A note I forgot to include in this video - a lot of people are commenting that Twitch Affiliate (and partner) exclusivity applies on a stream-by-stream basis. AKA, you could stop a Twitch stream and then stream immediately on RUclips afterward. This is true. So you could do a M-W-F Twitch schedule, T-T-S RUclips for example. People need to realize this IS exclusivity, and Twitch is intentional in their wording here. Livestreaming is already an enormous time investment compared to all other forms of content creation. Sustaining multiple platforms on separate days is ultimate brand dilution - you will get nowhere. Twitch knows this and limits you from restreaming because they understand the power of brand diversification. They don't want to take that chance that you perform better on another platform. They want to lock you in so you gain traction on Twitch or no where. No streamer in the top 10,000 has succeeded by creating separate streams at separate times on separate platforms. My recommended strategy here is to FOCUS - but only after you have the data. If you restream to Twitch, RUclips, Facebook, etc - you will know in 1-3 months what is performing for you. You then make a more informed decision. In marketing this is split testing. You always split test because it gives you more relevant data. In brand building, more relevant data is always good. Do not sign a contract giving away real value and rights in exchange for the $50 Twitch throws at you for your 20 subs. That is not good business. You are worth way more than that. I'm not trying to sell you anything, and I don't care what platform you end up on. What I advocate is for you to make informed, data-backed decisions on where you build your brands. Don't follow my path and definitely don't follow Twitch and their "achievement" program. Work out your own salvation.
I'm an affiliate and have consistent but >20 viewership on twitch after 5 months. I'd like to look into youtube streaming (because I'm turning my vods into youtube videos) but I don't want to leave twitch for a significant amount of time. What do?
I got the affiliate message about a month ago. Read the ToS and about the taxation policy. My gut told me something was off. It felt like I was selling my soul to the devil. Been reading online and viewing posts and with this video it seems like I wasnt too far off. Thanks for the eye opener Devin.
Twitch partner support really is the biggest meme of all time, takes a month to get a response back that doesn't even look to be written by an actual breathing human
It doesn't look like it's written by a human because they most probably have blurbs for each request and all possible responses. I worked for Amazon, hence i know this.
i know a girl who got it in 1 day. She literally made an account 2 days ago, streamed once, and got it the next day. She got an interview with someone at twitch within 24 hours and she came from youtube
@Cameron Norton RUclips ads can be skipped after 5 seconds Twitch will give you a 30 second unskippable ad. Dokatoz runs 6-8 ads EVERY HOUR I do not watch his streams for that reason alone.
@@CaptainAnonymous im not sure about that, u might be right but..hmmmmm.. i think they added ads to all videos now? i often upload copyrighted music though so i do get those ads unfortunately, but as long as i can have the music up i dont mind.. as long as i dont get a copyright strike
@funny twitch doesn’t give streamers the option to turn ads off. Every single streamer I’ve personally spoken with (between 50-75 streamers) have ALL agreed that they would simply turn ads off if they could; ads interrupt content and drive away viewers with no positive in return.
Worth noting: Twitch Affiliate exclusivity applies only on a stream-by-stream basis. Meaning, you can stream on Twitch, and stream on RUclips; you just can't stream to both at the SAME time, like with restream. You CAN stream on Twitch on Thursday and RUclips on Sunday, for example.
I've seen twitch affiliates/partners stream on RUclips first then switch to Twitch afterwards. You're correct in that you can't stream to multiplatform at the same time but people seem to be able to swap between platforms as long as you don't stream to multiple at the same time.
But doesn't it say that twitch owns your content within a certain time frame so if you stream to youtube as an affiliate and get tips isn't twitch obligated to retain the tips or violate you for breach of contract?
@@whatistruth101 No. Twitch is never entitled to tips given off-platform. Twitch owning your stream for 24 hours simply means you can't multistream, nor can you post any clips to YT or social media for 24 hours. (the latter is almost never enforced and Devin breaks this by uploading this video fewer than 24 hours before the stream it was made on.)
Yeah, It hit me hard in the way that I have tons of value, But no one that buys it. I got called a fraud and a scam without even bringing up the topic of money. So the entire Provide value thing is busted. I have acomplished so much just towards streaming, have I got any value back from it? no, not really. I got experiences that can be defined as value - But I can't use it to anything, so its not that great value after all.
@@JostoneHD "yeah, It hit me hard in the way that I have tons of value, But no one that buys it" What you are showing is that you have no empathy towards your audience. If nobody is buying your stuff its because you arent providing value to your audience. Just because you think its valuable doesnt mean its valuable to your audience. Find out what your audience thinks is valuable then give it to them.
@@JostoneHD You are confusing personal value with product value. you are not the product, your content is. You have value, your audience has decided your product does not. if you start taking product value as personal value, you are going down a bad path that will lead you nowhere but heartache. It's also possible that your product does have value, but you're not marketing to the right people.
@@shawnemployee6906 if the feedback I get from those that watch it and it shows to be valued then it has value. It has nothing to do with personal value.
@@EmmyDereest I m not mixing anything. I had one guy in my chat, he left because he was the only one there, but he loved my content. And I have learned away valorant strats, I have had some funny content where I quote "this is the best I've seen getting back on socials" from my audience. It has nothing to do with personal value. I know my content is valuable. And when streaming, you are the product, people come to your stream to watch you. Why are you watching tim when there might be better warzone players out there? Because it's tim, and you watch him for his personality... gosh.... and i thought for a moment the youtube comment section was actually friendly and understanding...
Of course it’s right. Pretty much every popular streamers other than the OGs blew up because of RUclips. Twitch sucks ass until you have a big audience.
@@FizzyCape ur wrong. RUclips has more discover ability, but watch stream scheme. They have a lot of tips on streaming. You don't have to be big to grow on twitch
Just a note: *All contacts are negotiable.* You can work with Twitch to modify parts a contract before you sign. If they refuse, you can simply not sign. I know several partners who don't have exclusivity in their contracts.
They just added that function with channel points that does keep watch time, "Predictions". I spent 2 more hours on a channel than I would have, cuz I was betting points.
the "Predictions" thing Twitch implemented doesn't even work for my area/country and neither does the ''watching ads for bits'' do, so idk what the point of it is
Me who has been on and off for 4 years at this point, stuck on average views, never once getting above 2 despite getting more followers - saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame
Yeah for me that's twitter and tiktok and the only thing stopping me from meeting the requirements is the amount of days I've streamed because I only just started
Basicaly the only reason I sub to many channels is for the emotes. I kinda think hes underestimating their value. Ive literally used streamers emotes in a diff stream and had the person go "woah thats a cool emote" and then find that persons twitch.
I just want affiliate for the channel points. Idk what he means by they’re useless. I see small streamers coming up with cool ways to use them and people have fun with them. 🤷♀️ but I do see big streamers not even come up with anything cool for theirs so I guess that’s why he said that
Very interesting video as usual and interesting topic. While i agree that for smaller streamers (less than 10/15 ccv average) your points are all valid and affiliate status is pointless and all those threads on the /r/twitch subreddit about "grinding toward affiliate" are insane, i disagree that people should never become one. As for bigger affiliates that haven't reached partnership size yet in the 30/50 viewer range ( while you're growing your brand etc) that consitute probably less than 10/20% of the whole affiliates lots of them make decent income from twitch and have more than 50/100 subs, and at that point the money could be used to grow your brand more and invest in your stream , like for exemple use that money pay an editor to grow your youtube channel or emote artist to have actual decent emotes that increase viewer chat engagement , or literally pay to promote your twitter etc. in addition the exclusivity clause is a big meme imo , they never enforced it for affiliates and if they one day start to do it will only happens once you reach a decent size for them to even notice you since it's a report based system (for partners) so TLDR if you're big enough for the exclusivity clause to be an issue, you're already big enough to get partnership so it's a non issue the transcoding priority is a big selling point IMO as there is still lots of people who watch on mobile or don't have fiber, and not having transcoding could lose you some potential viewers in addition about the ads, recently the ads revenue have increased on twitch and streamers with a 50 avg ccv can reach the $100/month with just ads (if they play manual ones) and also disable prerolls Also an other key point is the "community appartenance" feeling that your viewers might get once they're subscribed to your channel/have that status in your discord and might incite them to become superfans and increase your viewer retention and engagement as people are more likely to keep watching you after they've spent $5/month on your channel and you can also snipe gift them if they post nice comments to incite them to come back more often (as you often do yourself in your stream) and you can't do that without affiliate status. so again an affiliate with 30/50 ccv can reach 300 to 500 dollars per month and at that point this income isn't negligeable either to re invest in your brand or if you're just starting out, do it part time as a student etc , under the 20 viewers threshold i agree that it's pointless though and i would prefer if twitch actually increased the barrier to entry to that status but as you mentioned, smaller affiliates bring them lots of money so no chance they'll ever do it. hell i'd even suggest people to not take partnership under 200/300 ccv and stay an affiliate and keep restreaming to youtube and other platforms to grow even more and only take partnership after. Aways thanks for reading my ted talk :)
Very interesting reply! For me, Devin seems to suggest more that if your long term goal is to have a sustainable income from streaming/content that the affiliate is not a good decision as it doesn’t benefit you as much as they want you to believe. When it DOES you’re likely already at the partner level. How many people do you think are in the middle ground, not partnerable yet have significant benefits from Af? How many do you think are honestly content at level? How many want to make it their full time gig? IMO those in the middle ground are the most subject to burnout and won’t last as long as hobby streamers or the larger career content creators..
@@Desopolis So the thing is that if your long term goal is to have that sustainable income from streaming, getting affiliate is first a good first step to see what type of income you can generate regularly , 2 not obligatory but veeeery incited to go through it by twitch themselves if you want to get partnership one day, as often they ask partnership applicants to have affiliate and have 50 or more paid subscribers before getting partnered once they reach the 75+ viewer count . as for how many people are stuck in that middle ground generating in the $500/$1000 a month ish and not getting enough to get partnership yet, i'm not sure but considering that there is over 400K affiliates and 40K partners i'd say it's probably a fair number, like 5/10K different creators and even if the number would be only 1000 that's still a significant number of people. yeah i'd agree that the middle ground people are the most subjects to burnout as they have to grind extra hard creating content on all platforms to grow and reach higher numbers but might not make enough income to pay someone to help them , or enough to quit their day job. it's a rough place to be as they can imagine seeing themselves grow but are sometimes stuck in that zone
@@Saysera the requirements for partnership I think is the most driving point to me in that argument, but I still think I would plan for a delay.. For me personally, I’m not exactly sure which platform will be best for the types of content I want to produce. I’ve seen streamers of all kinds on Twitch but I won’t be doing much if any gaming. I think growing any platform to a point where my viewership is at the partnership level would be the first step even if I would hypothetically make a slight bit more money before that point. I can see there would be some hinderance by not having some of the offerings or notifications of subs but I think I can mitigate that using third parties. As to “how much” I’d be using a lot of math/assumptions for a while for sure.. Totally not typical for most affiliates but Another issue is I’ve been doing some crazy experimenting with equipment and trying to create new ways viewers can engage. Twitch plug-ins allow for a lot of amazing things but RUclips has very very strong 360 support.. So I think I would also want to work those things out
@@Desopolis yeah that's why i'm against straight up not taking affiliate ever, cause unless you can start on twitch with already over 100 viewers , then you'll have troubles getting partnership and any income before you get it as for which platform fits certain content better that's a whole other discussion yeah , i'm sure some stuff would work better on youtube or facebook because of the culture and demographic of the users on those platforms but growing your viewership to the partnership level first might be hard and long , and if you generate next to no income doing it it might be hard to commit to doing it and not give up yeah the different extensions or 3rd party tools you can use or create to increase viewer engagement would definetly be a valid factor in chosing a platform over an other imo
I've said this many of times during my content: "make your own goals, celebrate your own milestones, and celebrate your achievements that you created with your community". Never jump for the carrot that is dangled in front of you by someone else.
