The things that Sonos doesn't dare tell you (but I will)
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- I cover (or is it uncover?) details of the Sonos Sub Mini that you might not already know. So find out more before you place your pre-order. Actually, these information are all in plain sight. But I will analyse it and share its significance, and what it really means to you.
*** Rob Hargraves pointed out that I said at the 10:53 mark, "the sub mini is the first sub that Sonos has produced that is NOT sealed". I meant to say that the Sub mini is the first sub that Sonos has produced that is SEALED.
Big thanks to Rob for pointing it out and everyone please take note!
Sub Gen 1/2/3 - PORTED
Sub Mini - SEALED
If you found my work useful and would like to support it, please visit my Patreon link to contribute to my coffee fund! : / peterpee .
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Good examination of the specifications. I'd add that while the surface area of the Sub Mini's drivers compared with the Sub, we must also expect the excursion to be lower on the Sub Mini and also for it to have a lower powered amplifier based on the selling price. So, total output is not only a function of cone area.
I don't have a close up shot of the Sub mini in action, but if I show you a video, you can actually, just maybe, glimpse that the cone excursion is something of a small wonder... Let's see about that. :) Can't wait to test out for sure!
HI Peter, I have always enjoyed your detailed and easy to understand videos but am not sure why you need to spend most of the video justifying why your channel is different! It’s rather cringey to keep hearing le. Believe in your channel approach and strength! Discerning viewers (like me hehe ) can easily tell without any scientific tests. LOL.
Oops! Ok, feedback taken. :) Thanks for sharing and appreciating!
100% agree. Peter, you have a niche of your own and your content speaks for itself. By over-pitching yourself you are diluting your own messaging.
It’s for new subscribers. Not everything is about you 😂
Agree!! 3 minutes of self promotion is very cringe indeed.
I was thinking of commenting the exact same thing but didn't want to come across as rude. The truth is every time I watch these reviews, I automatically think "Wow this is some in-depth stuff, that no other reviewer does". I can safely assume that most of Peters viewers think the same way too, so it doesn't need to be mentioned tbh.
Glad someone mentioned it. Even more respect to Peter for taking it in the right spirit! Keep up the awesome work!
My take from you is the Sonos Arc and the sub-mini in a medium to large room will suffice?
Waited more 5 years and I’m going to buy it. I don’t care what they say it’s good to pair with. It will be good for the Arc and Beam and everything in the line.
Haha... spoken like a true wireless audiophile!
I find your videos very informative. I’m new with sonos and learning a lot from you. Thank you for your service.
You are most welcome John.
If you build it they will come(and subscribe).. but if you give a really bad sales pitch why you are better, they will not come(and subscribe). Keep it up and thank you Peter for your videos. I use your videos to learn about everything i need help with and my confidence making a decision/purchase is the most confidence ive ever experienced ever about anything ever in my life... wish i could feel that way in my love life, abilities and others.. keep it up and just remember this counterintuitive truth nugget about getting subscribers. You havent heard anywhere else i promise you i will be the only one to give you this info you wont find anywhere else; -a quick fast subtle statement to subscribe, will get you more subscribers then any other strategy, in fact the more people over think (being funny clever or anything long winded or repeated) the more us viewers will go out of our way to not subscribe or simply click out of the video or pretty much do the opposite of anything you want us to do. Anyways, as far as ur videos content and everything you do A+++ %100 Thank you for your time and effort i always watch your videos id be lost without them being unhappy stuck with 2 sonos 5's with 2 beams; instead of 4 sl's 2 subs and an arc hahah (sonos humor if u dont get it u dont know).
Lol
He's right^^ also thank u im preordering 2 mini subs! Thank u for sealing my decisions peter!
Peter: My Gen 3 Sub weighed in @ 29.2 lb. FYI.
Thanks for the help! Yeah. That confirms what I measured too.
Excelent video Peter, thanks. Curious to see how Sub mini’s larger drivers will perform against Gen 3’s smaller drivers but with more space and ports.
