1998 GMC c8500 weird truck! no start! Why would someone order a truck this way? part 1
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- Опубликовано: 26 авг 2024
- This is a 1998 GMC c8500. I must be missing something on this one. Why would someone order this truck with this combination of engine, transmission, rear differentials and suspension? Odd very odd to me!
I think topkicks are awesome looking. That’s a sweet truck for sure.
I love the GMC topkick, I think there sharp looking trucks, would love to own that.
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Donald swink same
Drive one enough and you'll hate it
Topkicks/Kodiaks of this era never had a large engine. They all had a small cat or a big block gasser; some of the later ones had an Isuzu 7.8.
Our kodiak has a 454.
The weird thing is that this video popped up on my feed because I had that exact truck in Pennsylvania and I have yet seen one like it since, mine was I believe a 2000 “Chevy” c8500 16’ TRI AXLE DUMP with a 300 hp cat and a Eaton fuller 8LL it was a dog... raised cab roof bubble. I loved that truck.
We have a 91 kodiak where I work that has the same engine. It's a bear to start, but once you get it going it'll run all day. The only bad thing about it is the transmission is a 4 speed allison automatic. It sucks on the highway.
I spent 4 days on my mechanical 3116, but it was an easy fix, I just replaced it with a DT466, runs great now. Cat should offer that in the parts manual!! Wind didn't bother me a bit!! Great info, but I am still gonna stay away from them, at least 100 feet or more!
Jonathan W kinda cool to see someone I'm subscribe to watching the same videos
Jonathan W that fixed it for sure! if I can get it going I should cut the rears off and stick a single axle under it. then the engine would be suitable for something smaller. like a 10' dump, flatbed, gooseneck hauler, small wrecker or what ever.
why would any one use a ih dt466 it was junck
roy myers dt 466 is a fantastic motor!! Why do you say that? What's your bad experience with it
@@Mad.Man.MarineI agree they are Junk!, though mine were HEUI 466E and Both Tossed a rod before 225K whereas my T444E ran for 400K when I sold it same size 4700 International trucks... The T444E is still in service at 600K as a toy box!
That fuel line crossover had me dying god i love this truck life
The fuel situation reminds me of a 24 valve Cummins I bought 5 years ago. Seller thought the truck had a fuel delivery problem...he was right in part. The tank was dead empty! I brought 5 gallons of fuel with me and she fired right up. Ended up with a killer deal on the truck.
HEUI=
Hydraulic
Electronic
Unit
Injector
I enjoy your vids and projects.
I did a Detroit c6500 a few years back with the same crossover issue
I've been pulling wrenches all my life this was a great video that you made ! You are approaching this problem in the right way !! 100 % if it where I would do the same thing I hope and pray that you find the problem I would scrutinize ever electrical connections with a fine tooth comb !! In my past experience 50 years !! Everyone over looks them !! I would spend all day on that rig just disconnecting each wire connector and looking for any corrosion period !!! I cant stress enough how important having a clean corrosion free connection is !! If is not a clean connection it will not give a positive signal to the E C M ??? Then the E C M will be confused?? And shut everything down
🇯🇲🥃😎shit after this guy is done talking I’m gonna become a full blown mechanic , way to go man I sure learned a lot in a short space of time
Some of those engines have a fail safe for oil and water. If the fluid are low or the seners are bad the engine will eather shut off or won't start.
That's a very common engine and drive train for that Chevy. Probably has a deep reduction, normally a 9LL trans. Cheap farm truck
HEUI's can also have a external o-ring failure between the hp oil cavity and the lo press fuel cavity external to the injector, causing hp oil to be forced in the diesel fuel ,emptying the oil pan.and there would be no smoke. if someone changes HEUI injectors without properly (or not) replacing those external o-rings this can happen.
Yeah that's a normal farm truck set up low speed high torque cheap to operate
I know the feeling brother. I've got a 14L Detroit I'm about ready to either part out or set a blaze.
i haven't had any big problems with the 14L engines. is it the emissions?
You need to buy a longer dipstick clearly nobody has yet
Wow I Can't believe this was 3 years ago this is one of the First videos I saw from you JC
I think that GMC had the 3116 Cat because nothing larger would fit without either stretching the hood or modifying the cab.