As an Affiliate on twitch who only streams because I enjoy it, I think affiliate isn't that bad of a deal. It hasn't affected my streams whatsoever, all the points made in this video are still valid though. I have earned £40 out of £100 to get the payout and while it is frustrating, again, I stream for fun, and all that money is from people who genuinely want to support me. I won't stop streaming for a good while as things are going because I love it! so when that payout eventually comes it'll be rewarding. I know that twitch takes quite clearly an unfair amount of the money, however, I have frequently promoted my own Patreon page and my normal streamlabs donation page as an easier option for me receive (almost) the full amount, however, viewers see twitch as a far easier medium to support streamers on, for example, twitch prime subs, which aren't available for non-affiliated streamers. Another thing I want to add is from my personal experience, almost ALL of my most loyal viewers are ALWAYS competing for more channel points, I think its a very fun and creative way to get viewer engagement and interaction. of course, I'm only talking from my own personal experience. Please know this is my own personal opinion, however. You just have to take into consideration what you want from streaming and make a decision based off of that :)
As an independent musician and a gamer as well I could never imagine giving my likeness away that's career suicide before it even goes anywhere...I am noticing how there are similarities in the music industry and the gaming industry with predatory business practices notably the Twitch situation as well as how things are being handled with call of duty league
Same. My ears perked up as soon as he said it. I understand Twitch requests this so that they can fully exploit content if need be but that kind of power for a platform that screwed creators with DMCA's isn't something I'm for giving over when you have better options.
Ironically as an Affiliate you don't do that. At all. No idea why Devin is thinking that Affiliate contracts are doing that. Maybe he misremembers a partner contract with affiliate contracts.
I mean he’s already made it there. How anyone else would review a page if you’re already long time settled and have experience. He doesn’t have to worry about it, but it’s to help any other person wanting to dedicate themselves. There’s thousands of people that stream thinking they’ll make it big or something, but depending on solo or squad of peoples probably only 1 squad and like 2 solo streamers are gonna somewhat be successful.
@itsDannyRoy Well he has his own audience that he appeals too, I don’t take it that way, but although the comparison is different, I mean you could crap on something and still use/play/ equip it etc. There’s games I spent years on and hate to this day and I’ll always tell people not to play it, but I still do it myself. I’m sure he sticks around cause.. I mean he isn’t like a top 20 streamers I don’t believe or anything like that, so unless forced off the platform there’s no reason for someone to stop using it. Look at ninja and shroud going to mixer, yeah they got a big pay through contract with the company, but set of top 5 streamers at the time if not still currently went way lower on mixer, vs whoever was top 10 on Twitch. So like, imagine for this guy. Lol.
The bits annoyed me too, why be affiliate and tell others not to, even if you already made it? His brand is sold to Twitch too then and he doesn't care?
I'm an affiliate and I have no regrets. In fact, I get way more money from subs that anything else. I've tried other platforms and don't like. It's important to point out that the exclusivity is ONLY that you cannot stream to multiple platforms at the same time. I stream to Twitch on weekdays, and I stream to RUclips on Saturdays. Twitch has grown slowly due to networking, but I'm now seeing more traffic from my RUclips videos. i see no problem with becoming an affiliate. I do, however, see a problem with becoming a partner. If I were a partner, I could not divide up my streaming schedule.
@@AtomiicPC It's a classic case of denial, when someone accepts a bad deal they will try to justify it with "no regrets" and "I'm doing so well right now" instead of thinking about the reality which is "wow I could've had a much bigger platform" "I've just locked myself in"
How is it going? I've been considering streaming, obviously on Twitch first but then I stumbled on this video and have been considering multistreaming as of like... 20 seconds ago. My main worry about YT or even FB is that I feel like it's not as easy to make a community
yea i would keep your opinions to yourself, I'm a small time affiliate streamer with a couple thousand followers, I make on a low end about $1,500 a month. Income has to do with viewer demographic; completely removing the ability to make income at all is just bad advice.
This video is quite arrogant. There’s no reason on being dedicated to streaming on RUclips unless you’re monetized. On Twitch, not only can you earn money from subscribers, gifted subs and many more, even if Twitch does take a cut you’re still earning more than you would streaming on RUclips as a small creator.
I mean I never thought achievements were huge milestones anyways lol, they're fun little bonus goals, just like Xbox Achievements; They don't reward you with anything but they feel rewarding to get.
Bits: I know having Twitch make money doing nothing isn't ideal, but just like when I used SuperChats on RUclips, I still notice an overall increase in revenue due to convenience for many people. Transcoding: I stream in 1080p, if I don't have transcoding available, people leave because they think my stream is lagging when it's them that have shitty internet. I've also had MANY complaints that the screen is "black" on the mobile app, and I know it's because of their bandwidth limitations on their phones.
or codec support :( I think transcoding is the big thing that keeps these platforms so monopolistic, it's alot of computational power to transcode everything live with decent latency. With video you can self-host and transcode as part of a rendering pipeline, but it's entirely unfeasible live unless you have a small army of engineers.
@@JMRSplatt Yea, it happens when transcoding is not on for some of my mobile viewers, because the stream forces 1080p 60fps. It's frustrating when people think that it's my fault, when everything is silky smooth for myself and like 99% of the rest of the viewers. :( I think some have found a work-a-round here and there by restarting their device, changing the app settings, and allowing for more usage. So annoying that it happens though! :(
@@Azralynn Ohh, right! interesting! Yes, I've actually forced my stream to 720p at the request of viewers since it's not available when using 1080p. That makes sense now. Thanks for the infos!
I stream at 900p due to the fact that twitch does not even support the bitrate to support 1080p. I think 900p 6000 bitrate is as good as you can get currently
Liking the videos lately man, but I do think you’re not giving enough weight to how important subs and cheering can be to smaller streamers I’ve seen plenty of small streamers with dedicated audiences getting 100’s of subs a month, and 1000’s if not 10k+ bits a month Often way under partner but still with an engaged enough community that they can make like $200-$1000 a month from streaming. Probably not enough to live on for most, but for most, it’s not nothing
But under an objective standpoint, it doesn't matter how big the numbers are, you're making less money than the equivalent on youtube if they just straight up subbed to your channel and just gave 5 bucks on the side or purely gave you the bit money on a tip, that's what he's saying
Those are mostly streamers that already have something good going from another platform. Not all, but most of them. In that case, they should consider all their options.
The thing is, I’m streaming as a hobby and have no intention of making it my full-time job, but I would love to be affiliate because I want to use channel points to have fun with viewers. If I don’t want to make it a job, does it make sense to be affiliate?
Late but; as he said you can eventually cancel this deal. I’d go ahead and do it if you’re in it for fun, and if you grow a bit, maybe terminate the deal and take his advice
Exactly this! This guy is seriously off putting and is talking to people who actually want to make streaming a full time job. Doing it for fun and maybe a bit of extra cash by all means go ahead. The way he talks is about the money is as if it's going to be your only income. He shit talks channel points and says "they only increase chat engagement." Like.. Isn't that the point of them? I'd only come back to this video if you're getting big and the contract is going to conflict with other stuff but from what I've seen with people who are big on twitch and are big else where (RUclips mainly) have no issue. RTgame, callmekevin, kitboga.. then again they're partners and not sure if that's much different to affiliate in terms of contract. Just keep in mind, you'll only get a small chunk of the income you'll see. There's plenty of videos from other people explaining that without the whole off putting attitude.
@@Jaypeemedia yes! I would love to make a bit of money but I am not expecting to. I genuinely enjoy and love streaming. I streamed on a small platform for 4 years - sometimes I’d be streaming 8... 10... or more hours a day lol. Because I just loved it. If it could be my job I’d be so over the moon and happy but I’m not going into it with like the mindset of ‘this is going to be my job, I’m building a brand, I’m doing this to make money!’ I have the mindset of I love to stream, interact, i would like to be an affiliate because it feels like an accomplishment to me. Really put off by him saying it’s easy to get an average of 3 viewers. I guess if you cheat it is lol but it does take time and work... idk. If you start building up a community with people who like watching you and want to support you they’ll be happy for you and they might wait through the ads because they know it’ll help support you and they’ll want to stick around and want to keep watching after an ad. Like. Idk. I think it depends on the reason why you’re going into streaming.
This is kinda how I feel to be honest, I know I'll never be a big streamer and I don't really want it to be a full time job anyway - the cash I make from affiliate is small, but it's a nice little bonus payout for doing something I enjoy. I agree with all of his points if you're looking to make it big, but I don't think there's much harm in doing it if you just stream occasionally and aren't trying to build a big brand.
Thankyou, Im very close to being eligible to become an affiliate, listening to what you've said has completely changed my mind and has made me realise what could've gone wrong
I've applied as an affiliate a year ago. I did not feel like what I did was a mistake but now do. The damage is done but I keep my head up. I'm glad that watching your streams make me learn on the long run. I still try to make content and build a community. I am still happy to find your channel and keep learning! Keep it up Devin!
Yeah I got affiliate back in 2014 but quit streaming. Recently started again and really wish I hadn’t become one. The preroll ads are detrimental to small channels :/ oh well hindsight is 20/20
I think a big issue I have with this video so far is that one. Even though it is easy to become affiliate at least without buying it I still don't know how viable/real that is. Its also difficult and I'd say an accomplishment still. Second he speaks of becoming a partner at a certain amount of subscribers. If you are not affiliate you won't be able to get subscribers so unless you are basing possible subscribers on followers and view counts. Which is still in accurate cause you have no idea if anyone wants to sub to you. Then you have no way of knowing if you will be making money off twitch. Plus 125 a month is nothing to scoff at especially for people doing this as a hobby.
RE: Ads I am convinced that picture in picture ads are the way forward. Back in the days watching on television a live sports event, I would switch during the ads. But then they did picture in picture ads without the commentators commentating and w the sport sound muted, but still could watch the race/sport. I did not switch but continued to watch the sport.
ehh.. for sports that might work since its mostly just visual entertainment... how about you are watching a movie and in the dialogue there are multiple dramatic plottwists and/or reveals-- but you missed all of those cuz ads muted the movie (or series)... or how about you are watching educational show and when the most important part comes, the one you should takes notes from - then its muted and you can't hear what the "teacher" or expert, whatever, is saying. Now back to streaming: for me its not about the games - its about interaction. I don't think i can have conversation with someone who would go mute midspeech.. like... what if i just asked a question and they were answering it just when i get ad. Or if i try to catch stream early and while they are having introduction for the game or theme of the stream, lets say they are explaining a certain kind of challenge, if its on mute and there weren't graphics with texts or pictures on thrown in - i'd be quite confused to see my fav streamer doing something out of ordinary. I very much say no to this idea. To me it doesn't seem to work in most cases.
I can kinda see this for some content like repetitive games but it can block whole important pieces of context at times. I think they need to get the streamer more involved regarding ad breaks etc. When chilling in a queue lobby or really early in a match an “ad break” wouldn’t be as painful. The other thing though is there’s a growing fear that ads are the next big bubble.. Twitch’s failed midrolls, and YTs new policies, and Wired’s recent report are examples of rumblings in the industry..
Thank you. I had no idea that this was even an issue! Really is sleezy, almost seems like twitch intentionally takes your growth to keep you under that $100 mark so they can just make money off of you. Thank you for saving my stream, I was going to take affiliate and had no idea
Thanks for saving me. I thought about starting to stream on twitch. I have a full time job and want to strat streaming for fun. Now I know I won't stream only on twitch for sure. Gonna watch more of your videos to figure out what to do. Great content.
If someone were to multistream as an affiliate Could they go back to streaming to twitch exclusively once they think they're in "kill range" of twitch?
Since you can always re-onboard to affiliate status (after you offboard from it)I truly believe if a streamer is big enough, twitch would want to get him/her to stream for them exclusively.
If you are big enough that Twitch would even check to see if you're streaming at the same time somewhere else you'd be beyond big enough to get partner.
Great video as usual. I feel like a lot of this is dependent on timing. I have zero regrets about becoming an affiliate. I only stream 6-8 hours per week and the rest of my energy is focused on recording/editing for youtube and tiktok etc
"Nobody cares if you're in different chats." Personally I leave if people are reading from 2 different chats. They always neglect one or more of the chats and it's boring as a viewer to not know/see what they're replying to if they're not showing chat on stream/screen.
transcoding does matter specially for many areas where people have an average of 2mb/4mb internet speed and can't run 1080p or even 720p i stop watching many streamers cause i couldn't reduce the quality less then 720p
@@gyroninjamodder not really, it's first come first served. Our streams only average about 8 viewers but more often than not we have a transcode server
Yeah if I can't watch a stream without buffering I don't stick around, it's part of the reason I stream at 540p, never had anyone complain about quality but when I streamed at 720p I couldn't watch my own preview window and I had people complaining about buffering
Thankyou for the bit at the end talking about being an anomaly, I'm floundering my day job right now and looking for ways out and I really needed to hear that.
