & engine is really noisy & hard to pull, stock cqm is quiter & runs good. (I have video posted)
Going to try this again by adjusting valves & hoping this is my issue.
I am the tech guy at OMB!
Please understand that it is very difficult to diagnose issues when I can’t see or touch the engine
If the engine is hard to pull the engine over the valve lash was not set correctly
@@TheGrayGoatGarage ruclips.net/user/shortsuNPvT379Z7c?si=DXExxvHit_6fZhyJ
This is what it was doing. This noise is coming from the intake valve lifter & opposite on timing from tdc..
I will adjust valve lash tomorrow 🤞 hoping 1 its easier to start & 2. hoping the noise is quieter.
@@TheGrayGoatGarage ruclips.net/user/shorts8gxBpLjuplo?si=SOCw3McR01g3r6uc this is how it sounds. Stock cam is quiter & runs good. With billet flywheel & rod.
My nephews 212 is also hard to pull the starter, the 2nd pull is hard. So will.adjust valve on that one too!
Kinda excited now
@@oswaldocastillo6305 it sounds like something inside is hitting!
@@TheGrayGoatGarage only sounds with the mod 2 cam, stock cam its all normal. The first link, its something in the intake lifter. I put exhaust first & spin engine to hear the noise & nothing, until i put the intake one it sounds that clicking noise. & engine soins smoothly tho, doesnt feel like anything is grabbing.
Also dud oil sensor & gov delete.
Thanks 🙏
Well done ty
Please whats the tool he used to measure the lash like the little metal sheet thingies
It is called a feeler gauge
www.ombwarehouse.com/feeler-gauge-0015-to-015.html
I got a 224 with billet rod flat top piston and a tts thunderstix ghostbuster camshaft and 26lb springs and I’m getting bad kickback I clearanced the cam and crank a bunch and it’s always very hard to pull I set my lash good nothing is hitting idk what the issue is
Valve lash! If you pull the spark plug out and it pulls over fine, reset the lash!
Set at .002” on both sides and make sure you are at TDC on the COMPRESSION stroke
99.9% of the time loose lash is the issue!
My clone was running a little sketchy when fully hot and run hard for awhile. So I took the note here about how this design can get loose when hot ... I couldn't locate the .002 gauge at first and set them with .0015.
Being that .002 is already tighter than spec, .0015 was way too tight. I got one backfire out of the exhaust and nothing more. Engine was super easy to pull because there was now zero compression now: I removed the spark plug again and never felt any air when rotating the engine. So yeah, after you adjust, rotate that engine again and check that aspect also.
I used the .003 gauge and set them there. I didn't have a chance to verify hot performance but it started easy and had very snappy mid range power.
Overall it was kind of a pain and I'd never say I was super confident in the clearance I achieved, partly because without a mirror or some way to observe the piston, TDC using this method is "close" but not exact. You can easily rotate the crank _some degrees_ at "TDC" this way, which of course isn't truly accurate unless you also witness where the timing mark is.
Hello, I was just wondering what brand pull starter handle that is on your engine? Thanks
That is the stock pull start handle that came with the engine
Question. I have a new 212 non-Hemi predator engine. I put 18lb valve springs in it. ( did a stage 1 upgrade kit)
I’ve been reading that the non Hemi has 1 lash cap. I’m concerned because I was careful but I do not remember ANY lash caps when I took it apart. I’ve heard the new non-Hemi engines don’t have any. Is my engine that new? I’m freaking out a little. Thank you!
The Predator 212 non Hemi engines do not come with any lash caps! You are not losing your mind! You are fine!
@@TheGrayGoatGarage phew!!! Thank goodness!
Thank you!
I feel no pressure pushing my thumb at all. Could that be a sign that I’m loosing compression somewhere?
If you felt no pressure it could be three things. A valve was open. You were in the exhaust stroke. Or the rings are shot.
Chances are the rings are fine.
Try it again and watch the rockers. Make sure both rockers loosen up when the piston is at TDC
Nice!
Help me I did what you did in the video and my mind bike is still not running right and still hard to pull what can you do to help me
Hi Braden,
I can tell you to do it again. There are two top dead centers on a four stoke engine. The lash must be set at TDC on the compression stroke when both valves are closed. If you have set the lash on the exhaust stroke the lash will be too loose.
When the lash is too loose the decompression lever on the cam will not "burp" the exhaust valve open to relieve the cylinder pressure. That is why the engine pulls over hard
How do know which one is the compression stroke
Pull the spark plug out, put your thumb over the hole, and rotate the engine. The exhaust stroke will feel like it is sucking in the compression stroke will force your thumb off the hole. Get to TDC and set your lash
Ordered a 224 power kit from you with 1.3 black venom roller rockers, set them to .000 valve lash, running strong! Just wanted to know your thoughts on setting them at .000? Good, bad, pros and cons? Thanks !
Do it on a hot engine and you are fine... do it on a cold engine, give it .003
What makes the bowels come off the rocker arms but it's running
Bowels?
Great reference points I should just write it down but it’s just as easy watching video again I’m on motor build #3 and I always get something different out of each time watching the video 💪🏾🫡 3:12
Eric, been having kick back on starting and went to readjust lash. Basic build. Champion rockers, 22lb springs, mod 2 cam, non hemi with factory 5mm valves/split retainers. I was thinking of adding lash caps because with the champion rockers the adjusters sit down in the valley of the retainers and it's hard to get the feeler in and get an accurate measurement. I got the appropriate length pushrods, but just seen someone with a similar setup that looked like the adjusters beat the hell out of his stems that didn't have caps. I ordered some titanium valve stem caps/rotators. Any thoughts on this? I had posted in I've group and got crickets. Scoured Google and nothing definitive. Hoping you'd have some wisdom to share with me.