Looking forward for your tests as always 😊
Good question and those are the points I am wondering to myself.
I recall alot of the beam gen 2 vs Arc reviews early on where like “it’s an Arc killer!”
now a year later we know it’s no competition - apples to oranges just like this sub mini apples to oranges to the sub gen 3
Well I would not call the beam 2 an arc killer but it is a nice little soundbar that sounds surprisingly well with music in my opinion. Regarding music, even better than the arc but that is my personal opinion.
Yeah, I guess that is part of the initial hubris surrounding a new product launch. Let's really test this new sub and see how it performs!
@@PeterPee yes sir!
I found the sub mini perfect to pair with our BEAM Gen2+Era100’s for our master bedroom system. It’s perfect for our tv shows.
Thanks!
Thank you too!
Peter. I just weighed mine. G2 sub is 32.6lb , G3 is 29.0
Fantastic! Thanks for your help! And so you have both! :)
@@PeterPee yes. Believe it or not I have one of each!
Thank you for the info , you definitely know sonos. I watched the video but wasn't sure weather or not the sub mini is sealed o right not. Is the sub mini actually Sealed?
I‘m looking forward to see you do the frequency response sweeps of the mini and compare it to the gen 3 as well as the overall sound of both compared!
Maybe the future best setup will be with one of each subs to combine their strengths and maybe cancel out some weaknesses?! 🤔
I would be absolutely thrilled if you tried a mixed bass setup for one of your future videos.
Greetings from Austria and as always: great content, keep it up!!!
Great video again! Thank you! Going to weigh my Sub Gen3 soon…
Thanks Keith!
fantastic video and great details, as always Peter. As soon as I heard about the sub mini.. I thought peter is going to compare the volume and driver area of the sub gen 3 and the mini.. and Lo and behold!
I've already checked the weight of my sub gen 3 from the previous videos and it checks out. :)
Cool! Thanks for your support all along!
Thank you for your detail video. I just got a two questions. I recently got the Arc and want to add rear speaker. Would the seal speaker a better choice like Sonos ones SL or the port speakers like the Ikea frames. Leaning toward the frame to save space but if the difference is big then I will go with the ones SL. Thank you
Thanks Peter for another great video. I love the setup of your videos and the depth of information you share. You definitely pulled me into the Sonos eco system ;)
Damn, I really need to apply for the job of a Sonos salesman.
I have Arc and two One SLs. Do you think it is worth considering adding the Sub Mini? Mostly for music...
I actually think it's worth even getting the Sub Gen 3, the bigger one. I am a big proponent of subwoofers so....
Hi Peter If i use ARC+sub mini for movie is it good ?
Hi Peter which one should go better with the playbar. The sub gen 3 or the sub mini?
Depends on room size. Big room go for sub gen 3. Smaller than 250 SQ feet probably good with sub mini.
@@PeterPee thanks a lot I
I have the bean (Gen 2) and a par of SL. This is exactly what was missing from my current setup. I did the preorder, I hope I did not make a mistake
I think you might find this to be the second best decision after buying the beam.
Great content Peter. I am just disappointed that you said the mini could be more of a music sub, rather than a movie sub, because if i did get the mini, it would be mainly for movies………hope your reviews will tell a different story.
These are just speculatory at the moment, based on whatever info is out there. And yes, it could change when I test it. And also note the the difference in theory may not translate to difference in actual use.
Nice review. Thanks a Ton. One Thing o don't get. How is the Sub Mini compensating the Fact, that it is sealed ?
We are not going deep into sub design. Sealed subs usually require a slightly more powerful amp than an equivalent ported sub if you want the same level of output. But ported subs require amps with high damping factor to STOP the cone when the bass notes stop else they end up sounding flabby and sloppy. At this point, we don't have much other info cos we haven't tested it yet.
Can 2 of the Sub Minis be paired up?
No can’t
can’t wait for a comparison
I can’t wait too!