Appreciate you going over the "donation vs tips" and chargebacks in this video. We are a 501c3 that streams on Twitch and were always curious if we had protection since donations are legitimately donations to a charity. A+ video!
He lists why he thinks that also. As an affiliate myself, I get robbed any time some wants to support me. I currently have 40 subs and I’m still not at $100 so I can’t even get that money yet. I would be 100x better off not being an affiliate, broadcasting on multiple sites to bring in more viewers to build my brand, and also not have a prerolled ad that scares people off.
As someone who has friends that use restream, it’s a bad idea in my opinion. That means they have to check chat more often and it’s awkward when they’re replying to other comments that you can’t see and can’t really be apart of the conversation. And one chat is always focused on more than the other. It would be better to do a schedule where you stream to this platform this day, and this platform the next.
One of the most genuine talks about growing in the streaming/content creation world. Thank you Devin, always appreciate your videos and the insight they bring.
To my understanding, affiliates are allowed to stream anywhere they want. Your LIVE content is exclusive to Twitch for a 24 hour period and thats it. Partners are supposed to be exclusive to Twitch only but also do whatever the hell they want so realistically the exclusivity agreement on Twitch across the board is worthless.
@OkayDude TV Correct. Maybe you should too. Here, lemme help. "Live Content Exclusivity. Solely for any live audio-visual work you choose to provide to us as User Content (your “Live Twitch Content”), starting from beginning of the Initial Broadcast of any such Live Twitch Content, and continuing for a period of twenty-four (24) hours following the end of the Initial Broadcast of such Live Twitch Content (the “Exclusivity Period”), such Live Twitch Content is exclusive to Twitch (even as to you). During the Exclusivity Period of any Live Twitch Content, you will not, nor permit or authorize any third party to, broadcast, stream, distribute, exhibit and otherwise make available such Live Twitch Content in any manner. Notwithstanding the foregoing, you have the right to make any Live Twitch Content available, during the Exclusivity Period, solely via the Twitch Services. After the Exclusivity Period of any Live Twitch Content, the license to such Live Twitch Content will become non-exclusive and you will have the right to broadcast, stream, distribute, exhibit and otherwise make available such Live Twitch Content in any manner and format desired by you. The “Initial Broadcast” means the initial broadcasting, streaming, distribution, or other exhibition of Live Twitch Content via the internet, whether such Live Twitch Content is broadcast on a real-time, live basis as the subject event is occurring or such Live Twitch Content has been prerecorded and is being initially broadcast for the first time via any manner or method of streaming."
Thanks for informing me about this. I have been streaming relentlessly almost every single day since March 2020 and I don’t think I’m getting a good deal out of what I try and do. It’s not perfect but I try hard to get stuff going. If amazon or twitch is going to treat people who are dedicated to their app like peasants then I literally can’t take this as seriously as I want to and this upsets me very much. If you already are an affiliate what should you do? There was a time where I just used a paypal or BTC link instead of a sub button but people told me to get affiliate, but i ALWAYS hated the idea of being taxed out the ass so I just didnt do it....Thanks for this man
I was looking for a video of whether or not you HAVE to accept an affiliate contract in order to accept a partner contract later on. All I could find were videos saying "Become an affiliate fast!" And I literally don't even want to. So I appreciate this video.
There's also a luck advantage of being family related to a Twitch streamer that would make you get partnership fast like Sodapoppin's brothers BJ and Dkane got partnership, Tyler1's brother Erobb got partnership and being the boyfriend or girlfriend of a popular streamer helps as well.
I'm already a twitch affiliate but honestly I'm really thinking of switching to youtube after hearing everything. I don't really have a viewer base on twitch anyways and the 3 people who do watch me wont mind switching to RUclips.
same, like i want channel points as well so i can interact with viewers more and stuff like that also many streamers have affiliate and are fine with it
If you listened to the video, he’s simply saying that being an affiliate is not worth all of the negatives associated with twitch (ads driving off viewers being the biggest one in my opinion), and you should WAIT until you can become a partner to decide if you want to take on those negatives for the pros that come with being a partner.
I literally was just offered affiliate today and figured I would check out the video because I like to hear all sides. At the time I watched this I had no idea about a contract or anything. Thank you for explaining everything because the thought of signing over what I have worked hard to create for an unknown end goal makes no sense to me. Great video!!!!
I just started streaming 3 weeks ago, and my friends have been supporting me while streaming. I’m at 45 followers, and was thought affiliate was going to be awesome to reach. Everything you said makes perfect sense. The only thing I would ask is if I should stick to twitch because that what all my friends and majority of the people know? I personally have never streamed or watched any live streams anywhere else. Maybe I should start streaming on YT, while I still can, my only fear is that I won’t grow as much on YT.
You will absolutely grow more on YT, I speak from experience. With the ability to make videos, and to keep your streams up forever, you will be able to grow on RUclips MUCH more easily. I typically only get about 1 viewer a stream on Twitch, but on RUclips, depending on the time of day, I might get around 6-10 viewers. Any chat interaction is bettter than none! You can also apply the tactic of making good thumbnails and getting discovered by the algorithm. It's overall just easier to grow on RUclips, whether you stream or not.
Affiliate is 3 viewers and anything between 3 and like a 100 viewers is a dead zone where you don't make anything unless you have some seriously generous viewers that donate a lot for some reason, I don't know the numbers but the amount of streams with 100 or less viewers is huge.
@@Johansen1000 I know a streamer who streams with 8 average viewers , he got affiliate 2 months ago , and already cashed out £120. But like you said it's probaly because he has generous viewers
@@kitn2507 As I said you don't make anything, £120 for 2 months work, any crappy job and you would make that in less than 2 days, if you have a job that actually requires an education you'll make it in 2 hours.
Well I've had affiliate for about a year, and I have only cashed out onces about 2 weeks ago, I sit with an average of 4 viewers and of I'm lucky about 2 subs a month. I have been a bit luckyer of late with bits but yeah, it's hell gaining views.
@@llamaduden3397 considering offboarding because u would be growing 30% faster. ur slowing almost half ur growth by having ads and ur not making any money anyways. u could be growing faster
You could argue bits donations are more valuable to affiliates because it's an extra revenue opportunity. I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination. Just keeping an open mind.
I know that this is an older video, but I’ve been struggling with the ad manager on Twitch trying to get the pre roll ads off…. I wish I would have found this video before I decided to go forward with the affiliate program. I like the way you type out notes and you explain things really well. Thank you for helping people. ❤
Thank you for that. One question still: Won't affiliates get recommended to people more likely on twitch than non affiliates? I mean they are profiting of Affiliates, wo why not recommend them? So if that is true, being an Affiliate makes you more discoverable?
It might get you recommended more, but it isn't gonna be by much, if anything xD Everything else in that 'contrct', is a joke. So I don't believe you are gonna get recommended by much, or anything even, again.
It absolutely will, if you see someone's name with the tick symbol on the side, it immediately makes you want to check them out. But i feel like this video's message is very skewed, there is a reason why every one, i mean 99% of people will agree that getting affiliate is the right move and if it really was a problem, then i am pretty sure all the top creators would opt out of it. This view is skewed because it's coming from a business stand point, marketing for maximum profit and expose yourself as much as possible, so basically stream on youtube, facebook, twitch which is honestly just not a smart idea, this guy calls it split testing, i don't know marketing but he's probably correct, i guess split testing applies to real life businesses and marketing but in terms of streaming which is entertainment coming from 1 individual, it just doesn't make much sense. Twitch is meant for streaming, youtube is not known for streaming but for uploading content, and no one cares about facebook, it really doesn't matter if twitch is the only platform you can stream on because it is the best platform to stream on, you get emotes, you can easily clip things etc, it's just built solely for streaming unlike youtube or facebook. I think objectively the best thing isn't to not get twitch affiliate, but to get it, and in terms of exposing yourself more out there, stream on twitch, upload videos on youtube, upload clips on tiktok, maybe even twitter or instagram, it's true that people don't really get known from twitch itself but that is exactly what youtube is for, along with tiktok.
Brand dilution is such a bogus concept when it comes to streamers. The name of the game is absolute exposure. The very practice of oversaturating is the entire engine on how you get maximum exposure.
my one problem with is he mainly just going on about money, and i know a lot of small streamers personally, and not one of them cares about the money. they mainly just care about having a good community that wants to watch them. and if u actually enjoy a streamer u will watch the ad cuz u want to watch that streamer
"Channel points will help engagement in chat but not increase watch-time" THAT'S WHAT I WANT. ENGAGEMENT IN CHAT IS THE BEST THING ABOUT STREAMING. I'd rather watch a streamer with 100 viewers who's engaging with chat than a streamer with 1000+ viewers who hardly looks at chat.
I don’t know why streamers don’t talk to their viewers. When I stream I actually talk to my viewers but I can’t look at chat while I’m playing until I die or the match ends then I’ll talk to them. I feel like streamers should talk to the viewers instead of reading the donations and etc.
Exactly right? i love engagement with the streamer more than anything only reason why i would stay longer cus feels like they're talking to us. He's really salty bout this.
I made sure i sent this to my brother as soon as i saw it he just started streaming on twitch. He would be way more sucessful working on his youtube and multistreaming cross platform
To anyone wondering: 9. Term and Termination. The term of this Agreement will begin upon our acceptance of your Program application and will end when terminated by either you or us. Either you or we may terminate this Agreement at any time, with or without cause, by giving the other party written notice of termination. We may withhold accrued unpaid Program Fees for a reasonable period of time following termination to ensure that the correct amount is paid (e.g., to account for any cancelations or returns). Upon any termination of this Agreement, all rights and obligations of the parties will be extinguished, except that the rights and obligations of the parties under Sections 8 and 11-17 will survive the termination of this Agreement. If you terminate the Agreement and your earned balance equals or exceeds the Payment Threshold, we will pay you your earned balance within approximately 45 days after the end of the calendar month in which the Agreement is terminated, pursuant to Section 4.1. Any earned balance below the Payment Threshold will remain unpaid. No termination of this Agreement will relieve either party for any liability for any breach of, or liability accruing under, this Agreement prior to termination
This video could not have come at a better time. Due to internet issues I had to take a temporary step back from streaming on Twitch. I was determined to get that Affiliate status, so when I couldn't stream for a bit I was really discouraged at first. But now it feels freeing not worrying about going Affiliate, and I've got more time to focus on Instagram art and RUclips. Still planning to stream on Twitch again soon, but this time with more focus on content diversification
The most annoying thing about Twitch ads is that they replay the same ad over and over again until seeing it is just absolutely mind numbing and irritating
I've been thinking this for a while and it's good to hear the data supports it. Need to get out of my affiliate contract immediately. Regarding emotes, each to their own but even when they're cool it's such a scam to give money to the Amazon black hole for pretty pixels. But I'm also old enough to remember 00s-era forums where they all had killer custom emotes for free.
I'm very new to streaming and this is all new info to me. I'm glad to have this info and perspective now rather than later when I might have been eligible for the affiliate program and signed the contract without knowing better. Subbed
I really appreciate the detailed breakdown in this. I especially agree with the terrible, unwelcoming preroll system. That said, while I understand and agree that things like restreaming are better for growth, I wonder about the quality of that growing community. Through reading comments here and my own experience it seems that Twitch has the most engaged community. I have only ever seen a couple restreamers and it felt weird seeing the streamer interact with different communities and people in chats at being unable to interact with each other. What is everyone else's experience with restreams? I have really enjoyed the affiliate program, especially for the emotes, channel points, transcoding, and monetization options. I have made about $1000 in 7 months, which is small compared to the amount of work, and perhaps could be more had people been on multiple platforms and people considered donating, but thst is money I made along my journey and I'm very proud of it. And there is something to say for the accessibility of Twitches easily accessible payment options like subs, gifted subs, and bits. I know Twitch does not help small streamers grow, but fortunately my goal is personal growth first and twitch stream second, and in that regards being an affiliate has helped with that.