Lash caps are always a good idea! Use them at every opportunity. The lash caps for 5mm stemmed valves are very hard to find and not something we have access to. I would consider shorter pushrods to get the adjuster further out. I have only seen the issues with Champion rockers and dual or 36# springs in big cams. Let me know if you can find 5mm lash caps. Everything is geared to 5.5mm stems and those caps are not correct for you!
www.ombwarehouse.com/pushrod-length-checker-small-block.html. I use this tool to get the proper valve train geometry. This allows you to mock things up and get the correct length pushrods. There are way too many variables in Chinese engines to have a one size fits all” approach and everything needs to be checked!
@@TheGrayGoatGarage thanks Eric. I of course checked to find them with you first as always. I did find them from an EBay seller who I've used for some hard to find oddball stuff a few times. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide your knowledge.
@@TheGrayGoatGarage it's in my ever expanding cart now 😁
Welp I don't have a feeler gauge so I went off how lose they where and bam first pull it started
is that signed picture of the atagonist from Toy Story 2? that is so cool lol
The warehouse makes surprises for me and I like that one a LOT!
What measurement do i put the intake valve
Between .015 and .030
Stock length billet rod mod 2 cam 24mm mukini carburetor 10k rpm cast iron flywheel 22 lbs valve spring in a non hemi predator 212 ..... valve lash too its currently st at 0.003 and it wont crank
What does “it won’t crank” mean? Will it not pull over? Or does it not start?
Do you have spark?
Does the engine pull easily without the spark plug in?
@@TheGrayGoatGarage it does not start yes it has spark pulls over easy with spark plug out
the feeler gauges i bought start at the lowest .005 dont ineed .002
Yep! You bought the bigger set. Look for the feeler gauges that go to .001”
Does this apply to predator 212 gen 3 non Hemi??? Thanks
They are the same its easy job if you get the feeler gauges
Honda EP1000 Engine valve clerance point pls tell me
I don't work on generator engines, but an engine is an engine! Set the lash at .003" on both sides cold. You will be fine!
Is the powerstroke 212 just a rebranded predator 212?
Maybe! Most other brands of 212cc engines do not use Predator 212 parts. They typically use the Honda GX200 rod, cam, and flywheel. There is no way to know unless you can get accurate measurements of the parts!
What wrenches do we need
You need a 14mm and 10mm wrench
I have never seen the exhaust valve lash smaller than the intake valve lash... now quit mething around .... 2 snug on the exhaust that's going to hang open?... am I wrong?
You are incorrect. These engines, unlike automotive liquid cooled engines, expand whey warmed up causing lash to increase.
Set both sides at zero if you are confident in your mechanics skills!
My engine runs fine when idling but cant accelerate
Check or get new carburetor
This took me half the day LoL.
Sad when I know how to do somehting but never did it before.
I got it figured out and i thank you except I had it so messed up once that it wouldn't start, then it started really hard and now the ticking on the exhaust valve is gone.
But now the intake side is noisy, this is when I put the bike away and it was time for a beer.
I will get it tomorrow, only it sucks because I was going to set the lash and ride it at 11am today, around 6pm I finally got to ride it long enough to hear the noise again and for the governor to stick closed(caught up under the gas tank) and scare the **** out of me(I'm new to bikes at 50, things got really torquey fast).
This bike (Axis M200) is so much fun and I feel like a teenager when Im rippin it down the trail near my house everyday.
What happens if you over tighten your valve lash
Imo you had to mess with those cheap chinesium nuts too much.
Great vid though, I watch a lot of your bike vids.
Whats that tool called
The "feeler gauge"?
My engine will start and run but dies after a couple seconds with throttle
That sounds like a carb issue. I would check for a vacuum leak or go to a larger main jet. Too many variables for me to know
Man I can’t even lose or tight the bolt
darn i wish folks use metric like me lol
I feel good to be like 667. Lol. Curse removed!
NO GONNA RUN I?
OO3 FOR IN AND OU??
Yes, I gonna run it!
.003” for intake and exhaust. This is tighter than the factory specs but help the engine start easier and run better!
I watched it at 1.75 speed. More watchable that way.
OMB > GPS
I like to know why my post was removed?" It was a sensible question.
What was it?
Why did the Chicken cross the road ?
All I want is the number lol
What number? The lash should be set at .003”. Is that what you need?
If you truly believe what the hard-core go kart racers say about about the .003 lash then why did you set them at .002-.003??
The hard core ho kart racers set lash at zero. That is not something I want to relay to someone that does not have a lot of engine building experience! Keep in mind these engines expand as they get hot.
Most cam cards call for .003” lash and that is the best setting for most stock to mildly modified engines
😂 you got so many spanners
I like tools and still have the first tools I got for Christmas 42 years ago!
5:51 .0015 is not 15 thousands. Carefully out there, math be real hard.
My apologies. I should have said "15 TEN thousandths". I sincerely apologize
NOT 15 thousandants,,, 1 and 1/2............. .0015 " is NOT 15 thousandants!!!!
OMGosh! I am so sorry. Yes. You are correct. It is 15 TEN thousandths
Please accept my apologies
Does it really matter that much?
If it does then you watched wrong video.
It especially won't start right if your intake valve is to loose since it hits the the lobe on cam that actuates decompression....motor will snatch cord outta your hand and break shit. So both valves equally important