Ok so the sub mini has more surface area. I would like to know what the excursion of each driver is compared to the gen 3. Do you have any information about driver excursion for both models?
No. This is not publicly announced information. I made a video on that before...Let me find it.
I have Arc - do you think new Sub mini would pair well since the soundbar is not a sealed design and doesn't it really matter or play a significant role compared to pairing Arc with last gen sub vs new sub mini?
The Arc is a sealed design. But really, I think it doesn't matter that much. I think I might have not been super clear in my video but the difference will be small when it comes to design consideration.
Does anyone know when the embargo is up?
Which side of my mortar board should I place the tassel??
Haha... Arnie, all of us on this channel are graduated from Sonos' rabbit hole, and then some. So maybe wear it on both sides now.
@@PeterPee 20 products purchased or gifted to date. I am now approaching the center of the earth. Wifie does not wish to hear the word SONOS any longer.
So, if there is more area but it’s sealed vs the sub does that mean they will probably sound similar?
Hard to tell... Cos we don't know the amplification power as of now. And sealed vs ported sounds very different depending on many factors, including the port size and design.
Can you do a ported vs sealed sub video at some point unless you’ve already done such a video..
Love it !!!
Thank you!
Hi Peter. I have been waiting for this Sub Mini to complete my collection , however i got more confused as i watched your videos. I have a Beam Gen 1 with One SL for surround. I am using them to watch RUclips and movies. Based on your research, the Sub Gen 3 would be a better choice for me as you mentioned its good for movies. Should I go for the Sub Gen 3 instead considering my requirement and also from pricing-point, it is about $200 difference to the Sub Mini. Your advice is very much appreciated. Thank you !!
I have not heard the sub gen 3 and sub mini together at the same time before. I was just commenting based on use case. If you are really into movies, a ported sub would be great.
But it’ll be best if you wait for my review. When I have a chance to test both subs side by side.
@@PeterPee Thank you for the reply. Will wait for your review. Have a good weekend!!
Will mini perform better for music's with Arc + one sl as surround?
Not sure yet. I need to test it to know.
So , the first secret of the sub mini is ... drum-roll.... it has a smaller volume (so it's actually smaller !) and weighs less then the sonos sub ..... wow who would have guessed that !. What a detail many of us would have missed !
Loved the video!
Really wanna buy the sub because that’s the only missing piece to my setup, but already broke the bank so it will be for next year maybe… still looking for a sugar mommy/daddy 😂
Keep up the great content!
Thanks for your support!
I just bought a black sub gen 3 from Sonos a few days ago, and it weighs 26.2 lbs! Is that normal?
Huh! That sounds odd. Meaning... they actually reduced the weight further? That's quite a bit off. Below a pound difference I can possibly credit it scale calibration but a 3 pound difference sounds real. Are you also sure that your scale is on a flat hard surface?
@@PeterPeeit was on hardwood/laminate flooring when I weighed it. 26.2 lbs... I was surprised. 10 lbs off advertised weight seems odd to me. Should I be concerned? This is my first sub ever.
Can it be paired with an existing sub? (Gen 3)
Nope, apparently not. Saw it on some other channel But I could be wrong.
No.
So long story short, we should be excited for the sub mini?
All I can say is… YES!
how about amplifier or power to move this 6" drivers... it will be the most important at this moment... Thanks a LOT Peter!!!
Yes, I will be testing that too!
How much is the Mini?
429USD.
I've got enough tucked away for a pair of SVS 3000 micro's....
I may have to wait to listen to these first....
Oh... oh... I have ONE SVS SB-3000 micro... Those are so so pretty and are really powerful. I will probably pit those two against each other.
With half the weight and half the sound, there's absolutely no way possible for the mini to get the same 25Hz extension as the sub 3. The mini should get no lower than 50Hz.
Of course it’s not going to get the same levels as the sub gen 3. But 25hz measurement is taken as a relative dip, not at a specific absolute volume levels.
Though you’re clearly right. The output at 25hz will have the sub gen 3 trump the sub mini la.