If you have 50 followers and no path to make a career out of streaming its fun to have your own emotes and get a random twitch prime here and there. This whole analysis is only aimed at creating a brand and making a career out of your personality by looking at the success cases. 99% of affiliates will never have these supposed issues down the line because they are never getting there.
The worst thing about being a Twitch Affiliate (as well as a regular Twitch video live-streamer) in my opinion is that VOD's (a.k.a. archived video live-streams) are *_only_* available for viewers for *_*14*_*_ _*_days;_* and you in being a Twitch Partner isn't much better there when it comes to VOD storage: VOD's/archived video live-streams are *_only_* available to viewers to watch for *_*60*_*_ _*_days_* - *_that_* is what I hate the most about Twitch; I usually don't have time to watch *_several/many_* archived video live-streams in any given week/7-day period (though I *_*try*_* to do that as much as I can in recent weeks, which is *_*THE*_*_ _*_ONLY_* reason why I even *_follow_* a few Twitch video live-streamers but subscribe/give donations to none on Twitch).
super thought provoking. I appreciate the way you approach the whole discussion. one of the biggest reasons I am attracted to twitch is how feature rich it is (natively and because of ease of implementing or developing a 3rd party extension), will have to do some more research on what's possible with RUclips streaming currently, and cross my fingers YT gets better as a live streaming platform. but for now.. I really like channel points, and am turned off by the idea of splitting my chat via restreaming. will go check out your video on restreaming to see if you can convince me.
from 34:00 its the best realest and truest advice Devin has ever given. Not to toot my own horn but i am an example of exactly that part he covers there!
Your comment on value connects so well to my organizational strategy class as we have talked extensively about creating value and finding out how to create sustainable competitive advantage. Can’t believe university is actually helping me better connect and understand industries as much as it has.
I just left Twitch after clicking on two streams and getting two consecutive pre-roll ads. Closed the tab and came here, so can confirm. Not only that, I recently canceled my yearly amazon prime sub. There's no way I'm paying them to show me this gross amount of ads, if they want money from ads then they won't get it from me. I'm so done with their bs. All their fReE (mobile) gAmEs (loot) with prime is not worth it and it's not what people wanted.
I'm already an affiliate but this whole re streaming argument across multiple platforms is just a hassle which is why i didn't care much when i signed up for affiliate. Not only do you have to keep track of different chats when your live on multiple platforms you also have to setup alerts for all these different platforms not for me seems to much of a hassle i'm happy being a twitch affiliate only also as a twitch affiliate your still able to upload clips to twitter and a day later youtube so you are still leveraging different platforms. Also lets say you decided not to be an affiliate and multi stream on fb, youtube and other sites and start building a following on them. You then accept twitch partner how do you think those fans on fb and RUclips would feel that your unable to stream on their preferred platform? you would be a sellout in their eyes you really think they would follow you to twitch? haven't we learnt this from what ninja did? Also i don't recommend PayPal they did me dirty when first starting out streaming they permanently terminated my account and future accounts because of being a streamer aka high risk so if your in the states recommend using SEPays in streamelements in case they do the same to you. Unfortunately, they don't have SEPays for Canada so Bits and Subs are the only way my fans can support me if they want. FUCK PAYPAL!
That's a good point about losing followers from other platforms if you accept twitch partner. I'm also confused on how you can get to partner without ever accepting affiliate? Like do you just show them your stats on these other platforms and slip straight to partner?
@@jacoblindsey6888 You don't need to be an affiliate to apply for Partner, just like when you're an affiliate and you hit the Partner numbers it isn't a guarantee that they'll accept your Partnership application. Partnership isn't automatic like Affiliate is.
@@jacoblindsey6888 Naw, only people watching on twitch count towards the partnership requirement. Which is another reason i feel this whole multi-platform stream has more cons then pros in my opnion.
You can set up a combined chat on your stream (restream does that) so you only have to read one, then you can put that chat on screen. I have the "youtube gang" jokingly harass the "twitch gang" on since they can read each other, that boost the engagement. When you see you're on your way to get partner on twitch you'll focus on it, it's not like one day you wake up and see "oh I'm partner, sorry youtube people, you gotta switch". That process takes months... "hassle" is spending like 4 hours setting up alerts on all the platforms. Streamelements does that for you, you can just import alerts from one platform to another. If you want to live with streaming I think you can invest 4 hours into it.
Bro, you've done it really good! I'm just starting my brand now and there's lot of ideas that i reconstruct after you've done this video. Thank you a lot! :)
i just started moving from being youtube-exclusive to restreaming and was wondering what twitch affiliate means. thank you sooooo much for the straightforward and honest explanation!!! insta-subscribed!!!
I have one note/question to add, back when I first started streaming, BEFORE I became affiliate, I had plenty of people come in to my stream and complain that they had to sit through a pre-roll ad! I also recall visiting a few of my friends streams who were also just starting out and there was ALWAYS a pre-roll... the only difference was down the bottom, instead of reading “this ad helps support *Streamer Name*” it would read “this ad helps support Twitch”. Now they may have changed this since and made the decision to remove pre-rolls from non-affiliates, but back when I first signed the agreement, EVERYBODY had ads, they just weren’t getting any revenue from them...
So Ive been streaming for almost 3 months, I hit affiliate after like 1 week and the same month I got my first paycheck through gifted subs and a lot of bits. I just wanna mention that Im succsessfull with being a little irrelevant streamer with 20 viewers who actually are benefitting a lot from the affiliate program. The reason why I made this comment isnt to tell Im right ur wrong or whatever, But If you only wanna stream on twitch I honestly think affiliate is a good idea in some scenerios.
did you give them the options to pay/support you through paypal or patreon? just wondering, because obviously if your only payment methods are subs and bits, and you aren't pushing for people to use paypal/patreon where you aren't getting as much money taken. then obviously they're going to donate with bits/subs like im curious if you 1. even have paypal/patreon set up 2. after each donation or before donations do you go, " please use paypal/patreon to support me instead of subs/bits, but i appreciate all of them" / " patreon/paypal are my preffered payment methods" also, is subs/bits the only way you're benefiting. if not: in what other ways are you benefitting from the affiliate program?
@@mysticflow467 I told them one time to use Paypal Yeah, and the paypal is setup to the stream ”donation” Button, and Im Also able to use twitch emotes and subscribtion badges with the affiliate program; which is benefitting the stream a lot in many ways, we have inside jokes about the emotes and stuff
Re-streaming is the reason? I can still put out content on RUclips, Facebook, and Twitter as a Twitch affiliate while keeping my potential $100 a month. Why not?
It would be more profitable in the long run to livestream on multiple platforms simultaneously. You can grow a youtube livestream faster than you can grow a youtube channel, and you'll have a hell of a time getting those youtube viewers into your twitch afterward and that's the more lucrative income source
@@chizystreams can you name one popular streamer who streams on all platforms? Better yet ask yourself why isn’t Devin Nash practicing what he preaches? Pretty sure he accepted twitch affiliate himself since he’s a partner lol
@@traughdaddy He's a full-on partner. He has his target audience, and a lot of his content has to do with twitch specifically so it makes sense for him to settle there. I accepted the affiliate contract with twitch ages ago so even if I were to get back into streaming I couldn't multistream, but I have to imagine if you can be in more places at once you have a higher chance of being discovered.
@@traughdaddy I think you missed the point where this whole video was about starting streamers and not popular ones with thousand viewers. Sounds like the whole point of the video flew straight over your head to be honest.
Loved your video here. I canceled my affiliate yesterday, and I decided to go look around for other people making bullet points for why this is a good idea so that I could explain concisely why I did this, and your video here takes the cake in this regard and really helped me put my thoughts in order in an explainable way. Thanks much dude!
hey, thank you for this. I've just recently started streaming on Twitch, and I've been watching all kinds of videos on how to improve my stream, what to do to grow, etc. I'm extremely new, I only have 10 followers that I've managed to gain in the past 6 days, with one regular viewer. That viewer is super active and I've managed to get some attention from a couple of other small streamers on Twitch, but that being said, I think it's more important to be able to multistream as you make a lot of good points on how to do so. So, thank you for the information, it's super helpful, and you've gained a sub for the heads up. I appreciate your advice, thanks again.
A note I forgot to include in this video - a lot of people are commenting that Twitch Affiliate (and partner) exclusivity applies on a stream-by-stream basis. AKA, you could stop a Twitch stream and then stream immediately on RUclips afterward. This is true. So you could do a M-W-F Twitch schedule, T-T-S RUclips for example. People need to realize this IS exclusivity, and Twitch is intentional in their wording here.
Livestreaming is already an enormous time investment compared to all other forms of content creation. Sustaining multiple platforms on separate days is ultimate brand dilution - you will get nowhere. Twitch knows this and limits you from restreaming because they understand the power of brand diversification. They don't want to take that chance that you perform better on another platform. They want to lock you in so you gain traction on Twitch or no where.
No streamer in the top 10,000 has succeeded by creating separate streams at separate times on separate platforms. My recommended strategy here is to FOCUS - but only after you have the data. If you restream to Twitch, RUclips, Facebook, etc - you will know in 1-3 months what is performing for you. You then make a more informed decision. In marketing this is split testing. You always split test because it gives you more relevant data. In brand building, more relevant data is always good.
Do not sign a contract giving away real value and rights in exchange for the $50 Twitch throws at you for your 20 subs. That is not good business. You are worth way more than that.
I'm not trying to sell you anything, and I don't care what platform you end up on. What I advocate is for you to make informed, data-backed decisions on where you build your brands. Don't follow my path and definitely don't follow Twitch and their "achievement" program. Work out your own salvation.
Thanks for the informative content
thanks for the information im thinking about streaming/making videos soon so this might help!
Thanks devin for being a real one
I'm an affiliate and have consistent but >20 viewership on twitch after 5 months. I'd like to look into youtube streaming (because I'm turning my vods into youtube videos) but I don't want to leave twitch for a significant amount of time. What do?
I got the affiliate message about a month ago. Read the ToS and about the taxation policy. My gut told me something was off. It felt like I was selling my soul to the devil. Been reading online and viewing posts and with this video it seems like I wasnt too far off. Thanks for the eye opener Devin.
Twitch partner support really is the biggest meme of all time, takes a month to get a response back that doesn't even look to be written by an actual breathing human
Oh shit it's Patterz. much love man
Patterz Pog
It doesn't look like it's written by a human because they most probably have blurbs for each request and all possible responses. I worked for Amazon, hence i know this.
i know a girl who got it in 1 day. She literally made an account 2 days ago, streamed once, and got it the next day. She got an interview with someone at twitch within 24 hours and she came from youtube
I mean hey at least there's a support from Twitch, RUclips has nothing.
The biggest meme is affiliates "supporting" each other, by subbing to one another. Guess who gets a %50 cut from all of that? Twitch.
FR! I had a friend get mad at me cause they were subbed to me but I didn't sub back. I was like "Dude, we're only both losing money then."
I call this a circle jerk.
I think somebody made a comic about how comic artists buy from each other and kept the smallpress comics market working.
@jmad beatz GAMING that's a real homie move.
Super True Lol
Twitch still runs ads on non affiliate/partner streams, you just dont get paid for it.
Yeah I feel like before I was affiliated I was told there were ads on my stream I’m just not getting the revenue lol even if that’s basically nothing
@Cameron Norton youTube says they CAN but I've not seen it happen
@Cameron Norton RUclips ads can be skipped after 5 seconds Twitch will give you a 30 second unskippable ad. Dokatoz runs 6-8 ads EVERY HOUR I do not watch his streams for that reason alone.
@Cameron Norton youtube won't put ads on your vids if you don't apply them yourself. The only exception is when your video gets copyright claimed.
@@CaptainAnonymous im not sure about that, u might be right but..hmmmmm.. i think they added ads to all videos now? i often upload copyrighted music though so i do get those ads unfortunately, but as long as i can have the music up i dont mind.. as long as i dont get a copyright strike
it's always when you're about to finalize the stuff where people like him show up and make you doubt everything you worked towards
For real lmao
Just keep doing you, at the end of the day
No cap bro💯
I just hit the affiliate achievement last night and was right on the payout registration and then I see this video😂😂
The only time I've seen people use ads is to be able to go to the bathroom. Which is perfectly understandable
Low key I leave in that moment lol
@funny twitch doesn’t give streamers the option to turn ads off. Every single streamer I’ve personally spoken with (between 50-75 streamers) have ALL agreed that they would simply turn ads off if they could; ads interrupt content and drive away viewers with no positive in return.