My brother in law has one that he uses to haul corn from the field to the bins. About 50 mph is its top speed. The small engine works just fine on the farm. My biggest complaint, is it dies t want to turn with a load of corn. All it wants to do is go straight.
Injector o rings leaking oil into your fuel. Happens with those cats. Father in law has a 3116 and 3126 and both have done that. Easy fix. Both of them have been great engines
The only reason I could think of it having that engine is that someone hated the idea of the Isuzu diesel being installed in that engine bay.
Honestly I really kinda like those old Gmc’s
It was a field truck with not enough power to break from an employee but built to haul the load.
HEUI - hydraulic electronic unit injection. The 3116 came first as a mechanical injection engine. The 3126 was next with the HEUI system. For some reason GM wanted to continue with the 3116 which Cat then modified for the HEUI system. I did a lot of training on these engines.
What is wrong with the GMC Topkick ? I always liked them .
damn that is a nice truck , huge surprise seeing a 3116 in a monster truck like that ,,i've got a 3116 in a chevy 5500 service truck
mine is only a 24000 GVWR though ,,not a hotrod by any right but it does the job
It's like hearing a lecture in Chinese... no clue. But I enjoyed the video, you seem knowledgeable and not a know it all. Hope you get it fixed, I love those old square trucks like that.
Nice truck,, love it!!
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HEUI = Hydraulically actuated electronic controlled unit injector
If this is the same HUEI system that was on the 7.3L Power Stroke Ford, you will need to use a 15w40 with defoamer in motor oil. I used to drive one for a company, and we were informed that the only oil at the time that contained this defoamer was Motorcraft or Shell Rotella 15w40. If your oil is foaming, you will lose oil pressure and I bet your injection would probably not make pressure either. Some of the things you said tend to indicate this very thing. Ford said it would lose power. The computer may sense pressure drop and shut her down.
we used trucks like this for hauling steel in the city , light truck , small and easy to get around in and a fuel sipper and do not need lots of speed in the city just power to pull a full load , 25-30 K , and the walking beam made it easier on our back .
I'd take a guess, and it is a guess, that the reason that truck was specified like that with the low power engine and high GVW is because it was only used over short distances, it certainly wouldn't have been a highway truck. Based on the fact that it came from a potato farm I would say it was used for transporting the potatoes from the harvesting fields to the sorting and processing plant so short runs and the high GVW was to carry the maximum amount as modern harvesting equipment can easily outpace the turnaround time for smaller trucks hauling the harvest in. This one probably got retired when even it wasn't carrying enough each load to keep up with the harvesting. It's going to have worked hard but it certainly looks like it was well taken care of, but I would expect it to have a lot more wear than the miles would suggest...
They worked great on farms
I come from Maine. They were very popular. I have had two of them myself as firewood delivery trucks with 4 cord bodies.
Walking beam very valuable we can never keep enough in the salvage yard
That really is an odd truck. Such an underpowered engine for that long wheelbase and tandem rear axles. I agree, some of the cat engines aren't desirable. It'd probably be better for parts since it's an undesirable setup
260 ac! Put 2 windows down & do 60! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Nice video.!!
I laughed my ass off when u mentioned 260 air conditioning system.. :)) keep up the good work.. thanx
I hated doing service calls on trucks with 3116 engine, especially in the winter when below 40 degrees F. The rest of the tuck is a great farm truck!!
I have a '93 Chevy Kodiak 33k GVW with a 3116 and it has been an excellent truck. It is not an exciting truck but it has delivered several thousand cords of wood for me. I do wish it had the bump in the roof!!
I’ve been hauling rock with a very similar C8500. This one is an absolute turd with a 7.8 Isuzu and a 8LL transmission. I’ve been 51k-56k loaded. It’ll only do 11mph pulling the hill out of the quarry wide open in 3rd gear. Tried 4th and she just wouldn’t 😂 I will say it handles the weight just fine as far as chassis and brakes…
Only thing I hated about them 3116's is there not a sleeved block.makes a pain to do an inframe
That is a pretty oddball setup.. Ive never seen a 9speed in a C7600-8500.. Ive seen tandems, butNot that long. But that thing aint gonna be no hi-way truck.. Thatd be OK on flat ground haulin local.. Like you said somebody must have ordered it.. Thatd truck be fine with a single axle. shorter frame.