Pete, they had me at hello.
Yeah! They had me at Hey Sonos!
I was commenting a couple of days ago to a coworker, that Gen 3 Box is lighter
Yeah, I know right? I was first tempted to weigh them because I could tell by feel that it's already lighter.
I hear a lot of comparisons between music and movies, but what about console gaming combined with a sub choice ?
Could you take this in your content ?
Gaming will be similar to movies. The key is the dynamic range of the content. For gaming, there will be quite a bit of loud sounds (assuming guns and bombs like so many games today).
Sub Gen 3 13.40 Kg
There seems to be quite a varied range of weight.
The price in Singapore is ridiculous. They really just pushing it as much as they can. Well I guess the beam will be the last thing I get from them
That’s a lot a words about nothing. Without knowing the linear excursion, BL curve, and input power, there can be no conclusion about anything.
Sub Gen 2 39.2lbs
The variance is so high based on what is reported... This sounds like the heaviest I have heard of a Sub Gen 2.
No news on the 14.15 update???
14.15 is just app update not firmware update on the speakers. 14.16 did drop though and I just released the video.
@@PeterPee Ah. Thankyou...
Just to add a data point: my Sub gen 3 weighs 12.9kg.
Thanks for your help! This is right on point. Mine is about 13.1 to be precise.
Was your first reaction also: WTF does Elon Musk wanna tell me about the Sonos Sub Mini?!😄
I apologize, Peter!🙏
Haha... Oh... The asian version. Hahaha..
Come on Peter, you don’t need to spend 3 minutes before actually talking about the product itself 😂
Damn... I really need to talk less. :) But... I am practicing for my job. :) In my job, I do need to talk quite a bit. Haha..
Mine - Gen 3 is 14.45kg.
Slightly heavier than mine. But still not 16KG. Actually, I am wondering if there are other factors involved, such as when you bought the Sonos Sub Gen 3... hmmm...
It's about $660 here in Malaysia 😅
Wait.. about RM2000 you mean?
@@PeterPee RM2,999 🤣
half the size, half the weight but not half the price, retail for Sgd$869, its too expensive, $200+ more than the USD retail price which is USD$429😏😒
Yeah, I’m struggling with the SGD pricing too.
@@PeterPee it doesn't make sense that the exchange rate is too much difference, Australia retails for $699 which is about the same rate of Sgd, $869 is ridicolous..🤦♂️🤦♀️🤦
@@PeterPee still cannot understand why Sonos decided to price it so high in SG. A S$700-750 would have been much more palatable.
@@ksc9131 im thinking around $650 including gst would be reasonable, at least half the price of the sub gen3 and considering the exchange rate plus gst..but for $869? you can buy brand new Klipsch The Fives for almost the same price..
I suspect the performance is not 50% weaker tho. e.g. 70% similar to subgen - hence the price. I've pre-ordered on installment plan!
Thanks!
Woohoo! Thanks for this!
I don't know if the Sonos sub mini is inferior to its gen 3, but I can say that I have the sub mini connected to my arc, positioned next to my sofa and it even makes the sofa vibrate during explosion scenes. very good and I don't regret buying it. It has fantastic value for money. I bought mine for $343.00 during the year-end holidays. I even leave mine set at -1 because I live in an apartment and it even vibrates the furniture inside the room.
I have the Sub Mini now for already 3 days and I can confirm that the Sub Mini ist an excellent sub for Music and for Moves. I use it in my 40 M2 Living Room togehter with the sonos arc an two One and I#m very happy with the performance. The sub mini boosts the bass of the whole system and takes the bass work away from the arc and improves the clarity and the sound of the arc.
That’s fantastic. Glad to hear that the sub mini is performing even in such a large space.
@@PeterPee i can confirm. Ir works good with sub mini and arc.
Very interesting Peter... Thanks for sharing! Very informative as always!
Thank you Alan!
You are doing a great job. This is the best and clearest video so far. Respect bro!!