Worth noting: Twitch Affiliate exclusivity applies only on a stream-by-stream basis. Meaning, you can stream on Twitch, and stream on RUclips; you just can't stream to both at the SAME time, like with restream.
You CAN stream on Twitch on Thursday and RUclips on Sunday, for example.
I've seen twitch affiliates/partners stream on RUclips first then switch to Twitch afterwards. You're correct in that you can't stream to multiplatform at the same time but people seem to be able to swap between platforms as long as you don't stream to multiple at the same time.
@@Stardrifter404 Correct!
But doesn't it say that twitch owns your content within a certain time frame so if you stream to youtube as an affiliate and get tips isn't twitch obligated to retain the tips or violate you for breach of contract?
Yes!! I kept thinking that throughout the video and was wondering if I was mistaken xD
@@whatistruth101 No. Twitch is never entitled to tips given off-platform.
Twitch owning your stream for 24 hours simply means you can't multistream, nor can you post any clips to YT or social media for 24 hours. (the latter is almost never enforced and Devin breaks this by uploading this video fewer than 24 hours before the stream it was made on.)
"if you are going to go anywhere in your life, you need to be value-focused"
that one hit me hard.
Yeah, It hit me hard in the way that I have tons of value, But no one that buys it. I got called a fraud and a scam without even bringing up the topic of money. So the entire Provide value thing is busted. I have acomplished so much just towards streaming, have I got any value back from it? no, not really. I got experiences that can be defined as value - But I can't use it to anything, so its not that great value after all.
@@JostoneHD "yeah, It hit me hard in the way that I have tons of value, But no one that buys it" What you are showing is that you have no empathy towards your audience. If nobody is buying your stuff its because you arent providing value to your audience. Just because you think its valuable doesnt mean its valuable to your audience. Find out what your audience thinks is valuable then give it to them.
@@JostoneHD You are confusing personal value with product value. you are not the product, your content is. You have value, your audience has decided your product does not. if you start taking product value as personal value, you are going down a bad path that will lead you nowhere but heartache.
It's also possible that your product does have value, but you're not marketing to the right people.
@@shawnemployee6906 if the feedback I get from those that watch it and it shows to be valued then it has value. It has nothing to do with personal value.
@@EmmyDereest I m not mixing anything. I had one guy in my chat, he left because he was the only one there, but he loved my content. And I have learned away valorant strats, I have had some funny content where I quote "this is the best I've seen getting back on socials" from my audience. It has nothing to do with personal value. I know my content is valuable. And when streaming, you are the product, people come to your stream to watch you. Why are you watching tim when there might be better warzone players out there? Because it's tim, and you watch him for his personality... gosh.... and i thought for a moment the youtube comment section was actually friendly and understanding...
Me: hmm this is very interesting
Also me: *already affiliate*
Sucks to be you
lmao same is it even possible to cancel?
me
How much u get paid?
@@justz3367 not much from twitch, direct donations are primary source
Next vid: "So you've already signed an affiliate contract..."
🙃
Bruh this is me 😂
He covers this in the video, if you watch it all he states that you can terminate your contract via twitch support.
@@notan3144 so what is the penalty for not following it?
@@crimsonclaw6337 Read the clause, but I'd assume it is along the lines of potential a suing. That's the threat of a contract.
@@notan3144 yeah probably otherwise it would be to easy to get out of it
When you’ve been partnered since 20012. This mans knows the future he has to be right follow his advice
I noticed that too, this man has history.
Also RIP Vainglory.
Of course it’s right. Pretty much every popular streamers other than the OGs blew up because of RUclips. Twitch sucks ass until you have a big audience.
@@Cross1nsan1ty yeah was very big into vain glory when it first came out back in high school sad to see it go
Bro your pfp is triggering PTSD
Long live WP Taka
@@FizzyCape ur wrong. RUclips has more discover ability, but watch stream scheme. They have a lot of tips on streaming. You don't have to be big to grow on twitch
"This should be renamed"
THEN RENAME IT DEVIN. YOU HAVE THAT POWER.
Actually fucking true
He’s a boomer cut him a break guys.
but the click bait tho
Just a note: *All contacts are negotiable.* You can work with Twitch to modify parts a contract before you sign. If they refuse, you can simply not sign. I know several partners who don't have exclusivity in their contracts.
I'm pretty sure that twitch won't even talk with the nobody with 25 viewers anyway.
@@suyogkhadilkar you need an average of 75 viewer to get the qualification to be partner. So maybe that could be a workaround
They just added that function with channel points that does keep watch time, "Predictions". I spent 2 more hours on a channel than I would have, cuz I was betting points.
the "Predictions" thing Twitch implemented doesn't even work for my area/country and neither does the ''watching ads for bits'' do, so idk what the point of it is
"It's easiest requirements"
Then me who tries to reach those requirements for almost 4 years and still not enough ._.
Felt that. Although I only recently started streaming.
Me who has been on and off for 4 years at this point, stuck on average views, never once getting above 2 despite getting more followers -
saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame
I hit affiliate last night after starting two weeks ago- but i didn’t sign up for affiliate yet. Probably not going to now
Yeah for me that's twitter and tiktok and the only thing stopping me from meeting the requirements is the amount of days I've streamed because I only just started
@Shefle I mean... you need to stream for 7 separate days... so it definitely didn't take you under a week :P Nice try, though.
Only reason I signed twitch affiliate was for emotes. I could care less about everything else.
Basicaly the only reason I sub to many channels is for the emotes. I kinda think hes underestimating their value. Ive literally used streamers emotes in a diff stream and had the person go "woah thats a cool emote" and then find that persons twitch.
Exactly
@@lemonworm Didn’t know you can use emotes on other streams that’s pog
I just want affiliate for the channel points. Idk what he means by they’re useless. I see small streamers coming up with cool ways to use them and people have fun with them. 🤷♀️ but I do see big streamers not even come up with anything cool for theirs so I guess that’s why he said that
I got my affiliate because I wanted my own custom emotes that i can use and my friends can use (i gift them subs if they want the emotes)
Very interesting video as usual and interesting topic.
While i agree that for smaller streamers (less than 10/15 ccv average) your points are all valid and affiliate status is pointless and all those threads on the /r/twitch subreddit about "grinding toward affiliate" are insane, i disagree that people should never become one.
As for bigger affiliates that haven't reached partnership size yet in the 30/50 viewer range ( while you're growing your brand etc) that consitute probably less than 10/20% of the whole affiliates lots of them make decent income from twitch and have more than 50/100 subs, and at that point the money could be used to grow your brand more and invest in your stream , like for exemple use that money pay an editor to grow your youtube channel or emote artist to have actual decent emotes that increase viewer chat engagement , or literally pay to promote your twitter etc.
in addition the exclusivity clause is a big meme imo , they never enforced it for affiliates and if they one day start to do it will only happens once you reach a decent size for them to even notice you since it's a report based system (for partners) so TLDR if you're big enough for the exclusivity clause to be an issue, you're already big enough to get partnership so it's a non issue
the transcoding priority is a big selling point IMO as there is still lots of people who watch on mobile or don't have fiber, and not having transcoding could lose you some potential viewers
in addition about the ads, recently the ads revenue have increased on twitch and streamers with a 50 avg ccv can reach the $100/month with just ads (if they play manual ones) and also disable prerolls
Also an other key point is the "community appartenance" feeling that your viewers might get once they're subscribed to your channel/have that status in your discord and might incite them to become superfans and increase your viewer retention and engagement as people are more likely to keep watching you after they've spent $5/month on your channel and you can also snipe gift them if they post nice comments to incite them to come back more often (as you often do yourself in your stream) and you can't do that without affiliate status.
so again an affiliate with 30/50 ccv can reach 300 to 500 dollars per month and at that point this income isn't negligeable either to re invest in your brand or if you're just starting out, do it part time as a student etc , under the 20 viewers threshold i agree that it's pointless though and i would prefer if twitch actually increased the barrier to entry to that status but as you mentioned, smaller affiliates bring them lots of money so no chance they'll ever do it.
hell i'd even suggest people to not take partnership under 200/300 ccv and stay an affiliate and keep restreaming to youtube and other platforms to grow even more and only take partnership after.
Aways thanks for reading my ted talk :)
Very interesting reply!
For me, Devin seems to suggest more that if your long term goal is to have a sustainable income from streaming/content that the affiliate is not a good decision as it doesn’t benefit you as much as they want you to believe.
When it DOES you’re likely already at the partner level.
How many people do you think are in the middle ground, not partnerable yet have significant benefits from Af?
How many do you think are honestly content at level? How many want to make it their full time gig?
IMO those in the middle ground are the most subject to burnout and won’t last as long as hobby streamers or the larger career content creators..
@@Desopolis So the thing is that if your long term goal is to have that sustainable income from streaming, getting affiliate is first a good first step to see what type of income you can generate regularly , 2 not obligatory but veeeery incited to go through it by twitch themselves if you want to get partnership one day, as often they ask partnership applicants to have affiliate and have 50 or more paid subscribers before getting partnered once they reach the 75+ viewer count .
as for how many people are stuck in that middle ground generating in the $500/$1000 a month ish and not getting enough to get partnership yet, i'm not sure but considering that there is over 400K affiliates and 40K partners i'd say it's probably a fair number, like 5/10K different creators and even if the number would be only 1000 that's still a significant number of people.
yeah i'd agree that the middle ground people are the most subjects to burnout as they have to grind extra hard creating content on all platforms to grow and reach higher numbers but might not make enough income to pay someone to help them , or enough to quit their day job. it's a rough place to be as they can imagine seeing themselves grow but are sometimes stuck in that zone
@@Saysera the requirements for partnership I think is the most driving point to me in that argument, but I still think I would plan for a delay..
For me personally, I’m not exactly sure which platform will be best for the types of content I want to produce. I’ve seen streamers of all kinds on Twitch but I won’t be doing much if any gaming.
I think growing any platform to a point where my viewership is at the partnership level would be the first step even if I would hypothetically make a slight bit more money before that point.
I can see there would be some hinderance by not having some of the offerings or notifications of subs but I think I can mitigate that using third parties.
As to “how much” I’d be using a lot of math/assumptions for a while for sure..
Totally not typical for most affiliates but Another issue is I’ve been doing some crazy experimenting with equipment and trying to create new ways viewers can engage.
Twitch plug-ins allow for a lot of amazing things but RUclips has very very strong 360 support..
So I think I would also want to work those things out
@@Desopolis yeah that's why i'm against straight up not taking affiliate ever, cause unless you can start on twitch with already over 100 viewers , then you'll have troubles getting partnership and any income before you get it
as for which platform fits certain content better that's a whole other discussion yeah , i'm sure some stuff would work better on youtube or facebook because of the culture and demographic of the users on those platforms
but growing your viewership to the partnership level first might be hard and long , and if you generate next to no income doing it it might be hard to commit to doing it and not give up
yeah the different extensions or 3rd party tools you can use or create to increase viewer engagement would definetly be a valid factor in chosing a platform over an other imo
I've said this many of times during my content: "make your own goals, celebrate your own milestones, and celebrate your achievements that you created with your community". Never jump for the carrot that is dangled in front of you by someone else.
Why am I watching this?! I don’t even use twitch and i have a deadline of tomorrow T_T
As an Affiliate on twitch who only streams because I enjoy it, I think affiliate isn't that bad of a deal. It hasn't affected my streams whatsoever, all the points made in this video are still valid though. I have earned £40 out of £100 to get the payout and while it is frustrating, again, I stream for fun, and all that money is from people who genuinely want to support me. I won't stop streaming for a good while as things are going because I love it! so when that payout eventually comes it'll be rewarding. I know that twitch takes quite clearly an unfair amount of the money, however, I have frequently promoted my own Patreon page and my normal streamlabs donation page as an easier option for me receive (almost) the full amount, however, viewers see twitch as a far easier medium to support streamers on, for example, twitch prime subs, which aren't available for non-affiliated streamers. Another thing I want to add is from my personal experience, almost ALL of my most loyal viewers are ALWAYS competing for more channel points, I think its a very fun and creative way to get viewer engagement and interaction. of course, I'm only talking from my own personal experience. Please know this is my own personal opinion, however. You just have to take into consideration what you want from streaming and make a decision based off of that :)
"Societal consensus does not often follow empirical evidence." -
Davin Nash
That's a badass quote.