Working for Concrete Alternatives in Drums, Pa we inherited a truck EXACTLY like this truck except it had a gas engine. It wouldn't run. I spent hours under it, on top of it and couldn't ever find out why... I assumed it was a bad ground. I was going to put an aftermarket electric fuel pump on it. It never did get running as far as I know. One of our PENNDOT 6.0's mangled some injectors and I never got back to that Chevy. I have no idea what was happening in it.
We have one of those where i work. Its a little more beat up than that one. I know thats not the same engine we got, but i weighed 50,000 total hauling gravel with it today. And she barely moves. It will do 65 loaded like that but it takes forever to get up there with the allison 5 speed auto. I hate that combo. Ac still works ok in it but radio is busted. We broke drivers side rear spring once and had a hard time finding a new one. But i love that suspension. Rides good when loaded and handles curves WAY better than the internationals we have. That c 85 i dont have to slow down in curves. But the heavy duty new macks and the internationals i have to drop down to 50 mph to make certain turns and its still nerve racking! But not with the chevy!
Really a nice pick for custom applications, awesome rear suspension.
Yeah pretty common setup. See older boom trucks set up like this a lot.
I bet that Truck was probably never intended to do much interstate travel. It probably hauled stuff from the fields to the storage bins or something and on 2 lane back roads. A friend of mine owns a big commercial farm and he’s still got some old Chevys and GMC’s with gas engines and big grain bodies on them they never need to run over about 55 mph anyways and the front end is pretty light so they don’t get stuck in the fields when there empty With the lightweight gas engine. The internationals with the DT 466 is seem to mar up the front axle and get stuck when they’re empty.
Drove a 99 gmc 6500 dump bed with the 3126 and nv5500 i believe and it was ok. Had 300k or better on the engine. But i ended up being upgraded to a 06 ford 650 with the c7 and auto trans roll off and it was the worst thing I've ever driven. With only 33k on it.
also that crazy truck spec sounds like a bucket truck spec too.
haha on the fuel tank situation!
Street Drive 64 I forgot to put in the video that I found the oil leak....oil drain plug gasket was bad. I will be back on tomorrow but not for too long.....at least that is what I say. if I don't fix it ..it will drive me nuts.
@@j.c.smithprojects bad drain plug gasket but no oil on the ground?
Where did it leak to?
How much is this truck? Or what would one normally go for?
Boy , it sounds like an ass !!! Wow , but you gotta love country living !! I gotta hand to you troubleshooting the Cat , it sounds endless , I do hope you find what everybody else couldn't !!
it will just take time. my scanner doesn't go back to that old of a truck. a scanner would let me see the crank signal, injector control pressure, injector pressure regulator percentage and so on. this would make diagnosing much easier but....if it was easy everybody would do it. i made a hydraulic pressure gauge set up to test the icp pressure. i can use a volt meter to see crank signal. i can dead head the regulator and give the oil rail full pressure. its not ideal but it is better than spending money on software i may never use again.
That is a pretty common configuration in my neck of the woods. I even see a lot of c7500 tandems with the 366 Gas.
no kidding....not common around here...too little of an engine for such a heavy chassis.
Popular here in KY as farm trucks - don't need a big engine when you're never going over 35 mph. I have 2 myself, a 76 Chevy C65 with the 366 / Clark 5 + Eaton 2 and an 05 C5500 Topkick with the 8.1 / Allison 5 auto but my use is opposite: I use them as race car transporters, which isn't a lot of weight. Very cost effective when you need a big truck but not 100% of its capacity all the time.
Love that truck and would buy it for the right price but there's alot of people here in Phoenix would want that truck so good luck or sell it...
Thats a farm truck. Great to convert to a sprayer or nurse truck.
Dude I would have loved working with you on this
Hi I think it's a good looking truck. Would make a great house truck. That's like a tiny house blended with a rv. Popular in New Zealand where I live. Unfortunately big gmc truck are rear over here. Anyway thanks for the interesting video.
It was mentioned. The 3116 would run rough if it needed oil or or an oil change. It was rather experimental.