I love your content. Thank you for taking the time to be so thorough and informative in all of your videos, the b-roll footage is excellent as well. Very professionally done.
Hey thanks! I thought the B roll could be better. My handling of a camera outside the studio really sucks. :)
I weighted my Sub Gen1. Yes. Gen 1. It is 14.80kg. Hope this help
Hey that’s cool! Nice cos I never had a gen 1 to weigh before!
I have the mini. Its more than sufficient for my living room. It measures 16 ft x 42 ft. At times to much base and I have to turn it down. I think for the average household it is more than adequate for music and movies. I'm quite impressed with it. I have it hooked up with the arc. Excellent results. Thanks for your informative reviews
I can see that Sonos is attempting to bring more into its eco system with the sub mini and I applaud them for this. I feel with the beam in a average sized room the sub mini will be adequate and performance will be good enough for the vast majority of users. The sub gen 3 though will definitely in my opinion be better for those action movies where there are explosions and action scenes, especially in a larger room. I currently have the arc and two SL’s for rear speakers and feel that given the size of my room the sub mini will suffice, if only to release more from the arc. Having said that I do feel the sub gen 3 is the better buy for the long term.
We'll see how it goes in the long run. Most Sonos products do retain value quite well. Actually, the champ of value retention is the Sonos One!
Your videos are amazing and very informative. No need to reassure us..just keep creating these videos.
Thank you, I will! Thanks for the feedback!
This is my first time coming across your videos. I love the details you provided. Good job!
Thanks for putting your appreciation down in writing!
Hey Peter, great video. To collect some data :) My Sub Gen 3 weighs also 13kg
Thanks for this info!
Peter you are extremely smart and very thorough in your videos
Aiyoh, shy la. Thank you!
Pre ordered it yesterday! Can’t wait to hear it now after this video!! Thanks Peter!!
Hope you enjoy it!
Peter my man, you scienced the shit out of the subs and slapped some math like a boss 🔥
Haha, obsession can drive strange behaviour.
I love you Peter! Thank you so much for all your research and advice
Thanks for your support!
I've held off on buying the sub gen 3 because of the cost and the concern of disturbing my neighbors below. Excited to see how the sub mini performs because I really want the mini so that my arc will not have to perform all the bass itself.
And a sealed sub might actually do that trick for you... I seriously think so.
You should have got the beam also 😂
Hi Peter, love your reviews..do you have one for best setup specs using an Arc, 2 Fives and a Sub Gen 3? Thanks!!
Danke!
Thank you!
Thanks!
Thanks for all the work you do. I know this takes time and resources but it's clear you take this seriously and I hope the community continues to support you!
Hey there! Thanks for your very kind support and lovely motivating comments. I love doing what I do but sometimes I do get a little tired and want to just keep away from this. Juggling work isn't easy too. But no fear! This is a busy period and I will get through the ever expanding list of videos to make on the newest Sonos member!
Excellent video Peter! I learned quite a bit from this video especially in the great details on Sonos tech!
I find Sonos Sub mini is overpriced in HK and Singapore by a big margin but I was unable to get a good explanation from the distributor in HK! I have noticed that most retail prices for Sonos products when compared with US Retail prices was around 20% premium in HK, a margin I am willing to pay for considering HK is a smaller market. However, Sonos sub mini are priced at 40% premium after tax and duties (which is 0% in HK) are applied in the aforementioned 2 locations. I wonder if you may have an explanation on why such jump in price just for Sub Mini? BTW, fyi, Singapore @S$869 = US$616 , is also under the similar price premium over US/UK/Australia, i.e. US @US$429/UK @£429/Australia @$699. The premium is enough to cover buying from the US direct and ship over with freight. The worse is that it makes me think twice if I should continue to invest in Sonos. The concern I have is that the huge price premium may reduce Sonos' market share here in HK and drive the distributor to struggle which may risk Sonos supporters without support!
The pricing in HK and SG is indeed marked up quite a bit unfortunately.