"If you want to be an anomaly, you have to act like one." -Devin Nash 2020
@@concealedobfuscation lol this
Was just thinking about that xD
As an independent musician and a gamer as well I could never imagine giving my likeness away that's career suicide before it even goes anywhere...I am noticing how there are similarities in the music industry and the gaming industry with predatory business practices notably the Twitch situation as well as how things are being handled with call of duty league
Same. My ears perked up as soon as he said it. I understand Twitch requests this so that they can fully exploit content if need be but that kind of power for a platform that screwed creators with DMCA's isn't something I'm for giving over when you have better options.
Same here, I am an actress and worked in movies and did commercials, never give anyone exclusive rights to your likeness PERIOD. ;D
Ironically as an Affiliate you don't do that. At all.
No idea why Devin is thinking that Affiliate contracts are doing that. Maybe he misremembers a partner contract with affiliate contracts.
"Signing a legal contract is a big meme"
I cannot thank you enough just for saying that
lmao mans roasting bits and then have them pop up during the stream
I mean he’s already made it there.
How anyone else would review a page if you’re already long time settled and have experience. He doesn’t have to worry about it, but it’s to help any other person wanting to dedicate themselves. There’s thousands of people that stream thinking they’ll make it big or something, but depending on solo or squad of peoples probably only 1 squad and like 2 solo streamers are gonna somewhat be successful.
@itsDannyRoy Well he has his own audience that he appeals too, I don’t take it that way, but although the comparison is different, I mean you could crap on something and still use/play/ equip it etc.
There’s games I spent years on and hate to this day and I’ll always tell people not to play it, but I still do it myself.
I’m sure he sticks around cause.. I mean he isn’t like a top 20 streamers I don’t believe or anything like that, so unless forced off the platform there’s no reason for someone to stop using it.
Look at ninja and shroud going to mixer, yeah they got a big pay through contract with the company, but set of top 5 streamers at the time if not still currently went way lower on mixer, vs whoever was top 10 on Twitch. So like, imagine for this guy. Lol.
notably he complained about twitch taking a cut, if you look under the partner thing it states twitch pays them, at affiliate the streamer pays them
The bits annoyed me too, why be affiliate and tell others not to, even if you already made it? His brand is sold to Twitch too then and he doesn't care?
Damn glad this came out I was nearing affiliate and now I'm considering just doing multistreaming instead
Food for Thought.
I'm an affiliate and I have no regrets. In fact, I get way more money from subs that anything else. I've tried other platforms and don't like.
It's important to point out that the exclusivity is ONLY that you cannot stream to multiple platforms at the same time. I stream to Twitch on weekdays, and I stream to RUclips on Saturdays. Twitch has grown slowly due to networking, but I'm now seeing more traffic from my RUclips videos.
i see no problem with becoming an affiliate. I do, however, see a problem with becoming a partner. If I were a partner, I could not divide up my streaming schedule.
@@Di_bear out of curiosity, how many subs do you have on twitch?
@@rospon her subcount on twitch says 51. so she isnt making much from subs monthly from it. so imo her opinion is meh.
@@AtomiicPC It's a classic case of denial, when someone accepts a bad deal they will try to justify it with "no regrets" and "I'm doing so well right now" instead of thinking about the reality which is "wow I could've had a much bigger platform" "I've just locked myself in"
I just started on RUclips coming from twitch as an Affiliate, RUclipss gaming spot need a bit of work but it feels good.
Bout to make the move myself!
Gotta say youtube is really difficult compared to twitch
Both yt and twitch has issues, however not as bad as twitch atm
They just need to work on their search menu, I couldn't find people streaming a certain game.. but I'm sure it will come!
How is it going? I've been considering streaming, obviously on Twitch first but then I stumbled on this video and have been considering multistreaming as of like... 20 seconds ago. My main worry about YT or even FB is that I feel like it's not as easy to make a community
“If you want to be an anomaly, you have to act like one” is some of the best advice I’ve ever received personally. Couldn’t agree more.
yea i would keep your opinions to yourself, I'm a small time affiliate streamer with a couple thousand followers, I make on a low end about $1,500 a month. Income has to do with viewer demographic; completely removing the ability to make income at all is just bad advice.
This video is quite arrogant. There’s no reason on being dedicated to streaming on RUclips unless you’re monetized. On Twitch, not only can you earn money from subscribers, gifted subs and many more, even if Twitch does take a cut you’re still earning more than you would streaming on RUclips as a small creator.
I mean I never thought achievements were huge milestones anyways lol, they're fun little bonus goals, just like Xbox Achievements; They don't reward you with anything but they feel rewarding to get.
Bits: I know having Twitch make money doing nothing isn't ideal, but just like when I used SuperChats on RUclips, I still notice an overall increase in revenue due to convenience for many people.
Transcoding: I stream in 1080p, if I don't have transcoding available, people leave because they think my stream is lagging when it's them that have shitty internet. I've also had MANY complaints that the screen is "black" on the mobile app, and I know it's because of their bandwidth limitations on their phones.
or codec support :(
I think transcoding is the big thing that keeps these platforms so monopolistic, it's alot of computational power to transcode everything live with decent latency. With video you can self-host and transcode as part of a rendering pipeline, but it's entirely unfeasible live unless you have a small army of engineers.
I have that black screen problem with random streams on my phone.. mine included. It's very odd... Android..
@@JMRSplatt Yea, it happens when transcoding is not on for some of my mobile viewers, because the stream forces 1080p 60fps. It's frustrating when people think that it's my fault, when everything is silky smooth for myself and like 99% of the rest of the viewers. :( I think some have found a work-a-round here and there by restarting their device, changing the app settings, and allowing for more usage. So annoying that it happens though! :(
@@Azralynn Ohh, right! interesting! Yes, I've actually forced my stream to 720p at the request of viewers since it's not available when using 1080p. That makes sense now. Thanks for the infos!
I stream at 900p due to the fact that twitch does not even support the bitrate to support 1080p. I think 900p 6000 bitrate is as good as you can get currently
glad i saw this before becoming affiliate
Yeah, same here.
Same
Same
@@granthoover9045 lol I was joking saying same that like I have a chance. I have no intention of streaming
Same god bless devin for opening my mind to building a brand
Liking the videos lately man, but I do think you’re not giving enough weight to how important subs and cheering can be to smaller streamers
I’ve seen plenty of small streamers with dedicated audiences getting 100’s of subs a month, and 1000’s if not 10k+ bits a month
Often way under partner but still with an engaged enough community that they can make like $200-$1000 a month from streaming. Probably not enough to live on for most, but for most, it’s not nothing
I think his main point is that instead of telling your audience to sub you should tell them to tip via paypal if you are a small streamer
But under an objective standpoint, it doesn't matter how big the numbers are, you're making less money than the equivalent on youtube if they just straight up subbed to your channel and just gave 5 bucks on the side or purely gave you the bit money on a tip, that's what he's saying
Those are mostly streamers that already have something good going from another platform. Not all, but most of them. In that case, they should consider all their options.
@@bobguyson6151 *tip via paypal
@@gyroninjamodder oh yeah you are right
The thing is, I’m streaming as a hobby and have no intention of making it my full-time job, but I would love to be affiliate because I want to use channel points to have fun with viewers. If I don’t want to make it a job, does it make sense to be affiliate?
I just did it because I got bored. I'm mostly part time but who knows, maybe I'll go full time but I'm still researching
Late but; as he said you can eventually cancel this deal. I’d go ahead and do it if you’re in it for fun, and if you grow a bit, maybe terminate the deal and take his advice
Exactly this! This guy is seriously off putting and is talking to people who actually want to make streaming a full time job. Doing it for fun and maybe a bit of extra cash by all means go ahead. The way he talks is about the money is as if it's going to be your only income. He shit talks channel points and says "they only increase chat engagement." Like.. Isn't that the point of them? I'd only come back to this video if you're getting big and the contract is going to conflict with other stuff but from what I've seen with people who are big on twitch and are big else where (RUclips mainly) have no issue. RTgame, callmekevin, kitboga.. then again they're partners and not sure if that's much different to affiliate in terms of contract.
Just keep in mind, you'll only get a small chunk of the income you'll see. There's plenty of videos from other people explaining that without the whole off putting attitude.
@@Jaypeemedia yes! I would love to make a bit of money but I am not expecting to. I genuinely enjoy and love streaming. I streamed on a small platform for 4 years - sometimes I’d be streaming 8... 10... or more hours a day lol. Because I just loved it. If it could be my job I’d be so over the moon and happy but I’m not going into it with like the mindset of ‘this is going to be my job, I’m building a brand, I’m doing this to make money!’ I have the mindset of I love to stream, interact, i would like to be an affiliate because it feels like an accomplishment to me. Really put off by him saying it’s easy to get an average of 3 viewers. I guess if you cheat it is lol but it does take time and work... idk. If you start building up a community with people who like watching you and want to support you they’ll be happy for you and they might wait through the ads because they know it’ll help support you and they’ll want to stick around and want to keep watching after an ad. Like. Idk. I think it depends on the reason why you’re going into streaming.
This is kinda how I feel to be honest, I know I'll never be a big streamer and I don't really want it to be a full time job anyway - the cash I make from affiliate is small, but it's a nice little bonus payout for doing something I enjoy. I agree with all of his points if you're looking to make it big, but I don't think there's much harm in doing it if you just stream occasionally and aren't trying to build a big brand.
Thankyou, Im very close to being eligible to become an affiliate, listening to what you've said has completely changed my mind and has made me realise what could've gone wrong
I've applied as an affiliate a year ago. I did not feel like what I did was a mistake but now do. The damage is done but I keep my head up. I'm glad that watching your streams make me learn on the long run. I still try to make content and build a community. I am still happy to find your channel and keep learning! Keep it up Devin!
Yeah I got affiliate back in 2014 but quit streaming. Recently started again and really wish I hadn’t become one. The preroll ads are detrimental to small channels :/ oh well hindsight is 20/20
@mirkat @dareality contact support, you might be able to cancel it or somethin
I think a big issue I have with this video so far is that one. Even though it is easy to become affiliate at least without buying it I still don't know how viable/real that is. Its also difficult and I'd say an accomplishment still. Second he speaks of becoming a partner at a certain amount of subscribers. If you are not affiliate you won't be able to get subscribers so unless you are basing possible subscribers on followers and view counts. Which is still in accurate cause you have no idea if anyone wants to sub to you. Then you have no way of knowing if you will be making money off twitch. Plus 125 a month is nothing to scoff at especially for people doing this as a hobby.
RE: Ads
I am convinced that picture in picture ads are the way forward. Back in the days watching on television a live sports event, I would switch during the ads. But then they did picture in picture ads without the commentators commentating and w the sport sound muted, but still could watch the race/sport. I did not switch but continued to watch the sport.
ehh.. for sports that might work since its mostly just visual entertainment... how about you are watching a movie and in the dialogue there are multiple dramatic plottwists and/or reveals-- but you missed all of those cuz ads muted the movie (or series)... or how about you are watching educational show and when the most important part comes, the one you should takes notes from - then its muted and you can't hear what the "teacher" or expert, whatever, is saying. Now back to streaming: for me its not about the games - its about interaction. I don't think i can have conversation with someone who would go mute midspeech.. like... what if i just asked a question and they were answering it just when i get ad. Or if i try to catch stream early and while they are having introduction for the game or theme of the stream, lets say they are explaining a certain kind of challenge, if its on mute and there weren't graphics with texts or pictures on thrown in - i'd be quite confused to see my fav streamer doing something out of ordinary. I very much say no to this idea. To me it doesn't seem to work in most cases.
I can kinda see this for some content like repetitive games but it can block whole important pieces of context at times.
I think they need to get the streamer more involved regarding ad breaks etc.
When chilling in a queue lobby or really early in a match an “ad break” wouldn’t be as painful.
The other thing though is there’s a growing fear that ads are the next big bubble.. Twitch’s failed midrolls, and YTs new policies, and Wired’s recent report are examples of rumblings in the industry..