I liked the cab design
3116 replaced the 3208 which was a common engine in top kicks . Most came with hydraulic brakes unless ordered otherwise they where a favorite for rental company's penski herts
I drove a binder box truck with that same engine. 6 spd eaton. I had to push that truck to get it to highway speed. Its an odd setup for sure
You lost me a while back, my fault, I never understand diesel talk. I now own a Japanese tractor w/diesel, I better learn. Good video, I did learn some things, thanks for sharing. Guess I’ll put in for summer school.
not sure what you mean by odd duck. thats a very common combo all over the country. probably one of the most common
I got a 3126 that had a hard start one day then the next day would not even start changing fule filter don't really now much about cat motor but win u try to prime with the plunger it's builds up then falls and don't hold prsher
am I the odd one that likes the top kicks? not that motor though.
Oil quality is going to be the biggest concern in those setups so even though you just put oil in it what's the condition? Happens all the time in the Ford f250 f350 s 450s. That's cheap and I would check there first and also look to see if the filters been sucked dry for the fuel filter on the side of the motor.
They should have marketed 3306 D I engines more.. they were great! The newer engines were junk in my opinion and I worked for cat 42 years..
Douglas Meek did you ever run into the ARD head on any of the newer on highway engines
Oh god, ARD head updates on sdp c15's and lee c13's. what a pita. especially when an m2 would come in with a c13 in it.
I sell truck parts and I had a customer call me who had picked up one with low miles and had a 3116 Cat and wanted to find a 3116 to put back in it and nobody makes a crate engine not Cat or not even in an aftermarket engine. The 3126 was a better medium duty engine like you said. I have seen some people have put DT466 engines in them. Those TopKicks are pretty desirable when parted out if you can be patient and find people wanting the parts.
3 of our compactors have 3126's. One has a Mercedes. The Mercedes doesn't have a draw. And the injection pump is belt driven.
I have a '99 w/ the 454gas n allison 4spd auto just single axle rear but I'm having trouble getting a good ecm for it, can u help any?
It's got the same injection set up as a 7.3 powerstroke wich the 7.3 powerstroke is the international t444E.
Anthony Young heui injection. Cat has heui pumps powerstrokes have hpops
@@JamsheedRpgGodBoss it's the same thing just looks different I'm a machanic I work on all that junk.
I actually like the truck. I don’t know much about that engine though. Looking forward to what you find out on this truck.
That looks like a 3126a model. I like that engine. Would make a great generator
Man I have 7 of those trucks and motor combo those are stout motors out pull 60serries detroit if you turn them up easy to do to we have 1 with over 1mil miles on it I turn them up every day for people
Extra lube
You turning up the mechanically injected versions, I presume?
Man i would love to work for u n learn from u. I could learn more from u than the 2 years spent in auto tech .
Cool truck
I don’t think I’ve ever watched a mans hands as much as yours.
Wonder if its the hand that visits Svengoolie at the end of show?
Funny but I never knew that cat built that phony hvhp pump for ford/corn queen but I was thinking it sounded like the same system my 95 f350 had which could work like a dream or be your nightmare. I did all sorts of things like digging into that heater in the fuel bowl or the glow plugs not cycling.. then you mentioned it and wala boom.That particular cat motor was a throw away engine, no power and a nine speed must have some low gears in the rear end. I wound up putting a air shift four speed progressive brownie in so that old dump truck could make it out of the pit. What gets me is that they had great turn one screw in and on manual fuel system on like the 3406 which is a great little engine that can make some serious power. Of course it wasn't the 3408 which if you could afford fuel for, you didn't need a job, just a place to spend money. I had about three of them over the years that for the right money was the deal. So I'm curious as to what you find. Love your videos
That thing looks brand new
My brother's 7.3l powerchoke was doing the same thing now it misses bad and its smoking white, any guesses as to what it could be
I love odd ducks :)
I think its the regulator cause our powerstroke shuts off randomly but when it cools down it turns on again so we change it and it solved that problem
That 3116 cat will handle just about anything you throw at it.