Hi Peter, Thks for sharing some details, specially the surface cone. I guess more surface means more power to move them. I would be curious to know the power of the amplifiers..
Another point you did not mentioned: the Mini is not meant to be laid on his side! Stand up only! Contrary to the Sub that can be set in both positions …
Huh! I did overlook that! You are absolutely right!
What if you are into music AND movies?
I’m waiting for your review and then I think my setup will be beam-2 ones-mini
In my heart, that is THE KILLER COMBI for the Sub Mini. But I haven't tested it yet.
Great points! Fantastic work 🔥
Thank you for appreciating!
I want know now buy this for movies sub mini with beam gen 2 or not i don’t want lose my money please answer
I will be releasing that video soon. Please hang on. Finalising the test.
Your channel is just pure gold in terms of home theater and music setups. Thank you very much!
Wow, thanks!
Thanks!
So you just said the sub mini is the first ported sub sonos has ever made and they've only ever made sealed subwoofers. Lol. That's definitely backwards.
I think I mentioned they have only ever made ported subs. The Mini is the first sealed sub. I might have worded it in a confusing manner!
Thanks ! Very informative! When is the embargo off and can we expect you to speak “freely” 😁 ?
Soon! Actually I am noob in this. I don’t even know if I am supposed to talk about the embargo! Haha.
@@PeterPee thanks! Well I guess telling when the embargo date ends isn’t a forbidden thing 😂 but hey… I don’t know the Sonos rules ! Really looking forward to it.
Nice work. It will be really interesting to know that amplifier output draw comparison between the 2 subs. Having the air compression behind the mini with the larger driver area...
Spot on Chris... Questions in my head...
Gen 2 Sub weighed in at 33.3 lbs
Thanks for this data point!
great content
Thanks GW!
Thanks for the info regarding cone surface area. I am very curious about how the mini will sound in the end. It reminds me a bit of the SVS SB3000 micro Subwoofer which I always found awesome…!
Yes! You are right! I have the SVS SB3000 micro and I really REALLY want to pitch the two of them together!
I want to see this battle! This would be such a wonderful study.
@@PeterPee whaaaat XD
Very informative, thank you! More and more seems to push me in the Mini direction.
I am quite smitten with the sub mini! And I definitely want a sealed sub option.
10:53 you said the sub mini is NOT sealed. Is this a mistake Peter?
Oh yes! Thanks for catching that! It is the first sealed subwoofer from Sonos!
Thanks Rob! I have made your comment into the video description! I hope everyone reads it and not get confused!
Thanks
Thank you Aleksandar!
Thanks!
Thank you for the kind contribution!
Thanks!
Hi Joe! Thank you very much for your kind contribution!
Great info as always,, thank you. I just wanted to add , the mini may have a driver cone surface advantage, but without comparing the max end to end linear excursion of the drivers on both units, it may not yeild any meaningful advantages
Great point! Because the excursion of a ported sub usually ends up to be higher. There is less pressure to fight in a open ported design!
If what Bang & Olufsen did with 6" drivers on beolab 28 is a sign to come with active amplifiers and DSP, Sonos sub is going to be a big sounding little unit.
My setup is an Arc, Sub mini and 2 ERA 300’s and i sold my Sub gen2. My sub mini is on the right side of my TV and the port is facing front. Listening to music (bass/treble configured in app) it sounds to my needs. Watching a movie i change the positioning of the sub mini 180 degrees in the app. This will give way more bass to the ERA300’s and Arc. It really is, and that without moving the sub mini physically. Can you explain how this works Peter? Imo the sub mini works with music and with movies by changing this setting in the Sonos v2 app.
Thank you for the great information you give. Question, I have a Gen 3 can I add the mini to be a 2nd sub to my system? Also will you be doing a video on the latest update 4.20??
This was great, thanks mate! Would you suggest the mini would be good enough for a smaller lounge room where music is more my poison rather than action movies. I'm a musician and love a variety of many types of music.. so thinking to add a sub to my arc. Any response is greatly appreciated 👍🏻