Thank you. I had no idea that this was even an issue! Really is sleezy, almost seems like twitch intentionally takes your growth to keep you under that $100 mark so they can just make money off of you. Thank you for saving my stream, I was going to take affiliate and had no idea
Thanks for saving me. I thought about starting to stream on twitch. I have a full time job and want to strat streaming for fun. Now I know I won't stream only on twitch for sure. Gonna watch more of your videos to figure out what to do. Great content.
If someone were to multistream as an affiliate
Could they go back to streaming to twitch exclusively once they think they're in "kill range" of twitch?
Since you can always re-onboard to affiliate status (after you offboard from it)I truly believe if a streamer is big enough, twitch would want to get him/her to stream for them exclusively.
Ninja for example
If you are big enough that Twitch would even check to see if you're streaming at the same time somewhere else you'd be beyond big enough to get partner.
So glad I found this, specially when I'm sort of getting desperate because I'm close to getting affiliate.
Whats your twitch ill help you out man ill follow
@@VAROYALTY please help me too🥺
@@VAROYALTY twitch: destyzzzz
@@xvynty7 got you! my twitch is iNocturnal_
Same!
Great video as usual. I feel like a lot of this is dependent on timing. I have zero regrets about becoming an affiliate. I only stream 6-8 hours per week and the rest of my energy is focused on recording/editing for youtube and tiktok etc
"Nobody cares if you're in different chats."
Personally I leave if people are reading from 2 different chats. They always neglect one or more of the chats and it's boring as a viewer to not know/see what they're replying to if they're not showing chat on stream/screen.
This helps a lot as someone who has been just began streaming!
When he was ranting about the ads on twitch I got an ad roll from youtube lmao
transcoding does matter specially for many areas where people have an average of 2mb/4mb internet speed and can't run 1080p or even 720p
i stop watching many streamers cause i couldn't reduce the quality less then 720p
You have to get partner to get transcoding though or be a large affiliate stream.
@@gyroninjamodder not really, it's first come first served. Our streams only average about 8 viewers but more often than not we have a transcode server
Yeah if I can't watch a stream without buffering I don't stick around, it's part of the reason I stream at 540p, never had anyone complain about quality but when I streamed at 720p I couldn't watch my own preview window and I had people complaining about buffering
You can get transcoding as an affiliate regardless of audience if server load is low when you start your stream
Or have it permanently as a partner.
@@CarlosFlores-pl3lb when traffic is low you can't grow
Thankyou for the bit at the end talking about being an anomaly, I'm floundering my day job right now and looking for ways out and I really needed to hear that.
restreaming kills chat interaction, which sounds like a big deal to me, especially when you are a small streamer.
Appreciate you going over the "donation vs tips" and chargebacks in this video. We are a 501c3 that streams on Twitch and were always curious if we had protection since donations are legitimately donations to a charity. A+ video!
so hes saying the exact opposite of what alpha gaming said in his video "never use restream"
I think the primary counter argument is that you may appeal to an audience that isn't on platform A but is on platform B
I'm pretty sure Harris changed his mind since then, considering the route twitch took.
He lists why he thinks that also. As an affiliate myself, I get robbed any time some wants to support me. I currently have 40 subs and I’m still not at $100 so I can’t even get that money yet.
I would be 100x better off not being an affiliate, broadcasting on multiple sites to bring in more viewers to build my brand, and also not have a prerolled ad that scares people off.
Restreaming Dilutes you, and your community is scattered. Makes no sense.
As someone who has friends that use restream, it’s a bad idea in my opinion. That means they have to check chat more often and it’s awkward when they’re replying to other comments that you can’t see and can’t really be apart of the conversation. And one chat is always focused on more than the other. It would be better to do a schedule where you stream to this platform this day, and this platform the next.
One of the most genuine talks about growing in the streaming/content creation world. Thank you Devin, always appreciate your videos and the insight they bring.
To my understanding, affiliates are allowed to stream anywhere they want. Your LIVE content is exclusive to Twitch for a 24 hour period and thats it. Partners are supposed to be exclusive to Twitch only but also do whatever the hell they want so realistically the exclusivity agreement on Twitch across the board is worthless.
@OkayDude TV Correct. Maybe you should too. Here, lemme help. "Live Content Exclusivity. Solely for any live audio-visual work you choose to provide to us as User Content (your “Live Twitch Content”), starting from beginning of the Initial Broadcast of any such Live Twitch Content, and continuing for a period of twenty-four (24) hours following the end of the Initial Broadcast of such Live Twitch Content (the “Exclusivity Period”), such Live Twitch Content is exclusive to Twitch (even as to you). During the Exclusivity Period of any Live Twitch Content, you will not, nor permit or authorize any third party to, broadcast, stream, distribute, exhibit and otherwise make available such Live Twitch Content in any manner. Notwithstanding the foregoing, you have the right to make any Live Twitch Content available, during the Exclusivity Period, solely via the Twitch Services. After the Exclusivity Period of any Live Twitch Content, the license to such Live Twitch Content will become non-exclusive and you will have the right to broadcast, stream, distribute, exhibit and otherwise make available such Live Twitch Content in any manner and format desired by you. The “Initial Broadcast” means the initial broadcasting, streaming, distribution, or other exhibition of Live Twitch Content via the internet, whether such Live Twitch Content is broadcast on a real-time, live basis as the subject event is occurring or such Live Twitch Content has been prerecorded and is being initially broadcast for the first time via any manner or method of streaming."
@@jess78044 Yea dude can't even get that right, he makes some good points but least have the facts
Thanks for informing me about this. I have been streaming relentlessly almost every single day since March 2020 and I don’t think I’m getting a good deal out of what I try and do. It’s not perfect but I try hard to get stuff going. If amazon or twitch is going to treat people who are dedicated to their app like peasants then I literally can’t take this as seriously as I want to and this upsets me very much. If you already are an affiliate what should you do? There was a time where I just used a paypal or BTC link instead of a sub button but people told me to get affiliate, but i ALWAYS hated the idea of being taxed out the ass so I just didnt do it....Thanks for this man
I was looking for a video of whether or not you HAVE to accept an affiliate contract in order to accept a partner contract later on. All I could find were videos saying "Become an affiliate fast!" And I literally don't even want to. So I appreciate this video.
There's also a luck advantage of being family related to a Twitch streamer that would make you get partnership fast like Sodapoppin's brothers BJ and Dkane got partnership, Tyler1's brother Erobb got partnership and being the boyfriend or girlfriend of a popular streamer helps as well.
I'm already a twitch affiliate but honestly I'm really thinking of switching to youtube after hearing everything. I don't really have a viewer base on twitch anyways and the 3 people who do watch me wont mind switching to RUclips.
i feel like twitch did something to you and now youre trying to get back at them.
same, like i want channel points as well so i can interact with viewers more and stuff like that also many streamers have affiliate and are fine with it
If you listened to the video, he’s simply saying that being an affiliate is not worth all of the negatives associated with twitch (ads driving off viewers being the biggest one in my opinion), and you should WAIT until you can become a partner to decide if you want to take on those negatives for the pros that come with being a partner.
I literally was just offered affiliate today and figured I would check out the video because I like to hear all sides. At the time I watched this I had no idea about a contract or anything. Thank you for explaining everything because the thought of signing over what I have worked hard to create for an unknown end goal makes no sense to me. Great video!!!!
I just started streaming 3 weeks ago, and my friends have been supporting me while streaming. I’m at 45 followers, and was thought affiliate was going to be awesome to reach. Everything you said makes perfect sense. The only thing I would ask is if I should stick to twitch because that what all my friends and majority of the people know? I personally have never streamed or watched any live streams anywhere else. Maybe I should start streaming on YT, while I still can, my only fear is that I won’t grow as much on YT.
You will absolutely grow more on YT, I speak from experience. With the ability to make videos, and to keep your streams up forever, you will be able to grow on RUclips MUCH more easily. I typically only get about 1 viewer a stream on Twitch, but on RUclips, depending on the time of day, I might get around 6-10 viewers. Any chat interaction is bettter than none! You can also apply the tactic of making good thumbnails and getting discovered by the algorithm. It's overall just easier to grow on RUclips, whether you stream or not.
That ending monologue of 'going through the motions' is gold.
What about streamers that make most of their money on gifted subs?
i didn’t realize most affiliates made less than $50 a month it makes me appreciate being able to cash out every month a little more. great video devin
Affiliate is 3 viewers and anything between 3 and like a 100 viewers is a dead zone where you don't make anything unless you have some seriously generous viewers that donate a lot for some reason, I don't know the numbers but the amount of streams with 100 or less viewers is huge.
@@Johansen1000 I know a streamer who streams with 8 average viewers , he got affiliate 2 months ago , and already cashed out £120. But like you said it's probaly because he has generous viewers
@@kitn2507 As I said you don't make anything, £120 for 2 months work, any crappy job and you would make that in less than 2 days, if you have a job that actually requires an education you'll make it in 2 hours.
Well I've had affiliate for about a year, and I have only cashed out onces about 2 weeks ago, I sit with an average of 4 viewers and of I'm lucky about 2 subs a month. I have been a bit luckyer of late with bits but yeah, it's hell gaining views.
@@llamaduden3397 considering offboarding because u would be growing 30% faster. ur slowing almost half ur growth by having ads and ur not making any money anyways. u could be growing faster
You could argue bits donations are more valuable to affiliates because it's an extra revenue opportunity. I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination. Just keeping an open mind.
I know that this is an older video, but I’ve been struggling with the ad manager on Twitch trying to get the pre roll ads off…. I wish I would have found this video before I decided to go forward with the affiliate program.
I like the way you type out notes and you explain things really well. Thank you for helping people. ❤
Thank you for that. One question still: Won't affiliates get recommended to people more likely on twitch than non affiliates? I mean they are profiting of Affiliates, wo why not recommend them? So if that is true, being an Affiliate makes you more discoverable?
It might get you recommended more, but it isn't gonna be by much, if anything xD
Everything else in that 'contrct', is a joke. So I don't believe you are gonna get recommended by much, or anything even, again.
It absolutely will, if you see someone's name with the tick symbol on the side, it immediately makes you want to check them out. But i feel like this video's message is very skewed, there is a reason why every one, i mean 99% of people will agree that getting affiliate is the right move and if it really was a problem, then i am pretty sure all the top creators would opt out of it. This view is skewed because it's coming from a business stand point, marketing for maximum profit and expose yourself as much as possible, so basically stream on youtube, facebook, twitch which is honestly just not a smart idea, this guy calls it split testing, i don't know marketing but he's probably correct, i guess split testing applies to real life businesses and marketing but in terms of streaming which is entertainment coming from 1 individual, it just doesn't make much sense. Twitch is meant for streaming, youtube is not known for streaming but for uploading content, and no one cares about facebook, it really doesn't matter if twitch is the only platform you can stream on because it is the best platform to stream on, you get emotes, you can easily clip things etc, it's just built solely for streaming unlike youtube or facebook. I think objectively the best thing isn't to not get twitch affiliate, but to get it, and in terms of exposing yourself more out there, stream on twitch, upload videos on youtube, upload clips on tiktok, maybe even twitter or instagram, it's true that people don't really get known from twitch itself but that is exactly what youtube is for, along with tiktok.
Brand dilution is such a bogus concept when it comes to streamers. The name of the game is absolute exposure. The very practice of oversaturating is the entire engine on how you get maximum exposure.
Something to note about restream.io, they charge a ridiculous monthly payment to stream to a Facebook public page.
I just discovered this video as I have been grinding for affiliate, now I have a lot to think about. Thanks Devin, I appreciate you!
my one problem with is he mainly just going on about money, and i know a lot of small streamers personally, and not one of them cares about the money. they mainly just care about having a good community that wants to watch them. and if u actually enjoy a streamer u will watch the ad cuz u want to watch that streamer
"Channel points will help engagement in chat but not increase watch-time" THAT'S WHAT I WANT. ENGAGEMENT IN CHAT IS THE BEST THING ABOUT STREAMING. I'd rather watch a streamer with 100 viewers who's engaging with chat than a streamer with 1000+ viewers who hardly looks at chat.
I don’t know why streamers don’t talk to their viewers. When I stream I actually talk to my viewers but I can’t look at chat while I’m playing until I die or the match ends then I’ll talk to them. I feel like streamers should talk to the viewers instead of reading the donations and etc.