School bus motor
@@rustedratchetgarage6788 nope that come in alot of different vehicles.
had a couple of those one was a boom truck and the other was a Lowe's lumber delivery truck very bad combination j.c. I agree I also have worked on really crappy sterling's same combination c7 cat with 9 spd 40k rears Hendrickson really bad on fuel too
jesse salinas all I can figure is it was ordered by someone who wasn't familiar with those engines. they had been out for many years by the time this one hit the road. it is just suck a low hp and low torque engine for this application.
yes sir I've seen lots of wire line boom trucks here in Texas with that combination on sterling's early ones those truck weigh approx 57k with the national 900 crane mounted very small hp for that application that happens when companies hire a corporate guy that seats behind a desk and knows nothing on trucks to order trucks for them lol
jesse salinas right....bean counter ordering trucks..I would assume they thought they could save fuel with the small engine. too bad it was the exact opposite!
Exactly what I first thought you have an air leak that slowly builds up to a pocket
The only thing really wrong with this truck is the Cat. There is a reason why Cat got out of the truck engine business. If you could put a M-11 Cummins or I guess a International city Truck engine turbo charger and cut the muffler. Put a mechanical water temp guage and a mechanical oil pressure. Is there oil in the water? The cab and chassis is ok too. The long frame will give you a better body selection etc. Good luck
What is that noise the neighbor makes?
we had a few of these odd balls in our fleet, noone cared to use them and they were very weak in daily duties.
it was like we had to buy a few of these every year to be equal opportunity to the rest.
they saw more time sitting in the yard than any serious work.
one big waste of money !
I just subscribed to your channel because you are great at explaining. Thank you can't wait for more
HEUI = Hydraulic Electronic Unit Injection 😁 ... Definitely an odd build you found.
That is a common injector of cat engines
The reason behind this combination is the keyword “farm” they carry heavy ass loads I pick up stuff at farms daily and I see what these truck haul
Yup, my buddy has a c70 gmc with a smallblock chevy he bought from a farm.
Henry Dillard small block Chevy? Was it a feather farm
I like the bodyi just never liked the dash its the same dash as the pickups its cheap cracks easy,that suspensionis strong my dad had a international with a 671 detroit this suspension out lasted the truck,when the truck wore out he cut the frame added a cab front end with a 350 cummins hauled another 10 years retired sold the truck,truck was mostly used off road feed dirt etc it was a dump truck
my rig sits in the Texas sun all day, and it has for almost all its life. never had a cover for it. guess what? no cracks. maybe if someone beats the shot out of it, but they are solid. I have a swb 1990 Silverado. same dash and all essentially
Ive seen quite a few cracked ,i have a 2010 suburban i hear and have seen alot of them cracked mine never has its acording to the weather if you live where it gets real cold in winter and hot in summer there bad about cracking where the insterment panel connects ive seen alot of them cracked there
What did you end up doing with this old gmc were looking for one
I drove a few 1994 models with the Blue Bird cheese bus body with the same engine and four speed automatic. I hated those buses to pieces. They were as slow as a mule with arthritis. The engine smoked like a dirty chimney, driving uphill was a lesson in futility, and I hated the instrumentation. Just yuck.and triple yuck. The 2004 Freightliner with the Mercedes engine was a much better improvement, and it was fun to drive.
Electrical short on the IDM Injector Drive Module.
Had same on a powerstroke once.
HEUI = Hydraulic Electric Unit Injector.
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I think thats why the ford guys use higher pressure oil pumps too.. Im a cummins guy but i do read and watch videos about other stuff too.
20k tandems only give you 34k total, not 40k. That's why you'll see semi trailers with spread axles , the 2 axles around 5ft apart, they have too be a certain distance apart to be allowed 20k each. So you have a gvwr of 45k (11+34), not 51k.
Dustin, u r incorrect sir. 34.000 is the max legal weight on that tandem. Gross Vehicle Weight Rating on each axle 2 & 3 is 20,000. Ergo 20,000 plus 20,000 plus front axle weight rating of 21,000 equals 51,000 GVWR.
Correction Frt axle rating 11,000.
Cab shape looks really good.
If you scrap that engine and trans you can give it to me lol.
This video was in my recommend. Subscribed 👍
You sucked trash out of that empty tank you put 5 gallons in . Check your fuel filter for rust back flush and drain.