Exactly right? i love engagement with the streamer more than anything only reason why i would stay longer cus feels like they're talking to us. He's really salty bout this.
I'm seriously trying to find a reason why I should listen to someone who has to second guess themselves om 10*2.5=25
if that's really what you got from this then you need some serious help. like actually
@@delamain2077 if you tell someone they need help based off a simple RUclips comment then you need some serious help. Like actually
@@frankieselback4407 you just did the same exact thing.
I made sure i sent this to my brother as soon as i saw it he just started streaming on twitch. He would be way more sucessful working on his youtube and multistreaming cross platform
To anyone wondering:
9. Term and Termination. The term of this Agreement will begin upon our acceptance of your Program application and will end when terminated by either you or us. Either you or we may terminate this Agreement at any time, with or without cause, by giving the other party written notice of termination. We may withhold accrued unpaid Program Fees for a reasonable period of time following termination to ensure that the correct amount is paid (e.g., to account for any cancelations or returns). Upon any termination of this Agreement, all rights and obligations of the parties will be extinguished, except that the rights and obligations of the parties under Sections 8 and 11-17 will survive the termination of this Agreement. If you terminate the Agreement and your earned balance equals or exceeds the Payment Threshold, we will pay you your earned balance within approximately 45 days after the end of the calendar month in which the Agreement is terminated, pursuant to Section 4.1. Any earned balance below the Payment Threshold will remain unpaid. No termination of this Agreement will relieve either party for any liability for any breach of, or liability accruing under, this Agreement prior to termination
This video could not have come at a better time. Due to internet issues I had to take a temporary step back from streaming on Twitch. I was determined to get that Affiliate status, so when I couldn't stream for a bit I was really discouraged at first.
But now it feels freeing not worrying about going Affiliate, and I've got more time to focus on Instagram art and RUclips. Still planning to stream on Twitch again soon, but this time with more focus on content diversification
already making multiple accounts to utilize restream! Thank you for the incredibly eye-opening facts
"You should never become twitch affiliate" also him "Im affiliate on my twitch channel"
ikr
The most annoying thing about Twitch ads is that they replay the same ad over and over again until seeing it is just absolutely mind numbing and irritating
I've been thinking this for a while and it's good to hear the data supports it. Need to get out of my affiliate contract immediately. Regarding emotes, each to their own but even when they're cool it's such a scam to give money to the Amazon black hole for pretty pixels. But I'm also old enough to remember 00s-era forums where they all had killer custom emotes for free.
I'm very new to streaming and this is all new info to me. I'm glad to have this info and perspective now rather than later when I might have been eligible for the affiliate program and signed the contract without knowing better. Subbed
I really appreciate the detailed breakdown in this. I especially agree with the terrible, unwelcoming preroll system.
That said, while I understand and agree that things like restreaming are better for growth, I wonder about the quality of that growing community. Through reading comments here and my own experience it seems that Twitch has the most engaged community. I have only ever seen a couple restreamers and it felt weird seeing the streamer interact with different communities and people in chats at being unable to interact with each other. What is everyone else's experience with restreams?
I have really enjoyed the affiliate program, especially for the emotes, channel points, transcoding, and monetization options. I have made about $1000 in 7 months, which is small compared to the amount of work, and perhaps could be more had people been on multiple platforms and people considered donating, but thst is money I made along my journey and I'm very proud of it. And there is something to say for the accessibility of Twitches easily accessible payment options like subs, gifted subs, and bits.
I know Twitch does not help small streamers grow, but fortunately my goal is personal growth first and twitch stream second, and in that regards being an affiliate has helped with that.
You should make a video about multi streaming with Harris since you both have opposite views it would be interesting
If you have 50 followers and no path to make a career out of streaming its fun to have your own emotes and get a random twitch prime here and there. This whole analysis is only aimed at creating a brand and making a career out of your personality by looking at the success cases. 99% of affiliates will never have these supposed issues down the line because they are never getting there.
Well put
The worst thing about being a Twitch Affiliate (as well as a regular Twitch video live-streamer) in my opinion is that VOD's (a.k.a. archived video live-streams) are *_only_* available for viewers for *_*14*_*_ _*_days;_* and you in being a Twitch Partner isn't much better there when it comes to VOD storage: VOD's/archived video live-streams are *_only_* available to viewers to watch for *_*60*_*_ _*_days_* - *_that_* is what I hate the most about Twitch; I usually don't have time to watch *_several/many_* archived video live-streams in any given week/7-day period (though I *_*try*_* to do that as much as I can in recent weeks, which is *_*THE*_*_ _*_ONLY_* reason why I even *_follow_* a few Twitch video live-streamers but subscribe/give donations to none on Twitch).
Such solid content. Good to see someone thinking it through and speaking it.
Twitch is winner takes it all and a rip off when it comes to monetization.
super thought provoking. I appreciate the way you approach the whole discussion. one of the biggest reasons I am attracted to twitch is how feature rich it is (natively and because of ease of implementing or developing a 3rd party extension), will have to do some more research on what's possible with RUclips streaming currently, and cross my fingers YT gets better as a live streaming platform. but for now.. I really like channel points, and am turned off by the idea of splitting my chat via restreaming. will go check out your video on restreaming to see if you can convince me.
I feel like i just got my mind unf’d! Just thank you 🙏🏾!
from 34:00 its the best realest and truest advice Devin has ever given. Not to toot my own horn but i am an example of exactly that part he covers there!
Your comment on value connects so well to my organizational strategy class as we have talked extensively about creating value and finding out how to create sustainable competitive advantage. Can’t believe university is actually helping me better connect and understand industries as much as it has.
I just left Twitch after clicking on two streams and getting two consecutive pre-roll ads. Closed the tab and came here, so can confirm.
Not only that, I recently canceled my yearly amazon prime sub. There's no way I'm paying them to show me this gross amount of ads, if they want money from ads then they won't get it from me. I'm so done with their bs. All their fReE (mobile) gAmEs (loot) with prime is not worth it and it's not what people wanted.
hey,alright
I'm already an affiliate but this whole re streaming argument across multiple platforms is just a hassle which is why i didn't care much when i signed up for affiliate. Not only do you have to keep track of different chats when your live on multiple platforms you also have to setup alerts for all these different platforms not for me seems to much of a hassle i'm happy being a twitch affiliate only also as a twitch affiliate your still able to upload clips to twitter and a day later youtube so you are still leveraging different platforms. Also lets say you decided not to be an affiliate and multi stream on fb, youtube and other sites and start building a following on them. You then accept twitch partner how do you think those fans on fb and RUclips would feel that your unable to stream on their preferred platform? you would be a sellout in their eyes you really think they would follow you to twitch? haven't we learnt this from what ninja did? Also i don't recommend PayPal they did me dirty when first starting out streaming they permanently terminated my account and future accounts because of being a streamer aka high risk so if your in the states recommend using SEPays in streamelements in case they do the same to you. Unfortunately, they don't have SEPays for Canada so Bits and Subs are the only way my fans can support me if they want. FUCK PAYPAL!
That's a good point about losing followers from other platforms if you accept twitch partner. I'm also confused on how you can get to partner without ever accepting affiliate? Like do you just show them your stats on these other platforms and slip straight to partner?
@@jacoblindsey6888 You don't need to be an affiliate to apply for Partner, just like when you're an affiliate and you hit the Partner numbers it isn't a guarantee that they'll accept your Partnership application. Partnership isn't automatic like Affiliate is.
@@jacoblindsey6888 Naw, only people watching on twitch count towards the partnership requirement. Which is another reason i feel this whole multi-platform stream has more cons then pros in my opnion.
Glad someone else wrote this. Perfectly said.
You can set up a combined chat on your stream (restream does that) so you only have to read one, then you can put that chat on screen. I have the "youtube gang" jokingly harass the "twitch gang" on since they can read each other, that boost the engagement.
When you see you're on your way to get partner on twitch you'll focus on it, it's not like one day you wake up and see "oh I'm partner, sorry youtube people, you gotta switch". That process takes months...
"hassle" is spending like 4 hours setting up alerts on all the platforms. Streamelements does that for you, you can just import alerts from one platform to another. If you want to live with streaming I think you can invest 4 hours into it.
Bro, you've done it really good! I'm just starting my brand now and there's lot of ideas that i reconstruct after you've done this video. Thank you a lot! :)
i just started moving from being youtube-exclusive to restreaming and was wondering what twitch affiliate means. thank you sooooo much for the straightforward and honest explanation!!! insta-subscribed!!!
I have one note/question to add, back when I first started streaming, BEFORE I became affiliate, I had plenty of people come in to my stream and complain that they had to sit through a pre-roll ad! I also recall visiting a few of my friends streams who were also just starting out and there was ALWAYS a pre-roll... the only difference was down the bottom, instead of reading “this ad helps support *Streamer Name*” it would read “this ad helps support Twitch”.
Now they may have changed this since and made the decision to remove pre-rolls from non-affiliates, but back when I first signed the agreement, EVERYBODY had ads, they just weren’t getting any revenue from them...
So Ive been streaming for almost 3 months, I hit affiliate after like 1 week and the same month I got my first paycheck through gifted subs and a lot of bits.
I just wanna mention that Im succsessfull with being a little irrelevant streamer with 20 viewers who actually are benefitting a lot from the affiliate program.
The reason why I made this comment isnt to tell Im right ur wrong or whatever, But If you only wanna stream on twitch I honestly think affiliate is a good idea in some scenerios.
did you give them the options to pay/support you through paypal or patreon?
just wondering, because obviously if your only payment methods are subs and bits, and you aren't pushing for people to use paypal/patreon where you aren't getting as much money taken. then obviously they're going to donate with bits/subs
like im curious if you 1. even have paypal/patreon set up 2. after each donation or before donations do you go, " please use paypal/patreon to support me instead of subs/bits, but i appreciate all of them" / " patreon/paypal are my preffered payment methods"
also, is subs/bits the only way you're benefiting. if not: in what other ways are you benefitting from the affiliate program?
@@mysticflow467 I told them one time to use Paypal Yeah, and the paypal is setup to the stream ”donation” Button, and Im Also able to use twitch emotes and subscribtion badges with the affiliate program; which is benefitting the stream a lot in many ways, we have inside jokes about the emotes and stuff
Re-streaming is the reason? I can still put out content on RUclips, Facebook, and Twitter as a Twitch affiliate while keeping my potential $100 a month. Why not?
That’s not really what he’s saying but aight
It would be more profitable in the long run to livestream on multiple platforms simultaneously. You can grow a youtube livestream faster than you can grow a youtube channel, and you'll have a hell of a time getting those youtube viewers into your twitch afterward and that's the more lucrative income source
@@chizystreams can you name one popular streamer who streams on all platforms? Better yet ask yourself why isn’t Devin Nash practicing what he preaches? Pretty sure he accepted twitch affiliate himself since he’s a partner lol
@@traughdaddy He's a full-on partner. He has his target audience, and a lot of his content has to do with twitch specifically so it makes sense for him to settle there. I accepted the affiliate contract with twitch ages ago so even if I were to get back into streaming I couldn't multistream, but I have to imagine if you can be in more places at once you have a higher chance of being discovered.
@@traughdaddy I think you missed the point where this whole video was about starting streamers and not popular ones with thousand viewers. Sounds like the whole point of the video flew straight over your head to be honest.
Loved your video here. I canceled my affiliate yesterday, and I decided to go look around for other people making bullet points for why this is a good idea so that I could explain concisely why I did this, and your video here takes the cake in this regard and really helped me put my thoughts in order in an explainable way. Thanks much dude!
I was suspicious of this video at first, but you make a lot of valid points. It seems like too much grinding for too little return.
hey, thank you for this. I've just recently started streaming on Twitch, and I've been watching all kinds of videos on how to improve my stream, what to do to grow, etc. I'm extremely new, I only have 10 followers that I've managed to gain in the past 6 days, with one regular viewer. That viewer is super active and I've managed to get some attention from a couple of other small streamers on Twitch, but that being said, I think it's more important to be able to multistream as you make a lot of good points on how to do so. So, thank you for the information, it's super helpful, and you've gained a sub for the heads up. I appreciate your advice, thanks again.